Issue #149 preview and discussion

[TigerClaw]

Here's a preview for issue 149, It contains a huge spoiler.
https://screenrant.com/tmnt-149-preview-teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-armaggon/

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[lonewarrior20]

Man, it's gotten so timey whimy I'm almost expecting the Docter to just pop up.

[Andrew NDB]

Leo is crying there because someone got unmutated? Why is that cry-worthy?

[Cowabung-Gal]

Leo is crying there because someone got unmutated? Why is that cry-worthy?

Campbell logic. It’s like watching Steven Universe: full of cutesy crybaby characters

[CyberCubed]

What on earth? So that Lita kid got changed back to a human and Leonardo is mad? What is Sophie on? This feels like character assassination.

Also as I've said previously, this whole "Evil Bob from the future" thing is honestly so dumb, because his only motive is to be de-mutated back to a human again. Like wtf is going on, why would he join Armaggon and try to erase history just for this.

Sophie's run cannot end soon enough.

[neatoman]

... Oh no! Something that is at the very worst a neutral change has happened to the little girl! Now she won't look like a monster to rest of the world anymore and can integrate with regular society! Maybe she'll get adopted, go to school, get a career, start a family and have a social life outside of a few select weirdos. What a horrible fate!...

**** this. I mean really, just **** this ******** logic, man. There is nothing, literally nothing bad about what happened to Lita here, not a single goddamn thing. Out of all the stupid, horrible, low quality ****** writing decisions made in this series for the past four years this may very well be up there as taking the crown. I'm not joking when I say these pages make me want to scream directly into Mike, Leo, Carmen, April and Koya's ears about how ****ed up their reaction to all of this is.

[TheLabRat]

Not surprised. They did a lot of character assassination on other characters. Making Leo a crybaby is just one of them. Seriously, since he already has such power, why didn't he use it on himself first?

[CyberCubed]

**** this. I mean really, just **** this ******** logic, man. There is nothing, literally nothing bad about what happened to Lita here, not a single goddamn thing. Out of all the stupid, horrible, low quality ****** writing decisions made in this series for the past four years this may very well be up there as taking the crown. I'm not joking when I say these pages make me want to scream directly into Mike, Leo, Carmen, April and Koya's about how ****ed up their reaction to all of this is.

Yeah, if this wasn't Sophie's second to last issue I could have seen this being a good point to drop the book. Thankfully it's almost over.

Leonardo saying, "This is a violation!" literally had me laugh out loud with how moronic that sounded. I think Sophie was trying to do a trans-allegory here or something? But it's generally a baffling thing to write either way given Lita was a human little girl.

[Dangv]

It's wrong to be normal in Campbellverse, duh.

[neatoman]

The only way I can see this moment getting "fixed" is if Lita stays human, is written out of the series for a while and when they reunite, it's turned into a joke where she flips them off, tell them to eat **** for not considering the long term benefits and point out she never wants to see them again for how they reacted.

[Zog The Magnificent]

Seriously. The only way this is a big deal is if it affected one of the uplifted animal mutants, not the LITERAL CHILD WHO IS NOW BACK TO NORMAL. Seriously, what the hell is this?

I guess I shouldn't be surprised. Campbell's stupid run can't end quickly enough.

[hypered1]

I suppose I shouldn't be surprised by the single minded idiocracy here that has completely missed the point of this being Leo's internal rage at failing as a father figure.

[neatoman]

I suppose I shouldn't be surprised by the single minded idiocracy here that has completely missed the point of this being Leo's internal rage at failing as a father figure.

And? Who cares? The intention makes no sense, if he wanted what's best for her then he'd allow her the best possibility for the future. If the intention is just for him to raise her himself instead of letting an adoptive human couple do it, then what he's saying is unbelievably selfish. And keep in mind, if Lita really still wants to live with a bunch of mutated turtles, this changes nothing. Absolutely NOTHING, except her having broader possibilities.

[Cowabung-Gal]

Wait. Is this the author’s way of saying “Protect Trans Kids”, considering Leo’s despair over Lita de-mutating?

[Cloudrunner]

So Lita is trans? I guess that was probably stated somewhere and I just wasn't paying attention.

[Zog The Magnificent]

I suppose I shouldn't be surprised by the single minded idiocracy here that has completely missed the point of this being Leo's internal rage at failing as a father figure.

If Leo's idea of being a good father is selfishly wanting to keep Lita a mutant, instead of doing what's best for her, then the character is beyond f**ked. Lita can still live with them, still be family, but now she's back to normal and can do more things. Demutating is literally the best outcome for her and basically every mutant introduced since mutant town.

But no, apparently we're all idiots, all of us, each of us, every one, because we don't like the stupid and out of character decisions that have been made in this run once again. The real "single minded idiocracy" are the people who mindlessly praise and defend this, and try to shut down any discourse by insisting that anyone who has a different opinion is an idiot.

[neatoman]

If Leo's idea of being a good father is selfishly wanting to keep Lita a mutant, instead of doing what's best for her, then the character is beyond f**ked. Lita can still live with them, still be family, but now she's back to normal and can do more things. Demutating is literally the best outcome for her and basically every mutant introduced since mutant town.

But no, apparently we're all idiots, all of us, each of us, every one, because we don't like the stupid and out of character decisions that have been made in this run once again. The real "single minded idiocracy" are the people who mindlessly praise and defend this, and try to shut down any discourse by insisting that anyone who has a different opinion is an idiot.

Yeah, exactly. **** the way all these characters react here. Even if the actual issue has Lita declare that it's OK and that being turned back into a human fine (and I doubt that is what will happen but let's assume there is enough clarity amongst the writers and editors to realise this reaction from them is stupid), then it still won't change the fact that Lita has plenty to gain and nothing to lose from being turned back into a human. It's not that Leo is "protective" of Lita that is the problem, it's that his first reaction is that this is bad thing when there are literally no logical reasons it would be.

[TheLabRat]

Obviously, this prove once again that they can't even handle bloated side characters. If Lita become mutants again, the damage done to Leo's character will still be there. If she changed back to human forever, that mean everything about future Lita and Band Wars arc is pointless and wasted.

[Chaotix12345]

I think it's less that she was demutated and more that Leo couldn't stop Bob from doing who knows what to her. I mean, a small child just got messed with by a dude serving a time-eating megalodon using powers born of "QNA" science that nobody else there fully understands. Even if Lita wanted to be demutated this whole time, I doubt Leo and the others would trust that to Bob and his crazy powers. Who knows what other effects they could have on her?

[hypered1]

I think it's less that she was demutated and more that Leo couldn't stop Bob from doing who knows what to her. I mean, a small child just got messed with by a dude serving a time-eating megalodon using powers born of "QNA" science that nobody else there fully understands. Even if Lita wanted to be demutated this whole time, I doubt Leo and the others would trust that to Bob and his crazy powers. Who knows what other effects they could have on her?

It's this exactly. Leo's reaction was borne from the heat of the moment, no different than when Splinter snapped the broom in issue #18.
Absolutely he would want what's best for her, but in this instance he's angry at himself for failing to protect a child.
Also let's not forget that Lita was abandoned as a child before she was mutated so literally knows nothing outside of her adoptive mutant family.

[neatoman]

I think it's less that she was demutated and more that Leo couldn't stop Bob from doing who knows what to her. I mean, a small child just got messed with by a dude serving a time-eating megalodon using powers born of "QNA" science that nobody else there fully understands. Even if Lita wanted to be demutated this whole time, I doubt Leo and the others would trust that to Bob and his crazy powers. Who knows what other effects they could have on her?

It's this exactly. Leo's reaction was borne from the heat of the moment, no different than when Splinter snapped the broom in issue #18.
Absolutely he would want what's best for her, but in this instance he's angry at himself for failing to protect a child.
Also let's not forget that Lita was abandoned as a child before she was mutated so literally knows nothing outside of her adoptive mutant family.

This is some backwards, contrived nonsense justification. As far as they can tell, all that happened here is that Lita return to her natural form, which does not have any negative effects on her. She hasn't been harmed, at all, if anything she's arguably healthier. Could there be more going on? Maybe, but these pages give us no reason to think so. And even if we were to accept that Leo's reaction is just a spur of the moment, what's really dumb here is that four other characters react in similar way, intentional or not it just makes it look like Lita being cured is exactly the thing they're not cool with.

And the thing with Splinter is a false equivalence, he calms down and tries to be reasonable the second after he snapped the broom… Nor does he declare someone must die either.

And if you think she needs to be a mutant to still have a role in their lives if really wants that, what's wrong with you?

[TheLabRat]

She wasn't wiped from the timeline, or suffered other worst fate. She just changed back to a human. Lita is still part of family, or she can even go to planet neutrino just like those orphans of Saint Robert's Orphanage. Leo has no reason to be angry and cry like this. Didn't Campbell say that Leo was an adult now? But she still make Leo like a teenager who never really grew up. He is their leader! A elder brother!

[lonewarrior20]

I’m wondering what’s happening with Timestress Lita with this happening. I know things are diverging and right now she’s technically outside of time at the moment but this is clearly going to have ramifications down the road, such as did Bob take anything else from her or from any of the others?

[TigerClaw]

I’m wondering what’s happening with Timestress Lita with this happening. I know things are diverging and right now she’s technically outside of time at the moment but this is clearly going to have ramifications down the road, such as did Bob take anything else from her or from any of the others?
Future Lita and Renet knew the truth about Bob, and those events played out, So whatever happened was meant to happen, And Future Lita is still a turtle.

[CyberCubed]

The cover of issue #150 shows future Lita still as a Turtle, so I guess the timelines are getting split because if kid Lita get turned back into a mutant again after this and she and everyone else is fine with it, that's also going to be stupid.

As said before, normal animals changed into mutants like Old Hob, Leatherhead, Alopex, etc. being de-mutated would be worse for them because they'd go back to being regular animals with no intelligence. But humans changed to mutants being turned human again would be a benefit for 95% of them.

They should find some way to harness this QNA power and somehow broadcast it over all of mutant town to turn everyone back their human, but knowing the writers they'll just ignore that and leave them all as they were. I guess a bunch of humans are content with living the rest of their lives as walking farm animals.

[TigerClaw]

The cover of issue #150 shows future Lita still as a Turtle, so I guess the timelines are getting split because if kid Lita get turned back into a mutant again after this and she and everyone else is fine with it, that's also going to be stupid.

As said before, normal animals changed into mutants like Old Hob, Leatherhead, Alopex, etc. being de-mutated would be worse for them because they'd go back to being regular animals with no intelligence. But humans changed to mutants being turned human again would be a benefit for 95% of them.

They should find some way to harness this QNA power and somehow broadcast it over all of mutant town to turn everyone back their human, but knowing the writers they'll just ignore that and leave them all as they were. I guess a bunch of humans are content with living the rest of their lives as walking farm animals.
Whatever turned Lita back to a human, It was some sort of magic, And we don't know how long that will last, Because Lita's mutation is all genetic, And that is something that can't be change through magic, With magic you could probably create an illusion that someone has changed.

[Bahamut810]

Whatever turned Lita back to a human, It was some sort of magic, And we don't know how long that will last, Because Lita's mutation is all genetic, And that is something that can't be change through magic, With magic you could probably create an illusion that someone has changed.

Have they ever actually said that 'magic' cant change someone's form or genetic makeup? I don't recall that.

[Bahamut810]

That aside...

I guess the new era is going to be restarting the boys' story without the backdrop of being japanese. I guess they will be the boys who grow up as just turtles in a sewer now.

[TigerClaw]

Have they ever actually said that 'magic' cant change someone's form or genetic makeup? I don't recall that.
I dont know if Magic can cause anyone to mutate from a molecular level, I know that magic can have people turn into stuff, But its usually temporary.

This article talks about this upcoming issue, and mentions metaphysical 'QNA'.
https://screenrant.com/tmnt-149-preview-teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-armaggon/
Even if they can, Lita's life will never be the same. A former member of the Splinter Clan who considers Donatello and Leonardo her fathers, Lita was seemingly destined to become a powerful 'Timestress,' charged with safeguarding the timestream. However, the future Lita fans have seen in this role was still a turtle, suggesting that Bob and Armaggon may have just rewritten her life for the worse. Seeing as the damage is done on a temporal level - affecting her metaphysical 'QNA' - there's no way for the brothers to save her .

[TheLabRat]

That aside...

I guess the new era is going to be restarting the boys' story without the backdrop of being japanese. I guess they will be the boys who grow up as just turtles in a sewer now.

I like the reincarnation setting in IDW TMNT, but it was weird the Turtles don’t get to have their own lives. This is actually all about the grudge between Yoshi and Saki, and the other one is about Saiki's past life being related to a dragon god. What about the Turtles? They are nothing, just because they were Yoshi's children in their previous life. It might be interesting if some turtle actually had its own previous life story that wasn't even related to the Foot Clan or Homato family.

[Andrew NDB]

That's true. If we're to take reincarnation as a real thing, if I was a carpenter in a previous life that doesn't mean that I'd be able to instinctively build a house in this one with no training. If my previous life was wiped out from the timeline that'd just mean -- in theory -- if I visit a hypnotist and they probe my past lives I wouldn't be able to say I had a carpenter past life. I've always looked at reincarnation as like the raw component atoms/energy (so to speak) of a soul being recycled, not the person it belonged to itself. The new person would still exist, it'd just mean the raw component atoms/energy would have come from someone or something else.

I've always advocated for the reincarnation angle in IDW. It's interesting and as I've said before, it'd be neat to see on screen and would allow for Feudal Japan flashbacks we wouldn't otherwise get. It's just silly (stupid?) when maybe too much stock is imbued into it with the present lives. The Turtles should still be 100% unique individuals.

[ProphetofGanja]

Seriously. The only way this is a big deal is if it affected one of the uplifted animal mutants, not the LITERAL CHILD WHO IS NOW BACK TO NORMAL. Seriously, what the hell is this?

I guess I shouldn't be surprised. Campbell's stupid run can't end quickly enough.

That, could have been interesting. One of the Turtles' mutant allies suddenly becomes a regular animal again? Interesting. But this? With Leo reacting like that? Nah

That's true. If we're to take reincarnation as a real thing, if I was a carpenter in a previous life that doesn't mean that I'd be able to instinctively build a house in this one with no training. If my previous life was wiped out from the timeline that'd just mean -- in theory -- if I visit a hypnotist and they probe my past lives I wouldn't be able to say I had a carpenter past life. I've always looked at reincarnation as like the raw component atoms/energy (so to speak) of a soul being recycled, not the person it belonged to itself. The new person would still exist, it'd just mean the raw component atoms/energy would have come from someone or something else.

I've always advocated for the reincarnation angle in IDW. It's interesting and as I've said before, it'd be neat to see on screen and would allow for Feudal Japan flashbacks we wouldn't otherwise get. It's just silly (stupid?) when maybe too much stock is imbued into it with the present lives. The Turtles should still be 100% unique individuals.

Yeah the reincarnation angle of this series has been one of the best additions to the TMNT canon and it deserves further exploration

[TheLabRat]

They took some interesting stuff from Leo. At least in this series, he is the most spiritual and the first turtle to learn spiritualism skill from Splinter. He even took the initiative to used astral projection to fight against the Rat King. Give Leo some minor magical abilities actually make sense, since he does the most meditating and astral projecting out of all the turtles. But now, Donnie becomes a time traveling magician who is doomed to become a mad wizard and Venus is some kind of magical frankenstein. This ruin Leo's character development since he's just a teacher at the dojo now.

[Zog The Magnificent]

They took some interesting stuff from Leo. At least in this series, he is the most spiritual and the first turtle to learn spiritualism skill from Splinter. He even took the initiative to used astral projection to fight against the Rat King. Give Leo some minor magical abilities actually make sense, since he does the most meditating and astral projecting out of all the turtles. But now, Donnie becomes a time traveling magician who is doomed to become a mad wizard and Venus is some kind of magical frankenstein. This ruin Leo's character development since he's just a teacher at the dojo now.

For real. Leo was always the "mystical" guy on the team, and then out of nowhere Donnie just became the mystical guy and Leo had a huge part of his character removed. It's not even the first time something like this has happened in this comic. Just to name one, all of Alopex's character traits basically got ported to Jennika, and then Alopex had nothing of value to do.

[Bahamut810]

For real. Leo was always the "mystical" guy on the team, and then out of nowhere Donnie just became the mystical guy and Leo had a huge part of his character removed. It's not even the first time something like this has happened in this comic. Just to name one, all of Alopex's character traits basically got ported to Jennika, and then Alopex had nothing of value to do.

Thats not true, at the drop of a little comfort she immediately became a valley girl.

[Zog The Magnificent]

Thats not true, at the drop of a little comfort she immediately became a valley girl.

Yeah, and all of her previous roles in the story, such as "reformed former member of the Foot Clan," ended up with Jennika. Many things Jennika has been doing is stuff that Alopex should have been doing.

[bjaxx87]

I wonder if that whole Armaggon plot is a way to erase pretty much everything ever happened in IDW TMNT and have a full "soft" reboot for volume 2. I sure wouldn't mind.

I won't get my hopes up, though, since books like TMNT Alpha (showing Hob and Spider-Lindsey on the cover) seem to pick the story up right where we left off.

[TheLabRat]

For real. Leo was always the "mystical" guy on the team, and then out of nowhere Donnie just became the mystical guy and Leo had a huge part of his character removed. It's not even the first time something like this has happened in this comic. Just to name one, all of Alopex's character traits basically got ported to Jennika, and then Alopex had nothing of value to do.
Another worst thing is they tried to push Leo x Koya idea. Let the most disciplined ninja turtle to fall in love with some bloodthirsty murderer? This just make Leo look like a hypocrite.

[Zog The Magnificent]

Another worst thing is they tried to push Leo x Koya idea. Let the most disciplined ninja turtle to fall in love with some bloodthirsty murderer? This just make Leo look like a hypocrite.

Well, the Campbell run has not exactly been a bastion of good writing.

[Cowabung-Gal]

Well, the Campbell run has not exactly been a bastion of good writing.

What are you talking about?! Campbell’s an AMAZING author! One of the very best! No, scratch that: Campbell IS the best! Waltz made the right decision when he stepped down as the head writer because he did a pretty lousy job at writing the turtles. The stories he came up with were totally lame and unoriginal, like on a Next Mutation level of bad. Also he wrote Jennika as some boring straight woman, but thankfully Campbell fixed that and changed her into a lesbian queen with a cute pig girlfriend, and you can’t get more original than that! They make a cuter couple than Kermit and Miss Piggy! I was hoping that TMNT would eventually become more like the Party Of Five reboot and every other teen drama on Freeform, and to my great delight, it did! I can totally relate to the characters now when I couldn’t before! And people who complain about the political stuff like the allusions to Trump’s border policies and his red-cap-wearing followers obviously don’t know that comics have always been political. Campbell is just trying to help people become more aware of all the injustice in the world because all the other media outlets obviously aren’t doing enough. Such bravery and integrity shouldn’t be mocked or criticized; it should be praised. The era of Campbell will forever be remembered as the best years of TMNT. Thank you, Campbell, for giving us so much joy and making TMNT a hundred times better than it ever was!

https://y.yarn.co/6853e229-ea88-4c45-a110-df68751a68f6_text.gif

[GameCobra]

You know, I was curious about something after seeing this comic: Have the turtles ever been pre-mutated or transformed into another species? Heck, even turned human once. I'm pretty sure they were pre-mutated once, but I can't remember for the life of me.

[hypered1]

You know, I was curious about something after seeing this comic: Have the turtles ever been pre-mutated or transformed into another species? Heck, even turned human once. I'm pretty sure they were pre-mutated once, but I can't remember for the life of me.

Not sure what you mean? They started out as kids in Japan, Shredder killed them then they were reincarnated as baby turtles and were finally mutated into their anthropomorphic forms.

[Andrew NDB]

Not sure what you mean? They started out as kids in Japan

That's not the way reincarnation works! If I had a previous life where I was a frog, and then a previous life before that where I was a donkey, that doesn't mean "Hey, Andrew started out as a donkey!" I started out as a human. The other stuff is just where my soul used to reside.

[Cowabung-Gal]

Mikey summed up reincarnation best:

https://static1.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/TMNT-Reincarnation-comic.jpg?q=50&fit=crop&w=943&dpr=1.5

[GameCobra]

Outside of reincarnation, I mean has anyone transformed them from turtles to something else. Has the Rat King ever turned them into rats? Has Kitsune ever transformed them into foxes? Did they ever get de-mutagened and actually mess it up and become human? Just some examples.

[hypered1]

Outside of reincarnation, I mean has anyone transformed them from turtles to something else. Has the Rat King ever turned them into rats? Has Kitsune ever transformed them into foxes? Did they ever get de-mutagened and actually mess it up and become human? Just some examples.

The only examples I can think of off the top of my head would be Bebop & Rocksteady when Savanti Romero undid/ redid their mutations a couple of times (B&R: Hit the Road) and the Gang of Four who were able to control their mutations as canids using Null tech (Universe #11) and later took on the forms of the 'Null Turtles' (the one's with white face masks) during the Armageddon Game arc.

[hypered1]

That's not the way reincarnation works! If I had a previous life where I was a frog, and then a previous life before that where I was a donkey, that doesn't mean "Hey, Andrew started out as a donkey!" I started out as a human. The other stuff is just where my soul used to reside.

Reincarnation as a concept isn't a scientifically quantifiable phenomenon and there's absolutely zero provable evidence to the contrary and indeed the idea has always had inconsistent properties between various religions and philosophies, ergo within the confines of a fictitious narrative the writer has every right to adapt the concept to best fit the story they're trying to tell.

However I do agree that you're a bit of a donkey sometimes.

[Dangv]

That's not the way reincarnation works! If I had a previous life where I was a frog, and then a previous life before that where I was a donkey, that doesn't mean "Hey, Andrew started out as a donkey!" I started out as a human. The other stuff is just where my soul used to reside.

Wouldn't your soul then be the purest definition of "you"? It is the only thing that would move on to the next life. You would've still been you as a frog, or a donkey. Sounds like you in your human form didn't learn a valuable lesson from those previous lives. Back to being a donkey in the next one. :lol:

[Ninjinister]

Reincarnation as a concept isn't a scientifically quantifiable phenomenon and there's absolutely zero provable evidence to the contrary and indeed the idea has always had inconsistent properties between various religions and philosophies, ergo within the confines of a fictitious narrative the writer has every right to adapt the concept to best fit the story they're trying to tell.


For real, this is like someone arguing that one property's rules for time travel need to apply to another. When it comesto things that are, at least to current knowledge, COMPLETELY MAKE-BELIEVE, you can't say how it does it doesn't work outside of what the property itself has already established.

[Cowabung-Gal]

All this talk of donkeys and reincarnation reminds me of this scene:

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[Fenryr]

That was complete garbage. At least it read quick.

[CyberCubed]

That was complete garbage. At least it read quick.

Man, you aren't kidding. I actually remained hopeful for a bit but the further I read the worst this got. Besides the battle of the bands arc, this might very well be the worst story arc Sophie has written yet, and that says a lot. It's even more baffling this is the final big story for issue 150 as well.

Like the whole story makes zero sense. Evil Bob from the future who only cares about being human again, yet can't use his QNA magic powers on himself like he did Lita? The Turtles and April being "outraged" Lita was turned back to a human girl, saying "they'll fix this" (wtf?) Weird nonsensical future stuff with cyborg Jennika and a famous Michelangelo?

The whole arc makes no sense. Even IDW's version of Armaggon is pretty boring since he's not a real character and just a giant space shark. Thank god Sophie's run on IDW TMNT is pretty much over. Imagine if she got another 50 issues after this in some alternate timeline. *shudders*

[neatoman]

Yeah, I hate this, I really do. The nonsensical character writing was even there early on when this run was mostly just boring crap (remember Bebop and Rocksteady accepting a rock-off as an alternative to violence, then just gave up before even trying?), but it's so much more noticeable here now that this garbage is wrapping up. The fact that it's ending is the only real silver lining here.

[staypuftweepel]

The whole IDW series has been up and down for me. Even during the Tom Waltz era I found some of the arcs to be boring or anticlimactic so I’m really happy this whole thing seems to be coming to a close. It’s been 13 years and it’s time for something new. The past 50 issues has been such a slog (with a few exceptions). People said Volume 4 was slow but I found that so much more intriguing. I think Peter Laird actually understood how to write the characters and even though I thought drawing April was dumb he at least knew how to tell the story well.

It really bugs the hell out of me that the turtles wear clothes. They all look so frumpy. They travel to the time where Michelangelo is famous and he’s just hanging out in his very basic apartment in a pair of sweats. Couldn’t he at least have cool things around or dress like a famous a hole or something. Mikey looked like he was gonna cry in two different timelines here.

Like everybody said before it makes more sense for everyone to be happy for Lita becoming a human again since that’s her natural state. Plus I agree with Cybercubed, why can’t Bob just turn himself human if he can turn Lita human? Plus it seems so silly that the final threat the turtles will face in this series is someone named Evil Bob. Couldn’t he have a cooler name?

[CyberCubed]

Weirdly I feel Sophie had a better grasp on the Turtles and characters earlier in her run, but in the last number of issues it feels like everyone is just a little out of character for no reason at all. Like nothing that is happening makes any sense, and the way the characters interact with each other makes no sense either.

Also wtf is Carmen? This character is like a glorified extra, I can't be bothered to go back and check but she didn't have a single line of dialogue the whole issue did she? Why on earth did they introduce this random black girl? As dumb as Bob is, at least the story plot is about him. Carmen is like an "extra" on a movie set that has no reason to be there.

[TheLabRat]

Mikey looked like he was gonna cry in two different timelines here.

After #100, core four turtles are become more passive and have to rely on others. Ever since Campbell made Jennika the turtle's older sister, Leo wasn't an older brother anymore. She always said "You guys are just babies".

[DexVcx]

The whole IDW series has been up and down for me. Even during the Tom Waltz era I found some of the arcs to be boring or anticlimactic so I’m really happy this whole thing seems to be coming to a close. It’s been 13 years and it’s time for something new. The past 50 issues has been such a slog (with a few exceptions). People said Volume 4 was slow but I found that so much more intriguing. I think Peter Laird actually understood how to write the characters and even though I thought drawing April was dumb he at least knew how to tell the story well.

It really bugs the hell out of me that the turtles wear clothes. They all look so frumpy. They travel to the time where Michelangelo is famous and he’s just hanging out in his very basic apartment in a pair of sweats. Couldn’t he at least have cool things around or dress like a famous a hole or something. Mikey looked like he was gonna cry in two different timelines here.

Like everybody said before it makes more sense for everyone to be happy for Lita becoming a human again since that’s her natural state. Plus I agree with Cybercubed, why can’t Bob just turn himself human if he can turn Lita human? Plus it seems so silly that the final threat the turtles will face in this series is someone named Evil Bob. Couldn’t he have a cooler name?

This so true. They should just finish vol 4 at this point.

[DexVcx]

Weirdly I feel Sophie had a better grasp on the Turtles and characters earlier in her run, but in the last number of issues it feels like everyone is just a little out of character for no reason at all. Like nothing that is happening makes any sense, and the way the characters interact with each other makes no sense either.

Also wtf is Carmen? This character is like a glorified extra, I can't be bothered to go back and check but she didn't have a single line of dialogue the whole issue did she? Why on earth did they introduce this random black girl? As dumb as Bob is, at least the story plot is about him. Carmen is like an "extra" on a movie set that has no reason to be there.

Main problem with idw they take a lot fron mirage and archie and don't do nothing with it. So what was even the point in bringing her into this universe.

[TheLabRat]

Main problem with idw they take a lot fron mirage and archie and don't do nothing with it. So what was even the point in bringing her into this universe.
They're basically just some nostalgia baits. The same goes for Ch'rell and Bishop from 2003 cartoon. They don't have any decent writing in IDW TMNT

[Bahamut810]

Yeah, after the Campbell run I am going to put a hard limit on 5 issues for the new one. If I don't enjoy the main series after 5 issues I am done. I kept going because of bubblegum and hope from stuff happening around the series but...

yeah.

[Cowabung-Gal]

I knew it was going to end up being a dumpster fire after I asked the newly appointed Campbell on DeviantArt not to get all political with the new run and Campbell basically responded with, “Just who do you think I am? Of course I’m going to insert politics” and even added an evil laughing gif at the end. My fears were confirmed in the Jennika miniseries where blatant TDS was shoved into your face, and with Jennika becoming the stereotypical Mary Sue butch lesbian, I finally bailed out.

I applaud the rest of you for remaining hopeful up until #149, though.

[Sabacooza]

Sophie Campbell was never a fan of TMNT. No real fan would sell out and sh*t all over a property they love like she has. There. I said it.

[Andrew NDB]

I knew it was going to end up being a dumpster fire after I asked the newly appointed Campbell on DeviantArt not to get all political with the new run and Campbell basically responded with, “Just who do you think I am? Of course I’m going to insert politics” and even added an evil laughing gif at the end. My fears were confirmed in the Jennika miniseries where blatant TDS was shoved into your face, and with Jennika becoming the stereotypical Mary Sue butch lesbian, I finally bailed out.

I applaud the rest of you for remaining hopeful up until #149, though.

https://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showpost.php?p=1813120&postcount=35

But I mean... she's honest about it, right? 99% of these folks in comics and beyond are not.

[Monty Mole]

Sophie Campbell was never a fan of TMNT. No real fan would sell out and sh*t all over a property they love like she has. There. I said it.

Didn't she also make a bunch of Tcest art at one point?

[Cowabung-Gal]

Didn't she also make a bunch of Tcest art at one point?

As a longtime DeviantArt browser, I remember that Campbell did in fact have Tcest fanart, specifically of Raph and Leo snuggling/kissing, until one day, for some strange reason, all of that was deleted, conveniently before it was announced that Campbell would be the new head writer. It was the painted face AU with the then yellow Artemisia.

[ProphetofGanja]

...Like the whole story makes zero sense. Evil Bob from the future who only cares about being human again, yet can't use his QNA magic powers on himself like he did Lita? The Turtles and April being "outraged" Lita was turned back to a human girl, saying "they'll fix this" (wtf?) Weird nonsensical future stuff with cyborg Jennika and a famous Michelangelo?

The whole arc makes no sense. Even IDW's version of Armaggon is pretty boring since he's not a real character and just a giant space shark.

Weirdly I feel Sophie had a better grasp on the Turtles and characters earlier in her run, but in the last number of issues it feels like everyone is just a little out of character for no reason at all. Like nothing that is happening makes any sense, and the way the characters interact with each other makes no sense either.

Also wtf is Carmen? This character is like a glorified extra, I can't be bothered to go back and check but she didn't have a single line of dialogue the whole issue did she? ... Carmen is like an "extra" on a movie set that has no reason to be there.

You know, when you're right, you're right, Cubed. So much about the series has made so little sense for the past couple years. This was one of my favorite comic series for a long, long time, hell, this run has been going on for over a decade now. But despite it having some really, really interesting ideas, even in the last few years, the execution has just not been there. So many of the plot points the series has done in the past few years could have actually been really good, if they had been done a little differently.

All in all I still think this IDW run has been a good one, and I'm optimistic about the soft-reboot coming this summer.

[shredder orokusaki]

This proves again WHAT MONSTERS the turtles are. Instead od being happy that their friend Lita became human now they are angry because she is not a freak like them!

[Andrew NDB]

This proves again WHAT MONSTERS the turtles are. Instead od being happy that their friend Lita became human now they are angry because she is not a freak like them!

It might be an allegory for de-transitioners. Can't have that!

[CyberCubed]

I think the weird thing is there's nobody to reign Sophie's writing in, meaning no higher up to tell her what she can or can't do. Tom Waltz no longer works on IDW full time and the other editors there simply gave her free reign to do whatever she wanted. Like can't someone look at her story outline and say, "Where are you going with this?" Or "This feels out of character." etc.

Where is the quality control. Not to mention we have 3 female Turtles in the book at the same time (Jennika, Venus and future Lita) which alone is absurd when you stop to think about it. Why couldn't Lita be some other animal like a newt or lizard or something than yet another female Turtle?

Why is it half the plotlines under her run were botched when on-paper they could have been interesting with any other writer? It really does feel like stuff you'd see on fanfiction.net or deviantart in the early 2000's. Like someone's fanfiction officially published.

[Cowabung-Gal]

Where is the quality control. Not to mention we have 3 female Turtles in the book at the same time (Jennika, Venus and future Lita) which alone is absurd when you stop to think about it. Why couldn't Lita be some other animal like a newt or lizard or something than yet another female Turtle?

Heroes In A She-Shell

https://i.makeagif.com/media/5-23-2019/HQwsrZ.gif

[Zog The Magnificent]

It really does feel like stuff you'd see on fanfiction.net or deviantart in the early 2000's. Like someone's fanfiction officially published.

I mean, that's basically exactly what it is. Like many other things these days that were hijacked by people who don't even like them, claim to be fans, and then destroy everything about them that people liked, all in the name of hubris, to "leave their mark" on the franchise.

[DexVcx]

I think the weird thing is there's nobody to reign Sophie's writing in, meaning no higher up to tell her what she can or can't do. Tom Waltz no longer works on IDW full time and the other editors there simply gave her free reign to do whatever she wanted. Like can't someone look at her story outline and say, "Where are you going with this?" Or "This feels out of character." etc.

Where is the quality control. Not to mention we have 3 female Turtles in the book at the same time (Jennika, Venus and future Lita) which alone is absurd when you stop to think about it. Why couldn't Lita be some other animal like a newt or lizard or something than yet another female Turtle?

Why is it half the plotlines under her run were botched when on-paper they could have been interesting with any other writer? It really does feel like stuff you'd see on fanfiction.net or deviantart in the early 2000's. Like someone's fanfiction officially published.

Couldn't be anymore true

[Bahamut810]

Finally read it...yeah...

1. Yeah, I agree about Lita. What happened was objectively good for her. Bob should have just come to them and said "Hey, I can sold this problem that some of the people have." and sold it to them like that. ALL THE QNA HE COULD WANT. I guess this may be Lita trying to fix herself? Tell the turtles that he was important so that he becomes this villain so that he steals her QNA so she can go live normally.

2. An extension of that, yeah...I can't bring myself to care about Carmen or Bob either. Literally the only reason they were there is because we were told (not shown) that they were important and we should care.

3. I am not sure how I feel about this plot that seems like its going to end with Armaggon's victory. He is going to eat the old souls of the boys thus rebooting them to the more gritty storyline where they aren't tied to their history beyond being mutant turtles. It could be different, but that considering the next issue is it and what we were told is coming up its the most reasonable end. As long as this era comes to an end I can get over it.

[Stu_Padasso]

Sophie Campbell was never a fan of TMNT. No real fan would sell out and sh*t all over a property they love like she has. There. I said it.

I think it might be a little more complicated than that.

From my understanding, when “Sophie” was “Ross,” she had been working at Mirage and was working on a “Secret Of The Ooze” fan comic. So, I think it’s fair to say that she is a fan and is familiar with the lore but didn’t know what to do with the characters.

It’s the same problem I have with Chris Yost and Craig Kyle on the X-Men. From all accounts, they are both big comic book guys and are very good at adapting the source material to other media like television and movies, but when they work on the comics themselves, they just recycle characters and ideas only edgier and more violent. For example, you have Laura/X-23 who is basically a teenage Wolverine with tits who cuts herself and and the Predator X creatures the are mindless Warwolves from Excalibur that dig up and eat the carcasses of mutant kids that were blown up in a missile attack on a school bus. By the time the event Second Coming came to an end, the franchise had become murder and misery porn with many characters like Nightcrawler being needlessly killed off or mutilated and others, particularly Cyclops, being irreparably damaged.

Of course I’m of the personal opinion that the X-Men have creatively and conceptually run its course like so many other properties that have become victims of their own success and should have been allowed to end gracefully, but whatever. I just hope that the same doesn’t happen to the Turtles.

I think it might be important to point out that while someone might be familiar with what happened in a character’s history, they may not understand who the character is. K&Y didn’t understand that Wolverine wouldn’t be the sort of person who would murder an unarmed person pissing themselves in the middle of the highway. Logan wasn’t that man anymore. He had grown and developed with his time with the X-Men and serving as a surrogate father figure for Kitty Pryde and Jubilee. Likewise, Leo would never become romantically involved with a bloodthirsty psychopath like Koya or Donnie the resident scientist and engineer become a wizard.

That’s why I m cautiously optimistic about Jason Aaron taking over TMNT because over the work the work he did on the Wolverine Goes To Hell story arc, Wolverine and The X-Men, and Astonishing X-Men, he un-f*cked a lot of the damage that Kyle and Yost did.

It’s just a damn shame. Campbell is a great artist, the Mutant Town concept had a lot of potential, Jasper Barlow had a fun Dr. Herbert West vibe and little Lita is was such an adorable little bean. But it all just got pissed away.

[shredder orokusaki]

Finally read it...yeah...

1. Yeah, I agree about Lita. What happened was objectively good for her. Bob should have just come to them and said "Hey, I can sold this problem that some of the people have." and sold it to them like that. ALL THE QNA HE COULD WANT. I guess this may be Lita trying to fix herself? Tell the turtles that he was important so that he becomes this villain so that he steals her QNA so she can go live normally.

2. An extension of that, yeah...I can't bring myself to care about Carmen or Bob either. Literally the only reason they were there is because we were told (not shown) that they were important and we should care.

3. I am not sure how I feel about this plot that seems like its going to end with Armaggon's victory. He is going to eat the old souls of the boys thus rebooting them to the more gritty storyline where they aren't tied to their history beyond being mutant turtles. It could be different, but that considering the next issue is it and what we were told is coming up its the most reasonable end. As long as this era comes to an end I can get over it.

Armagon will eat the turtles and april and iw ill win!

[MikeandRaph87]

Why did everyone react like Future Bob murdered Lita? Leonardo crying, claiming he failed her? She is demutated and can be adopted into a loving family now. No crazy future with her training under Renet. I don't understand. Is it some trans allegory or something? Some liberal agenda of Campbell that I am missing? It just looks like a whole set of characters acting out of character. Why Donatello has not been toiling away to cure the mutations is beyond my understanding to begin with.

[CyberCubed]

There's definitely some "trans allegory" implications here. The fact that they say it's a "violation" that Lita got changed back, as if they had to "ask her permission" first whether she wanted to be a mutant or human again, is very odd. The whole issue and the last several has some very not-so-subtle "I changed my identity" aspects to it, with Venus going from a frog to Turtle being experimented on by Dr. Barlow, Mona Lisa before that, Jennika, Bob wanting to be human again, Lita, etc.

I suppose people who are unaware that Sophie is trans probably wouldn't pick up on this stuff, but if you know, you know. It's hard not to see the connection. I never saw TMNT mutants as struggling with their identity before (besides the few who genuinely wanted to be humans again), and even then it was not an identity thing, just that they wanted to live normal lives again.

[Sabacooza]

@Stu_Padasso You may be right in some respects but I lose respect for anyone that sacrifices their fandom on the altar of woke and ruins it for everyone else.

Nobody is interested in reading about a day in the life of Sophie Campbell and what makes her tick. We want to read about TMNT.

[Stu_Padasso]

I think the weird thing is there's nobody to reign Sophie's writing in, meaning no higher up to tell her what she can or can't do. Tom Waltz no longer works on IDW full time and the other editors there simply gave her free reign to do whatever she wanted. Like can't someone look at her story outline and say, "Where are you going with this?" Or "This feels out of character." etc.

Where is the quality control. Not to mention we have 3 female Turtles in the book at the same time (Jennika, Venus and future Lita) which alone is absurd when you stop to think about it. Why couldn't Lita be some other animal like a newt or lizard or something than yet another female Turtle?

Why is it half the plotlines under her run were botched when on-paper they could have been interesting with any other writer? It really does feel like stuff you'd see on fanfiction.net or deviantart in the early 2000's. Like someone's fanfiction officially published.

“Old Hobb turned me into a newt!”

“A newt?”

“I got better.”

Yeah, I’ve been on a Monty Python kick lately.

It makes you wonder, doesn’t it? The weird thing is that I thought that things were steadily getting better with the introduction of Barlow and the buildup to the Armageddon Game event. For a while I had thought that maybe Campbell had found her footing or editorial had finally reined her in. Who knows? Maybe her run would end on something of a high note?

But what we got was the enchanter known as… Donatello?

I blame myself. I knew something was amiss when Jennika showed up at the police station to bail Raph out dispite knowing that she was a convicted felon and a fugitive from justice and the cops knowing who she was. When I was on probation I did my tried to keep my head down and be the best goddamn Boy Scout that ever lived. Someone should have stood up to Campbell and said, “No, that’s stupid. Haven’t you been paying attention? Explain this.”

Oh, well. Denial ain’t just a river in Egypt.

I know I’m not as young as I used to be and I couldn’t draw to save my life. But I wonder if I should look into becoming a comic book editor. I’d make Jim Shooter look like Barney the Dinosaur.

@Stu_Padasso You may be right in some respects but I lose respect for anyone that sacrifices their fandom on the altar of woke and ruins it for everyone else.

Nobody is interested in reading about a day in the life of Sophie Campbell and what makes her tick. We want to read about TMNT.

Agreed. It’s no different than what Tim Sheridan has been doing on Alan Scott: Green Lantern whereas he took a a golden age character who should have been left out in pasture, retconned his sexuality without the input of his creators who themselves are long gone and turn it into gay trauma porn.

So, Campbell is transgendered. Whatever. You’re an adult, it’s your body, your money, your choice. You could have another head grafted onto your body for all I care.

Of course if you’re transitioning from male to female you would be losing a head…


This may not be a very popular opinion, but probably the biggest reason I’m fine with introducing new turtles like Lita, Venus or Odyn, Moja, Uno, and Yi in TLR because when, God forbid, both Laird and Eastman have passed on, the old school turtles can ride off into the sunset and hopefully be left the ever-f*ck alone.

[Rooish]

I'm not saying the characters haven't gone totally OOC lately, and I'm not saying this wasn't a trans allegory (and I'd be fine if it was, although yeah I haven't needed the entire comic to become queer, even as a queer person), but I think people are overreacting to this particular incident. Leo is a Turtle and he can't remember when he was a human. To him, Lita is family--basically a daughter. It makes sense that he would automatically react to her transformation as something ghastly when he knows her as a turtle and a member of his family. He is a character--not necessarily what we the audience are supposed to think is the truth. And she was demutated without her consent and she did seem pretty happy as a turtle. So I think like, he can overreact and that's okay.

[Jeff]

What on earth? So that Lita kid got changed back to a human and Leonardo is mad? What is Sophie on? This feels like character assassination.

Also as I've said previously, this whole "Evil Bob from the future" thing is honestly so dumb, because his only motive is to be de-mutated back to a human again. Like wtf is going on, why would he join Armaggon and try to erase history just for this.

Sophie's run cannot end soon enough.

i thought the same thing. If Bob can just de-mutate Lita at will, why can't he de-mutate himself?

[CyberCubed]

I'm not saying the characters haven't gone totally OOC lately, and I'm not saying this wasn't a trans allegory (and I'd be fine if it was, although yeah I haven't needed the entire comic to become queer, even as a queer person), but I think people are overreacting to this particular incident. Leo is a Turtle and he can't remember when he was a human. To him, Lita is family--basically a daughter. It makes sense that he would automatically react to her transformation as something ghastly when he knows her as a turtle and a member of his family. He is a character--not necessarily what we the audience are supposed to think is the truth. And she was demutated without her consent and she did seem pretty happy as a turtle. So I think like, he can overreact and that's okay.

That doesn't really fit either. Leo or the other Turtles barely interacted with Lita outside a small handful of issues. I'm not sure how much time in-universe has passed since issue 101, but I think it's probably just been a year or less. There's no reason any of the Turtles should view Lita as "their daughter," it just sounds like more of Sophie's nonsense.

The line, "It's a violation" is basically a trans-allegory. Meaning someone got "changed" against their will. Back early in Sophie's run there was an issue where Mona Lisa was trying to call her parents and they were horrified she turned into a mutant and Mona was crying about it, and it was another example of her writing where parents couldn't accept their daughter "changed their identity." and so forth.

Then you have other stuff where Jennika is now a lesbian despite the fact that when she was human she had a boyfriend in the past (as seen in the Jennika mini-series), and she had a crush on Casey as well for a while under Tom Waltz run. Sheena a lesbian pig mutant was introduced just to give Jennika a girlfriend. Jennika and Sheena was also the first "on-screen" lesbian kiss in TMNT comic history.

There's some other various stuff that happened in her run we can go into, but everyone knows what it is. Surprisingly enough Venus is actually really well-written in her run so far, which says a lot given how Venus was hated for years prior. Venus hasn't done anything to make me dislike her or think she's boring like Jennika so far, which I'm surprised about.

[hypered1]

That doesn't really fit either. Leo or the other Turtles barely interacted with Lita outside a small handful of issues. I'm not sure how much time in-universe has passed since issue 101, but I think it's probably just been a year or less. There's no reason any of the Turtles should view Lita as "their daughter," it just sounds like more of Sophie's nonsense.

It's been about 18 months or so; after the time skip in #101 it's mid winter, #124 was a Christmas issue and currently it's around early fall.


The line, "It's a violation" is basically a trans-allegory. Meaning someone got "changed" against their will.

It's called consent; Lita wasn't asked whether she wanted to stay a mutant or not so Bob's actions are an assault. You don't do things to other people bodies without their express permission.


Then you have other stuff where Jennika is now a lesbian despite the fact that when she was human she had a boyfriend in the past (as seen in the Jennika mini-series), and she had a crush on Casey as well for a while under Tom Waltz run.

Bi-sexuality is a thing, you can be attracted to both genders.

[neatoman]

It's called consent; Lita wasn't asked whether she wanted to stay a mutant or not so Bob's actions are an assault. You don't do things to other people bodies without their express permission.

You mean like how she turned into a turtle in the first place because a catman decided to "punish" people who had no idea of what was going on by dropping a dirty bomb on them? In other words, how she never even consented to being transformed into a turtle in the first place? I guess you need to ignore that for this crap to make any sense.

Or maybe you think all those episodes in FW, 4Kids and Nick in which mutants are cured, not to mention the Secret of the Ooze, should have had scenes where someone should have kindly asked "So do you want to remain an abomination that you never wanted to be turned into in the first place?".

[Drose18]

Is issue 150 really going to be as short as normal? Gonna be really hard to get a satisfying conclusion in just 20 some pages.

[hypered1]

Is issue 150 really going to be as short as normal? Gonna be really hard to get a satisfying conclusion in just 20 some pages.

It'd going to be double sized.

[MikeandRaph87]

The biggest crime is why the Turtles are not actively trying to find a retro-mutagen. I don't believe it was mentioned but once. It was the first Jennika mini where Bebop and Rocksteady pretended to. Why would any of them actually want to be a mutant if he or she was a human and it's not Bebop and Rocksteady who view it as a steroid power up and did so willingly? I would assume that Lita wants to be human. this whole violation the talk and Leo crying over it is more laughable the more I read it.

I know that I have said it before, the success and subsequent milking of The Last Ronin is what killed this comic. It's why Tom Waltz his plot threads through by #100 leaving some dangling and expected to be tied up even if he had left. Then the delays and successes prolonged the intended allotment for Campbell, who is just playing Deviantart and passing it off like it's #101 on until Tom can finish his story. Then gets it back to continue? I don't understand why IDW kept the person on. Seeing the events of #149 justifies this taunt is real and this is the issue shown is the one that broke it for me, yet it took until #117 for me to walk.
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/349029039884505974/

Was milking The Last Ronin worth it for this?

[Cowabung-Gal]

It's called consent; Lita wasn't asked whether she wanted to stay a mutant or not so Bob's actions are an assault. You don't do things to other people bodies without their express permission.

Well, Lita didn’t ask to be mutated into a turtle either. At least she now has a chance to live a normal life again since she’s been changed back to a human. Maybe it isn’t what she or her mutant peers want, but it’s undeniably what’s best for her. If anything, Leo and the others are being rather selfish.

There is a trans allegory here; you can’t convince me there isn’t, and guess what? That’s what the writers want us to see. People like Campbell think that underage impressionable children can “consent” to being exposed to rather dangerous drugs and being scarred and made sterile for the rest of their lives. Heaven forbid they get a tattoo before they’re 18. But change their identity/sex/gender/whatever? Go for it.

Bi-sexuality is a thing, you can be attracted to both genders.

“Both”? Are you implying something here? Careful, hypered1, you might offend the wrong people.

And you and I both know that if Jennika were to go back to liking the other gender, a bunch of people on Twitter would’ve accused the writers of being “homophobic”.

[Monty Mole]

As a longtime DeviantArt browser, I remember that Campbell did in fact have Tcest fanart, specifically of Raph and Leo snuggling/kissing, until one day, for some strange reason, all of that was deleted, conveniently before it was announced that Campbell would be the new head writer.

That's pretty ****ed. You think she deleted them by choice? Or did the head people at IDW ask her to?

[CyberCubed]

To be fair what people draw on deviantart literally decades ago doesn't really matter for their professional career. Lots of big time artists drew porn of characters in the past and nobody cares (except maybe Disney? lol) if they find out about it. But yeah there's a difference when you start to work on a book officially.

[Cowabung-Gal]

That's pretty ****ed. You think she deleted them by choice? Or did the head people at IDW ask her to?

I personally think it’s the former. Campbell probably really wanted that position as head writer but also knew that incest is still generally frowned upon in our society (who knows how long that taboo status will last though), so it would be a bad look for the new head writer to be into that kind of stuff and therefore less people would want to buy the comics. But even after destroying the evidence, Campbell still managed to sink the ongoing series with the all furry Freeform nonsense that nobody asked for.

[hypered1]

The biggest crime is why the Turtles are not actively trying to find a retro-mutagen.

This has been brought up several and the answer will never change:- why would they or anyone else for that matter actively try to find or create what would be the single most dangerous thing to themselves if their enemies got their hands on it.

[hypered1]

I personally think it’s the former. Campbell probably really wanted that position as head writer but also knew that incest is still generally frowned upon in our society (who knows how long that taboo status will last though)

Genetic abnormalities resulting from inbreeding are incredibly dangerous to any potential offspring especially if it's multi-generational. But hey, you do you Alabama.

[Stu_Padasso]

The biggest crime is why the Turtles are not actively trying to find a retro-mutagen.

I had just assumed that the Turtles were just trying to keep their sh!t together and that the retro mutagen could be weaponized.

I don't understand why IDW kept the person on. Seeing the events of #149 justifies this taunt is real and this is the issue shown is the one that broke it for me, yet it took until #117 for me to walk.
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/349029039884505974/

Was milking The Last Ronin worth it for this?

Well, to be fair, she seems to be self aware of how people feel about her and has a sense of humor about it. It’s more than I can say about Kathleen Kennedy.

Of course Sophie has a sense of humor. Unlike Kennedy, she’s not a biological woman

[Boooo! Get off the stage, @$$hole!]

[CyberCubed]

“I'm Sophie and I ruin people's childhoods for a living. #transcrafted”

I admit, I laughed harder than I should of. This is an actual quote of hers. LOL.

[Cowabung-Gal]

Genetic abnormalities resulting from inbreeding are incredibly dangerous to any potential offspring especially if it's multi-generational. But hey, you do you Alabama.

I thought Britain was the inbreeding capital of the world? Or was that poor oral hygiene?

[neatoman]

I thought Britain was the inbreeding capital of the world? Or was that poor oral hygiene?

Britain is the meme answer for poor oral hygiene, Alabama is the meme answer for inbreeding. As for the real answer when it comes to inbreeding, that's Pakistan and oddly enough by quite a huge margin.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/inbreeding-by-country

[staypuftweepel]

This has been brought up several and the answer will never change:- why would they or anyone else for that matter actively try to find or create what would be the single most dangerous thing to themselves if their enemies got their hands on it.

Way back in the 88 series the guys went out of their way to try and get the retromutagen ray generator so they could help Splinter. They tried to turn him back into a human despite the danger it presented to them. The turtles usually try to do what they can to help people because they’re heroes. This series has borrowed quite a lot from the Fred Wolf series you’d think maybe they’d take that too instead of just having the turtles selfishly keep everyone a mutant to satisfy their needs.

[neatoman]

Way back in the 88 series the guys went out of their way to try and get the retromutagen ray generator so they could help Splinter. They tried to turn him back into a human despite the danger it presented to them. The turtles usually try to do what they can to help people because they’re heroes. This series has borrowed quite a lot from the Fred Wolf series you’d think maybe they’d take that too instead of just having the turtles selfishly keep everyone a mutant to satisfy their needs.

Or how about when Donatello tried to find a permanent cure for the mutants underground in the 4Kids show? Hell, the 2012 show also had him constantly work on curing mutations (even if they kept using BS reasons why most of the mutants stayed mutants).

Like I already pointed out, previous iterations got this idea right, most franchises get this right. Ben Grimm, Bruce Banner and Curt Connors may never truly be cured permanently and maybe they can learn to live with it but at the end of the day, they still want to be themselves and not some monstrous mistake of science.

[Cloudrunner]

Well, Lita didn’t ask to be mutated into a turtle either. At least she now has a chance to live a normal life again since she’s been changed back to a human. Maybe it isn’t what she or her mutant peers want, but it’s undeniably what’s best for her. If anything, Leo and the others are being rather selfish.

There is a trans allegory here; you can’t convince me there isn’t.

You mean a group of people, rather than doing what's best for the child and allowing them to live a normal life, instead choose to have them live as a freak with genetic/medical issues that will carry with them for the rest of their lives? And they're doing it not for the child's sake, but to justify their own existence?

Wow, it really IS a trans allegory.

[Andrew NDB]

You mean a group of people, rather than doing what's best for the child and allowing them to live a normal life, instead choose to have them live as a freak with genetic/medical issues that will carry with them for the rest of their lives? And they're doing it not for the child's sake, but to justify their own existence?

The fun part is the most fierce debates you'll ever get into about this issue are with people who either don't have kids/don't want kids/will never have kids/can't have kids. Though there is at least among the white celebrity or upper middle leftist class a growing number of parents who push/immediately push and encourage transition as a sort of sacrifice to "the movement" as if to say, "I'm sorry I'm white, but at least I have a trans kid! So I'm part of you guys, in a roundabout way!" Scum of the highest order.

[TheLabRat]

April says "we'll fix"it", feel like a villain would say. But this comic make the main characters act hypocritical or OOC many times so I wouldn't be surprised.

[staypuftweepel]

I think it’s weird that Campbell never really showed Lita’s reaction to it. After she gets turned into a human there’s only two panels where you see her. One where she says “what happened to me?” And another where you only see the side of her head and art makes her look like she has a major underbite. I think a better writer would show her deal with the fact that she isn’t a turtle anymore. Maybe cry or show any kind of emotion. Spend some panels actually conveying what it meant to her instead of pages of everyone else’s reactions.

[CyberCubed]

Lita, the weasels, Sheena, etc. are all essentially Sophie's OC's, deviantart characters made canon. None are interesting.

Thankfully we only have 1 more issue to endure of this and then it's all finally over. I'm glad IDW as a whole is not ending because if the series ended with this it would be remembered as a let down for decades to come.

At least the series now has a chance to bounce back or get even better than Waltz run depending on how the writing goes.

[Coola Yagami]

I think it’s weird that Campbell never really showed Lita’s reaction to it. After she gets turned into a human there’s only two panels where you see her. One where she says “what happened to me?” And another where you only see the side of her head and art makes her look like she has a major underbite. I think a better writer would show her deal with the fact that she isn’t a turtle anymore. Maybe cry or show any kind of emotion. Spend some panels actually conveying what it meant to her instead of pages of everyone else’s reactions.

OR, depending how long she was human pre-mutation, make her actually smile and be happy she's human again.

What they should be doing is making Lita have some sort of internal conflict with being happy she is human again while being worried she'll no longer fit in with the rest of misfit toys and be voted off the island.

Trying to turn Lita into some sort of trans allegory just doesn't work because it's just something that can't be compared to mutations in this series. Especially since Mutant Town is full of people that were mutated against their will. None of them chose to 'transition' into muntant animals.

[Andrew NDB]

None of them chose to 'transition' into muntant animals.

The idea is probably that deep down, they were always that way, the mutagen only validated their "true self." But mostly in reality it is, "I really, really want to make a strong trans allegory and I want it NOW, and I don't care if it doesn't make sense!"

Wasn't it Out of the Shadows that made it so every human being had some latent animal DNA in them for no reason at all? I don't know if that's much worse than this, really.

[neatoman]

Wasn't it Out of the Shadows that made it so every human being had some latent animal DNA in them for no reason at all? I don't know if that's much worse than this, really.

I will never get over how stupid the OotS explanation was, the fact someone out there thought (or at least didn't think anyone would scrutinise the concept) that humans evolved from pigs and rhinos, or that turtles seemingly evolved from humans.

I honestly don't get why they didn't put animal DNA into the syringes or had them mutate from regular animals... I mean... Bebop and Rocksteady should be ignored in the first place, but if you have to use them, why give them such a stupid origin?

As for the explanation for why anyone turned into what they did when hit by Hob's bomb, I'm pretty sure Bobby Curnow stated that this was because the stolen mutagen came with data for mutation formulas, but I can't recall that being explicitly stated in the comic itself or if Campbell stuck to that idea. Not entirely sure what to make of the Venus thing though, if she genuinely turned into a turtle or smoothed out the surgery scars is somewhat unclear.

Speaking of Venus, how about that part where she forced Barlow to turn even more ratlike just out of petty revenge and he literally states that he would have preferred to just have been killed, was that a "violation" too? I guess we are just meant think that what Bob did was "wrong" because he's the "bad guy" and what Venus did was "good" or at least "permissible" because she is the "good guy" and Barlow was also the "bad guy". (And I'm pretty sure that if Venus had done the reverse, just turned Barlow human again, he would have just ****ed off and never bothered anyone ever again rather than be a potential problem in the future. Not sure she could have done that instead but then just killing him might just have been preferable in just about every way imaginable.)

[GameCobra]

I honestly hope the twist here is that Rita realizes that this actually works better for her. Bob actually made her life better and it's the turtles and the foot clan that are being weird about it.

The way they drew the panel with her face looking over her shoulder doesn't look like a kid that's freaking out what happened, just has alot of questions about what's happening to her. The twist being that she actually likes it.

[Coola Yagami]

I honestly hope the twist here is that Rita realizes that this actually works better for her. Bob actually made her life better and it's the turtles and the foot clan that are being weird about it.

The way they drew the panel with her face looking over her shoulder doesn't look like a kid that's freaking out what happened, just has alot of questions about what's happening to her. The twist being that she actually likes it.

Probably not. Fantasy is dead nowadays, everything has to be some sort of allegory for something. I'm surprised whoever the current villain isn't some allegory to Trump, regardless of how little sense it would make.

It's like Mutant Mayhem with the Turtles wanting to be like human teenagers and go to school and crap when mutant reptiles that were raised in the sewers and trained in the art of ninjitsu since birth should not have the same wants and desires as a typical human teenager.

[CyberCubed]

Also why does Sophie keep making all these alternate future timelines as well? In this one Jennika is a half cyborg in mutant town, and Michelangelo is famous (?), I'm surprised they didn't have him dating Regenta or something. Like what is the purpose of all these future timelines especially since most of them contradict each other? At least none will be canon so it's a relief.