Stranger Things (Netflix Original)

[IMJ]

Love the show but I'm having a hard time digging into it. I'm only at episode 2 or 3 at this point - basically Dustin just went and found his punk-D&D buddy in the shed after the death of the preppy chick in his trailer.

I'll get through the season of course, but it's not grabbing me like previous seasons where I power watched those suckers. The bad guy - Vecna is interesting. Reminds me a lot of the monster from "The Keep". Creepy hellish bastard.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by IMJ

Love the show but I'm having a hard time digging into it. I'm only at episode 2 or 3 at this point - basically Dustin just went and found his punk-D&D buddy in the shed after the death of the preppy chick in his trailer.

I'll get through the season of course, but it's not grabbing me like previous seasons where I power watched those suckers. The bad guy - Vecna is interesting. Reminds me a lot of the monster from "The Keep". Creepy hellish bastard.

Everyone seems to agree that episode 4 is where it all "clicks." Smooth sailing from there.

[CyberCubed]

The season was slow to start. Besides that the Russian subplot just drags way too long and feels like it's from some other show. I can't imagine the shows young target audience like teens and early 20 year olds caring about Hopper in a Russian prison in Siberia. He's way out of their age range and they can't relate to him like all the kids on the show.

Will also is a gay homosexual useless crybaby who drags down every scene he is in. If I knew he would turn out like this they should have just left him lost forever in Season 1. His face is so painful to look at too, he always looks like he's 2 seconds away from crying and then that's what happens. I don't mind gay characters but going full homo with them is too much for me to handle.

I liked the climax episodes even though a lot of what they do with Eleven is basically just a mix of Star Wars Force powers and Dragon Ball Z stuff at this point. Hell mostly Jean Gray too, just get her mad or think about her friends dying and she'll save the day.

[NinjaPug]

They should've had Hopper actually be dead at the end of S3 and remove the whole Russia subplot that was nothing but filler this season.

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by NinjaPug

They should've had Hopper actually be dead at the end of S3 and remove the whole Russia subplot that was nothing but filler this season.

Yeah I felt his death at the end of Season 3 was a fine end for the character. The Russian subplot felt like it got way too much screentime this season, and it feels like they just need Winona Ryder's character something to do.

It's also noticeable how Mike doesn't really have much purpose anymore either? He seemed like the main character of the show besides Eleven when it first started, and here he was barely involved in any of the climatic final battle. He felt sidelined the entire season like he serves no real point anymore. The whole Mike/Will/Jonathan trio basically felt irrelevant given they skipped over them in a few episodes.

They should just focus on Nancy, Steve, etc. and that's really all you need now

[Andrew NDB]

Just finished 9.

I'm OK with the Russian subplot as long as it pays off. So far beyond the revelation that the Russians are experimenting on Demigorgons (?)... there isn't much? And what was that thing in the containment unit swirling around? Did they capture the Mind Flayer?

And yeah, the lesbian/gay melodrama could be lost. If this was a show in 2005 or 2015, sure.

[CyberCubed]

Yeah why are they applying 2020 era social norms and tolerance toward gays in a show set in 1986? Were there gays and lesbians in 1986? They certainly wouldn't be open about it and teens/young adults certainly weren't open about it back then.

I was in High School in the early 2000's from 2000-2003, and even as recent as that nobody would ever admit to being gay, and the only lesbians you saw were the ones in the online pornos and not in real life unless two girls were dared to kiss or something.. I know the show is written now but certainly back in the 80's when gay's were made fun of all the time (watch old 80's era movies and see how they treat gay people as jokes back then), and you'll see what it was actually like.

It's honestly revisionist history that girls want to be lesbian in 1986. WTF.

[Andrew NDB]

In the early 90s it was unthinkable anyone in school would "come out," to friends or otherwise. By the mid to late 90s you would start to see a tiny bit of that, at least anecdotally, but almost all of them were getting beat up, killed, or having to transfer schools.

In 1986? Yeah right. Maybe 1 or 2 in San Francisco or something, and they probably kept it to themselves. This is revisionist history.

[joe-eyeball]

This season is quite easily the worst one overall despite being the most ambitious in scope. It was bloated with too many characters and subplots that didn’t really develop all that well. It lacked a fun factor that was found in the previous seasons. And with every episode running over in length it kind of stripped away an episodic television feel to the series. And it just continues the lather, rinse, repeat format the show has followed each season. Overall has this show really taken any big risks with its storylines? Doesn’t seem that way to me.

[Zulithe]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Yeah why are they applying 2020 era social norms and tolerance toward gays in a show set in 1986?

I was in HS in the 90s, and there were many openly gay students. This was in the suburbs, not even a large city. Both of the gay characters in Stranger Things, set a little more than 10 years before my time, are not open about it; Will hides it entirely but his brother senses it. Robin also hides it, and only tells Steve after they had been through a lot of **** together.

I promise you that many gays particularly pre-90s can relate very strongly to Will, who hides his sexuality because he feels nobody will accept him.

While it's easier now (still not super easy, and still hard in certain more conservative areas), being a gay teen when you feel like you have to hide your sexuality, while other gay teens are also hiding theirs for the same reason, feeding into this cycle of feeling alone and without a partner when all your peers are dating the opposite sex with ease, is a strongly relatable experience and the show gets that across well.

It looks like Robin might have come full circle in her arc. The series now needs to give Will some kind of comfort in the next (and last) season, because having him agonize over Mike for all this time is rough to watch and not fair to his character to keep him in that agony. It's also very clear they are setting up Will to be a little more proactive in the plot for Season 5 with how he "senses" Vecna and/or some other upside-down power near the end again.

[CyberCubed]

So then I don't get it, does Will have a crush on Mike? Because it's not really made clear, and obviously he knows Mike/Eleven are a couple and want to get back together. So I don't get why he cried in the car after telling Mike how special he was to El.

His whole character makes no sense. I can't even stand looking at him because his face looks so weird even in other scenes where nothing is happening, like he's constantly about to burst into tears. What a goddamn loser.

[NinjaPug]

What is everyone's understanding of the hierarchy of the Upside Down?

Originally I thought the Mind Flayer was in charge with Vecna being his general as the MF is essentially the hive mind of everything in the UD. In the finale we learn that Vecna stumbles across the MF and forms him into the shape of a spider. Is Vecna in control of the MF?

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

So then I don't get it, does Will have a crush on Mike? Because it's not really made clear, and obviously he knows Mike/Eleven are a couple and want to get back together. So I don't get why he cried in the car after telling Mike how special he was to El.

At this point they've written themselves into a corner. They have to make Will gay for Mike or they will incur the wrath of the SJW mafia. Even if that wasn't the original plan though I suspect it was.

I have to admit, as these actors age and TPTB are witnessing it (obviously)... maybe some plans have changed? Mike standing next to Eleven doesn't look as great as it did 3 seasons ago, and I'm talking about how the Mike actor looks now. He's a fairly awkward looking dude.

They might just actually make Mike gay for Will, at this point. And that's a big happy point to land at in season 5.

"I love you Eleven, but I am in love with Will." And Uma Thurman's kid seals the deal with some other chick to boot. Because that is introduced here as a "shucks, she can't make it happen as a high school lesbian in 1986" No. Clearly there's a payoff coming.

[CyberCubed]

It does seem like they're pushing Eleven away from Mike, sort of realizing as they've grown up and they're grown apart a bit and are better off as friends. I don't think Mike will be gay though, because it doesn't seem likely. If Will is gay they'll probably introduce some new character for him, just like Robin suddenly got some random lesbian girl introduced out of nowhere instead of making say Nancy into a lesbo.

Besides that my other least favorite character is probably Erica, if only because she has the trope of being the "always in the right" black girl persona. They left her out of this season a lot compared to Season 3 but she's kinda annoying IMO. The less we see of her the better.

To be honest I'd watch a whole spinoff of Nancy, Steve and Robin. At this point I enjoy them more than the young kid protagonists. Give them guns/swords/weapons like we saw in the finale and they can turn them into the next gen of Buffy the Vampire Slayer or something.

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

It does seem like they're pushing Eleven away from Mike, sort of realizing as they've grown up and they're grown apart a bit and are better off as friends. I don't think Mike will be gay though, because it doesn't seem likely. If Will is gay they'll probably introduce some new character for him, just like Robin suddenly got some random lesbian girl introduced out of nowhere instead of making say Nancy into a lesbo.

Besides that my other least favorite character is probably Erica, if only because she has the trope of being the "always in the right" black girl persona. They left her out of this season a lot compared to Season 3 but she's kinda annoying IMO. The less we see of her the better.

To be honest I'd watch a whole spinoff of Nancy, Steve and Robin. At this point I enjoy them more than the young kid protagonists. Give them guns/swords/weapons like we saw in the finale and they can turn them into the next gen of Buffy the Vampire Slayer or something.

What? You don't like Dustin? He's like the best character in the show. In fact, I would say Steve really grew as a character thanks to Dustin.

[CyberCubed]

I like Dustin, I didn't mention him there. I think Mike and Jonathan have gotten really boring, Will has always sucked, and Lucas is just there for me, and his sister is annoying.

I like Max a lot and Nancy and Steve, Robin is cool too. I feel most of the other characters don't have much to do anymore and it shows.

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

I like Dustin, I didn't mention him there. I think Mike and Jonathan have gotten really boring, Will has always sucked, and Lucas is just there for me, and his sister is annoying.

I like Max a lot and Nancy and Steve, Robin is cool too. I feel most of the other characters don't have much to do anymore and it shows.

Agree. Heck, I would like to swap out all the Beyers and replace them with Suzies family since they seemed to be more entertaining.

I wonder if Steve and Nancy are a wink to the Ninja Turtles, along with Argyle. Seen people mention that Argyle reminds them of Michelangelo (he's a surfer dude who is laid back and likes pizza), then you got Nancy that wants to be a reporter and you got Steve with the bat with nails. All he needs is a hockey mask.......

[Andrew NDB]

Saw the finale now. It was more "Empire Strikes Back" and "Inception" than the big triumphant good vs. evil battle it seemed like was being setup. The good guys pretty much failed on all of their goals. Vecna still opened up his super gate and survived, killing a ton of people. About the only victory of any kind was undoing Max's death. I do like that the good guys brought guns to battle Vecna. It's so stupid in things like It Chapter 2 where nobody thinks to bring even so much as a handgun.

Didn't like how casually Jason was disposed of. It seemed so expected that he'd just be fodder in the end, which is exactly what he was. I was thinking they'd give him an arc over this season and the next and kind of "Redeem" him. Eddie, too. Creating him just to kill him off in the same season, meh.

Also, the more I think about it the more it seems that nobody really had any growth this season except maybe Max (she got her closure). Eleven got her powers back, sure, but what about everybody else? There is the tease of Steve and Nancy getting back together and Jonathan and Nancy's relationship being on the rocks... by the end of the season, we're right back where we started with that. We began this season with Eleven giving Mike the silent treatment and that's exactly how we end. Will is a closeted homosexual at the beginning pining over Mike and that's how we end. Uma Thurman's kid, the same thing, except maybe that band check is like-minded after all (or maybe not?). Eddie had a great arc but he's killed off.

And I bet Max wakes up with some kind of superpowers. Or maybe she's blind, but she can see what Vecna sees or something.

Also, I'm not sure it's clear how the Upside Down itself -- specifically, with the version of Hawkins that's like a snapshot of Hawkins in 1983 -- was created. Vecna arrives in that dimension and sees Demigorgons around, makes the Mind Flayer... but then what? How do all the Hawkins buildings and such populate there? And what was Vecna doing between 1983 and 1986? Specifically between seasons 1 and 2, 2 and 3, and 3 and 4? That seems like a lot of hanging out by himself in the Upside Down doing a whole lot of nothing.

Originally Posted by NinjaPug

Originally I thought the Mind Flayer was in charge with Vecna being his general as the MF is essentially the hive mind of everything in the UD. In the finale we learn that Vecna stumbles across the MF and forms him into the shape of a spider. Is Vecna in control of the MF?

That was interesting. Clearly he finds the "dark energy" nexus (the same swirly stuff the Russians were containing in that little cell) and takes it and creates/controls the Mind Flayer. From the way Will was talking it seems like it's an extension of Vecna.

*edit: On a second glance, it looks like Jason might be OK in the Upside Down. At first it looked like it just ripped him in half and left him like that but on closer inspection it looks like he is wholly being absorbed into it.

[IndigoErth]

Little predictable that Eddie was going to end up being the one who dies, but relatively decent season overall. Glad Hopper did get back home in the end of it, been waiting for that scene for so long.

But nothing came of Steve's nasty encounter with those bat things last month? Aw come on. lol

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

So then I don't get it, does Will have a crush on Mike? Because it's not really made clear, and obviously he knows Mike/Eleven are a couple and want to get back together. So I don't get why he cried in the car after telling Mike how special he was to El.

To me that scene, when he turned away to the window teary eyed, read as Will in fact being in love with his friend but accepting that he has to let him go.

Furthered my belief that that is the case when he was stirring up the salt water with his brother who clearly knows and talked to him, but wasn't going to directly bring it up himself.

I didn't quite buy the speculation after the prior eps, but yeah... I feel those scenes kind made it clear in a quiet, indirect way.

Similar story with Robin probably having to accept that the girl from band may not be available to her romantically either, but hopefully she's still found a new good friend who gets her and her zany personality.

[CyberCubed]

Will is a homo