Weapons laws vs fakes

[IndigoErth]

So here's a question I can't really find an answer to, and I know U.S. states vary so a general answer is probably never going to apply to all, but figured someone might have some info or thoughts on this.

If a weapon is illegal in a state...is a fake also illegal?

In my case, my state is unfortunately one of those where throwing stars are illegal. (But throwing knives are fine, go figure.) Otherwise, I'd happily have one simply for display. Sometimes I see rubber "training" stars on eBay and am tempted, but I can't determine if those would also be illegal if they are designed to resemble the real thing.

[IMJ]

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

So here's a question I can't really find an answer to, and I know U.S. states vary so a general answer is probably never going to apply to all, but figured someone might have some info or thoughts on this.

If a weapon is illegal in a state...is a fake also illegal?

In my case, my state is unfortunately one of those where throwing stars are illegal. (But throwing knives are fine, go figure.) Otherwise, I'd happily have one simply for display. Sometimes I see rubber "training" stars on eBay and am tempted, but I can't determine if those would also be illegal if they are designed to resemble the real thing.

Generally speaking, weapons laws are extremely specific. This is how people are able to acquire firearms that are otherwise illegal to purchase - you buy a stock for example and assemble it with other components, one of which maybe you machine an extra hole into to get the desired effect.

And so, generally speaking with that degree of specificity in mind, most weapon laws revolve around functionality and visibility. And so in my experience the functionality part is of paramount importance to application of the law while visibility is about safety.

Most replicas are fine if they are non-functional. It gets harder regarded bladed weapon replicas, because of blade sizes and so on, but let's face it - a foam sword is a foam sword and not a blade.

The other aspect to your question is that the likelihood of you having problems from having a real ninja star on display in your collection is next to zero unless you are doing other activities that invite inspection of your home, and even then something like that.... you know... unless there have been ninja star killings in your neighborhood.....

[Leo656]

All of it is incredibly stupid. Last I heard, this was still America.

Plus, the whole thing is full of holes. My wife once bought a display dagger from East Meets West, perfectly clear and legal. They'd have them on display in the window and everything. Perfectly "safe" to purchase and own; "For display purposes only" and all that. Then when my Dad's girlfriend broke into our bedroom and tried to attack her while I was at work one day, my wife grabbed the thing and gave her a nice little gash that needed nine stitches to close.

Just saying. You can't own a butterfly knife, but you can go to the mall and buy one'a these things. And you SHOULD be able to, that's your right as an American. I'm just saying, the standards are f*cking ridiculous.

I have a textbook on "military self defense" techniques that shows you - with illustrations - how to blind and kill a person with an ordinary household hairbrush. It's easier than you'd think.

Big Brother needs to mind his f*cking business and leave people alone. You wanna buy a sword, some throwing stars or whatever? Your business. F*ck 'em, says I. You've got stuff just as "lethal and dangerous" sitting in your nightstand. F*cking "Nanny State" garbage.

[IndigoErth]

I think some of this stuff is similar to fireworks, where as it can be legal to sell in a state, but the residents who live there can't legally buy and own them.


I'm just the sort though where if it's not legal, then I'm going to be mindful of that, no matter what I personally wish the law was. Even if some of the laws like this are stupid. If I can't, then I can't, it's not like it's anything I need and can in fact live without... but it would just be cool if we could.

I do have a large tanto and what is technically a throwing knife... plus a brother-in-law on the same property with guns, a sister with a bow and arrows... but the star, well good god no, that one would be an issue. It's almost comical.



edit: Found this amusing piece.

The New York Times
February 8, 1984

The ''throwing star,'' an ancient Oriental weapon with sharply pointed metal blades, has become the latest fad among local schoolchildren to the dismay of police and some parents.

The stars, measuring from two to six inches in diameter and studded with three to eight points, can be bought at knife shops, army-navy stores, martial-arts stores and major shopping malls.

It is illegal to carry a throwing star, which is considered an illegal knife, but there is no law against selling them.

The weapons - known as shurikens, pinwheels and kung fu, Ninja, Chinese or Japanese throwing stars - cost from $1 to $4.50.

''All these little boys are carrying them around in their pockets like toys,'' said the mother, who asked not be named, of a 12-year-old boy in suburban Plano. ''But they're not toys. They are lethal weapons.''

Her son said he knows the stars are dangerous but ''a lot of the sixth graders have them - it's a real big hit.''

Police say most youngsters who own the throwing stars don't realize they can be arrested for possessing the weapons.

Lieut. John Reid of the Dallas Police Department said the youth division plans to ask the Legislature to prohibit the sale of throwing stars and other illegal weapons to youngsters under the age of 18.

Darrell Craig, a Houston martial- arts master, said the interest in the throwing stars can be traced to the popularity of martial-arts movies. The throwing stars also are used on a new television series ''The Master.''

Mr. Craig said he believed most parents consider the throwing stars a toy. But he added: ''They are very dangerous. I wouldn't let my kids have them, and I'm in the business.''

Geezus, who was selling these to kids. lol

[mrmaczaps]

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

So here's a question I can't really find an answer to, and I know U.S. states vary so a general answer is probably never going to apply to all, but figured someone might have some info or thoughts on this.

If a weapon is illegal in a state...is a fake also illegal?

In my case, my state is unfortunately one of those where throwing stars are illegal. (But throwing knives are fine, go figure.) Otherwise, I'd happily have one simply for display. Sometimes I see rubber "training" stars on eBay and am tempted, but I can't determine if those would also be illegal if they are designed to resemble the real thing.

If there is no law saying you cannot own a prop/replica of an item, its typically not illegal to do so.

So real throwing stars are illegal, but if you have fake ones, probably depends on the material. Metal ones not sharpened to be deadly would probably fall under illegal.

But as someone else said, this is America. No tool of self defense should be made illegal to own. They're simply tools. The intent is in the owner or user of said item.

California or Illinois or New York?

[Leo656]

Being mindful of the law is great and all, but people should still do what they wanna do if they're not hurting anybody. If a law-abiding person wanted to hang a sword or some stars on their wall for decorative purposes, for example, they should still be allowed to do so, even if those things are "illegal". But they should probably be mindful enough to be somewhat discrete about it. Say, having such a display in an upstairs bedroom or otherwise a place that isn't going to be the very first thing a person sees when they walk into your house.

Even if they're "against the law" a person would most likely only get in trouble if they were walking around with them in public. If the police came to their house for some other reason and saw them, the worst thing that would likely happen would be that they would confiscate them. Especially if they were clearly just part of a display or something, like in a case or whatever. They CAN push the issue but they generally won't.

After the situation my wife got into (which was more than 15 years ago now) she's technically "not supposed" to own any swords or anything like that, not even "replicas", but we do. Once in a while when the cops have been here one of them would say "I don't think you're supposed to have that," but they don't push the issue. They can if they want to but they never have, it's pretty much up to their discretion. Anything that's more paperwork, they generally won't bother with unless there's a real reason.

I respect that those laws are there "to protect people" but a person who just wants to hang something on their wall to admire it or whatever should have that right. They're not hurting anybody.

There used to be a lot of shops in the flea market over here that sold that kinda stuff - stars, swords, butterfly knives, etc. - but I think they cracked down on that because I don't see it as much anymore.

Regardless, common sense would assume that rubber throwing stars would be the same as rubber swords or nunchakus - a toy. I highly doubt a rubber "toy" could be against the law no matter what it looks like. If so, that's terrible.

[joe-eyeball]

The laws regarding bladed weapons are laughable in most areas. They can be different from one jurisdiction to another. The fact that throwing stars and throwing knives are illegal in your area is especially hilarious. Both of those “weapons” are actually very poor choices to be used as a weapon for their intended purpose. But where I’m at I can conceal carry multiple firearms and that would be perfectly legal but if I have a microtech auto knife in my pocket then it’s illegal. Makes no sense!

[IndigoErth]

Originally Posted by joe-eyeball

But where I’m at I can conceal carry multiple firearms and that would be perfectly legal but if I have a microtech auto knife in my pocket then it’s illegal. Makes no sense!

Exactly. It is the same here, as I think anything beyond 3" can't be concealed. Being in a car also counts as concealed, but that just opens more questions about, say, purchasing kitchen knives. I know no cop would think anything of a fresh set of them in a shopping bag headed home, but theoretically, I guess they should be removed from the box and strapped to the roof of the car so they aren't concealed.

Firearms vs stars/blades... Can't say I've ever heard of someone going on some killing spree with throwing stars. But a few states were/are dumb enough to have nunchucks banned too -- another one I assume a novice owner is probably more likely to hurt themselves with more than anyone else -- so nothing is surprising. You want the biggest gun legally available to civilians, sure, go for it. You want two sticks to hit yourself with? No, we can't have that.

And actually, ironically, throwing knives are fine here. Figure that one out.

[joe-eyeball]

A large part of the problem is that bladed weapons aren’t held up to the same federal/constitutional standards as firearms. So individual jurisdictions can pass laws against their use where doing the same for firearms could potentially violate state law and be overturned in court. Mostly there just isn’t a large enough and genuine effort to combat draconian knife laws.

[mrmaczaps]

Originally Posted by joe-eyeball

A large part of the problem is that bladed weapons aren’t held up to the same federal/constitutional standards as firearms. So individual jurisdictions can pass laws against their use where doing the same for firearms could potentially violate state law and be overturned in court. Mostly there just isn’t a large enough and genuine effort to combat draconian knife laws.

Bladed weapons, IMO, should fall under 2A protection too. They're not really arms of course, but tools, that if used properly can be used in self defense. But then again, I also feel like anyone who can afford a tank should be allowed to own one & make use of it.... its the only way I'd want to travel through the State of New York these days. Lol.