Official Ep Discussion S4 Ep 10: Trans-Dimensional Turtles

[GoldMutant]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uN4Br3ICRRU

First and foremost, happy Easter everyone! Whether you're spending time with family, snacking on chocolates, going on hunts, I hope your day is great. :) Now that we got the holiday out of the way, here we go with one of the most anticipated episodes thus far in the entire series.

Ever since rumors circulated in season 2 with a brief cameo in The Manhattan Project and the Fred Wolf Turtles manhandled in Tiger Claw's flashback in The Wrath of Tiger Claw, we now reach an episode long in the works. This is far from the first time the franchise has crossed over with past iterations as Turtles Forever preceded this. While opinions are subjective, the original cast wasn't apart of the version which did personally hurt the special. Fast forward (pun intended :P) and here we are now. Ironically matching up as episode 88 (the year of Shredder and Splintered plus the Fred Wolf's second season), this episode has several love letter references. Ranging from the old Konami video games, poking fun at goofiness, etc.

If you haven't seen the clips, I'll include the Youtube links at the bottom. That said, with Cam Clarke, Barry Gordon, Rob Paulsen and Townsend Coleman returning to their classic roles with the current Turtles to battle Kraang Sub-Prime and the original Krang himself, what awaits the heroes in a half shell of past and present? Will there be over the top cheesiness? Are we going to see a strange new pizza? More importantly, where do the characters fit in with this wacky adventure nearing the space arc's tailgate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2DSMKs0Jko
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTYZH9ZztJ0

Happy Easter ladies and gents, enjoy the crossover!

[Sabacooza]

Some said the old toon turtles were treated poorly. I guess we'll see tomorrow.

[CyberCubed]

Is this going to be put up on Nick.com too?

[Commenter 42]

I'm really surprised at the abysmal animation quality, for both 2D and 3D. I think we all are. The writing on the other-hand, seems really strong.

Suddenly FW S1 looks like a masterwork next to this flash nonsense.

Not hating, still excited for the ep as a whole, and love the idea, (who doesn't?) Just think Viacom could have moved some of the PD budget over to Ciro and Brandon's team, instead of wasting it on Vomit-rage pt2.

Also, Vomit-rage pt2. is my new band name.

[TheJ-manTurtleMan]

Some said the old toon turtles were treated poorly. I guess we'll see tomorrow.

After watching tbe episode, I can definitely see how some people feel that way. I don't think they are treated as poorly as "Turtles Forever" though. Also, the end of the episode is pretty sweet, I know it will answer questions that some people had.

[Vicky82]

The episode is up on I Tunes now.

[kelligrafie]

I'm really surprised at the abysmal animation quality, for both 2D and 3D. I think we all are. The writing on the other-hand, seems really strong.

Yeah same.

I think most fans could probably forgive the animation side of things as long as the story is funny and action packed.

That's the power of nostalgia I guess.

The fact they've got the 80's battle theme music playing in the background when they fight Krang in one of those trailers made me so giddy. :trazz:

[TigerClaw]

Today's the day, can't wait. :)

[Mew]

http://i.imgur.com/J3aawiX.jpg

[kelligrafie]

Brace yourselves.

Peoples who post screencaps of every single second of the episode on tumblr but can't figure out how to upload the actual episode... are coming.

:trolleye:

[Vicky82]

Brace yourselves.

Peoples who post screencaps of every single second of the episode on tumblr but can't figure out how to upload the actual episode... are coming.

:trolleye:

Yeah and they also record 30 secs of a scene but don't record a whole episode :ohwell::roll:

[NinjaPug]

Sorry these people don't record it so you can watch it illegally.

[Vicky82]

I found a stream that works :D

[TigerClaw]

Here we go!

[Desslok]

Okay I just saw the episode and I absolutely LOVE it. I think the FW turtles are handled pretty faithfully here (and of course having the original voice cast helps a lot). There are a few jokes about the OT's shortcomings, but here they don't come across as blatant bashing as they sometimes did in Turtles Forever.

Obviously everyone working on this episode did their homework, there are quite a few OT references thrown around and fans of that show will no doubt recognize some familiar sounding music tracks when the turtles are in the OT dimension.

A few more points:

-The scene with the Mirage turtles is BEAUTIFULLY illustrated and although it's brief the payoff is pretty funny.

-Krang's banishment from Dimension X is brought up by Sub-prime...

-Splinter scene (as most of his do) will hit you in the feels.

-Megan Fox gets namedropped in one of the most hilarious exchanges I've ever heard on this show. I won't say who says it or when, but I laughed pretty hard.

[GoldMutant]

I still stand by my word on it, even though great to hear them return one more time to the roles, I still feel Barry Gordon's Donatello voice hasn't aged too well. The others still sound amazing, but Barry.... eh I get it's his age but it does distract a little. :ohwell:

Really liking how the Michelangelos get along well due to Fred Wolf Michelangelo, makes me smile. :) Then again, I do kinda feel Townsend is among the best Mikes over the franchise voice wise, tied with Robbie personally.

[Vicky82]

LOL a Megan Fox joke :lol:

Seeing the turtles with Splinter brought tears to my eyes. :cry:

[The Happy One]

Wait so....that's how it all...connects??
Wow...I kinda like it!

[Cyndaquilfan123]

This might be a contender for my favorite episode. They really outdid themselves!

[TigerClaw]

That was a great episode, great ending too. :)

[Vicky82]

OMG, OMG, OMG, OMG, that was awesome :D

So in the 80s dimension, this episode happened before Wormquake.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Fun episode. Although did '87 Krang sound like Chris Griffin to anybody else?

[Ninturtle]

This episode reminded me of why I love the Nick show

[Coola Yagami]

It was pretty good. They made fun of the 80s lame fighting but they actually kicked more ass in the nick world. When 80s Leo punched a Kraang. It reminded me that they hardly ever punch anything in the 80s show.

Still a little messed up that krang was banished from Nick dimension x. It was an interesting idea but that means 80s krang was from Nick dimension x all along..

[cryan]

Unlike turtles forever, I liked the fact the writers treated the FW Turtles with dignity this time and not completely ridiculed them. The beginning though was a bit painful but the ending of the episode was great.

[Sabacooza]

Pretty cool episode. I only wish it were actually a 2 parter like some wished for because it just seemed to zip by pretty quick. Would've liked to see Bebop, Rocksteady and Shredder but that will be coming up eventually.

[Vicky82]

IGN review up

8.7

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2016/03/27/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-trans-dimensional-turtles-review

[Aaronardo]

I can offer so much praise for this episode. Hearing Pat as Krang for the first time in 20 years (WOAH. It's been exactly 20 years since the OT went off the air!) had me geeking out, the 2D animation was surprisingly really good particularly in the fight scene between the two turtle teams, everyone was incredibly in-character (I almost expected OT Donnie to cry, "Aw, that was my favorite Bo!"), the scene with the Mirage comic Turtles with the hilarious payoff, the Megan Fox joke, and that Splinter scene that hits ya right where it hurts.

While it's definitely the best of Season 4 so far (it even addresses one of my overall problems with the season in the first minute!), this episode does still run into its fair share of problems. Like how rushed it sometimes feels. Scenes often feel "cut short," and just feel like hallow shells (no pun intended) of actual scenes.

With an additional 6 episodes being added on to this season out of nowhere, you'd think they would rewrite the episode as a two-parter, seeing as how it's so jam-packed with so much information and material, it feels very crowded as a 22-minute episode. Still a great episode, nonetheless. Even if you take out the whole novelty of the OT TMNT and Krang returning to the small screen, it still has very sharp writing, among the sharpest in the series thus far, and the story had me on the edge of my seat.

9/10

[Powder]

That was fabulous. LOVE that they connected Krang to their universe's brain-goons. It's official canon as far as this guy's concerned! Super faithful adaptions, though Raph was more abrasive than his original counterpart. It worked considering the context & angle they were going for. Townsend was easily the standout performer, they all did wonderfully, but his Michelangelo did not miss a beat. Absolutely perfect! I fanboyed over how many Turtles In Time references they threw in there, that was awesome. We can all agree that's easily one of if not the best rendition of the FW turtles & associated works, right? :tlol: I can't believe they managed to cram all that into one episode without it feeling too rushed, like, whoa, kudos! Perfect pacing. I guess more time for fan-service would've been nice, but fan-service is fan-service. I FEEL YOU LEO, I FEEL YOU. ;~; I've missed Splinter too... Makes me wonder if that's the last of the past-selves close encounter sorta stuff, though, & of course a part of me is like "Eh? Surely Splinter would ask them about the conflict's resolution whenever they get home from their patrol, so what happened there?" but I guess I've just gotta dismiss it.

I f**king love Gilbert Gottfried. I can't help but gush about him every time Kraang-Sub-Prime makes an appearance. Even among such an iconic cast in such an epic feature, he stole the show. :trazz: The Megan Fox joke had me rolling. Too funny.

Mirage turtles were cool. Nicely rendered.

[Coola Yagami]

Also notice how 80s Leo actually gave orders and acted like a leader. In forever he was just there.

[TurFlytle]

Fun episode. Although did '87 Krang sound like Chris Griffin to anybody else?

If they wanted to do that, they could have got Seth Green. :lol:

[GoldMutant]

(Poll is up btw)

Even though the plot took a back seat... damn, this was a great throwback. The return of the original cast, the jokes, soooo much good this time. Besides Barry Gordon personally, the rest of the cast still has it 20 years later. :) The Turtle chemistry was awesome too, especially the Michelangelos; only one I wish we saw more of was the Raphaels, especially because Paulsen's Raph was aggressive this time (Red Sky attitude much? :P). Don't want to go crazy, but there were just a few things that personally hurt it from being one of the best of the series for me.

My main issue though is what Sabacooza brought up and Aaronardo said as well, I do feel it zipped by a little quickly, especially the ending fight between the two Turtle teams, Sub-Prime and Krang. That and the animation in Fred Wolf didn't do it for me either. Other than those two things, it was immensely entertaining and is how you treat the property with love and care. With both sides perfectly balanced in a crossover and working well together, I honestly can't complain.

I'll give the episode an 8.5 out of 10, if the pacing didn't feel too quick I'd give it a higher ranking. By far among the best this season so far!

[Ninturtle]

I wished the Mirage turtles actually got line though, not speaking lines but maybe text bubbles. And I also wish we got to see Sub Prime in the Mirage dimension too. But other than that and the fact that it was rushed I loved this episode.

[TigerClaw]

I noticed something peculiar, when TigerClaw comes right out from that worm, he has the eye patch on, if I remember, he didn't had the eye patch when he was swallowed by it.

continuity is a bit screwed there.

[Coola Yagami]

It was kinda clever how they did it though. Basically taking actual comic panels from issue 1 and somehow making it work. I read issue one so many times I recognized every panel.

[Venom]

Fun episode. Although did '87 Krang sound like Chris Griffin to anybody else?

Nope, sounded just like he always did.

Now 2012 Leo, he does sounds like a deeper voiced Chris Griffin. ;)

Makes me wonder if that's the last of the past-selves close encounter sorta stuff, though, & of course a part of me is like "Eh? Surely Splinter would ask them about the conflict's resolution whenever they get home from their patrol, so what happened there?" but I guess I've just gotta dismiss it.

Maybe not. Leo was able to say enough about the present wasn't the present, and this Splinter is highly deductive, so he probably gleaned the Turtles before him weren't *his* Turtles, especially how his final exchange to them before heading through the portal could be implied that, while Splinter may not know what's going to happen, he understood what they were doing has grave consequences for the bigger picture. Then again, I could be looking deeper into what's effectively a shallow pan of oil.

I wished the Mirage Turtles actually got line though, not speaking lines but maybe text bubbles. And I also wish we got to see Sub Prime in the Mirage dimension too. But other than that and the fact that it was rushed I loved this episode.

We didn't get to see it because the next scene is likely the Mirage Turtles killing him, especially as seeing this is before they actually met the Utroms.

[drgon78]

Good episode, loved the "turtle power" joke, and it was nice to ear those classic voices and background music again.

[Chaotix12345]

That was fun. Great hearing the old cast back in the saddle again and loved all the little touches like the '87 Turtles rarely using their weapons, the slight animation/voice flubs in the '87 dimension, and all the small video game references. The Turtle Prime scene was also really fun from an animation standpoint, though I wish they had done just a liiiiittle bit more with it.

Though, Krang being revealed as a banished member of THE Kraang was strange continuity-wise with the old show, with all the time and dimensional travel, the ending confused me, and it REALLY would've benefited from being a two-parter. It was a little bit rushed.

[pannoni1]

What a treat for Easter, even better than the time traveling episode from that old VHS that I got 24 years ago where we encounter the "over-the-hill" Turtles. Well, other than Barry Gordon's Don starting to sound a little like that old age counterpart, the rest of the classic voice cast (take that, 4kids!) was spot on, and the interaction between the two generations was handled so much better than the unofficial 2K3 finale. The Mirage portion was another added bonus, and it felt even more true with the moving panels and lack of voices during the climax. While the FW characters still were suffered to that lameness including a pun by Leo, 1987 Krang showed that he could still provide tricks that weren't even in the original series, in the form of a jetpack and more efficient control in his size.

Now I know you wanted a two-parter, but with just three episodes left in the Space arc, we need at least one for the third crystal piece and preferably two for the final battle (a one-hour special would be preferred) as the Turtles try to save Earth from the black hole. Its a good reason why I'm still a TMNT fan.

Overall: 9/10

[SKX31]

I still stand by my word on it, even though great to hear them return one more time to the roles, I still feel Barry Gordon's Donatello voice hasn't aged too well. The others still sound amazing, but Barry.... eh I get it's his age but it does distract a little. :ohwell:

Really liking how the Michelangelos get along well due to Fred Wolf Michelangelo, makes me smile. :) Then again, I do kinda feel Townsend is among the best Mikes over the franchise voice wise, tied with Robbie personally.

It might be just rust though - you have old VAs like John de Lancie who can pull off very similar roles without a hitch (Q to Discord), and guys like Tim Curry and Tony Jay who just have / had such an presence that they can make people fangasm if they ever are in a scene together. (https://youtu.be/NEE53i0wNNA?t=40m14s) Mel Blanc and Frank Welker don't count, since they're pretty much VA gods. Compare John's IMDB page (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0209496/) to Barry's, for example (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0330015/) (the hypothesis is admittedly pulled out of thin air, but still). And the two were born on the same year (1948 ) even.

[Vicky82]

So that Tweet Rob Paulson tweeted a few days ago (then got deleted) means there is going to be a crossover episode in season 5 but this time with 80s Shredder, 80s Rocksteady and 80s Bebop.

I wonder if that will be a 2 part episode.

[TigerClaw]

So that Tweet Rob Paulson tweeted a few days ago (then got deleted) means there is going to be a crossover episode in season 5.

I wonder if that will be a 2 part episode.
No doubt they'll be back in Season 5. :)

[Powder]

The only thing that left me confused was the ending. This took place just before Wormquake? Are they gonna touch upon that in the future, or are we just supposed to assume Tigerclaw kicked their asses & used Donnie's portal "gun" to get back home? Perhaps he brought it with him through the portal & that's what'll lead to the next crossover?

[Aaronardo]

The question is, who would voice Shredder? I like Townsand Coleman and all, but his Shredder never really did it for me.

[TigerClaw]

You can now watch the episode online.
http://www.nick.com/videos/clip/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-410-full-episode.html

[GoldMutant]

The question is, who would voice Shredder? I like Townsand Coleman and all, but his Shredder never really did it for me.

According to Rob Paulsen's deleted tweet (should be a picture in the season 4 discussion page), Kevin Michael Richardson is going to voice 80's Shredder.

[Ninjinister]

The question is, who would voice Shredder? I like Townsand Coleman and all, but his Shredder never really did it for me.

According to the cast list Paulsen posted, it's Kevin Michael Richardson

[Coola Yagami]

The only thing that left me confused was the ending. This took place just before Wormquake? Are they gonna touch upon that in the future, or are we just supposed to assume Tigerclaw kicked their asses & used Donnie's portal "gun" to get back home? Perhaps he brought it with him through the portal & that's what'll lead to the next crossover?

That's actually a clever way to explain how he returned.

[Vicky82]

The question is, who would voice Shredder? I like Townsand Coleman and all, but his Shredder never really did it for me.

https://40.media.tumblr.com/0f0efb1956a2bb3ed0e8439e1852eab3/tumblr_inline_o4gn46XNxN1sz1u74_540.jpg

Kevin Michael Richardson is going to voice 80s Shredder.

[Cyndaquilfan123]

https://40.media.tumblr.com/0f0efb1956a2bb3ed0e8439e1852eab3/tumblr_inline_o4gn46XNxN1sz1u74_540.jpg

Kevin Michael Richardson is going to voice 80s Shredder.

What is there going to be another crossover? Since when?

[Powder]

Since the date on the image you just quoted.

[ToTheNines]

The whole Krang being from the Nick universe thing was dumb, I thought. They made such a big deal over the 2D and 3D aspect being unique to the respective universes, but last time I checked Dimension X was always 2D in the Fred Wolf show. Then there's the matter of conflict with Invasion of The Krangezoids, but funnily enough this retroactively makes sense of Krang's flashback in Three Musketurtles.

Other than that shoehorn, I loved it. Not as epic as Turtles Forever, but hearing the voice cast again was beyond cool. An instant classic.

[neatoman]

So I haven't watched the episode yet but is really true that it depicts Krang as being one of the Kraang from the Nick show? If that's the case, how the hell do they explain all this then?
http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-season-4-technodrome-lava.jpg
http://comicsalliance.com/files/2012/12/tmntkrangs.png
http://41.media.tumblr.com/fb5ba658904fa684534c29fbeb3e5c3d/tumblr_ng622jzz7q1u5of2vo1_1280.jpg
http://static9.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18154/2996188-tmnt7.png
http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-season-8-berserko.jpg

Edit: And even ignoring that, why doesn't he look or behave like one of the Kraang?

[Ninjinister]

Maybe like Kraang Prime, he was mutated.

[Powder]

Kraang are a species whose secrets are many among the species that is known as Kraang.

[evan2000]

The only thing that left me confused was the ending. This took place just before Wormquake? Are they gonna touch upon that in the future, or are we just supposed to assume Tigerclaw kicked their asses & used Donnie's portal "gun" to get back home? Perhaps he brought it with him through the portal & that's what'll lead to the next crossover?

Well it would seem like this took place DURING Wormquake, shortly before Leo called Splinter on the Cheesephone. But that can't possibly be only 6 months before Annihilation Earth? This was more likely 6 months before The Invasion (when Irma was revealed to be KSP). Adding up the >3 months at the farmhouse, RtNY/BfNY to the events of Annihilation Earth, and then minus the 6 months Fugitoid reversed back: we're still at least 1 year apart between Wormquake and the "present" (when the turtles were zapped from Fugitoid's spaceship). Perhaps time was somehow stretched/shrunk during dimensional travel?

Btw there was a part in this ep when Donnie said they're gonna be stuck in the 2D dimension forever - the way he stressed on the word FOREVER made me feel it was a nod to Turtles Forever. Overthinking much? :tlol:

[Vicky82]

The only thing that left me confused was the ending. This took place just before Wormquake? Are they gonna touch upon that in the future, or are we just supposed to assume Tigerclaw kicked their asses & used Donnie's portal "gun" to get back home? Perhaps he brought it with him through the portal & that's what'll lead to the next crossover?

Well it would seem like this took place DURING Wormquake, shortly before Leo called Splinter on the Cheesephone. But that can't possibly be only 6 months before Annihilation Earth? This was more likely 6 months before The Invasion (when Irma was revealed to be KSP). Adding up the >3 months at the farmhouse, RtNY/BfNY to the events of Annihilation Earth, and then minus the 6 months Fugitoid reversed back: we're still at least 1 year apart between Wormquake and the "present" (when the turtles were zapped from Fugitoid's spaceship). Perhaps time was somehow stretched/shrunk during dimensional travel?



The way I see it.

When all the Turtles were in the 2012 Turtles lair, I think it was a couple of months before Annihilation Earth.

When the 80s turtles returned to there Dimension and then the worm from Wormquake attacks, the 80s turtles Dimension time is different to the 2012 turtles Dimension time.

So basically every time all the turtles were in 80s Dimension it was before Wormquake but everytime the turtles went to the 2012 Dimension it was after Wormquake but just before Annihilation Earth.

[Ninjinister]

Kraang are a species whose secrets are many among the species that is known as Kraang.

This explanation is the explanation that is known as the best explanation.

[Utrommaniac]

https://40.media.tumblr.com/0f0efb1956a2bb3ed0e8439e1852eab3/tumblr_inline_o4gn46XNxN1sz1u74_540.jpg

Kevin Michael Richardson is going to voice 80s Shredder.

So we have a crossover, with the Technodrome gang back together...and...Captain Ryan from Space Heroes??? Unless it's just Donnie watching the show again.

So I haven't watched the episode yet but is really true that it depicts Krang as being one of the Kraang from the Nick show? If that's the case, how the hell do they explain all this then?
http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-season-4-technodrome-lava.jpg
http://comicsalliance.com/files/2012/12/tmntkrangs.png
http://41.media.tumblr.com/fb5ba658904fa684534c29fbeb3e5c3d/tumblr_ng622jzz7q1u5of2vo1_1280.jpg
http://static9.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18154/2996188-tmnt7.png
http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-season-8-berserko.jpg

Edit: And even ignoring that, why doesn't he look or behave like one of the Kraang?

He doesn't behave like one of the Kraang because at this point, he's technically an Utrom. Why he doesn't look like the other Utroms is the next set of questions.
I would think Krang made his own version of Rock Soldiers (Out of spite? Because he thought he could do better?), and there's just two different things named Neutrinos, like how we have animals named the same thing but aren't the same type of animal. Like electric eels (which are knifefish) and moray eels (which are actually eels). The Krangazoids are already considered a massive knife to continuity, but I would say that they might be hyperdeveloped mutants, with their genes triggered to develop limbs and bodies that Utroms technically don't have, but lie extremely dormant. I wouldn't say hyper-evolved, because that's not how it works.

If anything, Drakus fits into the picture far more than anything else here.

[kelligrafie]

Rewatching the episode, I think Kraang Prime calls 80's Krang 'cousin'.

So 80's Krang is a Kraang, not the Kraang as in Kraang Prime.

The 80's explanation is he was banished to Earth for war crimes.
2012 explanation is Kraang Sub-Prime banished him for messing things up.

If you were 80's Krang you'd make up a story (I'm a space gangster) to cover you being a total screw up.

That's how I make it work.


I loved how they looped it in with Wormquake though. Tigerclaw was the cherry on top of the icing on the cake.

[OrangeNinja1987]

Awesome episode! It was really entertaining and I had fun watching it. Not many complaints, I just wish there had been a direct callback to Turtles Forever. Some scenes did feel a bit rushed and I wish 80's Raph had more interaction between 2012 Raph and 2012 Donnie (the nod to their voices being the same could have been much funnier).
Anyway, I loved it.
9/10

P.S. I missed the Megan Fox joke because I was watching this with a non-TMNT fan, who I had to explain everything to. Can someone tell me what it was?

[Vegita-San]

The question is, who would voice Shredder? I like Townsand Coleman and all, but his Shredder never really did it for me.

Jim Cummings, or that guy who came out of nowhere in season 10 and never heard from him again after that. William E Martin. assuming that isn't a monkiker.

the only two shredder replacements out of 4 or so that never bugged me.


The Bad animation in the begining, and treating the 80s characters like idiots was horrible. when they avoided that, it worked far better than turtles forever did.

And I thouht the flash/howeverthey did it animation in turtles Forever was a bit jarring.. it got worse here.

[Utrommaniac]

Rewatching the episode, I think Kraang Prime calls 80's Krang 'cousin'.

So 80's Krang is a Kraang, not the Kraang as in Kraang Prime.

The 80's explanation is he was banished to Earth for war crimes.
2012 explanation is Kraang Sub-Prime banished him for messing things up.

If you were 80's Krang you'd make up a story (I'm a space gangster) to cover you being a total screw up.

That's how I make it work.
That's exactly what I'm thinking. Krang is full of hot air...he probably was only able to take control of the less competent parts of Dimension X because it was all he could manage.

I do like how this is the first instance of two Utroms sharing a similar name, sort of like how there can be someone named Steven and another person named Stephen. The trouble comes up when Utroms don't appear to have family names in any of their universes. So how do they keep track of family members? The telekinetic abilities of the Queen-led Utroms would make sense, especially now that there's some evidence for family groups among them. If Krang and Knight are cousins, then they have parents who were siblings. Obviously. So the question becomes, where does Krang fit into the Kraang's universal conquest? Especially with Utroms being peaceful and SubPrime having formerly been Knight?

[Jephael]

Great episode! I watched it online with my nephew after church, and he got a big kick out of it, asking me all sorts of questions that even I couldn't answer.

[Luke795]

Where was the Technodrome suppose to be?

[tmntsplinterfan1997]

I have to admit that is the best crossover episode EVER!!!! :tgrin: And I sure missed Master Splinter. :tcry: But I'm glad he made another appearance. :tsmile:

[TurtleGuy]

Where was the Technodrome suppose to be?

It looked like it was in Dimension X.

[CyberCubed]

A lot of great nods here:

1. Mike using his grappling hook, and his chucks. Raph hitting the fire hydrant, as well as throwing the pie of pizza at the end directly from the opening.

2. The 80's Turtles didn't freak out seeing alternate dimension Turtles, which was a nice continuity nod. The 80's Turtles have already seen plenty of alternate dimension Turtles, so I'm glad they weren't shocked to see them.

3. Loved seeing Turtle Prime again. Man, I think those actually pre-date the Mirage Turtles as just a #1 one-shot because of how violent they are. Funny how Kraang subprime got stuck there.

4. 80's Raph was really sarcastic here, moreso than usual. He seemed more like Season 1 or late Season 7-10 Fred Wolf Raph where he was snarkier.

5. I loved how 80's Donatello had a portable teleporter gun. Considering all the crazy inventions he came up with in the old show, it made a lot of sense.

6. 80's Leonardo was pretty in character, which was nice.

7. Lots of videogame references. All of Krang's attacks were from Turtles in Time rather than the cartoon. Especially his red glider that he never used in the show but its from the game.


As for voices, yeah, I think Barry Gordon had the hardest time trying to replicate his old voice. He is 70 something years old now, so he has aged 20 years since he last voiced the character so its understandable. Leo, Raph, Mike and Krang all sounded identical to when we last heard them though.

[GoldMutant]

As for voices, yeah, I think Barry Gordon had the hardest time trying to replicate his old voice. He is 70 something years old now, so he has aged 20 years since he last voiced the character so its understandable. Leo, Raph, Mike and Krang all sounded identical to when we last heard them though.

Barry Gordon is 67 years old as of now, not in his 70's at this time.

[CyberCubed]

Isn't he the oldest of the original voice cast though?

[GoldMutant]

Isn't he the oldest of the original voice cast though?

That's correct. Barry is the oldest at 67 and will be 68 later on this year, then Townsend Coleman at 61 about to be 62, Rob Paulsen at 60, and finally Cam Clarke at 58 soon to be 59.

[Yoshimickster]

LOVED IT-now for a second I thought it was weird that Krang and Kraang Sub-Prime were cousins, seeing how in the 87 show he said he had a body....but then it got me thinking. WHAT IF-after being banished from the Dimension X of Earth 2K12, he mutated himself a reptilian body-THAT-made him insane and forget he was an Utrom. And that's just the low ball theory, for one its pretty obvious Earth 1987 is Dimensionally unstable, WHAT IF when Krang went to Earth 2K12, the unstable meta-particles leaked into Earth 2K12 and altered Sub-Prime's memories OR history that Krang and he were cousins? SO many ways here.

[kelligrafie]

That's exactly what I'm thinking. Krang is full of hot air...he probably was only able to take control of the less competent parts of Dimension X because it was all he could manage.

I do like how this is the first instance of two Utroms sharing a similar name, sort of like how there can be someone named Steven and another person named Stephen. The trouble comes up when Utroms don't appear to have family names in any of their universes. So how do they keep track of family members? The telekinetic abilities of the Queen-led Utroms would make sense, especially now that there's some evidence for family groups among them. If Krang and Knight are cousins, then they have parents who were siblings. Obviously. So the question becomes, where does Krang fit into the Kraang's universal conquest? Especially with Utroms being peaceful and SubPrime having formerly been Knight?

Cousin doesn't always have to mean first cousin though, or even that you're biologically related.

As for voices, yeah, I think Barry Gordon had the hardest time trying to replicate his old voice.
I think if you compare the voices in this episode to the initial cameo during Wormquake though, there is a subtle improvement. I guess the longer you're speaking, the easier it gets to slip back into that role.

I'm just wondering how Barry and Cam are going to manage Bebop and Rocksteady.

Two punks are probably easier than teenagers.

[CyberCubed]

LOVED IT-now for a second I thought it was weird that Krang and Kraang Sub-Prime were cousins, seeing how in the 87 show he said he had a body....but then it got me thinking. WHAT IF-after being banished from the Dimension X of Earth 2K12, he mutated himself a reptilian body-THAT-made him insane and forget he was an Utrom. And that's just the low ball theory, for one its pretty obvious Earth 1987 is Dimensionally unstable, WHAT IF when Krang went to Earth 2K12, the unstable meta-particles leaked into Earth 2K12 and altered Sub-Prime's memories OR history that Krang and he were cousins? SO many ways here.

I think this can work. Krang mutating himself in the OT universe giving him the Krangezoid body makes a lot of sense.


I'm just wondering how Barry and Cam are going to manage Bebop and Rocksteady.

Two punks are probably easier than teenagers.

Rocksteady/Bebop's voices are pretty easy to imitate. Their voices in Turtles Forever sounded almost the same.

[Yoshimickster]

I think this can work. Krang mutating himself in the OT universe giving him the Krangezoid body makes a lot of sense.

YUP-and because it was most likely an unstable simulacrum of Earth 2K12 mutagen, it caused him to go koo-koo bananas! Which makes sense, seeing how in the 87 series it took them QUITE a while to get the mutagen just right, and in the case of 87 Slash it can easily be corrupted and make the mutatee insane. Dear LORD this head-canon works better than I thought!

[kelligrafie]

Slight continuity error.

When Tigerclaw bursts out of the Kraang worm at the end, he has his eye patch already on. He's still supposed to have both eyes for Wormquake and then lose or damage the eye getting back to his reality.

[SKX31]

I think if you compare the voices in this episode to the initial cameo during Wormquake though, there is a subtle improvement. I guess the longer you're speaking, the easier it gets to slip back into that role.


I might come off as a broken record, but age isn't the be-all-end-all when it comes to voices. John de Lancie's just a wee bit older than Barry, but his Discord is as good as ever. Of course, JdL's been involved in way more stuff than Barry recently (not to mention, he began voicing Discord in FiM's Season 2, and that show just started its Season 6).

If you wanna contrast Barry to another TMNT VA, then I'd look to Tony Jay. He voiced OT's Lord Dregg (TIL), and the reason Tony didn't showcase any rust is because he was EVERYWHERE in the 90s. Shere Khan in TailSpin? Check. Frollo in Hunchback of Notre Dame? Check. Mighty Ducks Cartoon (as Tim Curry's second hand?) Check.

As with JdL, Tony had way more roles in a certain span of time than Barry.

In the end? Rust can do a lot.

[CyberCubed]

Also this was the first episode we saw the Nick version of the Channel 6 building. We never saw the Channel 6 building in any other episodes of the Nick cartoon. I guess Carlos Chang O'brian works from there.

[TurtleTitan97]

This episode was plain fantastic. Nice to see the OT crew hadn't lost their touch. I liked Turtles Forever for what it was, but OT Turtles were handled much better than here.

That Megan Fox reference was hilarious, and I loved all the nods.

[picassotheninjaturtle]

So I haven't watched the episode yet but is really true that it depicts Krang as being one of the Kraang from the Nick show? If that's the case, how the hell do they explain all this then?
http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-season-4-technodrome-lava.jpg
http://comicsalliance.com/files/2012/12/tmntkrangs.png
http://41.media.tumblr.com/fb5ba658904fa684534c29fbeb3e5c3d/tumblr_ng622jzz7q1u5of2vo1_1280.jpg
http://static9.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18154/2996188-tmnt7.png
http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-season-8-berserko.jpg

Edit: And even ignoring that, why doesn't he look or behave like one of the Kraang?

Maybe he is an Utrom.

[Ceres]

So I haven't watched the episode yet but is really true that it depicts Krang as being one of the Kraang from the Nick show? If that's the case, how the hell do they explain all this then?
http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-season-4-technodrome-lava.jpg
http://comicsalliance.com/files/2012/12/tmntkrangs.png
http://41.media.tumblr.com/fb5ba658904fa684534c29fbeb3e5c3d/tumblr_ng622jzz7q1u5of2vo1_1280.jpg
http://static9.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18154/2996188-tmnt7.png
http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-season-8-berserko.jpg

Edit: And even ignoring that, why doesn't he look or behave like one of the Kraang?

Because the Kraang are only a fraction of the Utroms, people tend to forget this little detail. In the beginning they were all Utroms, so Krang was also one. But according to the episode today he joined the Kraang after they were first born, together with Subprime giving him a distinct personality because he is not mind controlled like the other Kraang.

[neatoman]

Ooookay, now I have actually watched the episode...

It's, um... It feels like a very poorly paced remake of Turtles Forever, the plot and nearly all scenes are really similar to Turtles Forever except everything feels like it happens too fast. Granted it's only about 20 minutes long so I can't fault it too much for the pacing, but it probably shouldn't have tried to cram pretty much all the same scenes into one episode. Yeah and the 2D animation, worse than the clips lead on...

Not really a bad episode but it feels like the crew didn't really want to make it, so they just watched Turtles Forever and used that as a basis.

I also find it amusing that some whiny individuals wanted to see this retcon Turtles Forever, instead it just takes a giant dump on what little continuity the FW cartoon had by making Krang one of the Kraang. This thing doesn't retcon Turtles Forever, it retcons season one of the FW cartoon and any episodes thereafter dealing with Dimension X or Krang's backstory.

[ranger_scout]

I really did enjoy the crossover. I just wish that the episode had not been only been half-an-hour because there could have been so much more. Cam, Townsend, Barry, Pat Fraley, and of course Rob have still got it after all of these years. I actually want to choose the first and last choice from that poll. I liked how towards the end of episode that 2012 Donatello got to work with 1980's Donatello in the Mirage world. Rob Paulsen got to have a scene as different version of Donatello alongside the Donatello, who was voiced by his good friend Barry Gordon. The little reunion the Nickelodeon turtles had with Splinter was a really sweet and heartfelt moment. Even though this was not an hour long episode, the 1987 turtles will return according to Rob Paulsen posted from a week ago.

[neatoman]

I'm not sure what the point of making a second crossover would be, this one amounted to little more than filler where some old actors reprised their roles.

[Rukitron]

I really did enjoy the crossover. I just wish that the episode had not been only been half-an-hour because there could have been so much more. Cam, Townsend, Barry, Pat Fraley, and of course Rob have still got it after all of these years. I actually want to choose the first and last choice from that poll. I liked how towards the end of episode that 2012 Donatello got to work with 1980's Donatello in the Mirage world. Rob Paulsen got to have a scene as different version of Donatello alongside the Donatello, who was voiced by his good friend Barry Gordon. The little reunion the Nickelodeon turtles had with Splinter was a really sweet and heartfelt moment. Even though this was not an hour long episode, the 1987 turtles will return according to Rob Paulsen posted from a week ago.

I agree the pacing for this episode was really fast, but I still liked it.

I seriously hope the FW Turtles actually just kicked Tiger Claw back into the portal and not him owning them, at the very least a rematch where they do win if what Tiger Claw said was true.

P.S.
Krang's back story is all over the place.

[kelligrafie]

I think the biggest mistake people made is assuming this crossover was going to be another Turtles Forever. An exact replica.

Or you wanted it to be another TF and therefore convinced yourselves that this was the case.

And now you're disappointed it's not TF2. Well that's your fault.

Stop comparing the two episodes and using a disappointment you created for yourselves by making inaccurate assumptions, to slate this episode.

:trolleye:

[neatoman]

I think the biggest mistake people made is assuming this crossover was going to be another Turtles Forever. An exact replica.

Or you wanted it to be another TF and therefore convinced yourselves that this was the case.

And now you're disappointed it's not TF2. Well that's your fault.

Stop comparing the two episodes and using a disappointment you created for yourselves by making inaccurate assumptions, to slate this episode.

:trolleye:

Well it's not an exact replica but the plot really similar.

[mrmaczaps]

The episode definitely should have been longer and maybe have been some kind of "special" rather than part of the regular season... and more Mirage/Turtles Prime.

[FredWolfLeonardo]

Really good episode, I have to say. Loved seeing both turtle teams interact and the villains too.

Only nitpicks would be not having any interaction between Pat Fraley and Nolan North's characters while wishing that the two Michelangelo have a teeny bit more screen time together. All the other characters were very fun to watch together and having the old voice cast, recreation of the 80s soundtrack, correct portrayal of the FW turtles and little references made this episode a charm to watch.

Looks like the Fred wolf turtles and Krang are destined to return sometime later, only this time with our beloved Shredder, Bebop and Rocksteady.

[CyberCubed]

I also find it amusing that some whiny individuals wanted to see this retcon Turtles Forever, instead it just takes a giant dump on what little continuity the FW cartoon had by making Krang one of the Kraang. This thing doesn't retcon Turtles Forever, it retcons season one of the FW cartoon and any episodes thereafter dealing with Dimension X or Krang's backstory.

Fred Wolf Krang was banished from Nick's Dimension X (and it seems to imply he is an Utrom), and then when he tried to take over the Fred Wolf Dimension X, he was banished from that one too and left to rot on Earth.

So basically Krang got banished from two Dimension X's.

[neatoman]

Fred Wolf Krang was banished from Nick's Dimension X (and it seems to imply he is an Utrom), and then when he tried to take over the Fred Wolf Dimension X, he was banished from that one too and left to rot on Earth.

So basically Krang got banished from two Dimension X's.

... No, Sub-Prime outright states he was banished to "2D earth" not another version of Dimension X.

[CyberCubed]

... No, Sub-Prime outright states he was banished to "2D earth" not another version of Dimension X.

But Dimension X exists in the original cartoon's universe, and as we've seen, Nick's Dimension X is completely different with weird gravity, floating worm creatures, and it seems to have no other alien races other than Kraang there.

So Krang tried to take over Dimension X in the original cartoons universe, which is what the backstory of that show was, and then the Neutrinos or whomever banished him to Earth.

[FredWolfLeonardo]

But Dimension X exists in the original cartoon's universe, and as we've seen, Nick's Dimension X is completely different with weird gravity, floating worm creatures, and it seems to have no other alien races other than Kraang there.

So Krang tried to take over Dimension X in the original cartoons universe, which is what the backstory of that show was, and then the Neutrinos or whomever banished him to Earth.

Agree with the theory of two different Dimension Xs. Either way though, this special screws around with the OTs continuity but that's not a bad thing because the continuity of that show was inconsistent at times anyway, which is surprisingly a consistent accuracy (or should i say inaccuracy) when carried over to the nick show LOL

[Krang100]

This episode is very enjoyable.

Has 87's Turtles and 87's Krang in a big role. Is too bad 87's Shredder is absent in this episode.

Unlike Turtles Forever. This episode, showed the real Turtles from 1987, which we knew and loved.

Rob Paulsen is in two TMNT team.

Acording to this episode. 87's Krang is Kraang Subprime's cousin. It mean Krang actually belongs to TMNT Nick universe, a least the term "cousin" is used in friendly term.

[CyberCubed]

Unlike Turtles Forever. This episode, showed the real Turtles from 1987, which we knew and loved.

Turtles Forever portrayed them almost the exact same way this episode did, sans the crying scene which should have been axed. Other than that they were almost identical.

[neatoman]

But Dimension X exists in the original cartoon's universe, and as we've seen, Nick's Dimension X is completely different with weird gravity, floating worm creatures, and it seems to have no other alien races other than Kraang there.

So Krang tried to take over Dimension X in the original cartoons universe, which is what the backstory of that show was, and then the Neutrinos or whomever banished him to Earth.

Yes I know, that's exactly the problem I have with it. Even if we are to buy the logic that there are two Dimension X's, it still doesn't make sense.

Sub-Prime stated that Krang was banished to another version of Earth, not another version of Dimension X. If he somehow discovered the other Dimension X afterwards, why does he call that one his "Home Dimension" when it shouldn't be? How does he know how to synthesise mutagen when he should just see it as worm milk? Why was he allowed to have a Technodrome if he got banished (a bit of nonsensical even in the old show now that I think about it)? Virtually nothing about this retcon makes sense the way it was presented because it contradicts practically everything we knew about Krang.

Sure, you could find way to rationalise it but the way it presented in the actual episode is complete nonsense, it's like depicting Batman with living parents and not explain it. The more likely reason is that Brandon Auman didn't really care when he wrote this episode and as a result we got a bad retcon.

[ToTheNines]

Yeah, promise you we're putting in much more thought trying to rationalize the retcon than anyone put into the idea in the first place.

Nick Utroms already have Kraang (who became Kraang Prime). So there's Kraang and Krang from the same universe? They could have just left them as dimensional counterparts.

What about Traag and Granitor? The real Neutrinos? Archie Krang/Dimension X? IDW's Krang/Dimension X?

[CyberCubed]

Technically it does explain why Krang was the only one of his species to be seen in the original cartoon. We never saw Utroms or his race (beyond that one flashback) in the original cartoon. In Season 7 he makes clones of himself but they were all based on his DNA.

I mean why didn't Krang have an army of Utrom warriors in the original toon? Aside from the obvious fact that the original show didn't use many Mirage concepts, he was essentially the only one of his species in the show. So he was "banished" from his own kind.

[THGhost]

Couldn't wait for downloads to arrive so I watched it on Nick.com


So. So. Awesome. Loved the interactions between the 2 turtle groups. Especially when the 2 Donnie's mocked each others voices. :lol:

It was cool that they gave the 2D and 3D animation more-or-less the same amount of screen time.

It's a pity James Avery died recently, having the 2 Shredders teaming up with the 2 Krangs would have been fantastic.

*Checks rest of thread*

https://40.media.tumblr.com/0f0efb1956a2bb3ed0e8439e1852eab3/tumblr_inline_o4gn46XNxN1sz1u74_540.jpg

Kevin Michael Richardson is going to voice 80s Shredder.

There's a part 2 with 80s Shredder? Yay!


"Krang Sub-Prime?" "No, Megan Fox!" :lol:

Where was the 2003 TMNT's reality? Having them show up would have been amazing! Nick ignoring that they exist once again.

Can somebody please make a gif of the 2 Mikeys throwing Krang Sub-Prime around with Donnie flicking him away afterwards? :lol:

[turtle1237]

It was great, being a fan of old toon turtles, I loved it, beats that garbage that was Turtles Forever. No OT turtles crying, no running from the battle, no scare turtles. This show in the short less than 30 min did ten times better than the 2003 turtles ever did.

I loved the turtle intro joke in the end battle with the pizza and give me a break. That was classic.

The show also made jokes on both sides of the nick Turtles vs OT turtles, the belts, ete. It was not so one sided like that movie did.

[ToTheNines]

When they got sucked into the Fred Wolf universe, I was hoping they'd play the classic opening sequence instead of the Nick one. Would have been a nice touch.

[turtle1237]

Turtles Forever portrayed them almost the exact same way this episode did, sans the crying scene which should have been axed. Other than that they were almost identical.

The crying, but what about the running away and acting scared when the battle was 2 much for ot turtles? And I dont recall a lot of noggies in the OT, I cant recall one really. In Forever, the turles were giving out noggies like every 5 mins? Sorry, but Forever may of hit on some points on the old turtles, but they miss the mark by a long shot.

And only Mikey had a pizza addiction in the old toon. Many times, the Turtles would saved the day over vs a slice. In fact, some times the turtles try to help Mike with his pizza habit.

[THGhost]

The crying, but what about the running away and acting scared when the battle was 2 much for ot turtles? And I dont recall a lot of noggies in the OT, I cant recall one really. In Forever, the turles were giving out noggies like every 5 mins? Sorry, but Forever may of hit on some points on the old turtles, but they miss the mark by a long shot.

And only Mikey had a pizza addiction in the old toon. Many times, the Turtles would saved the day over vs a slice. In fact, some times the turtles try to help Mike with his pizza habit.

I think you mean "noogies". "Noggy" is... something else entirely. (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Noggy)

[turtle1237]

I think you mean "noogies". "Noggy" is... something else entirely. (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Noggy)

noogies. ok

[TurtlePower96]

Just finished it. I really enjoyed it, probably one of my new favorite episodes. I absolutely love how they connected it to "Wormquake" at the end.

[THGhost]

Just finished it. I really enjoyed it, probably one of my new favorite episodes. I absolutely love how they connected it to "Wormquake" at the end.

I thought that felt familiar. :P

[neatoman]

It was great, being a fan of old toon turtles, I loved it, beats that garbage that was Turtles Forever. No OT turtles crying, no running from the battle, no scare turtles. This show in the short less than 30 min did ten times better than the 2003 turtles ever did.

I loved the turtle intro joke in the end battle with the pizza and give me a break. That was classic.

The show also made jokes on both sides of the nick Turtles vs OT turtles, the belts, ete. It was not so one sided like that movie did.

I would say Turtles Forever is a lot better written, nothing in this episode makes sense and the pacing is way off.

[Utrommaniac]

Yes I know, that's exactly the problem I have with it. Even if we are to buy the logic that there are two Dimension X's, it still doesn't make sense.

Sub-Prime stated that Krang was banished to another version of Earth, not another version of Dimension X. If he somehow discovered the other Dimension X afterwards, why does he call that one his "Home Dimension" when it shouldn't be? How does he know how to synthesise mutagen when he should just see it as worm milk? Why was he allowed to have a Technodrome if he got banished (a bit of nonsensical even in the old show now that I think about it)? Virtually nothing about this retcon makes sense the way it was presented because it contradicts practically everything we knew about Krang.

Sure, you could find way to rationalise it but the way it presented in the actual episode is complete nonsense, it's like depicting Batman with living parents and not explain it. The more likely reason is that Brandon Auman didn't really care when he wrote this episode and as a result we got a bad retcon.

I think that sense Krang was sent to a dimension without Kraathatrogon, then he probably would have tried to make a synthetic version based on what he knew came from the animal. A "vegan" mutagen, you could say =P . Sort of.

Technically it does explain why Krang was the only one of his species to be seen in the original cartoon. We never saw Utroms or his race (beyond that one flashback) in the original cartoon. In Season 7 he makes clones of himself but they were all based on his DNA.

I mean why didn't Krang have an army of Utrom warriors in the original toon? Aside from the obvious fact that the original show didn't use many Mirage concepts, he was essentially the only one of his species in the show. So he was "banished" from his own kind.

I know from early production that there had been discussion on Krang being an Utrom, but Kevin Eastman didn't want him to be an 'evil' Utrom, so they just made him a brain. Which is painfully ironic now considering that he's gone full force with the idea in IDW now.

[matteso586]

Would it be better if the 1987 Turtles called Subprime's suit a sellout? You know, as a joke to our reaction to the reveal in The Invasion.

Has anyone wondered how the 1987 Turtles got that teleporter thingy? I assumed that the events of War for Dimension X caused this episode to happen, due to the butterfly effect.

[TigerClaw]

I took two screenshots of TigerClaw in the 87 cartoon style. :)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CemKFnBWQAAKC76.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CemKF2sWsAA1O8B.jpg

[turtle1237]

I would say Turtles Forever is a lot better written, nothing in this episode makes sense and the pacing is way off.

It made sense, you cant compare 22 mins vs a over hour movie in pacing though.

In the 22 mins they hit the big points. It should of been a 2 parter.

[Galactus]

Just watched it and it was enjoyable but nowhere near as good as Turtles Forever.

I'll say one thing that I found that they did do better; the animation of the environments and characters of the Mirage comic universe was very well done and loved the depiction of the originals in action was based on actual artwork from the comics. The idea of using comic panels was also clever but if we ever saw the "Mirage Universe" again for any greater length of time I would prefer to portray it without the comic style borders and have the characters actually speak (naturally) although I can't see it happening again.

The two biggest flaws of the episode were understandable. The pacing was way too fast but that's due to it being a single episode and the lack of the rest extended Fred Wolf cast was a problem, I can imagine that they may have thought using Shredder (and by extension Bebop and Rocksteady) might be in poor taste given James Avery's passing. Strangely I thought we would have gotten appearances from both versions of April (and Casey) but again I'm guessing time was a factor here.

The best part for was when it slowed down in the Nick Earth and we saw Splinter in the lair which was reminiscent of the similar heartfelt scene in Turtles Forever which I think sums up my overall feelings on the episode.

I agree with the sentiment that it was essentially Turtles Forever-lite and I don't really see any more respect payed to the Fred Wolf characters as they used pretty much the same jokes about their lack of skills, not being being serious when it's called for like in the lair with Splinter and their world making little sense. Likewise their characterization was pretty much the same. Like it or not but most of the stuff Fred Wolf fans hated about how the characters acted in Turtles Forever was drawn from specific episodes of the old show - would it have been better had they focused on portraying them like they were in their semi-serious seasons/episodes? Maybe but you can't really argue that it was a complete mis-characterization when in fact it drew from a lot of the old show's continuity which is what this episode lacked. A lot of their jokes were more broad about how goofy the characters were and even attempts to directly reference things from the old show like '87 Raphael splatting a Kraang with a pizza recreating the scene from the intro were neat but they never actually did stuff like that in the actual show as in cartoon physics were they whip out giant objects from nowhere.

Also it seemed to lack knowledge of the old show beyond the basics. It seemed to portray Krang as trapped on Earth as opposed to having almost constant access to Dimension-X. The attempt to tie Krang with the Kraang was clever and ties the two shows together in a way that further crossovers will feel more organic but it does overlook that Dimension-X was often depicted very differently to the Nick show that it can't possibly be the same realm unless of course there are 2D parts of Dimension-X but I guess it's best not to overthink this.

Still I enjoyed it a lot and it was nice to hear the classic voice actors again and look forward to the next. In fact after watching it I couldn't help but think that and since I've yet to warm to the Nickledeon version of Bebop and Rocksteady and they haven't been used much that I wonder if it wouldn't have been best to hold off on them and have the classic versions hop to Nick dimension permanently...maybe that's where they could have gone during Seasons 9 and 10.

[neatoman]

It made sense, you cant compare 22 mins vs a over hour movie in pacing though.

In the 22 mins they hit the big points. It should of been a 2 parter.

Actually they could have ignored several scenes and just let the important ones run a bit longer, instead of cramming in as much possible. Shorter run time should mean fewer scenes, not shorter scenes.

As for making it a two parter, let me be blunt, no. This episode is already pointless as it is, it adds nothing to the story, it came out of nowhere and the arc it interrupted has been going on for nine episodes and will continue for four more. A second episode would just eat up more time.

[FredWolfLeonardo]

This episode somewhat contradicts the continuity of the Fred Wolf universe.

I can understand Krang's history with his cousin Subprime in the 3D dimension X, but the location of the technodrome being stranded in the 3Dverse after Krang is sent back to the 87 world doesn't seem to connect with the OT in any way.

This episode, while possibly having continuity errors like turtles forever, was overall very enjoyable for me and I feel it vastly improved on many areas where Turtles forever could've done alot better in regards to the Fred Wolf Cartoon.

Anyhow, judging from Rob's tweet, we'll be getting atleast one more episode sometime in the future with the 80s turtles and Krang returning, as well as the new addition of Shredder, Bebop and Rocksteady.

I'm guessing the future crossover will attempt to give us a brief explanation as to why shredder and his henchmen were missing during this episode, and will utilize the classic Technodrome in a bigger role this time.

[Ninturtle]

Actually they could have ignored several scenes and just let the important ones run a bit longer, instead of cramming in as much possible. Shorter run time should mean fewer scenes, not shorter scenes.

As for making it a two parter, let me be blunt, no. This episode is already pointless as it is, it adds nothing to the story, it came out of nowhere and the arc it interrupted has been going on for nine episodes and will continue for four more. A second episode would just eat up more time.

It may not add anything to the plot but this special was the most enjoyable thing to come out of the series in a while, even if would have extended the space arc a two parter would have been worth it.

[Galactus]

As for making it a two parter, let me be blunt, no. This episode is already pointless as it is, it adds nothing to the story, it came out of nowhere and the arc it interrupted has been going on for nine episodes and will continue for four more. A second episode would just eat up more time.

I suppose beyond simple fan service it does serve to properly introduce the concept of the two shows crossing over. I think we'll be getting some form of crossover at least once a season.

I would also imagine it serves the purpose of advertising the classics line. I know last Christmas I saw the classics figures still in stores and I would imagine any fan hoping for a continuation of that line or other figures based on the '87 show it probably has a better chance now.

But yes it's a bit jarring to have it in the middle of arc like this.

This episode somewhat contradicts the continuity of the Fred Wolf universe.

I can understand Krang's history with his cousin Subprime in the 3D dimension X, but the location of the technodrome being stranded in the 3Dverse after Krang is sent back to the 87 world doesn't seem to connect with the OT in any way.

This episode, while possibly having continuity errors like turtles forever, was overall very enjoyable for me and I feel it vastly improved on many areas where Turtles forever could've done alot better in regards to the Fred Wolf Cartoon.

I wouldn't say Turtles Forever had any continuity errors really. Anyone who was hoping that it would reference the status of the characters and things like the Technodrome after the pretty divisive Red Sky seasons was probably hoping for too much. They were shooting for depicting a classic OT setup and really you can say the special took place at any time in the Fred Wolf continuity.

It's a lot harder to rationalize the pretty consistent depiction of Dimension-X in the Fred Wolf show with the idea that it's the same on realm as what we've seen in the Nickledeon series. It's a great idea to actually say it was the Kraang that banished Krang but at the expense of well...every old show episode that depicted Dimension-X.

[neatoman]

It may not add anything to the plot but this special was the most enjoyable thing to come out of the series in a while, even if would have extended the space arc a two parter would have been worth it.

Do I need to remind people that this show isn't meant for stuff like this? Concluding the space arc (part of the ongoing story) ought to be a higher priority than making a crossover with a show that was cancelled twenty years ago.

[CyberCubed]

Why are you so concerned about the space arc? Its going up to episode 14, so if you don't count this crossover ep, the space arc gets 13 episodes. 13 episodes is half the season.

What difference would it have made if this crossover ep took place after they got home? Literally the only difference is the scenes with Fugitoid would be gone and you'd just see the Turtles zapped directly from their lair instead.

[Ninturtle]

Do I need to remind people that this show isn't meant for stuff like this? Concluding the space arc (part of the ongoing story) ought to be a higher priority than making a crossover with a show that was cancelled twenty years ago.

Why isn't the show made for stuff like this? The show has constantly showed that there were other dimensions so this makes perfect sense. And who cares if this isn't connected to the on going story? The special still did a lot. It told us what period of the the turtles on earth are on, it told us what happened before the OT turtles were doing before they appeared on Wormquake, and it gave us more of a back story on Krang. And it referenced the space arc before they went into the OT dimension and when they saw Splinter. It was a great special and the fact that it was in the space arc took nothing away from it.

[neatoman]

Why are you so concerned about the space arc? Its going up to episode 14, so if you don't count this crossover ep, the space arc gets 13 episodes. 13 episodes is half the season.

What difference would it have made if this crossover ep took place after they got home? Literally the only difference is the scenes with Fugitoid would be gone and you'd just see the Turtles zapped directly from their lair instead.

Because it has nothing to do with what's going on, the difference is that it wpuld feel far less out of place in the middle of other filler episodes.

[Galactus]

It's not that big of a deal for me but it can be frustrating for fans who want the story to advance particularly if you're watching the show as it airs. Remember when people complained the Northampton arc lasted way too long and they were stuck on the farm forever. I didn't personally think it was too long but the schedule of releasing new episodes meant it "felt" slower. Now space seems like a more diverse environment so it doesn't feel as static but I can see why fans are eager to see the story progress.

I think the biggest difference had this episode have been made outside of the space arc it would be that it wouldn't bother with the time travel aspect which I thought was bit odd but gave me my favorite scene of the turtles encountering their Splinter so I can't complain too much.

[IndigoErth]

A bit "eh" on the designs, but fun episode and awesome they were able to get the old cast in on it. Filler for sure I guess, but I like that the time frame allowed them a short visit with Splinter and home. At least that sort of tied a mostly filler-type episode in with the rest. Mirage Turtles appearance was pretty awesome - I really want to know what was going through their minds. lol :D

Megan Fox, huh? :lol: Too bad she plays April, roughly speaking, and not an Irma.

[Papenbrook]

As for making it a two parter, let me be blunt, no. This episode is already pointless as it is, it adds nothing to the story, it came out of nowhere and the arc it interrupted has been going on for nine episodes and will continue for four more. A second episode would just eat up more time.

Do I need to remind people that this show isn't meant for stuff like this? Concluding the space arc (part of the ongoing story) ought to be a higher priority than making a crossover with a show that was cancelled twenty years ago.

Agreed.

I have already lost interest in this show. At first, it kept using the OT cartoon as its own baseline. Now, it is actually using the OT for unneeded fan-service. Why must it rely so much on the OT?!

[Powder]

I have already lost interest in this show.

& the forums by extension, right?

[Ninturtle]

Because it has nothing to do with what's going on, the difference is that it wpuld feel far less out of place in the middle of other filler episodes.

The Krang situation the OT turtles were dealing with could have happened anytime so it's not hard to believe it happened coincidenently while the turtles are in space.

[Papenbrook]

& the forums by extension, right?

No, but some people are starting to/ have lost interest, Powder.

Probably season 2 is the best, at least first half is. Then season 1. Season 3 however, just awful. Like Platinum Dunes TMNT movie awful.

The first season was the best of the series (at least from what I tried to continue in watching), particularly the first two-thirds of the first season.

One of the biggest reasons was that we saw the Turtles engage and relate to the characters, especially the villains, in a deeper way (Bradford with Mikey, Fishface with Raph, and Leo with Karai and Fong, Donnie with Timothy); by doing so, it revealed the different facets of the Turtles, and as the series continued, appeared to be a progressive path of character development for the Turtles. Yet as it neared closer to the end of season 1... somehow that all fell apart:

1) The increasing caricature or one-dimensional depiction of the main characters. Mikey's increasing idiocy, the hyperfocus on making Raph a one-dimensional character with anger problems, Donnie's growing stalker like behavior around April, April becoming more like a Mary Sue, the ongoing overemphasis of the Donnie-April-Casey love triangle, etc.

2) The transition of making the villains as interesting characters with a backstory (i.e. Bradford, Fishface), to becoming "mutant villains of the week" (Season 2 and afterward).

3) And the most grating: The plot amnesia with the show, which undermines whatever lessons learned or whatever little growth there was for the characters (i.e. through the characters relating to each other as explained earlier), and now traded for more cliche school morale messages (i.e. "I can do anything if I believe in myself and my training!")


I don't know if it was the pressure from Nick or the production crew to change the format of a serial show to a more procedural-leaning one (with the show's plot amnesia), or to focus on the action figure merchandise (aka "mutant of the week") from Nick, or the departure of Sternin & Ventimilia, is the cause for the very disappointing tone and execution shift, but somewhere near the end Season 1 there's a gradual change in the show's direction.

It wasn't my favorite TMNT series from the start, but at least with the first season there was a lot of potential from what I saw and I was genuinely interested to see where it would go, but it never seemed to want to explore that potential in the show's narrative or maybe it was just oblivious to what good potential it had. By the time I saw the Season 2 finale, all of that potential I once saw, now all seems wasted and a distant memory.

What makes it worse is how this show was seemingly meant to encapsulate the "best" of the TMNT legacy, but it doesn't seem to quite do that. It doesn't have the solid, serial-formatted storywriting that 4Kids has, neither does it have the witty humor of the OT but rather has low-brow immature humor (i.e. Mikey being painfully dumb, farts, belching, the ongoing love triangle). It has quickly forgotten villains and developments (i.e. the Technodrome, the Foot Clan becoming nearly invincible robots, TigerClaw's ruthlessness), which the show hypes beyond the actual magnitude of their impact. Strangely enough, the show seems to be on its own non-distinct (by using numerous other TMNT elements and horror movies) and fairly unimpressive path within the TMNT franchise.
A round of applause for you RR! :nod:

Pretty much what you'd said sums up quite a lot of what I've been feeling. I think to add my own bits, for me the downhill transition started at Manhattan Project, since there was a lot in the two-parter that seemed unnaturally goofy and cartoonish. Xever giving Tigerclaw a glass of milk (cartoonish idea of cats liking milk) the cheese phone (rats liking cheese) and Bradford losing easily despite his superior second form didn't seem all that 'cute.'

I really think losing those two writers kind of killed things, since they seemed to know how to balance a lot of the show's elements, and once they left the show either hewed too much towards goofy at times or left a lot of the characters (especially the villains) underdeveloped and weak. I wish they could come back, the show could use their talents again.

Season 1 by far.

first part of season 2 was cool too.

[GoldMutant]

......Those are all from earlier in the show's lifespan, especially from RR (seriously wish he can come back :() and the others. Warhorse practically quit come Clash of the Mutanimals and I'm unsure on Babyturtles. Yes, they all came from last year as responses to the Which Season is the Best? thread, but tuned out probably beforehand and wanted to offer their two cents. :ohwell:

[Xav]

Jim Cummings, or that guy who came out of nowhere in season 10 and never heard from him again after that. William E Martin. assuming that isn't a monkiker.Unfortunately the chances of William E Martin returning are the same as James Avery's.
But Dimension X exists in the original cartoon's universe, and as we've seen, Nick's Dimension X is completely different with weird gravity, floating worm creatures, and it seems to have no other alien races other than Kraang there.But we did see other alien races in Nick's Dimension X like the Rock Soldiers, of course they look nothing like their Fred Wolf counterparts.

[spookycookies]

Very fun episode I really enjoyed it. But what was that Megan Fox joke? I must have totally missed it...

[Ninturtle]

No, but some people are starting to/ have lost interest in the show, Powder.
He really doesn't care about people losing interest in the show, he just want you to leave this forum like a lot of users do.

[TurtleGuy]

Unfortunately the chances of William E Martin returning are the same as James Avery's.
But we did see other alien races in Nick's Dimension X like the Rock Soldiers, of course they look nothing like their Fred Wolf counterparts.

I wonder if Krang created his own Dimension X after being banished?

Krang: Screw you guys! I'll just make my own Dimension X and I'll be overlord with my own rock soldiers! And it'll have Blackjack! And Hookers!

It's a farfetched theory and I just wanted an excuse to make Krang quote Futurama. :P

[IndigoErth]

No, but some people are starting to/ have lost interest in the show, Powder.
*shrug* People lose interest in things, it's life. Prob still have older TMNT they still love, and something new may catch their interest again someday.

[Galactus]

The crying, but what about the running away and acting scared when the battle was 2 much for ot turtles?

That seemed reminscent of many episodes like Bebop and Rocksteady conquer the Universe were the turtles were hit by weird rays that made them cowards but if you want an episode it happened while the turtles were supposed to be in character check out Snakes Alive were Leonardo contiually cowers in fear and runs away from battle leaving his brothers without help.

And I dont recall a lot of noggies in the OT, I cant recall one really. In Forever, the turles were giving out noggies like every 5 mins?

Actually that's the only thing I'd say in the special that wasn't drawn from the old show although it's hardly something that would never happen in the old show. Also correct me if I'm wrong but in Turtles Forever it happened twice hardly "every five minutes"

Sorry, but Forever may of hit on some points on the old turtles, but they miss the mark by a long shot.

Too much is specifically drawn from the old show to say that. Jokes from specific episodes paraphrased or quoted verbatim, actions the turtles take that are not only similar emulate the animation of the original episode.

Like I said would have been better if they'd forgone all the goofy characterization and focused on portraying more on "better" seasons/episodes? Maybe but the whole point is seemingly to portray three very different sets of turtles. It was handled fairly well here but at times it didn't seem like we were getting two very similar versions.

And only Mikey had a pizza addiction in the old toon. Many times, the Turtles would saved the day over vs a slice. In fact, some times the turtles try to help Mike with his pizza habit.

And there were many episodes they were portrayed as all equally as into pizza.

[TurtleGuy]

That seemed reminscent of many episodes like Bebop and Rocksteady conquer the Universe were the turtles were hit by weird rays that made them cowards but if you want an episode it happened while the turtles were supposed to be in character check out Snakes Alive were Leonardo contiually cowers in fear and runs away from battle leaving his brothers without help.

But in Snakes Alive's case that was justified with Leonardo having a crippling fear of snakes and he overcame said fear in the end.


Actually that's the only thing I'd say in the special that wasn't drawn from the old show although it's hardly something that would never happen in the old show. Also correct me if I'm wrong but in Turtles Forever it happened twice hardly "every five minutes"


While not giving each others noogies every five minutes, let's look at some other out of character moments such as Donatello not knowing the difference between a wrench and a hammer, Donatello saying that "Science isn't all about facts", the turtles constantly grinning and laughing at their own jokes and taking absolutely nothing seriously, or wondering why trashcans had no affect on a GIANT SHREDDER. They usually treated even the weirdest plans with some bit of seriousness. Or at least more seriously than the Turtles Forever FW Turtles did. And at least here, you can tell which character is which unlike Turtles Forever where all four of them were practically interchangable idiots with Raph throwing a fourth wall joke here and there(or as 2003 Raph put it "Four Mikeys").



Too much is specifically drawn from the old show to say that. Jokes from specific episodes paraphrased or quoted verbatim, actions the turtles take that are not only similar emulate the animation of the original episode.

Like I said would have been better if they'd forgone all the goofy characterization and focused on portraying more on "better" seasons/episodes? Maybe but the whole point is seemingly to portray three very different sets of turtles. It was handled fairly well here but at times it didn't seem like we were getting two very similar versions.


I'm just gonna quote Konchadunga since he put it best:


The best they can claim is some meta accuracy; like they distilled the whole show's silliness onto the Turtles, but that's still wrong. It would be like having one of the dark, gritty Batman incarnations of the modern era having a crossover with the Adam West Batman, if the latter was constantly saying phrases that began with "holy" and making puns, yes; that existed in the show but it wasn't Batman who did it!

I'd honestly would've preferred they show the differences between the turtles a little more subtlety instead of trying to hammer in the differences between the two incarnations about as a bluntly as a hammer to the crotch.

[Utrommaniac]

I wonder if Krang created his own Dimension X after being banished?

Krang: Screw you guys! I'll just make my own Dimension X and I'll be overlord with my own rock soldiers! And it'll have Blackjack! And Hookers!

It's a farfetched theory and I just wanted an excuse to make Krang quote Futurama. :P

Right! Someone get Pat Fraley to do voice that!

I like to think that with Dimension X being so enormous and obscure, it would have two different dimensional planes.

[SKX31]

.
Like I said would have been better if they'd forgone all the goofy characterization and focused on portraying more on "better" seasons/episodes? Maybe but the whole point is seemingly to portray three very different sets of turtles. It was handled fairly well here but at times it didn't seem like we were getting two very similar versions.

Oh bloody hell yes. Thank you for mentioning that.

I may be in the camp that thinks that 4Kids were not perfect when it came to handling the OT Turtles (although I don't think it was butchered), but that was far from the only thing about the special. Just as the "worse" parts of any given cartoon / special / whatever shouldn't be ignored in favor of the "better" (or vice versa - it risks creating a very skewed impression).

Yes, I can understand why people do that - I mean, do people really wanna remember absolute OT classics like Agatha Marbles and the bland villain plot of the week (mostly courtesy of the Shredder)? Not to mention how inconsistent Fred Wolf was from episode to episode?

In that vein, I'm echoing Mark Pellegrini:

This show (OT) is something unique unto itself. It is weird and spontaneous, but it can also be derivative and predictable. There are episodes where the animation quality surprises you and the show looks fluid and gorgeous. And then there are episodes that look like the Korean guy animating it had a seizure on his drawing board, the ink and paint guy was colorblind and the cel photographer was hoping that if he did a bad enough job someone would FINALLY fire him. But no one ever did.

This show can be brilliant, hilarious, exciting, crazy and otherwise inspired… but then nearly as often, it just goes through the motions to meet first run syndication deadlines. So yes, this show is flawed. VERY flawed, in fact. But all those little quality control malfunctions and inane nonsense are also part of its charm. If this show was competent 100% of the time it wouldn’t be nearly as entertaining.

You can watch the show distilled down to just its best episodes, sure. And for a while, I considered putting together an abridged viewing list; just the best episodes or the ones that mattered most to the narrative. But that would be sort of missing the point. You kind of NEED that crap, those episodes with lazy animation, recycled scripts, contradictory continuity and plot holes the size of the Technodrome. They’re as fundamental as the highlights; you can’t have the wheat without the chaff.

This goes for all shows, really. You can't just ignore the executive meddling behind >> and BttS when it comes to 4Kids. But neither should you ignore its strong points either. Same goes with Nick - so far, it's been the innovative reinvention of characters as a big positive and the handling of many, many villains (Karai and Shredder's goons) as a major negative.

Yea, I'm a broken record (again) - but it's an anvil worth dropping.

[Galactus]

But in Snakes Alive's case that was justified with Leonardo having a crippling fear of snakes and he overcame said fear in the end.

Yes he overcomes his fear at the climax of the episode but given that he's the leader of a group of heroes his actions of continually cowering seem like an overly goofy way of portraying fear but if we accept that the turtles act that when when scared then why can't we say they have a crippling fear of being erased. It's not like they didn't step up and fight back in Turtles Forever either.

let's look at some other out of character moments such as Donatello not knowing the difference between a wrench and a hammer,

Leonardo Lightens Up. It's pretty clear that is a reference to Donatello using a wrench as a hammer in that episode so much so that the animation copies that episode pretty nicely.

Donatello saying that "Science isn't all about facts",

Well yeah but then the depiction of whether Donatello's science knowledge was brilliant within the laws of the old show or whether he was kinda screwy who most of his inventions don't work I think is enough to justify a line like this.

The depiction the turtles constantly grinning and laughing at their own jokes and taking absolutely nothing

This is an interesting one. The turtles throughout most of the very smiley and grin-y. It's accentuated in Turtles Forever because they have visible teeth when smiling which the turtles only had in the first season and when they weren't always grinning. The inclusion of the first season teeth gives Turtles Forever a Cheshire cat quality.

As for laughing in unison there's plenty of examples of that, heck even in the 'better' seasons. Like Enter The Shredder were the three turtles upon hearing about a zoo theft break into fits of laughter.

seriously, or wondering why trashcans had no affect on a GIANT SHREDDER.

The turtles used fish to battle a ninja army and they often used trash cans and garbage and pizza in slap stick fights to good affect for them to justify that joke.

They usually treated even the weirdest plans with some bit of seriousness. Or at least more seriously than the Turtles Forever FW Turtles did.

I'm not so sure about that. There was a great site that reviewed the old show called TMNT Dissected and pointed out that once they started making regular fourth wall joke their commitment to fully beating bad guys went away.

Remember Night of Rogues were they tar Shredder and start cracking up instead of stopping him from getting away? Hey that's another example of the turtles cracking themselves up.

I often read that Leonardo in particular wasn't leader-y enough but apart from that first season his leadership generally amounted to saying things like "get serious guys" or "let's go turtles" which is what he pretty much did in Turtles Forever. When the Fred Wolf turtles are all cracking up over Utrom Shredder it's '87 Leo which breaks it up and says they've got to get to the lair.

At least here, you can tell which character is which unlike Turtles Forever where all four of them were practically interchangable idiots with Raph throwing a fourth wall joke here and there(or as 2003 Raph put it "Four Mikeys").

I think a great example of the turtles all becoming like Michelangelo is in A Thing About Rats when they arrive at April's apartment. Despite regularly eating pizza Michelangelo doesn't know he can't bite though a box, Raphael doesn't know how to use a shampoo instruction and ends up surfing into her living room, Leonardo who has paintings in the lair thinks April's painting is a target (or doesn't care that it's a painting) and Donatello doesn't know how to work an answering machine (see that isn't always the smart one) and that was one of the "good" episodes.

The show was full of that. Episodes were three turtles act the same (generally like Mikey) apart from the focus turtle or the other way around were the focus turtle acts way out of character in comparison to his sane brothers.

I'm just gonna quote Konchadunga since he put it best:

I'd honestly would've preferred they show the differences between the turtles a little more subtlety instead of trying to hammer in the differences between the two incarnations about as a bluntly as a hammer to the crotch.

I've said it twice in this thread that may have been better although no one cares that the 4kids turtles are somewhat humorless and a lot of their continuity gets skipped over or that the Mirage turtles are basically the same dark killer types. I tend to think a lot of the (justified) jokes wouldn't have really worked if they'd tried for subtlety but I we'll never know. It's not like this episode portrayed them distinctly different enough from the Turtles Forever approach.

[CyberCubed]

Also I'm pretty sure the original Turtles always laughing was largely taken from the second episode when April tells the Turtles about Bebop/Rocksteady for the first time. And they're standing there disguised in their punk outfits and they burst out laughing about a "rhino and warthog."

There are also several other episodes they burst out laughing over a villain, like when they see The Swatter in Season 6.

[Kilowog]

Dug the 1984 cameo quite a bit.

[turtle1237]

Also I'm pretty sure the original Turtles always laughing was largely taken from the second episode when April tells the Turtles about Bebop/Rocksteady for the first time. And they're standing there disguised in their punk outfits and they burst out laughing about a "rhino and warthog."

There are also several other episodes they burst out laughing over a villain, like when they see The Swatter in Season 6.

few times, the one mention was when Shredder stole zoo animals for what would be Bebop and Rocksteady.

Now the Turtles laugh because even they can not believe that Shredder and Krang would be reduce to stealing zoo animals. It was a crime that really didn't fit the villains.

Again, the Turtles very rarely laugh at the villains, but in this case, it was warrant because in stand of trying to rule the world, Shredder is out stealing zoo animals.

[Coola Yagami]

Turtles Forever portrayed them almost the exact same way this episode did, sans the crying scene which should have been axed. Other than that they were almost identical.

Nope. They weren't laughing every five seconds, and other than goofing off at the lair they took most of the situation seriously. Plus they actually remembered Leo was the leader this time and actually showed him giving orders.

[Chabrendeki]

I just watched the episode, and I liked it very much, especially the Turtles Prime scene...

I had the whole time the feeling, this episode is a continuation of Turtles Forever:

1) the OT-Turtles know already about another-dimension-turtles, OT-Donatello, already knows the coordinates of Turtle Prime. His portal gun could just be an improved version of the one he invented and used in Turtles Forever.

2) but nut just the Turtles know all this things: Krang knows all that too, he just follows the plan of Ch'rell, he witnessed. "The primary turtles dimension" as the source of all existing dimension is already a fact for him, and he uses this knowledge.

I don't say, this episode IS "Turtles Forever II", but you CAN watch it so.

[CyberCubed]

Nope. They weren't laughing every five seconds, and other than goofing off at the lair they took most of the situation seriously. Plus they actually remembered Leo was the leader this time and actually showed him giving orders.

The Turtles weren't laughing in every seen in Turtles Forever either, it really only happened at the beginning and once at the end. Likewise what does it matter if Leo was the leader or not? Half the time in the original toon Donatello would give out the orders in the episode while Leonardo would hang back and not say anything.

[Coola Yagami]

The Turtles weren't laughing in every seen in Turtles Forever either, it really only happened at the beginning and once at the end. Likewise what does it matter if Leo was the leader or not? Half the time in the original toon Donatello would give out the orders in the episode while Leonardo would hang back and not say anything.

Similar to this episode, most of the time Leo would send the guys to do the fighting while Donnie did the science stuff. The same could be said for any cartoon with Don when it came to anything scientific. He would know what to do and tell the others to do it and in those cases Leo, whichever version, would follow orders too.

Turtles Forever seemed to completely forget Leo's role. In fact, I was expecting a scene where both Leos clashed on who gave the orders, but it never happened. This version did, and with funny results.

I honestly don't see why the strong defense for Turtles Forever, when you know that movie's greatest shortcoming was the portrayal of the 80's Turtles. Turtles Forever might have done it first, but this episode portrayed them better. The only thing that would have made it better is if they used traditional animation instead of that weird flash animation.

[CyberCubed]

Turtles Forever seemed to completely forget Leo's role. In fact, I was expecting a scene where both Leos clashed on who gave the orders, but it never happened. This version did, and with funny results.

I remember quite a few scenes in Turtles Forever where Leonardo was telling the Turtles what they should do, but again it was OT Don that came up with all the plans to save the day as usual, just like the series did.

[Powder]

I just watched the episode, and I liked it very much, especially the Turtles Prime scene...

I had the whole time the feeling, this episode is a continuation of Turtles Forever:

1) the OT-Turtles know already about another-dimension-turtles, OT-Donatello, already knows the coordinates of Turtle Prime. His portal gun could just be an improved version of the one he invented and used in Turtles Forever.

2) but nut just the Turtles know all this things: Krang knows all that too, he just follows the plan of Ch'rell, he witnessed. "The primarely turtles dimension" as the source of all existing dimension is already a fact for him, and he uses this knowledge.

I don't say, this episode IS "Turtles Forever II", but you CAN watch it so.

Great points, you're right, it can totally work as an optional sequel. Good observations!

[Coola Yagami]

I remember quite a few scenes in Turtles Forever where Leonardo was telling the Turtles what they should do, but again it was OT Don that came up with all the plans to save the day as usual, just like the series did.

LMAO Like when? The only time I remember was when he told the others to shut up because 'this is serious'. He really didn't do anything leader-ish throughout the entire special.

[CyberCubed]

This episode had a lot of references to Turtles Forever. They didn't directly mention anything that happened in the movie, but the 80's Turtles and Krang knew all about the other dimensions.

[CyberCubed]

LMAO Like when? The only time I remember was when he told the others to shut up because 'this is serious'. He really didn't do anything leader-ish throughout the entire special.

"We've got to do something."

[Coola Yagami]

"We've got to do something."

He never gave orders or told anyone to do this or that. This episode portrayed that so much better. Leo was more in character overall.

[CyberCubed]

On another note, did anyone notice 80's Raph had the least amount of lines of all the older Turtles? I actually wonder if that was done purposely, because Rob Paulsen is already a regular on the show, so he didn't want to "hog all the screentime" away from the other 80's Turtle voices who only came back for this special.

Even saying that, I loved that Rob remembered his Raph talks differently than Nick's Donatello. I was worried he would use the same voice for both, but you can still tell the difference between 80's Raph and how nervous/fast talking his Donnie is.

[Coola Yagami]

On another note, did anyone notice 80's Raph had the least amount of lines of all the older Turtles? I actually wonder if that was done purposely, because Rob Paulsen is already a regular on the show, so he didn't want to "hog all the screentime" away from the other 80's Turtle voices who only came back for this special.

Even saying that, I loved that Rob remembered his Raph talks differently than Nick's Donatello. I was worried he would use the same voice for both, but you can still tell the difference between 80's Raph and how nervous/fast talking his Donnie is.

Well his Donnie voice is higher pitched and well... nerdier sounding than Raph. I think he would have remembered to lower the pitch to do Raph's voice and make him sound.... cool but crude.

[Wildcat]

It was a good episode but it should have been 2 parts and should have had it's own unique plot. They literally copied Turtles Forever with destroying realities and turtle prime.

I'm sure they'll crossover again. I mean it's quite predictable they'd somehow bring them back together to battle some huge threat later on. Especially since Tigerclaw knows about them.

I'd love if they included the 4kids turtles. Maybe that's unlikely but it shouldn't be since Nick owns that version now.

[FlawedCoil82]

Despite not being a big fan of the original cartoon, I have to admit that episode was a lot of fun! I only wish that it could have been an hour long and somehow included the 4kids version of the turtles as well so they wouldnt have seemed so "forgotten". Sub Prime was pretty entertaining/funny in this episode too. The first episode from this 4th season that actually left me wanting more.

[CyberCubed]

I honestly wonder if Nick will do a crossover with the IDW Turtles, since they're both going on now and Nick oversees both of them. Plus it would be like advertising their own product.

[Chabrendeki]

I honestly wonder if Nick will do a crossover with the IDW Turtles, since they're both going on now and Nick oversees both of them. Plus it would be like advertising their own product.

I don't think, that would happen in animation. The cartoon has a bigger audience, than the comic has... so it would be hard to explain, who these guys are.

...but I could imagine this crossover in a comic micro-series...

[CyberCubed]

IDW TMNT is getting both a videogame and a table-top board game soon. They might also get figures/toys at some point too. Each issue also sells around 20,000 copies give or take.

IDW TMNT isn't that obscure anymore. Obviously being a comic its nowhere as well known as the cartoon, but its gaining public awareness.

[TurtleFan2012]

I'm confused. Is Turtles Forever canon or not? 1987 Donatello doesn't seem to recognize the Mirage Turtles even though he met them back in TF. He acts like it's his first time visiting the Mirage universe. Weird. :ohwell:

In the beginning, it's implied that the 87 turtles met the 2003 turtles. How would they know about alternate realities if they never met the 2003 crew?

[Chabrendeki]

IDW TMNT is getting both a videogame and a table-top board game soon. They might also get figures/toys at some point too. Each issue also sells around 20,000 copies give or take.

IDW TMNT isn't that obscure anymore. Obviously being a comic its nowhere as well known as the cartoon, but its gaining public awareness.

Yes, I didn't deny this. I just think, this awarenes isn't enough yet, to make tis happen.

I would love it, it would happen, I just doubt, it will, you see?

[Chabrendeki]

I'm confused. Is Turtles Forever canon or not? 1987 Donatello doesn't seem to recognize the Mirage Turtles even though he met them back in TF. He acts like it's his first time visiting the Mirage universe. Weird. :ohwell:

In the beginning, it's implied that the 87 turtles met the 2003 turtles. How would they know about other alternate realities if they never met the 2003 crew?

Yes, you're right, he actually says "Wow, what kind of dimension is this?", and looks really wondered. And then Nick-Don explains, this could be a dimension before the dimensions of them both. So it's really confusing, especially, because, when Leo orders to go to Turtle Prime, he just need seconds to adjust the right coordinates on the portal gun, as if he already knew, where to go.

[CyberCubed]

Anyone find it amusing Barry Gordon's Donatello now sounds like the imitation 80's Don voice from Turtles Forever?

Since Barry Gordon's voice has changed over the years, his current voice sounds similar to the guy who voiced Don in Turtles Forever. Talk about irony.

[Powder]

While a bit more gruff due to age, his Donnie was just fine to me. Was very happy to hear him, given he's the least vocal/active of the 4 turtles.

[TheCollector]

I have to be honest, while I loved this episode(IT WAS SO GOOD), the part where Sub-Prime's Irma head was broken off and stabbed through with the sai upset me. I still don't care whatsoever for that story point..

[victory_angel]

Anyone find it amusing Barry Gordon's Donatello now sounds like the imitation 80's Don voice from Turtles Forever?

Since Barry Gordon's voice has changed over the years, his current voice sounds similar to the guy who voiced Don in Turtles Forever. Talk about irony.

I thought he sounded fine, the only time where I got thrown off was where he was explaining the portal projector and how it could hone in on Krangs frequency and he ended up sounding like a Drunk Professor Frink.

[neatoman]

I'm confused. Is Turtles Forever canon or not? 1987 Donatello doesn't seem to recognize the Mirage Turtles even though he met them back in TF. He acts like it's his first time visiting the Mirage universe. Weird. :ohwell:

In the beginning, it's implied that the 87 turtles met the 2003 turtles. How would they know about alternate realities if they never met the 2003 crew?

A joke about the questionable continuity in the Fred Wolf cartoon? I don't know but this episode's relation to the actual Fred Wolf cartoon is more questionable than wheter or not Turtles Forever counts.

[BH Daimaouji]

Turtles Forever portrayed them almost the exact same way this episode did, sans the crying scene which should have been axed. Other than that they were almost identical.

Nah 4kids 1987 TMNT were mindless freaks

According to the cast list Paulsen posted, it's Kevin Michael Richardson

Really? So it's like Nick based it on the polish dub of TMNT 2012, since the 80s turtles are voiced by theire TMNT 2012 VA

It's a shame James Avery didn't do the voices before he died and Nick was going to use it

[DarkAtuin]

Anyone noticed or mentioned that the 2D '87 Turtles (incorrectly) have bands on their ankles like in the first cameo, while it's been corrected in the 3D version?

[shredder orokusaki]

I saw it and it was great. Krang was lying to me all these years. He said that he was a criminal banished from his planet due to his crimes while in reality he is an idiot!!!

[Chaotix12345]

Upon rewatching, I just realized something: Krang REALLY must've taken Sub-Prime's "Destroy the Turtles at any cost" thing to heart if he's willing to destroy the Prime Dimension that causes everything else in the multiverse to go with it if it's destroyed. :lol:

[Ninjinister]

Nah 4kids 1987 TMNT were mindless freaks

Not even close to being true.


Really? So it's like Nick based it on the polish dub of TMNT 2012

Probably also not true. KMR probably auditioned or otherwise was legitimately cast on his own merits. Besides if it were, it would actually be the opposite... We would have James as 2K12 Shredder (which sadly would necessitate a recast later down the line.

[Coola Yagami]

Yes, you're right, he actually says "Wow, what kind of dimension is this?", and looks really wondered. And then Nick-Don explains, this could be a dimension before the dimensions of them both. So it's really confusing, especially, because, when Leo orders to go to Turtle Prime, he just need seconds to adjust the right coordinates on the portal gun, as if he already knew, where to go.

Turtles forever isn't canon. That was a 4kids movie basically and this is the nick show. It's two different shows and they both handled the crossover differently.

Don didn't exactly home in on the prime dimension per say, he homed in on the signal of wherever the last dimensional device was. It could have been anywhere and he would have found it the same way.

Also the Turtles got through different dimensions/planets all the time in the old cartoon. It's not much of a stretch. Plus they must have encountered krang and the Kraang already at this point. Krang must have told them their plans and where the Kraang came from.so they decided to bring the tmnt from the Kraangs dimension.

Remember, we just see this from the nick point of view, the moment they get beamed to the 80s show. The 80s turtles have already faced with krang and the Kraang at least once before they decided they needed help.

[Chabrendeki]

Turtles forever isn't canon. That was a 4kids movie basically and this is the nick show. It's two different shows and they both handled the crossover differently.

Don didn't exactly home in on the prime dimension per say, he homed in on the signal of wherever the last dimensional device was. It could have been anywhere and he would have found it the same way.

Also the Turtles got through different dimensions/planets all the time in the old cartoon. It's not much of a stretch. Plus they must have encountered krang and the Kraang already at this point. Krang must have told them their plans and where the Kraang came from.so they decided to bring the tmnt from the Kraangs dimension.

Remember, we just see this from the nick point of view, the moment they get beamed to the 80s show. The 80s turtles have already faced with krang and the Kraang at least once before they decided they needed help.

Yes the eisode sets no clear continuity neither to the Fred Wolf cartoon, or to Turtles Forever.

But if you want, you can interpret it, as a sequel to TF. The similarities in the aspects of other dimensions and how they function allow it.

But it's not the only possible interpretation. There are many.

[TurtleFan2012]

Yes the eisode sets no clear continuity neither to the Fred Wolf cartoon, or to Turtles Forever.

But if you want, you can interpret it, as a sequel to TF. The similarities in the aspects of other dimensions and how they function allow it.

But it's not the only possible interpretation. There are many.

The Mirage Turtles are a lot scarier here than TF. They were ready to slaughter them. Were they like this in the Mirage comics? :o

[Vicky82]

The Mirage Turtles are a lot scarier here than TF. They were ready to slaughter them. Were they like this in the Mirage comics? :o

Yeah they were killing bad guys left, right and center until issue 12 (I think) as they had to tone it down a bit because of the 80s cartoon.

[Utrommaniac]

Upon rewatching, I just realized something: Krang REALLY must've taken Sub-Prime's "Destroy the Turtles at any cost" thing to heart if he's willing to destroy the Prime Dimension that causes everything else in the multiverse to go with it if it's destroyed. :lol:
Yeah, I realized that myself. And compared it to using a blow torch to take out a spider. Which would then burn the whole house and the neighborhood to the ground.

[Yoshimickster]

Upon rewatching, I just realized something: Krang REALLY must've taken Sub-Prime's "Destroy the Turtles at any cost" thing to heart if he's willing to destroy the Prime Dimension that causes everything else in the multiverse to go with it if it's destroyed. :lol:

Indeed, I think we can assume that in Turtles Forever was early Krang where he was a generally competent villain, and the one in "Trans-dimensional Turtles" he was from the later seasons where loss after loss from four generally athletic teenagers with a pizza addiction caused his mental state to deteriorate. HEAD CANON!

[CyberCubed]

Turtles forever isn't canon. That was a 4kids movie basically and this is the nick show. It's two different shows and they both handled the crossover differently.
p.

You can consider Turtles Forever canon to the original cartoon and Nick cartoon if you want to.

Obviously it doesn't really matter, but for those of us who like to think every TMNT universe IS connected in some way, then its nice to think about.

[Powder]

Yeah, it's not that hard to consider either of these or both as canon, there are enough hiccups across each universe's continuity anyway, so it's not like it creates game-breaking errors.

[Ninjinister]

To say one or the other is clearly invalidated is pretty presumptuous considering there is scant evidence either way.

[Yoshimickster]

Both cross-overs are simultaneously canon and non-canon at the same time! Such is the chaotic nature of Earth-1987-2D.

[FredWolfLeonardo]

You can consider Turtles Forever canon to the original cartoon and Nick cartoon if you want to.

Obviously it doesn't really matter, but for those of us who like to think every TMNT universe IS connected in some way, then its nice to think about.

I guess the thing about turtles forever is beside the frequent out of character moments for all the OT characters except for April, Splinter, Bebop and Rocksteady, is that there is no way to reconcile it with the OTs continuity.

In that movie, the technodrome is an upgraded version of itself at the end which has absolutely no way of being reconciled with the old series, unless shredder and krang were feeling nostalgic for the classic design.

Atleast this crossover can be mapped somewhere around the early season 4 (excluding the euro vacation eps) due to some hints such as classic casey jones having met the OT which happened somewhere around late season 3, the technodrome being in dimension X like it did in season 4 and michealangalo using both his nunchucks and grappling hook which lasted until mid season 4 when he dropped his chucks completely.

[Chabrendeki]

There was a hint to OT Casey in this ep.? :o

[FredWolfLeonardo]

There was a hint to OT Casey in this ep.? :o

There was in wormquake

[Powder]

I really can't get behind all the fuss from you FW fans. Do you guys actually watch the series whose details you're so anal about? The developers contradicted themselves almost every week! All kinds of stuff went unexplained, there were conflicting backstories, events with no resolve, tons of plot amnesia, all that's okay with you, but this or Turtles Forever, arguably the coolest developments based in that universe, are the things that don't click? :tlol:

To quote Raphael; "Gimmie a break!"

[Chabrendeki]

There was in wormquake

Oh, I see. Thanks! :)

[FredWolfLeonardo]

I really can't get behind all the fuss from you FW fans. Do you guys actually watch the series whose details you're so anal about? The developers contradicted themselves almost every week! All kinds of stuff went unexplained, there were conflicting backstories, events with no resolve, tons of plot amnesia, all that's okay with you, but this or Turtles Forever, arguably the coolest developments based in that universe, are the things that don't click? :tlol:

To quote Raphael; "Gimmie a break!"

This Nick crossover clicks for me lol. Id guess somewhere around early season 4 excluding the european vacation episodes.

Continuity wise,TF doesn't click for me but that is all easily forgiven because the FW show is not about serial type continuity but rather about all these colourful characters interacting with each other in fun and entertaining ways.

However, what does feel very off about TF for me is the way that the OT are portrayed. There are a ton of moments that felt too out of character. Of course, there are alot of funny jokes about the OT, my favourite being the fourth wall breaking that hun notices, but the out of character moments stick like a sore thumb for me. After watching trans-dimensional turtles, it seems like nick goes their personalities spot on.

Don't get me wrong, i don't hate TF, i infact recommend it to all turtles'fans and believe it has too many good things that shouldn't be missed just because many of the OT characters except for Bebop, Rocksteady and Splinter feel off alot of the time.

[CyberCubed]

The Turtles are literally exactly portrayed as always. I say this as a big fan of the OT who rewatches the series every 2-3 years or so.

[Amaranthus]

This explanation is the explanation that is known as the best explanation.

Kraang approves of the explanation that is known as the explanation given by Kraang.

[Hero]

Enjoyed this new episode. Although it was a regular length running time, this felt longer. The visit to Prime universe was also a decent touch.

Hopefully another crossover is on the cards.

[Phoenix Fire]

I thought it was well done in the limited space of time they had. I'm not sure how I feel about Krang being a banished Kraang... but I feel like this is just the sort of episode you need to suspend belief on everything to enjoy the most. The nostalgia was strong with this one. :D

[TheJ-manTurtleMan]

I really can't get behind all the fuss from you FW fans. Do you guys actually watch the series whose details you're so anal about? The developers contradicted themselves almost every week! All kinds of stuff went unexplained, there were conflicting backstories, events with no resolve, tons of plot amnesia, all that's okay with you, but this or Turtles Forever, arguably the coolest developments based in that universe, are the things that don't click? :tlol:

To quote Raphael; "Gimmie a break!"
Yes. This. :tlol:

Also I don't know if it's been officially said anywhere, but brandon auman did specifically say at the panel and the Autograph signing, that there will be another crossover episode with 80s Shredder, Bebop, and Rocksteady. I just see a lot of people assuming. He didn't say what season though.

[DarkFell]

It seems a bit off that Krang has to rely on The Kraang just to get back into Dimension X, when in fact Krang's Technodrome was stuck in Dimension X in the OT continuum and obviously Krang forgot about his pan dimensional portal back in the control room.
So, OT Krang wouldn't have needed assistance from anyone...unless the Technodrome was totally out of power yet again. (Plot hole perhaps?)

Certain parts of the episode felt off in some areas, but it was good to see Splinter again and Nick Leo totally pegged the emotions when he saw his sensei.

It was also great to hear Pat Fraley kill it as Krang again, along with hearing the original OT VA cast again.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

Would love Krang and the 80s turtles to stick around for like half a season. Why not?

[Candy Kappa]

Pretty fun episode, although the cgi models of the FW Turtles could have used another overhaul. Krang was pretty solid.

[Ceres]

Would love Krang and the 80s turtles to stick around for like half a season. Why not?

I second that statement. :D

[DVD]

Loved it. Going to have to watch it again at a better time. It was like 4am when I saw it.
It was 22 minutes of shear fun, and I enjoyed very one of those 22 minutes.
The use of classic music had me grinning throughout.

Yeah, loved it. Good, fun episode.

[Mona_Lisa]

I know that I have not been around A lot lately but I had to drop in and put My two cents in about This episode.
I Loved IT! I enjoyed it so much! Sure the 2d animation was off, But it was fantastic! Hearing the original Voice cast together was epic, and then they even threw in OT background music!:D
They really Caught the personality's of the individual OT turtles with the exception of them making the OT Raph snarkier. But well I liked that to.
They pointed to a lot of the OT's goofiness but they didn't overdo it ( No crying, wet willies, noggies, And wimps who can't lift the manhole covers). Nick really did there homework!
And when the 2D turtles went 3d, I was really impressed with there 3D designs. I saw a few others didn't like it but I really thought it was great! I loved how they tied it back into The Nick turtles plot, and we got to see the Nick turtles see master splinter again! Although I too was wondering like others, Was master splinter like super confused? Would he say something to the other turtles when they got back??? I guess we just have to assume he herd enough to know he needed to keep his mouth shut. LOL.

I am really happy that there will be another crossover next season. Yes I realize the show is not meant to be a crossover nostalgia fest for us 30 year old OT fans. But they want to draw in as wide of an audience as possible. As a mom and a fan of the OT (I watched the 4kids show,' and watch the New show as well) It is so fun to sit down with my kids And watch with them. They, get excited when I am, If I am happy they are. We laugh together and talk and I believe it really is a nice way to broaden there audience Because it appeals to such a large age bracket. This episode gets 9 out of 10 stars from me!:D

The only thing that left me confused was the ending. This took place just before Wormquake? Are they gonna touch upon that in the future, or are we just supposed to assume Tigerclaw kicked their asses & used Donnie's portal "gun" to get back home? Perhaps he brought it with him through the portal & that's what'll lead to the next crossover?




If you were 80's Krang you'd make up a story (I'm a space gangster) to cover you being a total screw up.

That's how I make it work.


I loved how they looped it in with Wormquake though. Tigerclaw was the cherry on top of the icing on the cake.

I really like your theorys there!:D

Agree with the theory of two different Dimension Xs. Either way though, this special screws around with the OTs continuity but that's not a bad thing because the continuity of that show was inconsistent at times anyway, which is surprisingly a consistent accuracy (or should i say inaccuracy) when carried over to the nick show LOL
Lol. Very true

Yes, you're right, he actually says "Wow, what kind of dimension is this?", and looks really wondered. And then Nick-Don explains, this could be a dimension before the dimensions of them both. So it's really confusing, especially, because, when Leo orders to go to Turtle Prime, he just need seconds to adjust the right coordinates on the portal gun, as if he already knew, where to go.
The "Gun" itself was suppose to hone in on the devise all by itself somehow (to bad they can't just use that on the black hole generator). So
this doesn't have to be a nod to Turtles Forever.


A note to all you die hard 4kids turtles fans. The show itself was really entertaining. I am not Putting the 4kids turtles down at all. But I do not like the Turtles Forever special, I feel they made the OT turtles to dumb. But I can give turtles forever two complements...
1)There 2D animation was better
2) Raph broke the forth wall, I wish Nick had done that!

[TigerClaw]

I know that I have not been around A lot lately but I had to drop in and put My two cents in about This episode.
I Loved IT! I enjoyed it so much! Sure the 2d animation was off, But it was fantastic! Hearing the original Voice cast together was epic, and then they even threw in OT background music!:D
They really Caught the personality's of the individual OT turtles with the exception of them making the OT Raph snarkier. But well I liked that to.
They pointed to a lot of the OT's goofiness but they didn't overdo it ( No crying, wet willies, noggies, And wimps who can't lift the manhole covers). Nick really did there homework!
And when the 2D turtles went 3d, I was really impressed with there 3D designs. I saw a few others didn't like it but I really thought it was great! I loved how they tied it back into The Nick turtles plot, and we got to see the Nick turtles see master splinter again! Although I too was wondering like others, Was master splinter like super confused? Would he say something to the other turtles when they got back??? I guess we just have to assume he herd enough to know he needed to keep his mouth shut. LOL.

I am really happy that there will be another crossover next season. Yes I realize the show is not meant to be a crossover nostalgia fest for us 30 year old OT fans. But they want to draw in as wide of an audience as possible. As a mom and a fan of the OT (I watched the 4kids show,' and watch the New show as well) It is so fun to sit down with my kids And watch with them. They, get excited when I am, If I am happy they are. We laugh together and talk and I believe it really is a nice way to broaden there audience Because it appeals to such a large age bracket. This episode gets 9 out of 10 stars from me!:D






I really like your theorys there!:D


Lol. Very true


The "Gun" itself was suppose to hone in on the devise all by itself somehow (to bad they can't just use that on the black hole generator). So
this doesn't have to be a nod to Turtles Forever.


A note to all you die hard 4kids turtles fans. The show itself was really entertaining. I am not Putting the 4kids turtles down at all. But I do not like the Turtles Forever special, I feel they made the OT turtles to dumb. But I can give turtles forever two complements...
1)There 2D animation was better
2) Raph broke the forth wall, I wish Nick had done that!
I would love to see the 87 style Mona Lisa meeting the Nick version, and then seeing 87 Mona Lisa in 3D and Nick Mona Lisa in 87 style.

[Yoshimickster]

Turtles Forever is better as a 2K3 special than an 87 special, that's for sure.

[Allio]

So timeline

87

>Turtles Forever >Transdimensional Turtles >Wormquake

Mirage/Prime
>Transdimensional Turtles > Turtles Forever >Issue 1

[Etsyturtle2]

Did anyone else notice that in the OT dimension, every character had a shadow behind them, as if the background were just a painting behind them?

[cammy85]

Well, now we have an idea as to why OT Krang originally got banished form Dimension X in the first place. What a character!! It was great to see him fighting the Turtles for once.

The whole thing went too quickly but it was still great. Like Turtles Forever, you did have to pay attention to the show prior (which I admittedly haven't been) so you wouldn't get lost, especially since the series is still ongoing from here. Other than those problems, it was enjoyable seeing everyone back together again.

[Candy Kappa]

Did anyone else notice that in the OT dimension, every character had a shadow behind them, as if the background were just a painting behind them?

Yeah, it was a pretty nice touch.

[CyberCubed]

What was that stance Leonardo doing with his swords from, it was after he kicked Krang? I don't remember him ever doing that in the show.

[cryan]

The other thing about Turtles Forever was you didn't have the original voice actors like the y2k12 did. They got Pat Fraley, Townsend Colman and Cam Clarke to reprise their roles and they still delivered. Oh, and Rob was back in true form as 80's Raphael. The only thing with TF was how badly they ridiculed the 80's Turtles. I do agree the CG version of the 80's Turtles could have been fleshed out more. The 2d versions of the 2012 Turtles they were freakin adorable. I loved Mike's line when they find themselves in the 80's dimension "oh my gosh dudes we're in Pittsburgh"!!!

[TMNTInsighter]

The other thing about Turtles Forever was you didn't have the original voice actors like the y2k12 did. They got Pat Fraley, Townsend Colman and Cam Clarke to reprise their roles and they still delivered. Oh, and Rob was back in true form as 80's Raphael...

It's a union thing that didn't allow 4Kids to bring on any other VAs outside their little circle and apparently it still holds today. We'll never hear the 2003 cast on this series!

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Technically it does explain why Krang was the only one of his species to be seen in the original cartoon. We never saw Utroms or his race (beyond that one flashback) in the original cartoon. In Season 7 he makes clones of himself but they were all based on his DNA.

I mean why didn't Krang have an army of Utrom warriors in the original toon? Aside from the obvious fact that the original show didn't use many Mirage concepts, he was essentially the only one of his species in the show. So he was "banished" from his own kind.

Does this mean the Star of Brazil diamond ("Four Musketurtles") was teleported from Nickelodeon Dimension X to Brazil on MWS Earth? (with an attempt to send it to Nickelodeon Earth failing).

[TMNTInsighter]

BTW, I'm pretty sure that in that moment where Leo tried to tell Splinter about the future while envisioning Shredder's final act in "Annihilation Earth" may end up fulfilling the timeline in a way. Perhaps Leo's words there will ring in Splinter's ear during the events of AE and make him decide to seek out the Foot's help. I've always said that this arc needs to follow the time travel rules established in "Tale of the Yokai" which is very reminiscent of the rules in "Gargoyles" (please tell me someone else has seen that series). This way, the events of AE will occur because they already did (ala "Prisoner of Azkaban"). I always had a feeling that the Turtles might be the ones to lead the Triceratons to Earth in the first place and set up the events of AE. This episode did tidy up the time loop with Tiger Claw's appearance in the 1987 realm at the end after all, so that's good.

Obviously the conclusion of AE was so beguiling that you and I know things can't end that way. Which made me think that they'd break their own rules or use something very deus ex to wriggle their way through this arcs conclusion. I however believe that while the final result may be altered, the events that led up to it and the ramifications that are supposed to follow because of it would remain the same. I imagine, for example, in the turtles attempt to stop Splinter's assassination, they'd get the attention of Tiger Claw himself and, finding himself in the middle of the skirmish, ends up taking Splinter's place as the stabbed victim albeit he'd survive it. I imagine he'd enter a pact of vengeance with Splinter, himself embittered beyond what we've seen so that he's almost nothing like the Splinter we used to know. The job they did with the time travel conundrum so far, especially in this episode, gives me hope that they know what they're doing there.

[Galactus]

I'm confused. Is Turtles Forever canon or not? 1987 Donatello doesn't seem to recognize the Mirage Turtles even though he met them back in TF. He acts like it's his first time visiting the Mirage universe. Weird. :ohwell:

In the beginning, it's implied that the 87 turtles met the 2003 turtles. How would they know about alternate realities if they never met the 2003 crew?

Turtles Forever isn't canon to this series nor did I expect it to be.

I've said this in a thread about the 2003 series discussing whether Nickelodeon is trying to bury is trying to bury. It sounds strange considering they actually paid 4kids 10 million specifically for it and they have aired it in marathons which seemed to go down well with younger audience already watching the Nick show so it's strange that anyone would think they are.

That being said it doesn't pay to have another version out there right now that would seem to be competing with itself particularly since the Nick show draws a lot from the 4kids series including this episode which lifted it's plot, presentation, a lot of the same specific jokes and character beats from Turtles Forever.

I don't think they will any more with 4kids series until this animated series is over.

Turtles Forever is better as a 2K3 special than an 87 special, that's for sure.

How? The animation for the 2K3 characters and their world was much less compared to the amount of work they did for the '87 series. They also overlooked what happened to Serling (sure we can assume he found a way back to the future but it's not the same) as well as overlooking a lot of their history and continuity.

Whereas Turtles Forever had the entire OT cast of characters, vehicles and environments as well obscure references that die hard fans of the show should get and in the end Bebop and Rocksteady save the multiverse. The only fly in the ointment is the arguable characterization of the '87 characters.

By comparison I don't think the Nick crew really did much homework at all. It's not a huge deal for me but I'm surprised that more fans aren't making a bigger deal of the retconning of Krang here. Transdimensional Turtles portrayed Krang as permanently stuck on Earth pretty much overlooking that he spent considerable amount of the Fred Wolf series in Dimension-X which can't reasonably be seen as the same realm as the Nick one. Didn't the OT describe Krang as the Supreme Warlord or Dimension-X until he was exiled, it hardly gels with the idea in this special that he's essentially the Jar Jar Binks of the Kraang and thrown out because he's a screw up.

[Yoshimickster]

How? The animation for the 2K3 characters and their world was much less compared to the amount of work they did for the '87 series. They also overlooked what happened to Serling (sure we can assume he found a way back to the future but it's not the same) as well as overlooking a lot of their history and continuity.

Whereas Turtles Forever had the entire OT cast of characters, vehicles and environments as well obscure references that die hard fans of the show should get and in the end Bebop and Rocksteady save the multiverse. The only fly in the ointment is the arguable characterization of the '87 characters.

By comparison I don't think the Nick crew really did much homework at all. It's not a huge deal for me but I'm surprised that more fans aren't making a bigger deal of the retconning of Krang here. Transdimensional Turtles portrayed Krang as permanently stuck on Earth pretty much overlooking that he spent considerable amount of the Fred Wolf series in Dimension-X which can't reasonably be seen as the same realm as the Nick one. Didn't the OT describe Krang as the Supreme Warlord or Dimension-X until he was exiled, it hardly gels with the idea in this special that he's essentially the Jar Jar Binks of the Kraang and thrown out because he's a screw up.

It might've had all the OT characters, but they weren't the best representation of them in all honesty. Don't get me wrong, there were a good chunk of digs to the original series that REALLY worked, but there were also scenes where they said the turtles couldn't take anything seriously, 87 Donnie not knowing what a freaking HAMMER is, and a scene where they just huddle together and CRY for no reason. It wasn't enough for me to hate it, as Ch'rell was on POINT in this, but it could've been more respectful to the OT turtles. Heck, Bebop and Rocksteady were probably the most respectfully adapted characters IN that special!

AS FOR KRANG'S RETCON-there are several ways it can work. Yes, Sub-Prime stated he banished him to Earth-BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUT-Dimension X
isn't a different universe from Earth, but a different dimension. Imagine a universe like a cake, and dimensions are the layers on that cake.

As for Krang being Sub-Prime's cousin, there's two possibilities one logical and on fantastic. The logical theory, is that after Sub-Prime banished Krang to the Dimension X of Earth-1987, he scrambled together a mutagen that gave him the Krangezoid body he claimed to originally have. After it was destroyed via unknown means, he went insane forgetting his brain form was actually his original form.

NOW for the fantastic, it is well noted that the 1987 cartoon is full of inconsistencies that effect the series to its core, so much so that its meta-physical properties are unstable. The reason for these unstable properties has yet to be explained, my theory is that Krang's method of teleporting from Earth from Dimension X causes a space time ripple effect can cause all sorts of ill effects. We can then assume, that the distortion reached Earth 2012, altering not the voices or clothes of Sub-Prime, but either his memories or very HISTORY itself so that Krang was his cousin. As much as I love the 87 show for what it is, its meta-particles are a DANGER to the multiverse, and should be avoided as much as possible. So for all you dimension hopping turtle fans out there-PLEASE-wear proper dimensional shielding.

[CyberCubed]

I've said this in a thread about the 2003 series discussing whether Nickelodeon is trying to bury is trying to bury. It sounds strange considering they actually paid 4kids 10 million specifically for it and they have aired it in marathons which seemed to go down well with younger audience already watching the Nick show so it's strange that anyone would think they are.

That being said it doesn't pay to have another version out there right now that would seem to be competing with itself particularly since the Nick show draws a lot from the 4kids series including this episode which lifted it's plot, presentation, a lot of the same specific jokes and character beats from Turtles Forever.


You do realize Nick has put up the first four seasons of the 2k3 series on itunes, right?

[darthsmozers]

Watched and loved it. Can someone point out the video game references for me?

Also, I've been out of this show since season 2. Someone told me there is an episode with electric seaweed... is that from the old TMNT game? And if so, which episode is it?

[Etsyturtle2]

Yeah, it was a pretty nice touch.

Nice touch? Not only was the animation absolutely horrid, but they went with an inaccurate, unnecessary shadow to further push the "flat" idea, that they HAD to point out.

[TMNTInsighter]

No, it was a nice touch and so was the work put into the episode.

[Etsyturtle2]

No, it was a nice touch and so was the work put into the episode.

Thanks for opening my eyes. :trolleye:

Might I ask how it was a nice touch? (In the most polite way possible, of course)

[Galactus]

It might've had all the OT characters, but they weren't the best representation of them in all honesty. Don't get me wrong, there were a good chunk of digs to the original series that REALLY worked, but there were also scenes where they said the turtles couldn't take anything seriously,

Pretty sure I've danced this tango before a few posts back

87 Donnie not knowing what a freaking HAMMER is

Like in the old show episode Leonardo Lightens Up where Donatello used a wrench as a hammer and the animation is recreated exactly like that moment in the episode.

and a scene where they just huddle together and CRY for no reason.

Like any number of episodes of the old show where the turtles are affected by weird rays that male them cowards and do just that but there is an episode where at least one of the turtles does that without anything to alter his personality. Leonardo in Snakes Alive.

I admit I could have done without that moment but if we accept that Leonardo the leader of the group has a crippling fear that makes him act I think fair enough to say that all the turtles may have a crippling fear of being erased.

AS FOR KRANG'S RETCON-there are several ways it can work. Yes, Sub-Prime stated he banished him to Earth-BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUT-Dimension X isn't a different universe from Earth, but a different dimension. Imagine a universe like a cake, and dimensions are the layers on that cake.

As for Krang being Sub-Prime's cousin, there's two possibilities one logical and on fantastic. The logical theory, is that after Sub-Prime banished Krang to the Dimension X of Earth-1987, he scrambled together a mutagen that gave him the Krangezoid body he claimed to originally have. After it was destroyed via unknown means, he went insane forgetting his brain form was actually his original form.

NOW for the fantastic, it is well noted that the 1987 cartoon is full of inconsistencies that effect the series to its core, so much so that its meta-physical properties are unstable. The reason for these unstable properties has yet to be explained, my theory is that Krang's method of teleporting from Earth from Dimension X causes a space time ripple effect can cause all sorts of ill effects. We can then assume, that the distortion reached Earth 2012, altering not the voices or clothes of Sub-Prime, but either his memories or very HISTORY itself so that Krang was his cousin. As much as I love the 87 show for what it is, its meta-particles are a DANGER to the multiverse, and should be avoided as much as possible. So for all you dimension hopping turtle fans out there-PLEASE-wear proper dimensional shielding.

This episode seemed to have us believe that the Dimension-X we see is in the Nick series is the same as the Fred Wolf one and that the backstory the Neutrinos gave of Krang being exiled in Hot Rodding Teenagers from Dimension-X is Sub Prime banishing him. It's pretty clever and you have multiple ways you can try and explain away all the various inconsistencies this creates with the depiction of both on the show as well as what little description we have of Krang's backstory. I think easiest being that there are 2D parts and 3D parts of Dimension-X and maybe the Neutrinos saw things differently to the Kraang in terms of how incompetent Krang was but then it the characterization of the OT characters being screw ups bothered fans in Turtles Forever it's kinda strange this doesn't bother anyone.

Likewise if we can use reality warping to explain altered histories, appearances and even memories then you could easily make the same argument for Turtles Forever. The accident that sent them to the 4kids universe brought out their more cartoon aspects but no one ever came up with that 'excuse' for Turtles Forever.

You do realize Nick has put up the first four seasons of the 2k3 series on itunes, right?

I actually wasn't aware of that (so thanks) however I still think my opinion stands and it isn't really a criticism of the way Nickelodeon is handling the '03 show as I can understand (or at least why I think they are handling it this way) but I think if was a part of the canon they wanted to currently promote they would at least did some kind of reference to Turtles Forever.

[Yoshimickster]

This episode seemed to have us believe that the Dimension-X we see is in the Nick series is the same as the Fred Wolf one and that the backstory the Neutrinos gave of Krang being exiled in Hot Rodding Teenagers from Dimension-X is Sub Prime banishing him.

It's pretty clever and you have multiple ways you can try and explain away all the various inconsistencies this creates with the depiction of both on the show as well as what little decsription we have of Krang's backstory. I think easiest being that there are 2D parts and 3D parts of Dimension-X and maybe the Neutrinos saw things differently to the Kraang in terms of how incompetent Krang was but then it the characterization of the OT characters being screw ups bothered fans in Turtles Forever it's kinda strange this doesn't bother anyone.



Whoa...this brings up a lot of new thoughts. Since the second dimension of Dimension X is the one from the 87 version, that means the second dimension of 2K12 IS THE 87 VERSION! Trippy, that's some Mr.Mxyzpltlk stuff right there.



Likewise if we can use reality warping to explain altered histories, appearances and even memories then you could easily make the same argument for Turtles Forever. The accident that sent them to the 4kids universe brought out their more cartoon aspects but no one ever came up with that 'excuse' for Turtles Forever.

Not gonna lie, this thought is how I can still enjoy them in the movie. Also why there were suddenly mutant bananas.

And if the distortion wasn't from the 87 universe itself, it could also have been from Ch'rell attempted to destroy the entire multiverse, which even after stopping effected the 4th dimension to its core causing permanent distortion. That is some Back to the Future Stuff right there.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Pretty sure I've danced this tango before a few posts back



Like in the old show episode Leonardo Lightens Up where Donatello used a wrench as a hammer and the animation is recreated exactly like that moment in the episode.



Like any number of episodes of the old show where the turtles are affected by weird rays that male them cowards and do just that but there is an episode where at least one of the turtles does that without anything to alter his personality. Leonardo in Snakes Alive.

I admit I could have done without that moment but if we accept that Leonardo the leader of the group has a crippling fear that makes him act I think fair enough to say that all the turtles may have a crippling fear of being erased.



This episode seemed to have us believe that the Dimension-X we see is in the Nick series is the same as the Fred Wolf one and that the backstory the Neutrinos gave of Krang being exiled in Hot Rodding Teenagers from Dimension-X is Sub Prime banishing him. It's pretty clever and you have multiple ways you can try and explain away all the various inconsistencies this creates with the depiction of both on the show as well as what little description we have of Krang's backstory. I think easiest being that there are 2D parts and 3D parts of Dimension-X and maybe the Neutrinos saw things differently to the Kraang in terms of how incompetent Krang was but then it the characterization of the OT characters being screw ups bothered fans in Turtles Forever it's kinda strange this doesn't bother anyone.

Likewise if we can use reality warping to explain altered histories, appearances and even memories then you could easily make the same argument for Turtles Forever. The accident that sent them to the 4kids universe brought out their more cartoon aspects but no one ever came up with that 'excuse' for Turtles Forever.



I actually wasn't aware of that (so thanks) however I still think my opinion stands and it isn't really a criticism of the way Nickelodeon is handling the '03 show as I can understand (or at least why I think they are handling it this way) but I think if was a part of the canon they wanted to currently promote they would at least did some kind of reference to Turtles Forever.
Probably same Dimension X. Maybe first the MWS one where Utroms are fr.o.m. Then evil Kraang speciellt try to fit better fot themselves as they mutate and changer parts of Dimension X. Byt MWS triceratons are Probably not fr.o.m. Dimension X.

[Powder]

Thanks for opening my eyes. :trolleye:

Might I ask how it was a nice touch? (In the most polite way possible, of course)

It's a nod to the OT & other traditionally made animation from that era. Each frame was made up of the characters being painted on cels, clear sheets of "paper" that were placed over static painted backgrounds with various light effects & stuff. Often times, you could see the edges, shadows, even flecks of dust & the occasional hair. Nick "homaged" that aspect a bit. It was just a little stylistic decision they did to try & give it a hand-made touch so as to counter the very synthetic flash-heavy feel. I thought it was clever.

[Etsyturtle2]

It's a nod to the OT & other traditionally made animation from that era. Each frame was made up of the characters being painted on cels, clear sheets of "paper" that were placed over static painted backgrounds with various light effects & stuff. Often times, you could see the edges, shadows, even flecks of dust & the occasional hair. Nick "homaged" that aspect a bit. It was just a little stylistic decision they did to try & give it a hand-made touch so as to counter the very synthetic flash-heavy feel. I thought it was clever.

http://orl.baynews9.com/content/dam/news/images/2014/05/3/ninja%20turtle%203.jpg
http://ultraimg.com/images/104693.jpg

Um.... nah.

Edit: Besides the shadows, the animation in this episode was garbage.

[Allio]

Turtles forever animation was at least a nice upgrade to the animation

[Powder]

http://orl.baynews9.com/content/dam/news/images/2014/05/3/ninja%20turtle%203.jpg
http://ultraimg.com/images/104693.jpg

Um.... nah.

Edit: Besides the shadows, the animation in this episode was garbage.

Listen kid, I have 11 years on you & have spent a lot more time watching that show than you have, surely. Trust me, those flaws are seen on occasion. I never said it was ever-present. One screen-cap you grabbed from Google proves nothing.

Here's an example:
http://i67.tinypic.com/123ocy1.jpg

It's more prevalent in season one than the rest, but it's there if you look for it. Same for blur & grain.

http://i64.tinypic.com/23tm7bl.png

[oldmanwinters]

Embarrassed to admit it, but only after seeing this episode did I realize that Nick-toon-verse not only has a dedicated Channel Six building, but that's it's even in the new Season 4 intro.

[darthsmozers]

Um.... nah.

Edit: Besides the shadows, the animation in this episode was garbage.

I grew up with the 87 show. 80's kid here. I have to say I was totally sold with the voices and the dialogue that I wasn't nitpicking the shadow or the animation style. It was an awesome revisit to the 87 show which, by the way, had its fair share of "garbage" animation. This was pure fun. :)

[Etsyturtle2]

Listen kid, I have 11 years on you & have spent a lot more time watching that show than you have, surely. Trust me, those flaws are seen on occasion. I never said it was ever-present. One screen-cap you grabbed from Google proves nothing.

Here's an example:
http://i67.tinypic.com/123ocy1.jpg

It's more prevalent in season one than the rest, but it's there if you look for it.

http://i64.tinypic.com/23tm7bl.png


And, what ep. is the first screen cap from? I think I have it.

[oldmanwinters]

I'm late to this party, but I just wanna say I really appreciate the little touches of authenticity like having the FW Turtles refer to each other by their full names while the Nick Turtles always employ nick-names. That scene fighting Krang on the Channel 6 building made great use of this juxtaposition.

[ToTheNines]

And, what ep. is the first screen cap from? I think I have it.

The Making of Metalhead.

[Etsyturtle2]

Thank you sir.

[Toadtrooper]

22 minutes of Ciro Nieli masturbating when we already have a f***ing SPACE STORY to work with.

They're spreading out this season so you don't realize how horrible and uninspired this all is. It's TMNT as interpreted by joyless windbags who enjoy the sh***y humor that Big Bang puts out.

Weren't even intelligent enough to keep track of their relative timelines. Time travels faster in the Nick Kraang dimension, so Sub-Prime should have won just by trapping them there for a minute.

I'm so ready for the next reboot of TMNT. Which is actually the comic series which isn't f***ing up every single thing it touches.

*drops mic*

[Powder]

Mic drops only have impact when you've said something worthwhile. :tlol:

Ciro has been forthcoming about his opinions on the FW cartoon, which is to say he was not much of a fan. So I highly doubt he masterminded this.

There is nothing inherently BAZINGA about this show or its creative team.

[Cure]

The mic was off.

[STORMSHADOW__210]

Just watched. Easily one of the best episodes for me in not just this season, but series as well. Wasn't as amazing as turtles forever but very cool. My only nit pick would be (assuming they don't be doing this again) that there was no Shredder, Casey, bebop and rocksteady , and April on the episode .

[sdp]

This was Turtles Forever done right! And in only 22 minutes which felt more than enough time for this. Sadly that's also a bit of a criticism since it clearly borrowed plenty from Turtles Forever.

It's funny how the same jokes worked here so much better and that's because they were made tongue in cheek instead of in a mean spirited way like in TF. Only criticism you could say here is that since it wasn't a movie all the jabs were made almost immediately without the Nick turtles really knowing the OT turtles yet, I believe Raph says they don't even use their weapons but they haven't really even seen them fight. The OT turtles are shown to be goofy mother****-rs but competent and that they clearly have heart, that's something TF didn't do.

Now I haven't really watched the Nick show since S3 started so I got spoiled that Splinter died (actually I got that spoiled because of a thread title that was often seen from outside the forum but I had forgotten). The scene was still heartfelt for me though. Also Leo sounded terrible to me, I'm guessing most of you are already used to this new voice but everytime he spoke he took me out just like in the OT when they changed their voices. The 2D animation while it was clear that it was cheap flash-like animation, it looked a lot better than in the short previews and I didn't mind it. Same with the CG OT designs which I hadn't liked before they didn't bother me at all. The ending tying it up with Wormquake was awesome and I always wanted to know what had happened and the few extra seconds to it were awesome.


My biggest problem with the episode is the fact that they made Krang one of the Kraang. And not only that they made him the one that was banished for being stupid. That was a Turtles Forever level insult to the OT and kind of messes up his character in the OT as a villain more than any giggle ray could've done. I don't really remember how The Kraang were handled in the Nick verse though since its been over a year since I watched any episode and forgot but weren't they more like an insect-like species that acted as a Hive with only "mother" Kraang acting as a brain?

[CyberCubed]

22 minutes of Ciro Nieli masturbating when we already have a f***ing SPACE STORY to work with.

They're spreading out this season so you don't realize how horrible and uninspired this all is. It's TMNT as interpreted by joyless windbags who enjoy the sh***y humor that Big Bang puts out.

Weren't even intelligent enough to keep track of their relative timelines. Time travels faster in the Nick Kraang dimension, so Sub-Prime should have won just by trapping them there for a minute.

I'm so ready for the next reboot of TMNT. Which is actually the comic series which isn't f***ing up every single thing it touches.

*drops mic*

In all seriousness, what is your problem? You sound to me like you're having mental trauma over the episode. The space arc is 14 episodes (or 13 if you don't count this episode), so I don't see what you mean by "stretched out" since it was planned to be half a season.

Just because Nick goes on rerun breaks for months has nothing to do with the pacing of the actual show, since after all the eps have aired people can watch all eps back to back like with any show.

[CyberCubed]

My biggest problem with the episode is the fact that they made Krang one of the Kraang. And not only that they made him the one that was banished for being stupid. That was a Turtles Forever level insult to the OT and kind of messes up his character in the OT as a villain more than any giggle ray could've done. I don't really remember how The Kraang were handled in the Nick verse though since its been over a year since I watched any episode and forgot but weren't they more like an insect-like species that acted as a Hive with only "mother" Kraang acting as a brain?

No, the Kraang are all essentially brainwashed versions of Utroms to serve Kraang Prime. All the Utroms have individual personalities like Kraang sub-prime has, its only all the others are brainwashed under Kraang Prime's control.

So Fred Wolf Krang is, in fact, an Utrom. Since Krang's species was never named in the original cartoon, and we never saw Utroms in that series, it can fit.

[Klunk1234]

The episode was fantastic. I loved it! Everybody was great; Barry Gordon for obvious reasons (his age) has his Donatello voice a little bit hoarse, but it was great to hear '87 Donatello.

This time the '87 Turtles were not treated as idiots as Turtles Forever did. The Megan Fox joke make me laugh. Also, was nice to see the Prime Turtles.

If they do this again, they need to include the 2k3 Turtles, too.

[Donny's computer84]

I loved this episode, brings back memories of the '87 turtles and they looked good in 3D too. Great humor, a lot of funny scenes.:D All of the turtles were good in this one, I liked how they all worked together.:tgrin:
It would be nice to see the 2003 turtles in there as well.

[Mona_Lisa]

It's a union thing that didn't allow 4Kids to bring on any other VAs outside their little circle and apparently it still holds today. We'll never hear the 2003 cast on this series!

If that is the case we will probably never have a 4kids crossover.

[sdp]

There doesn't have to be just one Dimension X, there can be many. This is actually something that has been discussed here in the forums before, about ten years ago when I first joined. There's a thread called "Dimension X: Galaxy or Dimension (http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=18135&highlight=dimension)" that I made but similar posts had already been made before. Around that time I remember also mentioning how Dimension X from the OT could be the same one from Archie, I probably posted that in the comics section and got a few replies about how it could work but there were problems.


The only thing that left me confused was the ending. This took place just before Wormquake? Are they gonna touch upon that in the future, or are we just supposed to assume Tigerclaw kicked their asses & used Donnie's portal "gun" to get back home? Perhaps he brought it with him through the portal & that's what'll lead to the next crossover?

I got the feeling from the ending that yeah they left it in a "cliffhanger" and the next crossover will resolve it. I mean why else would they go back to this scene from Wormquake? The turtles going to fight the Worm was a good ending, we didn't need to see Tigerclaw kill the worm and confront the turtles.

If this is the only crossover then I'll be more than happy and hope it stays that way but If we get another one I'll take it without a question!




I don't really see any more respect payed to the Fred Wolf characters as they used pretty much the same jokes about their lack of skills.....Like it or not but most of the stuff Fred Wolf fans hated about how the characters acted in Turtles Forever was drawn from specific episodes of the old show - would it have been better had they focused on portraying them like they were in their semi-serious seasons/episodes? Maybe but you can't really argue that it was a complete mis-characterization when in fact it drew from a lot of the old show's continuity which is what this episode lacked. A lot of their jokes were more broad about how goofy the characters were and even attempts to directly reference things from the old show like '87 Raphael splatting a Kraang with a pizza recreating the scene from the intro were neat but they never actually did stuff like that in the actual show as in cartoon physics were they whip out giant objects from nowhere.

I read your explanation that you posted in the other pages about the specific episodes that they acted like that. While I think you're stretching it and grasping at straws with some of those examples a few of them I can definitely see as being references so thanks for that. I still think you're wrong though, and they didn't use as many references and even if they did. Imagine if I took all the silly moments from the fan favorite Batman The Animated Series and made a crossover film with the most recent Batman cartoon (well if there were one), those scenes would not represent the show as it was. Now I'm not saying they should've taken only the serious side of the turtles either since that wouldn't be them either and that's why fans don't like the red sky seasons but overall if you watch any one episode you can see the turtles being both serious and silly which is the balance that the Nick show got right.


but I guess it's best not to overthink this.

Anyone who was hoping that it would reference the status of............was probably hoping for too much.


Turtles Forever isn't canon to this series nor did I expect it to be.

This is what forums are for! To overthink it! ;)

Fans sometimes expect too much from crossovers but they have to realize what they are, fanservice. Its up to the fans to find continuity fixes. They aren't going to bother boring fans of the show with convoluted explanation as to how this awesome crossover happened or address it, its just obvious. If you don't want to consider crossovers canon or if you do great, its in your headcanon and don't over think it or overthink it whatever floats your boat.



I've said this in a thread about the 2003 series discussing whether Nickelodeon is trying to bury is trying to bury. It sounds strange considering they actually paid 4kids 10 million specifically for it
Now while its silly to think Viacom is trying to bury 2k3 (really? you've got to be a huge fanboy to think that). I do however think Nickelodeon doesn't care about 2k3 at all.

Why did they pay 10 million for it? It was a business decision more than anything. Viacom didn't want 4Kids airing TMNT while they were airing theirs, unlike the OT this one was still a "modern" take on the turtles. Second and probably the main reason they ponied up the money is contracts. 4Kids had a license agreement so they actually made money from merchandise, I'm sure there were other things in those contracts that made Viacom's decision to buy the show an easy decision instead of dealing with the hassle.

But as I said they don't really care for the show but obviously they dont' "hate it", they just don't see money in it. If they did then it would air constantly on Nicktoons instead of random marathons. We'd have all seasons on itunes insead of just 4. We'd have DVD box sets. They've obviously played around to see how they can monetize the show but apparently nothing has worked.

I do think there's a chance that we might see the 2k3 universe crossover eventually with the Nick show if the show goes on long enough. Not because Nick wanted it but because the writers finally decide its the right time.


How? The animation for the 2K3 characters and their world was much less compared to the amount of work they did for the '87 series. They also overlooked what happened to Serling (sure we can assume he found a way back to the future but it's not the same) as well as overlooking a lot of their history and continuity.

Whereas Turtles Forever had the entire OT cast of characters, vehicles and environments as well obscure references that die hard fans of the show should get and in the end Bebop and Rocksteady save the multiverse. The only fly in the ointment is the arguable characterization of the '87 characters.

By comparison I don't think the Nick crew really did much homework at all. It's not a huge deal for me but I'm surprised that more fans aren't making a bigger deal of the retconning of Krang here.

Turtles Forever was made to celebrate all turtle incarnations, it works as a season finale with Chrell finally defeated, gives a horrah to the Mirage turtles and an appearance of the OT. They didn't know it'd be the end of 2k3 but they still ended it like this just in case (which sadly was). And yeah they went through tons of work to get the OT right, they got the old character models which they had to look for and even as a dromer from this forum for them, the character cameos on the background and whatnot but sadly they missed the most important part which was the characterization of the turtles.

This episode obviously didn't do as much research or look as nice but that has to do more with the budget of the show, However with the small homework that they did they got the characters right and that makes this a much better crossover.

I totally agree with you on the Krang thing though, what was meant to be a cute nod actually craps all over the OT, I mentioned in my review that it did more damage than any "giggle ray" ever did. I don't like to be selective with my continuity though so I'll just have to live with it.

No, the Kraang are all essentially brainwashed versions of Utroms to serve Kraang Prime. All the Utroms have individual personalities like Kraang sub-prime has, its only all the others are brainwashed under Kraang Prime's control.

So Fred Wolf Krang is, in fact, an Utrom. Since Krang's species was never named in the original cartoon, and we never saw Utroms in that series, it can fit.

Ah ok, I guess that was explained in some episode I didn't watch, I only saw the first 3 or so episodes of S3. I just can't stand watching shows week to week with hiatuses. I'll just wait for the show to end before I watch it all but this episode made me want to marathon it all. And that's cool in my headcanon I always thought of Krang as an evil Utrom of the OT, we just never saw the actual Utroms in the OT.

[turtle1237]

Listen kid, I have 11 years on you & have spent a lot more time watching that show than you have, surely. Trust me, those flaws are seen on occasion. I never said it was ever-present. One screen-cap you grabbed from Google proves nothing.

Here's an example:
http://i67.tinypic.com/123ocy1.jpg

It's more prevalent in season one than the rest, but it's there if you look for it. Same for blur & grain.

http://i64.tinypic.com/23tm7bl.png

April is missing a hand lol. You have to let that stuff slide though, it was all hand drawn. That is a lot of work. BTAS, X-Men, they all had there flaws animation wise. No computers to fix the problems.

I still get that laugh from the superfreinds when Green Lantern has 3 arms or Batman is wearing a yellow cowl from time to time lol.

[Bry]

I was pretty disappointed with this one, actually. Like... it was fine, but it felt like a rushed retread/do-over of Turtles Forever that didn't do it as well, so... for me, what was the point?

The highlight was definitely getting the original '87 cast back, and they were absolutely on point. But the usual 2D Flash animation just didn't do the '87-verse justice, and even its own characters looked wonky during those segments. And the '87 Turtles looked "off" and kind of unsettling as 3D models. Maybe that was hard to avoid with the designs being what they are, and points for ambition there, but it didn't work as well as I'd have liked.

The episode itself was fun enough. Though it cribbed hard from Turtles Forever. Lots of similar ideas and elements and character moments. It even made sense as a kind of follow-up -- the '87 Turtles are aware of the multiverse, '87 Don has a portal gun, Krang knows the Mirage-verse is the prime universe... -- but stops short of referencing the source of those ideas, and even contradicts it a bit with '87 Donnie not recognizing the Mirage universe. Which was pretty disappointing. I wasn't expecting them to directly reference the 2003 show, but a respectful nod would have been nice considering they took so much of this episode from their big finale. And while the Mirage-verse being presented comic-style was a really nice touch, the utter silence of the Mirage Turtles was a bit disappointing by comparison, IMO.

And that's kind of the thing -- I want to take this episode on its own merits, but by design it's impossible not to compare it to Turtles Forever, and at that it falls very short. Still a fun little episode, but not as "special" as it maybe should have been.

[Hero]

Watched this for a second time with the missus and she loved it too. I'm still pleased the Nick team managed to pack in so much with this one.

Roll on the next crossover. Maybe we'll get a trilogy.

[Shark_Blade]

Mikey: Kraang Sub-Prime??

*Kraang Sub-Prime posed sexily* "No, Megan Fox". :twink:

I LOVE YOU NICK TEAM!!! :tlove::lol:

[CowabungaMikey]

This was a FANTASTIC episode! Loved it! I wished they showed more of the Prime Turtles though. Still, this is maybe my favorite 2012 TMNT episode!

[CyberCubed]

And that's kind of the thing -- I want to take this episode on its own merits, but by design it's impossible not to compare it to Turtles Forever, and at that it falls very short. Still a fun little episode, but not as "special" as it maybe should have been.

I think there were a lot of blatant homages to Turtles Forever in terms of scenes. The last scene with the 80's Turtles and Nick Turtles bowing to each other felt almost exactly like the scene where the 2k3 Turtles say goodbye to the 80's Turtles in the movie.

Likewise aside from the obvious similarities in the plot and the Prime universe, we also had the Turtles say goodbye in the Technodrome, which is the same place they went last time.

Krang being taken out by Kraang Subprime was also similar to the way Ch'rell knocked him out easily in both his android body and when they first met.

[Metalwolf]

I honestly don't see why the strong defense for Turtles Forever, when you know that movie's greatest shortcoming was the portrayal of the 80's Turtles. Turtles Forever might have done it first, but this episode portrayed them better. The only thing that would have made it better is if they used traditional animation instead of that weird flash animation.I've noticed that too. it's like some people can't get that not everybody liked that movie, and will endlessly try to 'convince' those who dislike it that this movie is just the most bestest thing ever, and that they just aren't seeing it's perfection.

It's annoying. And if you hate the movie enough to want it (and consider it) uncanon, Oh boy will they jump down your throat and and TELL you that too bad, so sad it's CANON, because it's got 80's Turtles and a means to always bring back those 80's Turtles, and ya know, dat's important. It's not because it's good. It's because it's allows them to wank the 80's Turtles and 'Turtle Prime' to their heart's content, and nerdgasm while they do it.

[TigerClaw]

BlackNerd posted his review of the episode.
http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?p=1563578#post1563578

[Ursalink]

I have contradictory opinions about this special. Let's see:

1º) First of all, this special should have lasted an hour long, just like "Turtles Forever".

2º) Speaking of "Turtles Forever", I would say that special is non-canon in this reality. There are several things unfitting here.
+ First and foremost, 80's Donnie didn't recognize the Mirage Turtles, even when he should remember them from "Turtles Forever".
+ 80's Krang talked about destroying the Prime Turtles with the Dimensionaizer, even when in "Turtles Forever", that action not only threated with destroying all the Turtles, but everything in the Multiverse too; including the villains.
+ The 80's Technodrome is back to his classic look, even when the Utrom Shredder upgraded it with Utrom technology and turned it into a real Doomsday's weapon.
+ The fact that this 80's Krang seems related to 2012's Krangs should be enough to prove this can't be the real 80's dimension. Besides, in its last seasons, the 80's turtles turned darker and more serious, like the 2003's and 2012's counterparts.

As far as I see, in "Turtles Forever", what we saw there weren't the real 80's reality or the Mirage's reality, but simply "twin dimensions" of the real ones. That could be applied to the 80's reality and the Mirage's reality from this special.

3º) It has been wrong at all levels that they didn't allow Splinter to be warned about the Shredder's betray in the future. I really want that event being avoided!!!

4º) They should have show us the Turtles being back in the Fugitoid's ship too, to explain any weird "time paradoxes" or something.

5º) The fact that this all thing happen at the same time that "Wormquake" seems wrong to me at all levels. It must be a long time already on Earth since the 10 episodes the Turtles have spent in space, and even so, a lot of crazy stuff happened in those 6 months? (Wormquake, Karai's mutation, Krang's invasion... etc). Besides, there's another continuity problem. If this story happens before Wormquake, why did Krang Subprime appear with his Irma's suit revealed? At this point, he's supposed to still be an undercover spy for the Krang.

This really gave me a lot of headaches, don't you think?

Well, since the 80's Turtles are going to return again, I hope this will give us a more logical "Turtles Forever 2" in the future. I really believe the 2003's Turtles should appear here too.

[TheMasterTurtle]

I enjoyed it overall. Some things I liked, some I didn't.

Liked:
-OT cast was spot on including Barry in my opinion
-The tying in they did with OT Krang
-The many toon and game throwback
-lots of clever pokes by the Nick turtles towards the OT
-the soundtrack was great including the old stuff

Dislikes:
-The 2D animation was terrible. Hated it
-I feel like the OTs 3D models were too bug-eyed
-the Mirageverse as a comic. I see why they did it but would have preferred it more like Forever portrayed the universe. Also didn't like how OT and Nick Donny remained the same in appearance while in this universe. Should have made them match more just like the Nick turtles did when they went back to Fred Wolf verse.
-length. They packed a lot in the 20 minutes. This would have been a better special or 2 parter then a single episode

There's more I'm sure but I need to watch it again. I look at it as an episode done for the old fans, ciro and friends included. I'd like the concept of the multiverse to be touched on again.

[CyberCubed]

Uh, the Prime-verse wasn't literally a comic book. I'm pretty sure the panels were a style choice. They weren't literally saying it was a comic book.