Watching through the 2k3 series for the fist time

[k_lala]

Originally Posted by sdp

Finished with Season 3 and I enjoyed it as much as season 2, maybe a little bit more but not as much of a difference like I did with S2 over 1. At first I was going to rank it below S2 but by the end it won me over, this season already has my two favorite episodes so far with Hun on the Run and Same as it never was. I felt this season was very Shredder-lite, I mean he didn't do much at all this season which is a shame, you just saw the shredder gathering Triceraton technology through out the season and never really went after the turtles, in fact in S2 Shredder didn't go after the turtles as much as he did in S1. I felt the ending was a bit anti-climatic as well, the turtles just decide to go attack the Shredder? it felt a bit out of character for them, also the fact that they were defeated by the Shredder and only won because of the Utroms (I'm not counting their self sacrifice as defeating the shredder, it felt cheap). Counting the season was Shredder-lite and the season finale didn't deliver I'm glad Chrell got a final battle in Turtles Forever, to give some better closure. Now that I'm talking about Turtles Forever, if this is the last we see of Chrell until then then I don't see why he had so much hatred for the turtles, I mean he was so insanely against them he wanted to kill them all the multiverse turtles even if it meant him too, I always thought it worked if there was a better reason but so far from S1-3 which is apparently his last appearance nothing really happened that made me think "oh no wonder he went insane to kill all turtles at the cost of his life", I can understand him hating them but not to the insane level the movie portrays it.

Now the characters this season I felt the turtles were definitely more balanced this time, S2 did it good but it was probably better this season. At least Mikey and Raph were definitely toned down, in fact I think Donatello got a lot of time which is great, now that I'm older I definitely think Donatello is easily the best turtle out of the four in most incarnations, though Raph will still be my favorite. I liked seeing April training martial arts and Casey did almost nothing this season which is a shame since he's annoying when he's just a character instead of actually part of the plot, I did like the way their romance was handled though. I wish Baxter wasn't stuck being Shredders goon so long but oh well I did really like Dr. Chaplin and their interactions. Karai didn't win me over this season either, I don't like the way they're handling her she just feels hypocritical instead of 'confused/conflicted' which is what they're going for. As for Shredder this season finally made me realize they took a Lex Luthor "I'm a businessman who is evil" persona and I absolutely hate it, it does not fit him at all, it worked to modernize Lex Luthor from just an evil scientist but not Shredder. Now Agent Bishop disappointed me, especially when everyone holds him in such high regard, don't get me wrong I liked him but I thought he'd be much more awesome. They played him as just another evil villain when I thought he'd be much more neutral, he's only against the turtles for the benefit of humanity. Sure they acknowledge thats why he does things but they still could have made him more sympathetic. I also hate how strong they made him, how did he take out the Shredder Elite so easily? I would have liked if he was strong but not that strong.

I definitely have a few questions with this season though. Why is Hun so loyal to the Shredder? I mean he is extremely loyal so there must be a reason right? And why does Hun hate Karai so much? A simple "jealousy" because of him preferring her over Hun is not a great explanation so I hope theres a better one. Also what is it with the Damyo going crazy after the loss of his son? It seemed out of character and he seemed perfectly fine during the Christmas episode which was after his son was gone. Also scary to think that if Lord Simultaneous hadn't done that then would the Damyo still have gone against the turtles and Splinter? He's psycho and mentally unstable to hold the War Staff in that case. My final question is about the Time Scepter, so it appears that it not only travels through space time but also dimensions? Was Same as it never was the future without Donatello or just another dimension like Turtles Forever showed? I like to think its another dimension, but if thats the case wouldn't it mean that Renet and Lord Simultaneous would have to be the same ones as the Mirage universe ones? Is there anything that would contradict that?

I'll be watching S4 now, this is the only season I had already watched entirely, and I absolutely loved it, in fact all my high praise of the show was based mostly on that season alone and I used to compare the 2k3 series to the equivalent of Batman:The Animated Series is to Batman. So I don't know if I'll be disappointed since I'm expecting it to be amazing or if it really is as good as I remember. Oh one final thought on S3, I'm not sure about the the post-triceraton invasion Earth, I don't know it feels like the 2k3 is no longer any wackier than the 87 show that Laird criticized the turtles going around in the daytime.



Well I have metal compilation CDs that have Pop-Punk songs in it, that doesn't mean they're metal. Anime is just the word for animation in japan, however around the world its used to describe animation made from Japan, it is not used to describe any type of foreign animation.




The music isn't bad since it doesn't bother me however its not excellent either and not memorable which is a shame.

I'm glad your having fun watching this series. I don't see it out of character to go attack the Shredder at season 3. As long as they had a purpose and they did, Splinter had a vision and they had to act in order to save a lot of lives in the galaxy.

I didn't mind seeing less of the Shredder if you see too much you over expose him and it makes each battle with him less significant. You dont want the series to be 80% vs the Shredder, a good balance was needed, the series was perfect how they handled him. I think even in the comics The Shredder wasn't that involved in the series anyways. He died in the first book only to come back and die again a few times.

[blockhead]

Most of it is good. I"m not a big fan of the animation or the shell puns though

[sdp]

Finished S4 today, well technically I didn't watch the last episode but I remember it was awesome and deals more with the next season than this one. S4 was the only season I had already completely seen, I remembered it was amazing and I was afraid after having watched S1-3 that it wasn't going to be as good as I remembered it, I mean I used to compare 2k3 with Batman TAS and I no longer felt that was good comparison. I was pleasantly surprised that I was wrong and S4 was still as good as I remembered, its so far easily the best season the show has had and based on the opinion of the later seasons I'm assuming this is where the show peaked. This season definitely felt a lot like BTAS to me, the earlier seasons where much more actiony and sci-fiish in their story telling, not to say this season didn't have action or sci-fi since it had plenty of it. It also makes me wish S1-3 could have been done this style instead not to say I didn't enjoy S1-3 since I did but they weren't as enjoyable. Even the updated intro is much better and original intro had already grown on me quite a bit.

Characters this season and I'm skipping the turtles well except Leo, he was definitely a bit too angsty, when I first saw S4 I didn't know what had happened with the Shredder so I just imagined it was much more epic than what actually happened so his angstyness made sense. However knowing what actually happened his angst did feel a bit over the top though I was very glad it was acknowledged by him that they did not defeat the Shredder because its true, they were defeated by him basically and it had been something that had bothered me so I'm happy it was mentioned. While his angst was a bit over the top it wasn't as much of a complain as many point out that "Leo went emo". Karai was excellent this season as well, she won me over after not having liked her much before. Same with Agent Bishop I felt he wasn't portrayed as only a villain like last season but he just does things in a shady way. Baxter was also made better though I always liked him anyways. I also really enjoyed how Hun worked this season, when I first saw S4 I didn't like Hun working without the Shredder but now that I saw more of their history it makes perfect sense, though I had thought that Hun knew Shredder was an Utrom since the start of the second season. Only character I didn't like much was the Ratking, I didn't like that he was just a the Bishop clone/monster from last season not familiar with the Mirage Ratking but I wish he had been different. I know based on Cybercubed's comments that he never appears again and I don't mind it because of his weak appearance though maybe his next appearance would have redeemed him.

My questions for this season are mostly about next season. Did Season 5 have its own intro or did it use the same Karai as Shredder from S4? Can someone tell me more of the story of S5? I didn't quite follow it except that Fast Forward was done first and that Laird apparently made S5 out of his pocket, which doesn't make sense since 4Kids DID have a say since they cancel the Nightmares Recycled episode. Also was S5 always 13 episodes? its odd they went for a 13 episode season and then 26 again for FF, it only makes sense if Laird did indeed make the season out of his pocket and he could only afford 13 which I already said I don't believe Laird did it all out of his pocket. I'm also still confused about the whole multiverse, it was also mentioned a few times this season but its definitely not used in the same way as the Turtles Forever multiverse.

Looking forward to S5, I am pretty hyped about it since the story arc setting up S5 was awesome so HYPE HYPE HYPE. I already know S5 isn't liked by many and I already know a few spoilers of it that I've accidentally read or some spoilers that people used as a signature I know its anime inspired which is fine by me I like Anime so I'll see how I like it, I'm definitely hyped about it and have high expectations regardless.

[triplexxx]

Originally Posted by sdp

Was Same as it never was the future without Donatello or just another dimension like Turtles Forever showed?

Well if it was a different dimension there would've been some hinted explanation of Donatello's disappearance other than the Time Scepter; also, the present-day 2k3 Donatello wouldn't've been included in the picture in Turtles Forever, so that was a misunderstanding, it's the future, or rather was the future.

[gobo]

Originally Posted by sdp

Did Season 5 have its own intro or did it use the same Karai as Shredder from S4?

Karai Shredder...

Originally Posted by sdp

Can someone tell me more of the story of S5? I didn't quite follow it except that Fast Forward was done first and that Laird apparently made S5 out of his pocket, which doesn't make sense since 4Kids DID have a say since they cancel the Nightmares Recycled episode.

Personally, I think it was done this way purposefully to build some anticipation. 4Kids didn't cancel "Nightmares Recycled"; Fox's Board of Standards & Practices did. But, Laird did give it a 'thumbs down' when reviewing it though. I also think that "Nightmares Recycled" was more or less a casualty of the declining ratings and growing heat coming from BS&P.

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by sdp

I really don't intend to write until I finish the season but
Well I'm already familiar with how the turtles are in the new show so its not like this is my first time seeing their personalities. With that said I like them though I do with they had toned down their personalities a bit Raph is too angry, Leo too angsty and Mikey too annoying. I always liked Splinter here as well, and Casey they made him too dumb. Maybe my opinion will change after actually watching the characters progress for the first time, so far they haven't shown their personalities too much though Mikey did show his annoying side already and Raph being a jerk.

Raph is really scary in the new version. Fits in with the comics though.

[k_lala]

Originally Posted by gobo

Karai Shredder...

Personally, I think it was done this way purposefully to build some anticipation. 4Kids didn't cancel "Nightmares Recycled"; Fox's Board of Standards & Practices did. But, Laird did give it a 'thumbs down' when reviewing it though. I also think that "Nightmares Recycled" was more or less a casualty of the declining ratings and growing heat coming from BS&P.

Nope they didn't cancel that episode bcuz of the ratings, ratings had nothing to do with it.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by Lynn

Raph is really scary in the new version. Fits in with the comics though.

I dunno, Raph has his moments in the comics, but he's definitely too over the top in 2k3. Everyone is.

[sdp]

Finished S5 and while not as good as S4 its definitely enjoyable, I don't understand all the hate for it, well I can see where they are coming from but really I don't see it that much of a difference. I mean yeah its very heavy on fantasy however how is that different from the earlier second season and third that are very heavy on sci-fi and we had already seen plenty of magic before anyways. I also don't understand why people compare it to anime, yeah I guess the mystic power up and the final battle are similar but besides that the season is nothing like anime.

Now one thing I noticed is this doesn't flow like a season very well, in fact it feels like a TV/DTV movie stretched out among 12 episodes instead of it being a 90 minute movie, in fact it'd be interesting if someone would edit it into a mini movie. Yeah earlier seasons also had plenty of connected episodes and on going story but they didn't feel like small movies. The only episode that didn't fit well in the story line was the Nano/JF episode, I actually thought once they got to NY there'd be more single episodes like that one. And while I normally hate the superhero episodes I really enjoyed that episode, first of all I always liked Nano and seeing him as a superhero was a great way to end his story, loved it. Because it kinda felt like a movie some episodes felt like they were dragon a 5 minute segment of training into a full 22 minute episode. Oh and I didn't like what the Mystics looked without their hats, they should have kept them Anyways to me this season felt very epic, the stakes were really raised, this is especially seen at the end when they all unite forces (and IMO it didn't make sense for Hun to have joined them). Funny how Tengu Shredder keeps mentioning he is the "One true Shredder" counting Turtles Forever, and sadly I kinda feel that Turtles Forever was not as epic as this season was and that Utrom Shredder is not as powerful, I mean they made Tengu into a beast, I definitely won't see Turtles Forever the same after this and I already had a problem with Chrell calling himself the one true shredder. In fact I think this season works perfectly as a series finale, the only thing not fully wrapped was Hun and maybe Bishop but they aren't anything big. I was only bummed that we never besides quick references learn how Chrell assumed the mantle of Shredder, in fact that would have been the only thing that could have redeemed Chrell as a more powerful force.

So did Hun get a new VA? It definitely seemed different and didn't like it as much, I vaguely remember reading about this years ago I think. Two last season questions but how come there wasn't a city at war 2.0 during S4? You'd think it would have happened after no shredder, I realize why they didn't do it but they should have had a better explanation. Also I just realized that last season the only character that didn't get wrapped up was Hun, we saw him stealing weaponry but never saw the fruits of what he was doing.

Now onto S6, another fan hated season and mostly because they skipped S5 for it, I've already seen the first half and while not as good as S4 I remember enjoying the light heartedness of it. Random question, anyone know how many of the flash TMNT shorts that aired on 4kids where made and where I can watch them?

[CyberCubed]

I can see what you mean, the whole Season 5 could have been a codensed 90 minute DTV movie.

There was supposed to be two filler eps, the Nanobot ep and Garbageman ep, but the second was never finished.

[Cowabunga Carl]

This thread made me want to rewatch the whole series also. Started today, working on season 1 right now. I'm enjoying reading what you think man.

[Avatar Yuffie]

Funny how Tengu Shredder keeps mentioning he is the "One true Shredder" counting Turtles Forever, and sadly I kinda feel that Turtles Forever was not as epic as this season was and that Utrom Shredder is not as powerful, I mean they made Tengu into a beast, I definitely won't see Turtles Forever the same after this and I already had a problem with Chrell calling himself the one true shredder.

Yeah... that kinda bugged me too in the film that the 2K3 peeps assume, and called, the One True Shredder was Ch'rell.

Then again, that film bugged me with 1987 Leo being painfully Out of Character so I try not to let the small details detract me from appreciating it.

I also don't understand why people compare it to anime, yeah I guess the mystic power up and the final battle are similar but besides that the season is nothing like anime.

I compare the Turtles' shapeshifting abilities to American Dragon Jake Long. All they need is the "Dragon Up!" catchphrase.

I also once disliked Fast Forward... but watching it again for the second time, I warmed up to it. Still dislike Cody (he eerily reminds me of Carter from the old cartoon, freakily enough), and I liked Serling... but they shouldn't have bring him along in BTTS.

[k_lala]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I can see what you mean, the whole Season 5 could have been a codensed 90 minute DTV movie.

There was supposed to be two filler eps, the Nanobot ep and Garbageman ep, but the second was never finished.

I don't think they should have condensed it at all and made it into a movie. I thought the Ninja Tribunal was perfect. Don't see why people didn't like it i know there are a few people here. There was too much going on to make it shorter, if anything i wanted more.

As far as the TS said about everyone calling themselves the one true Shredder. I was curious to know how Chrell would feel if he ever saw the original Oroku Saki since he did basically idolize him, take his name, etc. How would he have felt if he came face to face with the one true Shredder. He may have shaken in his boots.

Now i know there was BTTS, but that was horribly written, please don't get me started on that! Even though that show was canon, i'm taking it as not canon.

[gobo]

Originally Posted by k_lala

I was curious to know how Chrell would feel if he ever saw the original Oroku Saki since he did basically idolize him, take his name, etc. How would he have felt if he came face to face with the one true Shredder. He may have shaken in his boots.

I may write it that way when my 2K3 fics get to the abandoned Shredder Wars plot thread. Don't count on it, though. ^_^

[masterturk]

IVe only ever watched the ot but I saw this thread and thought you know may as well give it a chance. I saw the turtles forever movie and loved seeing the ots. The main reason back then was I didn't like the way it was drawn, Reading through I don't understand ur rants on ff lol I may need to rewind haha

I hope to watching this fairly soon an episode a night or so!

[Cowabunga Carl]

So I started to rewatch this series again from start to finnish because of this thread. And I have to say it is just as enjoyable now as it was when I first watched it. However there is one big plot hole I've noticed.

The Shredder wants Utrom tech so he can track the other Utrom's but being an Utrom himself and using a suit like they do, shouldn't he be able to use his own suit to do so?

[gobo]

Originally Posted by Cowabunga Carl

The Shredder wants Utrom tech so he can track the other Utrom's but being an Utrom himself and using a suit like they do, shouldn't he be able to use his own suit to do so?

Nay. Only The Sword of Tengu was shown to have this 'Utrom de-tech-ting' ability. And, there were plenty other big plot-holes. At least it wasn't like Fringe, leaving plot-threads dangling and forgotten regularly (Hey, everbuddy! Guess what I been watching lately. ). I just need to get busy filling in all those holes with my fan-fiction.

[Cowabunga Carl]

Thanks for setting that straight for me Gobo

[Powder]

Fringe is a mad good show, gobo.

[gobo]

Originally Posted by Powder

Fringe is a mad good show, gobo.

To true. Love it. But, they apparently had trouble deciding what to make the show about for the first season and a half. "Unearthed" was a prime example of how unsure they were of where to take the show. They seem to have finally settled on a direction, but the idea of there only being two universes is pretty absurd. If they wanted to say that Walter was somehow only able to find evidence of that one alternate universe, and that's why he's so confident that there's only two, it would be more believable. No scientist worth his salt would be so short-sighted as to believe there were just two. And, it's just laughable that every character in the show is able to refer to alternate reality Walter as "Walternate" with a straight face. But, despite all these dopey issues, the show is immensely entertaining.

Still think I'll be watching Supernatural live though... It's more my speed and I've been with that one since the beginning. I just started on Fringe this past Autumn (via DVD).

Meanwhile... Back on topic...
2K3 kicked shell. ^_^