Usagi question?

[U2WaTCHer]

I know this sounds like a dumb queston but didnt Usagi appear in the orginal turtle series as the rabbit with the sword. if so will he look as simular? heres a link of his pic off that site

http://www.stupidmonkey.net/turtles87/turtlesu.html

[Roseangelo]

Usagi wasn't created for the old TMNT toon. He's always looked like that.

[damnhooligan]

I would imagine they'd slick up the look of Usagi, just as they did the turtles, but remain true to form.

[Trunks]

does anyone remember the line from the old toon where raph was talking about usagi "hes a rabitt from another diminsion so off coarse he speaks english" I always thaught that was so funny.

[yojimbo]

As you can see by my icon and name I liked the rabit as part of the series. I injoyed how respectable he is in the eposode Usagi return home. When he has a fight with shreader and thought to loss so tried to kill the turtles. he is a rabbit i know i can trust. why high tec him up. I guss that is what kids like these days.


For all the people who did not like him. you can have it your way. but i did so ha, ha :lol:

[Tavares]

does anyone remember the line from the old toon where raph was talking about usagi "hes a rabitt from another diminsion so off coarse he speaks english" I always thaught that was so funny.

hehehe hell yeah i remember that line.

[Savanti Romero]

Does anyone remember that other, non Stan Saki, rabbit. I think his name was something like Shnokums, and he took the turtles to a fantasy land? :-?

[Karpo_007]

Hokum the hare?

[Savanti Romero]

Yea, thats it. Was he in the Easter special as well? I think I have that movie lying around some where. I'll have to watch that episode again.
:)

[Karpo_007]

He was in 2 episodes, mone with fantasy world and one where they wen't into future, If I remember correctly.

[gobo]

Krapo's right. Hokum Hare originated in the fairy tale dimension, and was introduced in the episode, THE TURTLES AND THE HARE. The following ep, ONCE UPON A TIME MACHINE, also featured Hokum (and thank goodness it was his last appearance). So, this VHS which was released as an Easter special was really crummy in as much as it had nothing to do with Easter. And Usagi's two eps deserved a release more than those if all they needed was a rabbit involved.

[Deathknight]

And Usagi's two eps deserved a release more than those if all they needed was a rabbit involved.
Very much agreed, although the UK did get a vhs with both Usagi episodes... lucky bastards. Although I didn't like Hokum Hare I thought the 2 Easter episodes had some good moments. I still can't stop laughing when I see Bebop and Rocksteady in bunny suits. Also some of my favorite quotes:
Krang: "Shredder! Come and see my latest invention!"
Shredder: "A tv remote control? Someone has already invented that Krang."

Shredder: "You've done your job now get out of there!"
Bebop: "Aww but boss, we was gonna have some fun with the toitles!"
Shredder: "I'm the only one who gets to have fun GET OUT NOW!"
Bebop: "Oh jeez, someday we're gonna have our own show."
Rocksteady: "Yeah, and then we'll be the boss of Shredder!"

And of course my off topic TMNT quote:
Bebop: "I see something!"
Shredder: "Is it the turtles?!"
Bebop: "No, it's a '57 Studabegar... ain't it beautiful?"
-The Ninja Sword of Nowhere

Yeah so sue me I can't spell. :roll:

[Savanti Romero]

Krapo's right. Hokum Hare originated in the fairy tale dimension, and was introduced in the episode, THE TURTLES AND THE HARE. The following ep, ONCE UPON A TIME MACHINE, also featured Hokum (and thank goodness it was his last appearance). So, this VHS which was released as an Easter special was really crummy in as much as it had nothing to do with Easter. And Usagi's two eps deserved a release more than those if all they needed was a rabbit involved.

In one episode Don is working on a easter egg machine, that breaks. Hokum was the Channel 6's Easter Bunny at the end of the show as well; or something like that.

[Pizza Face]

Usagi Yojimbo is probably tougher than the turtles. He was trained by this hard core lion dude and really, when you get down to it, a lion is totally tougher than a rat. But, since there are FOUR turtles and only ONE rabbit, we will call it a draw. :evilgrin:

[Bowser_Koopa]

no we won't, usagi could be defeated be leo anytime, even in blinds :)

[heretic888]

Silly samurai wabbit is no much for ninja turtle.

[Bowser_Koopa]

damn straight

[ForSquirtleMyNurtle]

I mean, think of it this way. If an actual rabbit fought an actual turtle who would win? The only way the turtle could win is if he hid in his shell and that wouldn't be winning at all. Plus, Usagi has cool ears.

[MW8979]

I mean, think of it this way. If an actual rabbit fought an actual turtle who would win? The only way the turtle could win is if he hid in his shell and that wouldn't be winning at all.

Not quite. The rabbit may be more agile, but once the turtle bites his legs with its sharp beak, he won't be so agile anymore.

[Pizza Face]

This Philiosophy of forsquirtlemynurtle is absolutely correct. Yes, the turtle would hid in it's shell. Thats a fact. And, as anyone will tell you, the path to honor does not lie in hiding. Now, supershredder84 makes an interesting thesis. But, he fails to back it up with any proof. When has a turtle ever been able to bite a rabbits foot? and, what if the rabbit attacked the turtle from behind? Could the turtle even turn around to bite him and even if so, would he be able to do it before his guts were pulled out? Yea, the beack CAN be sharp, like the beak on a snapping turtle. But, other turtles have beaks that are more like a saw or hammer. What would that turtle do? As far as the TMNT, I don't know for sure what kind of turtles they are, but they are absolutely not snappers. 8)

[heretic888]

Ok, I'll have a go at this. *chuckles*

I mean, think of it this way. If an actual rabbit fought an actual turtle who would win? The only way the turtle could win is if he hid in his shell and that wouldn't be winning at all. Plus, Usagi has cool ears.

Yes, but this is a turtle with a Physical Prowess (sorry about the RPG lingo) of 20 (Leo), and has been trained in Ninpo his entire life. Turtle stomps on wabbit earz.

Not quite. The rabbit may be more agile, but once the turtle bites his legs with its sharp beak, he won't be so agile anymore.

Errr.... Leo doesn't have a sharp beak. He has lips, technically (or else he couldn't talk).

This Philiosophy of forsquirtlemynurtle is absolutely correct.

Umm.... its spelled philosophy, dude. :D

Yes, the turtle would hid in it's shell. Thats a fact.

Not necessarily. I suggest you try playing around with alligator snapping turtles sometime....

And, as anyone will tell you, the path to honor does not lie in hiding.

"Honor" means squat when it comes to getting out of a tangle unbruised.

But, he fails to back it up with any proof. When has a turtle ever been able to bite a rabbits foot?

Its happened.

and, what if the rabbit attacked the turtle from behind? Could the turtle even turn around to bite him and even if so, would he be able to do it before his guts were pulled out?

Explain to me how a rabbit can pull a turtle's guts out.

Yea, the beack CAN be sharp, like the beak on a snapping turtle. But, other turtles have beaks that are more like a saw or hammer. What would that turtle do? As far as the TMNT, I don't know for sure what kind of turtles they are, but they are absolutely not snappers.

No, but they are Ninja.... which means they'd stomp on Usagi without even breaking a sweat. Nuff said.

[Pizza Face]

You have some interesting statements, but you still have not defeated my argument. Usagi is a not a ninja. He is a samurai, which is basically the same thing except a samurai has honor. So, just cause leo is a ninja dont mean runny eggs. I am glad that you are good speller. It will help you out greatly when you need to read the word bleach so you dont accidentally use ammonia when you are mopping floors. I did play with an aligator snapping turle once. I hit it on the back with a sledge, and yep, it hid in its shell. Well, you might be right about getting out of a tangle unbruised, but if you hide in your shell, you have no right to yell Turtle Power or Turtles fight with honor, now do you? A rabbit could bite the turtles tail off and then there would be a gaping hole. Hence, pulling guts out. Again, with the whole ninja thing. Ninja are not the toughest warriors around just because they are ninja. Some samurai were tougher than ninja. Miyamoto Mushashi fought lots of ninja, and they never beat him. And, he is the prototype for Usagi. Better luck next time, friend. :)

[Kali]

You have some interesting statements, but you still have not defeated my argument. Usagi is a not a ninja. He is a samurai, which is basically the same thing except a samurai has honor.
Excuse me while I die laughing. :lol:

[heretic888]

You have some interesting statements, but you still have not defeated my argument. Usagi is a not a ninja. He is a samurai, which is basically the same thing except a samurai has honor.

I don't even know where to begin with this mess. :roll:

I am glad that you are good speller. It will help you out greatly when you need to read the word bleach so you dont accidentally use ammonia when you are mopping floors.

*raises eyebrow* Eh??

I did play with an aligator snapping turle once. I hit it on the back with a sledge, and yep, it hid in its shell.

You do know that I know you're lying, right?? :roll:

Well, you might be right about getting out of a tangle unbruised

Don't worry. I am. :P

but if you hide in your shell, you have no right to yell Turtle Power or Turtles fight with honor, now do you?

Depends on your definition of "honor".

A rabbit could bite the turtles tail off and then there would be a gaping hole. Hence, pulling guts out.

*LAUGHS* Ok, two things:

1) A rabbit cannot bit through turtle hide.

2) You cannot pull something's guts out with a one-inch hole. Particularly when you don't have any hands to pull with.

*chuckles* :roll:

Again, with the whole ninja thing. Ninja are not the toughest warriors around just because they are ninja.

This depends on how strict your definition of "Ninja" is. Rest assured, that the definition of "Ninja" I am referring to does indeed contradict your ill-researched claims above. :roll:

Some samurai were tougher than ninja.

Ummm.... most Ninja were Samurai, genius.

Miyamoto Mushashi fought lots of ninja, and they never beat him.

*LAUGHS* Oh, lord... a few things:

1) No, there is no legend of Musashi having ever battled Ninja.

2) The legends of Musashi having "slain Tengu" point to the likelihood that he himself was trained by Ninja at some point (you'd have to have some background in Japanese mythology for any of this to make sense).

3) Musashi was not Samurai, he was Ronin. And, he most certainly didn't follow "Bushido" (which technically didn't exist at the time) and had little regard for "honor" (most of the stories concerning Musashi involve him using "dirty tactics" such as ambushes, running away, hidden swords, and the reflection of the sun as a weapon).

*chuckles*

And, he is the prototype for Usagi.

And that matters... how??

Better luck next time, friend.

You're obviously quite a bit younger than me, so I'll forgive you. :wink:

Laterz.

[Bowser_Koopa]

ninjas are spy samurais, so they have to be both warriors and spies, and usagi was only a warrior.

about the real turtle/rabbit thing, rabbits are very fragile, weak and they run like hell for nothing, so i doubt it would fight a turtle, in fact that could be thier only weapon, scape

[Spike The Xenomorph]

What do you mean "high-tech him up"? Are they returning Usagi into this series? SWEET if so! But don't make him a robot

[Bowser_Koopa]

i think he means to make him use some gadgets, and technology, stuff, usagi comes from old japan, so he is pretty much not a hi tech rabbit

[Spike The Xenomorph]

then they should keep him that way or if they have to improve him, give him a light saber

[heretic888]

ninjas are spy samurais, so they have to be both warriors and spies, and usagi was only a warrior.

That's not entirely accurate. Many historical Samurai completely unrelated to the Ninja clans or Ninpo were also skilled in the arts of espionage and stealing-in. Thus saying a "spy samurai" is what defines a "Ninja" is not entirely accurate.

[MW8979]

Before you continue this argument any more, we have to differentiate between two real animals fighting it out and the cartoon characters fighting it out.

If it was a real turtle and hare, most likely they'd just both sit there until the end of time, too frightened and unmotivated to attack each other. Now, if you were to inject them with a stimulant, like say cocaine, they very well can become aggressive then and try to fight. In this case, it's just a matter of time before the rabbit makes the wrong move and the turtle bites him. The rabbit can't do any damage to the turtle - it has a shell.

If you're talking about Usagi and TMNT, with weapons it would be pretty much a stand still, but once they both run out of steam, statistically it is more likely that a turtle would deliver a fatal blow, since there are more of them. If they were weaponless, then for sure turtles would win by sheer strength and numbers, since Usagi relies heavily on his weapons technique and little tricks/stunts he pulls off with his swords.

So pretty much no matter what way you look at it, the turtles would win.

[Karpo_007]

Besides the fact Ninja and Samurai use martial arts, I don't see man similarities. If I remember correctly, the word Samurai translates to Servant. They always have a master, if their master dies, they have to kille themselfs or become "ronin".

Ninja's as I see it were assasins, hired hand and so forth. With no similar obligations as Samurai. Altough TMNT, both Mirage and New cartoon have many Samurai aspects in them, Defending Honor and revenging master are pretty common in samurai stories.

[heretic888]

Besides the fact Ninja and Samurai use martial arts, I don't see man similarities. If I remember correctly, the word Samurai translates to Servant. They always have a master, if their master dies, they have to kille themselfs or become "ronin".

Actually, ritualistic suicide (seppukku) was not instituted until the Tokugawa Era (approximately 1600-1863). I'm not sure what time the concept of 'ronin' emerged.

Ninja's as I see it were assasins, hired hand and so forth.

This is a half-truth. Ninja were assassins when they had to be, but were by no means "hired hands" or mercenary in any sense.

Altough TMNT, both Mirage and New cartoon have many Samurai aspects in them, Defending Honor and revenging master are pretty common in samurai stories.

No, its common to Japanese culture. Period. Samurai or not.

[Bowser_Koopa]

i don't care, usagi joyimbo will never defeat the turtles! period

[ForSquirtleMyNurtle]

I don't know what I started with my metaphorical statement about real rabbits and turtles. First off: it was a metaphor. Second off: clearly the rabbit in question had rabies. Hence why the fight started at all.

My point is that a mutated rabbit will be much tougher than a mutated turtle since it will still have sharp teeth and claws whereas the ninja turtles have snouts (not beaks) and fingers with nails (not claws). And don't give me the "natural" armor defense because Usagi also has armor that he wears.

Usagi wins. Unless all the turtles team up on him.

[Pizza Face]

I see that someone has finally thought this through. Nurtle is correct in saying that the turtles have fingers with nails and a snout. While usagi has sharp teeth and nails, hence the rabbit at least kills two turtles. But what I find more intersting is how defensive people are to the turtles abilities. I know that this is a turtle website so everyone here is biased but think about this for a moment. When the turtles fight shredder, it takes all four of them just to fend off shredders attacks. When turtles go up against shredder alone, it is almost always a recipe for disaster. Now, how are four turtles, who can't even take down a puny human, ever expect to take down a grizzled war vetran like usagi. I just don't see it. Sure, the turtles are tough when they fight gang members, but these are just thugs. When they fight real hard core warriors, they have to run away and have don create some wacky machine that will do their fighting for them.

[heretic888]

My point is that a mutated rabbit will be much tougher than a mutated turtle since it will still have sharp teeth and claws whereas the ninja turtles have snouts (not beaks) and fingers with nails (not claws). And don't give me the "natural" armor defense because Usagi also has armor that he wears.

Ahem. The fact remains Usagi's "natural" weapons are incapable of penetrating turtle hide. Deal with it.

In addition, the TMNT are, once again, Ninja. That gives them the decided edge.

I see that someone has finally thought this through. Nurtle is correct in saying that the turtles have fingers with nails and a snout. While usagi has sharp teeth and nails, hence the rabbit at least kills two turtles.

Yes, and Leonardo has much sharper 3-foot katana blades.

Tell me exactly why Usagi would be using his teeth and nails when he has katana, as well??

I know that this is a turtle website so everyone here is biased but think about this for a moment. When the turtles fight shredder, it takes all four of them just to fend off shredders attacks. When turtles go up against shredder alone, it is almost always a recipe for disaster. Now, how are four turtles, who can't even take down a puny human, ever expect to take down a grizzled war vetran like usagi.

The above statement just oozes with stupidity.

I just don't see it. Sure, the turtles are tough when they fight gang members, but these are just thugs. When they fight real hard core warriors, they have to run away and have don create some wacky machine that will do their fighting for them.

*sighs* More stupidity.

I'm sure next you'll be saying Usagi is tougher than a platoon of Triceratons.

*chuckles* Laterz. :roll:

[Pizza Face]

quote:
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I know that this is a turtle website so everyone here is biased but think about this for a moment. When the turtles fight shredder, it takes all four of them just to fend off shredders attacks. When turtles go up against shredder alone, it is almost always a recipe for disaster. Now, how are four turtles, who can't even take down a puny human, ever expect to take down a grizzled war vetran like usagi.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



The above statement just oozes with stupidity.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just don't see it. Sure, the turtles are tough when they fight gang members, but these are just thugs. When they fight real hard core warriors, they have to run away and have don create some wacky machine that will do their fighting for them.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



*sighs* More stupidity.

Listen here, friend. You obviously know that I am right, because all you do is call me stupid. But, you don't defend you turtles to my attacks. Everyone here knows why: You are a pseudo intellectual who cannot form a basic, coherent argument. If you were to say something to the effect that Shredder represents ulitimate evil, and that the battle between good and evil is not so easily won, or if you said that shredder is also a ninja from the same clan, therefore he knows all the same secrets as the turtles thereby making him a worthy opponent. But no. You say "more stupidity" with such passion that I figure you must be on Pres. Bush's war council. :sleep: :sleep: :sleep:

[Kali]

Okay, this thread is so close to pushing it. Heretic, I have no problem with your arguments, but, for the sake of keeping order, please refrain from saying or implying that people are "stupid".

And Pizza Face, he has VERY MUCH defended against your arguments. You need to read his posts more closely. He's telling you that your "facts" are in error, and some of them are.

[Sparvid]

Oh great, now I have this image in my head of Shredder fighting Usagi... :|

[heretic888]

Listen here, friend. You obviously know that I am right, because all you do is call me stupid. But, you don't defend you turtles to my attacks. Everyone here knows why: You are a pseudo intellectual who cannot form a basic, coherent argument. If you were to say something to the effect that Shredder represents ulitimate evil, and that the battle between good and evil is not so easily won, or if you said that shredder is also a ninja from the same clan, therefore he knows all the same secrets as the turtles thereby making him a worthy opponent. But no. You say "more stupidity" with such passion that I figure you must be on Pres. Bush's war council.

*shakes head* :roll:

[Quiller-Bee]

A few thoughts:

1. There's no need to "tech-up" the original Usagi Yojimbo for use in the TMNT cartoon. If that's what the creators prefer for the series, then they should simply use Usagi's future descendant depicted in the trio of three-issue mini-series, Space Usagi.

2. Usagi is not a mutant, nor does he have "rabbit-like" abilities. With but a couple of notable exceptions in the Usagi Yojimbo comic books, the type of animal that a character is has about as much affect on their abilities as the color of a human being's hair has on his or her own. Think of them more as humans who simply resemble animals.

3. As for the debate as to who would win in a fight between Usagi Yojimbo and one of (or all four of) the Turtles: one thing one might want to consider before offering such self-assured opinions: Usagi has single-handedly faced and defeated far more opponents—as individuals and groups—than all four of the Mirage TMNT put together. If one hasn't already, read the Usagi Yojimbo comic books to get a better idea of what Usagi's skills are and the caliber of the opponents that he's faced before dismissing him so quickly. If you haven't already and choose not to do so, fine ... but if you haven't, you really don't have enough knowledge of "the opponent" on which to base a solid argument. Sure, you can debate it all you want, but if you don't know, how can anyone take your argument seriously?

What would the final outcome of such a showdown be? I don't know. I do know that it wouldn't be a pretty fight, nor would it end quickly.

[Bowser_Koopa]

you mean that you thin it would end quickly or that you don't know that it would end quickly?

[Karpo_007]

Leo versus Usagi would definetly be interesting...

[Quiller-Bee]

you mean that you thin it would end quickly or that you don't know that it would end quickly?

I think that such a fight would not end quickly.

Leo versus Usagi would definetly be interesting...

It would indeed. Peter Laird did a short back-up story in Usagi Yojimbo Vol. 1, #10 in which such a battle takes place. ("The Crossing") As far as I know, it's non-canon for the Mirage TMNT universe as well as Usagi's, but it's a cool little story nonetheless.

[Karpo_007]

I wonder why this was was posted twice.... *Delete please*

[Karpo_007]

I do not own any of the TMNT/Usagi cross over issue, altough in some issue[don't remember what] There was a short back story where Leonardo was transfered to Usagi's world. But I think he fought wiht Usagi, not against...

[Quiller-Bee]

I do not own any of the TMNT/Usagi cross over issue, altough in some issue[don't remember what] There was a short back story where Leonardo was transfered to Usagi's world. But I think he fought wiht Usagi, not against...
There were a couple of crossovers in the TMNT books that I can recall offhand. The first was "Turtle Soup and Rabbit Stew", which appeared in the very first Turtle Soup. The second was "The Treaty", which was included in the Shell Shock collection. In the first story, the pair unwittingly fought together against the Neko Ninja. In the second tale, Leo willingly helped Usagi against the Neko Ninja a second time.

I love Leo and Usagi team-ups. Personally, I'd prefer a team-up over a battle between the two any day.

[Karpo_007]

Could be either one, can't remember wich. Im pretty sure the TMNT will team up with Usagi in the series. But thats a long time away, it's the last story arc of the season.

[Quiller-Bee]

I can't wait to see it. Going on what little I know about the story arc from the episode synopses at the official site, I personally feel that Space Usagi would be better suited for the story than the original Usagi Yojimbo. Still, I think it'll probably be a good tale.

[Pizza Face]

I still dont see how he defeated my arguments or that some of my facts are in error. what exactly is in error? That turtles have hides so tough usagi cant penetrate it? If that is so, then why do the turtles fear shredders dinky claws? I belive that heretic feels threatened by my presence in this forum. Now, heretic know that I have exposed him for faker he is. He has dominated this forum long enough. Now that I have arrived, his power base feels threatened. But dont worry heretic. I will still let you be part of this intellectual exchange. You can be like my little apprentice. You can be my baby turtle and I will be your Master splinter. I will slowly teach the Way of Intellecualism, friend.

[Kali]

I still dont see how he defeated my arguments or that some of my facts are in error. what exactly is in error? That turtles have hides so tough usagi cant penetrate it? If that is so, then why do the turtles fear shredders dinky claws? I belive that heretic feels threatened by my presence in this forum. Now, heretic know that I have exposed him for faker he is. He has dominated this forum long enough. Now that I have arrived, his power base feels threatened. But dont worry heretic. I will still let you be part of this intellectual exchange. You can be like my little apprentice. You can be my baby turtle and I will be your Master splinter. I will slowly teach the Way of Intellecualism, friend.
Gah. Dude, don't even try. Trust me, he's not a "dominate force" on this forum. And you won't be either. I'm not going to stand for that kind of attitude from anybody. I've reached the end of my rope with people like this. Discussion is FINE, but what you're trying to do is prove you're right when there IS NO right answer!

[Pizza Face]

If there is no right answer, why are we talking about it in the first place. That would be silly. The turtles are a finite creation. They are not like a living society or language that continually changes. There is a beginning and end to them. Therefore, there must be right answers, and I belive that I posses them. People can challenge me if they like, either one at a time or all at once. I care not. For when it is over, I will be the only one to walk away. Friend. :oops:

[heretic888]

I still dont see how he defeated my arguments or that some of my facts are in error. what exactly is in error?

Most of everything you've said is inaccurate, from your biological errors concerning rabbits and turtles, to your humorous miconception as to what exactly a "ninja" is, to your obvious ignorance of Mirage TMNT storylines.

That turtles have hides so tough usagi cant penetrate it? If that is so, then why do the turtles fear shredders dinky claws?

No, but that is not what you said.

You said that *a* rabbit could tear through *a* turtle's hide... which if, to be blunt, untrue. Usagi is not a rabbit, he is an animal-like caricature of old Japanese artwork (in which warriors and monks were often pictured as animals). The truth remains, however, that a rabbit does not have any natural weapons capable of penetrating either a turtle's shell or scaly skin.

Usagi, however, has katana. The TMNT have weapons, as well.

belive that heretic feels threatened by my presence in this forum. Now, heretic know that I have exposed him for faker he is. He has dominated this forum long enough. Now that I have arrived, his power base feels threatened. But dont worry heretic. I will still let you be part of this intellectual exchange. You can be like my little apprentice. You can be my baby turtle and I will be your Master splinter. I will slowly teach the Way of Intellecualism, friend.

BWAHAHAHAHAH!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

This coming from the kid that asked the forum if should ambush a "TMNT hater"?? Please, don't make me laugh... oh wait, too late. :roll: