Star Wars Episode 8

[Spike Spiegel]

Originally Posted by Vegita-San

How I feel too.. especially with the head of lucas films anti male message.

If you think about it, Kathleen Kennedy probably experienced a lot of 70s and 80s era sexism to come up as far as she has in the male dominated film industry. She's likely seen more than her share of Weinsteins, Spaceys, and Ratners. Now that she's in a position of great power, she probably wants to shake things up in that regard, in terms of who gets to be in front of the camera as well as who's behind it.

I'd imagine that's at least part of the reason why the newer Star Wars films and projects(at least TFA/sequel trilogy and Rogue One) seem so female-focused.

I'm fine with more female characters, as long as they aren't boring Mary Sues. Maybe when they get through ramming the current stage of the franchise down our throats we'll get an Ahsoka Tano standalone flick about her years as a Grey Jedi. Clone Wars is still canon, and I know one of the characters in Rogue One also originated in the animated shows, so it seems possible.

[Vegita-San]

while that's entirely possible..

all indications are that she is just terrible and a chore to work with.

SPeilburg himself said she was terrible at her secretary job, but some how got promoted. either she slept around to get ahead, or she got promoted just so he wouldn't have to see her as much.

As for lucasfilm, I can't help but wonder if lucas 'chose' her to run the company, just so he could watch her flounder under her own ego. her films may make money NOW..but just wait until the general public gets even more tired of the same old formula than we are now. and see how fast the cookie crumbles.

that's my theory anyway.

Originally Posted by Spike Spiegel

I'm fine with more female characters, as long as they aren't boring Mary Sues. Maybe when they get through ramming the current stage of the franchise down our throats we'll get an Ahsoka Tano standalone flick about her years as a Grey Jedi. Clone Wars is still canon, and I know one of the characters in Rogue One also originated in the animated shows, so it seems possible.

the sad part is, we have to constantly repeat this, but those with an agenda won't believe it anyway. now I don't think 'Cool, another awesome woman character'..... Instead it's 'WHY is this being done?'

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by Vegita-San

the sad part is, we have to constantly repeat this, but those with an agenda won't believe it anyway. now I don't think 'Cool, another awesome woman character'..... Instead it's 'WHY is this being done?'

We literally have one lead female character, Rey, and the lead from Rogue one was a one-shot character killed off in the same movie.

Your whining about there being some anti-male crusade is absolutely idiotic. You sound to me like you can't handle major female characters. I'm not even a big fan of Rey (so far, the next movie can change that), but I don't see a problem.

[Utrommaniac]

An Ashoka movie would be pretty awesome. I'd even take a made-for-TV movie of high quality.

[plastroncafe]

I'm tickled by the idea of people into Star Wars who don't enjoy Mary Sue's, as if Anakin or Luke are anything other than Mary Sues.

That's like hating Mary Sue's but still liking Batman.

[Utrommaniac]

To put it this way...

Rey is no more of a Mary Sue than Luke is. Remember when he deflected energy bolts with his eyes covered in ANH, and how he Force-lifted his lightsaber in ESB even though nobody told him how?

[Spike Spiegel]

Originally Posted by plastroncafe

I'm tickled by the idea of people into Star Wars who don't enjoy Mary Sue's, as if Anakin or Luke are anything other than Mary Sues.

That's like hating Mary Sue's but still liking Batman.

But they aren't Mary Sues.

They're Gary Stus.

Luke and Anakin are still fairly boring too, in their own respective ways. Anakin less so, due to his overall arc. Obi-Wan (for the PT) and Han Solo (for the originals) are more fun to watch, IMHO. I guess I feel that way about Finn and Poe for the new trilogy.

[Utrommaniac]

I suppose in many respects, Anakin is probably a little higher on the "Stu-Sue" hierarchy because of the whole virgin birth thing.

Spoiler:

But I did realize...what if Anakin's origins explain another reason why the Jedi Order are forbidden to pursue romantic relationships?
What if a Jedi and their Padawan visited Tatooine for reasons, and the Padawan broke protocol with a "wham bam yes ma'am" with Shmi Skywalker.
Which ended up resulting in a baby with a far higher frequency of force sensitivity than was considered "normal" because of his parentage?
And of course later, that would be passed on in Luke and Leia, but with more Force Sensitivity than even Anakin had. Which...would probably provide a better explanation for why Padme died in childbirth than "being broken hearted". Maybe giving birth to not one, but two, highly force-sensitive babies was too much for her to take physically, especially after Anakin nearly strangled her.

Granted, there are lots of Force Sensitive beings that would probably pass on their abilities without necessarily knowing they are, or just not being trained as Jedi.

It would probably him down a few notches on the Sue Meter, but that would only open up more questions than solving problems.

Yeah, I'm gonna say, that Han Solo movie is lookin' pretty good about now. It would be interesting to see what it changes from the Han Solo novel trilogy of the 90's. Especially with certain Clone Wars elements retconning some of their most important plotlines of those novels, even before the Expanded Universe purge.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Utrommaniac

Remember when he deflected energy bolts with his eyes covered in ANH, and how he Force-lifted his lightsaber in ESB even though nobody told him how?

He literally had people telling him what to do right there in both instances. Posthumously in one, but still.

[newfan]

Well, I'm ready to see Luke again (depending on what they do with him), even if he will likely be killed off as with all Jedi Masters, just wonder in which movie that will be.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by newfan

Well, I'm ready to see Luke again (depending on what they do with him), even if he will likely be killed off as with all Jedi Masters, just wonder in which movie that will be.

I say 0 chance in 8. Decent chance in 9, bigger chance he carries over till at least 10. Moreso he lives to 10 now that Fisher died. Wouldn't foresee him in an 11.

What the hell is this?

https://www.comicbookmovie.com/sci-f...t-jedi-a155520

I hope this movie at least illustrates to us the stakes. Insomuch as the New Republic, the "Resistance," and the First Order... what and who and why is all of this, I have no idea, particularly after 7. The galactic politics seemed simple in any of the previous 6 movies, yet in 7 they seem so nebulous. The opening crawl of 7 seems to fly in the face of everything we see in everything after. It's weird this isn't important for any of TPTB to lay out. What are the stakes? Who are they fighting and why? Why is the New Republic against fighting the First Order despite the First Order clearly being all about their genocide to such a point that the New Republic needs a FAKE rebel alliance to fight their battles for them in secret? Especially after 7, when the First Order blew up a bunch of their planets?

[Vegita-San]

Originally Posted by Utrommaniac

To put it this way...

maybe ben told him about it off screen?

even dragonball super has mary sues. the female Saiyans go SS2 right off the bat.

[sdp]

Rey is the biggest Mary Sue Star Wars has ever had, and that's saying a lot, with that said I still like Rey and I like her being the "main" Jedi, she was just written very poorly in TFA, but I blame that on TFA and not Rey. Unlike say Captain Phasma, her character wasn't damaged and treated like trash.

I do think Keneddy's Star Wars is pandering to the extreme left in many of their things and ironically enough the extreme left has attacked Kennedy for being sexist You can never please that crowd. I think Rogue One also having a female lead was more of a they didn't expect the main movie to do it so they did it here to be different and when they realized they didn't care to change it but there wasn't anything "planned" to have both movies with a female lead.

An yeah as much as I crap on Disney's Star Wars, I still want to be blown away by Episode VIII and change my stance on it. I don't want to be a bitter Disney SW hater like the prequel haters were the last decade. I hope VIII proves me wrong, TFA just disappointed me so much as has everything else that has come out that I'm not sure it'll happen but the possibility is there.

I love me some Star Wars.

[newfan]

I'm not saying that the prequels didn't matter to me but it matters more to me that they don't mess up the sequels, still, I take the parts of Star Wars I enjoy even if I end up not liking it all.

[plastroncafe]

There's more than one crowd that'll never be pleased.

[Vegita-San]

Originally Posted by sdp

An yeah as much as I crap on Disney's Star Wars, I still want to be blown away by Episode VIII and change my stance on it. I don't want to be a bitter Disney SW hater like the prequel haters were the last decade. I hope VIII proves me wrong, TFA just disappointed me so much as has everything else that has come out that I'm not sure it'll happen but the possibility is there.

I love me some Star Wars.

yep. I don't like NOT wanting to see new star wars on opening day. but after all the bad Political PR, and the disappointing last two movies, I don't mind waiting a week or two to see this one depending on how reviews came out.

If past me went to the future and saw this reply, i wouldn't beleive I'd have said it.

[snake]

Originally Posted by Vegita-San

yep. I don't like NOT wanting to see new star wars on opening day. but after all the bad Political PR, and the disappointing last two movies, I don't mind waiting a week or two to see this one depending on how reviews came out.

If past me went to the future and saw this reply, i wouldn't beleive I'd have said it.

How the f*ck did you not like Rogue One? I can see not getting TFA, because I thought it was awful, but RO was everything I asked for.

[Metalwolf]

I liked RO, I didn't care for TFA because of how fast they upped Rey's powers and how easily she just learned everything, even to the point of beating a trained Dark Sider.

I think what it is that irks me so, is that they are seemingly afraid to give these new women protagonists much or any flaws or struggles for fear of making them appear 'weak' and 'vulnerable.' They come off as a little too perfect, often not being made to struggle or have setbacks in pursuit of their quest, and seem to even rise in power unnaturally fast (compared to the more often realistically paced progression for males) so they can be the ideal 'girl power' or 'strong woman,' and not be seen as having weakness or vulnerabilities.

Rey is no Luke or Anakin. She rose too fast, did not have any, if much struggles in gaining her power, and almost everything was showcased to illustrate how awesome she was. Thus is not how you write a good woman character, because it shows that you in fact have little confidence in this character to actually 'work,' so you artificially pump her up with inflated abilities and few flaws so you can get the audience to (hopefully) like her.

[Utrommaniac]

I personally wasn't too bothered by Rey's quickness to pick up on her skills so fast. Firstly because of narrative purpose, and then I just assumed it was because she was a fast learner.

From what I can tell, her greatest flaw is not wanting to make connections because of her abandonment issues. Like when she tried to ditch BB-8 as soon as she was sure she had rescued him. It's not that she can't do it. She actively chooses not to make friends with anyone, probably in the hope that she can start doing it after her family returns for her.

Granted, it's been a while since I've seen the movie, but I wasn't really bothered then. I was more worried about her being declared a Mary Sue because she could fly a ship pretty well.

[plastroncafe]

All this talk of Rey having too much power, and not once has anyone brought up Finn's ability to wield a lightsaber.

Or his ability to use the guns in the Escape ship... Or on the Falcon. We pretty much know he is mostly a janitor, whereas Rey is a mechanic.

Neither of these things bothered me, because let's not forget as a child Anakin Skywalker build C-3PO, and was the product of a virgin birth.

Everyone's mileage varies.