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Old 01-14-2020, 03:08 PM   #181
CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy
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The interviews are so strange for the past year or so. "We want to get back to to get back to the optimism that Roddenberry expressed" and then in the same breath, "Maybe the Federation and Starfleet is not what we thought, and super corrupt!" What?
The thing is, Deep Space Nine and Enterprise were able to delve into some dark corners (Section 31, Starfleet corruption, assassinations, human prejudice against Vulcans, Vulcan prejudice against Andorians, etc) and still remain true to Trek.

I don't get the same sense from this. EVERYBODY WHO STAYED IN STARFLEET IS CORRUPT. That's why Riker, Troi, Picard, etc are out of uniform.

If this doesn't turn out to be the case, I'll be shocked. Happy, but shocked.
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Old 01-14-2020, 03:31 PM   #182
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Spoiler-free review of episodes one to three

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There are hints at potential retcons and status-quo changes that might be problematic, but we’ll have to wait and see…
http://www.letswatchstartrek.com/202...e-no-spoilers/
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Old 01-14-2020, 04:03 PM   #183
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Spoiler-free review of episodes one to three



http://www.letswatchstartrek.com/202...e-no-spoilers/
I wonder what he's referring to...

The review seems promising.
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Old 01-14-2020, 04:03 PM   #184
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Spoiler-free review of episodes one to three



http://www.letswatchstartrek.com/202...e-no-spoilers/
That actually sets my mind at ease a little bit.
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Old 01-14-2020, 04:54 PM   #185
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Old 01-14-2020, 04:56 PM   #186
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I imagine the original Data is still alive will be a retcon? Or have his memory transfered to the new body.
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Old 01-14-2020, 05:05 PM   #187
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I imagine the original Data is still alive will be a retcon?
If I had to speculate at what we now know...



Rogue "synths" show up and devastate Mars a decade or so STP as seen in the "Children of Mars" Short Trek. Whether they were a Starfleet experiment gone wrong or if they just appeared isn't clear, though "rogue" kind of suggests they went turncoat. But I bet they're these guys:



Which means they're actually bastardized Soongh-type androids.

So after this happens, Starfleet freaks out about androids. In kind of a statement about internment camps and that kind of stuff, Starfleet orders that all androids serving in Starfleet be dismantled... including B4, who may or may not have manifested Data.

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Or have his memory transfered to the new body.
He already did that in "Nemesis." We know it because he told us he did it.
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Old 01-15-2020, 09:36 AM   #188
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A few spoilers from the TrekBBs board

Spoiler:
The Synths were created by Maddox, the starfleet scientist who wanted to acquire Data so he could dissect him in the episode "Measure of a Man", where there was a legal case put together to defend Data's rights as a living being

Picard had been the one to arrange the mass evacuation of Romulus, but the assembled fleet was destroyed by the Synths and Starfleet called off the evacuation. Picard resigned in protest.
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Old 01-15-2020, 10:27 AM   #189
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Originally Posted by ZariusTwo View Post
A few spoilers from the TrekBBs board

Spoiler:
The Synths were created by Maddox, the starfleet scientist who wanted to acquire Data so he could dissect him in the episode "Measure of a Man", where there was a legal case put together to defend Data's rights as a living being

Picard had been the one to arrange the mass evacuation of Romulus, but the assembled fleet was destroyed by the Synths and Starfleet called off the evacuation. Picard resigned in protest.
Daaaaaaaaaaamn. Interesting.
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Old 01-15-2020, 10:47 AM   #190
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A little more specific:

Spoiler:


Spoiler:
So pretty much what I thought with the androids. Still begs the question, "What made them attack?" I'm still thinking Lore.
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Old 01-15-2020, 12:52 PM   #191
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A little more specific:



Spoiler:
So pretty much what I thought with the androids. Still begs the question, "What made them attack?" I'm still thinking Lore.
Indeed? What makes them go rogue like that?
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Old 01-15-2020, 01:01 PM   #192
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Indeed? What makes them go rogue like that?
It all comes back to Lore, I think. He's wanted his army since "Descent," and the synths being based on Soongh tech already gives him an in. Just begs the question of how did he get reassembled and such. Maybe Maddox had to reassemble him to better study the tech... or maybe in monkeying with Lore's positronic brain, somehow his consciousness is spread out amongst all of the synths, like a mini collective.

Or I'm way off and it's as simple as, "There's RACISTS in high levels of Starfleet that hate Romulans, so nasty Admirals programmed the synths to attack Mars and stop their rescue!"
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Old 01-15-2020, 01:28 PM   #193
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It all comes back to Lore, I think. He's wanted his army since "Descent," and the synths being based on Soongh tech already gives him an in. Just begs the question of how did he get reassembled and such. Maybe Maddox had to reassemble him to better study the tech... or maybe in monkeying with Lore's positronic brain, somehow his consciousness is spread out amongst all of the synths, like a mini collective.

Or I'm way off and it's as simple as, "There's RACISTS in high levels of Starfleet that hate Romulans, so nasty Admirals programmed the synths to attack Mars and stop their rescue!"
I think I'd actually like the latter, rather than Maddox. As long as it's a few corrupt Starfleet brass (like Cartwright in ST VI: Undiscovered Country), and not a systematic corruption. But bringing Lore back could work.
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Old 01-22-2020, 11:52 AM   #194
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Stewart invites Whoopi to season 2.

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Old 01-22-2020, 12:04 PM   #195
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Stewart invites Whoopi to season 2.

I would love to see this. Guinan's relationship with Picard was never definitively explained outside of the awkward explanation that their 1st meeting was during the time traveling snake-staff fiasco. You were always left with the expectation that there was a lot more context than that. If that's all there was, there was no deeper years of experiences - there was a meeting during time travel.

Guinan was also always a great character.
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Old 01-22-2020, 12:06 PM   #196
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Guinan was also always a great character.
And is it just me, or does it feel like Guinan as a character was a great big setup for... I don't know, something that never happened or we never got to see? Some mystery they probably intended to unravel but never really did? We finally got to see another member of her race in "Generations" but that was pretty meaningless.

Obviously Guinan isn't supposed to age at all (she looked the same in the 1800s as she did in the 2300s) but I'm looking at her and I'm picturing her with the funny hat thing again and face thing... eh. It could work.
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Old 01-22-2020, 12:18 PM   #197
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And is it just me, or does it feel like Guinan as a character was a great big setup for... I don't know, something that never happened or we never got to see?
Yup, I think a lot of that goes part and parcel with the spirit of the rest of my post above.

There was sort of recurring dialog across TNG that hinted at this deep connection between her and Picard. But if that connection was only drawn from the Time's Arrow story, then that's less of a deep connection and more simply like "wow, I met you 500 years ago and here you are on my ship. Cool!" and that' it.
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Old 01-22-2020, 12:21 PM   #198
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There was sort of recurring dialog across TNG that hinted at this deep connection between her and Picard. But if that connection was only drawn from the Time's Arrow story, then that's less of a deep connection and more simply like "wow, I met you 500 years ago and here you are on my ship. Cool!" and that' it.
Which only ever spoke to her fondness for Picard, not vice versa.
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Old 01-22-2020, 12:47 PM   #199
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Yeah, Guinan and Picard as friends/lovers/whatever really should have been explored more.

Also why Q was intimidated by Guinan. That NEVER got addressed, which is frustrating.
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Old 01-22-2020, 09:26 PM   #200
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Yeah, Guinan and Picard as friends/lovers/whatever really should have been explored more.

Also why Q was intimidated by Guinan. That NEVER got addressed, which is frustrating.
That whole scene was ridiculous with the hand gestures and whatnot. El Aurians are always implied as being sort of empathic with minor abilities to manipulate the thoughts of others, but whatever Guinan was doing with her hands to "counter" Q was ridiculous.
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