Does anyone else feel disillusioned with their fandom?

[pferreira]

Originally Posted by Leo656

Rather, what *I* see quite often is people listing very clear examples of the show's flaws - be they in the writing, the animation, the humor, the coloring, etc. etc. - and you basically replying "Nah" because you're still in romantic love with a cartoon show you watched when you were 6. You've done it with movies, too, more than once.

Those are their opinions. Doesn't mean the FW TMNT series doesn't hold value. I have the high imagination I have today and I can thank 80's cartoon series like this for doing that. I don't see why the 80's cartoon series should be seen as a guilty pleasure. Your criticisms of it are as subjective as me saying I think every episode is perfect. It's not. I've been known here to point out what I like and dislike about any iteration of TMNT and that includes the 80's cartoon. The Fred Wolf iteration is just one I enjoy the most. Not sure why seeing value in something here is a crime. The hive mentality of what is and isn't good is one of the reasons why some fans in the past have abandoned these forums.

Originally Posted by Leo656

But objectivity is very clearly something that you struggle with.

Nope. I think you'll find I'm both subjective and objective. Sure I don't like the IDW comic but I appreciate what it's done for the franchise. If I read the entire thing I'm sure they'd be stories I like, I'm sure of it. I don't go around each thread of the IDW comic questioning the competency of the writers and the art. Neatoman does.

Originally Posted by Leo656

Again, nobody's telling you to "hate" anything, but your knee-jerk and hyper-defensive overreactions whenever anyone says anything negative about the FW show makes people like me assume that you're a fanatic with a dismissive attitude towards objective reality. You act like someone criticizing a cartoon show from 1987 is equitable to someone calling your kid ugly. Stop that. It gets on people's nerves and makes them question your faculties.

Again people can happily dislike something about the FW series. There are episodes I really enjoy and there are episodes I couldn't care for. Does it get on people's nerves that people like neatoman use every thread related to this show to bash it? It does for me because I wonder why you'd spend time on a part of the forum trashing something (sometimes out of spite) when you could be enjoying something somewhere else you like. I don't see people constantly bashing the 2012 or 2003 series or IDW as much, probably because I don't spend my time finding those threads. Maybe what I'm saying or my thought process here sounds too naive and I apologise because that's how my Aspergers brain works but I would of thought it would become frustrating to continuously read insults about a TV show someone likes and sees the value in.

[PizzaPower1985]

Just saw this thread and have noticed a few things about my personal TMNT fandom (and pretty much all my superhero/comic book fandoms). I'm a superhero fan first and a comics fan 2nd, so... that makes me appreciate multiple iterations/incarnations/versions of characters and their multiple media outlets.

With TMNT, I come in and out of it when the mood strikes (as I do with all my fandoms) and I just stay in for months or a couple years at a time, obsessively re-reading issues of Mirage or IDW, watching 2K3 a lot and playing the video games, watching the first 2 movies or catching the 87 pilot. And then I get out of it and my only window remains collecting IDW (which I'm now stopping). So, am I disillusioned? Yes, but not with the TMNT as a whole... just with everything that the property has become.

I would have expected (because the Nickelodeon stuff I grew up on in the early to mid 1990s was mostly made for pre-teens and teenagers) that a Nickelodeon buyout would have meant the most childish, the most juvenile that anything Nick did with TMNT would have been a step up from 2K3. Instead it went in the opposite direction. It didn't even attempt to speak to college aged "kids" or "today's teenagers." It was about selling toys and appealing to children.

As much as I love what IDW did in its first hundred issues, it NEVER once let it rip the way I wanted. I just once wanted to see Raph drink a beer, Leo behead somebody, a mild "Love Scene" between Casey and April, real curse words besides the occasional "damn" or "Hell"... anything to suggest that this was for an older audience. I really wanted Casey to be a lot more hardcore on crime than he was... He didn't seeme nearly as menacing as I thought he should have been... Thankfully we got child abuse and alcoholism (which are both tragic things in real life) and Splinter had to be the one to kill... so IDW flirted with "mature" storytelling but stayed pretty close to the tone of 2K3 (perhaps a little more edgy at times). When they started introducing a billion characters, the series has increasingly become a cartoon... All told, IDW has been well written, even if it's deliberately paced. I just wish it had been (not darker but) grittier, nastier and a little more demented.

So, I'm not disillusioned with the things I love... I just hate what TMNT has become, because it started as Mirage, gave us several great adaptations in cartoons, films and comics... but since Laird sold it... It's NOT TMNT anymore. It's a pale, un-amusing derivative... a shadow of former greatness.

It's only way back will be that oft-rumored Netflix series that I keep hearing so much about. Alas, I won't hold my breath.

[DVSleeSmooth]

Ngl I kinda feel this way.

Im only 14 so I grew up with TMNT 2012 Though ive watched some 2k3 on Youtube and Watched 1990 and the 2007 movies on Netflix.

Im fine with Rise its a new take and its a pretty solid show though I am a bit salty that Rise was the one to get the big budget like the fights are good but sometimes theres just too much comedy and I want a anime level fight where the Turtles just go ham on the foot or whatever mutant theyre fighting

I REALLY want a New Game peferablly in the style of Arkam or Spiderman PS4 but they already tried with Mutants in Manhattan and OOTS (Which both had really good ideas just were mediocre games) and I know Nick isnt gonna want to do a serious TMNT game again and would rather just make a ****** mobile game for Rise than actually try. Hell even if we dont get a serious game can we atleast get a 3D beatem up even Rise style.

I also Really want a new movie but Im sure the movie would **** up badly. I want it to be in the style of the 90s movie dosent need to be a origin but the tone of that With some mutants in there I would want the costumes to be animatronic but add CGI to where the costume connects or mabey add scaley skin effects I guess. But IK some money hungry executive would take advantage to pander to 80s fans because thats all they see it as and not a actual ya know Brand with lore

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by DVSleeSmooth

Ngl I kinda feel this way.

Im only 14 so I grew up with TMNT 2012 Though ive watched some 2k3 on Youtube and Watched 1990 and the 2007 movies on Netflix.

Im fine with Rise its a new take and its a pretty solid show though I am a bit salty that Rise was the one to get the big budget like the fights are good but sometimes theres just too much comedy and I want a anime level fight where the Turtles just go ham on the foot or whatever mutant theyre fighting

I REALLY want a New Game peferablly in the style of Arkam or Spiderman PS4 but they already tried with Mutants in Manhattan and OOTS (Which both had really good ideas just were mediocre games) and I know Nick isnt gonna want to do a serious TMNT game again and would rather just make a ****** mobile game for Rise than actually try. Hell even if we dont get a serious game can we atleast get a 3D beatem up even Rise style.

I also Really want a new movie but Im sure the movie would **** up badly. I want it to be in the style of the 90s movie dosent need to be a origin but the tone of that With some mutants in there I would want the costumes to be animatronic but add CGI to where the costume connects or mabey add scaley skin effects I guess. But IK some money hungry executive would take advantage to pander to 80s fans because thats all they see it as and not a actual ya know Brand with lore

It's kinda sad, at least to me, that newer, or younger fans like yourself, are being saddled with this juvenile stuff. TMNT started as a gritty, introspective, dark comic book. Then it became for children, but the best fans know that TMNT has potential to be as un-kid friendly as Punisher comics, The Dark Knight Returns, Love and Rockets or even lesser known works like Mr. X and Blacksad.

I'm sorry that you younger fans are getting the short end of the stick and my advice would be to lean as heavily into 2K3, Mirage, IDW and the 1990 film as you can. That's where the gold nuggets are in this pile of dirt that has become the franchise.

[DVSleeSmooth]

Originally Posted by PizzaPower1985

It's kinda sad, at least to me, that newer, or younger fans like yourself, are being saddled with this juvenile stuff. TMNT started as a gritty, introspective, dark comic book. Then it became for children, but the best fans know that TMNT has potential to be as un-kid friendly as Punisher comics, The Dark Knight Returns, Love and Rockets or even lesser known works like Mr. X and Blacksad.

I'm sorry that you younger fans are getting the short end of the stick and my advice would be to lean as heavily into 2K3, Mirage, IDW and the 1990 film as you can. That's where the gold nuggets are in this pile of dirt that has become the franchise.

Yeah honestly Like theres nothing wrong with liking the 80s stuff but I know this series has the potential to be a actual respected brand with great stories and not just a 80s fad recycled every few years for money

I heard that the IDW Comics are good but I havent really read them though I hear theres starting to be a decline in quality

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by DVSleeSmooth

Yeah honestly Like theres nothing wrong with liking the 80s stuff but I know this series has the potential to be a actual respected brand with great stories and not just a 80s fad recycled every few years for money

I heard that the IDW Comics are good but I havent really read them though I hear theres starting to be a decline in quality

Yeah, the IDW books haven't really been the same since after issue 50. There have still been some great stories but overall it's just not the same. I reccomend you give IDW a try, at least until ISSUE 50. If you dig it, try to make it to 100.

[Toxin45]

Like I am not disillusioned i have gone to other fanbases in my life and i still enjoy tmnt for what it is.

[miru]

I just fell out naturally. I couldn't really find any IDW TPBs on shelves, I barely watch television anymore, and the Rise toys faded from shelves in favor of Playmates's other lines like Ben 10. The entire franchise seems to be headed for another drought similar to the late 90s one.

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by miru

I just fell out naturally. I couldn?t really find any IDW TPBs, I barely watch television anymore, and the Rise toys faded from shelves in favor of Playmates?s other lines. The entire franchise seems to be headed for another drought similar to the late 90s one.

I'm not sure that's entirely true. A lot of people believe that the PD Turtle movies sealed the coffin on the franchise BUT... there does seem to be something bubbling under the surface. I don't know what that something is or how serious it is but something is there. The Netflix live action rumor sparked a lot of interest. Then there was that CBS All Access rumor that probably would have sucked anyway because, well, it's CBS... Ultimately it depends on what Nickelodeon wants to do. The IDW comic seems to be continuing so it's not totally dead. Time will tell.

[Leo656]

I don't think it'll ever be "late-90s dead" again. The adult toy collector market didn't exist back then and now it's pretty much the only reason why franchises like Gremlins, Friday the 13th and Nightmare on Elm Street are still above water.

There will always be more toys, I think, so in that way I think there will always be a spark of life left in the TMNT brand compared to 1998 or 1999-ish when there was absolutely nothing.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I don't think it'll ever be "late-90s dead" again. The adult toy collector market didn't exist back then and now it's pretty much the only reason why franchises like Gremlins, Friday the 13th and Nightmare on Elm Street are still above water.

There will always be more toys, I think, so in that way I think there will always be a spark of life left in the TMNT brand compared to 1998 or 1999-ish when there was absolutely nothing.

So basically, TMNT is alive in the same way a brain-dead woman on life support is alive? Just waiting for the plug to be pulled, being whored out by uncaring men?

You heard it here, folks. The TMNT franchise is Uma Thurman in Kill Bill.

[AquaParade]

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

So basically, TMNT is alive in the same way a brain-dead woman on life support is alive? Just waiting for the plug to be pulled, being whored out by uncaring men?

You heard it here, folks. The TMNT franchise is Uma Thurman in Kill Bill.

Dude, Uma Thurman essentially rose from the dead and kicked all sorts of ass in Kill Bill.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Originally Posted by AquaParade

Dude, Uma Thurman essentially rose from the dead and kicked all sorts of ass in Kill Bill.

All of a sudden, I'm an optimist!