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Old 05-09-2020, 02:45 AM   #61
DarkFell
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I doubt that the series even took itself seriously, and I reckon that held some appeal for a few folks in this forum.
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If it didn't take itself seriously at all why would people bother watching it?
..For the funzies? There are people that will watch the 60's Batman series for the campy fun of it. Heck, I even watch MST3K and that show doesn't take itself seriously either.
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Old 05-09-2020, 07:11 AM   #62
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Yeah, that was a very weak argument. Reminded me of a movie I saw a long time ago, I don't remember the plot because I was skipping around, but this one scene always stuck out in my memory. There's a spot where kind of a simple guy was debating with an intellectual type, and a pro wrestling match comes on the TV, and they start arguing about whether it's stupid or not, then whether it's fake or not, and the simpler guy goes, "Well if it was so stupid and fake then why would millions of people watch it?"

And it's like... people watch wrestling because it's silly and "fake". That's like 75% of its appeal to most people. Same goes for the FW TMNT cartoon. People like it for exactly what it unapologetically is. I mean look at how fast things went south when the show DID try and become "serious" near the end of its run, and it becomes very apparent that just like with wrestling, the inherent "goofiness" of the TMNT cartoon was a huge reason why anyone even cared about it. It gave the audience that loved that kind of aesthetic exactly what they wanted.

And that's fine, it is what it is and it only rarely tried to be anything else, and when it did try to be anything else it didn't entirely work (although whether the "blame" for that lies on the audience or the showrunners is an entirely separate conversation worth having). It's not really to my taste anymore but it succeeded very well at what it tried to do, which was be a comedic and satirical type show with action elements interspersed throughout. I don't know how anyone could ever say it was all that "serious", when outside of the first five episodes and then the last two seasons, it went out of its way to be farcical many times and succeeded very well in that.

Like yes, it had "action" as a way to create conflicts and move the plot forward, and its own set of internal logic and everything, and that's fine. But in some episodes almost every scene is full of gags or at least puns. That's why I would call it a "comedic action show", not an action show with comedy in it. I think it's just simply too often weighted towards the comedic elements for anyone to dismiss or diminish them, or to say that it wasn't "predominantly" a comedic show. It was, predominantly, a comedic show. And that's fine.
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Old 05-09-2020, 09:58 AM   #63
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What Leo656 said. The show also didn’t really have continuity as such, as the writers had no problem ignoring or changing its history whenever they saw fit. One of the reasons I still kinda like the FW toon and Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog is because they’re campy fun shows.
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Old 05-10-2020, 05:41 AM   #64
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Like I said, it was a show that hardly took itself seriously. The plots were silly, they were made that way on purpose, and there are still some folks that will watch the OT for the fun of it.

For those of us that the OT no longer do justice for, there are other forms of TMNT media. To each their own.

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Old 05-10-2020, 09:50 AM   #65
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To be fair, that video does not encapsulate all that is wrong with that particular movie, I sort of get why you don't get what's wrong with it. It's honestly hard to explain the problems without sounding like a raving madman. It's called Batman Unlimited: Monster Mayhem, in case you're interested.
I get you. If you used a clip of Batman surfing from the 60's series or used a clip from a Scooby-Doo crossover it would make more sense I guess.

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Heck, I even watch MST3K and that show doesn't take itself seriously either.
But...that's a comedy...

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It was, predominantly, a comedic show. And that's fine.
We'll have to agree to strongly disagree on that one. The same rule could be applied to other animated shows at the time. I always consider them action adventure with comedy. I'm not watching to expect comedic plots even though the show had some like most cartoons back then.
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Old 05-10-2020, 09:58 AM   #66
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If I ever get around to actually watching the entire series again, I'll have to do so with a clipboard in hand. I absolutely will mark down every single pun, joke, play-on-words, satirical reference and instance of slapstick, then calculate the mean average of jokes per 23-minute episode, just to settle this once and for all.

Don't underestimate my commitment to pointless and thankless tasks in the interest of saying "I Told You So."

I also procrastinate as a rule, so don't expect it anytime soon. But it's coming! With any luck it'll be out before that Obi-Wan show that's never happening.

EDIT: Wait, nevermind, why should I do it when Cubed can do it? Yeah, f*ck it, let him do it. I got sh*t to do. Like lots and lots of nothing at all. And that requires a lot of my attention.
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Old 05-10-2020, 11:31 AM   #67
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If I ever get around to actually watching the entire series again, I'll have to do so with a clipboard in hand. I absolutely will mark down every single pun, joke, play-on-words, satirical reference and instance of slapstick, then calculate the mean average of jokes per 23-minute episode, just to settle this once and for all.

Don't underestimate my commitment to pointless and thankless tasks in the interest of saying "I Told You So."
I think you could do a similar thing with the Richard Lester cut of Superman 2 and find out all sorts of campy stuff like the cellophane S, the slapstick, bumbling Clark, crazy and non sensical powers etc.

That doesn't negate the threat level and stakes of the movie though, and I would argue that the same goes for the FW tmnt cartoon.

Something can have jokes scattered all around it yet be taken seriously at the same time, and that in my opinion is one of the beautiful things about the FW tmnt cartoon (and the entire tmnt multiverse to an extent) which got many people hooked in the first place.

A question for you and anybody else who doesn't take the FW cartoon seriously, do you watch the FW cartoon in the same mood and sensibility with which you would watch something like Looney Tunes and Tom and Jerry? (No hate on either of those franchises, I love them both, but have a different way of approaching them unlike tmnt).

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Old 05-10-2020, 12:49 PM   #68
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I think you could do a similar thing with the Richard Lester cut of Superman 2 and find out all sorts of campy stuff like the cellophane S, the slapstick, bumbling Clark, crazy and non sensical powers etc.

That doesn't negate the threat level and stakes of the movie though, and I would argue that the same goes for the FW tmnt cartoon.

Something can have jokes scattered all around it yet be taken seriously at the same time, and that in my opinion is one of the beautiful things about the FW tmnt cartoon (and the entire tmnt multiverse to an extent) which got many people hooked in the first place.

A question for you and anybody else who doesn't take the FW cartoon seriously, do you watch the FW cartoon in the same mood and sensibility with which you would watch something like Looney Tunes and Tom and Jerry? (No hate on either of those franchises, I love them both, but have a different way of approaching them unlike tmnt).
Sorry bruh, but there ain't enough weed in the house to get me to sit through the Lester Cut of Superman II. I grew up loving it, but around age 13 I realized that holy sh*t, remove Terrance Stamp chewing the scenery and you're left with an absolutely terrible movie. F*ck that pink f*cking bear.

I do LOVE Terrence Stamp, though, which is pretty much the only reason I'd ever watch either cut of II again. It's not even my favorite role of his. John Tunstall 4 Life!

And I'd argue that to some degree it DOES lessen the stakes, because for my money, after the previous hour and a half of "shenanigans", I no longer care WHAT these people do, I just want the movie to end because you've already succeeded in convincing me that it's a farce. If the people making it think it's stupid, and are so hellbent on convincing me of it, then I'm not gonna argue with them. Although the Donner Cut succeeds slightly better at making me care. It's still badly-written dreck and completely, fundamentally misunderstands the characters and their motivations, and has about as much in common with the comic books as my ass does, but hey, it is what it is. I know I'm never gonna convince anyone who loves it that it's a bad movie. But it is. "Charming, but lousy" is how I'd sum it up if I had to put it in one sentence. So... yeah, not a great example to use on me, Chief.

Like when that kid says after the fight scene, "Awwwww, man... Superman din't even do nuffin'!" And I'm like "Wow, this kid's IN the movie and he's also seeing the same things I see. He just summed up the ENTIRE movie!" "Shoot comments that aren't supposed to be Shoot Comments" for the win.

- Before anyone asks, there's a very high probability that I've seen it more in a lifetime than anyone who's gonna try and change my mind. I absolutely LOVED the film and recorded it off TV at least a dozen times... until I reached the age of reason. Now it's strictly Nostalgia Viewing and not a very enjoyable experience. Mileage will vary, but objectivity helps. So don't @ me!
-----------------------------------

Jokes and snark aside, and directly to your question... nah, I can't really say it's like that, either. The FW TMNT show definitely isn't in the same vein as Tom N Jerry or Looney Tunes, and I wouldn't be in that mindset to actually sit and watch an episode. Just because it's comedic doesn't make it full-blown farcical, although a few moments certainly were. For me, I just sort of drifted away from that show a long time ago, partly from seeing all the episodes to the point of boredom, and also because my sense of humor changed significantly over time.

I honestly don't re-watch the FW show often, but not specifically because I don't like it, or don't see any value in it. I mean I went to the trouble of hunting down each of the DVD sets as they were released, at great cost and hassle, so if I wasn't a fan that'd be dumb. And I guess it's dumb that after all that they mostly sit on the shelf.

The mindset I generally have to be to watch the FW show, would generally be, "I wanna remember what it felt like to be 8, for an hour or two." And it's a feeling I'm fine with revisiting but it's not a place I'd choose to live in.

Hope that's a satisfactory answer. I'm having a hard time putting my thoughts into words at the moment.
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Old 05-10-2020, 05:04 PM   #69
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I doubt that the series even took itself seriously, and I reckon that held some appeal for a few folks in this forum.
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Originally Posted by pferreira View Post
If it didn't take itself seriously at all why would people bother watching it?
..For the funzies? There are people that will watch the 60's Batman series for the campy fun of it. Heck, I even watch MST3K and that show doesn't take itself seriously either.[/quote]
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But MST3K...that's a comedy.
Okay.. plan for Plan B.

Who's with me?
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Old 05-10-2020, 05:09 PM   #70
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Why not? It's early yet, I can squeeze in another 87 trips to the pisser tonight.

Mostly a Guinness guy but anyone who says no to a Pabst just doesn't understand this whole "drinking beer" thing to start with.
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Old 05-10-2020, 05:14 PM   #71
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The images that I pulled up for Guinness are just too holy for this forum. It was either taint them or pull up some Corona.

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Old 05-10-2020, 05:16 PM   #72
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Most'a these kids couldn't handle Guinness anyways. You seen 'em in the other thread; "Er, I don't know, sir, my Mommy taught me never to even sip of the Devil's Nectar, that's only for ne'er-do-wells" and all'a that stuff.

Most of 'em would probably fall over and pass out from half a Mike's Hard. NANCIES!
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Old 05-10-2020, 05:42 PM   #73
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Mike's Lemonade is within the same category as Smirnoff and Angry Orchard, isn't it? As in, all wine coolers?
They're good for a sugar high and a mini-buzz. 'Bout it.
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Old 05-10-2020, 06:32 PM   #74
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Ahhhhh, my first drunken experience was off a 6-pack of wine coolers and a couple'a beers.

It was New Years Eve. I was 7 or 8 or so. Good times!
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