Sonic the Hedgehog

[Turo602]

Originally Posted by TMNT_Guy

Sonic the Hedgehog 4 was backed by Sega so...yeah.

So what? Where's that going? Last I checked, Sonic 4 has beautiful graphics.

Originally Posted by TMNT_Guy

It's been explained multiple times why they don't have enough time to make hand drawn style graphics. Even with all the money in the world there's only so much you can get done in time when you have less then a handful of people working. Taxman's team is simply to small to work on something like that.

Yes, so why does there have to be a time limit and why couldn't Sega expand his team? It's not an impossible task. They either didn't think to make the game look that nice from the beginning or Sega is holding them back.

[oldmanwinters]

Originally Posted by TMNT_Guy

Some people can't stand it, some people don't see anything wrong with it, there never seems to be a middle ground with Sonic 4.

Honestly, I think I'm one of the few in the middle with it. I don't think it's very good, but I do get some enjoyment out of it, especially the art direction in the snowy carnival zone of the sequel. It gameplay shift between Episodes 1 and 2 is a bit jarring and it's disappointing we will probably never get an Episode 3. Overall, it's a "meh" game that I wish didn't have that coveted #4 attached to it, because it suggests close continuity with the Genesis games... but is clearly a product of a post-Dreamcast approach to Sonic theory.

Originally Posted by Turo602

Yes, so why does there have to be a time limit and why couldn't Sega expand his team? It's not an impossible task. They either didn't think to make the game look that nice from the beginning or Sega is holding them back.

Even the great Sonic 3 had to make its "Hedgehog Day" deadline! Fortunately, we ended up getting "Sonic & Knuckles" out of the whole deal.

[TMNT_Guy]

Originally Posted by oldmanwinters

Honestly, I think I'm one of the few in the middle with it. I don't think it's very good, but I do get some enjoyment out of it, especially the art direction in the snowy carnival zone of the sequel. It gameplay shift between Episodes 1 and 2 is a bit jarring and it's disappointing we will probably never get an Episode 3. Overall, it's a "meh" game that I wish didn't have that coveted #4 attached to it, because it suggests close continuity with the Genesis games... but is clearly a product of a post-Dreamcast approach to Sonic theory.

That's more or less how I feel about. I'm curious what you mean about the continuity though. I thought it did a great job linking the Classic era up with the Modern era, Episode Metal in particular. Showing Eggman picking up and fixing the remains of Metal Sonic from Stardust Speedway in Sonic CD and even explaining why Metal Sonic is special compared to the other Sonic robots.

[retr0pia75]

One thing about Mania that I'm curious about is how they're going to do the special stages. Are they going to make revamped versions of the ones of the original games, or just flat-out new ones entirely?

[oldmanwinters]

Originally Posted by TMNT_Guy

That's more or less how I feel about. I'm curious what you mean about the continuity though. I thought it did a great job linking the Classic era up with the Modern era, Episode Metal in particular. Showing Eggman picking up and fixing the remains of Metal Sonic from Stardust Speedway in Sonic CD and even explaining why Metal Sonic is special compared to the other Sonic robots.

I didn't mean timeline continuity, but aesthetic continuity. Sonic Adventure did a very good job of translating the look of classic Sonic into a 3D model, despite the more radical changes seen in the promotional artwork. Sonic Adventure 2 brought the 3D model more in line with the artwork, giving Sonic a sleeker and taller presence. The two big gameplay changes brought about by the Dreamcast era were the homing attack and the run animation, which abandoned the illusion that Sonic's feat move in an impossible circular loop.

The homing attack forever changed the platforming strategy of the games, and it was probably a necessary evil to keep the player from frustration in many missed targets and cheap deaths. Just try to leap atop the egg capsules at the end of an Act in Sonic Adventure and you'll probably know what I mean. Nevertheless, careful jump and roll placement were key to the core mechanics of the Genesis games, as Sonic could bounce high after hitting an enemy with lots of forward or vertical momentum and sometimes reach higher points. The homing attack essentially resets all momentum with each correct execution.

The run animation in Sonic 4 would have likely benefited from a less realistic but more retro-inspired style. Whereas Sonic's realistic movement is understandable in full 3D, in 2D it makes him look like his sliding across the ground if he's not up to full speed. The older animations sold the illusion that he stepped with more of a purpose. I previously mentioned the loss of rolling strategy from the Genesis games, and it's very strange to see Sonic assume a vulnerable position when he gets airborne after rolling up a slope.

Furthermore, Sonic 4 has little in common with Sonic 3 & Knuckles. Sonic 3 built upon Sonic 2, making changes that benefited the new title, and Sonic 2 clearly built upon the foundation laid by Sonic 1. Sonic 4 plays like 3D Sonic but tries to look like Sonic 1. My expectations for "Sonic 4" assume that all previous entries in the series would be considered. Perhaps if the game had received an "Episode 3," things questions might have been addressed.

Thus, when I play Sonic 4, it is clear to me that it is not a logical sequel to the old games, but simply an experiment to take the 3D progress back into the 2nd dimension.

EDIT: To say something positive about Sonic 4, I like the weirdness of the Sonic/Tails team-up moves in Episode 2. And the snowy park is beautiful and Christmasy.

[The Deadman]

[TMNT_Guy]

A "Collectors Edition" for Sonic Mania has been announced. It comes with a download key so the game is still digital only which is disappointing. Still, that Sonic statue in pretty cool. When you flip the power switch on the Mega Drive/Genesis it plays the classic "SEGA" chant.

It's 69.99 and available for PC, Xbox One and PS4. Apparently it's only available for a limited time.
http://www.sonicthehedgehog.com/en/g...tors/#purchase

[Wildcat]

This is really nice but ya...the whole point of a collector's edition should have been a physical copy of the game. It's soooo easy to put this on a disc.

Standard PS4/Xbox1 case with that exact box art with DISC inside.

Statue and ring cart could have still been included.

[Shark_Blade]

I'll get it digital then just like Sonic 4 Episode 1 & 2.

[oldmanwinters]

Originally Posted by Shark_Blade

I'll get it digital then just like Sonic 4 Episode 1 & 2.

I expect to go the Steam route. Curious to know how much it will retail for at Launch and whether I can be patient enough to wait for an inevitable discount.

[The Deadman]

It'll more than likely be $20 at launch.

[TMNT_Guy]

So they released a "infomercial" for Sonic Mania Collectors Edition. I wasn't expecting the statue to be that big.


For those that don't know, it's mimicking the original Sonic the Hedgehog 2 commercial.

[Turo602]

Haha, those are awesome. I already pre-ordered the collector's edition. That statue looks sweet.

[The Deadman]

Apparently the bigger Sonic game is now called Sonic Forces
https://mynintendonews.com/2017/03/1...-sonic-forces/

[The Deadman]

Sonic Mania also got pushed back to Summer now

[Shark_Blade]

I'm loving what I've seen so far.

[Wildcat]

Ya this looks awesome. I read a speculation that it takes place in a world where Eggman wins. If that's true it explains why classic Sonic is back. Maybe he comes from another universe or dimension...to join forces.

[Cure]

Looks like all the other recent Sonic joints. And I hear wisps are back and wisps suuuuck.

[Wildcat]

Wisps only give you a temporary ability to do something. Just like any other item box power-up. I don't see the problem with them. They were also in Lost World.

[Cure]

The powers suck, the music that plays while you have them sucks, and the voice (ROCKEEEEEEEEET!) sucks.

And I know they were in Lost World, what's your point?