Official Episode Discussion S2 #20 "The Legend of Kuro Kabuto"

[Machias Banshee]

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Alright, the saga continues!

So, Karai knows the truth about Splinter being her true father - and the one she Thought was her father has locked her into a prison cell somewhere in his skyscraper headquarters.

Meanwhile, something strange is going on in the building. Things are moving, vanishing... Imagine Shredder's surprise, when his helmet suddenly disappears! No longer able to hide his face, we'll finally see his true face, for all the distortion, old scars and anger that he holds inside from so many years of resentment and a need for revenge.

Kuro Kabuto... his helmet has a special name? is there some sort of special story behind it? Why would someone want it so badly as to risk stealing it from Shredder?

We've got some new questions now, so make up your own theories, and as always...

STAY TUNED!

[Machias Banshee]

Okay, so SOME of you can see this episode early.. :) have fun! Poll will be up later tomorrow morning..

[Zulithe]

2 hours and 30 mins to go. Can I stay up long enough? Guess I better start chugging Crush soda.

[ssjup81]

I'm going to use Amazon's site this time. I'm curious about the name of this ep, though. Why is it called Kuro Kabuto? At first I thought that maybe it was a name, but since Shredder's helmet gets stolen this ep, I guess it means "Dark Helmet"? Who knows, either way, I'm looking forward to this episode.

[Zulithe]

Good luck to you this time. I know you had a bit of trouble last week.

*edit* The episode is now up! I'll post impressions shortly.

[Zulithe]

The Legend of the Kuro Kabuto

SPOILERS COMMENTARY FOLLOW

UH-OH we start off strong with the Russian arms dealer. He has excalibur, whoa. OH he wants Shredder's helmet, iiiiiiinteresting. He also has a rhino in a glass display :o FORESHADOWING!
He hires Bebop, err, Anton Zeck (master thief) to do it! Awesome. And he's responsible for his missing eye, so they are already strongly connected.
Pizza time. Peperoni again?
Mikey using the smoke eggs... again :)
We are getting a *LOT* of Dominic as Leo in this ep, that's for sure.
Shredder looking more hideous than I remember... whoa
Trying to convince Karai that he was trying to do the "right" thing... uh-hu. Well, I'd love to hear his side of the story.
Shredder hides his helmet under his throne like that? He must really value the thing.
Whoa Bebop's fighting style is wicked.
Backstory on the helmet, awesome.
Baxterfly! Tiger Claw! Rahzar! Fishface! All four on the job.
"Don't get mad at me... you know you look nasty!" Bwahahahaha.
Buzzkill? Will that be Baxter's mutated name now?
Diaper on Leo's head... I thought that was Donnie's lot in life. ("A-wrapa this diap-a around-a ya face-a")
"Why am I smelling... the baby poops?" oh lawdy
Oh crap... what a twist at the end!



Very good episode by my accounting. Great new character with Anton, strong action even featuring 4 on 4 at one point, some of the better funny moments we've had this season, even the sound effects felt above average (tiger claw making cat sounds when being hit :p)

Despite this being somewhat of a Leo-centric episode that also features a voice fill-in for Leo, I didn't find it impacted the quality at all. Dominic's voice, while different, fits the character to me.

My rating: A

SPOILER IMAGES:


Rhino clearly displayed. What's on the opposite site? Warthog?
http://i.imgur.com/bui9t4Ml.jpg (http://imgur.com/bui9t4M)
Anton Zeck's calling card
http://i.imgur.com/lG5kBcXl.jpg (http://imgur.com/lG5kBcX)
"The clan's founder himself, the dreaded Koga Takuza was said to be the greatest ninja in the history of Japan. His skill with a blade was greater than any Samurai. Takuza laid waste to warriors and rulers alike. He stole the sacred totems of his defeated enemies and fused them into an alloy greater than steel! He himself forged the Kabuto, and it has survived undamaged to this day. I am sworn to protect it with my life. You will find it and bring it to me. Understand!?"
http://i.imgur.com/uzD86nfl.jpg (http://imgur.com/uzD86nf)

[shredder orokusaki]

I am the best! I beat all the turtles!!! And i got back my helmet!!!

[Allio]

excalibur, whoa. OH he wants Shredder's helmet, iiiiiiinteresting. He also has a rhino in a glass display :o FORESHADOWING!






it doesn't help that russian guy's attire is also similar to the new Rocksteady

https://31.media.tumblr.com/0ad36f37d5a3f87aa8f7e4f87354100e/tumblr_n77b8h742v1rj6kxdo1_1280.jpg

https://31.media.tumblr.com/ecbeaffc9712d419fba8cc679f51b596/tumblr_n77b8h742v1rj6kxdo2_1280.jpg

The brass knux and the shoulder pads to be exact

[MrTMNT2012]

Great Episode but the ending was too abrupt. That and Leo's voice dragged this episode down but everything else was great!

Finally got another Turtles Vs. Shredder fight and it did not dissapoint. Shredder is still too strong for the Turtles and I like how Leo stepped up to him. Bebop & Rocksteady are already turning out to be fantastic villains!

My favourite bit was the conversation between Rahzar and Tiger Claw, just couldn't stop laughing!

Also, the world-building was very strong in this episode. Loved the Kuro Kabuto flashback, brings back the whole 'ninja' feel of the show!

Overall, very good episode with an extremely abrupt ending - (8.7/10)

[evan2000]

What a perfect debut episode of B&R!

I like that they are serious in what they are doing and yet being able to provide comic relief :lol:

B: Wow to the wow!

R: I'm going to pop your head like blueberry!

Baxter lost his voice in this episode. He just buzzes around :D

[Shark_Blade]

You guys are lucky!

*waits patiently*:D

[NinjaPug]

For those that saw the episode was JB Smoove the voice of Anton?

[Jester]

I am the best! I beat all the turtles!!! And i got back my helmet!!!
Please...stop. I'm begging you...

[shredder orokusaki]

No i will not stop until i kill the turtles once and for all! No one can stop me!

[evan2000]

For those that saw the episode was JB Smoove the voice of Anton?
Yes, J.B. Smoove provides the voice of Anton Zeck.

[Electric]

I haven't seen the episode yet, about to, but since this issue bothers me quite a bit, can someone tell me how different and obvious it is that Dominica voicing?

[Jester]

I haven't seen the episode yet, about to, but since this issue bothers me quite a bit, can someone tell me how different and obvious it is that Dominica voicing?
It's all a matter of how much of an ear you have. It's almost a learned thing.

[JTH]

I haven't seen the episode yet, about to, but since this issue bothers me quite a bit, can someone tell me how different and obvious it is that Dominica voicing?
I felt it was slightly more noticeable in this episode than in Pizza Face, but all in all, it's still similar enough that it's not a big disturbance.

[Sewer Sirens Podcast]

Saw it. Overall, good episode. Not as good as the last one, in my opinion, but better than some of the last few: Lonely Mutation of Baxter Stockman, Mazes and Mutants, and Newtralized.

However, one thing...why couldn't Baxter speak? I was confused. Was Phil Lamar not available at episode or something?

[Coola Yagami]

Liking the ep so far. Bebop is basically Fatal Fury's Duck King with sci if tech. I hope he can still toss his laser Mohawks as a mutant.

Honestly bebop is a huuuuuuge change in character compare to just rocksteady being Russian.

[NinjaPug]

I freaking love this take on Bebop. Great design, awesome tech and Smoove is a great choice to provide the voice.

Will we learn where Anton Zeck got the tech?

[kelligrafie]

Great fight scenes between the turtles, the henchmen and Shredder.

Nice interaction between Karai and Shredder.

The dialogue felt very natural - very fluid.

Leo's voice dragged this episode down.
:roll: It really didn't. Dominic's doing fine as a stand-in. This is getting childish. You can't even use loyalty to Jason as an excuse.

Very funny episode as well. It wasn't a case of dumbing Mikey down for cheap laughs - some of the lines were REALLY sharp.

And I found it moved a lot of storylines along pretty cheap, without missing out anything important.

It was never going to beat Tiger Claw coming back but it was a very good episode and a good intro for Bebop and Rocksteady.

Baxter lost his voice in this episode. He just buzzes around.

Inexplicably weird.

[Overlordofnobodies]

Still watching it but I love how Rahzar and Tiger Claw talk to each other like allies. I remember a lot of people thought Rahzar will not get a lone with Tiger Claw because he sort of took him rank.

All so KillBuzz(great nickname) and Fishface was good to.

[ssjup81]

Okay, so I have finally watched the ep. It was really nice. I do agree that the Wrath of Tigerclaw was better, though. I like how they debated on saving Karai and Donnie and Raph's reaction to Leo's leader query. It was nice how Donnie was like, "We'll help you." At the end when they appeared at Shredder's hideout was nice. I knew they'd just appear and help Leo. When Shredder brought in Karai, though, I figured it would be a trap. I was expecting it to be a Footbot, actually.

When Shredder sent out those four (Rahzar, Fishface, Tigerclaw, Baxter) to find his helmet, I was expecting them to have a one-on-one fight with each turtle at first...

Leonardo vs Tigerclaw
Donatello vs Baxter
Raphael vs Fishface
Michelangelo vs Rahzar

The way it played out was much nicer though. Oh and I loved the conversation Rahzar and Tigerclaw was having. I liked Tigerclaw's line about how he'd want to eat Fishface because he's a fish and then Rahzar saying he'd want to eat him just to shut him up. :lol:

Now, as for Anton, I like him! I don't know the voice actor though. The name is familiar though. He has an interesting personality and I did find his reaction to losing the helmet and coming back with diapers funny. He still was remaining cool. If the Russian dude is going to become Rocksteady, at least both he and Anton will have a common goal.However, one thing...why couldn't Baxter speak? I was confused. Was Phil Lamar not available at episode or something?I was wondering about this after he was first mutated. In the OT series, every time Baxter made an appearance, he was becoming dumber and dumber, like an actual fly. It got to the point that he didn't even know who his true enemy was. I was wondering if Baxter in this series was going to follow the same path. The longer he remains a fly, the more and more he actually becomes one intelligence wise.

If they use Baxter again and he speaks, then maybe Phil Lamar just wasn't available to do any lines, but if he shows up again and he's still acting "fly-like", maybe he's literally "becoming a fly".

[snake]

Wow, awesome episode. I loved Bebop, but how did he get the suit? It was also nice to see the arms dealer again. Amazing Shredder fight as usual! It was so cool to see Tigerclaw, Baxter, Rahzar, And Fishface working together.



Nice cliffhanger too.

[sluggedup226]

it doesn't help that russian guy's attire is also similar to the new Rocksteady

https://31.media.tumblr.com/0ad36f37d5a3f87aa8f7e4f87354100e/tumblr_n77b8h742v1rj6kxdo1_1280.jpg

https://31.media.tumblr.com/ecbeaffc9712d419fba8cc679f51b596/tumblr_n77b8h742v1rj6kxdo2_1280.jpg

The brass knux and the shoulder pads to be exact


It was almost a given, you can see the glass eye on rocksteady in their mutated pic

[saintsaucey]

It was buzz kill right? So the russian will become rocksteady right? I'll admit that I doubted the pics posted of bebop and rocksteady and thought they were fakes. Turns out I was wrong.

[JTH]

I found it humoring that the arms dealer shows up here, episode 20 of Season 2, being he first showed up episode 20 of Season 1.

I'll be looking forward to his next appearance in Episode 20, Season 3.

[Coola Yagami]

Most abrupt rushed 'we're out of time' ending ever.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Good Episode. Here's My initial thoughts:

- Who designed Anton's suit, Joel Shumacher ?

- Was I the only one thinking of Leon the Professional when Shredder said "Get Me Everyone! " ?

- Cool, back story on the foot.

- I love the action sequences between the mutants and the turtles ?

- How did the turtles not kill Anton at the speed they were traveling at in the Shell Raiser?

- The Shredder pulled a Bowser on the Turtles at the end.

- It sure is convenient that Steranko came in to pickup Anton when he did.

Good Episode as to be expected, Though nothing groundbreaking. 8/10

[pannoni1]

This clearly was an episode that felt claustrophobic in terms of the number of events and mutants present. At least it responded immediately following the Tigerclaw episode with Shredder and Karai's potential fate. It did give a good natural stance on Shredder. That said, it was interesting that the Turtles could never convince that Kuro Kabuto was on their side. This almost had a Night of the Rogues feel with all of the mutants featured, including the future Bebop which I feel has a slick design. It still had room for another pepperoni reference that I thought would leave to another "I crave pizza no more" moment for Michelangelo. At least Karai escaped so it will be interesting to see if she can fully join the TMNT team for the next important battle. That said, we return to a Kraang-centric episode next week. While it didn't feel as great as last weeks, this is still worth watching.

Overall: 8/10

[Donatello19]

Pretty good episode. I especially liked the interactions between all of Shredder's henchman. Bebop is really cool so far, I hope they explain where he got his suit from eventually. One thing that was annoying about him though, is that he kept saying "hee hee, hoo hoo". I had my doubts about some of the theories that Steranko would be Rocksteady, but as soon as I saw him show up I knew that it was true.

This would've been a great episode if it weren't for Leo's voice...it's honestly just awful. I can't get used to it no matter how many times I listen, sometimes it sounds like an over exaggerated voice, other times it sounds like there is no emotion in it at all. Hopefully the voice actor will get better over time.

So, a good episode all in all. Too bad we're going to have to get back to Kraang plots next week.

[Donatello19]

At least Karai escaped so it will be interesting to see if she can fully join the TMNT team for the next important battle.

Uh...did you watch the episode until the very end?

[shredder orokusaki]

http://i60.tinypic.com/m8ofvd.png

[JTH]

Uh...did you watch the episode until the very end?
Actually, we don't know where she is. Most likely still there, but no certainty.

The scene after Shredder left her, she had something in her mouth to start sawing the jail bars. She could have escaped for all we know?

[Vicky82]

It wa a good episode, not as good as last week but still good but I thought the ending was a bit strange.

Didn't expect the russian guy to be back and has a collection of stolen items, Anton Zeck/Bebob is working for him and he accidently shot Steranko in the eye, yikes!! Looks like Steranko is going to be Rocksteady.
Smoke bombs are back.
Karai trying to break out of Jail was pretty cool.
I like Anton Zeck/Bebob he's awesome, like his high tech gear.
Good to see Baxter, Fishface, Rahzar and Tiger Claw in this episode.
Ouch!! poor Fishface got puched in the face, (why do I have a feeling, Xever is going to turn his back on Shredder).
The backstory/history on Shredder's helmit was great.
Rahzar and Tiger Claw interaction was funny.
Baxter's not talking now?? but was pretty cool that Fishface could understand him
The fight scene with turtles vs the four henchman was great, I love that Donnie throws Mikey into Tiger Claw.
Wow, I loved Leo's reaction when the billboard fell on Mikey, Raph and Donnie.
Funny when Leo's hiding in a bin and had a nappy on his head and then later when Zeck gave the bag to Steranko it was full of Nappies.
Wow Leo vs Shredder, awesome but was too short , I guess they are saving the best till later.
The Turtles vs Shredder was awesome but again too short.
I had a feeling it wasn't Karia due to the description of episode Vengeance is Mine turns out it was a robot/bomb
The ending was strange and felt rushed.

[Powder]

Great episode, but I've got to echo the comments about Leonardo. The voice is good, but the acting is not. He stands out hardcore among the others.

[AdamWarlock87]

I loved this episode one of my favs of the season so far. Bebop was awesome and a fun character. The ending was great I thought shredder totally pulled a fast one on the turtles, I was not expecting that at all. I even screamed oh sh*t!

[VaughnMichael]

haha such an awesome episode, glad I called it about the weapons dealer being Rocksteady!
I knew the designs had been waaaay to close not to be him.
I am shocked they didn't get mutated at the end though.
I've got to wonder now though how they get mutated?
Perhaps after seeing all the other freaks they think they need to power themselves up and get some mutagen.
Unless of course Shredder comes after them and that's how it happens.
Karai is on a mission thought with what she's doing she'll be out of her cell in a year (or in an episode with TV pacing lol).
I really loved all the characters being together here and I can tell Fishface is going to get fed up and leave at some point what with everyone abusing him.
It'd be a really great episode if he comes to Donatello for help.
I did find it odd though that Baxter couldn't talk, I have to wonder if they're going to have him start turning more fly than man (like in the 80's toon).
Over all I really liked this one minus Anton's Michael Jackson laugh so I give it an 8 out of 10 stars.

[OrangeNinja1987]

Good episode. It wasn't too amazing, but I did love Anton Zeck. He will make a perfect new version of Bebop. Though, I don't think I'd be fond of the arms dealer as Rocksteady, but it looks like it will be him. I was hoping for Rocksteady to be a friend of Bebop's like in the original and for him to have a cool voice because I always loved how the original Rocksteady sounded. No more "Say your prayers, toitles"?
I loved the backstory on the Foot clan and the helmet. Perfection.
Dominic was an okay Leonardo, but his voice just bothered me for the entire episode. I'm used to Biggs and even though he is a complete jerk I think he plays Leonardo better. It took me out of the show hearing Leo sound different.
The bomb that looked like Karai at the end was rushed but it seemed like something Shredder would totally do.
I'd give this a 7.5/10. :)

[Sewer Sirens Podcast]

Really enjoyed the reappearance of the Russian guy, Steranko. Since he was in one of my favorite episodes from Season 1, Enemy of my Enemy, I remember him and his character. Cool how they brought him back. And, if he turns out to be Rocksteady, I think that'll be interesting. Wasn't expecting that until people one here pointed it out. Excited to see how Bebop and Rocksteady will become a team. I don't know if I'd be all for him as Rocksteady, though. I think I'd rather have him stay human.

Anton was a cool character, I like him and I am satisfied with the fact that Bebop won't be totally stupid, just like he used to be. That doesn't mean that I WANT him to turn into another Mutant of the Week character.

The new voice actor for Leo was fine, except he'll take awhile to get used to.

And, yes, the ending of the episode didn't really work well.

[fridaynightdestination]

That was a great episode! Great action, I loved the fight between Leonardo and Shredder, all the villains going after the helmet was cool, seeing Bepop was awesome, the ending was cool, it fooled me, so overall, great episode. But dear GOD did Leonardo's voice actor suck! That's not permanent, is it? Please tell me it isn't permanent. I thought I heard he was taking the rest of the season off to take time to spend with his new baby? I hope its not permanent. But overall, great episode. 8.5/10

[Donatello19]

I forgot to ask, why can't Baxter talk anymore? He was clearly capable of speech last time.

[JTH]

An ending like that will always look rushed on TV, when you see the credits rolling before anything happens, you know something will end sudden, and it doesn't impact you as much because you know it's coming too fast.

I said the same thing in "Of Rats and Men", that ending was rushed too on TV because Rat King and Splinter were still fighting when the credits started, but when you watch the episodes on ITunes or elsewhere and the credits aren't rolling, you aren't preparing for a rushed ending and it comes off much better.

I'm personally fine with the ending, IF Plan 10 picks up right where this episode leaves off and they start the next story. If not, I agree with the rushed ending.

[Sewer Sirens Podcast]

Also, as Vicky82 said, it was kind of disappointing that I, at least, knew that Karai wasn't Karai in the ending, because or the next two episodes descriptions. Sort of ruined the whole surprise element for me, which stunk.

Better consider not reading episode descriptions any more...:ohwell:

[Leofan26]

Oh man freakin awesome episode. Loved, loved, loved the Leo V.S Shredder bit even if short. Don't worry Shredder, I'm sure next time you face off against Leo hey'll get his revenge for what your going to do to him in the up coming episode, paybacks a bitch :D

Now I don't know what some of you guy's are going on about
Leo's VA, I had no problem with it :-?
Seriously though, fun episode. One of my top favorites.

[saintsaucey]

I forgot the russian was in an episode already. So since there was no trailer for next week does that mean there is another break already.

[NoName999]

Really good episode.

Plenty of great interaction from all sides.

[kelligrafie]

I forgot the russian was in an episode already. So since there was no trailer for next week does that mean there is another break already.

Jun-22-2014 Plan 10
SOURCE (http://www.nickandmore.com/episode-lists/nickelodeon/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles.txt)

We will have one/two trailers by/on Thursday. That tends to be the unwritten rule.

[Retro-Specs]

All in all, this one was pretty good. So much to focus on, too...

Good to see all of Shredder's mutants working together, especially Tiger Claw and Rahzar. The way Tiger Claw stated that they ought to get along as equal shows that he still has some wisdom and honour - I like that in the character.

In a way, I see how the Kuro Kabuto back story really develops Shredder as a character. Now we now more about his history, about what he holds dear, and why he is so opposed to Hamato Yoshi, beyond the conflict over Teng Shen - he sees Splinter as weak and pathetic, perhaps even as unwilling to honour the sacred history of the Foot Clan. Also, I'm glad Shredder still walks about and even fights just as confidently without his helmet. I was afraid they'd do something where he refuses to be seen or fight without it or something.

The way Rahzar said "He got your helmet"... that tone was almost like "aw... do you want a hug, master?" In a way, though, I'm surprised that none of Shredder's minions knew just how important the Kabuto is. Xever I can understand, but the way Bradford once described Shredder's past with Hamato Yoshi, you'd think he'd know more.

And of course,

Bebop and Rocksteady. Obviously a much different take, and they aren't going to be buddies in a gang like before, but I do like what they are setting up here... Rocksteady will obviously be more of a leader, and have reason for constant yet comedic conflict with Bebop. Steranko is a powerful person already, what with his collection and being a big arms dealer. So I wonder, will they actually end up as minions of Shredder, or will they be stand alone villains, basically using the combined resources of Zeck's mysterious tech, and Steranko's organization. Maybe Nick thought that B&R were such big characters that they ought to be made into their own villain "group" Or, perhaps mutation will take all of that away, like how Bradford obviously no longer does any direct work or PR for his dojos anymore.

Well, this assuming Steranko is indeed going to be Rocksteady, but I think it's pretty obvious at this point. Official designs too similar, and the rhino in the glass case. In any case, I like where this is going and want to see more. Both of these characters are dangerous in their own way, let alone together, yet the show can also degrade them with a bag full of diapers. Powerful yet funny.

[Electric]

Great episode, but I've got to echo the comments about Leonardo. The voice is good, but the acting is not. He stands out hardcore among the others.

You're right. It's not that the voice doesn't fit Leo, because it does, it's just that is sounds so out of place around the other turtles.

[NoName999]

I forgot to ask, why can't Baxter talk anymore? He was clearly capable of speech last time.

Obviously clinical depression

[blindturtle02]

Fantastic episode! This one felt action packed from start to finish. I love Smoove as Anton/Bebop. This actor is very unfamiliar to me so I looked him up earlier this week so I could hear a few voice clips. He was a great choice. You can tell he was having fun recording his lines.

My better half and I sort of shook our heads pertaining to Baxter not being able to talk. For now, I just chalk it up to Phil Lamar being unavailable to voice him. Baxter is one of my favorite characters, so I hope they let him keep his personality.

Great seeing Steranko again. Totally wasn't expecting him to utter one of my favorite lines,"Why am I smelling the baby poops?," but there you go. Poor guy. I think Anton and Steranko are going to make a pretty great team if they do end up working together later on. It seems that the writers might not dumb down B and R this time around. That's what I'm hoping, at least. Also loved that little exchange between Rahzar and TigerClaw. Nice seeing a bit more of Shredder this episode. And the backstory on the Kabuto was a nice touch. Wonder who had it before Shredder?

[NinjaPug]

I forgot to ask, why can't Baxter talk anymore? He was clearly capable of speech last time.

Probably didn't have it in the budget to pay Phil Lamarr on top of all the other characters or Lamarr had a conflict and couldn't record.


I'm personally fine with the ending, IF Plan 10 picks up right where this episode leaves off and they start the next story. If not, I agree with the rushed ending.

Where was the cliffhanger? The bomb blew up as they were jumping/throw off the roof. Nothing left to explain.

[ssjup81]

I forgot to ask, why can't Baxter talk anymore? He was clearly capable of speech last time.I had a theory in this post...

http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showpost.php?p=1283071&postcount=24

[ssjup81]

In a way, I see how the Kuro Kabuto back story really develops Shredder as a character. Now we now more about his history, about what he holds dear, and why he is so opposed to Hamato Yoshi, beyond the conflict over Teng Shen - he sees Splinter as weak and pathetic, perhaps even as unwilling to honour the sacred history of the Foot Clan. Also, I'm glad Shredder still walks about and even fights just as confidently without his helmet. I was afraid they'd do something where he refuses to be seen or fight without it or something.There is one thing about this story that I don't fully get. How did they go from Samurai to ninja?

That aside, I want there to be more to Shredder. When he told Karai that he had to do what he did, I was thinking, "Um...why?" It's nice that he is honorable when it comes to the foot. Even though we've learned this stuff, he still comes across as butthurt over Teng Shen's being in love with and marrying Yoshi.

[saintsaucey]

I think one of my posts got deleated.

[Hero]

Baxter was a bit quiet this episode. ;)

[martinitolove]

Bebop and Rocksteady. Obviously a much different take, and they aren't going to be buddies in a gang like before, but I do like what they are setting up here... Rocksteady will obviously be more of a leader, and have reason for constant yet comedic conflict with Bebop. Steranko is a powerful person already, what with his collection and being a big arms dealer. So I wonder, will they actually end up as minions of Shredder, or will they be stand alone villains, basically using the combined resources of Zeck's mysterious tech, and Steranko's organization. Maybe Nick thought that B&R were such big characters that they ought to be made into their own villain "group" Or, perhaps mutation will take all of that away, like how Bradford obviously no longer does any direct work or PR for his dojos anymore.

Well, this assuming Steranko is indeed going to be Rocksteady, but I think it's pretty obvious at this point. Official designs too similar, and the rhino in the glass case. In any case, I like where this is going and want to see more. Both of these characters are dangerous in their own way, let alone together, yet the show can also degrade them with a bag full of diapers. Powerful yet funny.

I suppose that after her escape from prison Karai will be starting her own gang. It will ally itself sometimes with the Turtles and sometimes with Shredder, as well as Bebop & Rocksteady working for her! :tgrin:

[TurtleTitan97]

Awesome episode overall. And it was nice to see the early introduction of Bebop and Rocksteady. Can't wait for the next episode. :tgrin:

[TigerClaw]

I thought it was a good episode, finally being able to see Shredder without the Helmet, I was amused by the exchange Rahzar and Tiger Claw had regarding the Cats vs Dogs thing.

[TigerClaw]

I have a feeling that Russian dude is going to be Rocksteady.

[JTH]

"The Legend of Kuro Kabuto": IGN Review
http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/06/15/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-the-legend-of-the-kuro-kabuto-review

[TurtleTitan97]

I have a feeling that Russian dude is going to be Rocksteady.

I think most of us already knew that, TigerClaw.

It was practically confirmed by this episode.

[TigerClaw]

It was interesting to hear the history behind the Shredder's helmet.

[BabyTurtles]

eh...the episode was alright.

Raph was kinda getting on my nerves though.....and then later in the episode he suddenly changes his mind about saving Karai :T

Bebop was cool though.....it's sad that him and Steranko will be changed into mutants....more human villains would be nice.

[ssjup81]

eh...the episode was alright.

Raph was kinda getting on my nerves though.....and then later in the episode he suddenly changes his mind about saving Karai :T

Bebop was cool though.....it's sad that him and Steranko will be changed into mutants....more human villains would be nice.You know, I want Tigerclaw to be demutated (or however you would say it) against his will for some reason. I'm just curious how he would react to it since he's obviously embraced his mutations all of these years. There ya go, a human villain.

[TigerClaw]

I like how Rahzar and Tiger Claw, sees that whole Cats vs Dogs thing being ridiculous, when they were teamed up.

[Luckyday]

Why would they though? They were both human.

[ssjup81]

Why would they though? They were both human.I think that the humanity that Tigerclaw once had is long gone, given how long he's been mutated.

[JH24]

That was an amazing and very entertaining episode. I really enjoyed the fight scenes and the interactions and the final fight with Shredder was really the icing on the cake.

I liked Shredder's portrayal in this episode, for once he's not preoccupied with revenge but with retrieving the helmet, in a way it changed how he interacted with others, especially the turtles. I liked the backstory of the Kuro Kabuto.

The scene between Shredder and Karai was interesting, Shredder sounded surprisingly sincere, showing a bit of a different side.


Zeck and the Russian guy make a great duo (I'll pop your head like blueberry!) and Anton Zeck is a fun character.

I also have to compliment Dominic as Leonardo, personally I feel he did an amazing job. There are some differences but he really caught Jason Biggs' mannerisms and way of speaking. I can honestly say I didn't need to adjust to his voice at all. It sounds great.


All in all, a great episode. I'm really enjoying the episodes which focus more on the Foot and Shredder. Oh, and I enjoyed Rahzar's and Tigerclaw's banter, it's fun to see they're actually getting along, with both being warriors a sharing a kind of bond between them.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Cool Episode! Fortunately, someone had already posted it up on you-tube, so I didn't have to wait very long to watch it. Loved the Foot backstory, and Tigerclaw and Rahzar's chat was fun. Zeck/Bebop is a really cool character- I like him already! Not so sure about the Russian guy, but he could be interesting. Shredder IS a total jerk, I don't really understand what he has against Splinter beyond their feud over Shen, who is long gone anyway. Since it was Saki's jealousy that got her killed, he has no leg to stand on here.

A little disappointed that Baxter didn't speak, but it's cool that Xever can still understand him. I loved Bebop's tech (that skate-line thing he was using to move through thin air was AWESOME!) especially the invis-suit. Some sweet stuff in this ep.

[Bry]

Fun episode for sure! Nice to see most all of the Shredder's minions working together all at once (even if Baxter was conspicuously silent), and they each even had a few decent moments.

Zeck and Steranko were great. Love J.B. Smoove, love him as Zeck, will love what's coming next. Gonna enjoy seeing these two interact more as time goes on.

Dominic Catrambone as Leonardo was more noticeable this time (because, y'know, he had more lines). His vocal quality is good for the role, but unfortunately he didn't feel quite "right" compared to Jason Biggs. I feel like Biggs sells it a bit more, if that makes sense? I guess we'll see how that situation pans out, but if Dominic is in the role full-time, I'm sure he'll grow into it more as time goes on.

[marcelangelo]

I also asked myself why baxter didn't speak..was this another flipped around order in the episodes?maybe in next weeks ep something happens to baxter so that he is unable to speak...
I certainly don't remember any reason why he shouldn't be able to talk in the legend of the kuro kabuto...
apart from that the ep had some nice things for me..I like the bad guys team ups....loved razahr and tiger claw snipping at fishface;)
and rocksteady um uh...steranko invading with a helicopter was a surprisde for me...in THAT instant I thought -hey mabe its time for the intro to the new turtles blimp here!!!!;)too bad it didn't happen...
loved the hand drawn flashbacks in the last two eps...

[Chinibio]

Great episode, and really liked the part with Rahzar and Tiger claw talking. Whenever a show gets the time to create bonds between the bad guys, I really appreciate it. I think it makes the show even more interesting. I'm glad to see this show is apparently taking that road. And I hope they don't just stop there. In the past there have been some shows i have been watching just because of the dynamics between villains were so well done.:) Watch out turtles if they do the villains right, I just might start cheering for the bad guys!:D (joking I love the green team too much to do that)

[Coola Yagami]

Actually I did kinda like the bad guys in this episode more than the turtles. Especially since shredder gave them a mission that didn't involve them. Honestly the turtles could have skipped this episode and just have it be about the mutants trying to find Anton and then maybe fight each other for credit of who delivers the helmet back to shredder.

Bout time shredder had 4 mutants for 4 turtles though. That already puts him on too of the others.

[IndigoErth]

Ok episode, though focusing on the intro of a new character kinda lacking on who are supposed to be the stars of it. Will be honest I found the new guy ever so slightly annoying. And Baxter randomly lost his voice?


Leo's voice... if they ever fully switch it will be tolerable, though think he needs to work on the tone or whatnot a little.

For now, if it continues to occasionally jump back and forth between Biggs and this new guy... given Leo's age I'm just gonna try to pretend it's normal male teen voice change stuff going on. lol :P

[TigerClaw]

Here's Black Nerd's recap of this episode.

7ooDR1avBLg

[MaximeLoonatic]

Everybody it's so sure that the russian it's going to be Rocksteady... But how can we be so sure? If he get mutated, why he would join Shredder? He is not a loyal ally in my point of view

[TigerClaw]

Everybody it's so sure that the russian it's going to be Rocksteady... But how can we be so sure? If he get mutated, why he would join Shredder? He is not a loyal ally in my point of view
You have to take into account that all the characters in the Nick series are In Name Only, They won't be like the originals, Since this series is its own thing.

That Russian dude is going to be Rocksteady whether people like it or not, I have no problem with it. :)

[MCLeo28]

Everybody it's so sure that the russian it's going to be Rocksteady... But how can we be so sure? If he get mutated, why he would join Shredder? He is not a loyal ally in my point of view

Well, if he managed to get Baxter Stockman to work for him, then he can certainly manage getting Steranko and Zeck to work for him.

[NinjaPug]

Who said Bebop & Rocksteady are going to work for Shredder in this iteration? I hope they don't.

[IndigoErth]

Pheh, forget all that (lol not really), I'm just curious how it's gonna play out that they get mutated with creatures not normally found in the city. Hmm..

[Bry]

You have to take into account that all the characters in the Nick series are In Name Only, They won't be like the originals, Since this series is its own thing.

That Russian dude is going to be Rocksteady whether people like it or not, I have no problem with it. :)

Exactly. And seeing as TMNT started as a parody of Marvel comics, something about the giant rhino-man being a Russian criminal just seems... right, somehow.

Who said Bebop & Rocksteady are going to work for Shredder in this iteration? I hope they don't.

Good point. Could be fun having them as their own separate criminal duo. These versions certainly have the skills and the smarts to do it alone.

[MartiusR]

Quite decent episode, although some things were bothering me a bit. I liked the idea of three-sides conflict, but without Kraang. Jesting and frivolous Anton was quite unusual character (well, most of the "bad guys" are dark and serious, I'm not telling that it is bad, although it's a nice change to have someone different from the scheme), but his cheers and laughter became after some time irritating for me. By the way - it would be quite interesting, if Anton and Steranko even after mutation would still be "on their own". I like them as "another team", and have hope that they won't join (be forced to join?) to the one of the existing sides.

Aaand it's always nice to see something from the Foot Clan history, even if the idea of 1500 years helmet (used through this whole time by the FC leaders, and yet still in such shape) was ridiculous.

I must admit, that I liked the idea of Tiger Claw & Rahzar duo, finally some mutants in Shredder's crew that are quite good company for themselves, not under compulsion.

Well, most of us already mentioned about the ending... But yeah, that was like an abrupt film.

Tiger Claw was fighting much weaker than in the previous episode. Well, nothing new (someone already noticed, that there was big difference between first appearance of Rahzar and his role in Manhattan Project), but still, from episode to episode, it was stinging in the eyes a bit.

Decent episode, but it's no match for "Wrath of Tiger Claw". On the other hand - it is not a shame, "Wrath.." raised the bar reaaaly high.

And now two weeks of waiting for conclusion (or maybe beginning of conclusion?) of big twist with Splinter's daughter. Can't wait, can't wait :)

[Foombamaroom]

I loved this episode. Don't get me wrong, Wrath of Tiger Claw was really, REALLY great, probably my favorite episode with Slash and Destroy following after. Dominic did a good job voicing Leo, and I feel I could get used to it after a while. I was a bit disappointed with the action throughout the episode, but that 20 second fight with Shredder was just great and was the icing on the cake for me. I really wish they would show more and longer Shredder fights, as that's one of the highlights about this show. And it was nice to see the Shredder's character development with Karai, and I laughed pretty hard at that scene with Leo and Shredder.
"How do I know you won't attack me as soon as I give you the helmet?"
"OF COURSE I'M GOING TO ATTACK YOU!"

[MrTMNT2012]

This would be in my Top 5 Episodes of Season 2 if it weren't for Leo's voice.

I know it's not a big deal but everytime Leo spoke, it just took me out of the episode! Jason Biggs is actually one of my favourites in the new series and if they were to replace him, I wish they atleast got Michael Sinterniklaas back or something....

[MrTMNT2012]

Here's Black Nerd's recap of this episode.

7ooDR1avBLg

Loool! Love that guy's recaps. He does a great Bebop impression. :tgrin:

[BubblyShell22]

This episode was awesome! Loved the intro to Bebop and Rocksteady. Looks like it'll be interesting to see them mutated. And Steranko would work for Shredder because they were old friends once, so he may be forced to do so if he gets mutated by Shredder. Really liked J.B. Smoove as Zeck. He did a good job, and I can't wait to see more of him.

The history behind Shredder's helmet was great as was his conversation with Karai. Loved how Leo fought Shredder and how the bad guys teamed up. Tiger Claw's and Rahzar's conversation was hilarious. "I DO want to eat him because he's a fish." "I want to eat him just to shut him up." Also loved Steranko's lines here. "I'll pop you like blueberry." "Why am I smelling the baby poops?"

As for Dominic's voice acting, I loved it. It wasn't bad at all, and if he's replacing Jason permanently, then I'm all for it. He did show emotion when the sign fell on his brothers, and even when he was determined to save Karai. It was great. Bring it on!

Overall, a pretty awesome episode. Can't wait to see more of this arc in two weeks, though I'm anxious for Plan 10 to see how that turns out, too.

I also can't wait to see Steranko and Zeck as Bebop and Rocksteady as I feel it'll be amusing to see these two trying to work together.

[martinitolove]

Good point. Could be fun having them as their own separate criminal duo. These versions certainly have the skills and the smarts to do it alone.

See my previous assumption!

I suppose that after her escape from prison Karai will be starting her own gang. It will ally itself sometimes with the Turtles and sometimes with Shredder, as well as Bebop & Rocksteady working for her! :tgrin:

[CyberCubed]

You have to take into account that all the characters in the Nick series are In Name Only, They won't be like the originals, Since this series is its own thing.

That Russian dude is going to be Rocksteady whether people like it or not, I have no problem with it. :)

Uh, what? The characters aren't just name only they are the characters.

[saber16]

Fun episode, though I can't believe it didn't hit me sooner that Steranko would be Rocksteady. Glass eyes... brass knuckles and spiked shoulder pads... a gold tooth/tusk....

[LeotheLateBloomer]

This would be in my Top 5 Episodes of Season 2 if it weren't for Leo's voice.

I know it's not a big deal but everytime Leo spoke, it just took me out of the episode! Jason Biggs is actually one of my favourites in the new series and if they were to replace him, I wish they atleast got Michael Sinterniklaas back or something....

Mike Sinterniklaas is my favorite voice for Leo but the new voice isn't bad, just noticeably different. I would fangasm in a heartbeat if he even voices at all I this show.

This episode was pretty decent. The third time the turtles fight the Shredder. Although as soon as the turtles grabbed Karai, it came to me that the Karai they rescued might be a fake.

[ssjup81]

I never did comment on Leo's voice in this ep. It was okay. He sounds fine, but....I will admit to Jason Biggs having a better delivery. The stand in/replacement (whichever) just needs to work on it more. As I've said before, at least it's not completely awful, like OT Donnie and Raph's voice standins.

You know, given this characterization of Leonardo, I wonder how Cam Clarke would voice him.

[electric_sheep]

So they steal my Mikey needing two pizza's bit and they don't even aknowledge me, this is bull...

[Coola Yagami]

Uh, what? The characters aren't just name only they are the characters.

Nope. I don't remember seeing dr. Falco, Anton, Chris Bradford, and the Pulverizer in the old cartoon. They are these characters in name only. Especially Bradford.

[FoxBoxKid]

Watching the episode right now and I'm finding Leo's alt-voice very distracting. It's kinda uncanny valley-esque, like he's been replaced by a look-alike impostor who really needs to work on their Leonardo impression. If they keep doing this regularly, I might stop watching.

[Metalwolf]

Nope. I don't remember seeing dr. Falco, Anton, Chris Bradford, and the Pulverizer in the old cartoon. They are these characters in name only. Especially Bradford.That's why I love this show, they aren't the 80's show characters. They are completely separate people :D

[electric_sheep]

This is the first time (In moving form atleast) Shredder show's affection towards anything, i kinda like that. It's awesome reason for a samurai helmet on a ninja plus it gives him some depth beyond turtle soup.

[MikeandRaph87]

Rocksteady is a russian general while Bebop is a master thief. So does Rocksteady have authority over Bebop or is it just a buisness contract where he is working WITH Bebop?

[Coola Yagami]

He has authority over Anton. Though that might change once they're both animals.

[n-zero]

Nope. I don't remember seeing dr. Falco, Anton, Chris Bradford, and the Pulverizer in the old cartoon. They are these characters in name only. Especially Bradford.

That's Ninja Turtles. The old cartoon is extremely different from the Mirage comics as well.

Sometimes Splinter is Hamato Yoshi, sometimes he's Yoshi's pet rat.

Sometimes the brain squid aliens are evil and called Krang or Kraang, sometimes they're neutral and called Utroms.

Sometimes April is a computer programmer. Sometimes she's a reporter.

Sometimes Slash is Bebop's pet turtle, other times he's an alien from a turtle planet.

Sometimes Leatherhead is an alligator mutated by the Utroms who's mostly good with occasional mood swings, sometimes he's an evil cajun-accented gator. Other times he's Jess Harley, a swamp person mutated by a witch from Dimension X.

Sometimes Karai is Shredder's superior from the Foot home office. Other times, she's his adopted daughter.

This is the way this franchise works. You can't get too attached to one universe and expect all of the others to follow in lock-step.

[MikeandRaph87]

I always preferred Bebop over Rocksteady so if they are not equals I prefer Bebop have authority over Rocksteady. I am silly like that.:P

Glad to see individual development!

[CyberCubed]

Nope. I don't remember seeing dr. Falco, Anton, Chris Bradford, and the Pulverizer in the old cartoon. They are these characters in name only. Especially Bradford.

What on earth? They're still the characters just revamped. Bebop and Rocksteady are the same characters with different names as humans.

[JTH]

What on earth? They're still the characters just revamped. Bebop and Rocksteady are the same characters with different names as humans.
And the problem with that is...........................................what?

[CyberCubed]

And the problem with that is...........................................what?

I was saying to Coola that they are the same characters not name only variants.

[Ninturtle]

I thought this was a pretty meh episode . I like how this is bebop and rocksteadys debut but I cant get over baxter buzzing . I understand phil lammar may have been unnavailable but why have him there it BUGGED the heck out of me . Also the episode seemed rushed especially the end . And i'm not the biggest fan of steranko being rockstedy he doesn't seem idiotic enough . The episode had it's funny moment was with tiger claw and rahzars interaction and bebops sillyness but there was still toilet humor like with the diaper jokes the enraged me . This episode was a 7.5 would have been better with out baxter . Also tiger claws fighting sucked in this episode he kicked there shells last episode and now leonardo could beat him that easily

[drgon78]

Great episode and dang, four mutants vs four mutants.

[Ninturtle]

Everybody it's so sure that the russian it's going to be Rocksteady... But how can we be so sure? If he get mutated, why he would join Shredder? He is not a loyal ally in my point of view

he has a golden tooth like rocmsteady and golden armor like him also he's inroduced with bebop . It's pretty obvious

[Ashwolf]

pretty gd ep, don't mind the change in leos voice since it adds more personality but the high pitched stuff w/ antons voice is a bit annoying

the fight scene was pretty cool

[MrTMNT2012]

If there's one life important moral we learned in this episode, it's: Never. EVER. Take Shredder's helmet!

That dude be PISSED without that steel cheese grater...

[TigerClaw]

If there's one life important moral we learned in this episode, it's: Never. EVER. Take Shredder's helmet!

That dude be PISSED without that steel cheese grater...
Of course, He's Hideous without it, You saw his face? Good Lord!

[CyberCubed]

Leonardo's voice is probably the best sound a-like I've ever heard in a cartoon. Usually whenever they change a voice in a cartoon its extremely jarring, but Leonardo sounded practically identical. Only one or two lines sounded like they weren't delivered as well, but he was pretty good.

Bebop was great and I love that he's still funny.

[Coola Yagami]

Leonardo's voice is probably the best sound a-like I've ever heard in a cartoon. Usually whenever they change a voice in a cartoon its extremely jarring, but Leonardo sounded practically identical. Only one or two lines sounded like they weren't delivered as well, but he was pretty good.

Bebop was great and I love that he's still funny.

And yet you're not complaining that bebop isn't a dumb as rocks street thug. And apparantly have no problem with steranko being rocksteady as long as he magically loses the accent. You're insane and make no sense.

Just face the fact that this is a brand new show and everyone is extremely different from past versions and just deal with it.

[CyberCubed]

I love Bebop in this show, and his design. I only don't like his name Anton.

I like the design of the Russian guy, but he needs to lose the accent if he becomes Rocksteady.

[Coola Yagami]

I love Bebop in this show, and his design. I only don't like his name Anton.

I like the design of the Russian guy, but he needs to lose the accent if he becomes Rocksteady.

And yet Anton is NOTHING like bebop except for his appearance. Such a hypocrite. They could have had done random white dude act just like 80s bebop and you'd complain.

The accent (or at least the broken English) isn't gonna go away so cut it out.

[CyberCubed]

And yet Anton is NOTHING like bebop except for his appearance. Such a hypocrite. They could have had done random white dude act just like 80s bebop and you'd complain.

Really? He's purposely played for laughs and is somewhat of an idiot in this show. He got hit by the Turtles driving their van into him, he got found out by Rahzar, he accidentally shot the Russian guy in the eye, he jumps from rooftops saying "Yeeehaa!" and he got tricked into giving baby diapers to Russian man.

Its not the same type of stupidity as OT Bebop, but he was clearly portrayed as a funny silly character here.

[snake]

Really? He's purposely played for laughs and is somewhat of an idiot in this show. He got hit by the Turtles driving their van into him, he got found out by Rahzar, he accidentally shot the Russian guy in the eye, he jumps from rooftops saying "Yeeehaa!" and he got tricked into giving baby diapers to Russian man.

Its not the same type of stupidity as OT Bebop, but he was clearly portrayed as a funny silly character here.

Nah, I just think he screws up a lot, I never got a "comedy" vibe from him. I don't think this Bebop will ever reach old Bebop in terms of stupidity.

[Coola Yagami]

Nah, I just think he screws up a lot, I never got a "comedy" vibe from him. I don't think this Bebop will ever reach old Bebop in terms of stupidity.

Plus he's a master theif with the skills to steal shredders helmet. He's a totally different character. He is comedic, but in a wild fun-lovin fast-talking kinda way. Not in a incredibly stupid and incompetent kinda way

[CyberCubed]

Plus he's a master theif with the skills to steal shredders helmet. He's a totally different character. He is comedic, but in a wild fun-lovin fast-talking kinda way. Not in a incredibly stupid and incompetent kinda way

You seem to not understand the difference between a new take and the same character. Every character in the Nick show is a new take, but they're still the same characters.

Anton IS Bebop.

[snake]

I love Bebop in this show, and his design. I only don't like his name Anton.

I like the design of the Russian guy, but he needs to lose the accent if he becomes Rocksteady.

If you don't mind me asking, whats so wrong with the name Anton?

[Electric]

Good episode, liked seeing all the henchman. I'm sure Baxter can talk, the VA probably just wasn't available. Really like seeing Rahzar and tiger claw talk. Weird, it almost seemed like shredder cared a small bit about Karai.


Worst part of the episode: Leo's voice.

It's a Leo voice, yeah. Just doesn't fit in with the others, lacks emotion (like when the guys were disobeying him at the beginning), and is just distracting

[Coola Yagami]

You seem to not understand the difference between a new take and the same character. Every character in the Nick show is a new take, but they're still the same characters.

Anton IS Bebop.

And Steranko IS Rocksteady. Accent and all. Hell the accent you're so pissy about is part of the new take on the character. So quit complaining.

[victory_angel]

Good episode, liked seeing all the henchman. I'm sure Baxter can talk, the VA probably just wasn't available. Really like seeing Rahzar and tiger claw talk. Weird, it almost seemed like shredder cared a small bit about Karai.

It's hard to raise someone who you technically hate and not feel some affection for them.

[Powder]

Am I the only guy who, despite enjoying Phil's work, really likes the idea of a more feral Baxter? I found him far more entertaining with just fly sounds than with a regular voice. :tlol:

[Ninjinister]

I wanna see Rahzar and Tiger Claw hang out in their downtime now.

[turtle1237]

With all the weapons from Myth that Rockstandy has in his collection, The only things he is really missing is Thor's hammer and the Arms of Achilles. :lol:

For people that dont know, the arms of the Great Achilles were made by the God of Fire, and were said to be the finest arms there ever was.

[Ninjinister]

I thought it was pretty ballsy of them to include the Spear of Destiny in the show. Not too often do you see references to Christianity in modern children's entertainment outside of dedicated media, for fear of a soccer mom uprising.

Speaking of which, it's in my personal headcanon that Steranko has a super intense sweet tooth. I don't think most people would be able to tell a fake spear was made of marzipan just by breaking it.

[BabyTurtles]

Good episode, liked seeing all the henchman. I'm sure Baxter can talk, the VA probably just wasn't available. Really like seeing Rahzar and tiger claw talk. Weird, it almost seemed like shredder cared a small bit about Karai.


well of course, Shredder did raise her since she was a baby.

[T-U-R-T-L-E POWA!]

I liked the episode in and of itself but I honestly have to say that I really think the show will suffer without Jason Biggs. I know this will probably become an area of contention among fans but I just feel that he doesn't have the dynamic and dramatic flair in his voice that this version of Leo really needs. I was super pumped to see the future Bebop though. Also I love seeing Tiger Claw. I'm glad they're using him. I felt some of the dialog of this ep was a little cliche as well. My main example of this was when Leo screamed "Nooooo!!!" Was anyone else hoping they would have shown an easter egg of the 80s Shredder during the flashback sequence? I just thought it would be a good way to work him in since they were showing the helmet down through the years. I know his helmet looked somewhat different but it would have been cool if the guy who created the helmet would have looked like 80s Shredder or something.

[blue_angel99]

Perfect episode for Father's Day...:trazz:

Karai doesn't really need to be rescued; seems like she can bust herself out and when she does....watch out Shredder!

[victory_angel]

With all the weapons from Myth that Rockstandy has in his collection, The only things he is really missing is Thor's hammer and the Arms of Achilles. :lol:

For people that dont know, the arms of the Great Achilles were made by the God of Fire, and were said to be the finest arms there ever was.

Let's not forget the Golden Fleece, the holy grail, the philosophers stone, the aegis, ogma's whip, The cap of invisibility, The book of Thoth, the apple of discord, The hand of Glory, and a whole list of other mythological and legendary objects.

[ZeoRed]

So did I miss something? Is Biggs out of
The show for good?

[Sighphi]

Not going to like this Bebop at all.
If the Russian is Rocksteady he is ok.

[pennydreadful]

Oh wow, just finished watching the episode... loved that moment between Karai and Shredder in the prison - all the feels!!!

Also it was great to have another episode without the April/Kraang storyline.

[TurFlytle]

Oh wow, just finished watching the episode... loved that moment between Karai and Shredder in the prison - all the feels!!!

Also it was great to have another episode without the April/Kraang storyline.

Too bad we're going to have another one this week which makes no sense after that cliffhanger.

[pennydreadful]

Too bad we're going to have another one this week which makes no sense after that cliffhanger.

Eh, I'll just spend the downtime between good episodes coming up with off-screen bromance bonding moments for Rahzar and Tiger Claw.

[Metalwolf]

Let's not forget the Golden Fleece, the holy grail, the philosophers stone, the aegis, ogma's whip, The cap of invisibility, The book of Thoth, the apple of discord, The hand of Glory, and a whole list of other mythological and legendary objects.He had all of those? He ran through his list so fast that I couldn't pick up all that he was saying.

[alpaca witch]

I really like the dynamic new Bebop and Rocksteady have, they both provide comic relief without going overboard and can still be threatening and serious when needed. People seemed to be annoyed by new Bebop's "hoo hoo's" and all that but I thought it was hilarious, coupled with his laser mohawks.
Did anyone else think when they removed the bag from Karai's head they'd find out shredder mutated her? I know it isn't confirmed she'll mutate but it seemed like the perfect set up for that.

[BubblyShell22]

Yeah, I thought so, too, but I liked how it was a bomb. Too bad this arc won't continue for two weeks and we'll be back to the Kraang plot next week. Still, looks like it'll be a fun filler episode, so I guess I can deal with that.

[CyberCubed]

Come to think of it, Karai didn't have any lines in this episode either, right? I think there was some odd VA exclusions in this show.

Baxter and Karai didn't speak at all, and Leo was recast. I wonder what was up with this episode.

[Storm Eagle]

Baxter talking in buzzes. They just find more and more ways to screw that guy over, eh?

[madyankees]

Weird unsatisfying ending. Other than that its ok I guess.

[Bry]

The weirdest part about the ending wasn't just the abruptness, but the use of the standard "lighthearted" ending fanfare. Like... that wasn't a comedy ending, guys! They failed to rescue Karai and nearly got blown to bits! Yet it was almost played like the Shredder nailed them with a wacky prank. Weird choice.

[Sewer Sirens Podcast]

Mike Sinterniklaas is my favorite voice for Leo but the new voice isn't bad, just noticeably different. I would fangasm in a heartbeat if he even voices at all I this show.

Amen to that!

Regarding the new voice of Leo, I was watching the new episode with a friend yesterday, and he, soon after Leo started speaking, asked me if there was a new voice actor. I said yes, and after listening more, the new voice actor was so out there and misplaced he started mocking the voice's delivery throughout the episode. Rude, but it shows the change is apparent.

Come to think of it, Karai didn't have any lines in this episode either, right? I think there was some odd VA exclusions in this show.

Baxter and Karai didn't speak at all, and Leo was recast. I wonder what was up with this episode.

Hmmm ... well, Karai had that one line "let me go" or something that kept repeating, but other than that I don't think she had any lines.

[blindturtle02]

Yeah, I thought so, too, but I liked how it was a bomb. Too bad this arc won't continue for two weeks and we'll be back to the Kraang plot next week. Still, looks like it'll be a fun filler episode, so I guess I can deal with that.

I'm wondering if next week's episode is going to have to do with the overall plot of the series. They keep teasing the idea of the lair being discovered, and what better way to lead into that than with next week's story? Does anyone know if that Shredder/Kraang alliance is still in full swing? We really haven't seen any of that since Target: April O'Neil. Or are both parties just choosing to go their separate ways? Shredder and co haven't mentioned it for quite a while now. Did they have some sort of off screen exchange I missed in a webcomic or something?

(Kraang)"It is not that which you call you. It is the ones known as us. No things that are known as hard feelings, one called Shredder."

[Gokhan]

Great Episode but the ending was too abrupt. That and Leo's voice dragged this episode down but everything else was great!

To be honest I didn't notice a difference in his voice. Guess I'm2 busy enjoying the show 2 worry about something that petty

[AT-Man]

Damn, I liked the brief Foot history lesson! But now I also fear that at some point the turtles will go back in time 1500 to prevent Foot from ever existing or some stupid bull. I hope they will never ever introduce time travel in the series.

[Metalwolf]

Damn, I liked the brief Foot history lesson! But now I also fear that at some point the turtles will go back in time 1500 to prevent Foot from ever existing or some stupid bull. I hope they will never ever introduce time travel in the series.Me too, and I hope the same. I hate time travel stories, since they never do the most logical thing and stop the villains from ever being born. :roll:

[Ashwolf]

Me too, and I hope the same. I hate time travel stories, since they never do the most logical thing and stop the villains from ever being born. :roll:

yeah but in a way, that would be plain cruelity cause theres a difference from stopping a organization from being made and cutting off a persons life be4 it even began, I don't reject the idea but w/ the way tv shows r rated nowadays and such, guessing it would be a huge timebomb

[LivingMutagen]

Me too, and I hope the same. I hate time travel stories, since they never do the most logical thing and stop the villains from ever being born. :roll:

Usually, without the villain, then the hero wouldn't have been born either. It's a loophole. For this series, Oroku Saki killed Tang Shen and stole Hamato Yoshi's daughter. Yoshi went to live in New York. Buys 4 turtles, sees the Kraang, and is subsequently mutated.

If they went back in time and stopped the villain or organization from ever existing, then they would most likely never exist either.


And onto the episode.

This episode was great! Loved Anton Zeck and Steranko. Great duo (and obviously Bebop and Rocksteady). Didn't find Leo's voice as jarring as some people did. Loved the character interaction. Also, it was obvious that Karai was a trap in the end. It's Shredder. Of course it would be a trap.

[Zarana-X]

Did Anton remind anyone else of Dynamo from "The Running Man"?
http://pluckyoutoo.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/dynamo1.jpg

[FoxZerro]

:roll: It really didn't. Dominic's doing fine as a stand-in. This is getting childish. You can't even use loyalty to Jason as an excuse.


My issue with Dominic is that its jarring to hear another voice doing it. I appreciate Dominic standing in and he does a fairly close approximation of Jason Biggs, but when he deviates even slightly it takes me out of the episode and that disappoints me. When I'm not activily wondering whose voices a character and then suddenly I realize its someone different thats' an issue.


Bebop was cool though.....it's sad that him and Steranko will be changed into mutants....more human villains would be nice.


I agree I was disappointed that I liked Zeck as much as I did, because it upsets me that he is going to be mutated


You seem to not understand the difference between a new take and the same character. Every character in the Nick show is a new take, but they're still the same characters.Anton IS Bebop.


You seem to misunderstand what he meant when he said that the characters on the Nick show are the character's in name only. All he was trying to say is this version of Bebop will be his own character. Don't expect any of the character's who are homages to the past interations to be exactly like they used to be just because they have the same name. They are only those character's who came before them in name only, the rest of their characterization will be new and different in keeping with the new show.

You're arguing on a literal level while he's championing a figurative idea.

Can we please end the sniping about it now?

[TMNT is cooler than MOTU]

A very solid episode! I thought Anton/Bebop was a pretty fun character. Curious to see how long he'll stay human before they mutate him.

[JH24]

The weirdest part about the ending wasn't just the abruptness, but the use of the standard "lighthearted" ending fanfare. Like... that wasn't a comedy ending, guys! They failed to rescue Karai and nearly got blown to bits! Yet it was almost played like the Shredder nailed them with a wacky prank. Weird choice.

Yeah, that ending was a bit surprising, but in a way I liked it ending on a lighter note. It showed the turtles (especially Leo) are still too naive as they actually believed they had Karai.

Leo seems to throw out his common sense when it involves Karai, his idea that Shredder would keep his word made me shake my head yet it's also a trait I find endearing. It's so Leo.

[Sighphi]

Did Anton remind anyone else of Dynamo from "The Running Man"?
http://pluckyoutoo.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/dynamo1.jpg

Now i hate it even more. :lol:

[Tazi]

It was a pretty cool, good that I didn't quit watching this show after the Pizzaface episode.

B&R are a lot different from their original rendition, but their new style kinda worked for me, so I don't care.


It's wierd that Bebop now use Chichi's attack:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-5WAqUUN55cA/TegsSXBHM0I/AAAAAAAAAG0/PtsZX1mSMGs/s1600/db8-03.jpg
http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100603041327/dragonball/images/6/6f/Helmet_Blade.jpg

;)

[blindturtle02]

A very solid episode! I thought Anton/Bebop was a pretty fun character. Curious to see how long he'll stay human before they mutate him.

I wonder if we'll see both Anton and Steranko mutate the next time they show up. I'm also hoping they'll work for Shredder as soldiers of fortune on occasion, but mainly decide to be on nobody's side but theirs. That might be interesting if they were the ones who ended the Kraang/Shredder alliance at some poin. Prior to their mutations, maybe. I'm also cool with them working for him full time like they did in the OT. We know that TigerClaw is a merc, so I suppose Shredder could do the compensation thing with Anton and Steranko if he wanted. Although, they did attempt to steal his helmet, so I'm guessing he's not in a generous state of mind where these two are concerned.

[TurtleTitan97]

It's wierd that Bebop now use Chichi's attack:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-5WAqUUN55cA/TegsSXBHM0I/AAAAAAAAAG0/PtsZX1mSMGs/s1600/db8-03.jpg
http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100603041327/dragonball/images/6/6f/Helmet_Blade.jpg

;)

I can't believe I didn't even notice that. Good eye!;)

[pennydreadful]

Did Anton remind anyone else of Dynamo from "The Running Man"?
http://pluckyoutoo.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/dynamo1.jpg

Heeeey, well spotted!

I loved the humor we're getting from the new Bebop and I really hope that it's something that they keep after his mutation - I feel that it's a very fun, fresh take on the character.

Also I'd love it if he kept his laser-mohawk powers after mutation, cuz I thought that was just gnarly. 8)

[BubblyShell22]

I'm wondering if next week's episode is going to have to do with the overall plot of the series. They keep teasing the idea of the lair being discovered, and what better way to lead into that than with next week's story? Does anyone know if that Shredder/Kraang alliance is still in full swing? We really haven't seen any of that since Target: April O'Neil. Or are both parties just choosing to go their separate ways? Shredder and co haven't mentioned it for quite a while now. Did they have some sort of off screen exchange I missed in a webcomic or something?

(Kraang)"It is not that which you call you. It is the ones known as us. No things that are known as hard feelings, one called Shredder."

I don't know if the alliance is in full swing or not, but it'll be interesting to see if that's the case. We haven't really seen the Kraang that much with Shredder, and I remember in Target: April O'Neil that Shredder didn't want Karai to have any dealings with the Kraang until he returned which she ignored. Maybe he decided to sever ties with them after that. We'll just have to wait and see.



I wonder if we'll see both Anton and Steranko mutate the next time they show up. I'm also hoping they'll work for Shredder as soldiers of fortune on occasion, but mainly decide to be on nobody's side but theirs. That might be interesting if they were the ones who ended the Kraang/Shredder alliance at some poin. Prior to their mutations, maybe. I'm also cool with them working for him full time like they did in the OT. We know that TigerClaw is a merc, so I suppose Shredder could do the compensation thing with Anton and Steranko if he wanted. Although, they did attempt to steal his helmet, so I'm guessing he's not in a generous state of mind where these two are concerned.

Oh, I don't think Shreds is going to be happy with those two at all, and this may be the reason they eventually get mutated. It would make sense for them to be punished in this way. We'll have to see how it goes though.

[Ninjinister]

It's wierd that Bebop now use Chichi's attack:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-5WAqUUN55cA/TegsSXBHM0I/AAAAAAAAAG0/PtsZX1mSMGs/s1600/db8-03.jpg
http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100603041327/dragonball/images/6/6f/Helmet_Blade.jpg

;)

Ha ha ha, when I watched the episode, I asked my brother "So did Zeck get his tech from Chi-Chi?"

[Shark_Blade]

Eh, Ultraman Ace did it first before Dragonball ZzZzz copycat tbh.

[CyberCubed]

Damn, I liked the brief Foot history lesson! But now I also fear that at some point the turtles will go back in time 1500 to prevent Foot from ever existing or some stupid bull. I hope they will never ever introduce time travel in the series.

Why on earth would you not want time travel in TMNT? It's a staple of the franchise and the best stories come out of it.

[JTH]

Why on earth would you not want time travel in TMNT? It's a staple of the franchise and the best stories come out of it.
I personally think they should keep it out of the series itself unless it's absolutely dire.

But if they ever make a full-length movie based on the show, I'd be totally down for it there. It should be treated as something special, not just thrown in as a random part of the show.

[Coola Yagami]

Well to be honest time travel is a staple of almost every heroic type kind of cartoon. I don't why everyone is making a big deal out of it as if tmnt was the first to have time travel.

[Metalwolf]

Well to be honest time travel is a staple of almost every heroic type kind of cartoon. I don't why everyone is making a big deal out of it as if tmnt was the first to have time travel.

Time travel just wouldn't seem to 'fit' into this series, since it seems to be more grounded and down to earth then most. Plus anytime we've had more 'fantastical' stuff happen in this show it often tends to be a groaner, a lot of people aren't too keen on April having powers or even some of the more fantastical mutations like Pizzaface, even the Kraang are wearying for some people. Something as far out there as time travel would most likely be too much, and why would they have it? As someone pointed out, if the Turtles tried to keep the Foot from ever being formed then their own history gets erased, since Yoshi never had the friendship with Saki, Saki never gets mad at Yoshi, and none of the events that snowballed from there happen.

The other thing of it is, is that the time travel is often placed in some cliche and overused location, which in TMNT usually often ends up being ancient Japan. What will they do there? Interact with the locals, do some lame fetchquest/stop this person quest and that's it. Or it will be something almost as predictable as Shredder stopping Tang Shen from liking Splinter or the Turtles from being created, which is also just as lame and predictable as the ancient Japan stuff. Because obviously they failed to 'fix' whatever in the past, because the Turtles/Foot and junk are still here! :roll:

[CyberCubed]

Uh, what? The reason they haven't done time travel yet is for the same reason we haven't had a Dimension X adventure on other planets yet...the CG limitations of the show prevents them from creating new sets outside of rare occasions.

Given Season 3 should up the budget I fully expect more sets created outside of NYC. The Turtles definitely need to time travel to the prehistoric dinosaur past, ancient Japan, and then future. It's a staple of every series.

[victory_angel]

If time travel is used, and they go to the past it has to be for a good reason. For example, April and the turtles seeing a holographic vision of how April's mother was abducted and how she supposedly escaped the Kraang.

If they go to the future it's always hypothetical. One of future story lines that is brought to the 2012 story in fanfics is the "Same as it Never Was." plot. It's always bugged me how the 2k3 never actually had a follow up to the events to what the Turtles saw and encountered when they were thrown across time and space.

The one thing that everyone can agree on, is that the world Donnie is sent to made the ones the others went seam like vacations. And should a Same as it Never Was event happen, I hope they initially don't have Donnie talk about what he saw. But make it clear whatever it was bothered him, before he does tell everyone what he experienced.


Other time travel events have the adult versions of the Turtles appear in the past seeking the help of their younger selves against another enemy.

[InsaneZane]

I enjoyed this episode a lot! Can't wait to see bebop and Rocksteady get mutated!

I really liked how Shredder seems to desire Karai's allegiance, even though we've heard him threaten her in the past, it gives more personality to The Shredder!

Why couldn't more episodes this season be like this one?
I was starting to think this show was really going downhill, but now I have high hopes again, I hope season 3 has way less of the ridiculousness

[Metalwolf]

I really liked how Shredder seems to desire Karai's allegiance, even though we've heard him threaten her in the past, it gives more personality to The Shredder!I think he does care about her to a degree, you could hear it a little in his voice. But this care is also a bit warped and twisted by his desire for revenge.


Why couldn't more episodes this season be like this one?
I was starting to think this show was really going downhill, but now I have high hopes again, I hope season 3 has way less of the ridiculousnessI think that is the feeling of many people on here, so you aren't alone on this. Hopefully they have way less of the MOTW junk and start doing stuff with the existing dudes they have.

[Eiko]

Why couldn't more episodes this season be like this one?
I was starting to think this show was really going downhill, but now I have high hopes again, I hope season 3 has way less of the ridiculousness

Yes I agree, I was getting really bored with the amount of silly episodes this season. just hope that season 3 does have more episodes like this one.

[rickwj324]

I really liked this episode, however I don't like the design of Zeck/Bebop at all. I didn't like his hokey tech suit, the silly mohawk blades he threw, or his voice.
Overall, it's not that big of a deal, but his design was the first thing I can honestly say I didn't like about this show. It'll be interesting to see how his character translates over to Bebop.

Rick

[Ninturtle]

I really liked this episode, however I don't like the design of Zeck/Bebop at all. I didn't like his hokey tech suit, the silly mohawk blades he threw, or his voice.
Overall, it's not that big of a deal, but his design was the first thing I can honestly say I didn't like about this show. It'll be interesting to see how his character translates over to Bebop.

Rick

I was hoping for a funny back story behind it like he ran into a bunch a humanoid kraangs holding that suit and he some how he got tripped up and got to show

[Coola Yagami]

Yes I agree, I was getting really bored with the amount of silly episodes this season. just hope that season 3 does have more episodes like this one.

Well they do have to sell toys.... And if they only did the serious plot driven episodes you wouldn't have 26 episode seasons.

[BubblyShell22]

I honestly think that Zeck either got his suit from the Kraang or he's a Neutrino.

[blindturtle02]

I honestly think that Zeck either got his suit from the Kraang or he's a Neutrino.

Do you think the Kraang are doing things behind Shredder's back? Selling weapons and all that? That'd be interesting. I'm guessing he got the suit from the Kraang. It'd be cool if the Neutrinos showed up eventually. Yeah, maybe he's one of them. I really hate waiting to see!

[Bry]

I honestly think that Zeck either got his suit from the Kraang or he's a Neutrino.

It'd be nice to get more backstory about that. I imagine we will at some point? It very specificaly looked like Kraang tech so it seems like a safe assumption - though it's a weird thing to go unexplained.

[ssjup81]

I think he does care about her to a degree, you could hear it a little in his voice. But this care is also a bit warped and twisted by his desire for revenge.

I think that is the feeling of many people on here, so you aren't alone on this. Hopefully they have way less of the MOTW junk and start doing stuff with the existing dudes they have.This is good and all, but what does the target audience want? If they like their mutant of the week stuff, they'll probably stick with that.

[CyberCubed]

LOL, why would anyone think Bebop is a Neutrino? He's obviously human.

[FoxZerro]

LOL, why would anyone think Bebop is a Neutrino? He's obviously human.

His name, his hairstyle, his technology. I intially thought when they said the name "Zeck" I thought he might be a neutrino, then when I saw him I knew it was the man who would be Bebop

[Powder]

Totally makes sense to me. I kinda like that idea, as a matter of fact.

[blindturtle02]

This is good and all, but what does the target audience want? If they like their mutant of the week stuff, they'll probably stick with that.

Kids are probably more likely to buy cool looking mutants in terms of toys, so I have a feeling they'll stick with mutants and aliens. You overhear allot if you tend to work in a school district. I've heard allot of,"Rahzar's a beast! I want the action figure," and,"So and so looks really nasty. They need to make him!" The mutant of the week stuff seems to be going over really well with the kids. They like the Kraang stuff too of course. I was in Walmart after this episode aired shopping for groceries and we were checking out the Turtles stuff. Some kid was there talking with his mom and passed over Baxter in his armored suit. He goes,"Nah, I want them to make Baxter fly. He got his butt kicked when he was human, but he was great in the episodes with Bat daddy and Mohawk guy." Bat daddy? lol Out of the mouths of babes and all that. I really enjoyed seeing Steranko and Anton in human form though. Loved the mutant vs mutant action we got last weekend. The writers seem like they're trying to please both audiences the best they can. Man, I hope Shredder keeps most of these minions around. I like the variety he's got going.

[MrTMNT2012]

This Episode got an all-time low rating for the series!

It managed to score 1.8 Million viewers only....yikes. Not really surprising seeing how it got ZERO promotion.

[blindturtle02]

This Episode got an all-time low rating for the series!

It managed to score 1.8 Million viewers only....yikes. Not really surprising seeing how it got ZERO promotion.

Hope Nick gets on the ball with promos. Some animated series do mini trailers for each episode and all Nick manages to focus on is usually a joke or two whenever they do promos. Or you'll see the same one pertaining to a group of episodes for a few weeks. I forgot this one didn't get any promotions. And it was such an awesome episode too.

[Vicky82]

This Episode got an all-time low rating for the series!

It managed to score 1.8 Million viewers only....yikes. Not really surprising seeing how it got ZERO promotion.

Don't forget it was Father's Day too, so kids spending the day with there dads.

[BlisterStockboy]

I haven't been watching this season a whole lot because of other stuff going on in my life, but I did catch this episode because I saw the introduction of a pre-mutated Bebop. So I figured I'd watch it, and damn..

This episode was great. It was a lot of fun. Nothing too interesting happened though, which was kind of disappointing, but I loved seeing all of the villains interact. Since the Turtles can cut through the foot soldier robots like butter, I was very glad to see that Shredder's army of mutants is finally growing to be a challenge. The villains are so cool, and I can't wait for Bebop and Rocksteady.

[BubblyShell22]

Do you think the Kraang are doing things behind Shredder's back? Selling weapons and all that? That'd be interesting. I'm guessing he got the suit from the Kraang. It'd be cool if the Neutrinos showed up eventually. Yeah, maybe he's one of them. I really hate waiting to see!

They could be. You never know. I know, but it would be a good way to introduce them, don't you think?


LOL, why would anyone think Bebop is a Neutrino? He's obviously human.

As someone else has said, his name, his suit, and the fact that he can shoot lasers from his freakin' mohawk. Have you ever seen a human do that?

[NinjaPug]

This Episode got an all-time low rating for the series!

It managed to score 1.8 Million viewers only....yikes. Not really surprising seeing how it got ZERO promotion.

Luckily everything on Nick was low this past Sunday, even SpongeBob.

[Stugehen]

Luckily everything on Nick was low this past Sunday, even SpongeBob.

I would concur that the lower views are a result of it being Father's Day weekend. Let's hope next week is better.

[Metalwolf]

They could be. You never know. I know, but it would be a good way to introduce them, don't you think?




As someone else has said, his name, his suit, and the fact that he can shoot lasers from his freakin' mohawk. Have you ever seen a human do that?That would be cool if he was, although Cubed would be complaining "Bebop should be human!!11" :roll:

[MCLeo28]

As someone else has said, his name, his suit, and the fact that he can shoot lasers from his freakin' mohawk. Have you ever seen a human do that?

Well, no, but we haven't seen any human with advanced technology like that either. It's actually implied it's as advanced as the Kraang, so if a human can get a hold of it, then yes, they probably could go far beyond what a human being can if they wanted to.

That, and Anton Zeck was annoyed and commented on the amount of freaks that were living in the city, so no doubt that Anton Zeck is a human or else he would not have been disgusted by the mutants.

[Metalwolf]

That, and Anton Zeck was annoyed and commented on the amount of freaks that were living in the city, so no doubt that Anton Zeck is a human or else he would not have been disgusted by the mutants.He also sounded like he knew about mutants for a while too and has been in that city before, since he made a comment about that city going downhill. Plus his other comment makes me think he's a bit grossed out by them, like to him they are the equivalent of roaches. "Eww, now there's more of the things?"

[pennydreadful]

I really liked how Shredder seems to desire Karai's allegiance, even though we've heard him threaten her in the past, it gives more personality to The Shredder!

Agreed - it was my favourite part of the whole episode and I really hope that they keep it as part of Shredder's character even if she does join the Turtles' side. I feel that it brings a wonderful depth and dimension to Saki that we haven't seen before.

I honestly think that Zeck either got his suit from the Kraang or he's a Neutrino.

That would be a terrific way to introduce the Neutrinos, and would be a great style to use for them also! :)

[blindturtle02]

I also liked that depth we saw with Saki this last episode. I was hoping for it but unsure as to whether or not we'd get it. Not really sure if I trust this depth yet. He also said something along the lines of doing whatever he needed to in order to win. Need to re-watch this one soon.

[Ninturtle]

Am I the only guy who, despite enjoying Phil's work, really likes the idea of a more feral Baxter? I found him far more entertaining with just fly sounds than with a regular voice. :tlol:

I really disagree that BUGGED the crap out of me . When he doesn't talk he feels more like just a fly not Baxter . When he talks you get a creepy vibe and in this episode he had no character . I would had love to hear him say stuff like " hey i'm new to being a freak " when fish face insulted him . He's the reason why I don't like this episode !

[BabyTurtles]

so I wonder why they decided to have Baxter not talk??

[n-zero]

His name, his hairstyle, his technology. I intially thought when they said the name "Zeck" I thought he might be a neutrino, then when I saw him I knew it was the man who would be Bebop

I'm pretty certain they're named after Marvel artists.

Anton Zeck would be named after Mike Zeck, who drew Secret Wars and Kraven's Last Hunt and co-designed Spider-Man's black costume along with Rick Leonardi.

Steranko would be named after Jim Steranko, who wrote and drew Nick Fury: Agent of SHIELD.

[Raphtastic]

I thought this episode was okay. I don't mind Zeck too much, although the laser Mohawk thing just bugs me. He'll make an interesting Bebop. Bebop and Rocksteady in the OT were too bumbling for me, though I liked their designs, so it'll be cool to see a different take on them in this universe. I liked Shredder's interaction with Karai, showing that he's not entirely one - dimensional. The humor was on throughout the show.

It was no Wrath of Tigerclaw, though. That episode was really good.

[VaughnMichael]

so I wonder why they decided to have Baxter not talk??
Budget.:ohwell:

[BubblyShell22]

Either that or Phil wasn't available to record lines that day.

[Fang Wolf]

I thought would be a little more Foot History of the founder of the Foot Clan. :shredder:

[kelligrafie]

I posted this in general information, but I'll copy it over to here because it's relevant.

Brandon Auman: "...Sometimes we just go way over budget and we had to cut his 4-5 lines. Baxter will speak in the next ep, don't worry..."

[VaughnMichael]

Either that or Phil wasn't available to record lines that day.
No Brandon who works on the show said it was budget.

[BubblyShell22]

Yeah, I just saw that now. Thanks for clearing that up. Glad Baxter will speak again though.

[Wretched Reptile]

I can't totally put my finger on it, but this episode felt kind of "off" to me. Certainly Leo's voice along with Baxter simply buzzing around and not talking didn't help matters, but the whole thing just felt a tad tonally wrong IMO. For a "main arc" type of episode, it was almost too goofy or something. I generally expect a lighter tone for stuff that's blatantly filler or even many of the Kraang-centric stories (which themselves always border on filler at times), but nothing up until now involving Shredder and the Foot has felt as silly as parts of this one did. To me, anyway. Zeck is just a goofball with all his Michael Jackson "hee-hoo'ing" and his working relationship with Steranko felt like something out of a sitcom. I guess that may be an ideal beginning for this Bebop and Rocksteady though, I dunno. Still, I'm having a hard time for some reason really buying that these two are going to become Bebop and Rocksteady, despite it already being an obvious fact.

Definitely not my favorite episode though. While I didn't hate it or anything, I was just somewhat underwhelmed. And as some others have mentioned, the conclusion was way too awkward and rushed. The rest of it just felt kind of all over the place. Tiger Claw and Bradford becoming commiserating disgruntled "buds" was probably the highlight for me. Loved that. I'd rank the rest alongside Mazes and Mutants as far as how much I was disappointed though. Shame too, as the previous episode was easily one of the absolute finest half hours of the new series to date. The Wrath of Tiger Claw was just so insanely good.

[Ninturtle]

Now i hate it even more. :lol:

Why ? He's a funny , yet kick ass charecters . He's incompetent yet he almost stole shredders helmet . They need to explain how he got the suit but i'm sure that will be in a later episode

[blindturtle02]

Yeah, I just saw that now. Thanks for clearing that up. Glad Baxter will speak again though.

I'm glad it was just budget. Baxter seemed pretty depressed in this latest episode though. Sometimes when folks I know have rotten days, they talk very little or other times they don't talk at all. That mind has to be working around the clock, scheming and attempting to come up with some plan or another in order to get out of Shredder's clutches. I feel like this whole helmet ordeal was a big annoyance to Baxter since he's got other stuff on his plate at the moment. All Shredder and the other minions seem to offer Baxter are insults, so I bet there are days in which he doesn't feel like conversing with them at all. Hell, no one even gets his name right. So I imagine he's like,"Why bother?," at times. No excuse for him acting the way he does, however.

[BubblyShell22]

Yep, very true. He was probably having an off day and didn't feel like talking, which would make sense for the character. Honestly, though, I love the name botching thing. It's just such a funny gag.

[MCLeo28]

^ It does make sense. The fact that he even said he can't trust anybody really proves his self-esteem was severely impacted and just adds on to the damage he's had to his self-esteem in the past.

[Metalwolf]

I wonder why then he just doesn't leave? I know he's likely afraid, but there is often a certain point where most people would say 'Screw it, it's worth the risk.'

Plus he has the lab. He could at least attempt to come up with a retromutagen, just so he's trying.

[ssjup81]

I posted this in general information, but I'll copy it over to here because it's relevant.

Brandon Auman: "...Sometimes we just go way over budget and we had to cut his 4-5 lines. Baxter will speak in the next ep, don't worry..."So much for my theory of Baxter going the same route as OT Baxter. Gradually losing his intelligence.

[MCLeo28]

I wonder why then he just doesn't leave? I know he's likely afraid, but there is often a certain point where most people would say 'Screw it, it's worth the risk.'

Plus he has the lab. He could at least attempt to come up with a retromutagen, just so he's trying.

Because like last time, unless Baxter wants to move out of the city, Rahzar can just smell him out like last time and Tiger Claw's superior senses can also aid in this.

That, and Shredder threatened Baxter that his final time of disobeying him will lead to a dire consequence and for Stockman, it's not worth the risk if he gets found out again. He also doesn't trust anybody so even if he does create Retro-Mutagen, he still can't trust the Foot to spare their life just to cure Shredder's mutant henchman. He has to do what they say or he's going to get killed off regardless of making the Retro-Mutagen.

[victory_angel]

So much for my theory of Baxter going the same route as OT Baxter. Gradually losing his intelligence.

That may still happen. I can see him stealing Donnie's notes on his efforts to create retromutagen, and try to replicate it himself and not getting it right.

We should ask ourselves: Does Donnie us code for what chemicals or things he uses just in case someone did steal his notes? Does he use a code name for April so if someone doe steal his notes on the retromutagen, he at least knows what the final ingredient is? Or does he have photographic memory and is able to remember all things needed for the Retromutagen without the use of notes?

[Metalwolf]

Because like last time, unless Baxter wants to move out of the city, Rahzar can just smell him out like last time and Tiger Claw's superior senses can also aid in this.Well, if moving out of the city is what it takes, then he might as well. And there is a way to get around their sense of smell, if he thinks of doing it. There is stuff that hunters use that they can apply to their clothes, it hides their scent so that the critter they're hunting can't smell them. In a pinch he he could even use baking soda to neutralize his smell. The only thing though is that he'd have to have a pair of clothes that are clean and he hasn't handled recently. He'd also have to shower almost right before he leaves with a scentless shampoo, or he'll still have scent on him. He would also have to find something to cover up any lingering odor, but it would have to be a smell that is normally found in the city, (like a strong trash smell) otherwise his smell will still kinda be trackable. He can do it, but he has to stop thinking like a city slicker and more like a hunter. Rahzar and Tigerclaw over-rely on their sense of smell because they think nobody can evade them that way, but a smart hunter knows several different ways to trick even that sense.



That, and Shredder threatened Baxter that his final time of disobeying him will lead to a dire consequence and for Stockman, it's not worth the risk if he gets found out again. He also doesn't trust anybody so even if he does create Retro-Mutagen, he still can't trust the Foot to spare their life just to cure Shredder's mutant henchman. He has to do what they say or he's going to get killed off regardless of making the Retro-Mutagen.Sometimes a risk is worth taking, if the rest of your life will remain crappy if you don't. if Baxter's gone completely out of the city, Shredder won't want to leave it because of the Turtles. Plus he'll be hesitant to send his henchmen because once his is out of the city, Baxter could go anywhere he felt like. He has the advantage of being able to fly, none of the other guys have that. Plus nothing says he has to share any retromutagen he creates to cure Shredder's henchmen, he could cure himself and leave them to rot in their mutant forms while he goes and makes a new life for himself. That would be the best revenge for him, he becomes human again while they grow old and die as freaks.

[Klunk1234]

I though that guy who has Rocksteady's mohawk would mutate. Very good episode, but the Shredder framed the boys with the Karai robot. What will happen next?

[BubblyShell22]

Um, it's Bebop who has the mohawk, not Rocksteady.

[sdp]

Beebop was pretty cool, I liked his high tech angle thief angle, but this episode pretty much "downgraded" all the mutants including Tiger Claw and Baxter into easily defeatable henchmen. The Shredder fight was cool but the Karai was a dummy was something I'd expect out of an 80s or 90s cartoon that has to keep the status quo but tries to trick you into thinking it was going to change.

[Sumac]

Awesome episode.

It was quite too similar for the "Manhattan Project" and "Lonely Mutation...", but executed right. The pacing was optimal and nothing felt rushed or needless.

Steranko could have been an awesome secondary villain in his own right. He has GLORIOUS PRESENCE and a cool eye to boot. Anton Zeck was certainly by TRON and was aslo kind of cool. For "some" reason he has reminded me of Castor from Tron: Legacy.

Foot Clan backstory was nice, but I think, it should have been told much earlier in the show's run. Like maybe back in the first season. It was nice to see interaction between villain characters, that usually don't have screentime. I liked that Rahzar and Tiger Claw were rather friendly instead of expected "cat and dog" dynamic. Baxter lacking voice was strange, but I guess they couldn't get his actor for this episode.

Overall, great episode, if a bit fillerish.