With OotS a failure, what's next for TMNT films?

[ZariusTwo]

Perhaps if Turtles Forever had done a better job with the FW Turtles rather than paint them as annoyingly cooky losers, there'd be a bit more demand from the baby boomers who caught that and tuned in for the next incarnation.

Trans-Dimensional Turtles came too little, too late in correcting TF's mistakes.

[Editor's Note Comics]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

Perhaps if Turtles Forever had done a better job with the FW Turtles rather than paint them as annoyingly cooky losers, there'd be a bit more demand from the baby boomers who caught that and tuned in for the next incarnation.

Trans-Dimensional Turtles came too little, too late in correcting TF's mistakes.

So you think a part poor box office results comes from a series finale that aired 7 years ago, on a show that can't manage to get a proper DVD release, because of the way it handled characters from 1987, and that baby boomers (people age 52-70 now, ages 23 - 41 when the '87 series aired, 45 and 63 when Turtles Forever came out) aren't coming out for the movie because they didn't like that finale? That's more than a little bit of a stretch.

[Casey]

Originally Posted by Editor's Note Comics

So you think a part poor box office results comes from a series finale that aired 7 years ago, on a show that can't manage to get a proper DVD release, because of the way it handled characters from 1987, and that baby boomers (people age 52-70 now, ages 23 - 41 when the '87 series aired, 45 and 63 when Turtles Forever came out) aren't coming out for the movie because they didn't like that finale? That's more than a little bit of a stretch.

I for real laughed out loud at both the comment that sparked this reply as well as the reply itself.

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by TMNTChris1980

Sorry, but I have to disagree. The nostalgia for the OT is just about dead. This has been proven by the OT characters being in the Nick episode, and the ratings being abysmal. I think 4 to 5 years ago, people wanted to see an OT TMNT movie, and they didn't get it. If you saw the 2014 TMNT movie looking to see your favorite characters from the 80's/90's you were severely let down. The producers of OotS tried to make good, by making a movie geared towards the OT. It was too late, and they already lost people with their first attempt.

You're joking, right? Ratings for the crossover in the Nick show were about the same as all the other Season 4 episodes. That's how it is now. Nick also aired that episode online a few days early on their website before it came out on TV, so many likely watched the streamed version.

Also do you seriously think OT characters will ever fade away completely? IDW is using Krang, Bebop and Rocksteady and they've basically cemented them as major parts of the TMNT mythos along with the Mirage characters. There's no escaping this now.

Krang's also been retconned as an Utrom in both the IDW comic and Nick cartoon. I'm willing to bet most future versions of TMNT now have Krang as the leader of the Utroms or something similar to IDW where he was the prince.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

Perhaps if Turtles Forever had done a better job with the FW Turtles rather than paint them as annoyingly cooky losers, there'd be a bit more demand from the baby boomers who caught that and tuned in for the next incarnation.

Trans-Dimensional Turtles came too little, too late in correcting TF's mistakes.

Uh, no. The show has been off the air for 20 years and has (as far as I understand) not been given a lot of reruns, that's the reason people younger than 30 typically don't care about it. That and it is a pretty underwhelming show, so anyone who intentionally seeks it out may not have very high chances of liking it.

Trying to blame this on Turtles Forever is just bizarre.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by Editor's Note Comics

So you think a part poor box office results comes from a series finale that aired 7 years ago, on a show that can't manage to get a proper DVD release, because of the way it handled characters from 1987, and that baby boomers (people age 52-70 now, ages 23 - 41 when the '87 series aired, 45 and 63 when Turtles Forever came out) aren't coming out for the movie because they didn't like that finale? That's more than a little bit of a stretch.

The lengths to which FW fanboys will go know no bounds.

[Commenter 42]

I'm still scratching my head. There won't be a ****ing part 3. They lost millions of dollars.

Wake the **** up!!!!


Wait, Sam and I voted the same way? We agree? Did Hell actually just freeze over?

[ToTheNines]

Originally Posted by neatoman

Uh, no. The show has been off the air for 20 years and has (as far as I understand) not been given a lot of reruns, that's the reason people younger than 30 typically don't care about it. That and it is a pretty underwhelming show, so anyone who intentionally seeks it out may not have very high chances of liking it.

Trying to blame this on Turtles Forever is just bizarre.

I have to believe he doesn't mean actual baby boomers, but those individuals who were children for the 4kids run and are about 21 now.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by ToTheNines

I have to believe he doesn't mean actual baby boomers, but those individuals who were children for the 4kids run and are about 21 now.

So did I, why he didn't just call them millennials is weird. When we think about the person we're talking about here though... Let's just say he seems rather odd for someone who was old enough to join a forum 13 years ago.

He's at least 18 (probably much older) and believes a TV special is responsible for this movie's financial failure. That and the additional belief that an episode of a cartoon with declining viewership was "too late to correct mistakes", just adds to the weirdness.

[ZariusTwo]

Ah from the "genius" behind "this movie is for people with brain tumors" comes "this guy's a weirdo now", you never cease to amaze me with your pettiness kiddo.

I have to believe he doesn't mean actual baby boomers, but those individuals who were children for the 4kids run and are about 21 no

Correct. Probably should have said millennials, but I was sort of half-tired.

Originally Posted by neatoman

it is a pretty underwhelming show

In your (worthless) opinion.

Originally Posted by neatoman

So did I, why he didn't just call them millennials is weird. When we think about the person we're talking about here though... Let's just say he seems rather odd for someone who was old enough to join a forum 13 years ago.

He's at least 18 (probably much older)

I'm 33

Call me "weird and "odd" all you want punk, as an Aspie I've dealt with worse labels from even thicker-headed bullies, I've got my theories and I'm sticking to them.

Originally Posted by Casey

I for real laughed out loud at both the comment that sparked this reply as well as the reply itself.

This has all been fairly intriguing...offer an alternative opinion/idea, get laughed at and labelled, made to feel like an outcast (amongst fellow unwashed flimsy outcasts), it's more telling of the sort of people who find more fun in negativity than a fun time at the cinema.

This is the kind of s*it that drove Leo away, well guess what? No getting rid of me. Do your worst.

[vicsavage]

Perhaps we can give the general public a bit more credit and determine that just because they see vaguely familiar elements from a cartoon they watched decades ago it doesn't mean they'll necessarily spend money to see it, especially since the Turtles themselves look like Hulkish monsters.

I mean, my reaction to Krang et al was "whatever". Yeah, I'd be a lot more excited if this happened in 1995...

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by Panda_Kahn_fan

base it off the nick version.

Dear god no. That thing barely has an identity of it's own anymore, it's a hodgepodge mix of various eras and it's done badly.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

Ah from the "genius" behind "this movie is for people with brain tumors" comes "this guy's a weirdo now", you never cease to amaze me with your pettiness kiddo.



Correct. Probably should have said millennials, but I was sort of half-tired.



In your (worthless) opinion.



I'm 33

Call me "weird and "odd" all you want punk, as an Aspie I've dealt with worse labels from even thicker-headed bullies, I've got my theories and I'm sticking to them.



This has all been fairly intriguing...offer an alternative opinion/idea, get laughed at and labelled, made to feel like an outcast (amongst fellow unwashed flimsy outcasts), it's more telling of the sort of people who find more fun in negativity than a fun time at the cinema.

This is the kind of s*it that drove Leo away, well guess what? No getting rid of me. Do your worst.

So you just admitted to being autistic, that certainly explains why you get so easily offended over jokes and why you try to discredit me over meaningless things.

Whatever, now that I know you actually suffer from aspergers I'm not going to continue responding to you from now on, it would be pointless and sad. I wish you had admitted this from the start, now I just feel bad about calling you weird.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Originally Posted by neatoman

now I just feel bad about calling you weird.

So you only feel bad about calling people names only if they have some sort of disability?

[ToTheNines]

I don't think Turtles Forever is to blame for the poor box office haul, but that it interesting to think about Zarius.

I didn't have a problem with the FW portrayal in Forever (they did get alot wrong obviously), but the 4kids attitude that they were the "lame version" of the turtles probably left an impression on a lot of people. Don't forget TF aired a couple of times on Nickelodeon in 2011/2012.

While IDW has done some cool things with FW characters, conversely the Nick show utilizes many of those characters only to completely overhaul them. And even though Trans Turtles had the guys more in character, the Nick boys were totally disrespectful towards them...

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by TheSkeletonMan939

So you only feel bad about calling people names only if they have some sort of disability?

I feel bad when I'm given reason to regret it. I wasn't picking on him, he kept insulting me for joking about how bad this movie is. He was constantly mischaracterizing me, calling me childish and mean when all I did was mock the quality of a movie. So when I wrote those sarcastic replies I didn't feel bad because he was the one who attacked me.

But then I learned he was autist. Responding to him with sarcasm really would be mean now.

His obsession with attacking me for joking about brain damage and childishness (both of which were jokes about the movie iself and not it's fans, even though he didn't understand that) makes sense now, he has a disorder that prevents him from developing properly, he likely meets people who patronise him for it on a regular basis. Of course he would react so strongly to such jokes.

[Bry]

...I mean, it's pretty safe to say that "Turtles Forever" had no impact on this movie's viewership whatsoever. Most of the casual audience (meaning the general audience with vague memories of the Fred Wolf show who aren't "hardcore fans") this movie was aiming its marketing at likely haven't seen that TV movie, if they're even aware of it at all. And even if they have, it's highly unlikely they'd be upset about it at this point. That's hardcore fan territory, and most of those people are here right now.

The only thing that likely had an impact here was the mixed-at-best reaction to the 2014 movie, or Fred Wolf nostalgia just not being as strong or widespread as the producers assumed. Either way, the movie failed to reach a wider audience based on its own merits (or lack thereof).

It's also worth noting that every version of the TMNT since Fred Wolf has made efforts to deepen the story and the characters to some extent. Krang and Bebop and Rocksteady have been used multiple times since, and each time they've been given character overhauls that this movie just didn't use or acknowledge. Honestly, after two cartoon series that leaned a lot harder on serialized storylines, often directly inspired by the original comics (or a hybrid with the comics as a major influence), Fred Wolf is kind of the anomaly at this point. For example, everyone knows Raph as the "angry one" even though that's absolutely not who he was in the Fred Wolf show. People know Shredder as Oroku Saki, who has a personal vendetta against Hamato Yoshi, even though that only rarely mattered in the Fred Wolf show. Krang has been worked into the story as an "evil Utrom" or a more "serious" villain more than once, and I think that's kind of seeped into the public consciousness a little bit. All that, and I think people expect more of an actual story, with at least some element of seriousness, because for the most part that's what we've seen (or seen attempted, at least) for the past 20 years of this property.

Playing exclusively to Fred Wolf nostalgia was a mistake. In writing, in production, and in marketing.

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by ToTheNines

While IDW has done some cool things with FW characters, conversely the Nick show utilizes many of those characters only to completely overhaul them. And even though Trans Turtles had the guys more in character, the Nick boys were totally disrespectful towards them...

Yeah, there's that too. If you hammer home to the audience enough times that older elements are better after a period of "readjustment" or to have an attitude towards the older model, they're going to go into something championing the older elements with that precise attitude.

[Sabacooza]

Originally Posted by Bry

It's also worth noting that every version of the TMNT since Fred Wolf has made efforts to deepen the story and the characters to some extent. Krang and Bebop and Rocksteady have been used multiple times since, and each time they've been given character overhauls that this movie just didn't use or acknowledge. Honestly, after two cartoon series that leaned a lot harder on serialized storylines, often directly inspired by the original comics (or a hybrid with the comics as a major influence), Fred Wolf is kind of the anomaly at this point. For example, everyone knows Raph as the "angry one" even though that's absolutely not who he was in the Fred Wolf show. People know Shredder as Oroku Saki, who has a personal vendetta against Hamato Yoshi, even though that only rarely mattered in the Fred Wolf show. Krang has been worked into the story as an "evil Utrom" or a more "serious" villain more than once, and I think that's kind of seeped into the public consciousness a little bit. All that, and I think people expect more of an actual story, with at least some element of seriousness, because for the most part that's what we've seen (or seen attempted, at least) for the past 20 years of this property.

Playing exclusively to Fred Wolf nostalgia was a mistake. In writing, in production, and in marketing.

I hate to say it but I liked the tone of the first Bay movie better. Yes, it was a bad movie but it had a sense of seriousness to it. This new movie was just way too cartoonish. I don't understand why it had to be a complete carbon copy of the Fred Wolf show when they clearly could've kept the serious tone of the first but yet add Bebop, Rocksteady and Krang. Do a more mature take on them. I mean IDW has no problem with this but then again, the writers and producers of these movies don't give a flying **** about the property nor do they respect or truly understand it.

[Vicky82]

I prefer a reboot don't care what version. I just don't want Bay and his crew involved.

I like to see it happen in the next few years not after I've kicked the bucket.

I like to keep the turtle actors and Bebop and Rocksteady actors, the others can go.