So what's the big deal about not depicting Shredder as a normal human?

[neatoman]

So I know there tends to be a bit of a controversy when the Shredder is depicted as anything other than a regular human (Utrom Shredder is probably the most known controversy, but see also Undead Shredder and Mechasuit Shredder).

Why though is something I don't really sympathise with. I mean let's face it, the Shredder looks cool but that's really about it, in terms of depth and personality he kind of sucks. He's usually a pretty shallow character, usually driven by revenge or desires of conquest with very few definable traits added. The closest a "normal" version of him has been given something more is the Nickelodeon Shredder, and that version of him just feels confusing to be honest.

You might as well mess around with him, at least that way he'll have something a little more interesting about him.

[pennydreadful]

He's the most well-known and favored villain in the franchise. I don't know how you get "he sucks" from that. If you don't like him, that's your opinion (but I'm gonna come out and say right now that it's wrong.) :tlol:

People don't like him being mutated or being an alien because the idea of an evil ninja master who commands numerous minions, and who can kick all of the Turtles' butts with one hand behind his back is interesting enough as is - it's not a concept that requires improving.

The idea of revenge as primary character motivation is perfectly acceptable and has been used for decades in fiction. Wanting to get back at someone for something - either a real or imagined wrong - is a normal human trait that everybody has experienced at some point in their lives. Shredder is an extension of that.

[CyberCubed]

He's still human in most incarnations, where are you getting this from?

OT = human
Nick = human
Movies = human (even after Super Shredder)
Archie = human
Mirage = human (worm clones separate character)
IDW = human (resurrected but still human)

It was only in 4kids he was an Utrom and yet there was still a human Oroku Saki in the past.

[IndigoErth]

I guess making him anything besides human might take away from his conflict with Splinter/Turtles, making it less personal and might lose some of the connection to why it's even there. ?

If your enemy turns out to be some evil alien, then I guess your conflict with them was more on circumstance and chance than anything of personal meaning on either side. Ends up you just got involved because...uh, well you just did, and they were bad so I guess someone had to.

I dunno, just my thought on it at least. Can't say I've ever really given it much thought before other than preferring human Shredder.

[neatoman]

He's still human in most incarnations, where are you getting this from?

OT = human
Nick = human
Movies = human (even after Super Shredder)
Archie = human
Mirage = human (worm clones separate character)
IDW = human (resurrected but still human)

It was only in 4kids he was an Utrom and yet there was still a human Oroku Saki in the past.

Key word is "normal", I would hardly say "resurrected and immortal" is something "normal".

[mexichrist83]

People don't like him being mutated or being an alien because the idea of an evil ninja master who commands numerous minions, and who can kick all of the Turtles' butts with one hand behind his back is interesting enough as is - it's not a concept that requires improving.


This. Also, in a franchise like this where gimmicky villains can be easily created by simple origin of mutation Shredder (while originating from the gimmick of having blades and spikes as armor) still remains a more grounded villain than the roster of mutants. He continues to be a formidable foe against the turtles without needing any type of enhancements like being mutated or an Utrom.

Even without his armor he could still hold own against the turtles and that makes him that much more of a threat against the turtles. His backstory with the turtles and Splinter is also very important which makes his antagonism against the turtles more meaningful and personal. That makes for a more interesting story.

[DarkFell]

I wondered about this same question, especially since the Shredder Redesign contest will end in a few days. I have thought of at least several different variations of Shred, but nothing that keeps him totally human.
Thanks for posting a thread that has given me an opportunity to really think of how he can still be interesting without mutating, being a hybrid of something else, ect..

[Mew]

I don't know.
I liked the Utrom Shredder in the 4Kids series. There are some people who want it exactly like the comics, where he was in a humanoid state. You had the clones, but those weren't human. You all are forgetting Dragon Lord from Next Mutation, although Shredder was human for some of "East meets West", the first four episodes of well, Next Mutation. Now, I don't mind what they did in the 2k7 film, but it would have been nice to see Shredder not human. I think people are just over-reacting, and if the Nicktoon mutates Shredder, people should just watch it. Give it a chance. The story could be great. But hey, that's just my opinion.

[DarkLightDragon]

Good question. Maybe it's because having a regular human as an antagonist go up against four mutated Turtles and a rat seems rather boring and feel said antagonist needs an 'edge' over them in some way?

[Bry]

I feel like keeping the Shredder human is important because he represents a very human origin for the whole concept - obsession and vengeance, and the scars they leave. Having the concept start relatively "grounded" like that and letting it grow outward from there is like setting the foundation before you build up. To me that's very important. In this case, an obsessive rivalry and a cycle of vengeance are kind of universal, something that anyone can understand. TMNT is a very "out-there" concept, so keeping things somewhat grounded at the same time is especially important. Shredder and the Yoshi/Saki backstory is a big part of how they strike that key balance.

But, IMO, the Shredder being a "deep" character, or bigger/stronger/deadlier/whatever, isn't the important part. In the Mirage comics, he was probably at his most dangerous after he was dead and left a power vacuum in New York. The Turtles faced aliens at war and actual monsters, but it was the evil in a single person that cast the longest shadow and caused them the most grief. In the best versions of the story, he's memorable/important because of the personal, human impact he's had on the characters. That's what engages the audience and that's what makes it interesting.

Even in the biggest, most over-the-top action spectacles, it's the personal emotional connection that makes any characters or any story work. We don't need the Shredder to be an alien or a mutant or in a giant mech suit to be engaged with the story - we just need a reason to genuinely care about the characters and their struggle. This is why the 1990 movie's final battle had much more emotion and impact than the 2014 one, which really had nothing more to it than "good guys here, bad guy there, they fight now".

[DarkFell]

^^ I agree with the above. You helped me to understand how Shredder should really be handled, therefor you totally nailed him IMO. Kudos. Here is your award.
http://chemistry.csulb.edu/images/award.jpg

[neatoman]

I feel like keeping the Shredder human is important because he represents a very human origin for the whole concept - obsession and vengeance, and the scars they leave. Having the concept start relatively "grounded" like that and letting it grow outward from there is like setting the foundation before you build up. To me that's very important. In this case, an obsessive rivalry and a cycle of vengeance are kind of universal, something that anyone can understand. TMNT is a very "out-there" concept, so keeping things somewhat grounded at the same time is especially important. Shredder and the Yoshi/Saki backstory is a big part of how they strike that key balance.

But, IMO, the Shredder being a "deep" character, or bigger/stronger/deadlier/whatever, isn't the important part. In the Mirage comics, he was probably at his most dangerous after he was dead and left a power vacuum in New York. The Turtles faced aliens at war and actual monsters, but it was the evil in a single person that cast the longest shadow and caused them the most grief. In the best versions of the story, he's memorable/important because of the personal, human impact he's had on the characters. That's what engages the audience and that's what makes it interesting.

Even in the biggest, most over-the-top action spectacles, it's the personal emotional connection that makes any characters or any story work. We don't need the Shredder to be an alien or a mutant or in a giant mech suit to be engaged with the story - we just need a reason to genuinely care about the characters and their struggle. This is why the 1990 movie's final battle had much more emotion and impact than the 2014 one, which really had nothing more to it than "good guys here, bad guy there, they fight now".

Well ok fine if having him be a human makes the backstory a little better but he's going to be the main villain, the one who keeps coming back over and over again, don't you kind of want him to be a little more than some dude out for revenge? If he's a one time villain then "Revenge and nothing more" is just fine but really needs to meatier in some way if going to appear multiple times, even if said "meatiness" is just freaky powers or a bizarre nature.

[Coola Yagami]

Aren't most villains that come back again and again 'some dude out for revenge'? That's kinda why they keep coming back, doncha know?

[neatoman]

Aren't most villains that come back again and again 'some dude out for revenge'? That's kinda why they keep coming back, doncha know?

Yes but usually they're more interesting in some way, without a more fleshed out personality or special abilites they're just some guy who really hate the good guy and that's boring.

[Coola Yagami]

True but what's more special than leading a ninja army and being able to beat all 4 main characters without even trying?

[Metalwolf]

Well ok fine if having him be a human makes the backstory a little better but he's going to be the main villain, the one who keeps coming back over and over again, don't you kind of want him to be a little more than some dude out for revenge? If he's a one time villain then "Revenge and nothing more" is just fine but really needs to meatier in some way if going to appear multiple times, even if said "meatiness" is just freaky powers or a bizarre nature.The Joker kept coming back and he was human, he was Batman's main arch-nemesis. Shredder doesn't need to be something extra special to keep coming back, the writers just have to be intelligent about how they do it.

[neatoman]

True but what's more special than leading a ninja army and being able to beat all 4 main characters without even trying?

Ah, ok then.

[Bry]

^^ I agree with the above. You helped me to understand how Shredder should really be handled, therefor you totally nailed him IMO. Kudos. Here is your award.
http://chemistry.csulb.edu/images/award.jpg

http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/tmnt/images/c/c1/Big-brawl-4.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20091111235456

Thank you, thank you! Haha :tthumbsu:

Well ok fine if having him be a human makes the backstory a little better but he's going to be the main villain, the one who keeps coming back over and over again, don't you kind of want him to be a little more than some dude out for revenge? If he's a one time villain then "Revenge and nothing more" is just fine but really needs to meatier in some way if going to appear multiple times, even if said "meatiness" is just freaky powers or a bizarre nature.

I can kind of understand that mindset... but then again, I don't think Shredder should "keep coming back over and over again". As I said before, he was at his most interesting to me after he died in the Mirage comics. His legacy, the cycle of vengeance, is more important than Saki himself. But that's just me. :)

[turtlefanforever]

If your mother had copulated with an alien instead of your father would the same result have happened?

There's your answer.

[syckles]

I liked Utrom Shredder, and the entire picture of the early 2003 storyline. Him not being human explained how he had a life time of training and it gave his character more depth... Even though essentially it wasn't just revenge on the turtles, but on them and other Utroms. I agree with him considering himself the "True Shredder"

I'm so thankful Eric Sacks wasn't the Shredder in the reboot like it was originally planned, I'd rather have a robot Shredder over him. As for mechsuit Shredder, the problem with the new TMNT is they're too powerful to be taken down by humans, as seen by the fact they're bullet proff and able to be hit by tanks. Shredder and the suit will probably become organic in the next film anyway.

[Vegeta]

A human foe is just more interesting as the turtles deal with so many other mutants and aliens. Shredder being a master at kicking the turtles asses comes off as more impressive to me when he is human. I agree that Shredder's character can be a bit one sided and bland but the IDW version is so vile and full of hate it's hard to not be intrigued by him a little.

[Mirror image]

He's still human in most incarnations, where are you getting this from?

OT = human
Nick = human
Movies = human (even after Super Shredder)
Archie = human
Mirage = human (worm clones separate character)
IDW = human (resurrected but still human)

It was only in 4kids he was an Utrom and yet there was still a human Oroku Saki in the past.

Honestly it is somewhat vague what happened to Shredder after he got blown up by his own termite bomb. Yes, the soul of worms don't live on inside regular worms that eat them, but remember the creation of worm Shredder was that of both science and magic so perhaps it was only his corporal form that came to be via worms adapting their foods DNA.

Just saying I would prefer it that way because otherwise the newer Shredder is taking revenge on the turtles for being the catalyst for him coming into the world as without the death of the original Shredder the life of the ''clone'' as he has been called would never have existed.

[ToTheNines]

What the thread title sounded like in my brain:

https://i.imgflip.com/a4yehv.jpg

[neatoman]

What the thread title sounded like in my brain:

https://i.imgflip.com/a4yehv.jpg

I dare you to write an actual Jerry Seinfeld style joke about Shredder's human status.

[ToTheNines]

I dare you to write an actual Jerry Seinfeld style joke about Shredder's human status.

I just asked DeepSeek to do it lol:

*(Jerry Seinfeld walks out to applause, adjusts the mic, and leans in with his familiar observational cadence.)*

Alright, how are you? Good to see you. You know, we all have problems. Your Wi-Fi’s slow, your avocado’s a little too hard… first-world stuff.

But have you ever really stopped to think about the problems of a *supervillain*? I was thinking about this. There’s this guy, from my… less mature television viewing days… The Shredder. From the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

Remember this guy? He’s the main villain. Very serious. Very angry. And his whole thing is he’s covered in… blades. That’s his look. The outfit is just… sharp metal. Everywhere.

What is the meeting with his tailor like? He goes in for a fitting.
“Alright, Mr. Shredder, let’s see… we’re gonna take in the shoulders… AHHH! MY HANDS! I’M BLEEDING! YOU’RE COVERED IN KNIVES!”
“Yes. That is the point.”
“The point is I can’t hem your pants without requiring a tetanus shot!”

And the dry cleaning. Forget it.
“Okay, sir, that’ll be one ticket for the suit, and… sir? Sir, the machine… it’s making a sound… it sounds like it’s screaming…”

He can’t do anything! You ever see him try to scratch an itch? It’s a disaster. He’s got to call in one of his henchmen.
“You there. My nose. The left side. Gently. No, not with the club! Use your finger! AHH, YOU’VE IMPALED MY NOSTRIL!”

This is a man who has never experienced the simple joy of a hug. Can you imagine? His daughter comes home from school, “Daddy!” … “NO! NOT DADDY! POINTY DADDY! GO TO YOUR ROOM AND BANDAGE THAT!”

His entire life is a series of minor inconveniences we never think about. Getting into a car.
*Mimes trying to squeeze into a sedan.*
“Your seatbelt, sir?” “I AM THE SEATBELT.”

And the motivation! What does he even want? He runs a criminal organization, the Foot Clan. The Foot Clan. Not exactly a fearsome name. The Foot. Sounds like a podiatrist’s convention.
“We are the Foot! We shall step on you! We are notorious for our athlete’s foot! Fear our orthotics!”

And he’s obsessed with these turtles. That’s his whole deal. “I must destroy the Turtles!” Sir, you are a grown man in a blender costume. They are teenagers. Who are turtles. And they live in the sewer. You’ve already won! Just… let them be. They’re eating pizza off the floor. You’re fine.

He’s always so angry. But you’d be angry too if your battle plan kept getting foiled by a talking rat. That’s his arch-nemesis. A rat. A wise, sensei rat, but still. You’re the head of a global criminal empire, and your biggest setback is a rodent who lives in a drainpipe.

“My schemes are ruined! By vermin! …Actually, that tracks.”

And the name. “Shredder.” Not exactly inspiring terror. Sounds like a guy who works at a Office Depot.
“What do you do for a living?”
“I’m a Shredder.”
“Oh, important documents?”
“No. Justice. And also any hope of fitting into a standard elevator.”

It’s a tough way to live. All that anger, all those blades. Deep down, I think he’s just lonely. He just wants someone to get close. But nobody can. Because he’s covered in razors.

He’s his own fortress of solitude. And his own greatest enemy. And probably a nightmare at a movie theater.

*(Shrugs)*
But that’s just me.

Thank you, you’ve been great! Good night!

[Zog The Magnificent]

I just asked DeepSeek to do it lol:

*(Jerry Seinfeld walks out to applause, adjusts the mic, and leans in with his familiar observational cadence.)*

Alright, how are you? Good to see you. You know, we all have problems. Your Wi-Fi’s slow, your avocado’s a little too hard… first-world stuff.

But have you ever really stopped to think about the problems of a *supervillain*? I was thinking about this. There’s this guy, from my… less mature television viewing days… The Shredder. From the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

Remember this guy? He’s the main villain. Very serious. Very angry. And his whole thing is he’s covered in… blades. That’s his look. The outfit is just… sharp metal. Everywhere.

What is the meeting with his tailor like? He goes in for a fitting.
“Alright, Mr. Shredder, let’s see… we’re gonna take in the shoulders… AHHH! MY HANDS! I’M BLEEDING! YOU’RE COVERED IN KNIVES!”
“Yes. That is the point.”
“The point is I can’t hem your pants without requiring a tetanus shot!”

And the dry cleaning. Forget it.
“Okay, sir, that’ll be one ticket for the suit, and… sir? Sir, the machine… it’s making a sound… it sounds like it’s screaming…”

He can’t do anything! You ever see him try to scratch an itch? It’s a disaster. He’s got to call in one of his henchmen.
“You there. My nose. The left side. Gently. No, not with the club! Use your finger! AHH, YOU’VE IMPALED MY NOSTRIL!”

This is a man who has never experienced the simple joy of a hug. Can you imagine? His daughter comes home from school, “Daddy!” … “NO! NOT DADDY! POINTY DADDY! GO TO YOUR ROOM AND BANDAGE THAT!”

His entire life is a series of minor inconveniences we never think about. Getting into a car.
*Mimes trying to squeeze into a sedan.*
“Your seatbelt, sir?” “I AM THE SEATBELT.”

And the motivation! What does he even want? He runs a criminal organization, the Foot Clan. The Foot Clan. Not exactly a fearsome name. The Foot. Sounds like a podiatrist’s convention.
“We are the Foot! We shall step on you! We are notorious for our athlete’s foot! Fear our orthotics!”

And he’s obsessed with these turtles. That’s his whole deal. “I must destroy the Turtles!” Sir, you are a grown man in a blender costume. They are teenagers. Who are turtles. And they live in the sewer. You’ve already won! Just… let them be. They’re eating pizza off the floor. You’re fine.

He’s always so angry. But you’d be angry too if your battle plan kept getting foiled by a talking rat. That’s his arch-nemesis. A rat. A wise, sensei rat, but still. You’re the head of a global criminal empire, and your biggest setback is a rodent who lives in a drainpipe.

“My schemes are ruined! By vermin! …Actually, that tracks.”

And the name. “Shredder.” Not exactly inspiring terror. Sounds like a guy who works at a Office Depot.
“What do you do for a living?”
“I’m a Shredder.”
“Oh, important documents?”
“No. Justice. And also any hope of fitting into a standard elevator.”

It’s a tough way to live. All that anger, all those blades. Deep down, I think he’s just lonely. He just wants someone to get close. But nobody can. Because he’s covered in razors.

He’s his own fortress of solitude. And his own greatest enemy. And probably a nightmare at a movie theater.

*(Shrugs)*
But that’s just me.

Thank you, you’ve been great! Good night!

I hate that I found that funny. It was just very easy to read in Seinfeld's voice, and most of it wouldn't be too out of place for 87 Shredder.

[ToTheNines]

Haha I know, it really did nail Jerry’s “voice”.

Very believable too, since one of his teenage girlfriends in the 90’s could have introduced them to TMNT.

[TylerD]

So I know there tends to be a bit of a controversy when the Shredder is depicted as anything other than a regular human (Utrom Shredder is probably the most known controversy, but see also Undead Shredder and Mechasuit Shredder).

Why though is something I don't really sympathise with. I mean let's face it, the Shredder looks cool but that's really about it, in terms of depth and personality he kind of sucks. He's usually a pretty shallow character, usually driven by revenge or desires of conquest with very few definable traits added. The closest a "normal" version of him has been given something more is the Nickelodeon Shredder, and that version of him just feels confusing to be honest.

You might as well mess around with him, at least that way he'll have something a little more interesting about him.

Have to disagree to be honest.... Shredder is and always will be one of the greatest villians of all time (yes all time... any comic, movie, etc) Shredders backstory in most storys is always exciting, and one of the very few that you can somewhat have a bit of compassion for him.... and yet find him a total psycho.... Mirage will always be my favorite.... Simple, and yet so well done. A simple revenge plot (revenging his brothers death) I don't find Shredder (Oroku Saki) in the least bit boring....

I will say however, I don't mind other variations of Shredder... I know the Utrom Shredder is a bit of a controversial one, but I didn't mind it, and I liked that changed things up than the typical human version of Shredder. With that said, he is a staple in villians, just like Joker is to Batman, Green Goblin is to Spiderman, Reverse Flash (Thawne) is to The Flash, Lex Luthor is to Superman, etc, etc.....

I love a storyline that doesn't involve Shredder from time to time, but overall I never get tired of Shredder, and keeping him human is the way to go with his backstory depending what it is.

[Andrew NDB]

Utrom Shredder is just cardboard. There isn't anything there. Nothing, beyond a vague sense of, "I want to conquer THE UNIVERSE!! BWAHAHAAHA!!" But that's not of any substance. It wasn't thought through on any level that I can discern.

Mirage Shredder is interesting, at least. At heart, he was just a little boy that wanted to avenge his big brother... but after doing so he gets sucked deeper and deeper into this circle of vengeance he didn't even really start.

[Coola Yagami]

The only depth Ch'Rell had was, for whatever reason, taking the time to train and adopt Karai. The fact he sometimes seems to care about her (while other times he treats her as disposable) keeps him from being completely black and white. But I guess they were forced to do that because they wanted to bring in Karai but keep Shredder alive so they had to put her somewhere.

Then he returned in Turtles Forever seeing red and only focused on killing the turtles.

[TylerD]

Utrom Shredder is just cardboard. There isn't anything there. Nothing, beyond a vague sense of, "I want to conquer THE UNIVERSE!! BWAHAHAAHA!!" But that's not of any substance. It wasn't thought through on any level that I can discern.

Mirage Shredder is interesting, at least. At heart, he was just a little boy that wanted to avenge his big brother... but after doing so he gets sucked deeper and deeper into this circle of vengeance he didn't even really start.

Well said. How I feel too

[shredder orokusaki]

Iam the best ninja of the world and yes most of the times iam human. Only in 2003 i was alien and demon. But the turltes are very weak anyway compared to me. Human or alien or demon or zombie iam the best ninja!

[ToTheNines]

Bill Burr style standup about a guy who thinks he’s Shredder. Also by DeepSeek:


*(The lights come up on Bill Burr, pacing the stage like a caged animal, sipping water. He places the bottle down on the stool.)*

Alright, how we doin'? Good? Yeah, you look good. I look like a peeled potato someone left on the radiator. But that's not your problem.

So, my wife, right? She's got this friend. And this friend is married to... a *project*. A real piece of work. This guy. This guy is the reason they had to invent a new type of unemployment. He doesn't have a job. He "manages his online brand."

*(Scratches head, incredulous)*

His "online brand." For what? Selling dick pills? No. Day trading crypto? Worse. This fat bastard... he's Shredder. From the Ninja Turtles.

*(Pauses for the laugh)*

I'm not kidding you. I went over there for some ******** barbecue, right? "Come over, the kids miss you." The kids are terrified of me. So I'm there, and this guy, Kevin, is not eating a burger. He's in the corner, on his laptop, *typing* with this intense look on his face. Like he's defusing a bomb. He's got the focus of a heart surgeon.

I go, "Kevin, what the hell are you doing, man? The hot dogs are gettin' cold."

And without lookin' up, he goes... in this low, gravelly voice... *"I am overseeing the Foot Clan's operations in the tri-state area. The Turtles will not disrupt our plans again."*

*(Stares blankly at the audience)*

I just stood there. I looked at this 42-year-old man with a gravy stain on his t-shirt, talking about the "tri-state area" like he's not referring to New Jersey, New York, and... ****in' Connecticut. What's he gonna do, attack New Haven? Steal all the pizza? Good luck, you fat ****, they've been trying for decades.

So I go, "Kevin. You're a mortgage broker from Scarsdale. Your 'Foot Clan' is three guys you met on a message board who are also afraid of their wives."

He gets *pissed*. Slams the laptop shut. "You know nothing of the Way of the Oroku Saki! My cyber-shurikens are feared across a thousand sub-reddits!"

*(Loses it, pacing faster)*

**CYBER-SHURIKENS!** Are you **KIDDING** me?! A shuriken is a metal thing that *cuts people*! A "cyber-shuriken" is you typing an angry comment and then hitting 'send'! "I shall defeat you with my *strongly worded rebuttal!*"

What does he do all day? I looked it up. He's on forums. Arguing. Arguing about the *lore*. He's in these heated debates with other grown-ass men about the tensile strength of Krang's robot body. He's photoshopping his face onto pictures of Shredder and posting them with captions like "**The Technodrome is fully operational. Pray we do not alter the deal further.**"

You're altering the deal on your cable package, Kevin! You're not a super-villain, you're a guy who has to ask his wife if he can spend sixty bucks on a new action figure!

And the gear! This is the best part. He's bought the costume. Of course he has. Two hundred pounds of washed-up ambition stuffed into a cheap vinyl outfit from some weird guy in Thailand. He puts it on and he can't breathe. He's in the basement, wheezing, "**Tonight I dine on turtle soup!**" while his upstairs, his actual, human children are asking their mom why daddy is making those noises again.

The worst part? He's a *gatekeeper* Shredder. You try to talk to him about it, he's like, "Oh, you like the *1990 film* Shredder? Cute. I prefer the nuanced menace of the *Mirage Comics* iteration, you filthy casual."

*(Imitating a nerdy, superior voice)*

"You filthy casual." Says the man whose greatest physical feat this decade was getting the lid off a new jar of mayonnaise.

What is his endgame? What is the goal? To be the most respected Shredder guy on the internet? To finally win the argument that the 1987 cartoon had the best portrayal of Baxter Stockman? Congratulations, Kevin! You win! Your prize is dying alone in a basement surrounded by pizza boxes and plastic ninjas! Your epitaph will be "He Had a Surprisingly Detailed Knowledge of Mutagen Canisters."

He's not a villain. He's a sad man LARPing as a character who lives in the sewer. The irony is so thick you could cut it with a... well, you could cut it with a real weapon, not a ****in' cyber-shuriken.

*(Takes a sip of water)*

I almost feel bad for him. Almost. Then I remember he tried to pay me for a six-pack last week with a handful of arcade tokens he called "Foot Clan currency."

You're not Shredder, Kevin. You're a guy who needs to shred his credit cards and get a ****in' job.

Thank you, you've been great! Goodnight!

*(Exits stage, still muttering)*

Foot Clan currency... unbelievable...