From an in-universe perspective, why did Crognard end the way it did?

[neatoman]

So as we all know at this point, Crognard ended with Crognard getting eaten. Considering the real life purpose of Crognard is to be a foreshadow joke, it's pretty funny but I have to wonder what the in-universe reason for killing Crognard was. Was the series cancelled? Was there some deeper meaning you had to have watched the other episodes to understand? Did the writers just hate the character and used the very last episode as a middle finger to the fanbase?

[ToTheNines]

No, we don't all know. Arse hole.

[neatoman]

No, we don't all know. Arse hole.

It's just speculation man.

[Candy Kappa]

Nice spoilers...



Crognard died cause he was dumb enough trying to solo Tiamat, the Evil Queen of Cromatic Dragons.

[NinjaPug]

It's just speculation man.

Spoiling what happens to Crognard in an episode that hasn't aired on TV yet isn't speculation.

[ToTheNines]

It's just speculation man.

Are ya dense?

So as we all know at this point, Crognard ended with Crognard getting eaten.

[ssjup81]

You should really put spoiler in the title as well as in your first post as some of us haven't seen it because not everyone can use Nick's site (due to not living in the US or not having cable) and it hasn't aired on television yet. I'm in Japan for goodness sakes...:ohwell:

That aside, I did see the ep.., That shocked me...I just wasn't expecting that and my jaw was hanging...literally. Anyway, about what it possibly symbolized...

I think it symbolized Zog's outcome. He stuck to his guns because that was what he believed and would "die with honor" to accomplish that goal. Crognard sorta did that too, wouldn't you say? I also think it showed how Zog underestimated not trusting the turtles and working together to take out the Kraang. Crognard went in solo too. He probably would've survived if he had his allies helping him.

[JTH]

Spoiling what happens to Crognard in an episode that hasn't aired on TV yet isn't speculation.
Don't tell Cubed this, he'll tell you everything about unaired episodes and seasons is common knowledge, even if you haven't seen or know anything about it...

[aliena]

Don't tell Cubed this, he'll tell you everything about unaired episodes and seasons is common knowledge, even if you haven't seen or know anything about it...

Maybe Cubed is a writer for the show and pretends to be a super fan with tons of knowledge to throw us all off. Maybe he knows everything that is going to happen all the way to the end. Naw only kidding.:D

[aliena]

So as we all know at this point, Crognard ended with Crognard getting eaten. Considering the real life purpose of Crognard is to be a foreshadow joke, it's pretty funny but I have to wonder what the in-universe reason for killing Crognard was. Was the series cancelled? Was there some deeper meaning you had to have watched the other episodes to understand? Did the writers just hate the character and used the very last episode as a middle finger to the fanbase?

I took the meaning to be for all those shows that fans love that end horribly or are slapped together at the last second just to get it over with. There was even some discussion and speculation that the writers were doing that very thing with the Nick show itself.

Crognard was actually pretty stupid even from the start when he made them rush and kill those innocent guys who wanted peace. He was more like an egomaniac who couldn't see reality going on around him. Only Spooch(?) seemed to know what was really going on.

[victory_angel]

Crognard was actually pretty stupid even from the start when he made them rush and kill those innocent guys who wanted peace. He was more like an egomaniac who couldn't see reality going on around him. Only Spooch(?) seemed to know what was really going on.

I agree with that. And also there haven't been all that many episodes with Crognard compared to Space Heros and SMRFF.

But I agree with your views about the first episode where Crognard and his companions are essentially beating up those slug people, simply because they were slug people.

[ssjup81]

Guess the lesson here is that being all brawn and no brain will end in tragedy. :-P

That aside, it's interesting how this was the first show where we got to see the ending.

[Luckyday]

I agree with that. And also there haven't been all that many episodes with Crognard compared to Space Heros and SMRFF.

But I agree with your views about the first episode where Crognard and his companions are essentially beating up those slug people, simply because they were slug people.

https://33.media.tumblr.com/713e46e0e31cdd52a662b40e496184d7/tumblr_nn49fkyFgi1rnzz12o1_400.gif

[victory_angel]

https://33.media.tumblr.com/713e46e0e31cdd52a662b40e496184d7/tumblr_nn49fkyFgi1rnzz12o1_400.gif

But it's true isn't it. The Wizardess character just says "I sense danger," and then says "Ew slug people."

However usually in these shows within shows there is an actual threat presented. But the there wasn't any threat presented with the slug people so it looked like Crognard and his companions were slaughtering them for no reason aside from the fact they were Slug People.

[Luckyday]

But it's true isn't it. The Wizardess character just says "I sense danger," and then says "Ew slug people."

However usually in these shows within shows there is an actual threat presented. But the there wasn't any threat presented with the slug people so it looked like Crognard and his companions were slaughtering them for no reason aside from the fact they were Slug People.

I know, Angel. I was agreeing with you in outrage. :lol:

[Candy Kappa]

But I agree with your views about the first episode where Crognard and his companions are essentially beating up those slug people, simply because they were slug people.

It's very much in line with any people who play Dungeons & Dragons, many skip the role-playing part and just slaughter NPCs and Monsters alike, often making the excuse that the creatures are of evil alignment and it's okay to kill them because "reasons"

The Slug people, could very well be evil by default like Orcs, but this particular tribe was peaceful . The "Heroes" don't care cause they can slaughter the without (at least in their mind) repercussions.

[aliena]

Guess the lesson here is that being all brawn and no brain will end in tragedy. :-P

That aside, it's interesting how this was the first show where we got to see the ending.

I kept thinking that either the tape would break and pop out of the machine because it was an old VHS tape or someone, or some thing, would burst into the Lair and break the player before they could finish it. :P

[MikeandRaph87]

This may sound silly considering I have seen every episode, but who is Crognard? If a character apparently died it would seem like it would be memorable not questioning who he is

[TurtleTitan97]

This may sound silly considering I have seen every episode, but who is Crognard? If a character apparently died it would seem like it would be memorable not questioning who he is

This guy, dude:

http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/tmnt/images/d/de/Crognard.png/revision/latest?cb=20141004190433

[Haalix]

I think it's foreshadowing for the actual season finale. like what happened in the Crognard finale, will happen with one of the TMNT characters.

And by the way Mikey keeps refusing to admit Crognard's death, I think he'll be with whoever dies and not wanting to admit his or her death. Though I think that's Splinter, since almost every spoiler says he'll die.

[MikeandRaph87]

This guy, dude:

http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/tmnt/images/d/de/Crognard.png/revision/latest?cb=20141004190433

I watch the episodes as they air on the DVR and fastforward through both the theme song and the tv show within a tv show not being a fan of either part of the show so it would make sense I would not know. Cant like everything about the series. Thanks for the clear up.

[kolaida]

Well, now we know, lol

[Toadtrooper]

It was foreshadowing of course (somebody "biting it;" the whole flying away thing).

But it's also a commentary on how most series finales suck.

[Kingoji]

My personal interpretation?

Each of the TV shows has been something of a meta reference to one of the Turtles themselves. Space Heores was often used as an obvious and deliberate parallel to Leonardo developing his role as team leader, Super Robot Mecha Force Five often echoed Donatello's development both in his engineering and in his relationship with April, and Crognard is a fairly Raphael-oriented show with it's reckless, hot-headed protagonist who often does bad things for good reasons.

the relevance of the finale in particular? Crognard refuses to listen to his team and in doing so ends up facing the end of his life. Raph stubbornly ignores his brothers warnings and becomes responsible for the Triceraton Invasion and all that entailed. Which is, essentially, the end of life as he knew it.

[ssjup81]

My personal interpretation?

Each of the TV shows has been something of a meta reference to one of the Turtles themselves. Space Heores was often used as an obvious and deliberate parallel to Leonardo developing his role as team leader, Super Robot Mecha Force Five often echoed Donatello's development both in his engineering and in his relationship with April, and Crognard is a fairly Raphael-oriented show with it's reckless, hot-headed protagonist who often does bad things for good reasons.

the relevance of the finale in particular? Crognard refuses to listen to his team and in doing so ends up facing the end of his life. Raph stubbornly ignores his brothers warnings and becomes responsible for the Triceraton Invasion and all that entailed. Which is, essentially, the end of life as he knew it. This is actually a really good theory. You're actually right.

[Luckyday]

This is actually a really good theory. You're actually right.

If he/she is right then Raph is going to be one who has a huge survivor's guilt in season 4.
I would be a little wary/skeptical on how the writers can handle that.

[senpai]

Some things just are. I'm not bringing too much meaning into something that was mainly done for a laugh. The only thing my brain took away from the scene was life is delicate. Even the mightiest fall eventually...

Not like Splinter or anything because obviously the time traveling biz will bring him back or something idk

[MsMarvelDuckie]

It's very much in line with any people who play Dungeons & Dragons, many skip the role-playing part and just slaughter NPCs and Monsters alike, often making the excuse that the creatures are of evil alignment and it's okay to kill them because "reasons"

The Slug people, could very well be evil by default like Orcs, but this particular tribe was peaceful . The "Heroes" don't care cause they can slaughter the without (at least in their mind) repercussions.


I don't know about yours, but that sort of thing would NEVER fly in my game groups. I spent 18+ years as a DM, and only ONCE did something like that happen- and I penalized the players responsible by throwing some very strong and immediate repercussions at them, that actually ended that entire campaign before it ever really got started. They learned quickly not to pull that kind of crap in my games!

As for my current group that I'm a player in, the DM is pretty much the same, and really encourages us to think about things before we go in. But then, several of us are veteran players or DM's ourselves, so we know what to expect, and not to take things at face value.


My personal interpretation?

Each of the TV shows has been something of a meta reference to one of the Turtles themselves. Space Heores was often used as an obvious and deliberate parallel to Leonardo developing his role as team leader, Super Robot Mecha Force Five often echoed Donatello's development both in his engineering and in his relationship with April, and Crognard is a fairly Raphael-oriented show with it's reckless, hot-headed protagonist who often does bad things for good reasons.

The relevance of the finale in particular? Crognard refuses to listen to his team and in doing so ends up facing the end of his life. Raph stubbornly ignores his brothers warnings and becomes responsible for the Triceraton Invasion and all that entailed. Which is, essentially, the end of life as he knew it.


That's an interesting theory. Although, it could be Zog, too.

[Shark_Blade]

My personal interpretation?

Each of the TV shows has been something of a meta reference to one of the Turtles themselves. Space Heores was often used as an obvious and deliberate parallel to Leonardo developing his role as team leader, Super Robot Mecha Force Five often echoed Donatello's development both in his engineering and in his relationship with April, and Crognard is a fairly Raphael-oriented show with it's reckless, hot-headed protagonist who often does bad things for good reasons.

the relevance of the finale in particular? Crognard refuses to listen to his team and in doing so ends up facing the end of his life. Raph stubbornly ignores his brothers warnings and becomes responsible for the Triceraton Invasion and all that entailed. Which is, essentially, the end of life as he knew it. That's very interesting. Though Crognard himself died, but Raph didn't; instead the whole world died. :teek: Does that signify anything..? Hmm..

I can't wait to see what tv series is up for next season. From your theory it would be parallel to Michelangelo, so... it must be a 80/90s cartoon series with a team... Captain Planet? Powerpuff Girls? X-Men? Chip & Dale Rescue Rangers?

I'm just blindly shooting after googling them up now.. :tlol:

[Luckyday]

That's very interesting. Though Crognard himself died, but Raph didn't; instead the whole world died. :teek: Does that signify anything..? Hmm..

I can't wait to see what tv series is up for next season. From your theory it would be parallel to Michelangelo, so... it must be a 80/90s cartoon series with a team... Captain Planet? Powerpuff Girls? X-Men? Chip & Dale Rescue Rangers?

I'm just blindly shooting after googling them up now.. :tlol:

What if it's a 80's zany sitcom that has a laugh track?

[Shark_Blade]

What if it's a 80's zany sitcom that has a laugh track?That'd be different indeed, though I'm only basing on previous trend of shows the boys are watching: all comprises of teams. :tsmile:

Let's say it's a sitcom (like Friends, maybe?), how do they shoehorn an enemy threat or teamwork lessons?

[Galactus]

All this makes me wonder if they'll have a token tv show next season during the space based arc.

Maybe an alien tv show like Stump Intergalactic Wrestling or perhaps since tv signals from Earth keep carrying into space maybe Honycutt's ship or wherever they are based picks up old tv Earth to shows.

[Kingoji]

That's very interesting. Though Crognard himself died, but Raph didn't; instead the whole world died. :teek: Does that signify anything..? Hmm..

I can't wait to see what tv series is up for next season. From your theory it would be parallel to Michelangelo, so... it must be a 80/90s cartoon series with a team... Captain Planet? Powerpuff Girls? X-Men? Chip & Dale Rescue Rangers?

I'm just blindly shooting after googling them up now.. :tlol:

I like the idea of an anthro-animal adventure show, which Mikey absolutely hates.

[turtle1237]

Just because Crognard got eating does not mean he was killed.

I seen Thundarr get eating by a creature or 2 and he turns out ok.
I believe even He-man got eating.

[victory_angel]

Just because Crognard got eating does not mean he was killed.

I seen Thundarr get eating by a creature or 2 and he turns out ok.
I believe even He-man got eating.

But that particular episode of Crognard was marketed as the absolute last episode of the show. Mikey and Leo even do a web search to see if there at least one more episode, or at least a Movie.


And to quote the scene:

Donnie: Raph's not pickin' up....maybe he's in trouble.

Leo: Any luck on your end, Mikey?

Mikey: (Skimming Computer screen) Nada, the Crognard fan sites all say that really was the last episode. What a bust!

Leo: I mean have you found, Raph? (Looks at Computer screen) Really there wasn't any movie or something after....

(Leo is interrupted by Rockwell)

Since there was nothing after that final episode that means Crognard is for all intents and purposes...deceased.

[turtle1237]

But that particular episode of Crognard was marketed as the absolute last episode of the show. Mikey and Leo even do a web search to see if there at least one more episode, or at least a Movie.


And to quote the scene:

Donnie: Raph's not pickin' up....maybe he's in trouble.

Leo: Any luck on your end, Mikey?

Mikey: (Skimming Computer screen) Nada, the Crognard fan sites all say that really was the last episode. What a bust!

Leo: I mean have you found, Raph? (Looks at Computer screen) Really there wasn't any movie or something after....

(Leo is interrupted by Rockwell)

Since there was nothing after that final episode that means Crognard is for all intents and purposes...deceased.

It was 1980's cheese, a little thing like getting eating is not going to kill you. Perhaps the show got cancel before Crognard punch his way free, it happens.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

It was 1980's cheese, a little thing like getting eating is not going to kill you. Perhaps the show got cancel before Crognard punch his way free, it happens.


Not so. This last episode mirrors the old Dungeons and Dragons cartoon series pretty blatantly with the dragon intended to look like Tiamat (and the slug people episode did this, too- there was a D&D episode that had a similar situation, but with different results), and characters certainly got killed in it! Also, I recall at least one or two deaths in both He-Man and even She-Ra as well. He didn't just get swallowed. There were crunching sounds, and his crown was spit out by the dragon! Anyone who's ever played D&D will tell you there's not coming back from that one....

[turtle1237]

Not so. This last episode mirrors the old Dungeons and Dragons cartoon series pretty blatantly with the dragon intended to look like Tiamat (and the slug people episode did this, too- there was a D&D episode that had a similar situation, but with different results), and characters certainly got killed in it! Also, I recall at least one or two deaths in both He-Man and even She-Ra as well. He didn't just get swallowed. There were crunching sounds, and his crown was spit out by the dragon! Anyone who's ever played D&D will tell you there's not coming back from that one....

I never saw the Dungeons and Dragons cartoon series, but in Thundarr ,Ariel was eating by a fire whale with sharp teeth(Don't ask what a fire whale is, its the 1980's lol)

By all Rights Ariel should have died, but no not in Thundarr, he just goes over punches it a few times, opens its mouth and Ariel is free lol.

We saw Crognard get impale, If he can take a spear or in this case, LOTS of spears in the chest, than he can lived though getting eating.

[TurtleTitan97]

Just because Crognard got eating does not mean he was killed.

I seen Thundarr get eating by a creature or 2 and he turns out ok.
I believe even He-man got eating.

But that particular episode of Crognard was marketed as the absolute last episode of the show. Mikey and Leo even do a web search to see if there at least one more episode, or at least a Movie.


And to quote the scene:

Donnie: Raph's not pickin' up....maybe he's in trouble.

Leo: Any luck on your end, Mikey?

Mikey: (Skimming Computer screen) Nada, the Crognard fan sites all say that really was the last episode. What a bust!

Leo: I mean have you found, Raph? (Looks at Computer screen) Really there wasn't any movie or something after....

(Leo is interrupted by Rockwell)

Since there was nothing after that final episode that means Crognard is for all intents and purposes...deceased.

It was 1980's cheese, a little thing like getting eating is not going to kill you. Perhaps the show got cancel before Crognard punch his way free, it happens.

I never saw the Dungeons and Dragons cartoon series, but in Thundarr ,Ariel was eating by a fire whale with sharp teeth(Don't ask what a fire whale is, its the 1980's lol)

By all Rights Ariel should have died, but no not in Thundarr, he just goes over punches it a few times, opens its mouth and Ariel is free lol.

We saw Crognard get impale, If he can take a spear or in this case, LOTS of spears in the chest, than he can lived though getting eating.

You must be incredibly naïve to actually believe this. Crognard's dead, gotta learn to deal with it.

Just out of curiosity, how old are you?

[turtle1237]

You must be incredibly naïve to actually believe this. Crognard's dead, gotta learn to deal with it.

Just out of curiosity, how old are you?

To see He-man and Thundarr lol. Well Reruns of the shows any way since my child hood ran for most the old Toon Ninja Turtles run.

Crognard, Yes I saw him get eating, I heard the crunching noises, but you have to remember, THIS IS A 1980's cartoon. We saw Crognard get impale, and perhaps off screen, burn, axe, cut up, and what ever else his enemies thrown at him. A little thing like getting eating is not going to kill a 1980's cartoon hero.

[ssjup81]

To see He-man and Thundarr lol. Well Reruns of the shows any way since my child hood ran for most the old Toon Ninja Turtles run.

Crognard, Yes I saw him get eating, I heard the crunching noises, but you have to remember, THIS IS A 1980's cartoon. We saw Crognard get impale, and perhaps off screen, burn, axe, cut up, and what ever else his enemies thrown at him. A little thing like getting eating is not going to kill a 1980's cartoon hero.But Mikey checked the net to see if there were more eps and found out that that was indeed the final ep of the series.

[turtle1237]

But Mikey checked the net to see if there were more eps and found out that that was indeed the final ep of the series.

Would not be the first time a show ending on a cliff hanger.

[ssjup81]

Would not be the first time a show ending on a cliff hanger.True, but I still feel it's meant to indicate that he's dead. The fact that it wasn't shown, but heard, says a lot. You heard the crunching sounds, a burp, and the spitting out of Crognard's crown because it would've been too gruesome to show in a kids show otherwise. What more do you need?

[Powder]

Crognard is not coming back.

[neatoman]

Crognard is not coming back.

https://38.media.tumblr.com/3f379b8123c979cc075f4742c6320701/tumblr_n3ominG5oR1twj5fjo1_400.gif

[Kingoji]

Wow. It's a cartoon within a cartoon that served its purpose. There's really no deeper discussion to be had here.

[turtle1237]

Crognard is not coming back.

If Crognard is dead, than that means the greats like He-Man, Thundarr and Mighty Mightor could not defeat that dragon. And I wont buy that, I WONT BELIVE that.


If Mighty Mightor can trash a T-Rex, than he could handle that Dragon. Crognard is just playing possum.

[TurtleTitan97]

If Crognard is dead, than that means the greats like He-Man, Thundarr and Mighty Mightor could not defeat that dragon. And I wont buy that, I WONT BELIVE that.


If Mighty Mightor can trash a T-Rex, than he could handle that Dragon. Crognard is just playing possum.

Boy, you really are a stubborn one ain't ya? :roll:

[Powder]

If Crognard is dead, than that means the greats like He-Man, Thundarr and Mighty Mightor could not defeat that dragon. And I wont buy that, I WONT BELIVE that.


If Mighty Mightor can trash a T-Rex, than he could handle that Dragon. Crognard is just playing possum.

I know a good therapist if you're in New York.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

I never saw the Dungeons and Dragons cartoon series, but in Thundarr ,Ariel was eating by a fire whale with sharp teeth(Don't ask what a fire whale is, its the 1980's lol)

By all Rights Ariel should have died, but no not in Thundarr, he just goes over punches it a few times, opens its mouth and Ariel is free lol.

We saw Crognard get impale, If he can take a spear or in this case, LOTS of spears in the chest, than he can lived though getting eating.


Trust me. Not EVERY 80's cartoon had invulnerable heroes. See: Robotech, Starbalzers, GI Joe..... As for the D&D cartoon, as I mentioned before, it had characters die, as did even He-Man and She-Ra. Mayby not MAIN characters, but it happened all the same. And that bit with the spears was done for a joke. It was meant to imply that his pecs were hard enough to stop the spears. Nothing more.


To see He-man and Thundarr lol. Well Reruns of the shows any way since my child hood ran for most the old Toon Ninja Turtles run.

Crognard, Yes I saw him get eating, I heard the crunching noises, but you have to remember, THIS IS A 1980's cartoon. We saw Crognard get impale, and perhaps off screen, burn, axe, cut up, and what ever else his enemies thrown at him. A little thing like getting eating is not going to kill a 1980's cartoon hero.


Not when it's the series finale. That pretty much makes it clear the hero is dead and NOT coming back. That's why it's a FIANLE! It's THE END. :trolleye:


But Mikey checked the net to see if there were more eps and found out that that was indeed the final ep of the series.


Exactly. There was no way for him to come back if it's intended as the final episode. That was the whole POINT!


Would not be the first time a show ending on a cliff hanger.


There's a difference between ending on a cliffhanger when a series simply doesn't get picked up for another season, and an actual intentional finale. Lost ended with everyone being dead- which was the original intention. This was the same sort of thing.


If Crognard is dead, than that means the greats like He-Man, Thundarr and Mighty Mightor could not defeat that dragon. And I wont buy that, I WONT BELIVE that.


If Mighty Mightor can trash a T-Rex, than he could handle that Dragon. Crognard is just playing possum.


There's a difference between a T-rex and a five-headed dragon Queen! One's just a dinosaur. The OTHER could have obliterated him five different ways before eating him! (Because anyone who has seen the cartoon or played D&D knows that Tiamat has five different breath-weapons. Fire, lighting, acid, poison gas, and frost.) Not to mention having magic and extremely tough armored hide. That dragon was basically the dragon GOD.....

[turtle1237]

Boy, you really are a stubborn one ain't ya? :roll:

But Crognard has the energy.

[turtle1237]

Trust me. Not EVERY 80's cartoon had invulnerable heroes. See: Robotech, Starbalzers, GI Joe..... As for the D&D cartoon, as I mentioned before, it had characters die, as did even He-Man and She-Ra. Mayby not MAIN characters, but it happened all the same. And that bit with the spears was done for a joke. It was meant to imply that his pecs were hard enough to stop the spears. Nothing more.





Not when it's the series finale. That pretty much makes it clear the hero is dead and NOT coming back. That's why it's a FIANLE! It's THE END. :trolleye:





Exactly. There was no way for him to come back if it's intended as the final episode. That was the whole POINT!





There's a difference between ending on a cliffhanger when a series simply doesn't get picked up for another season, and an actual intentional finale. Lost ended with everyone being dead- which was the original intention. This was the same sort of thing.





There's a difference between a T-rex and a five-headed dragon Queen! One's just a dinosaur. The OTHER could have obliterated him five different ways before eating him! (Because anyone who has seen the cartoon or played D&D knows that Tiamat has five different breath-weapons. Fire, lighting, acid, poison gas, and frost.) Not to mention having magic and extremely tough armored hide. That dragon was basically the dragon GOD.....

So This can beat
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEHyQPleeJY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lAG6srT9Mk
This?

Mightor has this lol.

Ok I still cant get that youtube thing to work, but its Crognard vs dragon and intro to Moby Dick and Mighty Mightor.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Let me stress this again. Tiamat (aka the dragon in Crognard) = DRAGON GOD. A literal deity of dragons, who is IMMORTAL!! Who also uses powerful magic, has the toughest hide of any dragon (which is incidentally far tougher than that of a T-rex), and is the mother of ALL dragons- in a literal sense. So, yeah, she can. There's a reason they call her the Dragon Queen. She has even killed other gods in the canon lore of D&D. So no, a "T-rex", no matter how bada$$, cannot beat that. You are talking to someone who has both watched and played D&D for YEARS, dude. And that's who Crognard was fighting, even if they never called her by name. So, yes, he was toast. And that Mightor would be, too. Even Godzilla/Mechagodzilla/Rodan/Mothra/whoever wouldn't stop her....

[ssjup81]

Trust me. Not EVERY 80's cartoon had invulnerable heroes. See: Robotech, Starbalzers, GI Joe..... As for the D&D cartoon, as I mentioned before, it had characters die, as did even He-Man and She-Ra. Mayby not MAIN characters, but it happened all the same. And that bit with the spears was done for a joke. It was meant to imply that his pecs were hard enough to stop the spears. Nothing more.





Not when it's the series finale. That pretty much makes it clear the hero is dead and NOT coming back. That's why it's a FIANLE! It's THE END. :trolleye:





Exactly. There was no way for him to come back if it's intended as the final episode. That was the whole POINT!





There's a difference between ending on a cliffhanger when a series simply doesn't get picked up for another season, and an actual intentional finale. Lost ended with everyone being dead- which was the original intention. This was the same sort of thing.





There's a difference between a T-rex and a five-headed dragon Queen! One's just a dinosaur. The OTHER could have obliterated him five different ways before eating him! (Because anyone who has seen the cartoon or played D&D knows that Tiamat has five different breath-weapons. Fire, lighting, acid, poison gas, and frost.) Not to mention having magic and extremely tough armored hide. That dragon was basically the dragon GOD.....Not even Crognard's super strong pecs could protect him from those. :lol:

[LeoRaph]

It was a fitting end for the mindless heartless 'hero'.

I also think Crognard highlights what 'Not' to do as a hero, in fact I don't think he had any redeemable qualities at all, which is why I don't think he is Raph like. Sure Raph has a temper and can be guns blazing but he also has more to him than that, some of those qualities being: he actually has compassion, 'can' listen doesn't mean he will all the time, is actually pretty smart, particularly street smarts (survival), can be a great leader, is creative, and has more skill being you know an actual ninja than the hulk smash mentality. If anything I see Crognard as the Bayturtles :twink:

I also saw the 'ending of Crognard' as poking fun at Series that are suddenly cancelled where it's much like Mortal Kombat Conquest if anyone remembers that. Not in the way of stupidity of the heroes who actually weren't. But more so in the way they ended it. It was such a shame as it was actually pretty good. I liked it anyway. Bruce Locke as Shang Tsung was awesome. But back to the topic I had the exact same reaction as the turtles did when the last episode of MKC aired.

In terms of foreshadowing, I haven't seen the last episode of Season 3 yet so I have no comment on that but I've seen a few spoilers in titles here so I think I'll watch it tonight. It actually airs next week here where my partner daughter and I watch it every week on tv rather than on the net but if what happens at the end is true I may watch it tonight on the net so I can soften the blow some how as that will be quite emotional for my daughter. She's been watching TMNT 2012 since day 1, she's almost 6 but that's 3 years of attachment to a character she loves so much, that's going to be tough on her despite being a cartoon.

[The Happy One]

But Crognard has the energy.

I know, pal. I know. Lol:lol:

But sometimes 'the energy' just ain't enough to save you from a five headed dragon.

[Tetsu Deinonychus]

Pretending Crognard was a real show (and not just an opening gag/forshadowing device), I think the two best scenarios have been said. Either the writers decided to just end the show with a dark joke, or that was meant to be a cliff-hanger, but the show got cancelled before they could conclude it.

The first one's funnier, but the second one is more plausible. Remember Crognard is supposed to be some cheap 80s cartoon, and those didn't end on dark jokes because that might upset the kids. They also didn't have concluding movies or get uncancelled due to demand because there'd be no internet fandom to demand that. There wouldn't be any more of Crognard until they made a remake series 20-30 years later, and that would have it's own continuity.

And, we are officially putting way more thought into this than the actual writers did. :P

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Pretending Crognard was a real show (and not just an opening gag/forshadowing device), I think the two best scenarios have been said. Either the writers decided to just end the show with a dark joke, or that was meant to be a cliff-hanger, but the show got cancelled before they could conclude it.

The first one's funnier, but the second one is more plausible. Remember Crognard is supposed to be some cheap 80s cartoon, and those didn't end on dark jokes because that might upset the kids. They also didn't have concluding movies or get uncancelled due to demand because there'd be no internet fandom to demand that. There wouldn't be any more of Crognard until they made a remake series 20-30 years later, and that would have it's own continuity.

And, we are officially putting way more thought into this than the actual writers did. :P


All very true. However, I'd add that on a side-note, ending the series with a dark joke like that IS very likely with these writers, since they seem so fond of "slipping $h*t under the radar". Most real 80's cartoons wouldn't have ended that way, but you can be sure the writers here had no qualms about doing it! (If they can slip in a joke about a sub and a sea monster....) Also, most 80's cartoons didn't even HAVE a finale as such, they just got canceled. The only one from that era I can think of that had a main character die would be Transformers Gen 1, ending with Optimus's death in the movie. Spider-Man TAS had a finale that involved him hopping through several realities, including "ours", where he met Stan Lee! Other than those two, I can't even think of any series from that era that had legitimate finales.