Avengers 5: Doomsday

[Andrew NDB]

With... Robert Downey Jr. as Victor Von Doom?

https://deadline.com/2024/07/robert-downey-jr-victor-von-doom-avengers-doomsday-1236024873/?fbclid=IwY2xjawESiG1leHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHcUcEWnW5L2G IjngcvQbyQVerpyiH9FJctKI2STTwc9hadmD5lWarNoo0A_aem _o-jXn4aWYunR2_I-0OBqpw

Hm. This lends credence to the rumors that the Fantastic Four in the new Fantastic Four movie don't JUST come to the present from the 1960s... but also another universe. A universe now, apparently, where Victor Von Doom looks like Tony Stark.

[TigerClaw]

With... Robert Downey Jr. as Victor Von Doom?

https://deadline.com/2024/07/robert-downey-jr-victor-von-doom-avengers-doomsday-1236024873/?fbclid=IwY2xjawESiG1leHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHcUcEWnW5L2G IjngcvQbyQVerpyiH9FJctKI2STTwc9hadmD5lWarNoo0A_aem _o-jXn4aWYunR2_I-0OBqpw

Hm. This lends credence to the rumors that the Fantastic Four in the new Fantastic Four movie don't JUST come to the present from the 1960s... but also another universe. A universe now, apparently, where Victor Von Doom looks like Tony Stark.
They describe it as a retro futuristic version of the 60s.

[neatoman]

With... Robert Downey Jr. as Victor Von Doom?

https://deadline.com/2024/07/robert-downey-jr-victor-von-doom-avengers-doomsday-1236024873/?fbclid=IwY2xjawESiG1leHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHcUcEWnW5L2G IjngcvQbyQVerpyiH9FJctKI2STTwc9hadmD5lWarNoo0A_aem _o-jXn4aWYunR2_I-0OBqpw

Hm. This lends credence to the rumors that the Fantastic Four in the new Fantastic Four movie don't JUST come to the present from the 1960s... but also another universe. A universe now, apparently, where Victor Von Doom looks like Tony Stark.

... So is it like how Quicksilver and Thanos look like Kraven and Cable?

[Coola Yagami]

I heard Doom might keep his helmet on all the time, as in, Robert Downy Jr doesn't want to distract the audience with his appearance and he might even go for a non-Tony voice.

My only problem with woke Disney being behind this, is that if they're going for a 'they came from the 60's to modern day' theme, they just won't help but have women put that gosh darned misogynistic Reed Richards in his place.

[Barkworm]

This is immediately so much more interesting to me than whatever the Kang film could have been. What a cool idea.

[RaphaelinSTL]

I haven't cared about Marvel movies in years, but getting the right Dr. Doom could've been enough to pull me. Nope. I'm still out, lol.

[Andrew NDB]

This is immediately so much more interesting to me than whatever the Kang film could have been. What a cool idea.

Well, that's not untrue. Though I hope there is still SOME manner of a payoff of the Kang stuff.

[XERO]

I was enjoying the Kang stuff, too, so I hope there's some kind of payoff, as well.

[Andrew NDB]

I was enjoying the Kang stuff, too, so I hope there's some kind of payoff, as well.

It doesn't need to be much, but it needs to be something.

[Barkworm]

Make Deadpool cameo and say something like "I thought Kang was supposed to appear but I guess he beat up his girlfriend".

Just kidding.

[XERO]

Make Deadpool cameo and say something like "I thought Kang was supposed to appear but I guess he beat up his girlfriend".

Just kidding.

Low key, that'd be funny as f*ck and such a Deadpool thing to say.

[Andrew NDB]

It'd probably be a dance in saying that... without actually saying that. But everyone knowing exactly what he means.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

Yup, it's true. RDJ will be Doom. Watched a bit the panel online.

[ZariusTwo]

Kang was such a pushover in the MCU. I'd have dropped the guy and relegated him to a Deadpool flick even IF Majors had been rehired

Doom's been an Iron Man in the past, notably in Bendis' 'Infamous Iron Man' back in 2015

[ToTheNines]

I haven't cared about Marvel movies in years, but getting the right Dr. Doom could've been enough to pull me. Nope. I'm still out, lol.

Yeah this sounds like it sucks. Guess we’ll never get a quintessential FF movie. Oh well.

[sdp]

Knee jerk course correction and their pulling big moves here, new idea for Avengers 5, ignoring the 5 year build up. Bringing in RDJ (Called it), probably couldn't get him as Iron Man so they convinced him with the is new role. But he'll still be paid as much as if he were iron man inflating the budget. And by having Dr. Doom in fantastic four you get people to watch that movie since it'll set up the next avengers movie. bold moves but I don't think it'll change much, the MCU is still not going to make a recovery, the peak in Infinity War/End Game will never be replicated again even if everyone was brought back, the mainstream moved on.
Thunderbolts and nu Captain America will still bomb, F4 will likely do better now that RDJ is Dr. Doom but won't be breaking records, it'll do more than fine though. Avengers 5 will be a disappointment in terms of an Avengers movie even if it'll still do a billion.

What a terrible cashgrab decision was to cast RDJ as Dr. Doom. A shame I would've wanted a good Dr. Doom and we'll likely just get Evil Tony Stark now. I mean it'll be amusing to see a know it all be an ass and be correct and be the bad guy but Dr. Doom is not comedic. I'm guessing Secret War will basically be an End Game reunion. "Remember all the characters you loved, here they are again, love us again"

[IMJ]

There is literally NO compelling "Stark as Doom" story that has ever been told nor one that almost any of the hardcore Iron Man fans are excited about seeing. My best and most honest hope for this is that in some montage of Universes we see a short snippet of Stark as Doom somewhat akin to seeing Henry Cavil as Wolverine in the new Deadpool movie.

There is literally no story that carries this narrative that I could give a $#!( about, although I'd be fine with being pleasantly surprised. But that's unlikely given how well I know the source material and how poorly Hollywood tends to chew it up and spit it out anyway.

I dunno. We will see.

Again, I hope this is just a mild misdirection on part of the Russo Brothers and that Stark as Doom is just a cameo.

[neatoman]

There is literally NO compelling "Stark as Doom" story that has ever been told nor one that almost any of the hardcore Iron Man fans are excited about seeing. My best and most honest hope for this is that in some montage of Universes we see a short snippet of Stark as Doom somewhat akin to seeing Henry Cavil as Wolverine in the new Deadpool movie.

There is literally no story that carries this narrative that I could give a $#!( about, although I'd be fine with being pleasantly surprised. But that's unlikely given how well I know the source material and how poorly Hollywood tends to chew it up and spit it out anyway.

I dunno. We will see.

Again, I hope this is just a mild misdirection on part of the Russo Brothers and that Stark as Doom is just a cameo.

Did they confirm that this character is Tony Stark? I know it might sound insane but we don't have an actual reason to think this Tony Stark as Doctor Doom, rather than a Victor Von Doom that just happens to be played by RDJ. If we're going to take the multiverse seriously, then we'll also have to accept things like that there are two versions of the Human Torch look just like Captain America and Killmonger.

[Andrew NDB]

Clearly the Victor Von Doom from the Fantastic Four universe just happens to look like Tony Stark. Now, #1 the fans get RDJ back so the hope is that'll mend bridges with a lot, #2 we'll get a whole lot of the MCU characters seeing Tony Stark's face and getting confused/sympathetic to him ("Tony Stark was a great man, and you've got his face!" and so on). It's still pretty stupid and cowardly.

[IMJ]

Did they confirm that this character is Tony Stark? I know it might sound insane but we don't have an actual reason to think this Tony Stark as Doctor rather than Victor Von Doom that just happens to be played by RDJ. If we're going to take the multiverse seriously, then we'll also have to accept things like that there are two versions of the Human Torch look just like Captain America and Killmonger.

I think it's pretty clear what they are going to do and my best guess is going to be the subject of a short article on my site soon.

But my best guess isn't anything I've seen anyone say online yet and all I'll say here is that it involves a repurposing of the original Avengers: Kang Dynasty script, which makes perfect sense because they had already put resources into getting that story developed. I will explain more later, but I don't see anyone discussing the angle I'm driving at anywhere.

[ranger_scout]

Chris Evans is coming back too.

https://deadline.com/2024/12/chris-evans-avengers-doomsday-1236198951/

[Andrew NDB]

Yeah, I bet there's some kind of "throwaway" to very quickly wrap up the Kang stuff at the beginning of the movie. It surely couldn't just be nothing, could it?

[ToTheNines]

This is so lame. Endgame was such a great ending, don’t ruin it.

It’s very sad and unfortunate what happened to Boseman, but could they really not something around other characters? Obviously trying to bank on Brie was foolish, but come on.

[ZariusTwo]

I think all the original Avengers (possibly sans Scarlett) will be back, but as villains for the new generation to defeat, so we'll get "evil white guy" Steve being punched out by the 'worthy' Sam Wilson Cap wielding Thor's hammer (like in the Secret Empire comic)

[ToTheNines]

I think all the original Avengers (possibly sans Scarlett) will be back, but as villains for the new generation to defeat, so we'll get "evil white guy" Steve being punched out by the 'worthy' Sam Wilson Cap wielding Thor's hammer (like in the Secret Empire comic)

God damn it. You’re 100 percent right, aren’t you?

[Andrew NDB]

Yeah, he'll be Captain Hydra like from a few years ago in the comics.

[Andrew NDB]

For some reason this story wasn't really given much traction:

https://abcnews.go.com/US/jonathan-majors-girlfriend-drops-defamation-assault-lawsuit/story?id=116127425#:~:text=Majors%20was%20found%20 guilty%20of,his%20management%20and%20PR%20firms.

Jonathan Majors' ex girlfriend basically dropped everything.

Majors and Jabbari stipulated to a dismissal of her lawsuit for defamation and assault that she brought against him in March, the filing said.

Obviously money was involved but you don't get to both accept the money, agree to all the charges going away and STILL pretend you were victimized/that Majors was so horrible. Even if he was.

[ToTheNines]

https://image.spreadshirtmedia.com/image-server/v1/compositions/T210A1PA4301PT17X83Y37D622167W16782H26027Cx000000/views/1,width=650,height=650,appearanceId=1.jpg

[ZariusTwo]

Russos threw out all of Michael Waldron's ideas and contributions, they're starting fresh

https://comicbookmovie.com/avengers/avengers-doomsday/rumor-russo-brothers-scrapped-michael-waldrons-avengers-5-script-update-on-daredevils-doomsday-role-a215655

[Andrew NDB]

Russos threw out all of Michael Waldron's ideas and contributions, they're starting fresh

https://comicbookmovie.com/avengers/avengers-doomsday/rumor-russo-brothers-scrapped-michael-waldrons-avengers-5-script-update-on-daredevils-doomsday-role-a215655

Not that the Russos are any great arbiters of quality themselves... as we've seen in every single thing they've done since the last Avengers movie.

[ranger_scout]

Chris Evans denies he's coming back saying he's, "'Happily retired."

https://ew.com/chris-evans-denies-avengers-doomsday-return-happily-retired-8783097

Meanwhile, Benedict Cumberbatch is backtracking on Doctor Strange not appearing in the movie, "I got that wrong. Don't ever believe anything I say."

https://ew.com/benedict-cumberbatch-clarifies-doctor-strange-avengers-doomsday-8783071

[ZariusTwo]

Chris Evans denies he's coming back saying he's, "'Happily retired."

https://ew.com/chris-evans-denies-avengers-doomsday-return-happily-retired-8783097

Meanwhile, Benedict Cumberbatch is backtracking on Doctor Strange not appearing in the movie, "I got that wrong. Don't ever believe anything I say."

https://ew.com/benedict-cumberbatch-clarifies-doctor-strange-avengers-doomsday-8783071

It's been a "Strange" week at this studio

[Andrew NDB]

Meanwhile, Benedict Cumberbatch is backtracking on Doctor Strange not appearing in the movie, "I got that wrong. Don't ever believe anything I say."

Including what he's saying... right there, as well.

[IMJ]

I think it's likely that the entire roster is coming as a form of "Evil Avengers" in an entirely unsatisfying encore that people will cheer-for in the moment but then hate later, like Iron Man 3.

Iron Man as Doom. Captain America as Captain Hydra. And the rest of the team as whatever evil version they decide to dig up. Basically a team appearance of Star Trek Mirror Universe versions.

Honestly, the Universe building thing was mostly fun and had some amazing content. Now reboot it and get back to the "Iron Man films can be like 'James Bond' and don't have to be tied to ongoing continuity forever.

[Andrew NDB]

Yeah. If I had to speculate... probably Scarlet Witch comes back in the movie, who is already evil (for now), and she somehow marshals extra-dimensional threats that just so happen to be pre-existing Avengers members but from other universes so as to play on the regular MCU's (and the audience's) heartstrings. Yeah, Dr. Doom, maybe Future Imperfect Hulk or something, Captain Hydra, and all that sort of stuff. But probably we'll see Scarlet Witch do a heel-to-face turn in it.

[ZariusTwo]

Concept art has leaked

-Doop, a mutant from the X-Static comics of the 2000s, is appearing
-Medieval/Tribal setting (presumably Battleworld)
-Doom will have his God Emperor form
-Vision and Starlord share an apartment
-Jocasta debuts in the MCU
-Hulk village
-Male Black Panther
-Young Avengers (Ms. Marvel, Hawkeye, Cassie Lang, Wiccan, and Speed)

https://comicbookmovie.com/avengers/avengers-doomsday/avengers-doomsday-leaked-concept-art-everything-it-reveals-from-the-fantastic-fours-fate-to-emperor-doom-a216533

[ToTheNines]

Sounds pretty lame.


Kind of annoyed by the Black Panther thing. I couldn’t finish Wakanda Forever because Riri was so cringe, but I loved the MCU take on Shuri and was looking forward to see her as BP in an Avengers movie.

Maybe Marvel got rid of her for her politics.

[neatoman]

How old is T'Challa Jr. meant to be?

[ToTheNines]

he should only be about 9 years old in this movie. Unless it’s several years after current “present day” (BNW and Thunderbolt are 2027, in universe and Toussaint was born either 2018 or ‘19). The Young Avengers stuff tells me it’s not that far off.

[Andrew NDB]

There is no Young Avengers stuff. If they were planning it at all it died during Feige's culling of everything.

[neatoman]

he should only be about 9 years old in this movie. Unless it’s several years after current “present day” (BNW and Thunderbolt are 2027, in universe and Toussaint was born either 2018 or ‘19). The Young Avengers stuff tells me it’s not that far off.

So like... Alternate Killmonger?

[ToTheNines]

So this will be almost 20 years after Spider-Man 3… any chance they have Peter get exposed to the symbiote while on Battleworld?

[IMJ]

So this will be almost 20 years after Spider-Man 3… any chance they have Peter get exposed to the symbiote while on Battleworld?

Sort of wondering if that was the point of having Sony-Eddie leave a piece of symbiote in the MCU at the beginning of Venom 3.

The whole MCU is a cobbled together mess though now that used to be fun as it unfolded, but is now starting to show it's cracks.

[Andrew NDB]

So this will be almost 20 years after Spider-Man 3… any chance they have Peter get exposed to the symbiote while on Battleworld?

If they're going to all the trouble of actually doing Battleworld and having Spider-Man there -- and it sounds like they are -- then I'd say yeah.

Sort of wondering if that was the point of having Sony-Eddie leave a piece of symbiote in the MCU at the beginning of Venom 3.

Wait, wasn't that at the end of Spider-Man 3? Or did they also show it again in Venom 3, which I have not seen? If they showed it again then it's definitely paying off.

[ToTheNines]

No Way Home mid-credit scene:

OkAL7cqkb_I?si=_UmVNsELs0rrHxf3

Opening of Venom 3 (scene is repurposed at 1:50 to about 3:15):

041KTRpr0XU?si=sd0Op1GgZQqUaQFB


Doesn’t look like they showed the symbiote piece being left behind. But yeah, I still think that arc is incoming. Just feels weird if they do black suit Peter at a time in his life when he doesn’t even have anyone close to him to tell him he’s going off the deep end.

Sort of wondering if that was the point of having Sony-Eddie leave a piece of symbiote in the MCU at the beginning of Venom 3.

The whole MCU is a cobbled together mess though now that used to be fun as it unfolded, but is now starting to show it's cracks.

Yeah. Used to be when they ham-fistedly cram a character or plot into a movie… the follow up was good and worth it (and normally coming within a year or two).

Now it’s just too much to keep track of, and at least half of it stinks.

[Andrew NDB]

Yeah. Used to be when they ham-fistedly cram a character or plot into a movie… the follow up was good and worth it (and normally coming within a year or two).

Now it’s just too much to keep track of, and at least half of it stinks.

The actual Marvel ones always seem to eventually pay off. The Sony Marvel ones, not so much. Like what was even going on with Scorpion and the Vulture at the end of Spider-Man 1?

[ToTheNines]

The actual Marvel ones always seem to eventually pay off. The Sony Marvel ones, not so much. Like what was even going on with Scorpion and the Vulture at the end of Spider-Man 1?

(Edited my previous post with an additional video for comparison)

Yeah they pay off but they’re awful. Like **** Ironheart. Re-re pretty much ruined Wakanda Forever for me. The Love and Thunder stuff probably won’t go anywhere. Basically anything related to Disney+. All that went in the toilet.

But hopefully Born Again corrects course.

[Andrew NDB]

But hopefully Born Again corrects course.

I have high hopes! And then that they put Daredevil and Punisher into, like, everything. And Kingpin into Spider-Man movies.

Holy hell, Born Again comes out tomorrow!

[ZariusTwo]

Iy7k3aJS0Fw

[Andrew NDB]

That's got to be the most boring announcement video I've ever seen, for anything. Super slow reveal of directors' chairs for actors we already could pretty well assume are in the movie? Now, if there's chairs for Charlie Cox or Jon Bernthal there at the end, then I'll get excited.

[ToTheNines]

Namor is back. I thought he got metoo’d

[Autbot_Benz]

Glad Kelsey Grammar's Beast is back

[Andrew NDB]

Glad Kelsey Grammar's Beast is back

Meh, I'm not. I don't have any problem with Kelsey Grammar's Beast but... can we hurry up and meet the "Real" MCU X-Men already?

[Autbot_Benz]

Meh, I'm not. I don't have any problem with Kelsey Grammar's Beast but... can we hurry up and meet the "Real" MCU X-Men already?

that's not gonna happen till we are all in our 80's at the rate the MCU is going :lol:

[Vicky82]

Pretty big cast, I bet some of them will only be in the movie for about 5 mins.

[Andrew NDB]

that's not gonna happen till we are all in our 80's at the rate the MCU is going :lol:

It's ridiculous. The deal with Fox and Disney was completed in 2019... that's 6 years ago. The only thing of any kind we've gotten of the "real" MCU X-Men since then is just adamantium in "Brave New World," and we didn't even really see it.

[Barkworm]

So, the film is full of Fox-Men characters? Why? Who asked for them?

[Coola Yagami]

Iy7k3aJS0Fw

Did that trailer really need to be almost six hours long???

So we got some of the FoX-Men in it and the Fantastic Four in it, Loki will somehow return.

If anything NOW would have been a good time to slip Deadpool in there.

[neatoman]

So based on the leaks, what are the odds of Latveria and/or Doom existing in the noral MCU? Because I've seen rumors that "Sokovia" is just a modernised name for Latveria.

[Coola Yagami]

So um... so far it looks like we're gonna get Thor, Loki, Winter Soldier, Sam Wilson, Shuri, Shang Chi, Ghost, Red Guardian, White Widow, Ant Man, the new Fantastic Four, Xavier, Magneto, Beast, Cyclops, Gambit, Mystique, Nightcrawler and Punisher. Am I missing anyone? Not counting of course, RDJ as Doom. I wonder if Thor and Loki will interact.

Who are gonna be the actual Avengers in this Avengers movie? So far I only see Sam, Thor, Ant Man and War Machine maybe? Shuri maybe? She's the new Black Panther right (never saw the unnecessary sequel). Are they gonna draft the Fantastic Four and Thunderbolts as temp Avengers? Is Doom a new villain from the Fox-Men verse that somehow came over to the MCU and thus the Fox-Men followed him?

I'm thinking the Fox X-Men are here to finally, finally, FINALLY have their last hurrah? I mean we have X3, Days of Future Past, Phoenix, Logan and Deadpool and Wolverine. Maybe this will be the final end for them so we can move on to the MCU versions?

[ToTheNines]

Wait, are we mercifully being spared any Captain Marvel nonsense?

[Coola Yagami]

Hmmm good point. I didn't see Brie Larson's name anywhere.

[Autbot_Benz]

I’m just excited for Alan Cumming’s Nightcrawler to be back after all these years

[Andrew NDB]

Hmmm good point. I didn't see Brie Larson's name anywhere.

There's a lot of people's names that aren't there but obviously will be in the movie.

I’m just excited for Alan Cumming’s Nightcrawler to be back after all these years

It was fairly criminal he wasn't in X3 after all that big intro in X2. Or even Days of Future Past. But you know what is just plain days past? The Fox-Men. This is 20 years too late and who cares now, and where's the real MCU X-Men?

[Stu_Padasso]

Iy7k3aJS0Fw

What a shi-t show. This is going to be an enormous convoluted mess. Not every brand or IP has to be interconnected to each other. What’s next? Is Elsa from Frozen going to be a mutant with ice powers?

And people wonder why these movies and comics don’t sell anymore.

At this point, both Marvel Comics and Marvel Studios have become like an old building that needs to be condemned. You can put in a fancy chandelier like Deadpool and Wolverine but that doesn’t change the fact that it needs to be torn down.

You’re seeing the sunken cost fallacy in action.

[Andrew NDB]

I admit, combining some of the least liked IPs in the MCU from Disney+ with the f***ing Fox-Men... talk about something that's difficult to get excited about.

[ToTheNines]

So, the film is full of Fox-Men characters? Why? Who asked for them?

Bryan Singer’s young boyfriends.

[Andrew NDB]

This brings up a good question. What IS there to get excited about in this movie? Beyond a general sort of sense that the Russos will make lemonade from Phase 4's lemons -- SOMEHOW.

Like, what is there? Seeing Robert Downey Jr. as Victor Von Doom? I still HATE that idea.

[ToTheNines]

This brings up a good question. What IS there to get excited about in this movie? Beyond a general sort of sense that the Russos will make lemonade from Phase 4's lemons -- SOMEHOW.

Like, what is there? Seeing Robert Downey Jr. as Victor Von Doom? I still HATE that idea.

Good point. Seeing Sam form and lead his own Avengers team? Which is fine, but seems like he’ll never escape living in Steve’s shadow if that’s all he’s gonna do.

There’s been no build up to anything. We’ll meet Doom later this year, then he’s the big bad of an Avengers flick 1 year later? Yikes. We had 6 years between meeting Thanos and him stepping into the limelight.

[Coola Yagami]

This brings up a good question. What IS there to get excited about in this movie? Beyond a general sort of sense that the Russos will make lemonade from Phase 4's lemons -- SOMEHOW.

Like, what is there? Seeing Robert Downey Jr. as Victor Von Doom? I still HATE that idea.

Dude, you know. RdJ as Doom and now the return of the the Fox-Men. Plus with all these characters it makes the movie feel 'bigger' and more 'important'. I mean it is am Avengers movie after all, and do many characters make this feel like an all hands on deck Avengers level threat.

[Andrew NDB]

I really hope I'm wrong, but I'm still feeling like all of this sudden "love" for the Fox-Men is just to give audiences and X-Men fans something resembling the real X-Men before we get the actual super-DEIed/LGBBQed MCU version that is sure to piss off large swaths of the fandom. And also so that Marvel and Feige can still say, "You don't like the MCU X-Men? Don't worry! The Fox-Men are still out there, too, in the multiverse!"

[Coola Yagami]

It's kind of odd. Stuff like this really does retroactively turn the Fox movies unti part of the MCU.

[Andrew NDB]

It's kind of odd. Stuff like this really does retroactively turn the Fox movies unti part of the MCU.

Not really. Not any more than the Tobey Maguire or Andrew Garfield movies are suddenly MCU films because of No Way Home.

As far as I'm concerned, the only pre-MCU Marvel movie that SHOULD be a part of the MCU is the original Ang Lee "Hulk." You can tell it was even supposed to be, what with it ending right where "Incredible Hulk" picked up in South America.

[Coola Yagami]

Not really. Not any more than the Tobey Maguire or Andrew Garfield movies are suddenly MCU films because of No Way Home.

As far as I'm concerned, the only pre-MCU Marvel movie that SHOULD be a part of the MCU is the original Ang Lee "Hulk." You can tell it was even supposed to be, what with it ending right where "Incredible Hulk" picked up in South America.

I mean they kinda are. If it was a story cameo maybe, but all the villains stories continued in that one.

[Stu_Padasso]

I really hope I'm wrong, but I'm still feeling like all of this sudden "love" for the Fox-Men is just to give audiences and X-Men fans something resembling the real X-Men before we get the actual super-DEIed/LGBBQed MCU version that is sure to piss off large swaths of the fandom. And also so that Marvel and Feige can still say, "You don't like the MCU X-Men? Don't worry! The Fox-Men are still out there, too, in the multiverse!"

I was listening to the WDW Pro channel on YouTube earlier today and one of the panelists theorized that because so many of the Fox characters were white and male they decided to add a bunch of D-list characters to fill out the checkmarks.

[Andrew NDB]

I was listening to the WDW Pro channel on YouTube earlier today and one of the panelists theorized that because so many of the Fox characters were white and male they decided to add a bunch of D-list characters to fill out the checkmarks.

At least in terms of this initial "announcement trailer." Obviously at the VERY least Spider-Man is in it, and so is Peter Quill. MINIMUM.

[sdp]

This movie will hit a billion right? But it'll barely reach it and will be the worst performing Avengers movie. People will point out that the MCU is dead and fans will proclaim "if it's dead why did it do a billion!!11".

But the downward trend is there, obviously Spider-Man, X-Men, Iron Man will bring big numbers but none of the highs they got and they'll continue to do less with each entry. The B/C list heroes will continue to bomb besides an exception or two. You can blame bad writing and planning but even if it had been perfect the mainstream had already moved on, the bad writing and planning is just accelerating the inevitable.

[Coola Yagami]

Apparently the woke crowd is complaining that She Hulk and Cap Marvel aren't in it. Screw em.

[Andrew NDB]

Apparently the woke crowd is complaining that She Hulk and Cap Marvel aren't in it. Screw em.

They probably are in it. And the She Hulk actress just cancelled a bunch of convention appearances due to "film commitments" right as they're shooting Doomsday.

[IMJ]

I've seen that She-Hulk's story-role in these is supposed to be as big as The Vision's arc was in the last two Avengers flicks.

[ranger_scout]

Halle Berry won't be reprising the role of Storm.

https://deadline.com/2025/04/halle-berry-reprise-storm-avengers-doomsday-1236358742/

[Andrew NDB]

Halle Berry won't be reprising the role of Storm.

https://deadline.com/2025/04/halle-berry-reprise-storm-avengers-doomsday-1236358742/

Somehow, we will endure.

[ZariusTwo]

Halle Berry won't be reprising the role of Storm.

https://deadline.com/2025/04/halle-berry-reprise-storm-avengers-doomsday-1236358742/

Ha, just when Marvel are pushing a 'Storm' comic as part of their, admittedly failing, X-Line. This'll end it for sure.

[ranger_scout]

This is strange. Channing Tatum is saying that while he is in the movie, he actually might not be playing Gambit.

https://comicbookmovie.com/avengers/avengers-doomsday/channing-tatum-addresses-avengers-doomsday-role-indicates-that-he-may-not-be-playing-gambit-a218479#gs.lewfzx

[Andrew NDB]

This is strange. Channing Tatum is saying that while he is in the movie, he actually might not be playing Gambit.

https://comicbookmovie.com/avengers/avengers-doomsday/channing-tatum-addresses-avengers-doomsday-role-indicates-that-he-may-not-be-playing-gambit-a218479#gs.lewfzx

He's probably playing it safe and not realizing that Marvel already released the CHARACTER names next to the actors on the chairs already.

[Autbot_Benz]

Halle Berry won't be reprising the role of Storm.

https://deadline.com/2025/04/halle-berry-reprise-storm-avengers-doomsday-1236358742/

Good she was a terrible storm

[IMJ]

Social media and the shill sites are all abuzz with FoX-Men talk. So funny when an opportunity for social onboarding arrives, everyone quickly forgets how most of those movies were complete dog$#!(.

[Coola Yagami]

Social media and the shill sites are all abuzz with FoX-Men talk. So funny when an opportunity for social onboarding arrives, everyone quickly forgets how most of those movies were complete dog$#!(.

ehhh X1 was alright for what it was, but most of it was the spectacle of seeing Wolverine and Magneto come to life.

X2 was awesome.

The less said about X3 the better.

Wolverine Origins was near-perfect, they just missed the landing with Deadpoool... but then ironically we wouldn't have gotten the modern day Deadpool trilogy.

Didn't care for First Class. The only one of those I cared about was Days of Future Past since it brought back the classics a bit.

[Andrew NDB]

No, no.

X1 was revolutionary because it was. It kicked in the door for superhero movies in 2000.

X2 was boring. Great Mansion invasion scene... boring everything else.

X3 I liked but everybody else hated.

First Class was GREAT! Possibilities there.

Days of Future Past was horrible. Glimmers of hope. Because this was a project the First Class guy was going to do until Bryan Singer exuded control.

Apocalypse was horrible. Apocalypse himself was laughable.

Dark Phoenix was an embarassment.

Wolverine?

I don't believe anyone would argue the intitial few prequel scenes that don't involve Deadpool are probably canon. Beyond that... idk. It quickly became a ****** 90s-style empty-headed action thing with all the tropes and it deserves all the hate.

The Wolverine. Not terrible but not great either.

Logan. Awesome! But it's also kinda... not building anything from those old ****** and often conflicting old X-Men movies.

[ZariusTwo]

X-3 I was hot and cold on for a while, nowadays I've warmed fully to it, it grounded the Phoenix stuff and simply told a story where a big fear about Jean is realized without all the space opera.

I did like Days of Future Past a lot, it was inferior to First Class though, and it felt like it had a grudge against it...obvious now thinking about the BTS stuff.

Apocalypse and Dark Phoenix should never have been greenlit.

The Wolverine films get better as they go I find

[ZariusTwo]

Wong and Marsden (minus visor) on set

https://xcancel.com/Sofianegamer001/status/1910700040638570747

[IMJ]

I feel like Marsden never got a fair shot as Cyclops in any of the movies. Too overshadowed by Wolverine....

[Coola Yagami]

I feel like Marsden never got a fair shot as Cyclops in any of the movies. Too overshadowed by Wolverine....

Most of his stuff was in the first movie.

He was missing/abducted for most of the second. Died about 15 minutes in the third. Though that one was he was filming Superman Returns.

[IMJ]

Most of his stuff was in the first movie.

He was missing/abducted for most of the second. Died about 15 minutes in the third. Though that one was he was filming Superman Returns.

Correct. On all of that... uhhh... hence "He never got a fair shot as Cyclops".

Even in movie 1 he didn't really get to emerge as a "leader" outside of "well he gave the occasional order".

[ZariusTwo]

More from the Doomsday set

https://x.com/TeeCeeComics/status/1911081301261550060

Screen test revealing Doom's look

https://x.com/thelegacyofnerd/status/1911518930415632513

[ToTheNines]

Atrocious. Hopefully that’s not real.

[ZariusTwo]

Atrocious. Hopefully that’s not real.

He looks like Jaga from Thundercats

[ToTheNines]

Lmao, very good

[IMJ]

I'm worried that could be real. Looks similar to the Infamous Iron Man design and also continues the diminishment of super-heroes on-screen for the actors face nonsense.

Honestly, I'm not feeling the direction for this at all whatsoever and I can't help but feel that the cheering for Downey as Doom is the same braindead social-phenomena we got during Iron Man 3 before everyone shook it off and started admitting that movie sucked.

I mean honestly - who honestly thought that Downey as Dr. Doom was a good direction to go in when you have "normal Dr. Doom" to do correctly without some nonsense spin?

[ranger_scout]

Days of Future Past was horrible. Glimmers of hope. Because this was a project the First Class guy was going to do until Bryan Singer exuded control.

Did you see the alternate version known as The Rogue Cut, which was released on home media back in 2015? Over the years, I found myself enjoying it more than the theatrical cut. I know fans are divided about Anna Paquin’s portrayal of Rogue in the films compared to how the character was written in the comics and the animated TV shows. She felt more like a combination of Kitty Pryde from the comics and Jubilee from the original animated TV series with Rogue’s absorbing powers. However, I didn’t mind it. This is probably because as a little boy I loved Anna Paquin in Fly Away Home. I hope she will get to return as Rogue in these films and have the ability to fly, especially if Gambit is indeed going to be in them.

[Andrew NDB]

https://i.ibb.co/gbG0RYXR/FB-IMG-1746722675882.jpg

[IMJ]

Obviously am curious to see how this unfolds, but.... eh. I dunno.

[Andrew NDB]

I'm thinking more and more by the end of this we end up with Tony Stark -- the real Tony Stark -- back, and Dr. Doom in the real Victor Von Doom body. Whoever will be playing that.

[Autbot_Benz]

I'm thinking more and more by the end of this we end up with Tony Stark -- the real Tony Stark -- back, and Dr. Doom in the real Victor Von Doom body. Whoever will be playing that.

Feigie has said numerous times they will never cheapen or on due Tony’s Death from Endgame

In a recent Vanity Fair cover story about Downey Jr., the president of Marvel Studios addressed whether or not they would resurrect Iron Man/Tony Stark after his death in “Avengers: Endgame.”

“We are going to keep that moment and not touch that moment again,” Feige said of Stark’s final moments in the 2019 film. “We all worked very hard for many years to get to that, and we would never want to magically undo it in any way.”

https://variety.com/2023/film/news/robert-downey-jr-iron-man-not-return-says-kevin-feige-mcu-1235819990/

[Andrew NDB]

Feigie has said numerous times they will never cheapen or on due Tony’s Death from Endgame

Was any of those times before or after Disney hemorrhaged hundreds of millions of dollars from MCU fail after fail after fail?

[IMJ]

There are a variety of ways that bringing Stark back into the fold via the multiverse doesn't cheapen his Endgame death at all. Not sure how anyone thinks those two points can't rationalize together.

But none of that changes the fact that bringing in a banger like Doom and tying him to Stark at all beyond opposition of the two is f'n dumb.

[ToTheNines]

There are a variety of ways that bringing Stark back into the fold via the multiverse doesn't cheapen his Endgame death at all. Not sure how anyone thinks those two points can't rationalize together.

I disagree. While it’s obvious that there’s 9 million Tony Starks alive and well in the multiverse, I think the MCU needs to keep him dead. Or rather, RDJ needs to be off limits. A re-cast Tony would be fine.


But none of that changes the fact that bringing in a banger like Doom and tying him to Stark at all beyond opposition of the two is f'n dumb.

Hard agree. We’re finally getting a semi-faithful FF movie, complete with a bunch of Kirby-isms and a REAL Galactus… but they have to reinvent Doom like this? We want Victor von Doom, the King of Latveria, speaking in the third person and hating Reed. Not Tony in a new suit.

[Andrew NDB]

I think you're missing the point. I can die tomorrow saving a town or something... then 10 years later a voodoo priestess brings me back to life. That doesn't nullify my sacrifice or what I did.

But yeah. They need to stop being weird about recasting people. These characters should be evergreen... no torch passing to DEI people or kids. But you can tell that's at least originally what most excited them... start with the core MCU, make a lot of money and interest, then bait and switch them to who they REALLY want to tell "stories" about.

[ToTheNines]

I think you're missing the point. I can die tomorrow saving a town or something... then 10 years later a voodoo priestess brings me back to life. That doesn't nullify my sacrifice or what I did.

In this analogy, no it wouldn’t nullify your bravery or nobility.

But from a narrative standpoint, it certainly cheapens the stakes.

And dead or not, Endgame was mean to be the END for certain characters. Most of all Tony and Steve. Steve isn’t even dead and I don’t think Chris Evans should ever return either. Turn the page. (Although I think a scene with Old Man Steve would have been huge for Brave New World).

[IMJ]

There are a variety of ways that bringing Stark back into the fold via the multiverse doesn't cheapen his Endgame death at all

I disagree. While it’s obvious that there’s 9 million Tony Starks alive and well in the multiverse, I think the MCU needs to keep him dead. Or rather, RDJ needs to be off limits. A re-cast Tony would be fine.

There are a variety of ways that bringing Stark back into the fold

I disagree. Or rather, RDJ needs to be off limits. A re-cast Tony would be fine.

There are a variety of ways

I disagree.

A re-cast Tony would be fine

:teek:
-sigh-

I think you're missing the point. I can die tomorrow saving a town or something... then 10 years later a voodoo priestess brings me back to life. That doesn't nullify my sacrifice or what I did.

And on that note, I would, surprisingly enough be okay with a recast. I love Downey as Iron Man.... love it. But the shared continuity has choked itself out a bit and I'm down with a full MCU reset and relaunch to be honest. And I'm not down for "Woke FF" fixing it.

[Andrew NDB]

And on that note, I would, surprisingly enough be okay with a recast. I love Downey as Iron Man.... love it. But the shared continuity has choked itself out a bit

Of course. And years ago I was saying how they could've had it both ways... in the battle with Thanos, just have Tony get hit with the Time Gem or something... POOF... new actor.

And it's a weird dichotomy at Disney MCU. We are both supposed to be growing old beside these characters and actors (because they are forcing that)... yet, don't look over here when we recast this person or that person. But certainly not THAT person (Ed Norton). It seems like a really root core thing that has been here from the beginning, and it has to be Feige himself.

I've always said, just treat this like comics. We are always in a forever moving forward "present day." Never state a year on screen. When actors age out, replace. Otherwise the MCU will either be, A) This thing where the actual characters people care about waste away and disappear and are perennially replaced by ones that nobody wants or cares about. B) We just reboot everything every 20 years or whatever. I say C) James Bond it. Like, the old James Bond. Sure the times change, but it's the same character(s) living the same lives with the same experiences. Yeah, some of the time-specific stuff won't make sense 10 years from then, but roll with it.

[Autbot_Benz]

AVENGERS: DOOMSDAY’ has been delayed to December 18, 2026.

https://x.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1925689224772063455

[Andrew NDB]

They must have just signed some new actors that will require waiting for their availability.

[ToTheNines]

Don’t know if this is news or not, but I just saw an updated MCU slate and there’s a currently unknown film scheduled for July 2027 in between the two Avengers movies.

I’ve seen people guess Dr. Strange 3 and Shang Chi 2. My guess is Thor 5.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

https://x.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1925689224772063455

Literally the same day as Ice Age 6, another Disney produced movie.:P

[Andrew NDB]

I’ve seen people guess Dr. Strange 3 and Shang Chi 2. My guess is Thor 5.

The only one of those 3 movies guaranteed to be in full-on production (or, you know, actually end up happening at all) is Dr. Strange 3. Though man, I'd really love to see a Thor 5 that repairs all the crap from the last 2 movies.

[ToTheNines]

The only one of those 3 movies guaranteed to be in full-on production (or, you know, actually end up happening at all) is Dr. Strange 3. Though man, I'd really love to see a Thor 5 that repairs all the crap from the last 2 movies.

Ha, yeah I guess I should have said “my wish” was Thor 5. Would make me happy to get one more that sent the character off on a high note. Which might be accomplished by one or both of these Avengers flicks.

[Andrew NDB]

Yeahhh...

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/16LkRsgt7x/

[IMJ]

Yeahhh...

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/16LkRsgt7x/

I think that entire thing was A.I.

[Andrew NDB]

Ryan Reynolds teases his involvement:

https://www.darkhorizons.com/reynolds-teasing-deadpool-in-avengers/

[IMJ]

The truth is that there have only been two Avengers movies. "Avengers" and "Avengers: Age of Ultron".

The rest have been "Marvel Universe" flicks.

[Andrew NDB]

The truth is that there have only been two Avengers movies. "Avengers" and "Avengers: Age of Ultron".

The rest have been "Marvel Universe" flicks.

And there's really only been 1 (maayyybe 1 and a half if we're being generous) Captain America movies.

[IMJ]

And there's really only been 1 (maayyybe 1 and a half if we're being generous) Captain America movies.

I'd say that "Winter Soldier" was a full-on Captain America movie. Black Widow fits into that world and basically every other character in that movie was firmly seated in a "Captain America vehicle".

Obviously Civil War was in many ways "Avengers 2.5".

[Andrew NDB]

I'd say that "Winter Soldier" was a full-on Captain America movie.

By comparison to Civil War, of course. But as cool as Winter Soldier was and as well told that story was, it really didn't do much of anything with Steve as a character or a person. It was Event Mode the whole time.

[ZariusTwo]

Steve only really gets five minutes of 'slice of life' in WS and CW. The rest of the time he's in Captain America mode

[ZariusTwo]

There was a brief behind-the-scenes falling out between two of the actors, to the point they were wiling to film scenes where they interact separate from one another, but it all got resolved peacefully

https://comicbookmovie.com/avengers/avengers-doomsday/rumor-new-details-emerge-about-on-set-clash-between-two-avengers-doomsday-stars-who-went-at-each-other-a223406

[IMJ]

For some reason I can't help but feel that Pascal ran his weirdo-mouth in "too much familiarity" with Ruffalo, and it went through Ruffalo's weirdo-brain and he was "offended".

Obviously I have no idea if that's the two people but it's an immediate personality fit.

[Andrew NDB]

It's a short list of people who could get offended like that loudly in a production of this magnitude.

[Andrew NDB]

C'mon, Simu...

RYUUbKqzKBI

[ranger_scout]

Guess who's back?

https://comicbook.com/movies/news/avengers-doomsday-report-confirms-steve-rogers-trailer-return-as-russos-post-cryptic-tease/

[neatoman]

Guess who's back?

https://comicbook.com/movies/news/avengers-doomsday-report-confirms-steve-rogers-trailer-return-as-russos-post-cryptic-tease/

YVkUvmDQ3HY

[sdp]

How much can this movie make?
With returning characters including foxmen, huge marketing since Disney knows everything depends on this movie doing well. I think tis going to struggle to even reach a billion.

[IMJ]

Nah, it will make money, but it won't be on the authenticity of the movie. People will pay simply to finally see these characters on-screen together and to find out what nonsense they are pulling with Iron Man.

This is an instance where it won't matter that it's littered with a forced-woke cast, or characters that people haven't cared about for going on 7 years now.

And then guys like Feige will suddenly come crawling out of the woodwork again to go on about how well they "celebrated the world" with their comic book movie and it will get run into the ground all over again.

Evidence before (movies with HUGE diminishing returns and audience rejecting since Endgame). Spike in the middle (Doomsday). Abandonment after, unless maybe they reboot the entire thing.

[Coola Yagami]

I keep finding AI fakes. Where's the actual trailer. There's rumors that Chris Evans is back?

[Andrew NDB]

It's not a very exciting trailer. It's just Evans arriving on a motorcycle, going inside his house with Peggy, looking at his Captain America costume, holding his baby, then it says "Steve Rogers will return in Avengers: Doomsday." Nobody else is in the trailer.

[Coola Yagami]

It's not a very exciting trailer. It's just Evans arriving on a motorcycle, going inside his house with Peggy, looking at his Captain America costume, holding his baby, then it says "Steve Rogers will return in Avengers: Doomsday." Nobody else is in the trailer.

To be honest, that's pretty much all you need.

[ToTheNines]

Awful.

Not only are they just crapping on all these endings we got in Endgame (that were all great and should be permanent), but they’re just throwing all of this together with zero buildup. What is going on over there?

[Andrew NDB]

Awful.

Not only are they just crapping on all these endings we got in Endgame (that were all great and should be permanent)

Permanent? They never even should have happened to begin with. The MCU was finally growing into cohesion by about the time of Infinity War... we didn't need an "ending" for all these characters.

[ToTheNines]

In a perfect world where the movies could more closely reflect the comics, sure.

But knowing that these actors don’t want these roles forever and the studio has an aversion to recasting, I thought they did a great job with Endgame as a finale.

Again, perfect world scenario would have had Steve around for all of phase 5-6. Instead he’s just gonna show up in Doomsday with zero buildup. I’ll still see it probably, but damn.

[ranger_scout]

I keep finding AI fakes. Where's the actual trailer. There's rumors that Chris Evans is back?

Marvel just officially confirmed Chris Evans is back as Captain America.

https://variety.com/2025/film/news/chris-evans-avengers-doomsday-teaser-captain-america-1236609054/

[sdp]

To me even 15 years ago it seemed obvious to me that studios just needed to continue with comic book movies as if they were still set in the same world and recasting, keeping these characters alive adventure after adventure, giving nods to continuity but at the same time being lax with it. Like James Bond did it successfully, it was technically the same Bond despite taking place in different decades.
WB was kind of doing this with the original Batman movies when they transitioned from Burton to Schumacher. Batman Begins would've also been a great Batman to continue had Nolan not messed it up by giving Bruce an ending.
Hell the DCU should've been a soft reboot to the DCEU, just giving these characters none of the prior baggage but new adventures that technically the older ones still happened.

but they’re just throwing all of this together with zero buildup. What is going on over there?
They're desperate and in denial, they see that the MCU boom is gone and are trying to revive it at all costs.

we didn't need an "ending" for all these characters.
The general audience wanted an ending, they'd been following the characters for ten years and were invested. They wanted a pay off. Even if End Game hadn't been an "ending" to most of the characters, people would've just gotten fed up and jumped ship. End Game gave them a conclusion to what they had been following and they loved it for it. The general audiences getting sick of the MCU was going to happen regardless, in fact it might've been more drastic had they continued it without some sort of 'end'.

[ToTheNines]

Agreed.

Permanent? They never even should have happened to begin with. The MCU was finally growing into cohesion by about the time of Infinity War... we didn't need an "ending" for all these characters.

Also, this isn’t “the return” of Steve Rogers. He’s going to just go away again after this. They’re dusting him off for Doomsday/Secret Wars because they’re desperate, that’s it. Seems cheap.

I don’t know what I’m even expecting from these two movies. I guess I thought Doomsday would be a Dr. Doom movie with a real story and then SW would be the big dumb “everybody’s in it” event that capped off the Multiverse Saga. So it feels weird to me that they appear to be hitting the panic button for part 1. But I have no idea how these two will be structured, so we’ll see.

[Andrew NDB]

Also, this isn’t “the return” of Steve Rogers. He’s going to just go away again after this. They’re dusting him off for Doomsday/Secret Wars because they’re desperate, that’s it. Seems cheap.

I'm not so convinced. Chis Evans isn't exactly putting out any hits that aren't called "Captain America" so they could probably negotiate something at not-RDJ levels of insanity. And the Mackie Captain America seems to have already run its course unless they want to put out another flop just for the sake of it.

And jeeze. There's no really "clean" way to do that. Either there will just be two Captain Americas running around and we aren't supposed to think much about it... or the Mackie Cap will die and Evans will -- reluctantly -- take back up the shield. There really couldn't be him stepping back down to be Falcon or anything.

I don’t know what I’m even expecting from these two movies. I guess I thought Doomsday would be a Dr. Doom movie with a real story and then SW would be the big dumb “everybody’s in it” event that capped off the Multiverse Saga.

That's exactly what I thought this would be. It's not even outside the realm of possibility that that WAS the idea... until they decided they needed to beef it up even more. In fact, isn't it a bit strange they're announcing RDJ as Doom not just for this one but Secret Wars? As in, "Huh, I guess Doom wins, yeah?" Endgame had an excuse when we already knew Thanos would survive into it because Endgame was called "Infinity War Part 2" until fairly late into things.

[Coola Yagami]

I'm not so convinced. Chis Evans isn't exactly putting out any hits that aren't called "Captain America" so they could probably negotiate something at not-RDJ levels of insanity. And the Mackie Captain America seems to have already run its course unless they want to put out another flop just for the sake of it.

And jeeze. There's no really "clean" way to do that. Either there will just be two Captain Americas running around and we aren't supposed to think much about it... or the Mackie Cap will die and Evans will -- reluctantly -- take back up the shield. There really couldn't be him stepping back down to be Falcon or anything.






Sadly that's how Marvel is nowadays. Steve loses the effects of the serum and turns his real age, so Falcon steps up to be the new Cap. Steve regains his powers and youth.... but Falcon doesn't step down. Now we got 2 Captain Americas.

Wolverine dies for a few years. Laura becomes the new Wolverine. Wolverine comes back to life... Laura doesn't go back to being X23... now we got 2 Wolverines.

Deadpool had a similar thing, which led to a mini-series called Deadpools and Wolverines.

Miles takes over as Spider-Man in the Ultimate Universe where Peter died. He's now in the 616 Universe which, as you know, Peter is still pretty much alive and active as Spider-Man. Miles doesn't change his codename or anything so now we got two Spider-Men. It's kinda silly considering that there are several Spider-Women but she doesn't have that problem. Gwen and Cindy call themselves Ghost Spider and Silk. They're not running around as Spider-Women as well.

Tony Stark was in a coma when Riri stepped up. Luckily they at least had the sense to call her Iron Heart instead of Iron Man since we knew eventually Tony was going to return.

[ZariusTwo]

Miles takes over as Spider-Man in the Ultimate Universe where Peter died.

And Ultimate Peter came back from the dead and chose to let Miles keep the mantle while he travelled the world seeking answers as to how he survived, taking MJ with him. Peter eventually returned to New York after Miles crossed over to 616 and became Spider-Man again.

[ZariusTwo]

Saw the Thor leak, it was dubbed in french but looked legit enough. Glad to see him treated seriously again.

[ZariusTwo]

UiMg566PREA

[Coola Yagami]

I guess one doesn't inherit the super soldier serum. I'm sure that kid would have been old enough in current day to replace both Walker and Sam as Captain America.

[Autbot_Benz]

Saw the Thor leak, it was dubbed in french but looked legit enough. Glad to see him treated seriously again.

Same here. That stupid hack Taika” I hate Thor Comics” Watiti did serious damage to Thor

[sdp]

That's the most "look it's the characters you used to love, please come see this movie" teaser trailer I've ever seen.

[Andrew NDB]

Same here. That stupid hack Taika” I hate Thor Comics” Watiti did serious damage to Thor

And yet the brain numbs welcomed him to the franchise with open arms with Ragnarok. But I saw what was happening, and what would happen if that was successful.

[IMJ]

Obviously we don't know the reality of what they are doing with Downey as Doom, but the MCU drifted too far away from the source material that we want to see. These movies are more for simple-minded normies (the colosseum goers) than for true fans of the art (the philosophers) and it's all guided by Kevin Feige who doesn't give a $#!( about anything beyond manipulating the peasants (the Caesar).

Downey as Doom is not compelling at all. And it's a ridiculous amount of mental-gymnastics to make it satisfying by some reveal that it's actually Tony playing at being a multi-verse Doom in order to stop the real Doom and return to the MCU.

The pulled off something great with entire Thanos thing, but it didn't need to end with the death of Iron Man. Honestly, I don't look at that as "story served" as much as "actor and studio ego". And following that line of thought, Downey as Doom seems like more "Actor ego" with the "final encore to bow out", except that Stark as Doom is ridiculous.

[Andrew NDB]

Downey as Doom is not compelling at all. And it's a ridiculous amount of mental-gymnastics to make it satisfying by some reveal that it's actually Tony playing at being a multi-verse Doom in order to stop the real Doom and return to the MCU.

That's really the only way this will be palatable. Getting RDJ back as Iron Man riiight at the finish line when they do their soft reboot and recastings.

[IMJ]

That's really the only way this will be palatable. Getting RDJ back as Iron Man riiight at the finish line when they do their soft reboot and recastings.

Exactly. But it's too much of a stretch - this isn't a "return to the great MCU".
It's an epilogue for the original actors likely to take a final bow.

I honestly, sincerely hope that "Secret Wars" wipes the entire slate 100% clean, but it probably won't because there are movies coming out in between Doomsday and Secret Wars.

[ToTheNines]

These movies are more for simple-minded normies (the colosseum goers) than for true fans of the art (the philosophers) and it's all guided by Kevin Feige who doesn't give a $#!( about anything beyond manipulating the peasants (the Caesar).

lol, I love this.

[Andrew NDB]

I think Feige was OK in the beginning years of the MCU but clearly he hit one too many Hollywood, liberal cocktail parties along the way and became comprised pretty fully. All the praises in the world you can sing about him, he's still the guy that approved stuff like the Marvels, Ironheart, Wonder Man, Love & Thunder and all of this stuff since Endgame. And instituted a company-wide directive away from straight, white male characters. If Feige's efforts had "worked" and an audience existed for it, we'd be knee deep right now in more sequels to the Marvels, with Riri and She-Hulk and Captain Two Moms popping up in everything. The (DEI) "Young Avengers" would have already been made and probably had a sequel by now, with solo movies probably planned for Hawkeye-woman, Kamala Khan and Captain Two Moms.

The unfortunate part is that even now, I don't really think there's anyone waiting in the wings that would be any better than Feige.

[sdp]

It's not that deep. They found a formulat that worked and replicated it movie after movie. I tapped out during phase 2 because of it but people were getting what they wanted and sure the content wasn't bad, just a bit by the numbers for me to care. But now that the stories they were invested in ended, there's no reason to watch these anymore for the average person as they see it's more of the same.

[IMJ]

Well, I will say this - most of the Marvel flicks aren't really all that great. The standouts are:

Iron Man
Cap Winter Soldier
The Avengers
Doctor Strange
Avengers: Infinity War
Spider-Man: No Way Home

I mean that's it. That's the true top-tier list of MCU flicks. Now the list bulges out underneath that one - the spread of "servicable and entertaining MCU flicks" gets a lot longer (i.e. all three Guardians movies) and then you have the truly formulaic junk flicks (the first two Thor flicks) and pretty much any movie with "THE MESSAGE" (majority of post-Endgame).

I mean hell, even here on this forum I'd be hard pressed to see anyone argue with that. Maybe some argument about "Black Panther" but I'd still file that movie as "garbage" from it's association as an "agenda flick" with some of the worst, T.V. grade VFX in any Marvel movie. I'd rather watch BP in Civil War where he was still amazing and promising.

[CyberCubed]

I think it's just diminishing returns. The movies also don't feel fresh anymore because they recycle the same formula, the jokes feel the same, the character interactions are the same, etc.

I mean they made what...like 40 movies over 15+ years? That's still an impressive run.

[Xav]

I guess one doesn't inherit the super soldier serum. I'm sure that kid would have been old enough in current day to replace both Walker and Sam as Captain America.That kid would be in his 70s in current day.

[Andrew NDB]

I think it's just diminishing returns. The movies also don't feel fresh anymore because they recycle the same formula, the jokes feel the same, the character interactions are the same, etc.

They can always mix things up. That's not the problem. The problem is that Feige/Marvel/Disney have been dead set on aging out the core characters with the actual actors so that they can replace them with ones more in keeping with the higher ups' ideology (that means mostly women, disabled people, POC and LGBTQ stuff). They've already saddled all of the surviving Avengers with kids now (mostly girls). When they realized that none of this was working and nobody wanted to see this new direction it was mostly too late. Now the best they can do is do a couple back to back events to "freshen the pot" and revitalize/recast where needed.

In comic book terms, they're cancelling Vol. 1 of the MCU and bringing it back with a nice, shiny Vol. 2 #1. After Secret Wars.

[Coola Yagami]

One problem I also see is how a lot of the main characters are kinda similar. Tony is a smartass. Strange is a smartass. Starlord is a bit of a smartass. It's no problem when they're in their own movies, but lump em together and you got 2-3 guys all trying to out-smartass each other. It becomes a contest of which one gets to make the next big quotable quote that gets memed.

[sdp]

A Phase 4 that did the exact same things they had done previously would've failed as well. Perhaps not as fast but people are just tired of the formula. Only comic book nerds thought this could go on forever. Normies just found it cool for 10 years.

We'll never in our lifetimes get to the level of popularity that the MCU had, it's like those wrestling fans that think the Attitude era can just come back if things were exactly like they were in the attitude era. No, the time has passed.

[Andrew NDB]

A Phase 4 that did the exact same things they had done previously would've failed as well.

idk, I don't think so. If they'd, say, right away started dropping breadcrumbs about Galactus after Endgame and did a slow crawl to a F4 movie that might have been something for Phase IV. Something and not nothing (which is what we got).

And what a waste, btw. They could have milked so much out of Galactus in advance of him and all they end up doing is, "Yep, there he is. In our F4 movie." During the marketing for the movie. That's it.

[IMJ]

A Phase 4 that did the exact same things they had done previously would've failed as well.

Nah, that's not on point at all. The MCU storytellers lost sight of good-narrative construction for the cash grab and they lost sight of a developing fanbase for "social messaging". And it came crashing down.

[ZariusTwo]

The X-Men teaser leaked

https://www.reddit.com/r/MCUTheories/comments/1pxmkcr/avengers_doomsday_trailer_3/

[ToTheNines]

Death comes for us all, Oroku Saki. But something much worse comes for you…

[ToTheNines]

KVS4TLWLDaQ?si=E76uUHE-z2LJSKlr

[sdp]

We're going to get an RDJ trailer where it seems he's iron man but at the end it'll show him with the Dr. Doom armor instead.

[Andrew NDB]

Yeah, the Rogue Cut made it like 3% better. No clue why that stuff was even cut to begin with.

[Stu_Padasso]

I admit that crossovers can be fun, but…

Does anyone else think that the X-Men and Avengers should each be their own thing? Can’t we focus on cohesive storytelling instead of “My favorite character has a bigger d!ck than yours” gimmick? I’m not ten years old anymore. And I can’t afford to buy comics or watch movies to keep up with this crap.

[IMJ]

I admit that crossovers can be fun, but…

Does anyone else think that the X-Men and Avengers should each be their own thing? Can’t we focus on cohesive storytelling instead of “My favorite character has a bigger d!ck than yours” gimmick? I’m not ten years old anymore. And I can’t afford to buy comics or watch movies to keep up with this crap.

The first problem is that we basically got two real "Avengers" flicks, and these Avengers movies are now "Marvel Universe" movies. The other problem is that people are "easy". I mean, I know this and am still excited by Cyclops in the costume actually doing "Cyclops stuff" on-screen after 25 years of waiting.

But, that's what is going to sell this movie. If none of that were there and this was the "Woke Avengers" as was pushed on us since Endgame, then it would fail miserably.

Infinity War and Endgame had narrative build-up and authentic excitement. This Doomsday thing is 100% pure "'memberberries".

[ZariusTwo]

KVS4TLWLDaQ?si=E76uUHE-z2LJSKlr

And now the real one

1clWprLC5Ak

[Barkworm]

The X-Men teaser leaked

https://www.reddit.com/r/MCUTheories/comments/1pxmkcr/avengers_doomsday_trailer_3/

Wait, what? Is this real? Stewart and McKellen AGAIN??? WHY?

[Autbot_Benz]

Wait, what? Is this real? Stewart and McKellen AGAIN??? WHY?

Cause they want to give the fox men one final send off before the MCU version

[Barkworm]

How many send offs do they need? Stewart's Xavier has died at least three times already.

[ToTheNines]

A Phase 4 that did the exact same things they had done previously would've failed as well. Perhaps not as fast but people are just tired of the formula. Only comic book nerds thought this could go on forever. Normies just found it cool for 10 years.

We'll never in our lifetimes get to the level of popularity that the MCU had, it's like those wrestling fans that think the Attitude era can just come back if things were exactly like they were in the attitude era. No, the time has passed.

Right, the fad is over. Look at Walking Dead. It was HUGE for a while, and it had consistency issues the entire time. Plus plenty of good seasons after the hype died down.

How many send offs do they need? Stewart's Xavier has died at least three times already.

Seriously.

[Stu_Padasso]

The first problem is that we basically got two real "Avengers" flicks, and these Avengers movies are now "Marvel Universe" movies. The other problem is that people are "easy". I mean, I know this and am still excited by Cyclops in the costume actually doing "Cyclops stuff" on-screen after 25 years of waiting.

But, that's what is going to sell this movie. If none of that were there and this was the "Woke Avengers" as was pushed on us since Endgame, then it would fail miserably.

Fair enough. The thing is that many of us know that these are “memberberrys.” It only worked for Deadpool and Wolverine because it was a screwball comedy.


Infinity War and Endgame had narrative build-up and authentic excitement.

I would have to respectfully disagree. I hate to sound like an armchair economist, but a lot of the time it’s not due to a lack of resources but rather supply chain problems. War, trade disputes, pandemics, corruption, mismanagement, and so on.

Thanos could have simply used the Infinity Gauntlet to double the amount of resources in the universe our used it’s power as leverage to resolve these problems. Instead, he’s just a giant purple Greta Thunberg.

And it’s still a bloated mess that requires me to watch hours upon hours of television and movies that I don’t care for or do research online to follow what’s going on. That’s not entertainment, that’s homework. Of course I will be accused of not being a “true fan” because I can’t spend next month’s mortgage payment on this stuff because I don’t treat Marvel as a lifestyle brand that defines me.

I got back into TMNT in large part because it was a “smaller,” more digestible universe. If it crossovers with anything it should be John Wick because it itself is still a newer, “smaller” franchise.

And because I want to see Keanu kill the Shredder with a pencil.

[IMJ]

I would have to respectfully disagree. I hate to sound like an armchair economist, but a lot of the time it’s not due to a lack of resources but rather supply chain problems. War, trade disputes, pandemics, corruption, mismanagement, and so on.

Thanos could have simply used the Infinity Gauntlet to double the amount of resources in the universe our used it’s power as leverage to resolve these problems. Instead, he’s just a giant purple Greta Thunberg.

And it’s still a bloated mess that requires me to watch hours upon hours of television and movies that I don’t care for or do research online to follow what’s going on. That’s not entertainment, that’s homework. Of course I will be accused of not being a “true fan” because I can’t spend next month’s mortgage payment on this stuff because I don’t treat Marvel as a lifestyle brand that defines me.

I got back into TMNT in large part because it was a “smaller,” more digestible universe. If it crossovers with anything it should be John Wick because it itself is still a newer, “smaller” franchise.

And because I want to see Keanu kill the Shredder with a pencil.

I mean that's an interesting perspective but... uhh... how does that line up to disagreeing with:

Infinity War and Endgame had narrative build-up and authentic excitement.

Because regardless of the plot, those movies did have "narrative build-up and authentic excitement" for them.

I got back into TMNT in large part because it was a “smaller,” more digestible universe. If it crossovers with anything it should be John Wick because it itself is still a newer, “smaller” franchise.

And because I want to see Keanu kill the Shredder with a pencil.

That is a crossover begging to happen.....

[Autbot_Benz]

That Thor trailer is amazing barley over a minute and it’s more Thor than love and blunder was

[Andrew NDB]

Wait, what? Is this real? Stewart and McKellen AGAIN??? WHY?

How many send offs do they need? Stewart's Xavier has died at least three times already.

I was perfectly OK to never see any trace of the Fox-Men ever again, like a faded, mostly bad memory. But I think this is less another goodbye to the Fox-Men as it just is Marvel/Disney wanting to play with the toys they bought from Fox at least one time before they make their own versions of them.

[IMJ]

I was alright never seeing them again too - the FoX-Men are generally the most dragged-out awfulness, surpassed only by the SPONY-Man universe.

The first two Singer X-Flicks got by first on "FINALLY, the X-Men onscreen" and then by "FINALLY: Wolverine goes ape$#!( onscreen!"

After that, people just went to go see all of those movies out of unrealized hope and the occasional neat concept here or there within a series of otherwise crummy movies that didn't really reflect the source material very well - or at least how fans wanted.

But on the other hand, it could be really cool finally getting to see these guys on camera with some sense of great accuracy and more iconic moments.

[Barkworm]

I was perfectly OK to never see any trace of the Fox-Men ever again, like a faded, mostly bad memory. But I think this is less another goodbye to the Fox-Men as it just is Marvel/Disney wanting to play with the toys they bought from Fox at least one time before they make their own versions of them.

But they've already done that, at least twice. Enough already.

[Andrew NDB]

But they've already done that, at least twice. Enough already.

Not fully. The reshoot scene in Doctor Strange 2 wasn't much of anything. They haven't really done anything else with the Fox-Men beyond Deadpool 3.

[sdp]

People are nostalgic about the Fox Men and no "correct" version of the MCU will ever top it, just how Sony's Spider-Mans will forever be the 'real' live action spidey for most and not the MCU one. So yeah of course they'll bring them back, no one is going to care for recast Wolverine/Professor X/etc. It doesn't matter that the movies weren't perfect, people can forgive that if they see the actors they love. Casuals don't care about the story implications or whatever and since they can hand wave it as "it's the multiverse" no one cares anymore.

[IMJ]

People are nostalgic about the Fox Men and no "correct" version of the MCU will ever top it, just how Sony's Spider-Mans will forever be the 'real' live action spidey for most and not the MCU one. So yeah of course they'll bring them back, no one is going to care for recast Wolverine/Professor X/etc. It doesn't matter that the movies weren't perfect, people can forgive that if they see the actors they love. Casuals don't care about the story implications or whatever and since they can hand wave it as "it's the multiverse" no one cares anymore.

That's a bit of cliche-rationale dude.

Honestly, I've never met a single person who is a "Fox X-Men or Toby McGuire Spider-Man purist". I think it's more about "wish fulfillment" for those of us who were there when those movies were still new. Neither franchise wrapped up in any kind of satisfying manner, so there's not only a sense of "nostalgia", but also a great sense of "unfinished business" stemming from both. Obviously "No Way Home" went a long way for Toby, but X-Men are still languishing.

[ZariusTwo]

X-Men is like Highlander...should have been only one, and if there had to have been a second and third one, it should have just been Days of Future Past and Logan.

[IMJ]

X-Men is like Highlander...should have been only one, and if there had to have been a second and third one, it should have just been Days of Future Past and Logan.

"The Wolverine" was pretty solid....

I mean, honestly what do we have from Fox that was GREAT?

The Wolverine
Logan
Deadpool & Wolverine

After that you have "decent enough....":

X2
Days of Future Past
Deadpool

and then after that literally everything falls into some various category of "garbage" to "viewable garbage"...

[Autbot_Benz]

"The Wolverine" was pretty solid....

I mean, honestly what do we have from Fox that was GREAT?

The Wolverine
Logan
Deadpool & Wolverine

After that you have "decent enough....":

X2
Days of Future Past
Deadpool

and then after that literally everything falls into some various category of "garbage" to "viewable garbage"...
Deadpool and Wolverine was marvel studios not fox

[IMJ]

Deadpool and Wolverine was marvel studios not fox

:lol:

I mean.... -sigh-

Yeah man, you're right. :teek:

[ZariusTwo]

"The Wolverine" was pretty solid....

Oh yeah, I liked that one too, though I've only ever seen it once.

Deadpool I'll give you also, I saw that three times, but that's another I find should have been one and done. It was the little engine that could, and from then on just became part of the machine.

[ranger_scout]

This is a good teaser, but it's still hard to understand why James Marsden is allowed to return as Scott Summers/Cyclops after he publicly defended a man, Brian Peck,who sexually abused a child actor, Drake Bell, in court and has yet to publicly apologize for doing it. Even if he didn't know about it, although I think he clearly did, he should still apologize to Bell and condemn Peck for his actions.

https://x.com/avengers/status/2008539279476265286

[ZariusTwo]

The next Doomsday trailer has now leaked. Getting lots of takedowns, but it was in much better quality than the bootleg X-Men one

[Andrew NDB]

I'm hearing these things leak every week and I can't really be bothered to watch them. I'll watch them when they're out officially and in good quality, or not. Meh.

[IMJ]

I'm hearing these things leak every week and I can't really be bothered to watch them. I'll watch them when they're out officially and in good quality, or not. Meh.

The X-Men one is out officially on most Marvel accounts on social media. I mean... it's fine. Again - movie built on wish fulfillment - seeing more nostalgia characters portrayed through the modern lens.

[ToTheNines]

I'm hearing these things leak every week and I can't really be bothered to watch them. I'll watch them when they're out officially and in good quality, or not. Meh.

https://youtube.com/@marvel?si=NAy06n_CuNIOhB3R

Marvel’s official YouTube has the first 3.

I saw a good quality LEAK of the fourth one on Reddit.

Shuri narrated. M’Baku introduces himself to The Thing, who awkwardly returns the favor.

[ranger_scout]

Despite the mixed and negative receptions of X-Men: Apocalypse and Dark Phoenix, respectively, I think it would've been better if Tye Sheridan had returned as Scott Summers/Cyclops instead of James Marsden. Sheridan is a great young actor.

Here is the new trailer for people to look at here.

kH1XlwHQv9o?si=tUAIVoobJb-2JoCZ

[Andrew NDB]

The X-Men one is out officially on most Marvel accounts on social media. I mean... it's fine. Again - movie built on wish fulfillment - seeing more nostalgia characters portrayed through the modern lens.

For me it's like, "What if those old X-Men movies with their cast were brought into the modern age of comic book movies and made SUPER COOL and comic book faithful?"

But I don't care about that. I never liked those movies to begin with and I don't care about seeing them again, in any form. Ever. Better to leave them firmly in the past and cross a lot of fingers that Marvel doesn't screw up their actual MCU version of them down the road. We don't need to revisit the Fox-Men in the present. Like, at all.

Maybe an "Old Man Blade" sequel with Snipes would pique my interest, but I can't imagine really anything else doin so.

[ToTheNines]

For me it's like, "What if those old X-Men movies with their cast were brought into the modern age of comic book movies and made SUPER COOL and comic book faithful?"

But I don't care about that. I never liked those movies to begin with and I don't care about seeing them again, in any form. Ever. Better to leave them firmly in the past and cross a lot of fingers that Marvel doesn't screw up their actual MCU version of them down the road. We don't need to revisit the Fox-Men in the present. Like, at all.

Maybe an "Old Man Blade" sequel with Snipes would pique my interest, but I can't imagine really anything else doin so.

I agree with all of this.

If it was me, I might throw them in there for a short bit just to kill them all or otherwise send them off. But the fact that the ****ing Fox-Men are co-headlining an Avengers movie is just blowing my mind.

And the only one I think the general audience is remotely attached to is Jackman as Wolverine. But can we move on already? Jesus Christ, how many sendoffs does he need?

[Barkworm]

I'm almost scared to ask but... Jackman is going to be in this, isn't he?

[Andrew NDB]

I'm almost scared to ask but... Jackman is going to be in this, isn't he?

For sure. Deadpool as well.

[ToTheNines]

For is. Deadpool as well.

I'm almost scared to ask but... Jackman is going to be in this, isn't he?

https://cdna.artstation.com/p/assets/images/images/077/928/890/large/citysvg-deadpool-wolverine-svg.jpg?1720715722

[sdp]

Their nostalgia crossovers are the highest earning MCU movies during the post End Game phases, of course this will be a crossover slopfest. The MCU is literally the comics now, event after event with a gimmick to try to bring the fleeting dying audience back with diminishing returns each time. So don't argue that they aren't being true to the comics.

[Barkworm]

I loved Roseanne in the 90s. It wasn‘t overly hilarious but the show had a ton of heart.

[ToTheNines]

I loved Roseanne in the 90s. It wasn‘t overly hilarious but the show had a ton of heart.

Roseanne will return in Avengers: Doomsday

[Andrew NDB]

I loved Roseanne in the 90s. It wasn‘t overly hilarious but the show had a ton of heart.

I never liked or watched Roseanne in the 90s... but I respected Roseanne in the 90s.

[Barkworm]

Hahaha, wrong thread, sorry! But let‘s just keep it like this and pretend Roseanne is also going to be in Avengers: Doomsday.

[ToTheNines]

“Dan! There’s another incursion!”

[ranger_scout]

Despite everything she said about not being a part of this movie, an X-Men writer says that Famke Janseen will be returning as Jean Grey after all.

https://www.ign.com/articles/jean-grey-actress-famke-janssen-will-return-in-avengers-doomsday-x-men-writer-claims

[Andrew NDB]

Despite everything she said about not being a part of this movie, an X-Men writer says that Famke Janseen will be returning as Jean Grey after all.

https://www.ign.com/articles/jean-grey-actress-famke-janssen-will-return-in-avengers-doomsday-x-men-writer-claims

It might just be Claremont assuming. But I don't know why she wouldn't be in it, at least for a short bit. One of the whole purposes in Days of Future Past was to undo her death in X3.

And Psylocke? Does that mean...

https://www.filmfad.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Olivia-Munn-Psylocke-X-Men.jpg

[ranger_scout]

The Fantastic Four meets Wakanda trailer is here.

399Ez7WHK5s?si=ACVvZdM2ZY682bz8

[Andrew NDB]

The Fantastic Four meets Wakanda trailer is here.

399Ez7WHK5s?si=ACVvZdM2ZY682bz8

Is that supposed to get people excited?

[IMJ]

I think out of all of this so far the only element that I am authentically interested in is finding out what direction they are going to go with Thor moving forward.

I'd like to think Hemsworth can keep playing the role forever as long as he does the Stallone-model of HGH.

[Coola Yagami]

For sure. Deadpool as well.

"Til you're 80"

[ZariusTwo]

Marvel Studios reportedly working on a new Avengers cartoon

https://x.com/i/status/2011802163601637394

[Andrew NDB]

So this is making the rounds. "Jackman's Wolverine is NOT in Doomsday!"

https://i.ibb.co/zVkpX6sF/659163743-932426629650696-1323832558095545190-n.jpg

But it's important to note... Marsden is only commenting on not seeing or working with Jackman on HIS scene(s). It wouldn't even really make sense for Jackman to appear with Marsden since -- if anything -- we'd most likely get the version of Jackman's Wolverine that survived Deadpool & Wolverine... who is NOT from what would be Marsden's Cyclops universe.

[ZariusTwo]

Wow. Disney announced a slew of job cuts and wiped out Marvel's whole visual effects department

https://www.forbes.com/sites/robsalkowitz/2026/04/14/disney-layoffs-hit-marvel-studios-hard/

[nidza_maj2000]

According to people who were at CinemaCon
Mystique will turn in Yelena

[ranger_scout]

Despite everything she said about not being a part of this movie, an X-Men writer says that Famke Janseen will be returning as Jean Grey after all.

https://www.ign.com/articles/jean-grey-actress-famke-janssen-will-return-in-avengers-doomsday-x-men-writer-claims

She's still saying that she’s not returning though.

https://movieweb.com/avengers-doomsday-former-marvel-star/

[Andrew NDB]

irVNGjRFZGk

[ToTheNines]

Looks ok.

I certainly miss the feeling an Avengers trailer would give me back in the day, but I’ll probably go see this.

[Andrew NDB]

I wonder what happens if in spite of everything this ends up as a big flop?

[ZariusTwo]

This just looks so...spent to me.

Dull colours, dull lighting, dull locations, dull acting.

Dull everything.

[CyberCubed]

I think the problem is most of the characters are the C-team.

Nobody cares about the Thunderbolts. This version of the Fantastic Four didn't exactly light numbers. Falcon is whatever. Ant-Man is whatever. Black Panther's sister is whatever. Thor has been in so many movies now he's lost his luster.

Unless you're over 40 and have nostalgia for the X-men and or Robert Downey Jr. playing Doom, there's not much here.

[Andrew NDB]

It sounds like the trailer is confirming the LEAKED outline that was going around earlier. Which is largely considered bad news, as the outline was SUPER light on story and just a class on "and then this happened... and then that happened... and then this happened."

"Incursions" keep coming across the MCU and beyond and the losers get their world wiped out or something. Dr. Doom tells the survivors (who he somehow convinces he is a good guy) to all build some kind of multiversal cannons on all of their worlds and this will stop the incursions, but surprise surprise, Dr. Doom ends up being a villain and the cannons are actually to destroy everything and resurrect everybody differently on Battleworld.

Essentially.

[IMJ]

It's hard to believe that the excitement in a build up to Thanos was SO huge for a decade. And now this.

[Andrew NDB]

Get excited about Thor! Except he hasn't been able to be taken seriously since maybe the second Thor movie.

Get excited about Steve Rogers! Except it's doubtful they'd even make him Captain America again?

Get excited about the Fox-Men! Except I don't like the Fox-Men at all.

Get excited about Shang Chi vs. Gambit! No.

Get excited about Dr. Doom! Except we don't know anything about him? And if you didn't already know RDJ was in this you wouldn't even know that was him in there in the trailer.

[nidza_maj2000]

This trailer looks really good, what do you think?

[Roseangelo]

My understanding is that they are having a hard time editing this into a cohesive plot. So we will see.

[Powder]

I only watch MAYBE a third of the MCU stuff out there, if that, & The Avengers characters themselves are damn near at the bottom of the pile as far as my interest is concerned. I'll probably skip this as I've skipped the rest. That said, it's cool to see the Fox X-Men characters pop up, classic outfits & all, but I doubt it will live up to anybody's expectations, or even be enough to reel less invested people like me in.

There's only so much you can do to keep things interesting, or epic, & those ships sailed mad years ago. A lot of good will was undone this past decade by crap films & shows, bad casting, weird decisions. I'd have preferred a fresh start.

Give me a new Blade movie.

[Autbot_Benz]

I’m excited for it. Glad Thor is back to being awesome and not the idiot from love and blunder.

Also man poor Shang Chi first appearance since his movie

[Andrew NDB]

Also man poor Shang Chi first appearance since his movie

Now the end credits of Shang Chi fulfilled their promised. He returned. Now we're good.

Jesus... will they even so much as mention the Eternals? Kind of a yikes if they don't. As in, how embarrassing.

[CyberCubed]

Also doesn't this movie have like 5x times more actors/superheroes than the previous Avengers movies prior to Endgame? They obviously can't divide screentime equally among 20-30 characters. Half the characters are just going to be there to say a few lines, get a minor fight scene or two, and not much else at all.

[Coola Yagami]

Also doesn't this movie have like 5x times more actors/superheroes than the previous Avengers movies prior to Endgame? They obviously can't divide screentime equally among 20-30 characters. Half the characters are just going to be there to say a few lines, get a minor fight scene or two, and not much else at all.

Gives me Mortal Kombat Armageddon vibes.

I mean another thing is some of them might not have major scenes persay, but they can still appear in the final all-hands-on-deck fight scene.

Kinda like Avengers End Game, a lot of the characters only appeared in the final scene, which made sense since they were snapped away and only recently returned.... but if we go only by screentime and not storyline, characters like Black Panther, Spider-Man and Wong only made it in those final fight scenes.

[CyberCubed]

Yeah, but an issue is other than Thor, this is all a bunch of C and D list superheroes. None of them are really draws honestly. You have some X-men nostalgia but other than that we got nothing else. Skinny Cap too.

[Andrew NDB]

Yeah, but an issue is other than Thor, this is all a bunch of C and D list superheroes.

They knew what they were walking into with guys like Shang Chi (probably why they're pairing him with Deadpool & Wolverine's Tatum breakout), but Thunderbolts and Fantastic Four were SUPPOSED to be huge hits. So they're kind of stuck there. A little weird they wouldn't want to showcase the "Safer Bets" in this, like Deadpool or Wolverine or even Dr. Strange, though.

[Daytona]

I’m looking forward to it. The Russo bros have yet to let me down in the MCU. The bar is so low for Marvel right now that I expect to find this movie quite refreshing even if not perfect.

That and the fact that they’re leaning into incursions and existential dread are enough to get me a little excited.

[Andrew NDB]

I’m looking forward to it. The Russo bros have yet to let me down in the MCU.

Though they've done nothing BUT letdowns in everything else outside of the MCU since Endgame.

Electric State, Gray Man, Cherry, all SUCKED.

[IMJ]

[B]Get excited about Dr. Doom! Except we don't know anything about him? And if you didn't already know RDJ was in this you wouldn't even know that was him in there in the trailer.

Honestly? I'm stone serious when I say that could be the best possible outcome. Downey plays Doom and that's it - NO correlation to Iron Man at all whatsoever.

It would be weird, yes. But honestly, the best route. We don't need "Iron Man/Stark as Doom." Basically at all. it would be another ruining of two marvel characters on film.

The only thing I could say that would MAYBE make all of this make sense?

In the comics, Stark was eventually revealed as a pawn of Kang's - it was maligned in the fandom. Badly maligned.

My Point? Maybe that was the original MCU plan to somehow bring Iron Man back, but when Kang was dropped as the arcs big-bad-guy, they repurposed Stark as a Doom variant to maintain the assets and adapt the story somehow.

[Andrew NDB]

This is the one thing the LEAKERS don't really seem to reveal.

We know half of the movie will be Dr. Doom having convinced all of the MCU that he's a good guy, so probably using Tony's face and/or body like a skinsuit is probably a means to that end intentionally. If he's literally using Tony's body, there might be attempts to woo the Tony within him to resurface, ending with him succeeding in casting Doom out (for Doom to occupy a new body? or manifest one?) or the good guys just blast his body/face to cinders to where it doesn't even matter if RDJ is under there or not anymore.

Aannd then we get a "Good" Iron Man variant or two, or something.

[IMJ]

This is the one thing the LEAKERS don't really seem to reveal.

We know half of the movie will be Dr. Doom having convinced all of the MCU that he's a good guy, so probably using Tony's face and/or body like a skinsuit is probably a means to that end intentionally. If he's literally using Tony's body, there might be attempts to woo the Tony within him to resurface, ending with him succeeding in casting Doom out (for Doom to occupy a new body? or manifest one?) or the good guys just blast his body/face to cinders to where it doesn't even matter if RDJ is under there or not anymore.

Aannd then we get a "Good" Iron Man variant or two, or something.

I'm thinking that the FoX-Men will be in the opening scene of the movie and that's practically it. Not sure how the Shang-Chi/Gambit fight apparently in the X-Mansion falls there, but....

[Coola Yagami]

It pretty much looks like Cyclops will only be in that one scene. Those scenes with the MCU people hanging with the Fantastic Four without any X-Men sprinkled among them....

[Andrew NDB]

We know how it opens.

The Tobey Maguire Spider-verse getting wiped out.

So it is probably a quick montage of that happening to different ones with the "winners" surviving.

[IMJ]

Yup. My thoughts so far are that the Fox stuff will basically be 'destruction fodder' early on in the movie and we don't see them again.

Maybe SOME of them will return in the next "Secret Wars" flick but at the end of that everything will be amalgamated and incorporated somehow.

[Barkworm]

Seeing the Fox-Men all die could have been neat if we hadn't seen so many of them be killed in so many films only to have it retconned somehow. It's just boring now.

[Andrew NDB]

Seeing the Fox-Men all die could have been neat if we hadn't seen so many of them be killed in so many films only to have it retconned somehow. It's just boring now.

Which is why it would be weird if Famke's Jean Grey doesn't show up at all here, since she's one of the ones they went to all the trouble of actually resurrecting.

[Coola Yagami]

It's clear the scenes with all the X-Men characters, even the Gambit/Mystique scenes take place in the mansion. Also there is a lack of X-Men characters in all those pan out shots with the Thunderbolts, Fantastic Four, Wakandans and so forth. Despite all the cameos, I guess the real bigger deal will be the Fantastic Four and Doctor Doom making the MCU jump... and the return of Steve I guess.

[Daytona]

Though they've done nothing BUT letdowns in everything else outside of the MCU since Endgame.

Electric State, Gray Man, Cherry, all SUCKED.

Yeah but they’re like one of those musicians who is really good within their main band but then goes and releases a crappy solo album. They’re fit for a certain position and excel at that. Hopefully.

[Barkworm]

Haven't bothered to do any research on this but why exactly is Steve Rogers young again?

[Coola Yagami]

Haven't bothered to do any research on this but why exactly is Steve Rogers young again?

Looks like time travel stuff. They probably grabbed him sometime after having a kid with Carter but before he got elderly.