The future of Rise - Page 2

BazookaJo · 08-05-2020, 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autbot_Benz

Rise has no future and good riddance to it

Is it really that bad?

I know IMDB rates it pretty darn low and what I've seen does not look particularly inspiring, but anything new can take time to find it's stride if you stick with it.

Can I take it that ROTTMNT is not worth investing any of my time in?

*CyberCubed* · 08-05-2020, 07:05 AM

I haven't watched much past the first 10 eps, but there's people who enjoy it.

After the show ends I plan to marathon it to give it a fair and proper viewing, but this is the first TMNT cartoon I didn't feel compelled to watch new as it was airing. I dropped it after the first 10ish episodes, the long hiatus didn't help.

But as said I will do a proper watch of the show in full after it ends. I don't like to judge shows before seeing them fully.

*Autbot_Benz* · 08-05-2020, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BazookaJo

Is it really that bad?

I know IMDB rates it pretty darn low and what I've seen does not look particularly inspiring, but anything new can take time to find it's stride if you stick with it.

Can I take it that ROTTMNT is not worth investing any of my time in?

that's up to you regarding watching rise or not. I could barley stomach the first 4 episodes.

*Powder* · 08-05-2020, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BazookaJo

Is it really that bad?

I know IMDB rates it pretty darn low and what I've seen does not look particularly inspiring, but anything new can take time to find it's stride if you stick with it.

Can I take it that ROTTMNT is not worth investing any of my time in?

IMDB's rating is only low because people like Benz here don't like change and/or shows that are targeted at people 20 years their junior.

They mark it low 'cause they're angry they aren't being catered to.

If you're closed minded & have a very specific idea of what TMNT is "supposed" to be, you may hate it. If you like frenetic action & very silly humor, it could suit you fine. This is like the Warheads sour candy version of the turtles (which I love, personally).

*IndigoErth* · 08-05-2020, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BazookaJo

Can I take it that ROTTMNT is not worth investing any of my time in?

Depends on what you like out of your TMNT. If you want a TMNT series that's basically like every other kid cartoon on tv these days, hey, go for it.

If not and you prefer a more consistently serialized series, there are a handful of episodes potentially worth watching together. Most of them are also the "longer" full half hour eps.

Spoiler:

At some point after it's over I just intend on binging those that I feel are worth it and get a better look at it that way with all the random junk out of the way.

Also, if the portrayal of their personalities matters to you, then you may or might not care for the changes depending on who your fave is. Mikey is largely fine, but due to the rest he doesn't really stand out on his own so much anymore. Raph is mostly fine, provided you don't mind his fire largely being extinguished. Donnie... this one is the arrogant jerk version, to put it bluntly. Leo... hoo boy... quite out of character from his normal portrayal. Personally, I don't care to see this personality on him again.

---------

Come to think of it... the paper ninjas are where? This show had all these "new ideas" that have been underutilized and/or just not seen in quite a while. Paper ninjas, Mayhem, kid Purple Dragons, kid Baxter, Draxum as a villain could have lasted longer... I'm sure there are others. Heck, even the Mystic City has just barely even been a backdrop for this series, with most appearances being one-off eps.

Torterra · 08-05-2020, 05:53 PM

---------

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

Come to think of it... the paper ninjas are where? This show had all these "new ideas" that have been underutilized and/or just not seen in quite a while. Paper ninjas, Mayhem, kid Purple Dragons, kid Baxter, Draxum as a villain could have lasted longer... I'm sure there are others. Heck, even the Mystic City has just barely even been a backdrop for this series, with most appearances being one-off eps.

They did show the purple dragons again in season 2 I think the episode was called "Breaking Purple" but I do agree with you on the paper ninjas and Mayhem though.

*sdp* · 08-06-2020, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I haven't watched much past the first 10 eps, but there's people who enjoy it.

After the show ends I plan to marathon it to give it a fair and proper viewing, but this is the first TMNT cartoon I didn't feel compelled to watch new as it was airing. I dropped it after the first 10ish episodes, the long hiatus didn't help.

But as said I will do a proper watch of the show in full after it ends. I don't like to judge shows before seeing them fully.

This is exactly me, I will just wait, I hate some of the things it was doing but loved some of the things it was doing. I'm all for different and trying new things, as long as it's fun. I'll wait until the movie is about to be released to have everything fresh. I wish the show gets a proper ending tho.

Kit31 · 08-06-2020, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

Depends on what you like out of your TMNT. If you want a TMNT series that's basically like every other kid cartoon on tv these days, hey, go for it.

If not and you prefer a more consistently serialized series, there are a handful of episodes potentially worth watching together. Most of them are also the "longer" full half hour eps.

Spoiler:

At some point after it's over I just intend on binging those that I feel are worth it and get a better look at it that way with all the random junk out of the way.

Also, if the portrayal of their personalities matters to you, then you may or might not care for the changes depending on who your fave is. Mikey is largely fine, but due to the rest he doesn't really stand out on his own so much anymore. Raph is mostly fine, provided you don't mind his fire largely being extinguished. Donnie... this one is the arrogant jerk version, to put it bluntly. Leo... hoo boy... quite out of character from his normal portrayal. Personally, I don't care to see this personality on him again.

I agree, most of the half-hour episodes are definitely the best in the series, but there are also a few of the more "filler" ones that are quite enjoyable. The series as a whole (so far) is kind of "meh" for me, but I do look forward to new episodes when they air. I just don't watch episodes over and over again like I have with the last two series.

I think the biggest turn-off for me on this series is the characterizations for the Turtles. I agree with your descriptions of their personalities, but I do like Mikey the best in this series. Raph isn't horrible, either. Leo and Donnie are definitely my least favorite, and Donnie's arrogant, jerk-y attitude is the biggest turn-off for me of them all. I don't mind April all that much, and Splinter has grown on me.

*IndigoErth* · 08-06-2020, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kit31

and Donnie's arrogant, jerk-y attitude is the biggest turn-off for me of them all..

It's rather unfortunate that they made him that way. In the beginning I really thought it seemed like he was just rather witty and maybe the best of the group in that way and potentially a 4th wall breaker in observation of the other three...but then it became apparent that it isn't witty humor, he's just a jerk.

What has became of sweet, good hearted Donnie...

Improving Mikey from not being such a dunce is good. Likewise Raph if some are tired of the angry thing. (Albeit seeming kind of bland, imo, since they didn't replace it with a better trait.) But for some reason they took the two cooler headed, more reserved boys and made them a jerk and an cocky idiot. *sigh*

But I guess we'll find out soon if these next eps are the end of it. Unless they choose to be vague about it.

*Zulithe* · 08-07-2020, 02:09 AM

It's definitely ending. The toys have all dried up. Keep in mind that TMNT is very much a show tied to its toy sales and has been for every series. If there's no merch being put out (and there hasn't for most of the year, and barely any in the back half of 2019 either) then you should see the writing on the wall.

BazookaJo · 08-07-2020, 02:39 AM

Thanks for that may need to give it a whirl - just forcing my son to watch the 2012 series with me currently

I think things need to evolve occasionally - certainly expectations change and the quality of many kids TV shows are far superior to the Saturday morning pap many of us older fans remember. Personally I'd love to see a more mature incarnation similar to the Castlevania animated series but don't think that's where the money is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

Depends on what you like out of your TMNT. If you want a TMNT series that's basically like every other kid cartoon on tv these days, hey, go for it.

If not and you prefer a more consistently serialized series, there are a handful of episodes potentially worth watching together. Most of them are also the "longer" full half hour eps.

Spoiler:

At some point after it's over I just intend on binging those that I feel are worth it and get a better look at it that way with all the random junk out of the way.

Also, if the portrayal of their personalities matters to you, then you may or might not care for the changes depending on who your fave is. Mikey is largely fine, but due to the rest he doesn't really stand out on his own so much anymore. Raph is mostly fine, provided you don't mind his fire largely being extinguished. Donnie... this one is the arrogant jerk version, to put it bluntly. Leo... hoo boy... quite out of character from his normal portrayal. Personally, I don't care to see this personality on him again.

---------

Come to think of it... the paper ninjas are where? This show had all these "new ideas" that have been underutilized and/or just not seen in quite a while. Paper ninjas, Mayhem, kid Purple Dragons, kid Baxter, Draxum as a villain could have lasted longer... I'm sure there are others. Heck, even the Mystic City has just barely even been a backdrop for this series, with most appearances being one-off eps.

~~AquaParade~~ · 08-07-2020, 10:29 AM

I don't wish any ill-will on anyone who is either working on the show or a fan of it.

But from a selfish, human, perspective, I am more than glad to see this show fail, because it will send the message to Nick and Viacom that this is not the ideal way to handle the franchise. It's about as far away from traditional as you can get, which is not what I want. And hey, if you read my posts around here, you should know I'm pretty open-minded with adaptions, but this is just a bridge too far.

80gmrp · 08-07-2020, 11:19 AM

I swore that I would stay out of this forum due to what happened the last time I posted here. While I’m breaking my promise this time, it’s not to express hate for the series (while I fully agree with AquaParade here, my dislike for the series has toned down significantly since then), or even to express an opinion.

Rather, I saw this on Tumblr. Whether the poster saw this thread or not, it appears the supporters of the show over there are also aware of the poor ratings.

https://rad-squillz.tumblr.com/post/...-rottmnt-a-psa

*IndigoErth* · 08-07-2020, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaParade

I don't wish any ill-will on anyone who is either working on the show or a fan of it.

But from a selfish, human, perspective, I am more than glad to see this show fail, because it will send the message to Nick and Viacom that this is not the ideal way to handle the franchise. It's about as far away from traditional as you can get, which is not what I want. And hey, if you read my posts around here, you should know I'm pretty open-minded with adaptions, but this is just a bridge too far.

Agree.

It's weird looking back at when many worried, myself included, that some of the choices of that 2014 film could be elements that Nick might decide to try to permanently embed into TMNT forever. (Which potentially can be seen a tiny bit in 'Rise' in some design choices if we're honest.) But then this comes along with some of these ideas and I now realize that at least a movie is a one and done kind of deal and less influential than a show that plays for a couple of years.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zulithe

It's definitely ending. The toys have all dried up. Keep in mind that TMNT is very much a show tied to its toy sales and has been for every series. If there's no merch being put out (and there hasn't for most of the year, and barely any in the back half of 2019 either) then you should see the writing on the wall.

Oh, definitely. Question is, is today the day or are they still going to drag the twitching body of it out to the originally intended end of season 2.

If they actually try to do what '87 and 2003 did late in the series and revamp it, albeit not even for a whole season or more like those shows, I'll be surprised. Yet not too surprised they might try it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 80gmrp

Rather, I saw this on Tumblr. Whether the poster saw this thread or not, it appears the supporters of the show over there are also aware of the poor ratings.

https://rad-squillz.tumblr.com/post/...-rottmnt-a-psa

Yeah, have seen a small minority of "save Rise" stuff online for a while. All I can say to them is good luck. Even a good show like 2012 that still put toys on the shelf for some of the end series arcs (that only this year did I finally find my 2012 holy grail of an affordable Monster Hunter Leo) was not extended any additional seasons.

*Autbot_Benz* · 08-07-2020, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zulithe

It's definitely ending. The toys have all dried up. Keep in mind that TMNT is very much a show tied to its toy sales and has been for every series. If there's no merch being put out (and there hasn't for most of the year, and barely any in the back half of 2019 either) then you should see the writing on the wall.

Check your 99 cent stores one collector the other day showed a picture of his was filled with Rise Stuff. The toyline failed the show failed it was a failure all around.

~~AquaParade~~ · 08-07-2020, 01:07 PM

It is time for Nick and Viacom to bow down to their mid-30's overlords. We are the beating heart of the franchise.

*Leo656* · 08-07-2020, 02:32 PM

I look at it like this: Not everything works for Everything, and context is important.

There are things this show tried to do that I like better in other avenues. But not at all what I'd ever wanted to see done with TMNT as an official product.

It's kinda like how my wife and I both love Robot Chicken and Family Guy... but we hated the Harley Quinn show despite it having a ton in common with those other shows. Same style of humor, same type of jokes, same level of "aim low and be as trashy as possible for shock value", but for whatever reason, I can handle it in shows that are making fun of that material, not from shows that are purporting to be an official part of the franchise. Jokes about Batman f*cking bats are kinda funny in a spoof show, not in an "official" show that just says "Well we're a spoof!" to excuse any and all bad/juvenile writing. And also, officially-licensed "parodies" are terrible by definition. Making fun of yourself isn't funny, it's sad.

Likewise, there's things about Rise that would appeal to me more in a different context. As an official TMNT product, I feel it was a waste of resources and did even more damage to an already-busted brand. After the Nicktoon and the BayTurtles fiasco, "Get Sillier" was NOT even 1% of what I ever wanted to see happen. And I know for a fact that most TMNT fans agree. They're very vocal.

I don't think it's fair to simply accuse people of being afraid of change. Some things just don't work. I heard the same stuff back in '96 when they made Superman into "Electric Man" for a year and a half. Same thing, especially from the DC higher-ups. "Just give it a chance; you just don't like anything being different", etc. etc. And I did give it a chance. I own all the issues, I've read them all multiple times, and I'll give credit where it's due: They did a very good job in TRYING to put the whole thing over as a good idea. They put the work in, tried to explain it and justify it in-story... it just didn't work. They actually put more work into forcing the change, than they did when they caved in to fan pressure and let him just be "regular" Superman again - point of fact, they went to great lengths to explain WHY he had these new powers all of a sudden, but just gave up and didn't even TRY to explain it when it came time to give him his old gimmick back. That was lame, but people were so fed up, I guess they didn't feel like it was worth bothering with an explanation.

That Superman storyline was an interesting experiment, and a chance to "do something new" with a character who's so often been accused of being "stale" or "boring" or whatever... but in the end, it didn't accomplish anything. Well, not anything GOOD; what it DID do, was waste over a year's worth of issues on stuff nobody wanted to see, make the character a punchline in the mainstream media, made DC a laughingstock because of how transparently desperate they were, and sent the books' sales into the gutter for the next 10 years, whereas they'd been doing "steady, but not great" before. I'm sure a few people did like that whole arc, but 20+ years later, even DC commonly admits that it was a mistake, a failure, and never should have been attempted. They've even done in-story bits apologizing for the whole thing, more than once.

Again, some things just do not work. With regard to "Rise", the nicest thing I can say is what I said after watching the first episode: "TMNT by way of Loony Tunes" was not something I ever wanted to see. It bothers me because like Electric Superman, I feel that it's a supreme waste of resources; the longer it goes on, the longer it will be before we get a "real" show that does more than just aim for cheap gags. If there was another show running concurrently and Rise was just "another thing", maybe it would be different. But as the thing that currently carries the TMNT "banner" in the absence of anything else? No. That's just wrong on every level.

I guess it's just disheartening to see a franchise that's had the piss taken out of it so many times, in so many avenues, just plain "give up" and start taking the piss out of itself. "Yeah, we know, it's stupid! That's what makes TMNT great... that it's stupid!" That's how I see people defend it on FB. Is it, though? Is "It's SO stupid" really the thing that makes TMNT so "great"? I never thought that.

Like others said, it's fine if people like it - although I question their values - but selfishly I'll be glad that it's over, if only because that leaves a 1% chance that a "real" TMNT show of quality will come out in the near future.

It won't, because "Nickelodeon", but still. That hypothetical better show can't come out until Rise is over with. So in the meantime all it is, is an obstacle. Given how many people are so vocally against it, it really doesn't make any sense to keep it around longer than necessary, other than to try and save face on how badly they miscalculated. Like with how it's cancelled, but they won't say so out loud. Why would they? Do people commonly trumpet failure, or do they just quietly and sheepishly slink away while people are distracted? The toys have been off shelves since Christmas; it's over.

Tough break for those who do enjoy it, but... well, history will vindicate the "haters", and that's just the way it is. There's no way we WON'T all collectively look back at this in 25 years with the same regretful eyes our parents have for bell bottoms and afro-perms. It is what it is.

I, frankly, can go the rest of my life without any more "Can you BELIEVE they actually did that?" from this franchise. I know... nobody asked.

*IndigoErth* · 08-07-2020, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo656

I, frankly, can go the rest of my life without any more "Can you BELIEVE they actually did that?" from this franchise. I know... nobody asked.

I'd be happy to say it, BUT only if it was actually daring to push the envelop in a way that worked and was awesome.

Scribbling stupid ideas on the envelop and spilling their juice on it and calling it new and brilliant is not the same thing.

*Leo656* · 08-07-2020, 03:17 PM

Well, sure, but when has "Can you BELIEVE...?" ever been applied to THIS franchise in a positive manner?

It's always only ever used for things like "Turtle Tunes" and "Next Mutation". If it was ever said positively, I guess it was for the 1990 movie. I know I, for one, could not believe they did that.

Since then, though? Yeah, only in the negative.

*IndigoErth* · 08-07-2020, 03:46 PM

Hey, even Turtle miracles can happen on occasion.

Rare as they may be.

Has this been posted already and I missed it? If not, there's this..

Quote:

Alelelelelelelelely @alypkmn 7h
Tonight the turtles will rise again one last time! in their full glory ...against their greatest enemy ...the shredder !! #rottmnt #RiseOfTheTMNT

If this person is legit, then his page says he's a rough animator for the show.

08-07-2020, 11:19 AM	#33
80gmrp Foot Soldier Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 236	I swore that I would stay out of this forum due to what happened the last time I posted here. While I’m breaking my promise this time, it’s not to express hate for the series (while I fully agree with AquaParade here, my dislike for the series has toned down significantly since then), or even to express an opinion. Rather, I saw this on Tumblr. Whether the poster saw this thread or not, it appears the supporters of the show over there are also aware of the poor ratings. https://rad-squillz.tumblr.com/post/...-rottmnt-a-psa __________________

08-07-2020, 02:32 PM	#37
Leo656 The Franchise Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,696	I look at it like this: Not everything works for Everything, and context is important. There are things this show tried to do that I like better in other avenues. But not at all what I'd ever wanted to see done with TMNT as an official product. It's kinda like how my wife and I both love Robot Chicken and Family Guy... but we hated the Harley Quinn show despite it having a ton in common with those other shows. Same style of humor, same type of jokes, same level of "aim low and be as trashy as possible for shock value", but for whatever reason, I can handle it in shows that are making fun of that material, not from shows that are purporting to be an official part of the franchise. Jokes about Batman fcking bats are kinda funny in a spoof show, not in an "official" show that just says "Well we're a spoof!" to excuse any and all bad/juvenile writing. And also, officially-licensed "parodies" are terrible by definition. Making fun of yourself isn't funny, it's sad. Likewise, there's things about Rise that would appeal to me more in a different context. As an official TMNT product, I feel it was a waste of resources and did even more damage to an already-busted brand. After the Nicktoon and the BayTurtles fiasco, "Get Sillier" was NOT even 1% of what I ever wanted to see happen. And I know for a fact that most TMNT fans agree. They're very vocal. I don't think it's fair to simply accuse people of being afraid of change. Some things just don't work. I heard the same stuff back in '96 when they made Superman into "Electric Man" for a year and a half. Same thing, especially from the DC higher-ups. "Just give it a chance; you just don't like anything being different", etc. etc. And I did give it a chance. I own all the issues, I've read them all multiple times, and I'll give credit where it's due: They did a very good job in TRYING to put the whole thing over as a good idea. They put the work in, tried to explain it and justify it in-story... it just didn't work. They actually put more work into forcing the change, than they did when they caved in to fan pressure and let him just be "regular" Superman again - point of fact, they went to great lengths to explain WHY he had these new powers all of a sudden, but just gave up and didn't even TRY to explain it when it came time to give him his old gimmick back. That was lame, but people were so fed up, I guess they didn't feel like it was worth bothering with an explanation. That Superman storyline was an interesting experiment, and a chance to "do something new" with a character who's so often been accused of being "stale" or "boring" or whatever... but in the end, it didn't accomplish anything. Well, not anything GOOD; what it DID do, was waste over a year's worth of issues on stuff nobody wanted to see, make the character a punchline in the mainstream media, made DC a laughingstock because of how transparently desperate they were, and sent the books' sales into the gutter for the next 10 years, whereas they'd been doing "steady, but not great" before. I'm sure a few people did like that whole arc, but 20+ years later, even DC commonly admits that it was a mistake, a failure, and never should have been attempted. They've even done in-story bits apologizing for the whole thing, more than once. Again, some things just do not work. With regard to "Rise", the nicest thing I can say is what I said after watching the first episode: "TMNT by way of Loony Tunes" was not something I ever wanted to see. It bothers me because like Electric Superman, I feel that it's a supreme waste of resources; the longer it goes on, the longer it will be before we get a "real" show that does more than just aim for cheap gags. If there was another show running concurrently and Rise was just "another thing", maybe it would be different. But as the thing that currently carries the TMNT "banner" in the absence of anything else? No. That's just wrong on every level. I guess it's just disheartening to see a franchise that's had the piss taken out of it so many times, in so many avenues, just plain "give up" and start taking the piss out of itself. "Yeah, we know, it's stupid! That's what makes TMNT great... that it's stupid!" That's how I see people defend it on FB. Is it, though? Is "It's SO stupid" really the thing that makes TMNT so "great"? I never thought that. Like others said, it's fine if people like it - although I question their values - but selfishly I'll be glad that it's over, if only because that leaves a 1% chance that a "real" TMNT show of quality will come out in the near future. It won't, because "Nickelodeon", but still. That hypothetical* better show can't come out until Rise is over with. So in the meantime all it is, is an obstacle. Given how many people are so vocally against it, it really doesn't make any sense to keep it around longer than necessary, other than to try and save face on how badly they miscalculated. Like with how it's cancelled, but they won't say so out loud. Why would they? Do people commonly trumpet failure, or do they just quietly and sheepishly slink away while people are distracted? The toys have been off shelves since Christmas; it's over. Tough break for those who do enjoy it, but... well, history will vindicate the "haters", and that's just the way it is. There's no way we WON'T all collectively look back at this in 25 years with the same regretful eyes our parents have for bell bottoms and afro-perms. It is what it is. I, frankly, can go the rest of my life without any more "Can you BELIEVE they actually did that?" from this franchise. I know... nobody asked. __________________ "I left some words quite far from here to be a short reminder... I laid them out in stone, in case they need to last forever..." "But hey... I'm not telling you anything that you don't already know." nWo Tech: The Official Thread Poison of the Technodrome Forums https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxr...awnHgDz1ceDcfA https://theroxxshow.blogspot.com/ Last edited by Leo656; 08-07-2020 at 02:37 PM.

08-07-2020, 03:17 PM	#39
Leo656 The Franchise Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,696	Well, sure, but when has "Can you BELIEVE...?" ever been applied to THIS franchise in a positive manner? It's always only ever used for things like "Turtle Tunes" and "Next Mutation". If it was ever said positively, I guess it was for the 1990 movie. I know I, for one, could not believe they did that. Since then, though? Yeah, only in the negative. __________________ "I left some words quite far from here to be a short reminder... I laid them out in stone, in case they need to last forever..." "But hey... I'm not telling you anything that you don't already know." nWo Tech: The Official Thread Poison of the Technodrome Forums https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxr...awnHgDz1ceDcfA https://theroxxshow.blogspot.com/

08-05-2020, 07:05 AM	#22
CyberCubed Overlord Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 41,050	I haven't watched much past the first 10 eps, but there's people who enjoy it. After the show ends I plan to marathon it to give it a fair and proper viewing, but this is the first TMNT cartoon I didn't feel compelled to watch new as it was airing. I dropped it after the first 10ish episodes, the long hiatus didn't help. But as said I will do a proper watch of the show in full after it ends. I don't like to judge shows before seeing them fully.

08-07-2020, 02:09 AM	#30
Zulithe Ninjutsu Master Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: NorCal Posts: 6,006	It's definitely ending. The toys have all dried up. Keep in mind that TMNT is very much a show tied to its toy sales and has been for every series. If there's no merch being put out (and there hasn't for most of the year, and barely any in the back half of 2019 either) then you should see the writing on the wall.

08-07-2020, 10:29 AM	#32
~~AquaParade~~ Banned Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 8,450	I don't wish any ill-will on anyone who is either working on the show or a fan of it. But from a selfish, human, perspective, I am more than glad to see this show fail, because it will send the message to Nick and Viacom that this is not the ideal way to handle the franchise. It's about as far away from traditional as you can get, which is not what I want. And hey, if you read my posts around here, you should know I'm pretty open-minded with adaptions, but this is just a bridge too far.

08-07-2020, 01:07 PM	#36
~~AquaParade~~ Banned Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 8,450	It is time for Nick and Viacom to bow down to their mid-30's overlords. We are the beating heart of the franchise.