Could this new movie be a soft-reboot?

[CyberCubed]

Do you think this new movie isn't TMNT 2 per se, but rather a soft-reboot of the first? Meaning they'll acknowledge the events of the first film, but everything will be all new?

- We have recast galore, with a new Shredder and Karai. We have new actors like Casey Jones, Bebop/Rocksteady, Baxter, and the original 1990 April returning.

- The Foot Clan have been redesigned to look more like ninja's unlike the army guys they were in the first film.

- Shredder looks like he's going to wear more traditional armor in this film, unlike the transformer Shredder.


While some things are the same like Megan Fox as April and Vernon is back as well as the same actors for the Turtles, we might even see the Turtles designs tweaked or changed. Maybe even a backstory between Splinter and Shredder.

[Panda_Kahn_fan]

Oh, how I wish it was! If Bay and the writers were replaced, and a new creative team were on board for this, most fans would be all over this like flies on honey-even with Megan Fox and Will Arnett still there.

[TurtleTitan97]

I just wish it was an actual reboot and Nick canceled this film franchise just like they did with The Last Airbender.

[TigerClaw]

Do you think this new movie isn't TMNT 2 per se, but rather a soft-reboot of the first? Meaning they'll acknowledge the events of the first film, but everything will be all new?

- We have recast galore, with a new Shredder and Karai. We have new actors like Casey Jones, Bebop/Rocksteady, Baxter, and the original 1990 April returning.

- The Foot Clan have been redesigned to look more like ninja's unlike the army guys they were in the first film.

- Shredder looks like he's going to wear more traditional armor in this film, unlike the transformer Shredder.


While some things are the same like Megan Fox as April and Vernon is back as well as the same actors for the Turtles, we might even see the Turtles designs tweaked or changed. Maybe even a backstory between Splinter and Shredder.
It could be, The fact the Shredder is a lot younger in the sequel, Could explain that Shredder in the 1st movie, Might have been Oroki Nagi, He was never referred to by any name, but the Shredder in the 1st one.

It's entirely possible that this Shredder will be Oroku Saki in the sequel.

[sdp]

That's what I think so as I posted on the other thread. But by soft reboot I'm thinking something along the lines of the second GI Joe movie. The original movie had a bunch of rewrites and they kind of saw the rewrites were the most popular elements of the movie so they want to incorporate more of that in the sequel but they don't want to reboot the franchise. So yeah maybe clear up a few lose ends but also stir away from the first movie. Sachs can continue in a much smaller role and retcon/fit the Foot back into the turtles continuity. A small "that stupid armor sachs made was terrible" comment from Shredder would even fix that and counting they added the "we're not aliens" joke in the first movie it's entirely possible.

[Andrew NDB]

Maybe even a backstory between Splinter and Shredder.

It's so weird that we would even have to actively hope for that.

[oldmanwinters]

It's so weird that we would even have to actively hope for that.

Quoted for Truth.

[TrickOrTreater]

It's so weird that we would even have to actively hope for that.

:lol:

So weird, so depressing.

[NinjaPug]

Other than going the reincarnation route there really isn't a way to have a Splinter / Shredder backstory.

I'm still trying to figure out how Splinter even knew who Shredder was in the movie.

[TrickOrTreater]

Other than going the reincarnation route there really isn't a way to have a Splinter / Shredder backstory.

I'm still trying to figure out how Splinter even knew who Shredder was in the movie.

Toilet ninja book?

[Coola Yagami]

Forget the first movie ever happened. Let's wipe that mess out of existence and move on ahead with a soft reboot. Like the Incredible Hulk was to the Hulk. I like how the movie isn't really called 'II' anywhere.

[CyberCubed]

If the Turtles are redesigned in this movie with no noses, as well as smaller and thinner and not 4 Hulks...I will jump for joy.

Sure, the actual plot of the movie might be as bad as the first, but the design changes go a long way.

[graphic_content]

If the Turtles are redesigned in this movie with no noses, as well as smaller and thinner and not 4 Hulks...I will jump for joy.

Sure, the actual plot of the movie might be as bad as the first, but the design changes go a long way.

agreed.

and if we're honest, the plot lines for the ANY turtles film have not historically been the greatest.

90's TMNT - arguably the best in the entire series was basically Danny: The Movie. And while the whole, kids disappearing to join the Foot was a good solid angle, their execution was laughable.

SOTO - Again, good theory, Shredder creating his own mutants to combat the Turtles - but execution? can you say 'Mama'? so stupid.

TMNT-3 - no, just no.

Imagi-TMNT - monsters, portals, Winters living forever wanting to finally die. some elements were good, but the Foot played disposable grunts, and the monsters were just an excuse to give the Turtles something to fight.

PD-TMNT...even as a fan of the film, I scratched my head as to why they so OBVIOUSLY rehashed The Amazing Spiderman. Seriously the writers need to be asked that question straight up, and demanded an actual answer.

****

To get back on topic:

- if they go the whole NAGI/SAKI route

- if they introduced Yoshi (via IDW) reincarnation

- if there are actual engaging close combat sequences that arent delegated to just throwing members of the Foot around

- and for CYBER's sake, tone down the nostrils

...then this could be a successful 'soft-reboot'. other franchises have done it, i do not see why this couldnt.

[Coola Yagami]

One thing about the 90's TMNT people (Nostalgia Critic) make fun if Shredder's plan. Well... the movie wasn't about some big master plan. Shredder already succeeded. He had a ninja clan that would span generations of any youth that felt alone in the world, and they were already robbing the city blind uncontested until the turtles came along. There was no plan. He already succeeded. It's like asking what's Kingpin's master plan. He doesn't need one. He already runs the city.

[Huzzah]

If the Turtles are redesigned in this movie with no noses, as well as smaller and thinner and not 4 Hulks...I will jump for joy.

Sure, the actual plot of the movie might be as bad as the first, but the design changes go a long way.

You have an unhealthy obsession with nostrils/noses, no offense meant of course. I actually have very little issue with the faces used, the sheer amount of expression they presented was amazing, though Hulk sized, super mutants were unnecessary, so I hope that is addressed.

[TrickOrTreater]

One thing about the 90's TMNT people (Nostalgia Critic) make fun if Shredder's plan. Well... the movie wasn't about some big master plan. Shredder already succeeded. He had a ninja clan that would span generations of any youth that felt alone in the world, and they were already robbing the city blind uncontested until the turtles came along. There was no plan. He already succeeded. It's like asking what's Kingpin's master plan. He doesn't need one. He already runs the city.

And that's why it's so goddamn genius.

Bring over an elite group of highly trained Ninja from Japan. Set up shop, begin building your criminal empire.

Now, your group of highly trained Ninjas can't live forever. You're going to need to build an army. An army TRAINED by those elite Ninjas from Japan, who are utterly loyal and devoted to you and only you.

Can't use adults. Their minds aren't nearly as moldable and they'll never be truly devoted to you.

Kids. Kids with no or bad families. Desperate kids with nowhere to go, kids with moldable minds.

Bring them in, give them everything they could want, all the while indoctrinating them into thinking they're a family, you're their father., building their skill in the meantime by committing silent, petty theft.

Until they're old enough/strong enough. Then, after they are completely loyal to you in every way, train them in the ways of your ninja clan.

An unlimited army of completely loyal ninja assassins for as long as you're alive, amassing your criminal empire to its highest peak.

So, so, so genius.

[Powder]

Yeah, that was a kick ass idea. I don't care what anyone else says. He was like samurai Vader meets cult leader. It doesn't really get more badass than that.

[CyberCubed]

You have an unhealthy obsession with nostrils/noses, no offense meant of course. I actually have very little issue with the faces used, the sheer amount of expression they presented was amazing, though Hulk sized, super mutants were unnecessary, so I hope that is addressed.

I think I was mentally traumatized by the noses/nostrils when I first saw them. They were so hideous and it made me realize the movie would be awful.

There's a reason the Turtles never had noses in any other incarnation.

[Leo656]

I think you were mentally traumatized when your parents set up your swing set only three feet away from the back of the goddamn house. :lol:

[IndigoErth]

I feel bad for laughing that that... :tlol:


Really, it took me a LONG time to warm up to a degree to the designs myself, it was like working through the stages of grief. :trazz: But it's healthier to reach the end stage at some point... I can deal with it at this point, but that's wasn't without work on my part in finding those moments that it wasn't so bad. (And just cringe and get through those moments it is. lol)

[Commenter 42]

Do you think this new movie isn't TMNT 2 per se, but rather a soft-reboot of the first? Meaning they'll acknowledge the events of the first film, but everything will be all new?...


Cubed, I fully blame you for the purple sponge on Gary's head. Infact, I'm starting to suspect you've been being involved in this since the beginning.


Just tape a purple mohawk to his bald head and give him shades and we are good to go!

I've got my eye on you.

[Raptor86]

I am afraid the only backstory between Splinter and Shredder will be: you killed me/my brother/ my father and now you must pay. Not because splinter is Hamato Yoshi, but just because he (and the Turtles) killed the first Shredder.

[Cryomancer]

And that's why it's so goddamn genius.

Bring over an elite group of highly trained Ninja from Japan. Set up shop, begin building your criminal empire.

Now, your group of highly trained Ninjas can't live forever. You're going to need to build an army. An army TRAINED by those elite Ninjas from Japan, who are utterly loyal and devoted to you and only you.

Can't use adults. Their minds aren't nearly as moldable and they'll never be truly devoted to you.

Kids. Kids with no or bad families. Desperate kids with nowhere to go, kids with moldable minds.

Bring them in, give them everything they could want, all the while indoctrinating them into thinking they're a family, you're their father., building their skill in the meantime by committing silent, petty theft.

Until they're old enough/strong enough. Then, after they are completely loyal to you in every way, train them in the ways of your ninja clan.

An unlimited army of completely loyal ninja assassins for as long as you're alive, amassing your criminal empire to its highest peak.

So, so, so genius.

Not to mention that anyone fighting them would have to "fight kids" and even if they get busted somehow they might not be tried as adults!

[Wolfie65]

Turtles have nostrils. Little tiny holes. What they do not have is much of a cranium. The computer program they must have used to morph a turtle into a humanoid mutant needs redesigning.
They also need to shrink by about a foot or so and get more lean, functional muscle, less steroid-pumped Mr. Universe muscle.
Plus, let's not forget that they are teenagers.
The whole story also needs to go back underground.
If a criminal organization (Foot, in this case) would basically take an entire subway station hostage, NYC would be swarming with about half a million soldiers and National Guardsmen almost immediately, while dozens of fighter jets would be poised to shoot any mega-armored Shreddatron off any given roof antenna. No ninja can outjump a missile.
The whole thing needs to be much more clandestine, night time in the quieter parts of NYC (if there are any....), sewers, back alleys, etc.

[CyberCubed]

Also why did they make them into Hulk's? The Turtles have never been huge burly monsters, they're supposed to be ninja! They have to be slim and small!

Its like they saw the Turtles were green and saw Hulk was green and thought they had to be 4 Hulks.

[newhire13]

I am afraid the only backstory between Splinter and Shredder will be: you killed me/my brother/ my father and now you must pay. Not because splinter is Hamato Yoshi, but just because he (and the Turtles) killed the first Shredder.

Kind of a reversal of the original story where Splinter trains the turtles so he can send them after Shredder because he killed Yoshi (who killed Yoshi because Yoshi killed his brother). I think keeping with the whole violence begets violence thing in this case would be the smart thing to do. Honor and revenge and that cycle.

[Casey]

I'm praying for a soft reboot and a simple rehashing the OT. That's all I need to see out of these jokers. They can't erase the first film from my memory, so just use the work they did to make the first one to make a "better" second one that I can at least appreciate for it's references to the OT. It's all about me really.

[Foombamaroom]

Forget the first movie ever happened. Let's wipe that mess out of existence and move on ahead with a soft reboot. Like the Incredible Hulk was to the Hulk. I like how the movie isn't really called 'II' anywhere.

No, The Incredible Hulk is a complete reboot of the Hulk series... It has nothing to do with 2003.

[Tora]

I think you were mentally traumatized when your parents set up your swing set only three feet away from the back of the goddamn house. :lol:

:tlol: I'm dying over here Bhahahahaha that is too damn funny!

[Galactus]

No, The Incredible Hulk is a complete reboot of the Hulk series... It has nothing to do with 2003.

That's not what they were saying at the time.

Obviously a lot of people felt that rebooting Hulk so soon after Ang Lee's movie it would cause confusion so the tag line they ran with at the time is that you could either view it as a followup to Hulk '03 or entirely it's own thing; it's up to you.

Honestly I think times of changed and audiences grasp the idea of reboots that you could reboot TMNT now with little incident. I think even the people who claim to enjoy it wouldn't mind if we got an actual faithful movie taking place of the other.

With just how many "changes" their making it's pretty clear Paramount are desperate to make this seem as different from the last as possible to the point that it seems a reboot is what they want if not for the mass amounts of time and money it would take. Now we have a sequel which will look different but seemingly has all of the same problems as the first multiplied.

[Autbot_Benz]

A1PZAwTWRH4

[TigerClaw]

A1PZAwTWRH4
He makes a great point by mentioning GI Joe Retaliation, That sequel was a soft reboot.

[Mulder]

That's not what they were saying at the time.

Obviously a lot of people felt that rebooting Hulk so soon after Ang Lee's movie it would cause confusion so the tag line they ran with at the time is that you could either view it as a followup to Hulk '03 or entirely it's own thing; it's up to you.

Honestly I think times of changed and audiences grasp the idea of reboots that you could reboot TMNT now with little incident. I think even the people who claim to enjoy it wouldn't mind if we got an actual faithful movie taking place of the other.

With just how many "changes" their making it's pretty clear Paramount are desperate to make this seem as different from the last as possible to the point that it seems a reboot is what they want if not for the mass amounts of time and money it would take. Now we have a sequel which will look different but seemingly has all of the same problems as the first multiplied.
No TIH is completely separated from Hulk 03.

[Galactus]

No TIH is completely separated from Hulk 03.

Yes...but that's not what they said at the time.

Like I said the party line was that you could see it as as a continuation of Ang Lee's movie or something entirely.

[Leo656]

:tlol: I'm dying over here Bhahahahaha that is too damn funny!

Yeah, that one always gets a chuckle. :tgrin:

[Xiewin]

He makes a great point by mentioning GI Joe Retaliation, That sequel was a soft reboot.

Yeah, but that still sucked.

[IndigoErth]

Could this new movie be a soft-reboot?

♫♪ Directing my pain with his decisions
Distroying my life with his words
Rebooting me softly with his wrongs
Rebooting me softly...with his wrongs
Killing my whole life with his words
Rebooting me softly........with his wrongs ♪♫

Sorry, that just sorta happened. I'll just... go now.

[Leo656]

Yeah, you BETTER apologize.

:trazz:

[Warhorse]

One thing about the 90's TMNT people (Nostalgia Critic) make fun if Shredder's plan. Well... the movie wasn't about some big master plan. Shredder already succeeded. He had a ninja clan that would span generations of any youth that felt alone in the world, and they were already robbing the city blind uncontested until the turtles came along. There was no plan. He already succeeded. It's like asking what's Kingpin's master plan. He doesn't need one. He already runs the city.

That could have been a good way to do this. They did it in the 2k3 toon, where Shredder was actually seen in public shaking hands with political figures, donating money to charitable causes, painting this squeaky clean image so if anyone who knew the truth about him, they would literally be fighting city hall to bring him down.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

And then reboot again during the third film? I don't think three reboots in a row works!

[Kendamu]

I figure that it might just be a quick, "Yep. That happened," before quickly moving on if there are references to the first film in this new one. Likely, it'd just be more like an episode of the OT where everything is pretty self-contained and you don't really need much more than what the theme song tells you to understand the episode.

[Commenter 42]

Turtles have nostrils. Little tiny holes. What they do not have is much of a cranium. The computer program they must have used to morph a turtle into a humanoid mutant needs redesigning.
They also need to shrink by about a foot or so and get more lean, functional muscle, less steroid-pumped Mr. Universe muscle.
Plus, let's not forget that they are teenagers.
The whole story also needs to go back underground.
If a criminal organization (Foot, in this case) would basically take an entire subway station hostage, NYC would be swarming with about half a million soldiers and National Guardsmen almost immediately, while dozens of fighter jets would be poised to shoot any mega-armored Shreddatron off any given roof antenna. No ninja can outjump a missile.
The whole thing needs to be much more clandestine, night time in the quieter parts of NYC (if there are any....), sewers, back alleys, etc.

Logic? You should know better!:lol:

[TMNachoT]

Recast a new actor and actress for Shredder and Karai is not reason to consider this film as some kind of reboot (it wasn't a reebot when kilmer or cloney had the batman roles after burton's films), nor the fact of having news character which is normal in heroes movies, buuuuut, it can give that feeling.

The problem for me with the first film was the fact that the turtles mutated on a lab and that there is not hamato/saki vendetta and all that stuff.

There may be a way to tell about them in the new film but that thing of the lab is not easy to ignore, it was told like that. If it was some kind of Splinter's blur memory that could be easily fixed, but not, it was told like that and April was there when they were normal turtles so that make it hard to change... if you want to give it a logical way to arrange that.

[AdamWarlock87]

They should reboot it by showing Krang observing alternate realities (which is where the Hulk turtles would be) and him thinking which one would be best to teraform for and he chooses the one where we get the turtles we all love small ninjas and back story on splinter and shredder. :)

[Wildcat]

The turtles' appearance can be toned down and it would still make sense. There's no need for any reboot.

Tone down the gear. Obviously, just don't wear so much.

Toning down the muscles would make them look more traditional. In real life simply not exercising for awhile looses weight and lowers muscle tone.

They'd still be tall but that's not really a problem imo. Being a ninja doesn't mean being short. They're mutants so it kinda fits anyway.

There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with nostrils. They don't need to be that big but as much as people wanna complain no one would be this upset if all the other versions had dots or small nostrils from the very beginning. It's actually weird they don't.

Why Laird and Eastman, and every other designer except for the video game, purposely excluded even just 2 dots is surprising.

[sdp]

Most of my complains from the first movie can easily be addressed in a sequel, all I need is:
Good Shredder introduction that justifies his first movie appearance
Slightly altered TMNT design, not even a radical change, just a slight change.
A better story.

I don't care what people say, the interactions of the turtles were great, the supporting characters were good as well. The story just kind of didn't make too much sense but since it was a fun ride then I didn't mind it as much but it can be explained away in a sequel with some offhand comments on why some things went the way they did.

[Wolfie65]

Not exercising for a while lowers muscle definition (and strength), RAISES weight and diminishes flexibility.
Not exercising for a week equals the loss of about 2 months of training, which could be disastrous for a Ninja.
While it is true that you do not have to be short to be a Ninja, being super-tall does negatively impact the ability to blend in, hide and virtually disappear, all of which are core requirements for a Ninja.

[letscook89]

They're not real ninjas in the 2014 film, because they aren't discreet at all and they kick asses like a character like Hulk would do. Despite the fact that I hate the bulletproof thing, I like them for being stronger and more dangerous than before. They don't give a sh!t about killing their enemies : Leo throws a military through the subway train while it is working. That guy probably died but they don't care. Then during the snow chase scene, Mikey throws another military out of his car and he smashs violently against a tree . He's maybe dead too.

Concerning the sequel, I don't want the producers to change their faces, but make them smaller and less bulkier. Plus they don't need all these accessories like glasses, belts and so on.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

they killed in the first few comics ,

they didnt really become "dont kill" till the cartoon

[Andrew NDB]

they killed in the first few comics

They never stopped.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

They never stopped.

Triceratons, Puzorelli mobsters, Foot ninja, Foot Elite, Purple Dragons, Federation soldiers, DARPA agents, kunoichi, vampires, Styracodons...

You name it, them boys done killed it.

[Wildcat]

Not exercising for a while lowers muscle definition (and strength), RAISES weight and diminishes flexibility.
Not exercising for a week equals the loss of about 2 months of training, which could be disastrous for a Ninja.
While it is true that you do not have to be short to be a Ninja, being super-tall does negatively impact the ability to blend in, hide and virtually disappear, all of which are core requirements for a Ninja.
Not exercising for awhile is not gonna make you an out of shape obese weakling. Especially not the turtles who are already in great physical shape. I did not mean they'd become lazy slackers. I don't know how you get 1 week = 2 months lost.

They'd could just hold back on workouts and practices until their muscles more so matched their body...just "de-hulk" themselves.

[Foombamaroom]

Triceratons, Puzorelli mobsters, Foot ninja, Foot Elite, Purple Dragons, Federation soldiers, DARPA agents, kunoichi, vampires, Styracodons...

You name it, them boys done killed it.

Hmmm. We should make then a new hit-list, then.

1. Jonathan Liebesman.
2. Andrew Form.
3. Brad Fuller.
4. Michael Bay.
(Possible) 5. Dave Green.


Let's hope to God this movie is a soft-reboot. And let's hope to God Dave Green is an actual fan of the franchise rather than Liebesman.
"Ugh, yah, I grew up with Ninja Turtles. My favorite one was the red one... There's a red one, right?"
Or so called fan Megan Fox.
"Raphael is the leader." - An actual quote from MF.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Hmmm. We should make then a new hit-list, then.

1. Jonathan Liebesman.
2. Andrew Form.
3. Brad Fuller.
4. Michael Bay.
(Possible) 5. Dave Green.


Let's hope to God this movie is a soft-reboot. And let's hope to God Dave Green is an actual fan of the franchise rather than Liebesman.
"Ugh, yah, I grew up with Ninja Turtles. My favorite one was the red one... There's a red one, right?"
Or so called fan Megan Fox.
"Raphael is the leader." - An actual quote from MF.

When I watched the interview with Megan, I actually don't think she was wrong in her head regarding the Turtles' identities; I think she just verbally slipped on camera.

Yes, I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt. The other guys? I want to feed them to the Mousers, feet first.

[letscook89]

Nope Megan Fox knows each turtle (quotes from the "Meet the turtles" spots) :
Leo : "The true leader is Leo, he's in control, he's calm"
Raph :"This movie has a close relationship with Raphael. He wants to be the leader".
Mikey : "Michelangelo was always my personal favorite. He's a funny character"
Donnie : "He's an electronic genius"
Plus I saw her in an interview where she were singing the "Go ninja Go" song by Vanilla Ice, because she said it reminds her of her childhood.

So maybe she has limited knowledges of the TMNT universe, but she at least knows who is who. :P

However, she's still a bad actress :lol:

[Foombamaroom]

I love how the other guys keep saying, "WE GOT THE APPROVAL OF KEVIN EASTMAN!"

Like, just stop. Eastman may have given them his "blessing," but here's the reason why. They probably kept making batshit crazy origin stories, and the one we got was the closest thing to the original, so Eastman wanted to end the monstrosity.

Also, Laird openly expressed how he despised the movie. And it doesn't matter if they got the creator's approval, what matters is that it's good and satisfying to the fan base. And I don't even know why the **** they had to change it. It wasn't broke before, and it isn't broke now. But they just add to wreck the origin.

Also, if they cared so much about it like they claimed to, WHY THE HELL WAS APRIL THE MAIN F*CKING PROTAGONIST?

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Also, if they cared so much about it like they claimed to, WHY THE HELL WAS APRIL THE MAIN F*CKING PROTAGONIST?

Because... boobs? :tshifty:

[letscook89]

Hmm I have the feeling that there were a few people in the staff who REALLY wanted to make a good TMNT movie and on the the other hand, some men like Bay, Liebesman or Fuller didn't care and ruined it. The fun fact is that one of the few scenes thar is enjoyable (the elevator scene) wasn't supposed to be in the movie. It was the four actors who were making fun together and then the director decided to put the scene in the movie.

[Wolfie65]

Not exercising for awhile is not gonna make you an out of shape obese weakling. Especially not the turtles who are already in great physical shape. I did not mean they'd become lazy slackers. I don't know how you get 1 week = 2 months lost.

They'd could just hold back on workouts and practices until their muscles more so matched their body...just "de-hulk" themselves.

Professional experience and the collected wisdom of athletes and personal trainers worldwide, that's how I get that.

As for 'de-hulking', if they were born as red sliders, they are not naturally hulky at all, so whatever hulkification occurred by the time Mr. Bay & Mr. Liebesman had them on screen must have been by way of steroids.
No one who isn't born with hulk genes looks like that by lifting and eating chicken.......

[Foombamaroom]

If I had to put my money on which ones wanted to make a decent TMNT movie, I'd say Form and Fuller. They seemed really active about this. Don't get me wrong, I still think they can burn in Hell for their treasonous crimes against the TMNT fandom, but yeah. Here are the three groups I blame:

1. Jonathan Liebesman - The dude was basically a knock-off Michael Bay, only he looked creepy as hell and pretended he knew a damn thing about TMNT. At least Bay acknowledged that he didn't really know about the Transformers. Liebesman also was incredibly stupid. Not like, "Hahaha, you're so stupid." but like IQ of room temperature stupid.

2. Bay himself. I think we all know why. "MAKE THEM BIGGER, MAKE THEM SCARIER, MAKE THEM LOOK LIKE THEY WANNA *** **** **** YOUR FAMILY WITH A **** *** **** *** HOLDING A BOWL OF SOUP AND A FLAMETHROWER WHILE **** *** ************ ******** ****** ********* NINJA TURTLES WHILE ****** YOUR **** *** ** EXPLOOOOOOOOOSIONS."

3. Those freaking writers. They did a decent script for Mission Impossible 4, but apparently, they don't know how to write a TMNT movie. Dear God, some of that dialogue was atrocious.... But hey, at least it wasn't Ehren Kruger.