How would you feel if Bebop and Rocksteady returned....

[Creativecreature31]

....Only except this time they were aged down to Teenagers like April, Casey, and Karai?

I can imagine them going to April's school and being really dumb bullies to everyone.
I can also imagine them as Casey's rivals on the Hockey Team or something like that.

Maybe they don't have to work for Shedder in this incarnation but instead they can be like minor bad guys who like to give the turtles a hard time just for fun.

And maybe they could sneak into the Turtles lair and accidentally get mixed up in some of Donnie's Mutagen experiments and mutate into a Rhino and a Warthog! XD

How would you feel about this?

[Mzx10484]

I would feel good about this ! Would be nice to see the old veterans again. As Shredder's henchman !

[snake]

I'd like for Bebop and Rocksteady to return, but didn't Ciro say they weren't?

Although of they did return, I wouldn't want them them to be teens, adults would sound more imposing.

[Jester]

Done in IDW style with Teen Bebop and Rocksteady it might work, where they were school bullies who were super stoked to be mutants.

[Donatello19]

If they had more traits than just being stupid, then yes. I like your idea.

[CyberCubed]

As long as one is still black with a purple mohawk and the other is a guy with blond hair wearing army camo duds, I'm fine.

My big fear is that they'll bring back these two but instead they'll just be normal animals instead of being human punks before mutation. I'd rather never see them at all if that's the case.

[NinjaPug]

I'd like for Bebop and Rocksteady to return, but didn't Ciro say they weren't?

Although of they did return, I wouldn't want them them to be teens, adults would sound more imposing.

When asked about B&R at one of the comic conventions Ciro said "be patient"

Plus there's that Nick toy list with their names on it.

[Powder]

I'm a fan of the characters, so I'm for it. I like your idea as well.

[CyberCubed]

When asked about B&R at one of the comic conventions Ciro said "be patient"

Plus there's that Nick toy list with their names on it.

Odd how we have toys listed but nothing for "Baxter-fly" who we already have a sketch of.

[NinjaMan]

....Only except this time they were aged down to Teenagers like April, Casey, and Karai?

I can imagine them going to April's school and being really dumb bullies to everyone.
I can also imagine them as Casey's rivals on the Hockey Team or something like that.

Maybe they don't have to work for Shedder in this incarnation but instead they can be like minor bad guys who like to give the turtles a hard time just for fun.

And maybe they could sneak into the Turtles lair and accidentally get mixed up in some of Donnie's Mutagen experiments and mutate into a Rhino and a Warthog! XD

How would you feel about this?

This would be an awesome idea. Heck I'd be happy if they ended up being Fong and the big Purple Dragon member.

[NinjaPug]

....Only except this time they were aged down to Teenagers like April, Casey, and Karai?

I can imagine them going to April's school and being really dumb bullies to everyone.
I can also imagine them as Casey's rivals on the Hockey Team or something like that.


This sounds like a great idea.

[Creativecreature31]

Wow. I'm glad so many people seem to like my idea! :)
You guys are awesome!

Though I'm sure you all mostly would just like to see Bebop and Rocksteady again regardless of the circumstances! XD

I'm just trying to imagine how they would work as Shedder's henchman in this incarnation. This Shedder is MUCH more Evil than the one from the 80's and I doubt that (Unless Bebop and Rocksteady were changed dramatically) Shedder would tolerate them for a very long time... O_0

[drgon78]

I am fan of those two and would like for them to show up in a series other then the original.

[Bossa Nova]

No thanks. I don't really have any strong feelings for these two one way or another, but I'm really bored of new character after new character being introduced at this point.

[BabyTurtles]

eeeh...I wouldn't really like it....

I'm not that big of a fan, but if they were done right sure....

[CyberCubed]

I only want to see them if they're exactly the way I remember them from my childhood.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

As much as I liked them, 2k12 needs to do it's own thing with new villians.

[Jester]

I only want to see them if they're exactly the way I remember them from my childhood.
Then watch the cartoon from your childhood...sheesh.

[Eiko]

....Only except this time they were aged down to Teenagers like April, Casey, and Karai?

I can imagine them going to April's school and being really dumb bullies to everyone.
I can also imagine them as Casey's rivals on the Hockey Team or something like that.

Maybe they don't have to work for Shedder in this incarnation but instead they can be like minor bad guys who like to give the turtles a hard time just for fun.

And maybe they could sneak into the Turtles lair and accidentally get mixed up in some of Donnie's Mutagen experiments and mutate into a Rhino and a Warthog! XD

How would you feel about this?

Would love this idea. :)

[TheBlueTurtle1]

I would love to see them, and with a slightly higher IQ:lol:

[BubblyShell22]

I think it would be cool if they came back again, but if they didn't, I'd be fine with that, too. It really doesn't matter to me whether they come back or not.

[Metalwolf]

As much as I liked them, 2k12 needs to do it's own thing with new villians.This is what I was thinking as well. I like them and I grew up with the OT, but I like how this new series doesn't try to be a cookie cutter of the OT.

People want B&R, but would you rather have had them be the villains besides the ones in the 2003 series? No Bishop, no Karai, no Hun, just these two as the main henchmen (besides Baxter.) The reason why I say this is that I don't think these two guys can be effective tertiary villains for long, their main iconic-ness almost always whenever they show up is to be Shredder's main henchmen. They would eventually steal the spotlight away from these other unique villains.

They are often intended as comic relief and bumbling villains whenever they get established, and I don't want to see the bad guys lose their serious edge. When that happens, the bad guys stop feeling like a threat.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

As I've said before, I wouldn't mind OT villians getting revived but as a fan of the comics, only if they can manage to reinvent them as a unique or dynamic character with a purpose. Unfortunately, Bebop and Rocksteady are just requested characters at this point in time. I just don't see them being anything more than that.

Part of the reason I loved the 2k3 villians is because they each had their own uniqueness to them. Villians such as Hun, Bishop, Touch & Go, Ultimate Ninja, Slashurr (even though he was in a game), etc. all had their own back stories and special abilities that made them stand out. That being said, I wouldn't want Nick to bring them in this show for the sake of it (Although Hun made his way into the Tales comics, so I guess his appearance in the show would be interesting to see). Ultimately, I'd just like to see new villians such as the Tiger villian as well as a few villians from the Mirage comics such as Savanti Romero.

[blindturtle02]

I'd love them to return. Although, I hope they'd be similar to the way they were in the 5 part pilot. Granted, I liked their bumbling as a kid and still enjoy watching their antics in the OT but if they were featured in the 2012 series, I'd prefer them a bit darker.

[TurtleTitan97]

I can't say I like the idea of Bebop and Rocksteady aged down to teens. It makes sense to do that for April, Casey, and Karai but I don't really see what would be the point in aging them down. I'd rather they'd remain older.

But if they ever returned, I'd hope they'd made a whole lot more smarter than they were in the OT.

[tylerdavies]

....Only except this time they were aged down to Teenagers like April, Casey, and Karai?

I can imagine them going to April's school and being really dumb bullies to everyone.
I can also imagine them as Casey's rivals on the Hockey Team or something like that.

Maybe they don't have to work for Shedder in this incarnation but instead they can be like minor bad guys who like to give the turtles a hard time just for fun.

And maybe they could sneak into the Turtles lair and accidentally get mixed up in some of Donnie's Mutagen experiments and mutate into a Rhino and a Warthog! XD

How would you feel about this?

I think that's a great idea. I like your origin idea for the characters.

This is what I was thinking as well. I like them and I grew up with the OT, but I like how this new series doesn't try to be a cookie cutter of the OT.

So much this. To be honest I could care less if the characters returned or not since I never grew up with them, but if they show up I'd like Nick to do a re-imagining of the characters instead of them just being "cookie cutter" from the 80's.

Then watch the cartoon from your childhood...sheesh.

The main gripe with a lot of members I see mentioning or posting about Bebop and Rocksteady is that they want them EXACTLY like the 80's version. If you want them exactly like they were in the 80's toon - watch the 80's toon or start writing your own fan-fiction lol.

[snake]

When asked about B&R at one of the comic conventions Ciro said "be patient"

Plus there's that Nick toy list with their names on it.

Really? I thought the toy list ones were the classic ones.

[RaphAndDonnie]

I wouldn't mind seeing them, as I'm a fan of Bebop and Rocksteady but I don't like the idea of them being teenagers. Early 20's, sure but teens? Eh.

[blindturtle02]

I wouldn't mind seeing them, as I'm a fan of Bebop and Rocksteady but I don't like the idea of them being teenagers. Early 20's, sure but teens? Eh.

Yeah, early 20's sounds like a great age for those two. I'm thinkin it's just a matter of time until they show.

[The Fifth Turtle]

With all the mutagen hiding throughout the city they wouldn't even have to go to the turtles lair. They can stumble on a canister and mistake it for an energy drink.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

OMG!! YES!! :tgrin: (fan-girl squeal) :tcool: I have always loved those two, they are one of my favorite things about the OT. That said, if Nick were to bring them back with perhaps a slightly darker feel and tweaked backstory, I would not mind at all. (Yes, it CAN be done, if one just takes a little time and care with their characters- I've done it myself, in fact.) Plus, they have the benefit of being nostalgia-candy for older fans like some of us here, while younger fans would get to finally see Shredder's "real" henchmen. (Sorry, but those two will ALWAYS be his "real" hench-mutants to me.) :tlol::trazz:

[CyberCubed]

I'd rather not see "bastardized versions" of Bebop and Rocksteady with spikes coming out of their arms and having skull ribs or any nonsense like that.

If Bebop and Rocksteady aren't designed to look and act similar to what they were in the 80's and 90's than I'd rather not see them all. Also if they were not both human prior with Bebop being black and having a purple mohawk, and Rocksteady not having blonde hair and camo duds....then forget it.

Bebop and Rocksteady do not need to be reimagined. I'd rather not see my childhood villains tainted. Leave them in the past then.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Why? IDW did it- and has made them really cool, from what I've seen so far. And none of the main character points were changed. They still looked the same, still were human first, and are apparently still pretty dumb. Just more threatening. Tweak their story and looks to be a little more modern, and I don't see why it would be "bastardized" at all.

[BubblyShell22]

Because Cubed is stuck in the past and wants to stay there. He hates change and if his childhood idols were changed it would be a horrible thing in Cubed's mind.

However, Duckie, I agree with you that it could be done right, and I have faith in the Nick writers that they could pull it off.

[Powder]

I wouldn't mind seeing them, as I'm a fan of Bebop and Rocksteady but I don't like the idea of them being teenagers. Early 20's, sure but teens? Eh.

Yeah, early 20's sounds like a great age for those two. I'm thinkin it's just a matter of time until they show.

They could still be Casey/Aprils peers if they were let back a few years, like most cartoon bullies. Makes sense to me. :tlol:

[CyberCubed]

Guys, Bebop and Rocksteady don't need, "monster designs," which is the look a lot of these Nick mutants have.

Look at Rahzar, I actually really like Nick's Rahzar design, but its pretty much a skeletal wolf. And then look at how Rat King is like a zombie in this version.

That's what I'm afraid of. I don't want Bebop/Rocksteady to look like monsters, I'd rather them just look like mutant animals. That's what my big fear is. No spikes all over their body or the horror monster look.

[DVD]

Yeah, bring em in.
I like that idea of them being school bullies, held back for being not so bright. Then there would a link to April and Casey, so the tensions or conflicts would have substance.
We could have a slow build up, with them As background, then mutation, then trying to become hired help to the Shredder. I say trying, as there is potential for comedy relief characters.
However, I think that Fishface and DogPound were written as the bb n RS for this show, so I'm doubtful that we will see them, but would be pleased to be wrong.

[MST3KFan]

IDW showed you can reimagine them and make them threats while still retaining the silly aspect they had in the original toon.

I would love to see how they would be in the modern cartoon if given development the way Dogpound and Fishface were before their mutations and make them threatening even before being oozed.

[ObiWanFan4life]

I would actually be pleased if they were in the show. But if the writers aren't subtle and clever with how they're introduced, it would feel like pandering to the fan base.

[Whatswiththeheadbands?]

I would like it. If karai, April and Casey all work as teenagers, then i don't see how Bebop and Rocksteady can't work as Teenagers.

[NinjaPug]

I really like the OP's idea that Bebop and Rocksteady are rival hockey players of Casey. That's a good way to introduce them pre-mutation that wouldn't be too similar to Bradford and Xever.

[Metalwolf]

However, I think that Fishface and DogPound were written as the bb n RS for this show, so I'm doubtful that we will see them, but would be pleased to be wrong.That's what I suspect, and why I wouldn't really care to have R&B try to be a 'replacement' to B&X. If B&R made a brief cameo as some human punks in jail then I wouldn't care, but I've grown attached to these new guys and I want to see how they turn out.

[Coola Yagami]

I also feel each version needs its own thing. the 80's had Bebop and Rocksteady, 2003 had Hun and Karai, and now we have Fishface and Dogpound. Let each version show it's own spin.

[CyberCubed]

I also feel each version needs its own thing. the 80's had Bebop and Rocksteady, 2003 had Hun and Karai, and now we have Fishface and Dogpound. Let each version show it's own spin.

Uh, what? Karai is in both 4kids and Nick, and Dogpound is now Rahzar. And Baxter is working for Shredder again in Nick like he was in 4kids.

In fact now the only unique character Nick has working for Shredder is Fishface. Karai and Baxter have almost the same exact roles they had in the 4kids version, and Rahzar is an old character.

So if Nick's intention was to do their own thing, then they seem to be going backwards actually....

[Coola Yagami]

Uh, what? Karai is in both 4kids and Nick, and Dogpound is now Rahzar. And Baxter is working for Shredder again in Nick like he was in 4kids.

In fact now the only unique character Nick has working for Shredder is Fishface. Karai and Baxter have almost the same exact roles they had in the 4kids version, and Rahzar is an old character.

So if Nick's intention was to do their own thing, then they seem to be going backwards actually....

Yes dear friend, but what past incarnation had Rahzar, Karai and Fishface working for Shredder? All at one time? It's still something new and different.

It would be like yet another TMNT reboot having Shredder use Tokka and Bebop. Both are old characters, but they were never paired off before in any other version.

[CyberCubed]

But they're still using old characters.

IMO the reason Hun was invented was because they didn't want to use Tatsu because of possible rights issues with Golden Harvest over the likeness of the actor. It was easy to create a new character and link his origin with Casey Jones.

Hun became so popular they brought him into Mirage and now even IDW is using him. I'd be surprised if he doesn't show up in Nick and take over the Purple Dragons now that Xever is permanently Fishface.

[Gwydion]

While I definitely like the idea the OP posed - B&R originally being teens on an opposing hockey team or bullies at school - I don't need to see B&R in the Nick cartoon JUST to have them there. I loved them in the OT, but unless they do come up with a clever way to add them in (like what the OP suggested), I would rather them not appear.

[Metalwolf]

Yes dear friend, but what past incarnation had Rahzar, Karai and Fishface working for Shredder? All at one time? It's still something new and different.

It would be like yet another TMNT reboot having Shredder use Tokka and Bebop. Both are old characters, but they were never paired off before in any other version.Exactly. It's fresh and new, and avoids the perennial risk of things getting stale.

Transformers seems to have that 'staleness' risk in the shows, they almost never deviate from standard formula. Almost to the point that each character has a story arc that is the rehashed version of their previous namesake's arc in an earlier show. It's why I love that TMNT does a big change up in each show/comic, you never know what's going to happen or who will show up in it.

[Coola Yagami]

But they're still using old characters.

IMO the reason Hun was invented was because they didn't want to use Tatsu because of possible rights issues with Golden Harvest over the likeness of the actor. It was easy to create a new character and link his origin with Casey Jones.

Hun became so popular they brought him into Mirage and now even IDW is using him. I'd be surprised if he doesn't show up in Nick and take over the Purple Dragons now that Xever is permanently Fishface.

You miss the point dude. It's not about using new or old characters. It's about using different character dynamics.

The OT had Shredder, Krang, Bebop and Rocksteady
2K3 had Shredder, Hun, Karai, Baxter and Chaplin
IDW currently has (or had) Shredder, Karai, Alopex, Bebop and Rocksteady
the new Nick show has Shredder, Karai, Dogpoung/Rahzar, Fishface and I assume Tiger Claw.

A mix of old and new, but still different dynamics. Like my previous example, if some brand new show had Shredder with Groundchuck, Bebop, and Fishface.... yeah, they're old characters we've seen before, but we never seen them paired up that way.

[CyberCubed]

Yeah I see that.

Anyway getting back to Bebop and Rocksteady, they better not give them "monster" designs. It works for characters like Slash and Rahzar to give them spikes or bones sticking out but it wouldn't work for them.

I hope to god they keep Bebop and Rocksteady's designs simple and don't give them outlandish monster designs with spikes and bones coming out of their skin.

[Coola Yagami]

Yeah I see that.

Anyway getting back to Bebop and Rocksteady, they better not give them "monster" designs. It works for characters like Slash and Rahzar to give them spikes or bones sticking out but it wouldn't work for them.

I hope to god they keep Bebop and Rocksteady's designs simple and don't give them outlandish monster designs with spikes and bones coming out of their skin.

That's kind of what I would be be afraid of. IDW just buffed them and aside from the stupid hooves, didn't change their looks too much. Based on everyone else, if they did mutate 'normally' they'd be the only mutants besides the Turtles, Splinter and Leatherhead to not turn into overdone monstrosities.

[rodster6]

I'd be happy seeing them make a come back as long as they were not as dumb and useless as in the old toon. Make them an actual threat.

I enjoy seeing old characters brought into the new show, not just for nostalgia but because none of them really had much character development in the old toon. I'd love to see the Punk frogs, Ray Fillet and the Mutanimals etc in the new show.
The problem is, the new show doesn't really seem to be doing much with characters they introduce outside of the Turtles themselves.

[VaughnMichael]

I'd totally be up for them coming back if done with justice.
Like others here I'm tired of the mindless monsters with spikes all over them.
I know the designers are horror fans but I think there should be at least a few mutants with personality and not so horrific looking.
They did the same thing in 2k3 but worse and it just annoyed the hell out of me, but I think that had a lot to do with Peter Lairds no mutants rule.

[NinjaPug]

Discogod saw renders of Bebop & Rocksteady at the UK Toy Fair:

Bebop & Rocksteady were my favourite reveals. They've been given a fairly major update, but they're still instantly recognizable. They look a lot meaner, more feral and "tribal", with markings over their bodies. I think you guys will be very divided on them, but I loved them.

[blindturtle02]

Yeah! I can't wait to see them show up. Tribal markings? Interesting. It'd be alright with me if they weren't providing comic relief this time around. At least not as much. They were great in the 5 part pilot of the OT. Bebop and Rocksteady seemed menacing, but they had a few nice comedic moments there. I dunno. I don't want to see carbon copies of the OT punks if that makes sense. But from what has been described so far, I'm very excited.

[CyberCubed]

Ugh so they're not human punks anymore? Horrible I knew this would happen.

Now I wish they didn't appear at all.

[sdp]

ugh yeah, I don't trust how the show is going to use R&B, and they're only bringing them because everyone keeps asking about them, they don't even want to so they won't be treated great. I'm definitely not a fan of this show, I don't understand how there isn't more backlash and is still well liked by most. I'll take Fast Forward or Back to the Sewers over most of the Nick episodes. And to think that I was one of the few who defended the show before it premiered. How the tables turn, or maybe the fandom just always has the opposite opinion of mine.

[bridgegrn]

I'm sure they'll like their version and treat them well.

[TurtleTitan97]

Ugh so they're not human punks anymore? Horrible I knew this would happen.

And you knew this HOW exactly? Just because they're described as looking "feral", doesn't mean they're gonna start off as animals. They could still mutate from humans. I doubt Ciro would change them that much.

[CyberCubed]

They're feral with tribal markings. That implies they were normal animals in some forest.

So much for street punks.

[Coola Yagami]

They're feral with tribal markings. That implies they were normal animals in some forest.

So much for street punks.

Cause animals have tribal markings on them right? They can paint themselves right? They could be street punks turned feral upon mutation. Look at what happened to April's father.

[CyberCubed]

It sounds like they were animals shipped from Africa (perhaps Tiger Claw picks them up when he comes to America), and after they get mutated they remember their animal instinct. In other words they're completely different characters.

Where are the two street punks?

[Coola Yagami]

It sounds like they were animals shipped from Africa (perhaps Tiger Claw picks them up when he comes to America), and after they get mutated they remember their animal instinct. In other words they're completely different characters.

Where are the two street punks?

Turned into feral mutant monsters. Get over it. Worked wonders for April's dad.

[CyberCubed]

So more mindless monsters? What the hell is the point then?

I want them to talk.

[Coola Yagami]

So more mindless monsters? What the hell is the point then?

I want them to talk.

well... there's this series out on DVD for 10 seasons... and they're in 7 or 8 of those seasons...

[NinjaPug]

Calm down Cubed:

Although they're more feral-looking, they still looked like themselves - Bebop had his black pants, red vest & shades, Rocksteady had his camo pants.

[CyberCubed]

Calm down Cubed:

Did Bebop have a purple mohawk? Please tell me he is still black!

[NinjaPug]

More from Discogod

Bebop was brown, with black trousers, red vest, purple shades, a mohawk (possibly purple, it was hard to tell) and (I think) black markings on his chest. Rocksteady was grey, shirtless with camo pants, white markings, no helmet. When I say "tribal markings", it's not like they're covered - it seemed to just be on their chests.

I've got to say, of all the characters from the old 'toon that have been revived for the new one, these 2 have probably undergone the fewest changes, aesthetically.

[CyberCubed]

Those sound less like tribal markings and more like tatoo's.

I wonder what he means by more feral? I understand they probably look more beastly but they had better be humans too.

[Ninjinister]

Those sound less like tribal markings and more like tatoo's.

I wonder what he means by more feral? I understand they probably look more beastly but they had better be humans too.

Why? Why had they "better" be humans? Why do you have such narrow qualifications on what needs to happen with this franchise?

[CyberCubed]

Why? Why had they "better" be humans? Why do you have such narrow qualifications on what needs to happen with this franchise?

Are you being serious? There's a huge difference between animals being mutated and actual humans becoming mutants.

Bebop and Rocksteady's appeal come from being human punks turned mutants. We got to see them as humans and then be mutated. Bebop's human design is incredibly iconic, from the purple Mohawk and shades to the black skin. He was a perfect example of an 80's black street punk.

I also like Rocksteady's camo army outfit and blonde hair.

[Ninjinister]

Are you being serious? There's a huge difference between animals being mutated and actual humans becoming mutants.

Explain.


Bebop and Rocksteady's appeal come from being human punks turned mutants.
Maybe in your little fantasy with the population of one.


I also like Rocksteady's camo army outfit and blonde hair.

See, this makes sense. "I like how it was before" is perfect logic for why you personally would care to see something. Making it sound like an ultimatum, or that more than just you feel that way, is ridiculous.

[CyberCubed]

Explain.


Maybe in your little fantasy with the population of one.



See, this makes sense. "I like how it was before" is perfect logic for why you personally would care to see something. Making it sound like an ultimatum, or that more than just you feel that way, is ridiculous.

You don't think being humans before makes them more appealing? It worked for Splinter, Dogpound and Fishface.

And Bebop and Rocksteady are known humans for 25 years.

[Cure]

I promise you, the majority of people know them as a rhino and warthog.

Either way, you're jumping to conclusions, as usual. Wait to see.

[Coola Yagami]

You don't think being humans before makes them more appealing? It worked for Splinter, Dogpound and Fishface.

And Bebop and Rocksteady are known humans for 25 years.

I honestly could care less how they're brought in. I could care less if they were mutated animals. I would just accept them as the Nick version of Bebop and Rocksteady. Them being feral mutated animals doesn't change the fact they were humans for 25 years. Just like Megan Fox doesn't change the fact that April never looked like her for 25 years.

[Universal_Adam]

Did Bebop have a purple mohawk? Please tell me he is still black!

What is with your black obsession? I've seen you mention this quite a few times in a few threads. Who cares what color he is as a human. Don't be obsessed with race.

[snake]

What is with your black obsession? I've seen you mention this quite a few times in a few threads. Who cares what color he is as a human. Don't be obsessed with race.

http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=44631

[CyberCubed]

What is with your black obsession? I've seen you mention this quite a few times in a few threads. Who cares what color he is as a human. Don't be obsessed with race.

Because Bebop is black. Why should he be whitewashed or changed into an animal?

I think its important because other than Baxter...Bebop is the only other notable black person in TMNT history.

[Coola Yagami]

http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=44631

I hate how that topic was closed before I could post in it. People are too over-sensitive. The world is becoming more and more pussyfied by the day. I agree the way he phrased the opening thread may have lacked some serious tact, but I think we're all better than getting our panties in a bunch over something so stupid. Grow a pair, people.

[CyberCubed]

I hate how that topic was closed before I could post in it. People are too over-sensitive. The world is becoming more and more pussyfied by the day. I agree the way he phrased the opening thread may have lacked some serious tact, but I think we're all better than getting our panties in a bunch over something so stupid. Grow a pair, people.

I'm surprised too. I thought people joke about ebonic slang all the time.

[Jester]

You keep fighting for social justice, Cubed. Yeah, that's the ticket...

[Coola Yagami]

I'm surprised too. I thought people joke about ebonic slang all the time.

Personally I speak with more stoner surfer slang than anything (and yes, I blame TMNT, Bill and Ted for this). And I didn't know 'oh snap' was ebonics. I thought that was just a funny and censored way of way 'oh ****' in front of children. And for the record, I don't really use any Hispanic slang at all, unless I'm imitating the stereotypical Mexican voice for a joke.

[TMNTmousers]

I did mind when they appear, I just hope they will be in the show.

[Metalwolf]

Because Bebop is black. Why should he be whitewashed or changed into an animal?

I think its important because other than Baxter...Bebop is the only other notable black person in TMNT history.I don't think they're going to 'whitewash' Bebop. They changed Baxter back, and he was white for most of the 80s' cartoon.

[CyberCubed]

I wish we got some confirmation of what their human forms look like. I will be angry if:

1. Bebop/Rocksteady are just normal animals before mutation. This bothers me because I always saw their personalities as mutants retaining their human personas.

2. Bebop/Rocksteady's human forms are those god awful Purple Dragon characters. Luckily I don't think so since there's 3 of them and only Fon seems important but still not quite enough to become one of them.

3. Bebop better stay black.

[snake]

I wish we got some confirmation of what their human forms look like. I will be angry if:

1. Bebop/Rocksteady are just normal animals before mutation. This bothers me because I always saw their personalities as mutants retaining their human personas.

2. Bebop/Rocksteady's human forms are those god awful Purple Dragon characters. Luckily I don't think so since there's 3 of them and only Fon seems important but still not quite enough to become one of them.

3. Bebop better stay black.

1- Why?
2-Why?
3- Why? Especially for this one.

[CyberCubed]

Because their human forms ARE them. Bebop/Rocksteady being anyone else would simply be them in design only, it wouldn't be the same characters.

[snake]

Because their human forms ARE them. Bebop/Rocksteady being anyone else would simply be them in design only, it wouldn't be the same characters.

In the OT maybe, this is a new incarnation. And why does Bebop HAVE to be black?

[CyberCubed]

Because he was created as a black man and that's how he should stay.

[snake]

Because he was created as a black man and that's how he should stay.

Why not mix things up? Make rocksteady black and bebop white, oh wait, WHO CARES WHAT COLOR BEBOP'S SKIN IS? WHO?

[TurtleTitan97]

Because their human forms ARE them. Bebop/Rocksteady being anyone else would simply be them in design only, it wouldn't be the same characters.

Who cares? This is a new show, and more importantly a new universe. Just because they're borrowing elements from the OT, doesn't mean everything has to be 100% accurate. Besides, I doubt Ciro and the crew will change them that much, they know what they are doing. We just have to wait and see what they do with them. You worry WAY to much.

[Zany Orange Dude]

I think this is an interesting concept. I'd love to see Nick do it! I can see Bebop and Rocksteady picking on Irma and April jumping into the rescue. Heck maybe even Casey.

[snake]

I think this is an interesting concept. I'd love to see Nick do it! I can see Bebop and Rocksteady picking on Irma and April jumping into the rescue. Heck maybe even Casey.
Welcome back!

[Papenbrook]

I hope Bebop and Rocksteady are shipped with Irma and Karai.

[TurtleTitan97]

I hope Bebop and Rocksteady are shipped with Irma and Karai.

Um...why?:tconfuse:

[snake]

I hope Bebop and Rocksteady are shipped with Irma and Karai.

In the show or in fanfiction? Becuase in the show, no. I really don't care for fanfic pairings.

But in the show? That's just creepy.

[CyberCubed]

Even the IDW comic kept their human designs similar to the OT:

http://static2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20131112173759/tmnt/images/6/6a/Rocksteady_and_bebop_human_designs_by_benbates-d6qjfdp.jpg


They updated them a little bit in areas but Bebop was still black with a purple mohawk and Rocksteady was a white guy in army camo pants.

[snake]

Even the IDW comic kept their human designs similar to the OT:

http://static2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20131112173759/tmnt/images/6/6a/Rocksteady_and_bebop_human_designs_by_benbates-d6qjfdp.jpg


They updated them a little bit in areas but Bebop was still black with a purple mohawk and Rocksteady was a white guy in army camo pants.

You still didn't answer my question.

[CyberCubed]

Because he was created as a black man and should STAY as a black man. I don't care if this is a new series. It's like saying Shredder should become a Mexican or April should become Asian.

[TurtleTitan97]

Even the IDW comic kept their human designs similar to the OT:

http://static2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20131112173759/tmnt/images/6/6a/Rocksteady_and_bebop_human_designs_by_benbates-d6qjfdp.jpg


They updated them a little bit in areas but Bebop was still black with a purple mohawk and Rocksteady was a white guy in army camo pants.

And yet you are seriously worried that after 33 episodes, you think that Ciro and the crew would change them up that much? Despite the fact that they've paid homage to a lot of TMNT's history, including the OT?

And again I ask... why?

[snake]

Because he was created as a black man and should STAY as a black man. I don't care if this is a new series. It's like saying Shredder should become a Mexican or April should become Asian.

Shredders a different story, and April can be whatever race the creators of a series want her to be. Bebop can just be a white gang member, it's not like everything has to stay the same.

[CyberCubed]

And yet you are seriously worried that after 33 episodes, you think that Ciro and the crew would change them up that much? Despite the fact that they've paid homage to a lot of TMNT's history, including the OT?

And again I ask... why?

Well some characters have had different origins/designs, such as Mutagen Man now being Timmy or Rat King now being Dr. Falco.

The reason nobody cared about those changes is because Mutagen Man was such a minor character in the OT (he was only in a single episode), and Rat King's origin changes drastically with each series and comic anyway.

Or someone like Rahzar, who is now Dogpound who was previously Chris Bradford. But then again Rahzar isn't "as important."

But Bebop/Rocksteady were in somewhere around 140 or so episodes of the original cartoon, and their human designs are iconic. I don't mind some subtle changes here and there, but they better look similar to the way they always do.

[snake]

Well some characters have had different origins/designs, such as Mutagen Man now being Timmy or Rat King now being Dr. Falco.

The reason nobody cared about those changes is because Mutagen Man was such a minor character in the OT (he was only in a single episode), and Rat King's origin changes drastically with each series and comic anyway.

Or someone like Rahzar, who is now Dogpound who was previously Chris Bradford. But then again Rahzar isn't "as important."

But Bebop/Rocksteady were in somewhere around 140 or so episodes of the original cartoon, and their human designs are iconic. I don't mind some subtle changes here and there, but they better look similar to the way they always do.

Shredder was in most of the OT, and he was redesigned for this show, and 2k3, and idw.

[TurtleTitan97]

and their human designs are iconic.

:trolleye:No there not, they're mutant designs are. They only appeared as human few times in the OT, while the majority of the time they're mutants. As long as people see a mutant rhino and warthog, they could care less.

[CyberCubed]

:trolleye:No there not, they're mutant designs are. They only appeared as human few times in the OT, while the majority of the time they're mutants. As long as people see a mutant rhino and warthog, they could care less.

Their designs are remembered enough to be recognizable 25+ years later regardless.

When you ask someone who watched the OT, "What did Bebop and Rocksteady look like as humans?" they'll know immediately what to say.

[Zany Orange Dude]

Welcome back!

Thanks.:tlol:

I am pretty sure they would keep Bebop the same race, they did for Baxter Stockman.

[ninja-zero]

If they were to return as teenage bullies to April & hockey rivals of Casey, perhaps after being mutated into a rhino & warthog or perhaps become a razorback boar instead...

Perhaps the Shredder, Karai, Rahzar & Fishface could take them in giving them rigorous ninja training.

Bebop can wield a meteor hammer while Rocksteady can wield a mace or an axe along with a submachine gun.

[Coola Yagami]

Their designs are remembered enough to be recognizable 25+ years later regardless.

When you ask someone who watched the OT, "What did Bebop and Rocksteady look like as humans?" they'll know immediately what to say.

No... they'd most likely say 'they were humans?' or 'I don't know... wasn't that just the first episode or something?'

And Rat King is a horrible example. Expect for this series, he always looks more of less the same. The OT was basically the kid-friendly version of the Mirage design. While his origins changed in 2K3, he still kept the same basic look. This show was the first to completely change his appearance.

[MST3KFan]

No... they'd most likely say 'they were humans?' or 'I don't know... wasn't that just the first episode or something?'

And Rat King is a horrible example. Expect for this series, he always looks more of less the same. The OT was basically the kid-friendly version of the Mirage design. While his origins changed in 2K3, he still kept the same basic look. This show was the first to completely change his appearance.

Wasn't Rat King in the Nick 2012 toon redesigned to resemble another character his VA, Jeffrey Combs, voiced in Batman: The Animated Series, the Scarecrow?

[Shred87]

....Only except this time they were aged down to Teenagers like April, Casey, and Karai?

I can imagine them going to April's school and being really dumb bullies to everyone.
I can also imagine them as Casey's rivals on the Hockey Team or something like that.

Maybe they don't have to work for Shedder in this incarnation but instead they can be like minor bad guys who like to give the turtles a hard time just for fun.

And maybe they could sneak into the Turtles lair and accidentally get mixed up in some of Donnie's Mutagen experiments and mutate into a Rhino and a Warthog! XD

How would you feel about this?
Would love it... Love it in idw and would be pumped to see them on nick... Would like to see tokka and rahzar again as well.....

[CyberCubed]

No... they'd most likely say 'they were humans?' or 'I don't know... wasn't that just the first episode or something?'

You're joking. Everyone here knows what Bebop/Rocksteady's human designs look like off the top of their head.

[Coola Yagami]

You're joking. Everyone here knows what Bebop/Rocksteady's human designs look like off the top of their head.

yeah, and we represent the rest of the world right? You keep forgetting there's a vast world beyond this little forum.

[CyberCubed]

yeah, and we represent the rest of the world right? You keep forgetting there's a vast world beyond this little forum.

You have to remember that Season 1 is the most rewatched season of the original cartoon. It doesn't matter that we only see their human designs for a few episodes, the fact that everyone watches the first two episodes so many times basically burnt their designs into our minds.

It's the same reason everyone knows what Baxter's human design in the OT looked like, and even then we only saw him as a human for like what...7 episodes maybe at most?

[Jester]

So iconic that 4Kids didn't realize who they were and used them as filler people in the streets of FW's New York in Turtles Forever.

[CyberCubed]

So iconic that 4Kids didn't realize who they were and used them as filler people in the streets of FW's New York in Turtles Forever.

You act like they didn't probably do that purposely as an inside gag. They had the model sheets of all the OT characters, they knew who they were.

[Jester]

If they did it as an inside gag, then it's a terrible inside gag.

[CyberCubed]

If they did it as an inside gag, then it's a terrible inside gag.

You forget that Peter Laird oversaw that movie too, he knew it was them.

[Leofan26]

It will sure feel weird, I always felt it made Shredder less of a serious villain. Lets look at 80s Shredder and compare him 2003 Shredder. Notice a major difference here? 80s Shredder was more comical in my opinion, season one and maybe two he seemed ok but as time went on I didn't see him as a threat much. Bebop and RockSteady sure didn't help make it better, they were more comical than him even, I felt like I was watching Team Rocket from season One of Pokemon, you mine as well had him say " Were blasting off again! " At the end of each episode :-?

Let's look at the 2012 Shredder to 80s Shredder even, guy may not appear much as the other past Shredders did but he's still seems like more of a threat. He gave Master Splinter one heck of a fight in the season one final, that's more than any thing 80s Shredder would have even dreamed to do, I'd Love for them to cross paths in the Dimension X arc and for 2012 Shredder to give his 80s Shredder some advice :lol:

I know Nick's series has more humor in it than the 2003 series did but still a bit more serious, I hope they can make these guy's more of a threat while adding in comical moments. I could see them being like Mikey is though :ohwell:

Guess will see, again my opinion :D

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

It will sure feel weird, I always felt it made Shredder less of a serious villain. Lets look at 80s Shredder and compare him 2003 Shredder. Notice a major difference here? 80s Shredder was more comical in my opinion, season one and maybe two he seemed ok but as time went on I didn't see him as a threat much. Bebop and RockSteady sure didn't help make it better, they were more comical than him even, I felt like I was watching Team Rocket from season One of Pokemon, you mine as well had him say " Were blasting off again! " At the end of each episode :-?

Let's look at the 2012 Shredder to 80s Shredder even, guy may not appear much as the other past Shredders did but he's still seems like more of a threat. He gave Master Splinter one heck of a fight in the season one final, that's more than any thing 80s Shredder would have even dreamed to do, I'd Love for them to cross paths in the Dimension X arc and for 2012 Shredder to give his 80s Shredder some advice :lol:

I know Nick's series has more humor in it than the 2003 series did but still a bit more serious, I hope they can make these guy's more of a threat while adding in comical moments. I could see them being like Mikey is though :ohwell:

Guess will see, again my opinion :D

What's so great with 2012 Shredder is how he doesn't appear in most episodes, gets hit by just a single punch or kick or two from the turtles as in the 1987 show and ends up defeated over and over again.

2012 Shredder can be gone for several episodes, but when he returns he strikes really hard.

[Cowabunga Carl]

I've noticed that if anyone else loves something then the OT they just need to move on and accept it is over according to Cubed, yet he latches onto the OT and demands everything be the same as it. Interesting.

[Metalwolf]

It will sure feel weird, I always felt it made Shredder less of a serious villain. Lets look at 80s Shredder and compare him 2003 Shredder. Notice a major difference here? 80s Shredder was more comical in my opinion, season one and maybe two he seemed ok but as time went on I didn't see him as a threat much. Bebop and RockSteady sure didn't help make it better, they were more comical than him even, I felt like I was watching Team Rocket from season One of Pokemon, you mine as well had him say " Were blasting off again! " At the end of each episode :-?

Let's look at the 2012 Shredder to 80s Shredder even, guy may not appear much as the other past Shredders did but he's still seems like more of a threat. He gave Master Splinter one heck of a fight in the season one final, that's more than any thing 80s Shredder would have even dreamed to do, I'd Love for them to cross paths in the Dimension X arc and for 2012 Shredder to give his 80s Shredder some advice :lol:

I know Nick's series has more humor in it than the 2003 series did but still a bit more serious, I hope they can make these guy's more of a threat while adding in comical moments. I could see them being like Mikey is though :ohwell:

Guess will see, again my opinion :DThat's why I was afraid of them being added. I like this Shredder and I didn't want that to get ruined by them. The Turtles are already a funny 'commentary' in the way they should be, since it's played against the dark background. Make it too goofy, and these jokes have nothing to play against.

[blindturtle02]

That's why I was afraid of them being added. I like this Shredder and I didn't want that to get ruined by them. The Turtles are already a funny 'commentary' in the way they should be, since it's played against the dark background. Make it too goofy, and these jokes have nothing to play against.

What if the humorous sides are dispensed with here? The writers might decide to make B and R more menacing like they were in the OT 5 part pilot. They had a few comic relief moments EG when they ran into each other during their first skirmish with the turtles. Rather like Dogpound/Rahzar and Fishface's comedic moments EG Dogpound's clumsy nature and Fishface's unfinished legs going crazy. The bad guys have a few comedic moments but the writers haven't gone overboard with those yet. I'm hoping the writers go the more serious route anyway when B and R appear. They want this show to succeed and last a good long while same as we do, I bet, so things ought to be ok. I've had the same worries about B and R as well.

[Coola Yagami]

You have to remember that Season 1 is the most rewatched season of the original cartoon. It doesn't matter that we only see their human designs for a few episodes, the fact that everyone watches the first two episodes so many times basically burnt their designs into our minds.



Who is this 'everyone'? Why are there people as overly-obsessed with the TMNT and OT as you are? That just can't be healthy?

I'm talkin about Joe Average TMNT fan that loves the show and comics but doesn't have to know everything about everything about them.

[victory_angel]

I think it would be cool for Bebop and Rocksteady to be on the Nick Show. I know we have a lot of villains currently, and San Diego comic-con is coming up in about 6 months from now so obviously we will be learning about any other villains and situations slatted for this current season, and for season three around then. If we don't learn about these things before then.

[renaissance reptile]

I love Bebop and Rocksteady (if for nothing else but their names) but I think Fishface and Dogpound have been pretty cool replacements (though less funny). Furthermore, I'm just not sure how they can be squeezed into the shows regular cast of rogues?

[shredder orokusaki]

When do you think they willl show us some tralers and screenshots of bebop and rocksteady?? Wil they appear before episode 13 or after that?

[Metalwolf]

I love Bebop and Rocksteady (if for nothing else but their names) but I think Fishface and Dogpound have been pretty cool replacements (though less funny). Furthermore, I'm just not sure how they can be squeezed into the shows regular cast of rogues?That's the thing I still feel, even after reading some ways that they could be implemented. Mainly it's because I think this show need to go on it's own path and while I like B+R, I don't want them in every incarnation of Turtles. Also you are right, how is every villain going to get enough showtime when there becomes too many of them?

[victory_angel]

If Bebop and Rocksteady are included. I can see them being thugs from a rival high school who have come to challenge Casey Jones. Rocksteady is attracted to April, he doesn't have crush on her. But I can see him saying that who ever wins April is the prize.

April is naturally unhappy about this particularly since she doesn't like being viewed as a prize to be won.

[Jon_Talbain]

I wouldn't mind how they are introduced, just as long as they are are written in well. Nickelodeon has already done so many "Mutant of the Day" episodes and some we haven't even seen since. So if Bebop and Rocksteady are included, I hope they are written in better and have bigger parts than most of the villains we have seen so far.

There could be more of a history or story to them if they were former students at April and Casey's school. Maybe they could be bullying Irma and other students some kind of way as humans. Or maybe Casey once tried to get into a gang or get into a group of troublemakers and met Bebop and Rocksteady before he decided to get out. There could be a lot of angles they go, but still not sure how they would have them mutated.

And as far as them being black and white as humans, it would be cool if they did pay that much homage to the originals, but it isn't that big of a deal in my opinion.

[j56]

So no pics of the Nick Bebop and Rocksteady have been shown at the US Toy Fair? I haven't been able to find any online, at any rate. =(

[Powder]

No, they weren't shown, hence, no pics. They're not even finished making them.

[CyberCubed]

I'm hoping they don't appear till Season 3 now, I'll feel like they're too rushed in for Season 2. We haven't even seen their human forms show up yet.

[NinjaPug]

I'm hoping they don't appear till Season 3 now, I'll feel like they're too rushed in for Season 2. We haven't even seen their human forms show up yet.

You're assuming a) they will have human forms b) that these human forms will show up in advance of the episode they're getting mutated in

Please don't even start about their 'iconic' human forms.

[OrangeNinja1987]

I'd like to see Bebop and Rocksteady in this series, but I want them done differently. While they worked in the OT, they wouldn't work in this version the way they are, since this cartoon is much more serious and doesn't create villains that aren't the least bit of a threat and only devoted to comedy. I'd love to see a darker tone for Bebop and Rocksteady. They did it with Slash, who was extremely goofy and immature in the OT, and made him a serious, incredible threat.

[CyberCubed]

You're assuming a) they will have human forms b) that these human forms will show up in advance of the episode they're getting mutated in
.

a) Dogpound/Fishface originally started as expies of Bebop/Rocksteady. They were humans turned mutant and were obvious throwbacks as new mutant henchmen for this generation. But they started as humans instead of as animals. I don't see why Bebop/Rocksteady won't be the same.

b) This show loves slow build-up to mutants. Mutagen Man was introduced as a human for two episodes, Rat King was introduced as Dr. Falco, Dogpound/Fishface went 9 episodes before mutation, Baxter is waiting all the way till mid-Season 2 for mutation.....Spike lasted an entire season before becoming Slash, etc.

The only characters who become mutants right away are the minor less-important mutant characters.

I suspect Bebop/Rocksteady will be properly introduced as human thugs for at least 2-3 episodes before mutation.

[NinjaPug]

You bring up good points but they're still assumptions. Personally, I would also like to see B&R start as humans for a number of episodes before getting mutated. The fact that B still has a mohawk (according to Discogod) makes you think he would have to start out human but you never know with Ciro's designs.

I have a feeling it won't ruin my day like it will yours if that's not the case.

[Vundi]

I only want to see them if they're exactly the way I remember them from my childhood.

Why is that?

[Coola Yagami]

never really saw Bradford and Xever as expies for Bebop and Rocksteady.... neither of them was ever a ninja master that owned his own dojo... and even though Xever was also a punk he's very different than run-of-the-mill street thug. I mean if I never seen the toys with the spoilers on the back, I never woulda guessed either of them would become a rhino or a warthog.

I always saw them as the 'next generation' of shredder henchmen. Just like 2K3 has Hun, the movies had Tatsu and now this series has them. I mean seriously, by that logic, are Karai and Tigerclaw also an expie of those two?

[Jester]

Why is that?
Because of all of us fanboys here, Cybercubed fears change the most. All changes makes him squirm.

[Huzzah]

Frankly if and when they are introduced it will likely either be as Karai's henchman, because of her inevitable split from the Shredder for various reasons, or my preferred method would be having them as members of the Purple Dragon Gang, I mean if you're a small time city street gang, and you want to wrench up some cred as legitimate threats, and you live in a city that have a fair number of hardcore Mutants tearing through the streets, why not add a couple of those hyped-up, mutated muscle heads to your ranks.

Oh look that smal street gang has punks with guns and knives...look at the Dragons over there though, they have punks with guns and knives...oh yeah and two of them are a jacked up warthog and rhino with even bigger guns...

[TMNT is cooler than MOTU]

If/when they show up, I'm hoping they'll be similar to how they are in the IDW comic. Still classically stupid, but strong enough and mean enough to be taken as a serious threat.

And I really hope they aren't teenagers either. :teek:

[Huzzah]

I'm good without teenaged versions of them.

One thing though, Bebop and Rocksteady should never, under any circumstances, be smart.

[CyberCubed]

I doubt they would be teenagers. They will probably be around Xever's age, which I assume is early 20's.