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Old 11-30-2023, 03:10 PM   #21
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I remember people in 2nd class talking about the premiere red sky episode ‘Get Shredder’ which aired in April 1995 in Ireland, just a few months before we finished second class. The more serious tone in comparison to previous seasons blew them away. Just for that ep though. There was no further discussion on red sky after that and by the time seasons 9 & 10 along with ‘Turtle Trek’ premiered here in 1998 they had likely moved on to other shows.
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Old 11-30-2023, 03:20 PM   #22
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I watched the show from the time I was 3 years old in 1988 to 1996 all the way through the final season. And then even went on to watch Next Mutation in 1997 on Fox on the following year.

Even when I was a young child before the internet existed, I made sure to watch every episode as much as I could, even all the reruns (remember back then they had like 4 eps of reruns each weekday). I probably watched the original cartoon in full about 100 times or more.
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Old 12-01-2023, 08:38 AM   #23
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I think discussing the dead period of the franchise is a fantastic topic.
I mean I was too young and barely remember anything about TMNT pre Power Rangers. It's also hard for most people to be objective including myself since as a kid just a couple of months can feel like years times when it wasn't. I felt like turtle mania was huge pre-power rangers but thinking back I might've only enjoyed a few months when TMNT II came out.

I was still huge into TMNT when III toys were getting put on clearance, don't know when that was. I kept buying TMNT toys but did stop buying as many when the Power Rangers automorphin figures came out, by that point I was buying other action figure lines. Now I still loved TMNT and played with TMNT exclusively but all the villains they fought were from other cartoons like Spider-Man, X-Men, Spawn etc. So yeah all this time I was into the turtles but not really buying as much merchandise. I already owned too many raphael's to buy Variant #12, 11 was enough for me, I preferred new villains. Last time I remember seeing TMNT advertised heavily was for Tournament Fighters on the SNES, after that it was just something that kept losing toy ailse space on the shelf. When The Next Mutation figures came out I was so excited that new exciting TMNT stuff was coming out, I never caught the show as a kid but loved having a emale figure, a black badass looking shredder and older looking raphael. But at that point I got into anime heavily with DBZ and later Pokemon so I forgot about the turtles completely until 2003 and in 2003 I was a teenager so it wasn't really until 2005 when I was in high school and wasn't as insecure if I liked the turtles.

passage of time is odd, back then a few years without something felt like forever and now years pass and it's as if said franchise hasn't been out of the shelves for that long. I used to only think it was just me getting older, but I'm not so sure anymore. I see kids that for them a 5 year break doesn't seem like that long. To me the GBA era felt like really long but it was only like 3 years and now kids have consoles for 10 years, basically their whole childhood or they get sequels 4 years later and are fine with it. To me a sequel 4 years later as a kid meant that franchise was long dead.
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Old 12-01-2023, 10:10 AM   #24
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But since Turtlemania was dead before the cartoon series was, a lot of people clearly haven't watched the final seasons. Like I said, my brother had no idea about the Red Sky episodes.
Very well stated to describe the decline of the curve there....

Around "here" the real luster of TMNT was lost with the coming of TMNT III. I'd say that Middle School before High School was probably when it faded for us (1992 or so).

I actually don't think I saw an episode of Fred Wolf beyond season 5 or 6 until I had them on DVD actually.
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Old 12-01-2023, 05:12 PM   #25
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I watched the show from the time I was 3 years old in 1988 to 1996 all the way through the final season. And then even went on to watch Next Mutation in 1997 on Fox on the following year.

Even when I was a young child before the internet existed, I made sure to watch every episode as much as I could, even all the reruns (remember back then they had like 4 eps of reruns each weekday). I probably watched the original cartoon in full about 100 times or more.
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I think discussing the dead period of the franchise is a fantastic topic.
I mean I was too young and barely remember anything about TMNT pre Power Rangers. It's also hard for most people to be objective including myself since as a kid just a couple of months can feel like years times when it wasn't. I felt like turtle mania was huge pre-power rangers but thinking back I might've only enjoyed a few months when TMNT II came out.

I was still huge into TMNT when III toys were getting put on clearance, don't know when that was. I kept buying TMNT toys but did stop buying as many when the Power Rangers automorphin figures came out, by that point I was buying other action figure lines. Now I still loved TMNT and played with TMNT exclusively but all the villains they fought were from other cartoons like Spider-Man, X-Men, Spawn etc. So yeah all this time I was into the turtles but not really buying as much merchandise. I already owned too many raphael's to buy Variant #12, 11 was enough for me, I preferred new villains. Last time I remember seeing TMNT advertised heavily was for Tournament Fighters on the SNES, after that it was just something that kept losing toy ailse space on the shelf. When The Next Mutation figures came out I was so excited that new exciting TMNT stuff was coming out, I never caught the show as a kid but loved having a emale figure, a black badass looking shredder and older looking raphael. But at that point I got into anime heavily with DBZ and later Pokemon so I forgot about the turtles completely until 2003 and in 2003 I was a teenager so it wasn't really until 2005 when I was in high school and wasn't as insecure if I liked the turtles.

passage of time is odd, back then a few years without something felt like forever and now years pass and it's as if said franchise hasn't been out of the shelves for that long. I used to only think it was just me getting older, but I'm not so sure anymore. I see kids that for them a 5 year break doesn't seem like that long. To me the GBA era felt like really long but it was only like 3 years and now kids have consoles for 10 years, basically their whole childhood or they get sequels 4 years later and are fine with it. To me a sequel 4 years later as a kid meant that franchise was long dead.
I once made a thread about being a TMNT fan in the 1998-2002 period.

Also, I forgot to mention that another thing that was popular around the time I was 5-8 was Biker Mice From Mars. But I don't think the series was very popular outside some European nations? It definitely was a somewhat big thing among guys of my own generation when they were kids. Not as huge as DBZ or Pokémon, but probably as big as The Power Rangers.

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Very well stated to describe the decline of the curve there....

Around "here" the real luster of TMNT was lost with the coming of TMNT III. I'd say that Middle School before High School was probably when it faded for us (1992 or so).

I actually don't think I saw an episode of Fred Wolf beyond season 5 or 6 until I had them on DVD actually.
I remember this one time seeing people dressed up as the Turtles at my city carnival when I was little. Either it was a promotion for the 3rd movie or The Next Mutation, I'm guessing. Most likely the latter, since I seriously doubt I'd have a somewhat clear memory of something I saw when I was 2 or 3 at best.

TNM aired here but I don't remember ever watching it. I spoke to some guys in HS who told me they saw it when they were kids and they said they thought it was lousy even back in the day.
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Old 12-01-2023, 07:37 PM   #26
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Here Turtlemania was limited to the cartoons, video games and toys, since Russia culturally "lagged" behind trends. We were too late for the movies, so to speak, so few people have seen them, usually on ****** bootleg VHS and few people knew anything about TMNT beyond FW cartoon.

So Turtlemania, left an enormous trace on my generation, but culturally it was just like a instant flash - just 2-3 years and it was gone, replaced, with Pokemons, Sailor-Moon, Spider-Man and some other stuff.

I think I disconnected from general trends somewhere in 1997 and was only vaguely aware what other kids of my age liked. I was still drawing TMNT comic books and my own characters up until beginning of 00s, when I get into modern (at that time) video games and emulators.

Though, I think neither Next Mutation, nor 2k3 were able to bring back Turtlemania here. If anything people (well, old school fans) were constantly complaining about lack of FW characters. Though, 2k12 series managed to bring some of it back - I remember seeing its toys in the biggest Toy Mall in the country in 2015, so they must have been somewhat of a hit with kids.
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Old 12-02-2023, 03:05 AM   #27
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Here Turtlemania was limited to the cartoons, video games and toys, since Russia culturally "lagged" behind trends.
No Archie or Fleetway comics in Russia?

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Old 12-03-2023, 09:21 AM   #28
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Until I got the internet in like, 2006- I had no idea that the FW show continued on for so long.
I dropped out of TMNT after the silliness of Secret of the Ooze and moved on to Toxic Crusaders.
The last (action) cartoon series I watched back then was X-Men, and by 94 I was "too old" for all that.

I've only seen bits of "Red Sky" episodes and I'm confident in saying I wouldn't have liked them.
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Old 12-03-2023, 10:44 AM   #29
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Until I got the internet in like, 2006- I had no idea that the FW show continued on for so long.
I dropped out of TMNT after the silliness of Secret of the Ooze and moved on to Toxic Crusaders.
The last (action) cartoon series I watched back then was X-Men, and by 94 I was "too old" for all that.

I've only seen bits of "Red Sky" episodes and I'm confident in saying I wouldn't have liked them.
Yeah man, I think the only thing that kept me in animation at all during that entire window after the SOTO was basically Batman TAS. That and Iron Man but even then I was falling out of my Iron Man fandom for about 4 or 5 years at that point.
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Old 12-03-2023, 11:37 AM   #30
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Until I got the internet in like, 2006- I had no idea that the FW show continued on for so long.
I dropped out of TMNT after the silliness of Secret of the Ooze and moved on to Toxic Crusaders.
The last (action) cartoon series I watched back then was X-Men, and by 94 I was "too old" for all that.

I've only seen bits of "Red Sky" episodes and I'm confident in saying I wouldn't have liked them.
I was already 12-13 when I first saw the Red Sky episodes. So I liked them. But had I watched them back in the 90s when I was quite younger then I doubt I'd have liked them.

Besides, Red Sky is only truly enjoyable in the 1st season. I missed Shredder so much during the Dregg episodes. It's good we got a 3-parter where he came back momentarily, but the series ended with a Dregg episode.

You know, it's kinda crazy. Imagine travelling back in time to 1989 and telling everyone at the time that Shredder and Krang would eventually get replaced by a new villain called Lord Dregg in the last two seasons. Who would have believed you?!
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Old 12-03-2023, 12:39 PM   #31
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You know, it's kinda crazy. Imagine travelling back in time to 1989 and telling everyone at the time that Shredder and Krang would eventually get replaced by a new villain called Lord Dregg in the last two seasons. Who would have believed you?!
Not in 1989, but maybe in mid-late 1992, after seing what had begun to happen in the Archieverse.
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Old 12-03-2023, 12:40 PM   #32
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Not in 1989, but maybe in mid-late 1992, after seing what had begun to happen in the Archieverse.
I've never read those. Did Shredder get phased out there too?
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Old 12-03-2023, 02:00 PM   #33
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I've never read those. Did Shredder get phased out there too?
You can check out basic facts about each issue here:

https://mutantooze.org/ninjaturtles/...hie/archie.htm

Spoiler:
Following the final events of Raw Power, published in October 1991, Shredder, Krang, Bebop and Rocksteady are phased out. Shredder returns later, but now teaming up with Armaggon and Verminator X, and only in a few issues
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Old 12-03-2023, 08:17 PM   #34
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I've never read those. Did Shredder get phased out there too?
It's complicated.

Steve Murphy (under the pseudonym "Dean Clarrain") clearly didn't seem to care about the FW status quo at all, so undid it fairly quickly and the only similarities afterwards seemed to merely be a consequence of having to advertise the same toyline. Bebop, Rocksteady and/or Krang were only featured in eight issues written by him before they were removed from the story, and in most of those issues they only show up to be responsible for a mutation and do very little else. They show up for three more issues much later but that is about it, the guy wrote 66 issues and those characters were only in 14 total, nor did they really appear in the two issues after he left the book. I don't think they were in many of the side minis either. As for characters like Burne, Vernon and Irma? He just straight up ignored those characters.

I suspect there might have been some sort of minimum requirement for those characters to appear and then he got rid of them when that had been filled? That's just a guess though.

As for Shredder, he is a more prominent character and he never really disappears in a way as to imply he won't show up again. However, he never really becomes the main villain again and he doesn't show up at all for the last 25 issues Murphy wrote. He is however the villain in Archie's attempt to rebrand the series. He's really more of a recurring villain than the big bad.

I think it kind of speaks to a problem with trying to depict Shredder as the main villain, along with moves like making him him an Utrom or an ancient demon. In a world populated with villains who are far more powerful and resourceful than some gangster in a samurai helmet ever could be, why is Shredder the main baddie?
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Old 12-03-2023, 09:11 PM   #35
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It's complicated.

Steve Murphy (under the pseudonym "Dean Clarrain") clearly didn't seem to care about the FW status quo at all, so undid it fairly quickly and the only similarieties afterwards seemed to merely be a consequence of having to advertise the same toyline. Bebop, Rocksteady and/or Krang were only featured in eight issues written by him before they were removed from the story, and in most of those issues they only show up to be responsible for a mutation and do very little else. They show up for three more issues much later but that is about it, the guy wrote 66 issues and those characters were only in 14 total, nor did they really appear in the two issues after he left the book. I don't think they were in many of the side minis either. As for characters like Burne, Vernon and Irma? He just straight up ignored those characters.

I suspect there might have been some sort of minimum requirement for those characters to appear and then he got rid of them when that had been filled? That's just a guess though.

As for Shredder, he is a more prominent character and he never really disappears in a way as to imply he won't show up again. However, he never really becomes the main villain again and he doesn't show up at all for the last 25 issues Murphy wrote. He is however the villain in Archie's attempt to rebrand the series. He's really more of a recurring villain than the big bad.

I think it kind of speaks to a problem with trying to depict Shredder as the main villain, along with moves like making him him an Utrom or an ancient demon. In a world populated with villains who are far more powerful and resourceful than some gangster in a samurai helmet ever could be, why is Shredder the main baddie?
I mean, it was mostly driven by the fact that they didn't have the right to the episode scripts, and he was bascially ordered to stop and make original stories. So he set new plots up, and then those naturally developed into the unique plots that we got, which personally, I think was for the better. And then he just kept going and seeing how far he could take the universe he'd set up.

As for your last point, it's because Shredder is their most personal foe. Why is Joker Batman's arch enemy? Why is Lex Luthor Superman's? There's more emotional investment in those stories. Sure, other enemies can technically DO more, but their arch foes hit them at their cores.
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Old 12-13-2023, 05:30 PM   #36
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I just remembered... Turtles in Time came out in 1991 as an arcade game. And in 1992 was released on the Super Nintendo.

I have no idea how much the game sold, but you can easily find people speaking highly of it online even way before the Cowabunga Collection was even a possibility. And a lot of people complained about Turtles in Time Reshelled.

Perhaps Turtles in Time was Turtlemania's last hurrah?
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Old 12-14-2023, 12:49 AM   #37
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No Archie or Fleetway comics in Russia?
Archie comic books were released, but its Russian publisher didn't care about numeration, so the series was released with a lot of gaps (like after Issue 7, they immediately started to publish Issue 40 or something like that).
From what I found those comic books were fairly rare and only 35 issues were released here.
They also published one original TMNT comic book of their own.

Fleeway books were released by another publisher, but they have published only few issues, I think. I have the ones with posters for Leonardo and Donatello (which are in my room to this day).

Interesting thing about Archie run is that some of the issues were published on their own, as stand alone comic books, while others were part of bigger magazines (usually about video games). Not sure how it was possible, but that was Russia in the 90s and copyrights mean very little here.

Also, it seems IDW comic books were also published here, but I've never seen them. Not that I visit bookstores often.

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Old 12-14-2023, 10:05 AM   #38
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So I would say that around the age of 8-11 years old (about 1989-1992), a VERY large percentage of kids my age were watching the show. However during the red sky years, me and my classmates were like 13-15 years old. By that point I think that the percentage of us that were watching the show was probably equal to the percent that was NOT watching the show when it was at its peak.
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Old 12-14-2023, 04:07 PM   #39
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So I would say that around the age of 8-11 years old (about 1989-1992), a VERY large percentage of kids my age were watching the show. However during the red sky years, me and my classmates were like 13-15 years old. By that point I think that the percentage of us that were watching the show was probably equal to the percent that was NOT watching the show when it was at its peak.
Plus, each of the Red Sky seasons only had 8 episodes. So clearly the show took a nosedive in popularity.

Seasons 3 and 4 were massive and then each season got shorter until the last 3.
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Old 12-14-2023, 04:11 PM   #40
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They also published one original TMNT comic book of their own.
Were those comics any good?
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