"Superman & Lois" TV Series on CW

[TurtleTitan97]

Look, up in the sky, it's another Arrow-verse TV series in the works.
Superman & Lois, featuring Tyler Hoechlin and Elizabeth Tulloch reprising their roles as the title characters, is in development at The CW.
Produced by Greg Berlanti, former The Flash showrunner Todd Helbing will pen the script and exec produce the potential series. The drama is described as revolving around the world's most famous super hero and comics' most famous journalist deal with all the stress, pressures and complexities that come with being working parents in today's society. (Helbing stepped down as showrunner on The Flash in March to focus on development.)
Helbing will exec produce alongside Berlanti and his Warner Bros. TV-based Greg Berlanti Productions topper Sarah Schechter and DC's Geoff Johns. The drama is based on the characters from DC created by Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster.
Hoechlin was first cast as Superman back in 2016 and has appeared in multiple episodes of The CW's Arrow-verse, including Supergirl and has participated in the franchise's annual crossovers. Grimm grad Tulloch was cast in September 2018 and appeared in last year's crossover.
This is the second Arrow-verse spinoff in the works for the 2020-21 TV season. The CW is also readying a female-focused Arrow spinoff starring Katherine McNamara, Katie Cassidy and Juliana Harkavy as the network is prepping for the next wave of its DC Comics franchise.
The Arrow-verse has become a network-defining brand for The CW, with The Flash ranking as its most-watched original series. The network is saying goodbye to the Arrow this season as it just launched Ruby Rose vehicle Batwoman (which last week earned an additional nine-episode order).

The development deal also arrives as The CW president Mark Pedowitz has been open about entering what he called the "next generation" of his DC shows. The younger-skewing network's current roster includes The Flash, Legends of Tomorrow, Supergirl and Black Lightning.
The decision to revisit Superman (and Lois) also comes nearly a decade after the former WB Network-turned-CW told Clark Kent's origin story in Smallville, which ran for a decade.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/superman-lois-tv-series-works-at-cw-1250479?utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

[Andrew NDB]

Jokes aside, it's an interesting turning point for WB. Like, it took all of the CW's might to wrestle out two or three Superman guest spots on Supergirl from WB... yet now they've approved a whole series about Superman?

[Autbot_Benz]

**** Yes I have been wanting this for so long. No more Superman being cucked when he is on supergirl

[ZariusTwo]

On one hand, it'll be good to see the focus on the Super-Family again. That's been missing since 2018.

On the other hand, they could eventually base a lot of this on what Bendis is doing, so we get an aged Jon Kent and Lois and Clark still a couple, but living independent lives fighting Leviathan

[Andrew NDB]

No more Superman being cucked when he is on supergirl

Don't be so sure. With Supergirl very likely to be cancelled this season, you can bet she'll be rescued and thrown to "Superman & Lois" as an ongoing guest.

[Autbot_Benz]

Don't be so sure. With Supergirl very likely to be cancelled this season, you can bet she'll be rescued and thrown to "Superman & Lois" as an ongoing guest.

They won't cancel supergirl. its their feminist flagship show for SJW bs. they will find away to keep it going. Also rumor has it she is gonna crossover with batwoman in an episode

[Sumac]

They won't cancel supergirl. its their feminist flagship show for SJW bs. they will find away to keep it going. Also rumor has it she is gonna crossover with batwoman in an episode
Will it contain Hot Lesbian Sex or nowadays Lesbian sex is progressive only when it includes "brave and stunning" "female dicks"?
Do Supergirl or Batwoman have "brave and stunning" "female dicks", though? :lol:

[Andrew NDB]

They won't cancel supergirl. its their feminist flagship show for SJW bs.

No, that's Batwoman now. Everything has always been leading to Batwoman. They don't need Supergirl anymore.

[Ninjinister]

They won't cancel supergirl. its their feminist flagship show for SJW bs. they will find away to keep it going. Also rumor has it she is gonna crossover with batwoman in an episode

No, that's Batwoman now. Everything has always been leading to Batwoman. They don't need Supergirl anymore.

Jesus Christ, you children and your make-believe enemies in the real world.

[Autbot_Benz]

Will it contain Hot Lesbian Sex or nowadays Lesbian sex is progressive only when it includes "brave and stunning" "female dicks"?
Do Supergirl or Batwoman have "brave and stunning" "female dicks", though? :lol:

good question. in episode 4 of Batwoman kate was sleeping with some broad and she was on top for a bit while making out :lol:

[sdp]

I think I prefer a superman show with supergirl guest starring, but this is technically not arrowverse since isn't supergirl in a different universe? or did they merge?

[Andrew NDB]

I think I prefer a superman show with supergirl guest starring, but this is technically not arrowverse since isn't supergirl in a different universe? or did they merge?

"Arrowverse" encompasses other Earths including Supergirl and Superman's (which yes, is separate). But since this will be post-Crisis, who knows what the status quo will be? Probably they'll merge the Supergirl/Superman Earth into the main one, if only to make it less weird for crossovers with the other shows.

[sdp]

I hope so, they really should've made it one universe from the start, because technically if we use the logic that supergirl is arrowverse then so is every other live action DC show thanks to the crisis event.

[Andrew NDB]

I hope so, they really should've made it one universe from the start, because technically if we use the logic that supergirl is arrowverse then so is every other live action DC show thanks to the crisis event.

I was going to say, "Maybe call it the Berlanti-verse, then" but it looks like he's a producer on Titans and Doom Patrol, too... so that clearly doesn't hold water.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

CW DC always sucks. Maybe it gets a decent first and second season, maybe not, but in the end, it'll suck.

It's the CW way.

[Krutch]

I don't know... I'll definitely check out the first few episodes, but I haven't liked much of how they've handled Superman in this universe, so my confidence is pretty shot.

Also not big on Tyler's Superman. His Clark is good; his Superman leaves alot to be desired, IMO.

[Andrew NDB]

CW DC always sucks. Maybe it gets a decent first and second season, maybe not, but in the end, it'll suck.

It's the CW way.

Nothing's ever been as good as Arrow season 1 and I think I enjoyed it a bit longer than you did, but yeah... the last seasons of Arrow, Flash, and Legends of Tomorrow were BAD. No idea what's going on on Supergirl beyond Superman jobbing to her once in a while, so nothing good, I'm sure.

[ZariusTwo]

Jesus Christ, you children and your make-believe enemies in the real world.

Satan's greatest trick was convincing the world he didn't exist.

[CyberCubed]

good question. in episode 4 of Batwoman kate was sleeping with some broad and she was on top for a bit while making out :lol:

Man I will have to youtube this. The only parts of these shows worth watching is the lesbian stuff, which you can just youtube, and skip all the rest.

[Coola Yagami]

Man I will have to youtube this. The only parts of these shows worth watching is the lesbian stuff, which you can just youtube, and skip all the rest.

Yeah Cubed, but can you navigate YouTube with one free hand?

[Autbot_Benz]

Man I will have to youtube this. The only parts of these shows worth watching is the lesbian stuff, which you can just youtube, and skip all the rest.

once again dusts off the old Technodrome saying folder and pulls out

Nobody cares about your boner cubed

[ZariusTwo]

It's been picked up and will go to series

https://ew.com/tv/2020/01/14/cw-early-series-orders-superman-and-lois-walker-texas-ranger-reboot/?utm_content=link&utm_campaign=entertainmentweekly_entertainmentweek ly&utm_term=3D6BD678-370D-11EA-B989-7DE9FCA12A29&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&fbclid=IwAR1p0zV5wl-FxU-ekGx1i1wF8jbCTMaM8NCapbmk74OHzwVqOYH6hie_D_M

[Autbot_Benz]

It's been picked up and will go to series

https://ew.com/tv/2020/01/14/cw-early-series-orders-superman-and-lois-walker-texas-ranger-reboot/?utm_content=link&utm_campaign=entertainmentweekly_entertainmentweek ly&utm_term=3D6BD678-370D-11EA-B989-7DE9FCA12A29&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&fbclid=IwAR1p0zV5wl-FxU-ekGx1i1wF8jbCTMaM8NCapbmk74OHzwVqOYH6hie_D_M

Im glad to hear this. I think Tyler Hochlin is a good Superman. Now that he has his own show he hopefully won't be Supercucked anymore. Like he was on Supergirl.

[Andrew NDB]

Im glad to hear this. I think Tyler Hochlin is a good Superman. Now that he has his own show he hopefully won't be Supercucked anymore. Like he was on Supergirl.

I dunno... I expect constant reminders of how much smarter Lois is than him.

[oldmanwinters]

Does this mean we shouldn't expect any Superman films in the near future?

[Autbot_Benz]

Does this mean we shouldn't expect any Superman films in the near future?

According to the Idiots at Warner Brothers they have no idea what to do with him

[ZariusTwo]

As of Crisis

Lois and Clark now have two sons, so will one of them be aged up while another stays an infant?

[Slade]

I have mixed feelings on this. On one hand, love Superman, want to see him on tv again. The other hand, CW shows really aren't that good anymore and not much of a fan of the guy playing him. But, I will check it out though.
Never even bothered with one episode of Supergirl.

[ZariusTwo]

Alleged summary of the pilot and premise



As the series opens, LOIS LANE is still working at the Daily Planet, but CLARK KENT has just been fired following a massive layoff plan at the journal. His father JONATHAN KENT is no longer with them, while his mother MARTHA KENT is living alone on the farm where he grew up in Smallville. They have twins, JONATHAN and JORDAN KENT, who are thirteen and very different -- both physically and otherwise. Jonathan is the popular one, an all-star athlete who's about to enter the Varsity team, while Jordan is more introverted, anxiety prone, and very much into computers and video games. They don't know who their father really is... yet. And they may or may not have inherited his powers.



Lois's father GENERAL SAMUEL LANE is in the picture and knows about Clark. LANA LANG is also a big part of the show. She's a banker, still living in Smallville, with her husband KYLE CUSHING, a firefighter, and their daughters, SARAH, who's fourteen, and younger SOPHIE who's eight. They are in a dark place: Kyle is a drunk and Sarah tried to take her own life a year ago.



And yes, Superman has an enemy in this version of the story, who appears as THE STRANGER in the pilot. His true identity is revealed ar the end of the episode...



https://www.primetimer.com/pilots/blog/the-cws-superman-lois-character-breakdown

[Autbot_Benz]

Alleged summary of the pilot and premise



As the series opens, LOIS LANE is still working at the Daily Planet, but CLARK KENT has just been fired following a massive layoff plan at the journal. His father JONATHAN KENT is no longer with them, while his mother MARTHA KENT is living alone on the farm where he grew up in Smallville. They have twins, JONATHAN and JORDAN KENT, who are thirteen and very different -- both physically and otherwise. Jonathan is the popular one, an all-star athlete who's about to enter the Varsity team, while Jordan is more introverted, anxiety prone, and very much into computers and video games. They don't know who their father really is... yet. And they may or may not have inherited his powers.



Lois's father GENERAL SAMUEL LANE is in the picture and knows about Clark. LANA LANG is also a big part of the show. She's a banker, still living in Smallville, with her husband KYLE CUSHING, a firefighter, and their daughters, SARAH, who's fourteen, and younger SOPHIE who's eight. They are in a dark place: Kyle is a drunk and Sarah tried to take her own life a year ago.



And yes, Superman has an enemy in this version of the story, who appears as THE STRANGER in the pilot. His true identity is revealed ar the end of the episode...



https://www.primetimer.com/pilots/blog/the-cws-superman-lois-character-breakdown



Why would they Fire Clark but keep Lois. oh wait its the CW gotta have the Strong Woman be able to keep her job while the Man gets fired.

[Candy Kappa]

Why would they Fire Clark but keep Lois. oh wait its the CW gotta have the Strong Woman be able to keep her job while the Man gets fired.

Isn't Lois usually depicted as the better journalist?

[Autbot_Benz]

Isn't Lois usually depicted as the better journalist?

I always thought Clark was depicted as the better one. But I don't follow Superman stuff very closely so what do I know

[Andrew NDB]

Isn't Lois usually depicted as the better journalist?

I've always taken that they're equals in the field, but that she devotes a little more energy to it. For obvious reasons.

[Leo656]

I think they each had at least one Pulitzer but Clark is also a best-selling and award-winning novelist. At least in the 1986-2010 continuity. His writing is one of the things he's most proud of as it doesn't require any extraordinary powers or abilities and thus he comes about his talent and awards "honestly". Which is a huge deal to him.

[TommyT]

Not feeling the Pilot description.

[ZariusTwo]

The spoilers are real and the Supersons have been cast. Jordan Elsass & Alexander Garfin will play Jon and Jordan Kent

https://deadline.com/2020/02/superman-lois-casts-couples-sons-jordan-elsass-alexander-garfin-cw-series-1202851698/

[Leo656]

People on the Superman page seem pretty unhappy. :ohwell:

There's a few "Let's wait and see" types but for most people who'd self-identify as "Superman Fans", none of this is anything we want or would ask for.

Sadly, if it tanks, all that happens is the WB suits proclaim "See? Nobody cares about Superman!" yet again and they put anything to do with him back on the shelf. Although I predict it's almost definitely going to get at least three seasons.

I hate that Hoechlin guy, so it's an easy skip for me. I think they jumped the gun with him; most people in the current climate are clamoring for a show with Routh instead, but they already pulled the trigger with this show. Too bad.

[Chris]

Why would they Fire Clark but keep Lois. oh wait its the CW gotta have the Strong Woman be able to keep her job while the Man gets fired.

I've always taken that they're equals in the field, but that she devotes a little more energy to it. For obvious reasons.

Agree with Andrew that they're normally shown as equals. That said, I can see why they'd fire Clark in both story and real world terms. In story Lois is, as Andrew said, usually shown as the more devoted/go getter whilst Clark is constantly late or MIA due to being Superman. Most bosses don't like that. In the real world it also means they can have Lois fill the role of investigator/journalist whilst Clark does the super heroics and trains Jonathan and Jordan. Without the love triangle you don't need them both to be reporters at the Planet. It sets Lois up in the information finder/coordinator role that Iris has in Flash, Felicity had in Arrow, and Gambi does in Black Lightning.

Not saying I agree with it (I like having them both at the Planet so I need to see how it plays out), but I can understand the why of it and it's not "strong woman keeps job whilst man gets fired".

[TommyT]

Am I the only one who is sick of the “training” of younger kids cliche?

[Leo656]

Agree with Andrew that they're normally shown as equals. That said, I can see why they'd fire Clark in both story and real world terms. In story Lois is, as Andrew said, usually shown as the more devoted/go getter whilst Clark is constantly late or MIA due to being Superman. Most bosses don't like that.

On principle you're correct, it's generally not a good look, BUT Clark always gets the big scoops and comes through in the clutch, so while Perry is often annoyed at Clark's shenanigans he gives him a very long leash because in spite of eternally being MIA, he always gets the job done. Lots of reporters don't necessarily punch a time clock anyway.

Just saying. :) Part of what I like about him being a journalist is it gives him a lot more freedom that he wouldn't have at a regular 9-to-5. Because yeah that definitely wouldn't work.

[Andrew NDB]

Sadly, if it tanks, all that happens is the WB suits proclaim "See? Nobody cares about Superman!" yet again and they put anything to do with him back on the shelf. Although I predict it's almost definitely going to get at least three seasons..

Yeah, pretty dead on. Though come to think of it... this show is kind of a lose-lose situation, isn't it? It does well, then Cuckman and Kids becomes a bit more cemented as the new "norm" for Superman. It does poorly, then yeah... what you said.

[Jester]

Part of me wonders if Perry White is out and THAT combined with Clark Supermaning lead to him being fired. I could see a new editor doing so as a power play.

...sadly I could also see the new EIC being a lady...

[Leo656]

Yeah, pretty dead on. Though come to think of it... this show is kind of a lose-lose situation, isn't it? It does well, then Cuckman and Kids becomes a bit more cemented as the new "norm" for Superman. It does poorly, then yeah... what you said.

I know it's been done in the comics recently but I'm of mixed feelings on Superman having kids to begin with. I'm not a huge fan of "Superman" being a legacy role that gets passed around. I don't know. My affection for the character is such that to me, ONLY Clark Kent is Superman. He only ever gets written to have kids, either in or out of canon, so they can one day usurp the role from him, and while that may be practical in the long run, it's not a story I'm interested in, personally.

Same reason I never got into Batman Beyond. I'm sure it's just fine, the little bit I've seen is alright, but I don't care about Terry. I like Bruce Wayne. That's the character I want to see in the role. It's an interesting story but it's not what appeals to my tastes. I don't want "New and Different", I want more of what I like to begin with.


Part of me wonders if Perry White is out and THAT combined with Clark Supermaning lead to him being fired. I could see a new editor doing so as a power play.

...sadly I could also see the new EIC being a lady...

Not a bad point. Very likely, in all honesty. Although Perry's fired Clark before, in-canon. It's not without precedent. It just smells fishy in this case given what we know of the CW and what they often choose to promote, and why.

"Lois the Career Woman and Clark the sad-sack stay-at-home Dad (when he's not saving the world)" sounds right up their alley. Again, it's not necessarily the story idea that's suspect, but their motivations and, ultimately, execution of the idea.

We'll see. I might watch the first episode out of loyalty, but I did that when he first appeared on Supergirl and it was like, "Nope!" And it's the same network, same actor, same everything, so... yeah, not much hope.

[ZariusTwo]

Same reason I never got into Batman Beyond. I'm sure it's just fine, the little bit I've seen is alright, but I don't care about Terry. I like Bruce Wayne. That's the character I want to see in the role. It's an interesting story but it's not what appeals to my tastes. I don't want "New and Different", I want more of what I like to begin with.

I love Batman Beyond, but I really don't like it having the final say on Bruce Wayne in the DCAU as a bitter lonely old man who can't let the mission go. There's also loads more wrong with the DCAU's later years besides that,but that's the main one that sticks in my craw.

A nice little amalgamation of the future from Tom King's run with Batman Beyond would do me just fine

[Leo656]

"Bruce dies on the job, Dick takes over as Batman to honor him" is the only Bat-future I personally care for. Nothing else really makes sense for any of the characters involved. There's like decades of stories which can be seen as building to and foreshadowing that. There's a logic and a symmetry to it.

It was kinda neat to see a version of that briefly as the status quo ten years ago, but circumstances kept me from fully enjoying it. Especially my loathing of Damien. Dick as Batman and Tim Drake as Robin? That's something I wouldn't even mind becoming permanent. Dick and Damien? Ehhhhh. It had its moments but it never really won me over. I really liked watching Dick grow into the role and everything that came with that, but having Damien involved ruined a lot of it for me. Even Dick with no Robin at all would have suited me better.

I'm not a big fan of "Grumpy Old Bruce" either, myself, but mostly because I kinda never imagined him living that long. I don't see him ever being able to "retire" - Obsessives can't simply flip a switch and "turn it off", and his sense of responsibility is simply too great. He'd spend his whole life blaming himself for every bad thing he "allowed" to happen through his inaction if he ever retired, and that's just not consistent with his established personality and character. Superman, same thing. For some characters the super-hero gig is just a job, but not for them. They couldn't ever just turn it off, I feel.

So I personally feel the only "happy ending" Bruce Wayne would ever get, is that he set Dick up to take his place. He got to raise Dick the way Thomas never got to raise him, and ultimately helped Dick become a much more well-adjusted human being than himself. That's the "happy ending".

Having anyone else take his place just makes Dick feel inconsequential in the grand scheme of things. That's why whenever a Terry or Damien comes along, and they're presented as The Rightful Heir to the mantle, I'm like "Eh." There's hardly anything supporting those possible futures. They don't feel to me like a natural evolution of the story that's been presented ongoing for so many years. They just feel like some editor said, "Make up a new Batman for the future, but you CAN'T use Nightwing." And it's like, why wouldn't you use him?

If that makes any sense.

[ZariusTwo]

If that makes any sense.

More sense than what DC normally has these days.

[CyberCubed]

Batman Beyond takes place when Bruce is like 80+ years old, which means Dick is likely in his 60's or older by that point. So even if Dick took up the mantle when he was younger he would have moved on by then too.

Batman Beyond originally came out in 1999, so in that timeframe I'd say it took place around the year 2050 or so? I don't know if its ever been officially stated anywhere.

[ZariusTwo]

Batman Beyond takes place when Bruce is like 80+ years old, which means Dick is likely in his 60's or older by that point. So even if Dick took up the mantle when he was younger he would have moved on by then too.

Comics establish he becomes the Mayor of Bludhaven, his daughter is Batwoman Beyond.

[IMJ]

The whole "kids and life progression" thing is taking a greater foothold in comics because it tracks with the comics readership, which is more akin to my age than it is to kids.

And it's probably born of the same thinking that makes people in marketing think that kids want to see kids doing things "like them" as opposed to seeing adults doing things that they can aspire to.

[BlimeyBullhop]

Super Goku

[Leo656]

Fair point about Dick's age, but nobody but them ever said they had to jump that far into the future to begin with, y'know? It still just feels like an editorial mandate more than an organic storytelling progression.

Frankly, none of the Possible Futures they've ever presented, from Dark Knight Returns to Beyond to Kingdom Come to DC One Million have ever felt like they "deserved" to be hard canon. But as What If stories or just different paths along the Multiverse they're still a lot of fun. I actually do like Possible Future stories a great deal, because it's fun to speculate. Some of them are even among my favorites, like some of the Armageddon 2001 stuff.
I just don't like when any of them get picked to be "official", in part because it's not likely that the story will ever move forward that far, anyway. Like in 2009 or whatever when they started trying to really make it look like Kingdom Come was finally going to happen in the official mainstream DCU; fun tease but I'm like "Yeah, no, that's not happening" and was a little bit annoyed that they were even teasing it. I did like how they managed to wiggle out of it, though. It was a fun ride but I knew it was just a tease so it kinda felt like a cheat. Plus, that future shouldn't be canon even though it's a great story.

[ZariusTwo]

Plus, that future shouldn't be canon even though it's a great story.

Not even Waid wants it to ever be canon, he's said time and again that it was meant to be an example of where DC shouldn't go, but unfortunately Didio and company are exactly the types of people who'd go there.

[Andrew NDB]

One of the saddest things I've ever seen in my life was Mark Waid coming to the mic at the Emerald City Comicon maybe 10 years ago to ask Geoff Johns a question about if Hal Jordan will ever resume his future persona from the comics, and the way Geoff dismissed him as an irate fan.

[Leo656]

Not even Waid wants it to ever be canon, he's said time and again that it was meant to be an example of where DC shouldn't go, but unfortunately Didio and company are exactly the types of people who'd go there.

One of the rare things I agree with him on.

Like, I LOVE Kingdom Come, but as a Superman fan, when people say it's one of their favorite versions of him, I'm like.... W h y y y ? Did you READ it? His entire arc is, "Gets pissy and quits because people say he's a nostalgia act, lets the world go to hell while he goes to futz around on the Holodeck, comes back and makes things even worse by being too heavy-handed and almost causes Ragnarok." That's... that's bad. He's not exactly the hero of the piece. He's not the VILLAIN, either, but it's his own bad decisions and inaction that directly lead to everything afterwards. He pulls it together at the end, sure - and it is a GREAT story, one of the greatest of all time, partly because of that arc, don't get me wrong - but it's a cautionary tale at BEST.

Like, in "The Kingdom" when they tell Current-Gen Superman what his Other Self did in the KC timeline, and he's like, "No... NEVER! I will NEVER let that happen!"... that's the guy. That's how Superman is. He does not take his ball and go home because people make fun of him for not killing people. That's not who he is at all. "The Kingdom" was a VERY flawed piece of work - although I enjoy it - but that repudiation of Kingdom Come felt necessary.

I loved Geoff's run on Justice Society with KC Superman, Starman, Magog, etc., though. I loved every bit of it, I just felt like they were jerking people around by teasing that KC was actually on the horizon, and was glad that it didn't happen.

One of the saddest things I've ever seen in my life was Mark Waid coming to the mic at the Emerald City Comicon maybe 10 years ago to ask Geoff Johns a question about if Hal Jordan will ever resume his future persona from the comics, and the way Geoff dismissed him as an irate fan.

Mark Waid also claims that when he saw Man of Steel in the theater, he jumped up and started yelling at the screen when Superman killed Zod. I really hope that's just a tall tale. I've heard him extrapolate at length on various things; he's a sharp cat, but in some ways he IS just an irate fan sometimes. He literally throws a fit whenever anything gets too far away from "Super-Friends" because that's what he grew up watching. And he's openly admitted as much, multiple times. Like dude, you're a senior citizen, grow the f*ck up and calm down.

His Flash run was goddamn brilliant, though. "The Return Of Barry Allen" from 1992-ish is one of my all-time favorite comic book stories, period. He's golden at some things. But on others he's way, way off. "Superman: Birthright", for example? Jesus, that thing is a mess. He's got no right to bitch at anyone else for their questionable creative choices, he's guilty as hell on a grand scale, himself.

[Andrew NDB]

Mark Waid also claims that when he saw Man of Steel in the theater, he jumped up and started yelling at the screen when Superman killed Zod. I really hope that's just a tall tale.

I have no idea if that's true or false, but that'd be dumb. Was he equally screaming at his comics when Byrne or whoever had Superman kill Zod in the comics in the 80s? That was a major plot point at the time. It even weighed on Superman in the "Superman vs. Aliens" comic.

[Leo656]

Probably. It was in a blog he wrote after the movie came out, and he went onto this whole long, deranged spiel about how fundamentally integral the concept of Superman never, ever, EVER killing anyone is. "Because it removes all the inspirational and heroic qualities of the character". Which is wrong on so many levels. I'm willing to bet he actually never read those books in the first place.

And frankly, the idea that someone is "less of a hero" when cops and soldiers kill people to protect others all the time is laughable. It's not like he smashed a purse-snatcher through a wall or liquefied a jaywalker, and it's not like it was an event that happened often in either case. It was an extreme circumstance in which someone MORE powerful than Superman said with a straight face, "I'm going to f*cking murder everyone. Literally everyone. And you can't stop me from doing it." And thus, he HAD to stop him from doing it. Because what was he gonna do, call his bluff? In the comics version, Zod had already murdered every single thing on that parallel Earth, from every human being to every blade of grass. He was by default like a million Adolf Hitlers combined. If there was even a .0000001% chance that he'd back up his claims - "I'm going to come to YOUR Earth and do the exact same thing, and make you watch!" - then it was too great a chance. If anything, he got off easy.

One can argue all day long about whether it's "fair" to put an "optimistic" character like Superman into such an extreme No-Win situation, but I call bullsh*t on that. The biggest knock people make on the character is that he's "too perfect" and "everything is easy for him", but if you READ the comics, it's never like that at all. He's constantly faced with No-Win situations and he's forever unsure of whether he did the right thing or not in any given situation he finds himself in. "Did I do too much? Not enough? Do I even have a right to my personal time? Every time I stop for coffee, people die. Even when I'm saving people Over Here, people are dying Over There. And I have to live with that." His entire f*cking LIFE is a No-Win scenario and he's just f*cking winging it. He has the HARDEST job in the universe and there's no manual. That story was simply a case of, "So here's Superman. Now here's the OPPOSITE of Superman. How do you stop him? How CAN you stop him?" Well... you're really only left with one solution, aren't you? If you don't get a pass for killing Space Hitler, well... I'unno, man.

That was one of the earliest comic books I ever read. My Dad used to read it to me, sometimes. And I'd say, "Dad, did Superman really have to kill that guy? I thought Superman never kills anyone?" And he said "Yeah, but sometimes even really good people have to do really bad things to keep other people safe. It doesn't mean they're not still good people. Superman always just does the best he can. The bad guy just didn't give him any choice." And from then on I never questioned it. It's STILL one of my all-time favorites and I get chills every time I get through the third issue. Especially the ending where he tearfully laments how he has to live with it for the rest of his life. How he knows everyone else still sees him as a hero, but he no longer feels like a hero to himself because in his heart he wishes he'd found another way, as impossible as that was to his logical mind. Powerful, powerful stuff. People who say there's no pathos or drama in Superman stories simply need to open a book once in a while.

And I loved how they referenced it in the Aliens cross-over, for sure (and what a great cross-over THAT was!). But even in the main books, he beat himself up so bad over it that he left Earth in disgrace until that Kryptonian priest set him straight. That gave us the whole Exile/WarWorld arc, which was brilliance in itself. The whole ordeal made Superman a better character and a better hero. The entire one or two-year arc from 88 through 89 was some of the best stuff that's ever been done with the character. So it's not like killing Zod happened in a vacuum and then he went back to smacking Prankster around like nothing happened. Pretty much the next decade-plus of stories grew out of that incident. It's arguably the defining moment of the Post-Crisis run, aside from the Doomsday thing. It's what everything else directly spun out of. If you piece it all together, NOTHING that happened in the comics through 2010 could have happened if the Zod Incident never took place. Mongul, Matrix Supergirl, Cyborg Superman, "Panic In The Sky", Eradicator/"Krypton Man", and even his resurrection, and on and on and on and on and ON. None of it happens - NONE of it - if he doesn't kill Zod. If Superman does not kill Zod, then dozens of the all-time greatest Superman stories ever put in print simply do not happen. Talk about a ripple effect. Why would anyone wish away the all-time greatest run in the character's printed history? Just because he fell from grace ONE time? The "fall" and "redemption" was the entire point of the arc!

Point being, these things don't happen for the sake of being "dark and edgy". They're about character growth, about Actions and Consequences. Pathos and Drama. Growing beyond trauma. Making the Impossible Choice and finding a way to live with it. Fighting to become the Best Possible Version Of Yourself. THAT is what Superman comics, at their best, are about. Everything great about fiction, period. If Mark Waid doesn't "get" that, because Superman pajamas are sold to little kids and therefore he can't ever kill a bad guy, even the WORST bad guy, then he's not much of a writer in my opinion.

It's not that Superman Never Kills. He shouldn't and REALLY doesn't want to. But I find it laughable to suggest that just because he's a "symbol of hope" he'd stand there and let people die if he could stop it, just because the only way he could stop it would be icky. It should ONLY ever be written as an Absolute Last Resort, obviously, and in both the comic and the film, that's exactly what it was. Therefore, I have zero problem with it and will furthermore say that it was the only real solution in either case.

Mark Waid is simply a well-intentioned manchild with an overly-simplistic view of morality. And occasionally, depending on character and circumstance, a very good writer. But as someone who's read Birthright multiple times, I'll flat-out say that he doesn't know jack from sh*t about Superman and shouldn't base his opinions on a bad cartoon show from 1974.

Seriously. He bases his characters on Super-Friends. Super-Friends. It's like he can't even hear himself talk. I wish the man no ill will whatsoever, and his Flash run would be one of my Desert Island picks for sure, but he should know when to stay in his lane, is all. His opinion is not The Gospel.

[ZariusTwo]

A full plot break down of the pilot has surfaced online


Clark narrates his origin. Obligatory flashback to Krypton blowing up. The Kents finding him, Jon dying while Clark was a teen. Clark meets Lois at the Daily Planet. I hope this isn’t the only scene with Perry White in it. But it looks like he’s no longer around. He might not fare any better than he did in Smallville screen time wise Also Steve Lombard makes a cameo. No mention of Jimmy though.
Jump to the present post crisis. Clark and Lois have twins, Jonathan who is a jock, and Jordan who suffers from mental illness. Neither know who their dad is, though Lois wants to tell them. Clark doesn’t want them to feel alien like he did.
Superman and Sam Lane are surprisingly chummy. They are working together to see who is sabotaging nuclear power plants. Evidence points to a speedster. Superman sugggests that this may be the Flash’s problem.
Later Clark has a very bad day. He gets fired and he learns his mother died of a stroke within the same 15 minutes. Morgan Edge runs the Daily Planet. Apparently a free man post-crisis.
They go to Smallville for the funeral. We meet Lana and her family. Also Cobb is there too, no mention of Kathy though. Clark being older than he looks is addressed again. The Langs are in support of Morgan Edge which leading to drunken argument between Lois and Lana’s husband (Pete is namedropped at one point, but this isn’t him).
Lane shows up again, revealing that the stranger is leaving messages to Superman in a kryptonian language. Also it is revealed that both Lois and Clark remember pre and post crisis.
The twins later find Clark’s old spaceship in the barn after almost getting killed by fallen debrey. After they survive without injury Clark and Lois assume Jonathan has powers and tell them the truth. Later after surviving another accident, it is revealed Jordan is the one with powers. At the same time Superman has a fight with the mysterious stranger who attacked the nuclear power plants and left kryptonian messages. He reveals he is from a world that was destroyed by crisis. Revealing that he and Superman were archenemies in his world. Then he throws kryptonite at Superman and escapes.
Later Clark decides he’s going to try to get his farm up and running and try to keep Morgan Edge’s influence from spreading to SMALLVILLE.
Elsewhere, the mysterious stranger is revealed to be Lex Luthor

[Autbot_Benz]

A full plot break down of the pilot has surfaced online


Clark narrates his origin. Obligatory flashback to Krypton blowing up. The Kents finding him, Jon dying while Clark was a teen. Clark meets Lois at the Daily Planet. I hope this isn’t the only scene with Perry White in it. But it looks like he’s no longer around. He might not fare any better than he did in Smallville screen time wise Also Steve Lombard makes a cameo. No mention of Jimmy though.
Jump to the present post crisis. Clark and Lois have twins, Jonathan who is a jock, and Jordan who suffers from mental illness. Neither know who their dad is, though Lois wants to tell them. Clark doesn’t want them to feel alien like he did.
Superman and Sam Lane are surprisingly chummy. They are working together to see who is sabotaging nuclear power plants. Evidence points to a speedster. Superman sugggests that this may be the Flash’s problem.
Later Clark has a very bad day. He gets fired and he learns his mother died of a stroke within the same 15 minutes. Morgan Edge runs the Daily Planet. Apparently a free man post-crisis.
They go to Smallville for the funeral. We meet Lana and her family. Also Cobb is there too, no mention of Kathy though. Clark being older than he looks is addressed again. The Langs are in support of Morgan Edge which leading to drunken argument between Lois and Lana’s husband (Pete is namedropped at one point, but this isn’t him).
Lane shows up again, revealing that the stranger is leaving messages to Superman in a kryptonian language. Also it is revealed that both Lois and Clark remember pre and post crisis.
The twins later find Clark’s old spaceship in the barn after almost getting killed by fallen debrey. After they survive without injury Clark and Lois assume Jonathan has powers and tell them the truth. Later after surviving another accident, it is revealed Jordan is the one with powers. At the same time Superman has a fight with the mysterious stranger who attacked the nuclear power plants and left kryptonian messages. He reveals he is from a world that was destroyed by crisis. Revealing that he and Superman were archenemies in his world. Then he throws kryptonite at Superman and escapes.
Later Clark decides he’s going to try to get his farm up and running and try to keep Morgan Edge’s influence from spreading to SMALLVILLE.
Elsewhere, the mysterious stranger is revealed to be Lex Luthor

Glad its Luthor hopefully its Jon Cryer's version. this show doesn't sound half bad

[Andrew NDB]

Sounds kind of weak to me, but I'll give it the once over.

[ZariusTwo]

The series will debut in January, Tuesdays at 9 PM. The Flash will be it's lead-in

https://comicbook.com/tv-shows/news/the-cw-schedule-fall-2020-shows-premieres-delay-covid-19/

..Whilst the next Arrowverse crossover will be between this show and Batwoman

https://tvline.com/2020/05/14/arrowverse-crossover-superman-batwoman-2021/

[Slade]

A full plot break down of the pilot has surfaced online


Clark narrates his origin. Obligatory flashback to Krypton blowing up. The Kents finding him, Jon dying while Clark was a teen. Clark meets Lois at the Daily Planet. I hope this isn’t the only scene with Perry White in it. But it looks like he’s no longer around. He might not fare any better than he did in Smallville screen time wise Also Steve Lombard makes a cameo. No mention of Jimmy though.
Jump to the present post crisis. Clark and Lois have twins, Jonathan who is a jock, and Jordan who suffers from mental illness. Neither know who their dad is, though Lois wants to tell them. Clark doesn’t want them to feel alien like he did.
Superman and Sam Lane are surprisingly chummy. They are working together to see who is sabotaging nuclear power plants. Evidence points to a speedster. Superman sugggests that this may be the Flash’s problem.
Later Clark has a very bad day. He gets fired and he learns his mother died of a stroke within the same 15 minutes. Morgan Edge runs the Daily Planet. Apparently a free man post-crisis.
They go to Smallville for the funeral. We meet Lana and her family. Also Cobb is there too, no mention of Kathy though. Clark being older than he looks is addressed again. The Langs are in support of Morgan Edge which leading to drunken argument between Lois and Lana’s husband (Pete is namedropped at one point, but this isn’t him).
Lane shows up again, revealing that the stranger is leaving messages to Superman in a kryptonian language. Also it is revealed that both Lois and Clark remember pre and post crisis.
The twins later find Clark’s old spaceship in the barn after almost getting killed by fallen debrey. After they survive without injury Clark and Lois assume Jonathan has powers and tell them the truth. Later after surviving another accident, it is revealed Jordan is the one with powers. At the same time Superman has a fight with the mysterious stranger who attacked the nuclear power plants and left kryptonian messages. He reveals he is from a world that was destroyed by crisis. Revealing that he and Superman were archenemies in his world. Then he throws kryptonite at Superman and escapes.
Later Clark decides he’s going to try to get his farm up and running and try to keep Morgan Edge’s influence from spreading to SMALLVILLE.
Elsewhere, the mysterious stranger is revealed to be Lex Luthor

Oh boy :roll: No..just no. Throw it all away.

[Autbot_Benz]

Fandom
@getFANDOM
·
18m
'Superman & Lois' will debut a 'really badass' new Superman suit design, according to EP Todd Helbing

(via #DCFanDome)

[TurtleTitan97]

Fandom
@getFANDOM
·
18m
'Superman & Lois' will debut a 'really badass' new Superman suit design, according to EP Todd Helbing

(via #DCFanDome)

Hopefully it's something close to the Kingdom Come suit from Crisis.

[Autbot_Benz]

Superman and Lois
@cwsupermanlois
·
8h
Ready to soar. #SupermanAndLois premieres Tuesday, February 23 on The CW!

[ZariusTwo]

One of the show's writers has been ditched

https://twitter.com/NadriaTucker/status/1324718215629467649

TLDR: The show was turning down every 'woke' pitch she came up with.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

One of the show's writers has been ditched

https://twitter.com/NadriaTucker/status/1324718215629467649

TLDR: The show was turning down every 'woke' pitch she came up with.

:tlol: :tlol: :tlol:

[Sumac]

God riddance, but I hope she won't attack other staff for dismissing her "brave and stunning" ideas or come up with stories of "incredible harassment".

[TMNTFanatic4Life]

Indeed. There's enough woke tuff in these shows as is without the need to try to add more to the mix.

[Autbot_Benz]

Thank goodness. Glad to see Superman won't suffer woke crap

[sdp]

Let's hope other shows also give these woke writers the boot

[CyberCubed]

I wonder if this series can go without adding a single gay, lesbian, or transgender character. Probably make it to episode 2-3 and that's it.

[ZariusTwo]

Apparently they wanted to race-lift Jonathan and Martha Kent, and were ignored on that issue also.

https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a34727669/superman-and-lois-diversity-calls-ignored/

[Autbot_Benz]

Apparently they wanted to race-lift Jonathan and Martha Kent, and were ignored on that issue also.

https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a34727669/superman-and-lois-diversity-calls-ignored/

man Race Changing Jonathan and Martha Kent so glad this stupid SJW Bitch got canned

[CyberCubed]

Thank god. I know they're only his adoptive parents, but why can't a couple from Kansas just be white these days?

[TMNTFanatic4Life]

Yeah, really. I'm all for diversity when it makes sense and here it didnt so glad she got the axe.

[Sumac]

Finally, SJW got justice it deserved, i.e. none of her trash was realized in the show.

[ZariusTwo]

The series cinematographer is Gavin Struthers, who worked on The Witcher, Shameless and Black Sails

https://www.thevulcanreporter.com/scoops/superman-lois-dop-gavin-struthers/


The first five episode titles have also been revealed


Pilot
Heritage
The Perks of Not being a Wallflower
Haywire
The Beacon

[ZariusTwo]

So CW's back-up plan for a lack of Batwoman/Superman crossover next year is to do a five episode event where John Diggle crosses over with the CW shows, in addition David Ramsey will direct many of the Arrowverse episodes.

https://deadline.com/2020/12/david-ramsey-john-diggle-dc-legends-arrow-the-flash-1234635557/?fbclid=IwAR3rUtKETRccYWW3mbUiIfRBUQID9FuLpqAzEbrn w-NrkNROzg8mtq1hMYQ

[Andrew NDB]

So CW's back-up plan for a lack of Batwoman/Superman crossover next year is to do a five episode event where John Diggle crosses over with the CW shows, in addition David Ramsey will direct many of the Arrowverse episodes.

https://deadline.com/2020/12/david-ramsey-john-diggle-dc-legends-arrow-the-flash-1234635557/?fbclid=IwAR3rUtKETRccYWW3mbUiIfRBUQID9FuLpqAzEbrn w-NrkNROzg8mtq1hMYQ

If there wasn't the HBO Max SJW Lantern show going on I'd say, "Oh! That means Diggle is going to be Green Lantern!" but it... probably doesn't?

[Autbot_Benz]

New Costume

https://i.imgur.com/wZ4OWkR.jpg

[CyberCubed]

Willing to bet Supergirl guest stars in a few ep of this down the line, especially since her show is ending.

[Leo656]

Willing to bet Supergirl guest stars in a few ep of this down the line, especially since her show is ending.

I think that's a very safe bet.

New costume is about a thousand times better than the old one. I just don't like the actor and I definitely don't like the way he's been presented thus far. I have a bad feeling that he'll be every bit the second fiddle to Lois that he was to Supergirl.

I mean, I gotta be honest, I probably won't watch it. I might check out the pilot but it doesn't feel like it's for me. For most of these shows in the last few years, the pilot's as far as I get.

[TMNTFanatic4Life]

I think that's a very safe bet.

New costume is about a thousand times better than the old one. I just don't like the actor and I definitely don't like the way he's been presented thus far. I have a bad feeling that he'll be every bit the second fiddle to Lois that he was to Supergirl.

I mean, I gotta be honest, I probably won't watch it. I might check out the pilot but it doesn't feel like it's for me. For most of these shows in the last few years, the pilot's as far as I get.


It's a great suit and I do like Tyler's Superman but yeah...its a lock that Lois will be the heavy lifter in this series if you know what i mean. I do applaud them for getting rid of that woke writer but I just feel like Lois will get the better material in the show and seem like the bigger deal over Supes, just based off what we've seen so far.


I hope I'm wrong and this Superman becomes a total badass with the proper respect to the character but yeah....dont feel it.

[Shark_Blade]

I guess it’s going to be like Lois & Clark series? I’ve never been into the series but since it’s currently on sale on iTunes recently I got the complete series and binged it.

5-N3o1IAxFc

It’s surreal seeing young hot Teri Hatcher pre-Desperate Housewives era. And Dean Cain looks great too until I found out he’s a Trump supporter ugh. Anyway I guess I can separate the man from his work. It’s a pretty enjoyable series, and Lex Luthor still has his hair lol.

[Leo656]

Dean Cain was a great Superman, but he was an amazing Clark Kent. Hatcher was probably the best Lois we've had, also. Lots and lots of people still argue that John Shea was the best Lex Luthor, and I'm not going to fight with them about it.

That show started to fall apart in Season 3 and it was completely off the rails by Season 4, but the first two Seasons still hold up for what they are. It could have altogether been great if they had, like, any money at all to spend.

But at the very least, the pilot movie and "The Green, Green Glow of Home" are still some of the best Superman stuff ever done in live-action, easily.

[ZariusTwo]

Should have ended with the discount Zod substitute Lord Nor's invasion.

[Leo656]

discount Zod substitute Lord Nor

:lol:

I don't know what honestly annoyed me more: The "Lois & Clark" writers' refusing to use almost any villain characters from the comics - for a combination of "We don't have the money" and "We don't read comics and we don't think our audience does either" reasons... OR, "Smallville" with the late-game insistence on jamming the show FULL of comic book characters and screwing all of them up entirely. :lol:

Actually... nah, "Smallville" was more annoying, just because the execution was so terrible in using those characters that it'd be better had they not bothered. :trazz: Given how L&C had really no money to work with, it's probably for the best that they did their own thing.

Y'know what's low-key probably the best "Superman" TV show? "The Adventures of Superboy". Seriously. Especially the Gerard Christopher seasons when they had a bit more money to spend and started taking everything more seriously. It's got a bit of cheese, and it's still a low-budget syndicated show, but it's SO right out of the comics and Gerard was terrific in the role, albeit a little stiff. Metallo was terrible, and their Lex was a total ham, but outside of that stuff the show was really, REALLY good, for the most part. Like, even Bizarro had a goddamn emotional arc over his series of episodes. That's a feat.

I mean, it's "Superboy", but that's really "in-name-only". It's set on a college campus and Gerard was in his goddamn mid-20s when they shot it. So f*ck what they call it, it's a Superman show. :lol: It's really only "Superboy" for licensing reasons between the Salkinds and WB, anyway. Like legally, they weren't "allowed" to make a Superman TV show in live action, so they just cast a young-ish looking guy and said it was "Superboy", but it's clearly Superman. Kinda dumb, but whatever, it doesn't hurt the show much, if any.

I love Dean Cain, but I'm still rather mad that they threw Gerard out of the audition for L&C once they found out he'd already played the role for four Seasons on another show. That felt unfair. Like, he's experienced, isn't that what you should WANT? I mean they'd verbally "promised" that he'd get to play Superman proper in some spin-off TV movies that never happened once the Superboy show was over, I feel he was owed. He should've been the FIRST guy they called for Lois & Clark, in my opinion. Stupid studio politics nonsense.

Really aggravates me that that show, and Gerard, are more or less forgotten by history. It's a good show and he was great in it. I dare say it might even be better than L&C, maybe. If nothing else, it's the most comics-faithful Sueprman show we've ever had, or are ever likely to get. Really wish it had more attention.

[ZariusTwo]

Really aggravates me that that show, and Gerard, are more or less forgotten by history. It's a good show and he was great in it. I dare say it might even be better than L&C, maybe. If nothing else, it's the most comics-faithful Sueprman show we've ever had, or are ever likely to get. Really wish it had more attention.

I borrowed a VHS tape one summer from a friend which had a Bizzaro two-parter from Superboy and it was by far the best thing on the tape, sandwiched in between Scooby Doo and VR Troopers episodes I'd seen a hundred times.

This was back when satellite/cable actually showed stuff the regular four channel set up I had never bothered with. Frankly, I preferred it when Satellite was just a tiny bit out of my grasp. I didn't know what to do with it when we could finally afford it.

[Leo656]

Yeah, those Bizarro episodes were awesome, some of the best stuff in the entire series.

I once bought a flea market bootleg DVD copy of the second half of the series, back when it was highly unlikely that the show would ever have an official release. I still have it, but man, I was glad when the actual DVD releases came out several years ago. The bootleg still had clips of some of the commercials on it. Fun time capsule, but not the optimal viewing experience. :lol:

I'm gonna do another run on that series soon. I watched it religiously as a kid every weekend but it's a lot better than I'd remembered. You really can't say that about most things.

[ZariusTwo]

-OUSrZVxIrw

[ZariusTwo]

The series will have a 90-minute premiere on February 23rd, followed by a special documentary called "Legacy of Hope"...this has wound up bumping Flash off the schedule, and it's seventh series premiere will now be on March 2nd

https://www.spoilertv.com/2021/01/superman-lois-to-premiere-with-90.html

[ZariusTwo]

uWh5JdynBUM

[Autbot_Benz]

uWh5JdynBUM

this looks pretty good.

[TurtleTitan97]

Definitely looks more cinematic compared to other Arrowverse shows.

Alright CW, you've got my attention.

[Autbot_Benz]

Definitely looks more cinematic compared to other Arrowverse shows.

Alright CW, you've got my attention.

it helps they got funding from HBO Max. It goes to Max after it airs on CW

[Sumac]

Sups looks like a hobo.
Could they at least shave him properly?

[ZariusTwo]

An additional two episodes added to season one

https://tvline.com/2021/02/03/cw-renewed-shows-2021-list-flash-riverdale-walker/?fbclid=IwAR2CfjhPeK8-h8i_RpRI7V0Q1dbZD8E70TYGTbaCYsfTmz9eJvUdrNkMQ_I

[ZariusTwo]

Vn3nWnalHJk

[Slade]

Trailer looks nice, but this still will be a dumpster fire. DC and CW need to break up or something.

[Leo656]

Those action shots of Superman are so blatantly, "Let's rip off Zack Snyder's cinematography, but let's try it without the budget." :lol: Not bad by TV standards though. Just sayin', it jumps out at me.

[ZariusTwo]

Yo8Yc4NTuxQ

[Jester]

Come on! Would Clark Kent really keep the fact that he's Superman from his own children?

[Coola Yagami]

Come on! Would Clark Kent really keep the fact that he's Superman of from his own children?

That makes no sense.... were they born without powers?

[Leo656]

I mean, in most modern continuities Clark's powers developed really slowly and he didn't have most of them until he was an adult. If his progeny's bloodline were "diluted" with human DNA, I can see their kids not having powers until later on, either.

But yeah, no, I kinda don't know if Clark would keep that kinda thing secret from his kids. I can see reasons why yes, and reasons why no.

I mean, "Lying to your kids because they can't handle certain information yet" is 99% of what being a parent is. Even though he's all about "Truth and Justice", I can't see that being much different for Clark.

I mean, he lied to Lois's face every day for years, for a while even after she was sleeping with him. For as noble as his intentions, we've often seen that his "I always tell the truth" thing is... conditional, at best.

I've always believed that Clark subscribes to the old Lionel Hutz theory: "There's 'The Truth' ((shakes head))... and then there's, 'The Truth'! ((nods vigorously))" Nothing else really makes much sense.

[ZariusTwo]

Clark and Lois kept his powers a secret from Jon in the comics too, and revealed them when Jon's powers began kicking in.

[ZariusTwo]

Another new trailer

2zsMhke1_FM

So Lois' father knows who Clark is. I recall that was a recent development that Bendis wrote into the books shortly before he killed Sam off.

[ZariusTwo]

Reviews of the pilot are coming in

https://www.tvfanatic.com/2021/02/superman-and-lois-battle-to-keep-their-family-together-in-new-tr/

http://www.kryptonsite.com/review-superman-lois-begins-a-bold-new-direction-for-dc-tv/

https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a35447089/superman-and-lois-review-episode-1/

[Leo656]

The first "review" says nothing and is more of a press release than anything, FYI.

Second and third articles almost completely contradict each other, which is interesting. Given how much the author of the middle link gushes about Smallville, safe to say I'm gonna throw their opinion in the trash. :trazz:

The third link seems to lean into what I've been most afraid of with this show. I know I'm an "older" fan and whatever, but an entire series about Clark having to grapple with angsty teenage kids who resent him and Lois is just about the last thing I'd ever wanna see.

I "just" want a basic, no-frills Superman show. "Lois & Clark" with a budget. "Superboy" without the camp. The 90s animated series in live-action. That's all I want. No gimmicks.

As time goes on, it feels more and more unlikely that such a show is ever going to exist. And that bothers me. :ohwell:

I will probably watch the pilot. But 1. I don't like this actor as Superman, and 2. None of this material interests me at all. "Smallville" was the last thing on Earth I was ever interested in seeing in a Superman show, with its ten years of Whiny Clark avoiding responsibility while accidentally meeting or creating his entire rogues' gallery before he was ever in the suit. But "Clark trying to juggle his role as Superman with raising two bratty kids" is pretty much the SECOND-to-last thing I'd ever care to sit through.

[ZariusTwo]

The first "review" says nothing and is more of a press release than anything, FYI.

Second and third articles almost completely contradict each other, which is interesting. Given how much the author of the middle link gushes about Smallville, safe to say I'm gonna throw their opinion in the trash. :trazz@

At it's peak, Kryptonsite was the premiere source for news and hype for Smallville, so there's an existing bias.

Fun fact, prior to Smallville, the webmaster used to run a pretty cool M.A.S.K fan page that he kept linked to Kryptonsite for years. :lol:

I used to be part of the forums, I had fond memories of partaking in their 'Round Robin' games in the early years. I remember flooding the thing with chapters involving every rogues gallery member I could remember, making the forum version of the show a defacto Superman series before Clark had ever heard of the fortress or Jor-El. Fun times riling them up.

[Andrew NDB]

I wonder how many episodes until one of the two Super sons comes out as gay?

[ZariusTwo]

I wonder how many episodes until one of the two Super sons comes out as gay?

Don't remind me of the tumblr cranks who want it to be Jon so badly so he can be together with Damien Wayne:cry:

[Leo656]

It's inevitable. That's probably why they gave them two sons instead of one son and one daughter. So one can "come out" partway through Season One.

I mean the author of the middle article takes time out from the review to go on a brief rant about how they hope the show has "more inclusion" before too long, so the CW audience that wants these shows is going to inevitably bang the drum to make it happen. It's all but assured.

And again, I don't want any of this in a Superman show. I just want a Superman show. But nowadays you can't DO a goddamn show without making it full of gimmicks and pandering and "Very Important Whatever."

Whatever happened to a good old fashioned action/adventure show about a super-hero fighting bad guys? Lois/Clark stuff is fine, but this thing gives off huge vibes that it's gonna be laden with family drama and "important" moments, and that just gives me gut rot.

[ZariusTwo]

It's inevitable. That's probably why they gave them two sons instead of one son and one daughter. So one can "come out" partway through Season One.

I mean the author of the middle article takes time out from the review to go on a brief rant about how they hope the show has "more inclusion" before too long, so the CW audience that wants these shows is going to inevitably bang the drum to make it happen. It's all but assured.

The show's producers reportedly fired one writer who wanted 'more inclusion'

[Leo656]

"More" or "Too much"? Because while that sounds encouraging, there's a matter of degree.

If that person was trying to make everything wall-to-wall gay and race-flipping characters left and right, then good, they deserved to be fired.

BUT, that doesn't mean they won't give Clark a gay son and spend a ton of time on that subplot at the expense of better things "just because". They absolutely can and probably will do that.

[mrmaczaps]

I'm not really impressed with either actor or actress for Clark & Lois...

And why are the kids teens? This is a CW show and Supergirl established that they were just pregnant last season and ended with Lois having babies. ?? Or did Crisis age them up 15 years?

This is just..... typical of modern storytelling. They use existing characters, throw in way to much sjw crap, some bs & a boatload of lies and call it storytelling. :lol: But I'll watch the first episode if I remember to record it. Maybe.

[ZariusTwo]

"More" or "Too much"? Because while that sounds encouraging, there's a matter of degree.

If that person was trying to make everything wall-to-wall gay and race-flipping characters left and right, then good, they deserved to be fired.

That's generally it, the writer was making the case that Martha and/or Johnathan could be black since the logic was Clark was adopted anyway.

[Andrew NDB]

And why are the kids teens?

Because -- sadly -- it would be too controversial to have toddlers coming out as homosexuals.

[ZariusTwo]

Or did Crisis age them up 15 years? .

Yep. Pretty much this.

[mrmaczaps]

Because -- sadly -- it would be too controversial to have toddlers coming out as homosexuals.

But they can self identify as trans?

[Leo656]

Apparently if they feel like it. :lol:

[Andrew NDB]

But they can self identify as trans?

Maybe next year. They have to do these indoctrination media things in phases. We're still at the "let's get lots of teenagers coming out to famous dads."

[Leo656]

I thought we were in the "Celebrities Whose Three-Year-Old Kids Are Somehow Gender-Fluid And/Or Nonbinary" Phase? These things change so fast!

[ZariusTwo]

Angus Macfadyen has been cast as Jor-El

https://comicbook.com/tv-shows/news/superman-lois-casts-angus-macfadyen-as-jor-el-exclusive-/

And, yep, they're pulling a Donner/Smallville with him by having him be the Fortress A.I

[ZariusTwo]

Some more footage from a leaked promotional 'Sneek Peek'

AWJsedEMx_M

[mrmaczaps]

Some more footage from a leaked promotional 'Sneek Peek'

AWJsedEMx_M

Glad they fixed the suit. This looks better.

Disappointing they didn't use the Smallville Kent farm like in pervious seasons of Supergirl.

Overall seems like a clusterf*ck though.

[Leo656]

I missed the first chunk of the episode because I forgot it was on today; we jumped in at the scene of Clark's kids yelling at him for not telling them he was Superman; which was alright but the one "emo" son's acting was a bit cringe-y.

So far it seems okay, but the one thing that jumps out at me the most is how very much they're trying to mimic Snyder's movies with the visual presentation. Like they literally cribbed entire scenes, sequences, camera angles, framing, and choreography. And just now they ripped a scene 1:1 from "Superman Returns".

It's not "bad", just interesting. Like it's very, very deliberate, to the point where it jumps out at you. "This is the same shot from MoS, this is that one scene from BvS," etc. Even the lighting and color palette during the scenes they "homage" is exactly the same. Points for doing their homework I guess.

I'm gonna have to see the whole thing from the beginning to really have an opinion. I don't like this Lois much, though. I get that they're trying to call back to Margot Kidder, but I never really liked her much as Lois, and I don't think that "Coked-Up Scarecrow" needs to be the "canon visual" for what Lois Lane looks like. I know, I'm shallow.

Tyler seems better here than he did in Supergirl.

I'unno, like I said I'd have to see the whole thing but so far it's not bad. There's some potential here. I'd still prefer just a "plain" Superman show, though, but that's me. I know that the people who write these shows feel that the "traditional" approach to these stories is tired and played out, but I disagree.

[Autbot_Benz]

Really enjoying this so far. Agreed with Leo Tyler is so much better in this because he doesn't have to play second fiddle to Melissa on supergirl anymore. Can't wait to see what the first Season has in store.

[Leo656]

We'll see. I gave Supergirl a chance and gave up after about four episodes, and every time I checked back in after that it had just gotten worse. So I'm willing to see what comes up but I've been burned before. It's still the CW, after all.

One thing that struck me between what I saw and what I read about, was the sheer number of homages and Easter eggs packed into this one pilot episode. Which can be good, in that it says "Look, we did our homework!" in the way they worked to include bits and pieces from pretty much every single other Superman movie and TV show. And that's a nice way to get people on your side right out of the gate. BUT, it also leads to questions about what they'll do when they can't just rely on Nostalgia Pops; they can't just crib visual homages and lines of dialog forever, after all, I mean they used up a bunch already just in this one episode.

Like I said, we'll see what happens.

[Autbot_Benz]

Looks like The Stranger is indeed Lex but from an Alt earth from what Twitter is saying . so there are two Lex Luthors in the Arrowverse

[Andrew NDB]

I missed the first chunk of the episode because I forgot it was on today; we jumped in at the scene of Clark's kids yelling at him for not telling them he was Superman; which was alright but the one "emo" son's acting was a bit cringe-y.

So far it seems okay, but the one thing that jumps out at me the most is how very much they're trying to mimic Snyder's movies with the visual presentation. Like they literally cribbed entire scenes, sequences, camera angles, framing, and choreography. And just now they ripped a scene 1:1 from "Superman Returns".

It's not "bad", just interesting. Like it's very, very deliberate, to the point where it jumps out at you. "This is the same shot from MoS, this is that one scene from BvS," etc. Even the lighting and color palette during the scenes they "homage" is exactly the same. Points for doing their homework I guess.

I'm gonna have to see the whole thing from the beginning to really have an opinion. I don't like this Lois much, though. I get that they're trying to call back to Margot Kidder, but I never really liked her much as Lois, and I don't think that "Coked-Up Scarecrow" needs to be the "canon visual" for what Lois Lane looks like. I know, I'm shallow.

Tyler seems better here than he did in Supergirl.

I'unno, like I said I'd have to see the whole thing but so far it's not bad. There's some potential here. I'd still prefer just a "plain" Superman show, though, but that's me. I know that the people who write these shows feel that the "traditional" approach to these stories is tired and played out, but I disagree.

Saw it now, too. Though mine seems to end with Superman plummeting toward Earth after getting stabbed at the hour mark, but it was billed as a 2 hour event? *shrug*

Yeah, I definitely saw a ton of stylistic borrowings from "Man of Steel" especially. Even the music! When Superman gets thrown outside... that "dum-dadda-dum, dadda-DUM!" is like identical to the score during the fights in MoS.

It's not bad. I'm going into this SUPER suspicious, but I didn't see any SJW ideology at play... yet. If I had to make a bet... the brown haired kid gets to be straight because they've already established he had some kind of mental thing going on (i.e., they won't make the "crazy" one be gay), so that means the jock-like blond son will become the gay one. But they left this first episode devoid of any of that.

But I'm not fooled... yet. Supergirl had a great premiere devoid of SJW stuff, and that was literally as long as that lasted. 1 episode.

[Leo656]

No, they had a whole extra half-hour to the episode after that spot. The episode was 90 minutes and then there was a half-hour puff piece talking to the actors and writer/producers about the Making Of. That's the "two hours".

I'd check your DVR settings, that was just a spot for a commercial break, not the end of the episode. They came back from commercial and did a note-for-note "homage" to the shot of him plummeting to Earth from "Superman Returns", except for him not landing in a giant crater at the end of it.

Frankly, I wasn't thrilled with how they more or less decided to have him no-sell the Kryptonite as soon as it became plot-convenient; he just "thinks of Lois" more or less and suddenly it was like he barely felt the Kryptonite anymore and snaps out of it, that was kinda weak. But whatever.

The rest of the episode was basically them as a family deciding to stay in Smallville, and the "shocking" reveal of who "The Stranger" was... which everyone pretty much already guessed.

If you missed any part of I think they're replaying it on Saturday. But it'll probably be online before then, too.

[ZariusTwo]

I enjoyed the pilot. I agree with Leo that there were a bucketload of easter eggs, one right after the other in some cases. They also ripped lines from the comics wholesale ("My mom made it for me" comes straight out of "A Superman For All Seasons"). The feats with the nuclear plant reminded me of similar tricks in Superman III.

I wish we'd seen more of Supes in this episode, I also feel it was a big risk concluding a pilot episode on Clark getting curb-stomped by the new Lex

Lois is fine, but played too big a "Marge Simpson" role here, nagging Clark, there wasn't enough of a spotlight on her personal investigation into Morgan Edge, and I don't think it was in character for Lois to keep Clark at home when her father needed him to investigate the nuclear plant attacks.

Jordan is my spirit animal. I wish they'd made him Jon, for christ's sake, he has the EXACT same look as young Jon from the comics, and he has all the powers also.

[Leo656]

But that would be "predictable", and it wouldn't "subvert expectations". You know that's the Very First Thing that gets discussed when these things start moving forward in development. Like having the kid named Jordan in real life not actually play the character named "Jordan", because Lord knows that would just be "too easy". "We gotta over-think and over-complicate everything Just Because."

And actually "My Mom/Mother made it for me" was from the "Lois & Clark" pilot way before it was in the comics. I have a very strong feeling that they cribbed it from there, not from "Superman For All Seasons". I'd be shocked if they used too many comics for reference at all, quite frankly, as almost every single homage/reference they used was specifically from the movies and TV shows (at least the ones I saw in the second half). That seemed to be the direct theme, borrowing liberally from previous film and TV works. I guess it's possible they took it from the book but it seems more likely that it's a "Lois & Clark" reference, to me. Just going by the theme.

Like for example I know that on the Superman Homepage they have an article about the Easter Eggs, and they cite the scene of Superman and the car as an Action Comics #1 homage, and obviously yeah, but the way it's shot and staged, it's more of an homage to the way they pulled that off in "Superman Returns", as it bears more of a resemblance to that than it does to the comic book cover.

Fleischer suit was a cute touch. A bit of a stretch to accept that any semi-modern version of the character would have actually worn such a dated design, but it's a nice bit of history and it's fun when it pops up.

[Andrew NDB]

I wish we'd seen more of Supes in this episode, I also feel it was a big risk concluding a pilot episode on Clark getting curb-stomped by the new Lex

Yeah... they really needed to come out of the gate with Superman kicking ass, especially after his treatment over and over again in Supergirl. They could save this "New Lex" (is it Alexander Luthor? probably. I see Geoff's shifty little name on this) for the 2nd episode.

[TurtleTitan97]

I thought the pilot was decent, even if the writing for the kids was kinda iffy.

[Andrew NDB]

I admit... this gives me hope, lol...

https://bleedingcool.com/tv/ex-superman-fisher-jl-case/

Really kind of seems like this writer lady was like, "B-b-b-but important SJW issues! Bechdel test and these other ones, blah blah" and was politely told to stfu. Which is... shocking. For CW. I want to say "maybe they've learned?" but I'm hesitant.

[CyberCubed]

Tbh this series should have been standalone, the fact that a lot of Superman's villains like Lex Luthor especially were already used on Supergirl takes a lot of freshness out of this series. This show should have been the start of an all-new universe even with the same Superman actor, because knowing half the villains have appeared already on Supergirl takes a lot out of it.

If she can handle all these villains, what need is there for Superman?

[Vegita-San]

does this get filmed in canada?

maybe canada can still be saved from wokeness.

[ZariusTwo]

If she can handle all these villains, what need is there for Superman?

Because Supergirl is f*cking off.

[sdp]

I'll wait until Ted Cruz chimes on this show before I start watching it.

[AquaParade]

Tbh this series should have been standalone, the fact that a lot of Superman's villains like Lex Luthor especially were already used on Supergirl takes a lot of freshness out of this series. This show should have been the start of an all-new universe even with the same Superman actor, because knowing half the villains have appeared already on Supergirl takes a lot out of it.

If she can handle all these villains, what need is there for Superman?

Sounds like a legit concern. Though as someone who never watched Supergirl, it may not have much of an effect on my viewing experience.
Superman is much more popular, so maybe they are aiming this at folks like me, while saving themselves some casting time and money.

[Autbot_Benz]

I admit... this gives me hope, lol...

https://bleedingcool.com/tv/ex-superman-fisher-jl-case/

Really kind of seems like this writer lady was like, "B-b-b-but important SJW issues! Bechdel test and these other ones, blah blah" and was politely told to stfu. Which is... shocking. For CW. I want to say "maybe they've learned?" but I'm hesitant.

ya That chick wanted to make ma and pa Kent Black stating clark is adopted so it doesn't matter the race of his parents or some stupid **** like that. Than CW showed her the door

[AquaParade]

Sorry you lost your job. Sounds like you were a pain to work with. Goodbye.

Maybe I'm a little cold, but I'm pretty much done with anyone taking their job complaints to Twitter. I get that it can be a powerful change for movement, but I don't think that's what is happening here.

[Autbot_Benz]

Sorry you lost your job. Sounds like you were a pain to work with. Goodbye.

When your too woke for the CW and they don't want you :lol:

[Sumac]

Funny thing all responses from "woke" people in that article are dumb gifs.

[TMNTFanatic4Life]

It was pretty good. Woe Park is a great addition to the show. I really enjoyed Tyler being able to shine with no Supergirl (nothing negative against Melissa!) there to one up him constantly. Hopefully this show remains WOKE free because it has the makings to be really good.

[AquaParade]

Funny thing all responses from "woke" people in that article are dumb gifs.

Gifs are so abused. Great way to not actually form your own opinon.

[Leo656]

This Chick: "This show doesn't have enough black people."
CW: "Well, to be fair... there really aren't a ton of them in rural Kansas, where the show is set. Or in Canada, where the show is filmed. So maybe..."
This Chick: "THEN LET'S PRETEND THERE ARE! MUH DIVERSITY! What is the POINT of even having a show without MUH DIVERSITY?!?!"
CW: "...Okay, don't call us, we'll call you."
:lol::lol::lol:

[Andrew NDB]

does this get filmed in canada?

maybe canada can still be saved from wokeness.

Nah, they've got "peoplekind" up there.

[Autbot_Benz]

Superman & Lois' Renewed for Season 2 at The CW

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/superman-lois-renewed-for-season-2-at-the-cw?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social

[Zulithe]

I think I will give this show a try even though I haven't been able to stick to any of the previous CW DC shows.

Maybe this weekend when I have some time.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Superman & Lois' Renewed for Season 2 at The CW

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/superman-lois-renewed-for-season-2-at-the-cw?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social

I love how shows get renewed one episode into their entire existence.

"Hey, people watched our pilot episode! Sign that sh!t for three more seasons!"

[Autbot_Benz]

Digging Jor-el and the Fortress of Solitude on here

[Andrew NDB]

I love how shows get renewed one episode into their entire existence.

"Hey, people watched our pilot episode! Sign that sh!t for three more seasons!"

Which makes me VERY suspicious about what's to come in the next 4 or 5 episodes. VERY suspicious.

Like, we're being baited with a nice politics/identity politics-free appetizer... but the main course is on its way. It's coming. A great big woke, SJW sandwich.

[ZariusTwo]

Superman and Lois episode 2

Who ate all the pies Jor-El?

Cushing with the air guitar on the whisky...damn they're making it hard to not like the guy sometimes

Lois taking charge of the family and nullifying an argument before it can escalates was the perfect tonic to predictable CW antics. Keep that sort of thing with the teens and not the family. Well done.

Sam keeping all the kryptonite stashed for Clark's 'protection'...nah, totally a precaution in he cases he goes rogue. Clark should have just said that to him, but, y'know, boundaries with the relatives.

And god damn the ending...Injustice? Crime Syndicate? Knightmare? A little of all three?

[Leo656]

It is really weird how every single show gets "renewed" after its first episode nowadays.

I guess it's not a "problem" except for all the really good shows of years' past which never had any chance to reach a satisfying resolution or conclusion because "the numbers" said it wasn't worth doing any more of them and so they were cancelled prematurely. Nowadays it's like "F*ck it, we're doing This Many and if people don't watch then oh well." Like, why does Batwoman get infinite chances despite the fact nobody watches it, but it took 24 years for more Twin Peaks? It all feels rather arbitrary.

[TMNTFanatic4Life]

Black Batwoman getting canned equals a Woke riot. I hate to say that but when ratings are that bad, how else can a show survive on terrible ratings, even for CW.
I know.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/wegotthiscovered.com/tv/batwoman-season-2-ratings-continue-plummet/amp/

[Autbot_Benz]

Black Batwoman getting canned equals a Woke riot. I hate to say that but when ratings are that bad, how else can a show survive on terrible ratings, even for CW.
I know.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/wegotthiscovered.com/tv/batwoman-season-2-ratings-continue-plummet/amp/

wegotthiscovered is a terrible website to use. I believe Batwoman's ratings sucks. but that website sucks too

[TMNTFanatic4Life]

Yeah well, it’s what popped up and i didnt check the site for legitimacy and when I saw Leo’s post, I just went with it.

But we all know the show sucks without needing ratings to confirm that. Just trying to figure out why it’s still on.

[Andrew NDB]

Saw episode 2. Long term I can see the whiny kids thing wearing me down but a pretty solid episode.

Is all the "hell" stuff a clue that this will end up being a loose adaptation of the H'El storyline? With Superman's evil brother or somesuch?

[ZariusTwo]

The show will go on hiatus in three weeks as the final season of Supergirl begins

https://www.cbr.com/supergirl-premiere-superman-lois-hiatus/

[Autbot_Benz]

The show will go on hiatus in three weeks as the final season of Supergirl begins

https://www.cbr.com/supergirl-premiere-superman-lois-hiatus/

yuck so we lose Superman till may and have the final season of SJWgirl instead no thank you

[mrmaczaps]

yuck so we lose Superman till may and have the final season of SJWgirl instead no thank you

SJWGirl is cancelled? Sweet.

[Andrew NDB]

The show will go on hiatus in three weeks as the final season of Supergirl begins

https://www.cbr.com/supergirl-premiere-superman-lois-hiatus/

Dumb. Why even punish Superman for a show that's already cancelled?

[TurtleTitan97]

Dumb. Why even punish Superman for a show that's already cancelled?

Not like they had a choice .They had to push the show back due a production issue involving COVID.

[Andrew NDB]

Not like they had a choice .They had to push the show back due a production issue involving COVID.

Oh. This is like the end of last year's season that got stopped?

But still. Right now Superman comes out the same night as Flash has been coming out... why can't Supergirl just do the same, or a different night every week?

[Autbot_Benz]

Oh. This is like the end of last year's season that got stopped?

But still. Right now Superman comes out the same night as Flash has been coming out... why can't Supergirl just do the same, or a different night every week?

Supergirl used to be on sunday's with batwoman you know the girl power evening

[ZariusTwo]

Online versions of the episodes will be extended

https://deadline.com/2021/03/superman-lois-series-premiere-ratings-cw-stream-extended-episodes-1234708245/

[Andrew NDB]

3 episodes in now and they're all solid and devoid of you-know-what. I'm impressed.

[ZariusTwo]

Back in the golden age suit for a flashback episode

https://www.justjared.com/2021/05/04/tyler-hoechlin-spotted-in-a-retro-superman-suit-in-new-superman-lois-photos/

[ZariusTwo]

Interview with Todd Helbing on what's to come in the next couple of weeks

http://www.kryptonsite.com/kryptonsite-interview-superman-lois-showrunner-ep-todd-helbing/

Todd also reveals that the original plan was to feature Diggle in five episodes, but the pandemic cut the whole story down to just one. Diggle will also be the only character from the Arrowverse crossing over this season, although Helbing reveals he would love to bring The Flash over.

[Autbot_Benz]

I enjoyed last night's episode. Glad this show is back

[Autbot_Benz]

welp the stranger is not a luthor but an alt earth John Henry Irons aka Steel the twist from tonights episode

[Andrew NDB]

welp the stranger is not a luthor but an alt earth John Henry Irons aka Steel the twist from tonights episode

Well that's an interesting twist. And why not John Henry Irons, really.

[Autbot_Benz]

Well that's an interesting twist. And why not John Henry Irons, really.

it was cool he even used his big ass hammer to attack superman for a bit. bet he will redeem himself by the end of the season or something

[Autbot_Benz]

Morgan Edge is actually a kryptonian the episode ended with him in a black Krypton suit and calling superman brother while floating in the sky.

No word if he is Zod or someone else

[ZariusTwo]

This show actually has twists nobody sees coming. How is that humanly possible on either the CW or the age of the internet!:o

[Autbot_Benz]

This show actually has twists nobody sees coming. How is that humanly possible on either the CW or the age of the internet!:o

Agreed and I love it.

[Andrew NDB]

I really wonder why John Henry Irons hasn't gotten a lot more love these years. And to state the obvious... he's an original black superhero. And hey, instead of making Superman black in the Abrams produced thing coming up, why not put Ta-Nehisi Racist Coates to work on a new John Henry Irons movie?

If the message is, "Black superheroes can be just as popular as 'white' (even alien ones, from other worlds) superheroes... but just not on their own. They have to replace a white character, then they can be just as popular," that is a truly bizarre message. In fact, I don't see how it doesn't seem plainly obvious they're shooting themselves in the foot from the get go on it.

[Leo656]

Y'know, since they've already had Superman's death onscreen in BvS, they could very easily do a "Steel" movie set in the same movie universe without having to tinker with very much at all.

It would be very easy to do. The movie could start shortly after Superman's onscreen death; pick up John Henry Irons as one of the mourners. He could have been one of the weapons contractors working for LexCorp until he had a change of heart. Flashback scene showing him being rescued by Superman at some point in the recent past, setting him up as his "inspiration". Pick up the plotline in the Present Day with some of his abandoned weapons tech getting out and into the wrong hands, and him deciding to try and pick up where Superman left off to try and stop it. Show him doing the deal over a period of weeks or months; you could even have Amy Adams do a Lois cameo. At the end, he gets the weapons off the streets and stops whoever the Big Bad of the movie is, and by this point Superman has come back to life so Irons contemplates retiring, figuring he's fulfilled his promise to Superman that he would "make his life count for something" and that there's no need to keep going out as Steel. But then Superman himself comes to him and thanks him for taking care of Metropolis while he was "away", and encourages him to keep fighting the good fight because "We can always use more help." Superman and Steel establish their partnership, the movie ends, and WB now has a ready-made, Superman-adjacent franchise that ostensibly would appeal to the "minority" demographic that the Black Superman project is aiming for, but in a much more organic and less insulting way.

I mean, that's it, right there. I just did all the work short of coming up with the villain, but I mean that's the "Steel" movie right there and it fits in so perfectly with the movies they've already done that doing it any other way would honestly be more work than necessary.

The only reasons I can figure why Steel doesn't get more of a push, is that 1. He's more less just "Black Iron Man" (somewhat valid criticism), and 2. He's too closely linked to the 1990s, and disregarding that entire decade at all costs in favor of Literally Everything But That has more or less been unspoken policy at DC ever since guys like Geoff Johns and Mark Waid started getting more power around 2005 or so.

[Andrew NDB]

Y'know, since they've already had Superman's death onscreen in BvS, they could very easily do a "Steel" movie set in the same movie universe without having to tinker with very much at all.

It would be very easy to do. The movie could start shortly after Superman's onscreen death; pick up John Henry Irons as one of the mourners. He could have been one of the weapons contractors working for LexCorp until he had a change of heart. Flashback scene showing him being rescued by Superman at some point in the recent past, setting him up as his "inspiration". Pick up the plotline in the Present Day with some of his abandoned weapons tech getting out and into the wrong hands, and him deciding to try and pick up where Superman left off to try and stop it. Show him doing the deal over a period of weeks or months; you could even have Amy Adams do a Lois cameo. At the end, he gets the weapons off the streets and stops whoever the Big Bad of the movie is, and by this point Superman has come back to life so Irons contemplates retiring, figuring he's fulfilled his promise to Superman that he would "make his life count for something" and that there's no need to keep going out as Steel. But then Superman himself comes to him and thanks him for taking care of Metropolis while he was "away", and encourages him to keep fighting the good fight because "We can always use more help." Superman and Steel establish their partnership, the movie ends, and WB now has a ready-made, Superman-adjacent franchise that ostensibly would appeal to the "minority" demographic that the Black Superman project is aiming for, but in a much more organic and less insulting way.

I mean, that's it, right there. I just did all the work short of coming up with the villain, but I mean that's the "Steel" movie right there and it fits in so perfectly with the movies they've already done that doing it any other way would honestly be more work than necessary.

That'd work.

The only reasons I can figure why Steel doesn't get more of a push, is that 1. He's more less just "Black Iron Man" (somewhat valid criticism), and 2. He's too closely linked to the 1990s, and disregarding that entire decade at all costs in favor of Literally Everything But That has more or less been unspoken policy at DC ever since guys like Geoff Johns and Mark Waid started getting more power around 2005 or so.

Geoff doesn't have any power anymore and hasn't for a while now. And Waid... I don't think Waid even had any power by 2005. He was ostracized, and largely had it out for Geoff on the way out.

I'm caught up with Superman & Lois. Suffice to say, all of my fears have been proven wrong so far... this show is great. Suspenseful, exciting, fresh. It feels like the first season of Arrow or Flash, but maybe better.

[Leo656]

It's less about "power" power and whether or not they got along or whatever, but right when DC was having its big "resurgence" before and after Infinite Crisis, Waid and Johns were writing a ton of the more prominent DC material AND they both had a big Nostalgia Boner for the Silver Age. And a lot of what either of them wrote was designed to turn the clock back before the 1990s happened. Geoff was a little more flexible but if Waid had his way everything would have been Super-Friends.

They were both very similar in that way, and it was all coming out at the same time.

[Autbot_Benz]

Morgan Edge is not Zod he is Tar-Ro son of Lara and Zeta-Ro hence they are half brothers

[Andrew NDB]

Latest episode was badass.

[Andrew NDB]

Uh oh.... it finally happened. After a quaint enough beginning to show Superman's earliest days it quickly becomes about Lois complaining about how no one wants to cover her stories about systemic racism. The bad guy turns out to be a white supremist going around torching minorities and Superman refused to say "truth, justice, and the American way."

[mrmaczaps]

Its a CW Supes show. Just when you thought it couldn't get worse, it does...

I expected it. Superpowered Morgan Edge. Lol. The Eradicator is a giant iron lung looking thing. Wtf. Turning humans into Kryptonians is garbage on the level of Smallville's kryptonite turning humans into super people. JHI wanting to kill Supes. Even Crisis making "one" world after yet there is still a multiverse.

There are red flags all over this show. I haven't kept up with Supes comics but I could still write better than this thing... And I'm not a writer.

[Autbot_Benz]

Uh oh.... it finally happened. After a quaint enough beginning to show Superman's earliest days it quickly becomes about Lois complaining about how no one wants to cover her stories about systemic racism. The bad guy turns out to be a white supremist going around torching minorities and Superman refused to say "truth, justice, and the American way."

To be fair that fight with the Neo Nazi was straight from Superman vs the Ku Klux Klan comic

https://i.imgur.com/70KCBOG.jpg

[mrmaczaps]

To be fair that fight with the Neo Nazi was straight from Superman vs the Ku Klux Klan comic

https://i.imgur.com/70KCBOG.jpg

Superman knocking the teeth out of socialist. Gotta love it.

[ZariusTwo]

Its a CW Supes show. Just when you thought it couldn't get worse, it does...

You're in the minority. Most people dig this show.

[Andrew NDB]

To be fair that fight with the Neo Nazi was straight from Superman vs the Ku Klux Klan comic

https://i.imgur.com/70KCBOG.jpg

OK, that's fair... but you have Superman's 80 years worth of rogues gallery to draw upon and these writers specifically wanted to make a story about a white supremist (complete with Lois snarling about systemic racism?)? From a specific comic that suspiciously came out 3 years into Trump?

It isn't sinking the ship for me, it just kind of is showing where these writers' heads are at. Maybe this was just a one off thing.

[mrmaczaps]

You're in the minority. Most people dig this show.

Most people are stupid. What's your point? I'm always in the minority. I lived & breathed all things Superman from 1990 til 2011. Comics, movies... Lois & Superman is worse than Smallville...

[Andrew NDB]

Lois & Superman is worse than Smallville...

What? I couldn't even make it more than 3 or 4 episodes into Smallville.

[Jester]

Most people are stupid. What's your point? I'm always in the minority. I lived & breathed all things Superman from 1990 til 2011. Comics, movies... Lois & Superman is worse than Smallville...

https://gregsimonmusic.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/children-who-are-wrong.jpg

[mrmaczaps]

https://gregsimonmusic.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/children-who-are-wrong.jpg

Kids today, you could sh!t in a box, slap the letters tmnt on it, freeze dry it and they'd probably buy it. Does that make it a great tmnt line of merch?

[Leo656]

Just to play Devil's Advocate, while lots of "fans" do love it, not everyone does. The guy who reviews it for the Superman website has been hating on it pretty hard since the third episode or so, going to great lengths to point out the overwhelming number of plot holes, inconsistencies, out-of-character moments and just plain "Sh*tty Writing Hidden Behind 'OMG That's So Cool!' Fanservice Stuff" that's all over this show.

To be blunt, I find Neal Bailey's review style practically unreadable in how over-the-top combative and mean-spirited it is and how whether it's TV, movies, or comics, he generally sh*ts on anything but the Chris Reeve iteration of Superman. I figured out a long time ago that he approaches every Superman project he reviews from the perspective of the disgruntled writer who swears that only HE knows how to write the Superman character properly, and is dripping with bitterness over not having the chance. It does cast a shadow over everything he reviews, especially when he makes comments within the reviews such as "I'm not saying I could write this show better (even though I definitely could!)...."

BUT, on the off chance a person can manage to slog through one of Neal's novella-length episode reviews and ignore all the "jokes" that don't land, self-worship, Snyder movie bashing, and focus just on his critiques about the show's actual WRITING, and all the plot holes and Idiot Plot and narrative inconsistencies and whatnot... then yeah, he makes some pretty ironclad arguments about how terribly-written the show is. I'm by no means a "fan" of his work, but when you're right you're right.

I wouldn't say it's AS bad as "Smallville" - few things are THAT bad - but they do have a lot of the same problems. Like fan-wank moments covering up the (at times) horrible writing, and people supposed to just roll over for it because "C'mon, it's a super-hero show, it ain't Shakespeare!" It doesn't have to be, but it should at least have the consistency to illustrate or explain how sometimes Clark can randomly hear a robbery in progress in flippin' Mexico but yet other times doesn't notice things going on in the very next room. Just for example.

Anyways. I think people are generally just starved for Superman content. Show started pretty good, got bad pretty fast. I don't think the CW network is capable of doing a truly great super-hero show. They just don't have the writers for that task, although they do like to spend money where appropriate, which is nice. For me, going all the way back to "Smallville" none of the special effects in any of their super-hero shows was enough to make up for the atrocious writing so many of them have had, and continue to have.

I dip in and out of this one but I think at most I'll pick up the DVDs when I find them cheap.

[Coola Yagami]

I dip in and out of this one but I think at most I'll pick up the DVDs when I find them cheap.

I mean, I'm sure the DVDs would make for fine coasters at least.

[mrmaczaps]

Just to play Devil's Advocate, while lots of "fans" do love it, not everyone does. The guy who reviews it for the Superman website has been hating on it pretty hard since the third episode or so, going to great lengths to point out the overwhelming number of plot holes, inconsistencies, out-of-character moments and just plain "Sh*tty Writing Hidden Behind 'OMG That's So Cool!' Fanservice Stuff" that's all over this show.

To be blunt, I find Neal Bailey's review style practically unreadable in how over-the-top combative and mean-spirited it is and how whether it's TV, movies, or comics, he generally sh*ts on anything but the Chris Reeve iteration of Superman. I figured out a long time ago that he approaches every Superman project he reviews from the perspective of the disgruntled writer who swears that only HE knows how to write the Superman character properly, and is dripping with bitterness over not having the chance. It does cast a shadow over everything he reviews, especially when he makes comments within the reviews such as "I'm not saying I could write this show better (even though I definitely could!)...."

BUT, on the off chance a person can manage to slog through one of Neal's novella-length episode reviews and ignore all the "jokes" that don't land, self-worship, Snyder movie bashing, and focus just on his critiques about the show's actual WRITING, and all the plot holes and Idiot Plot and narrative inconsistencies and whatnot... then yeah, he makes some pretty ironclad arguments about how terribly-written the show is. I'm by no means a "fan" of his work, but when you're right you're right.

I wouldn't say it's AS bad as "Smallville" - few things are THAT bad - but they do have a lot of the same problems. Like fan-wank moments covering up the (at times) horrible writing, and people supposed to just roll over for it because "C'mon, it's a super-hero show, it ain't Shakespeare!" It doesn't have to be, but it should at least have the consistency to illustrate or explain how sometimes Clark can randomly hear a robbery in progress in flippin' Mexico but yet other times doesn't notice things going on in the very next room. Just for example.

Anyways. I think people are generally just starved for Superman content. Show started pretty good, got bad pretty fast. I don't think the CW network is capable of doing a truly great super-hero show. They just don't have the writers for that task, although they do like to spend money where appropriate, which is nice. For me, going all the way back to "Smallville" none of the special effects in any of their super-hero shows was enough to make up for the atrocious writing so many of them have had, and continue to have.

I dip in and out of this one but I think at most I'll pick up the DVDs when I find them cheap.

Is that the Superman Homepage guy? I used to go there all the time to read reviews & stuff when I was regularly reading the Superman comics. Not too much since those days, a decade or so ago... i stuck with Supes from '91 to 2011 and own at least most of the 70s and 80s stories/comics... CW definitely sucks with writing. Too busy quota filling...

[Leo656]

Yeah, it is. He's pretty bitter, but occasionally makes some valid points. He "took a break" from the franchise for a few years after New 52 but it seems they got him back to review this show.

He's a dick, though. He's also an Admin, and last week he legit threatened to ban someone essentially for saying he liked the Snyder movies. Like, in his reviews and the Comments on said reviews, he constantly bashes "Man of Steel" (whether anyone brings it up or not), and someone asked him if he hated this show or MoS more, so he said "I'd still rather watch this show than MoS, MoS is terrible", and then another user was like "Well, I'd rather watch MoS every day than ever watch this show again," or something like that. So Neal was like "Go watch it, then, and if you Comment on any of my posts ever again I'm going to ban you from this site for harassing an Admin." :roll:

So yeah, not a fan of Neal The Guy at all. BUT, occasionally he makes a good point from a writing perspective.

[AquaParade]

Curious to see this, but I feel like after seeing Man of Steel so many times, I’ll have a hard time getting into the lower budget production.

[Leo656]

They ripped off countless shots from MoS (and "Superman Returns") in the pilot episode. Even some cinematography and framing and stuff. I only dip in and out so I'm not sure if they kept doing it but it was very noticeable in the first episode.

It was like every time they showed Superman doing anything, they ripped a shot from a movie. If you made it a drinking game you'd be passed out 2/3s of the way through.

[ssjup81]

I like this show. It's pretty cool seeing Lois and Clark in a family setting and all that goes on with that. I've never been a big fan of Superman in general, but am digging this iteration. He's so dorky and I like dorky characters. The story is okay for me as well and am curious where things will go given that whole brother angle going on. Next newer ep comes out in July.

I think this is the first Superman-related thing I've semi-gotten interested in since the 90s. I used to watch Lois & Clark back then and sometimes Superman TAS (but I preferred Batman TAS and would only watch Superman out of boredom if nothing else was on). Going a bit further back in my childhood, I liked the old Fleischer Superman shorts, the 1978 Reeves Superman films (well, I liked the first two), and sometimes watched reruns of the Adventures of Superman. Comics wise, I never could get into them so much. I've come across them. Kept up with some of the lore, but not enough to be an expert or anything.

I guess since I'm very very casual, this is why I don't mind this show so much. I never saw Smallville or the more recent Superman films (didn't draw me in). I know my father hated Smallville, though. Not sure why. I think he mentioned not liking the writing so much.

[Leo656]

If "competent writing" is a thing that a person values in ANY way, shape, or form, then that person indeed most likely hates "Smallville".

If the phrase "Idiot Plot" weren't already a thing, someone would have had to invent it just for that show.

[ZariusTwo]

The show has been nominated for best dramatic network series at the Hollywood Critics Association TV awards

https://twitter.com/HCAcritics/status/1413190330682277891

[Autbot_Benz]

Another great Episode. Superman fights Zod's mind inside him with the help of John Henry Irons

Also love the Steel Suit if that suit is it. Also Superman and Steel team up against Tal roh was cool

[Leo656]

Gotta love sh*t like this. :roll:

https://www.supermanhomepage.com/superman-lois-review-s01e12-through-the-valley-of-death/

Nevermind the never-ending holier-than-thou slog that is the actual review. Seriously, if ANY of you people sincerely think that I'M an insufferable know-it-all, by all means read literally ANY review of ANYTHING by Neal Bailey. He takes "I'm the only person who knows anything" to Zen Master levels. Even when his points are correct, he's such a smug prick you don't even care.

But the gem is this exchange in the Comments section between him and a user:

delbhoy
July 15, 2021 11:12 am
There are superman fans all over the world who come on this site to read about SUPERMAN. I am from Scotland and have been a member of this site for many years and I enjoy reading about movies, TV and interviews with cast members past and present.
What I am not interested in is when people like you use a platform about a TV episode to start airing your political views and acting out your own self importance.
Why don’t you find a site where everyone thinks they’re American political experts and spout your bs on there and keep this superman site about superman and genuine fans!!!

neal bailey
July 15, 2021 6:37 pm
Reply to delbhoy
I don’t frankly give a crap what you come here for, with an attitude like that.

Everything is political and politics suffuse how we regard things. I invite you not to read my review and bug off if something deeper than “It rocks!” or “It sucks” proves too much for your Pampers to handle. No one is forcing you to read my work, and I’d prefer people with your perspective didn’t.

You pay nothing for it, you have no say over it, and you don’t get to tell other people how they say things or why on this site.

If you don’t like that, tough. You’re barking up the wrong tree.


Would it shock you to know that in almost everything he reviews, Neal finds a way to mention that he emigrated to Canada because of Trump and how everything there is So Much Better than in America? It shouldn't. What it has to do with Superman, I don't know, but he generally works it in there regardless.

He's also an Admin. Couple weeks ago he legit threatened to Ban someone for asking him to tone down the pathological Snyder-bashing he also crams into everything he writes even when it's apropos of nothing.

"Tolerant Left." Agree with me or Get F*cked. Like what I say or I'll ban you.

Gotta say, with Admins like THAT I'm genuinely glad this place is such a free-for-all. People like that don't deserve positions of power. They barely deserve a soapbox to begin with.

[IMJ]

Gotta say, with Admins like THAT I'm genuinely glad this place is such a free-for-all.

It didn't used to be like that though man. It really only got better when that group of posters sort of got together and said enough was enough and stopped backing down to the sub-intellectual leftist-juggernaut that was widely the Technodrome.

And thankfully there is a site owner here who was smart enough to see the ludicrous nature of what was going on, regardless of his political opinions - I developed a lot of respect for that guy when you-know-who was denounced. We lived it here. It could have gone in another direction completely, if say the guy in your post there was running the 'Drome.

And so it's not that we had a "political" victory here - we had an "intellectual" victory from higher on up regarding the truth of what these boards had become at the time. Now at least, it's more centered because centered people don't have to stretch so far right to counter the leftist-cult-insanity here.

As for Superman? I still haven't seen it after being condition for years by the CW. The girl who plays Lois is like way-sophisticated-gorgeous though. I always thought that Superman-guy was CW-diversity-Superman.

[Leo656]

Those People are apparently much happier in the confines of their Twitter Echo Chambers, so good for them and good for us ACTUAL "tolerant and moderate" people for no longer having to deal with it.

I just can't believe such a scumbag has such authority on the Superman page. I barely even go there anymore because of that kinda sh*t. I haven't even had an account there in ages, but if I did I'd surely get Banned because no way I could resist the temptation to rip the guy a new ass.

He was always insufferable even back when he did the comic book reviews, but he's gotten worse it seems. He "quit the fandom" and stopped writing for the website after "Man of Steel" came out, because he "couldn't stand to watch the character be perverted to such a degree" or some nonsense. But since he used to review "Smallville" they apparently talked him into coming back to review this new show, so we get to deal with him again. Joy.

He was always 100% spot-on about "Smallville" being a worthless trash fire, though; I can give him that one. And most of his observations about this show are accurate, as well. But like I said, he's SUCH an asshole that who even gives a sh*t?

I guess me reading His Sh*t is a lot like how people here read My Sh*t. :lol: He's definitely way beyond me, though. Like holy sh*t.

I dip in and out of this show. It has some things going for it but one thing Neal is correct about is that it mostly runs on "Idiot Plot" to get by, with lots of fanservice to cover up how many things just plain don't make any goddamn sense. It's good by CW standards but it's got a lot of problems.

[Autbot_Benz]

Tal Ro is becoming The Eradicator he absorbed the remaining Kryptonian soles into his body and at the end of the episode he was absorbing the Sun's energy

[Autbot_Benz]

Decent Season Finale

wonder which Superman Villain will show up in Season 2. I hope Lex Luthor shows up eventually

[Andrew NDB]

So while it's not a confirmation in and of itself... that DC is making Jon Kent into a gay in the comics... that kind of means they would make that company-wide.

https://thehill.com/changing-america/enrichment/arts-culture/569376-in-shocking-twist-on-iconic-character-superman

Season 2 of "Superman & Lois," Jon Kent starts dating dudes. Watch.

[Autbot_Benz]

Teen Wolf alum Ian Bohen is set for a multi-episode arc on the upcoming second season of CW’s Superman & Lois.

Bohen will play Lt. Mitch Anderson, the metaphorical “new sheriff in town” at the DOD. His worldview divides into two types – those you serve and those who serve you. He doesn’t like that Superman exists outside that paradigm and tries to bring the Man of Steel under his authority officially.

https://deadline.com/2021/10/superman-lois-ian-bohen-season-2-cw-series-recurring-1234847008/

[Andrew NDB]

Yeah... not looking good for Jon Kent at all.

https://komonews.com/news/entertainment/dc-comics-announces-new-superman-jon-kent-is-bisexual-in-upcoming-comic

[mrmaczaps]

Not much bold or new about making yet another straight dude into a gay man. Pandering at its (worlds) finest...

[ZariusTwo]

I see this as a win for the show, given they had the genius to give us two brothers, they can afford to experiment with one of them while the other is straight

[Andrew NDB]

I see this as a win for the show, given they had the genius to give us two brothers, they can afford to experiment with one of them while the other is straight

Yeah, they can do whatever they want now. Time to tune out.

[ZariusTwo]

Yeah, they can do whatever they want now. Time to tune out.

Not necessarily, this show fired all it's woke writers remember? I'd trust them with this. Woke is only a problem due to the bad writing, it's not a problem in it's own right.

[Andrew NDB]

Not necessarily, this show fired all it's woke writers remember? I'd trust them with this. Woke is only a problem due to the bad writing, it's not a problem in it's own right.

I don't imagine anyone on "Superman & Lois" has the power to tell WB, "Sorry, WB, we know you guys want Jon Kent to be gay in the comics and for it to be like this big thing but we're not doing that on this show." No, it's still going to end up being something like, "Jon Kent must come to terms with his homosexuality in a town rife with homophobia -- Smallville!" Whether they're bullied into doing it or not.

[ZariusTwo]

Djouliet Amara joins the cast as a Smallville high student with secrets

https://deadline.com/2021/10/superman-lois-djouliet-amara-season-2-cast-cw-series-1234856026/

[ZariusTwo]

Jon Kent's actor reacts to the recent announcement his comic book version will be Bi-Sexual. Insists his interpretation is straight.

https://thegeekiary.com/jon-kent-came-out-as-bisexual-superman-lois-actor-jordan-elsass-is-already-panicking/101554

[Vegita-San]

"I don’t know if Elsass realizes this, but continuing to portray a canon queer character as “straight” or ignoring a canon queer character’s sexuality falls under the definition of Straightwashing. "

where do you even begin with this nonsense? So, what's it called when they change a character that's been straight for 60 + years? 'normalizing?' sigh..

[Andrew NDB]

Jon Kent's actor reacts to the recent announcement his comic book version will be Bi-Sexual. Insists his interpretation is straight.

Well, it will be until they tell him it won't be. Which will be soon.

[ssjup81]

I thought Jon Kent's character wasn't all that old comic wise. Shows how little I know. So the character is bi, now. *shrugs* I guess I don't feel one way or another about it.Jon Kent's actor reacts to the recent announcement his comic book version will be Bi-Sexual. Insists his interpretation is straight.

https://thegeekiary.com/jon-kent-came-out-as-bisexual-superman-lois-actor-jordan-elsass-is-already-panicking/101554Well, it will be until they tell him it won't be. Which will be soon.This made me think of Rupert Grint from the Harry Potter films. He said somewhere around the third film, that he hoped that in the books, Ron's character would get killed out because he didn't want to have to kiss Emma Watson since it was obvious that the books were headed in that direction (Ron x Hermione), especially after book 4. He mainly said that because he viewed Emma like a younger sister and kissing your sister would definitely be weird. I know, not fully the same, but as mentioned, it just made me think of it.

[Andrew NDB]

So the character is bi, now. *shrugs* I guess I don't feel one way or another about it.

I guess neither does he! :lol:

[Leo656]

I should be able to sue the guy who wrote that article for damages, on account of my eyes are now damaged from rolling them every five seconds while trying to read his nonsense.

[Autbot_Benz]

The actress who played Lucy Lane in S1 of Supergirl is coming to Superman and Lois in the second season

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/jenna-dewan-supergirl-superman-lois-1235039112/

[IMJ]

The network will force that kid to be a gay character and when he pushes back they'll recast him.

[ZariusTwo]

Season two premieres January 11th, followed immediately by the premiere of Bendis' creation Naomi

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/cw-midseason-2022-premiere-dates-1235043201/

[Autbot_Benz]

Kimberly Hart herself Amy Jo Johnson is directing an episode of Season 2

Amy Jo Johnson
@_amyjojohnson
·
1m
I'm buzzing with gratitude. Thank you
@cwsupermanlois

@WBHomeEnt

@GBerlanti
for letting this scrappy indie filmmaker direct with such a beautiful well-oiled machine (team).
The support as I learn the curve has been incredible!.#supermanandlois

https://i.imgur.com/gkfsY42.jpg

[ZariusTwo]

Well, it will be until they tell him it won't be. Which will be soon.

GtU6lx9VlwQ

(0: 49)

You were saying?

[Andrew NDB]

GtU6lx9VlwQ

(0: 49)

You were saying?

Mark my words. It's coming.

[Autbot_Benz]

Good Season Opener. The new superman suit looks good. The episode ended with a doomsday tease
Yes Doomsday is coming

https://ew.com/tv/superman-and-lois-season-2-premiere-doomsday-tease/?utm_campaign=entertainmentweekly_entertainmentwee kly&utm_content=new&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_term=61de36bcad72e20001e4a5ca

Superman & Lois showrunner Todd Helbing confirmed to EW that scene was indeed setting up the arrival of Doomsday, one of Superman's deadliest and most destructive foes in the comics.

[ZariusTwo]

Mark my words. It's coming.

It did, but not with the character you were expecting

It's Sarah Cushing, Lana's daughter and Jordan's girlfriend, that's bi-sexual

[Autbot_Benz]

Episode 3 next week will give us Doomsday's full reveal

[Autbot_Benz]

Todd Helbing the Showrunner talks about the comics making Jon Bisexual and if they will do it on the show

"We're certainly not opposed to exploring it," Helbing said. "But the way our character was set up, it feels like the comic book story and what we're doing are two separate stories. I don't think that we will, but we're certainly not opposed to it."

https://comicbook.com/dc/news/superman-lois-showrunner-reveals-if-the-series-will-follow-dcs-major-jonathan-kent-storyline/

[ZariusTwo]

A kindly way of saying "We don't want to piss off the gays, but yeah, we're totally gonna piss off the gays"

[Andrew NDB]

He might as well say "It's happening." Because there will be a push from above, guaranteed.

[ZariusTwo]

He might as well say "It's happening." Because there will be a push from above, guaranteed.

Or maybe they gave the bi-sexual angle to an (gasp) original character as a means of appeasing them?

[Andrew NDB]

Saw the last 2 episodes of season 1 I hadn't gotten around to watching finally.

Credit where it is due. Solid. This felt like a movie. Very well done and what they did with Steel near the end there was effective. I had doubts and worries about where a Superman and sons series might go in 2021... so it's a pleasant surprise.

They need to put everyone creatively involved in this show in charge of everything CW. I'm still skeptical where this show may be forcibly pushed into season 2 and beyond... but if these guys have earned enough clout to be left alone, I'm good.

[AquaParade]

I am tempted to check this out but I've never enjoyed a CW-esque DC television series in my life. And that's putting it nicely.

I know I can't expect it to be as great as Man of Steel, especially in terms of budget and visuals, but...is it anywhere near as good? Or is it just another Arrow, Flash, etc?

[Autbot_Benz]

Saw the last 2 episodes of season 1 I hadn't gotten around to watching finally.

Credit where it is due. Solid. This felt like a movie. Very well done and what they did with Steel near the end there was effective. I had doubts and worries about where a Superman and sons series might go in 2021... so it's a pleasant surprise.

They need to put everyone creatively involved in this show in charge of everything CW. I'm still skeptical where this show may be forcibly pushed into season 2 and beyond... but if these guys have earned enough clout to be left alone, I'm good.

The Showrunner on this show is Todd Helbing. He was Showrunner on the good seasons of The Flash back in the day.

[Andrew NDB]

The Showrunner on this show is Todd Helbing. He was Showrunner on the good seasons of The Flash back in the day.

Ah. Well then this all makes perfect sense.

[Leo656]

I am tempted to check this out but I've never enjoyed a CW-esque DC television series in my life. And that's putting it nicely.

I know I can't expect it to be as great as Man of Steel, especially in terms of budget and visuals, but...is it anywhere near as good? Or is it just another Arrow, Flash, etc?

I only saw the first couple episodes before getting too busy to keep up with it. What I saw was pretty good. Although the entire angle of Clark struggling to raise two teenagers back home in Smallville isn't anything I ever asked for or especially wanted, the premise is intriguing and out of the gate they seemed to be handling it well.

I hated Tyler as Superman on the Supergirl show, but he's much better here. It's amazing what better writing and costume design can do. I think the "metrosexual" haircut and perpetual beard stubble is a strange look for the character but it's whatever. Very rare to see a Dad of two teenagers looking like a college-aged Starbucks barista, but eh. CW.

The first episode, at least, had lots of Easter eggs and it definitely looks like the writers are fairly reverent of the mythos. Visually, they "borrow" from MoS and "Superman Returns" HARD in the pilot; there's multiple shots that are staged almost 1:1 identically and it's not "bad" by any means it's just so deliberate that it's impossible to miss.

Do not like Lois. Too skinny and she's not attractive. I know looks aren't everything, but in my way of thinking a guy who can get any woman he wants should end up with someone a bit above-average, otherwise it just isn't believable. It's obvious they cast the Lois actor based on her resemblance to Margot Kidder, but I hated Kidder's Lois so to me that was a misfire.

I can't really speak to the writing, sadly. First couple episodes were fine. Finding decent and unbiased reviews of the show is nearly impossible. Superman fans tend to gush and overrate any TV show he's involved in just because he never gets one, and professional critics gush about anything CW even though most of their output is trash. The guy who did the reviews for Superman Homepage was very much in the middle on the show, but his reviews are unreadable. They're novel-length rants (WAY worse than mine, I swear!) where he spends 2/3s of the text insulting the Snyder movies and anyone who likes them, ranting about how "deranged Trumpers" are to blame for all of society's ills, chastising people in America for not moving to Canada like he did, and in-between he ties it all in with Superman, kinda. So there's SOME insight into the show in his "reviews" but good luck finding any.

Having taken the time to sift through most of his "reviews" (God help me), it appears that consistency is a huge problem on this show. Lots of "idiot plot" stuff going on, where entire scenes (or even episodes) could easily be avoided by two characters having a conversation. Or worse, inconsistent use of Superman's powers, such as in one early episode where Clark can't manage to hear something going across town yet magically picks up on a crisis situation in Mexico happening at the exact same time, simply because the plot demands it. Some people don't mind things like that but they always rather bug me.

I recommend at least checking out the pilot and seeing if it's worth sticking with. I'm most likely going to pick up the DVDs and catch up that way. The little bit I saw was better than I expected but I've also seen/read things that are less-good.

[Andrew NDB]

Oh jeeze. Episode 2 of season 2 and already a lesbian drama around Jordan Kent's girlfriend.

But yes, it seems like... maybe... a proper Doomsday is emerging.

[Autbot_Benz]

Well Doomsday didn't Debut it was a misdrect and actually Bizzaro instead. Superman and him are kind of linked via those headaches Superman gets

https://i.imgur.com/cOAnTsb.jpg

[ZariusTwo]

Oh jeeze. Episode 2 of season 2 and already a lesbian drama around Jordan Kent's girlfriend.

So what? It's with an original character, not the Kents. Gay people exist, stop looking for your woke boogeymen

I'm not even saying this because I've suddenly 'gone woke', but you lot are going after anything that has the slightest SHRED of diverse drama in it and assuming it means something is betraying you. Enough. Don't like that bit? Tune out. It's a sub-plot and has no bearing on the core story.

[Coola Yagami]

So what? It's with an original character, not the Kents. Gay people exist, stop looking for your woke boogeymen

I'm not even saying this because I've suddenly 'gone woke', but you lot are going after anything that has the slightest SHRED of diverse drama in it and assuming it means something is betraying you. Enough. Don't like that bit? Tune out. It's a sub-plot and has no bearing on the core story.

True but Superman was never about lesbian drama. That is like, the last possible thing you would ever think of when thinking about superman. How bout just stick to him fighting bad guys?

[Vegita-San]

Episode 3 next week will give us Doomsday's full reveal

And we get to learn his pronouns!

JOY!

[Autbot_Benz]

And we get to learn his pronouns!

JOY!

WTF are you talking about?

[Andrew NDB]

So what? It's with an original character, not the Kents. Gay people exist, stop looking for your woke boogeymen

I'm not even saying this because I've suddenly 'gone woke', but you lot are going after anything that has the slightest SHRED of diverse drama in it and assuming it means something is betraying you. Enough. Don't like that bit? Tune out. It's a sub-plot and has no bearing on the core story.

No. Not enough. And it's not about trace elements, it's about pulling at a thread and revealing a bigger picture. A bigger woke picture. We know this because this is what happens to all CW shows, sooner or later. Usually sooner. Jordan's girlfriend shared a kiss with another girl and that's that, no big deal, right? Yes, big deal. They didn't do that for no reason. Next will be her questioning her sexuality and a love triangle forming, that in itself probably taking up huge blocks of time on the show for the lesbian melodrama (blocks of time that could otherwise be occupied with, you know, Superman doing Superman stuff) which will surely end up with her getting with the girl triumphantly.

And no, I don't think we should be tripping over lesbians and transexuals in Kansas. This isn't about representation, this becomes immediately about over-representation... which is, in fact, misrepresentation.

Just leave this **** out of the arts, I say. Most of us are sick of it, and many merely grit their teeth and tolerate it. Enough is enough.

True but Superman was never about lesbian drama. That is like, the last possible thing you would ever think of when thinking about superman.

Guaranteed that's what awaits us. Next will be her questioning her sexuality, her pretending to still be straight, yet looking longingly at Steel's daughter in slow-mo shots while walking with Jordan until she comes to terms with her lesbianism and runs to her crying, they kiss again, etc., blah blah blah. We've seen this done a million times. It wasn't needed on this show.

[Coola Yagami]

These people need to make their own shows about gay superheroes and whatever and just go all out. No one cares about 'real life drama' in a superhero show anyway. The only drama that needs to apply is superhero drama, the hero feeling angst about having to hide his identity, or because they couldn't save the life of that one person, or maybe the villain said something that cut deep, or even someone still not getting over their parents murder. THAT kind of drama. Not SJW drama that should be in another show like Riverdale or something.

Just make your own shows. If they're actually any good and not SJW trash like Q-Force, the people will come and you'll get positive representation that way.