Nintendo DS vs Sony PSP

[Shadow Leonardo]

there are two name gaming systems DS is already out PSP is coming soon here are the features:
Nintendo DS:
1.has good graphics for it's games
2.can draw on it
3.can play Game Boy games IDK if this is true
4.can chat wirelessly

Sony PSP:
1.can play MP3's
2.has the same graphics as the DS for it's games
3.rumored it can play DVD's but I doubt it

but I pick the DS slightly better

[Kid Icarus]

Few corrections here:

Nintendo's releasing a media player that's going to use SD cards. It'll be capable of DVD quality movie playback, along with MP3 playback. The media's also MUCH cheaper then the Sony Memory Stick (SMS's are about 60 bucks for 225 MB. For that price you can get a 1GB SD card).

You also have to take in to account the battery life of both systems. My DS lasts about 7 hours. Word is the PSP only lasts 2-3 hours, but Sony keeps dodging this question, and changing their answers to confuse the media.

Then the games. The PSP can play PS2 level games. The DS offers totally new games. Feel the Magic is a prime example of this. That game just is NOT possible on anything else. Also, because of the battery life, developers are going to make their games shorter on the PSP. I woulden't expect any 80 hour epics from Square anytime soon (hey, that'd be about 40 recharges).

Then you have the screens. The PSP wins in quality, but the DS out shines it in every thing else. First off, the system protects it's screens, something the PSP just doesn't do.

The PSP's out in Japan. The DS is outselling it 5:1. And note, thats ONLY in Japan. Add in the US sales, and the PSP looks like a flop.

[愛]

So in other words, PSP blows hard. DS wins my heart. I still need to get one... :cry:

[ThirdMarioBro]

And let me show the proof with this week's Japanese sales....

1. Dragon Quest & Final Fantasy in Itadaki Street Special (PS2, Square Enix) - 185,000 units
2. Super Mario 64 DS (NDS, Nintendo) - 125,000 / 366,000 units
3. Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater (PS2, Konami) - 122,000 / 610,000 units
4. Dragon Quest VIII (PS2, Square Enix) - 118,000 / 3,281,000 units
5. Mario Party 6 (GC, Nintendo) - 104,000 / 373,000 units
6. Sawaru Made in Wario (NDS, Nintendo) - 100,000 / 350,000 units
7. Pokemon Emerald (GBA, Pokemon) - 84,000 / 1,335,000 units
8. Rockman EXE 5: Team of Blues (GBA, Capcom) - 83,000 / 204,000 units
9. Kessen III (PS2, Koei) - 78,000 / 78,000 units
10. Donkey Kong Jungle Beat (GC, Nintendo) - 74,000 / 121,000 units

1. Nintendo DS - 252,000 units
2. PlayStation 2 - 145,000 units
3. GameBoy Advance SP - 111,000 units
4. PlayStation Portable - 92,000 units
5. GameCube - 54,000 units

Simple put, Nintendo is killing them hard. Just wait until Nintendo gets out some new games, or anything with the word Pokemon on it, and Sony may just as well slit they're wrists. Gwg covered all the main issues.

PSP is a poorly designed piece of junk. It overheats, and it's ability to play UMD mocies will cost a fortune. Nintendo's releasing a media addapter that will basically let you pirate your DVD collection and watch them in MPEG4 on your DS (mp3's too). Nintendo will win this by a big margin.

[Barkworm]

The sale numbers for the PSP are kinda misleading though. All the PSPs that are shipped sell out in no time but Sony can't produce enough systems. If Sony could ship as much units as Nintendo does, the sales would probably be higher.
Anyway, I wouldn't recommend a PSP to anyone. I'm not really interested in handhelds but the DS is so inventive that I'm going to buy one. The PSP on the other hand is way too generic, plus it breaks too easily. It also has no interesting games. I think the only really good thing about it is the way it looks.

[ThirdMarioBro]

And even it's looks are just a GBA streched out of porportion. It's a fragile paperweight. I bet kids over here will break the store demo units in a week.

[Spitfire]

Heres what Ive read on both and after playing the DS heres what I think

DS
Pros
Nice desgin
Touch screen!
Still uses good old carts
Has a memory stick thing
Is wireless
Nice button layout
Screens look nice
Picto-chat
wireless network!

Cons
Graphics arent as good as PSP but great for a handheld system, better then N64 if you ask me
Lack of really intresting titles, to me anyways

PSP
Pros
Also has a nice desgin...with a explosed screen
Lots of good titles, to me anyways
The widescreen is really nice
The graphics Ive read are better then a PS2 and Ive even read this in magazines
Can play Mp3s and all that nice stuff

Cons
EVen though Sony compressed the data on the discs to the battry life is longer its still pathicly low
Disks cant save on themselves like carts thus we have memory cards...yay Sony con more cash out of me
The joy stick is retarded
The screen can get damaged very easily, makes you wonder why Nintendo came out with the SP doesnt it Sony?
Disk = moving parts and when moving parts get dropped or just a bit out of place they break so I think you can break them easier. Kinda like if you drop a CD player

Though the PSP has a buttload more of games I would play I dont care. I never had a GBA so every GBA that intrests me I can still get, and thats quite a few, PLUS theres probly more DS titles comming out that will intrest me. Im sorry Sony you lose my buiness this time. Maybe PS3

Id also like to inform you all that the PSP has a Devil May Cry game comming out for it. That alone would make me want to buy one but Im still going with the DS. That should tell you something espcially people who know how much I like Devil May Cry

[Jonatello]

there are two name gaming systems DS is already out PSP is coming soon here are the features:
Nintendo DS:
1.has good graphics for it's games
2.can draw on it
3.can play Game Boy games IDK if this is true
4.can chat wirelessly

Sony PSP:
1.can play MP3's
2.has the same graphics as the DS for it's games
3.rumored it can play DVD's but I doubt it

but I pick the DS slightly better

PSP cannot play DVDs. Only movies made for it like FF:AC

[ThirdMarioBro]

Sony probobly did this so they could pull a Nintendo and release a flip fold PSP in the future. NIntendo released the SP out of necessity because we'd been needing it for 12 damn years. Sony wants to find a way to milk us for more money in the future by making a flip top model....just in time for when the originals break down.

People can see through they're cheap techniques a lot easier now.

[Kid Icarus]

Barkworm: Lack of units is Sonys problem then. If they're having problems meeting demand, they should increase production.

And Spitfire, of course the PSP's going to have more games... it's the same thing developers have been programing for for years now. The DS pushes them to think diffrently, and to comeup with new games. When Animal Crossing DS, and Pokemon Diamond and Pearl, come out, we're going to see a HUGE sales boom.

Kinda makes me wonder why Nintendo doesn't make a full blown Pokemon RPG for a console, but that's for another discussion.

[Brodie]

TMB just pissed all over this thread.

I only give the PSP a week after the release before TMB finds someone who bought one and takes it away, throws it, then pisses all over that.

[Kid Icarus]

Please Brodie...













It'd only be a day, at most, before I'd do that. Then I'd slap them.

[Barkworm]

And Spitfire, of course the PSP's going to have more games...
Are you sure? Last time I checked there was an awful lot of studios making games for the DS. I can't imagine the PSP will have a lot more.

[Kid Icarus]

aug, i ment more games that he'll like. I'm not making sense, even to myself. o.O.

[Spitfire]

Barkworm: Lack of units is Sonys problem then. If they're having problems meeting demand, they should increase production.

And Spitfire, of course the PSP's going to have more games... it's the same thing developers have been programing for for years now. The DS pushes them to think diffrently, and to comeup with new games. When Animal Crossing DS, and Pokemon Diamond and Pearl, come out, we're going to see a HUGE sales boom.

Kinda makes me wonder why Nintendo doesn't make a full blown Pokemon RPG for a console, but that's for another discussion.
Haha theres more GBA games I want then PSP games anyways so the DS already wins and all the games for GBA are cheap now. Yes I would buy a DS just to play GBA games! You gots a problem!?

[ThirdMarioBro]

*unzips pants*

There are also way more developers making games for DS than PSP. THe reason is simple. To make a game for PSP requires the full amount of work, production time, money, and investment required for a modern PS2 title. Simple put, few developers can afford that kind of investment for a portable. That's not even mentioning how complicated the hardware is....just like that of PS2. The only non-port titles coming out for it in Japan are parlor games. There are going to be tons of PS2 ports.

Nintendo has created easy to use front end programs to make development easier for DS than even the GBA. Developers are happy because they get to be the first to think up new ideas. Touch screen are nothing new, but never has there been a device available to the general public that allows these new ideas to be available to everyone. The developers are running with it. You're just not seeing a lot of them now because NIntendo got the system out early for Christmas. Something Sony just couldn't pull off over here because NIntendo flogged the LCD companies. Sharp and Panasonic won't leave Nintendo simple because they know who will win. Gamers will see all kinds of original ideas next year, and we all know what will happen when they drop the Pokemon bomb. Pokemania slowed down, because Nintendo hasn't really done anything new with it. If they go MMORPG, they'll shut down the whole damn internet.

DS will win. Japan has already proven this. Final Fantasy movies don't garner as much attention as games do. DS has Final Fantasy games, PSP dosen't. Final Fantasy is the very reason Sony is where they are now.

Also keep in mind, SD flash cards are coming down in price, and going up in size every day. 8GB models are coming. As the DS's life goes on, these cards will become accessable to developers. PSP's UMD discs are about 1.5GB. Discs can't be upgraded in size. SD cards can. Theoretically, once the approiate size card becomes available, they could port a full size Final Fantasy game from PS1, FMV's intact, to the DS and upgrade the graphics to they systems potential. Or they could just make new games. Hell, the Metroid demo proved it can do super compressed FMV right now. We don't know half of this system's potential yet. They've hidden little secrets they intend to unleash every time Sony gains a little ground, the first of which will be online/noline gaming right at the thing's launch. PSP is doomed. I rest my case.

[Spitfire]

Even though you pretty much Hate PSP dont you think maybe if they take another shot at it they might get it right the 2nd time around? I think they could. I mean it is their first shot at a handheld

[ThirdMarioBro]

They might do better next time, but I hope Nintendo crushes the hell out of them the first time so all those damn magazines will shut up saying that they're days of producing hardware are over just because Sony decided to raise they're hand.

I hate Sony mostly because of the image they've placed on gamers. Hardcore gamers are now considered rejects to the public. Basically, if you don't play Madden and GTA, you're not a "real gamer" anymore. It makes me want to vomit. That, and everyone in the US seems to feel they must go with whatever the general public decides is mainstream. If you don't, you're a reject. That is why I hate PSP. They want to force the handheld gamers to believe that if they own a Game Boy or DS, they're a kiddy nerd, and if you want to be cool, you must own a PSP. That is they're only option, and they run it full force. They have the power to do so, and I'm afraid the American public is stupid enough to go for it. We live for hype over here.

Also, there's the fact that if the PSP bombs, it'll wreak the Playstation brand. Thet'll hurt them in the next console battle, and at least level the field and let the world see a real console war, and you know with Reggie's marketing, Nintendo will go for Sony's blood.

[Spitfire]

Thats so true. Im always whats against style anyways. I hate everything mainsteam. From music to movies. I like alot of movies that the general public as you put it dont like. The general public to me is stupid and cant comprehend something intelligent like Hero because it has subtitles so they go watch something like Day After Tommrow and think its the greateat film ever. Most people are just fanboys. Everyone assumes if you have a certin system you need a certin game. Everyone thinks because I have a GC and a PS2 I have to have GTA games and Super Smash Brothers Melee. And everyone thinls because my Dad has a Xbox that he needs Halo he doesnt even like FPS games. Plus everyone just buys what magazines tell them to and everyone on gamer forums are just a bunch of 13 year olds who like to start fights and try to make themselves look cool. They think if the game had a M rating its instantly better then anything without a M rating. They also act like Gamecube is the outcast kiddy system because of games like Pikmin yet they ignore games like the RE series and Metal gear Twin Snakes. Hell Eternal Darkness too! But the rating doesnt make the game. Companys like Rockstar just make M rated games so pre-teenagers will buy them. They market them that way. I thought State Of Emergency and Man Hunt sucked but every 13 year old I talked to loved it just as much as they loved their Budokai which they think is the best fighting game ever made

Unless PS3 has Devil May Cry titles, and rumor has it 3 is the last game, or it has Zone Of The Enders titles Im no buying it. And rumor has it ZOE is no longer going to be made. If they make it they should make it for the Revolution because it would look so awesome and the controls would fit perfectly I bet

[ThirdMarioBro]

All that needs to happen is for Square to dump Sony, and they're bridge will crumble. But we all know how much Square is in bed with Sony.

[=GRiM=]

Sorry I'm a little behind here, but I just thought I'd point out that the PSP has nowhere near PS2 graphics. Have you seen the screenshots? They're a little better than PS-X maybe, but PS2? No.

DS is just plain more original. I already have one, and I honestly couldn't care less about the PSP. It just never interested me much. Hell, when I heard they were gonna have Animal Crossing, I jumped right on the DS bandwagon. When I went to pick up my DS from EB, I then found out it would be coming out sometime next September, but hey I can wait.

I still don't have any games for it yet... The Metroid demo got old fast and I got tired of sending myself crudely drawn doodle-porn.

I'm just waiting for something good to come along. I gotta say, the launch lineup wasn't exactly spectacular. I want a good RTS to come along. It'd be sweet it they could get Blizzard to do Warcraft of Starcraft for them.

[Barkworm]

Sorry I'm a little behind here, but I just thought I'd point out that the PSP has nowhere near PS2 graphics. Have you seen the screenshots? They're a little better than PS-X maybe, but PS2?
I agree that the PSP is a crappy handheld but that's just not true. The graphics look almost as good as the PS2's. Haven't you seen the "Metal Gear: Acid" or "Ridge Racers" videos?

[Shadow Leonardo]

PSP cannot play DVDs. Only movies made for it like FF:AC

I said I doubt it can play DVD's if you read

[ThirdMarioBro]

Things to clear up.

1. The PSP plays movies on specially made Universal Media Discs that were created so that Sony could usher in some portable format that people couldn't rip and so they could block the recordable disc media that has lately become they're worst enemy. The things cost more than standard DVD's, and you're having to basically buy the same movies twice, only without the neato DVD extras, because simply put, this ain't DVD. It's the same as how Sony's going to use some new super density DVD's in the Playstation 3 so they can "attempt" to force the public to convert to a new media format. They want this so they can resell every movie ever made on a new format, and if they control the format, they control the licencing fees, as well as what gets released to some extent. In other words, they'd control Hollywood. The MPEG group is a non-biased nutral party....Sony isn't in the slightest. No media company sould ever hold the rights to the standard formats. I don't care who they are. It would just cause a monopoly and drive most companies out of buisness.

2. I've seen the Metal Gear Acid and Ridge Racer videos. They definately look good. Damn good graphically, but PS2 they ain't. More like slightly sub Dreamcast. The Dreamcast still has far better texture mapping than the PS2 ever had to this day. PSP is just scaled sown PS2 hardware. They did that intentionally so they could easily port PS2 games over, or slightly rework existing engines to create cheaply produced new games for quick release on the handheld. The entire PSP idea is just basically an excuse to go for NIntendo's heart. Nintendo is a pain in the ass for Sony. Sony has the bigger market share, but Nintendo keeps raising the bar with they're games, and Sony's having a hard time keeping up. They want to just buy them out and end it, but they can't because NIntendo owns the majority of their own stock (Sega taught them a lesson). Same goes for Microsoft. If they can get Nintendo out of the way, the quality bar goes down, and it becomes easier to convert the gaming industry into a Hollywood driven racket used to create games that arre nothing but tie-in's to the year's Summer blockbuster. Original content is hitting an all time low in gaming. The DS attempts to solve that by giving the artists new tools rather than just using the same old battered paintbrush they've had for the past 15 years.

The PSP is an attempt from Sony to push Nintendo out of they're home market (portables). They know if Nintendo looses money, they have to issue stock to recoup, and at that point, they become buyable. Nintendo knows this, and I believe they will come out fighting this next year the likes of which no one has ever seen before. Not, during the NES era, not during the console war of '91, not during anything we have seen. They will rise and conquer Sony. This so called "war of the handhelds" is nothing more than aprelude to the next console war. They know if they slap down the Playstation brand in portables, people will give them a second glance in the console world. The real war hasn't even started......but it will come the second week in May. All hell will break loose, and it isn't going to be pretty.

[Peanut]

Am I the only one who thinks the whole console war thing is really really stupid?

[Barkworm]

No, it actually is completely retarded. I always said I'd buy every console that has a couple of outstanding games.

[愛]

I f*cking hate this console war talk. Who cares. No one. People are going to buy the systems whether you like it or not. Just because GameCube can be thrown off a building and have it still playable does NOT make it better than the others.

[ThirdMarioBro]

If the game companies could just put out the games that they're fans want to play, and everyone make money and be happy, then the world would be a better place. Sadly, all everyone is concerned with nowadays is just taking over someone else (points to EA and Microsoft). It sucks.

[Kid Icarus]

The point to the console wars is this: most people can't afford three $150 machines.

Gamers buy one machine, studios flock to that machine, and in the case with Gamecube you end up missing out a lot of great games (although I strongly belive that Nintendo's offerings make up for that, which is why I got a 'Cube).

And until every system is exactaly the same, there's always going to be "A is better then B" talk. It's always been around, and it always will be. It's sad, really, because that takes away from what they should be focusing on: the games.

[Peanut]

Well sure it's always going to be around. I'm talking about the fights and arguments taken to the extreme by over zealous fanboys. It's just so damn annoying to read something where someone will say "This system is so sh*tty! I hate it so much. They deserve nothing but death!" then another person will come along and say "Well you're a queer and my system is so much cooler! You should be hung!". All of this is without proper reason. There's no real reason to wish death upon a certain company and all it's followers, or to even hope that company will go out of business. There's no just cause to the "Console Wars". Swapping opinions about various games and consoles, "I enjoy so and so's console!" "Well old chap you've got your points, but I enjoy this console more!" "Good show!", even a little bit of arguing is ok, because expressing opinions tends to cause that. I'd much rather have some healthy debating rather than "My system can fall of a building and still work. So this other system is garbage.". Like I told Ai on MSN, If you're living in a place where your console has a chance of falling of a building, I suggest you dive off the building along with it.

[Jed]

If you're living in a place where your console has a chance of falling of a building, I suggest you dive off the building along with it.

Hahaha, yeah :lol: Can the GC really be thrown off a building and still work? I'm not trying it with mine anyway!

[Brodie]

I smell urine.

[Spitfire]

Sorry I'm a little behind here, but I just thought I'd point out that the PSP has nowhere near PS2 graphics. Have you seen the screenshots? They're a little better than PS-X maybe, but PS2? No.

DS is just plain more original. I already have one, and I honestly couldn't care less about the PSP. It just never interested me much. Hell, when I heard they were gonna have Animal Crossing, I jumped right on the DS bandwagon. When I went to pick up my DS from EB, I then found out it would be coming out sometime next September, but hey I can wait.

I still don't have any games for it yet... The Metroid demo got old fast and I got tired of sending myself crudely drawn doodle-porn.

I'm just waiting for something good to come along. I gotta say, the launch lineup wasn't exactly spectacular. I want a good RTS to come along. It'd be sweet it they could get Blizzard to do Warcraft of Starcraft for them.
Ive read that the graphics are great and that Screen shots do it no justice

Heres what Gamepro said

After sitting in our offices for almost two weeks, the handheld still hasn't lost it's "wow factor," largely eclipsing interest in the Nintendo DS.

The main draw of the handheld is its graphical prowess. Forget Zodiacs, N-Gages, GBAs and any other pocket game platform--the PSP blows others out of the water with an LCD that shows almost no pixilation, and unprecedented 3D graphics. Screenshots don't do the console justice. For those that stayed away from handhelds because of mediocre graphics, this may be the first to pique your interest.

The PSP isn't without flaws or concerns however--one being the UMD drive. Already we've experienced a couple long loading times and freezes where you can hear the motor whirring, trying hard to read the discs. The issues are reminiscent of MD Walkman's giving out after a year's worth of use (disc-based Walkmans in general seem to have a relatively shorter lifespan recently), and these minor hiccups revive such concerns. However, it hasn't faced any serious hang-ups, such as discs bursting from the tray as some news sites have reported, and has overall been pretty reliable.

Another drawback are the controls, both directional keypad and analog stick. The d-pad is a lot more mushy and vague in feel than the PlayStation 2 controller, and there lacks a concrete transition between diagonals, and ups, downs, and so on. The issue surfaces playing Vampire Chronicles--most may find it difficult to execute even the simpler quarter circle fireball moves. The problems in executing moves may be either a software or hardware problem, so there still isn't enough to go on to make definitive conclusions--but Capcom has never been one to skimp on controls for fighting games.

The analog stick seems to face the same issues as the PlayStation 2 did--dead zones and/or dull thresholds. Moving the analog stick slightly in Ridge Racers has no effect, making steering vague (the game still controls well overall, however). While again, there still aren't enough titles to back the finding, it may potentially mean that the console is ill-suited toward first-person shooters, which require pinpoint accuracy to play.

Batteries, despite the pre-release noise generated for low battery life, has been exactly what Sony stated--lasting 4-6 hours.

While the console itself has surpassed expectations, the lack of compelling launch titles means we have yet to see whether or not Sony's PSP will overrun Nintendo's DS as the lead handheld platform. With Nintendo having an already significant user base of 2 million, it won't be an easy fight.

http://www.gamepro.com/sony/psp/hardware/features/40689.shtml

Gamepro is the last Magazine to lie about stuff like that they have slammed some games pretty hard

[ThirdMarioBro]

The fact that every ad in Gamepro is for Sony makes me take everything thay say with a grain.....no, the whole damn salt mine.

Mushy cross pads are what I hated about the original GBA. They hurt your fingers after 1 hour. I guarntee you all the Final Fantasys will come to DS. Hell, I wouldn't be suprised if Sony attempted to buy Square for the betrayl.

It'll do better in the US market simply because people over here are stupid as hell.

[Kid Icarus]

So, they're willing to have a shoddy console just because the graphics are good?

Psh. Morons.

[Spitfire]

People are shallow minded if magazines tell them its good then people will buy it. Thats how it works. Im pretty sure every magazine is going to kiss Sony's butt and say its the best handheld ever and give it lots of praise. They will pretty much take what is true and warp it to make it sound better. The only reason I agree with that Gamepro article is because their really picky on graphics and them saying something like that has to mean something.

[Peanut]

How do the graphics on MGS: Acid even get displayed? Isn't it a card game?

[Spitfire]

How do the graphics on MGS: Acid even get displayed? Isn't it a card game?
In a sense yes it is but its not like any other card game Ive ever seen
http://www.gamespot.com/psp/strategy/metalgearsolid/media.html
Watch a video or two its not like your normal card game. Its looks kinda slow but probly once you get used to it Im sure it gets pretty fun

[Peanut]

Any kind of card game...and I'm out.

[Spitfire]

I agree it doesnt look to fun like I said. Plus every card game Ive ever had wasnt very good. Like Lost Kingdoms GAH I hate that game I bought in hopes of it holding me over until PSo was released for GC but it didnt help me at all! I also hated PSO 3 the card concept ruined it for me it. The only card game thats still cool is the Pok'emon card game for GBC haha that game was fun

[ThirdMarioBro]

People are shallow minded if magazines tell them its good then people will buy it. Thats how it works. Im pretty sure every magazine is going to kiss Sony's butt and say its the best handheld ever and give it lots of praise.

They already are. The media is against Nintendo. You know they've got to be good when the only magazine on they're side, is they're own magazine.

I still think they'll win in the US, it'll just be a closer fight thanks to the media.

[Peanut]

Come on now. The media isn't against Nintendo. Maybe they just haven't been coming up with the greatest stuff as of late and people actually realize that. DS being the one exception. I mean...look at the Gamecube, how many out of this world amazing games have been released for it? One's that'll be remembered for reasons besides the franchise they're tacked on to. While the games may have been great, SM Sunshine, LoZ: tWW, etc. They weren't classic Nintendo games by any means. Take the Zelda franchise out of WW and it would probably be an above average Action Adventure game. The same goes for Sunshine. Really when I look at my Gamecube library I see very little new or refreshing experiences. Pikmin and Animal Crossing being the only two. You can add Metroid Prime in there. I didn't, because I only owned it for 4 days. SSB: M was/is an amazing game, but really it's just an update. Now look out to the future line up. We've got Star Fox, which, lets face it, isn't exactly the greatest series ever. Then Zelda, which will no doubt be a blast, but will it really be a new experience? I can only hope. I've done a lot of thinking on this. Nintendo is always praised for innovation and creativity, but besides the few things, they haven't made any real Nintendo classics this generation. We'll remember the NES, Super Mario, Zelda. The SNES, Super Mario World, DKC, Super Metroid. The N64, SM64, OoT, SSB...but Gamecube?

[ThirdMarioBro]

Well, I believe that Metroid Prime was one of the most innovative games this generation because it established the fact that an adventure game can be experienced from a first person perspective and work as good, if not better than any other.....but you have a point on the others (Star Fox pending til February....but probobly it too).

I've enjoyed every game I've played this generation (except that damn NFS Hot persuit.....sold that sucker), but Nintendo's games haven't really been anything different this generation....but then again, neither have anyone elses. Jest better version, or sequels to what we saw last generation. They see this. That's why DS isn't just another Game Boy, and that's why we're scratching our heads trying to figure out where Revolution's A & B buttons went. Nintendo's trying to milk the old style of game development for all they can because in all likelyhood, it won't apply next generation.

All systems are filled with sequels and ports right now, but I believe we're on the verge of change. Enjoy the old days of ports while they last, because they're coming to an end. DS is the messanger. The launch titles were rushed to get the jump on Sony. They did. The real DS games come in the next couple of months, and each one of them is going to be a new experience, and remembered for starting a new genre. Gamecube is apprently going to be they're last "normal" console.

But that new Zelda has promise other than style. The return of top down dungons, and horse combat are things that should be great.

*edit* I had another point, but it sounded dumb. Needs rewording.

[Peanut]

All systems are filled with sequels and ports right now, but I believe we're on the verge of change.

God, I hope so. Nintendo better pull off some sick sh*t soon.

[Kid Icarus]

They will. I think the Revolution's going to have us peeing in our pants, I really do. There seems to be even more "WTF?" going on around it then there was with the DS, so I'm just gonna assume the more "WTF?" the better.

[jeff the cheff]

Am I the only one who thinks the whole console war thing is really really stupid?


No, I was reading TMB's post above that and shaking my head. It's not going to be an ugly war, it's just going to be like all the other times that game consoles have come out. They come out and its a huge deal, and one sells better than the others and thats that. Just because the Nintendo Revolution might not sell as well as the PS3, doesn't mean the whole gaming industry is going to hell. And I read everything about Sony "buying out" every company and I was like "wow....Sony is evil" But then I realized that there is no proof behind any of this, and it probobly isn't true. They just want to have the best selling products so they can make the most money.

[ThirdMarioBro]

This is just a rant. Not really related to any particular point.

The deal is, Nintendo and Sony have completely different ways of looking at the industry. Both was your cash. That's where it ends. Sony slacks off on first party and instead opps to trap third parties into development for their portables by holding their PS2 licence over their head. This will hurt them badly come next generation with the PS3. It's a freash start, and Revolution will presumably launch the same week, so there's other places to go with their games.

Sony wants quantity, NIntendo wants quality. As a result, Nintendo's development cycles are longer. They're making up for this by opening more studios and having Shiggy training them. They're expanding to make up for third partys. The quality won't go down.

PSP developers will be slacking off on the games to attempt to save on the budget since the games will cost as much as a PS2 game to produce. DS games don't cost near as much. DS will win, and it will hurt the Playstation brand a little, giving Nintendo a big brake come E3 with Revolution.

[/end rant]

[jeff the cheff]

Thats so true. Im always whats against style anyways. I hate everything mainsteam. From music to movies.

No you don't. You like TMNT, which is VERY mainstreem.

And even it's looks are just a GBA streched out of porportion. It's a fragile paperweight. I bet kids over here will break the store demo units in a week.

All store demo units of DS were broken within a short time too. The touch screens don't even work anymore, even if you try to calibrate it.

[Kid Icarus]

That's because little kids are jabbing the stylus into the screen. Of course that's going to break it.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Everyone breaks store displays because it's not their's. They want to see how much it can take for the fun of it. I've seen those little bastards rip sticks out of GCN and PS2 controllers for fun.

[jeff the cheff]

Yea, those kids ****ed DS' up reaaal bad.

[Kid Icarus]

I also hear that some diehard PSP fans are running around scratching "PSP rules" onto DS touchscreens.

Really, have we sunk that far? Sure, I may TALK about urinating on a PS2, setting it on fire, urinating on it again, and sending it into sony... but do I do it? No, 'cause I belive as a Nintendo gamer I'm expected to have a high level of class.

[Peanut]

Or maybe you just don't have a spare PS2 to do that to. :D

[jeff the cheff]

I'll pretty much pee on anything.

[愛]

You can't be serious. Gamers don't have an ounce of class. We bash the hell out of rival systems/games/whatever the f*ck like children. If we weren't so lazy, we'd probably be the most deadly rioters EVER.

[Kid Icarus]

*coughJapaneseN64launchcough*

[ThirdMarioBro]

HAHAHAHA oh man, that is priceless. The only thing that could beat a gamer riot in total gallons of blood would be Tianniman Square.

Damn preorders screwed up the riot we wanted in Japan at the DS launch. Revolution needs a shortage. I want to see BLOOD!

*the preceeding comments only serve as more proof that gamers are crazy, bloodthirsty maniacs*


But violent fanboys are probobly the most dangerious of all.

[Kid Icarus]

This is why, TMB, neither of us can go near any of Sony's buildings with the following:

Explosives
Sharp objects
Blunt objects
Biological weapons

This is also why I'm going to stay far FAR away from stores when the PSP launches. I might just attack people with my Gamecube for getting one.

[jeff the cheff]

I wanna pee on stuff.

[Kid Icarus]

Well, I guess we could pee on Sony's HQ...

[Spitfire]

Lets pee on the trucks as they leave the Sony factory carrying the PSPs to the stores. Hell lets just pee on all the fan boys who think the PSP is the best handheld ever without even playing it

[Barkworm]

Yeah, enough talk about pee guys.

[Kid Icarus]

Yes sir!

Now that we know the PSP is being trounced in Japan (the DS's userbase world wide is, what, five times larger then the PSP's?) do you see developer support dropping?

[Barkworm]

No, because Sony is selling all the supplys they have. Fact is that people would buy more PSPs if they could. I heard the black market and the second hand market are going crazy, people spent double as much or thee times as much money for the PSPs there.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Yeah, it'll get worse once their factories pick up. Still, all of this "handheld war" sh*t dosen't matter anyway. The Game Boy is beating the royal sh*t out of both of them combined. :lol: :lol:

[Barkworm]

Not in Japan.

[Kid Icarus]

IMHO, if Nintendo can manufacture AND ship 2.8 million units in less then two months, then Sony, a MUCH bigger company, should have NO problem meeting those same numbers.

I smell a PS2-type shortage.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Then we're all doomed and about to be cramped into a niche market. Either way, as long as I get may games, and Nintendo makes plenty of profit, then nothing will happen and I'm happy.

[Barkworm]

Is the GBA really outselling the DS in the US? It's kinda weird.

[Kid Icarus]

Yeah, it is. Keep in mind, that's exactaly what Nintendo wanted.

The DS is NOT the new Gameboy, it's a new area all together.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Yeah, the GAB has got another good two years of life in it. This is why they've been saying that DS will not compete with PSP. The PSP gets to fight a handheld with a 25 million install base in the US alone for the next two years, then the next Game Boy comes out in late 2006/early 2007 and beats the royal hell out of the PSP with a cheaper price and better graphics and all that. The DS is meant to expand the industry into new directions and create a new market outside the regular arena while Game Boy is still the leading force in handheld gaming.

This is just what Nintendo wanted, and they pulled it off.

To be fair, the PSP will also create it's own market of gamers. I won't describe it as I'll just submit to petty insults.

[jeff the cheff]

This is just what Nintendo wanted, and they pulled it off.



So you're saying nintendo wanted the DS to sell less than GBA? I would think that they would want their new system to sell well. Or maybe they realized the DS didn't sell as well and said "Uh....oh yea, we uh... meant to do that..."

And if they do say that, then why would anyone want to buy a DS, if it isn't meant to be the leading system? Why would developers want to make games for the second best system when they can make them for the #1?

Maybe I should sell my DS.



After I beat mario. (120 stars)




And feel the magic.





And pee on stuff.

[Kid Icarus]

The point is, the DS is a third market.

You've got console, you've got handheld, and now you have this weird console/handheld hybrid that does things neither are possible of doing (yet).

And yes, Nintendo's been touting the DS as a third pillar ever since the idea was announced.

Think of the DS as the Virtual Boy that doesn't suck.

[jeff the cheff]

Yea, they said the DS was totally different and all, but lets be real, it is a handheld, and it is meant to compete with the PSP. Thats why they released it around the same time.

[ThirdMarioBro]

But it's also meant to take the brunt of the battle off of the Game Boy. Game Boy is their prized brand, and the highest selling brand in all of gaming. The DS is a new brand that stands on it's own merits and can act as support against Sony. PSP will not beat DS in Japan IMO. It may beat it slightly in the US because the population of the country is made up of moronic assholes, but either way, if Sony wants to take the handheld market away from Nintendo, they're going to have to beat both. Both are fully suscessful platforms, and if they want to take control of the market, they have to beat both. DS is in a near equal fight with PSP (market wise), but even if it falls (it won't), then they still have to beat Game Boy...the system that appeals to kids and soccor moms. That's the only place where their kiddy image comes in handy.

Either way, PSP is fu*ked.

[愛]

There are moronic assholes in Japan, too. They're not exempt from that category.

[Spitfire]

PSP is going to do very well in the US. Atleast in its first month or to until they start breaking and performing crapply. Then again that doesnt stop people from liking the PS2....humans are so, whats the word? Retarded? The PSP is getting so much praise it will do just fine. The general public cares about one thing
What is cool and what makes them popular. The PSP is that right there. Sony is like Metallica it doesnt matter how much their new CD sucks people will buy it because it's by Metallica. And that goes for Sony without saying...so shallow humans are atleast modern day humans

[ThirdMarioBro]

There are moronic assholes in Japan, too. They're not exempt from that category.

Yes, but we've got a whole hell of a lot more of 'em. Either way, the real war is PSP vs. GBA. That'll go like Game Boy vs. Game Gear. DS vs. PSP will ve different, and there's a damn good chance Sony will get the lead (in the US at least). Nintendo of Japan dosen't have the "image" problem they have been stuck with in the US. I don't think that will make developers abandon the DS though. I don't give a sh*t as long as it does good in Japan since that's where all the games i'm gonna buy for the thing come from. Fu*k the American developers if the best they can do is touch screen Spiderman combo moves and Extra Camera angles in Madden.

The DS is the third pillar. Nintendo knew from the begenning that PSP couldn't touch GBA, but it might beat DS in the US because of the coolness factor that Sony will always have since they control all Pop culture over here. From a buisness standpoint, DS takes the heat off GBA. From a creative standpoint, it gives us a new way to play our games. Either way Sony can't win, because they can't beat them both. Oh, and all NIntendo has to do is get off their ass, make more DS = touch screen sex commercials, talk team ninja into making a boob squeezing game, and scream MMORPG Pokemon, and it's done. Will they do it? Who knows. If they do it, this petty fight ends there.

[Barkworm]

BTW, I saw the latest Japanese harware sales and it was the first time the PSP was outselling both the GBA and the DS:
PSP: 64.602
DS: 53.527
GBASP: 18.289
The GBA sales have significantly dropped since the DS was released (I think they've never been as low as now), it seems like the Japanese didn't really get the "Third Pillar" idea.

[Peanut]

Barkworm, don't rain on the fanboy parade. You might not make it to your next post alive.

[Barkworm]

Damn, but I was so excited about the responses. :D

[Kid Icarus]

11,000 more? Theyr'e gonna have to do that for a while to catch up.

[ThirdMarioBro]

GBA sales will take off once they start selling the multi-color ones in the US. You know they will eventually. If they'd bring those limited edition Pokemon ones over here, they'd fly off shelves.

[DrSpengler]

http://www.snafu-comics.com/?strip_id=169

[Barkworm]

In Japan the PSP is outselling the DS for weeks now. I wonder who'll win this race in the end.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Honestly, I don't give a flying monkey sh*t anymore. The industry is becoming.......scrap that, has become soulless anyway. Just as long as I get my Nintendo games and they make money, then fu*k Sony. I'm tired of worrying about being accepted by the mass public. If they don't realize how cool the DS is, then it's their loss and I pity them.

[Kid Icarus]

Hm. If I remember right though... the game:console ratio's worse on PSP then it is with the DS.

Developers look at that.

Also, Nintendo just needs to drop the Pokemon bomb... We all know it's comming, but the Japanese are even more Pokeobsessed then we are. It's been said that Pokemon Stadium on the N64 singlehandedly saved that consoles life there, and that was just a battle sim.

[Barkworm]

Hm. If I remember right though... the game:console ratio's worse on PSP then it is with the DS.
Really? If that's true Sony is screwed because I recently read that Nintendo isn't selling near as much DS games as they hoped to. It's funny, it seems like both the DS and the PSP are selling great but the games are not.
Anyway, the DS is finally coming out here next month and I'm dieing for Wario Ware Touch.

[Kid Icarus]

Well, the DS only has 2 must own games in the US right now, and one of them's pry a bit too Japanese for your average American gamer.

And, IMO, PSP doesn't have any must owns. Ridge Racer looks like, and that's about it. MGA look stupid. A Metal Gear card game? Hm. Yeeeeaaaaaahhhhhh.

You know what though? As long as I still get games for my DS, I'll be happy. DS games have to have something new to them to sell, that much has been made clear from numbers (excluding Mario 64, which IMO sold on the fact that "wow! Mario 64's in my pocket!"... the same sale Sony's pushing for with the PSP). It won't be the PS verses the N64 again, simply because the DS brings so many new things to the table. I haven't had this much fun with a system since the SNES.

[Barkworm]

That's why I'm buying it. Actually I have no interest in handhelds (I haven't owned a Gameboy since the original one) but the DS is a must-have.

[愛]

I don't really leave my house enough to warrant a hand-held, but for something like DS, which is so innovative to the point where I was even impressed, it's something you have to buy, because you could even play the thing at home and still get a lot of fun out of it simply because you can't do something that the DS can do on your run-of-the-mill console.

And for the record, I still don't have one. Soon, though.

[Kid Icarus]

seriously, ai, if i've got enough money left over from my various Pokemon things, i should buy you one.

i wanna see some more FPS on it. Metroid Prime works really well with aiming on the touch screen. What'd be funny, is if Bungie got the goahead to make a Halo game for it. I doubt that'd happen, cause THQ can only publish Xbox games on the GBA, but i'd buy it.

[愛]

I don't deserve it. I've been an asshole to everyone here lately.

I'd love to see more FPS games on it, too. I really do love my FPS games. Even an MMORPG on it would be fantastic. Pokémon, anyone? I don't know if I'd be willing to buy a wireless router just to play it, but...I do enjoy my MMORPG's.

[ThirdMarioBro]

What I'm hoping for is that Nintendo can run the original Goldeneye through EA's license and retool it for DS. Give it a new multiplayer, and modernize the engine, and add 16 player support via Wi-Fi and touch screen sniper control. FPS on this thing is gonna be amazing. The whole machine is just so unique.

3 days til Wario Ware :D :D :D

[Barkworm]

DAMN YOU ALL!!!

[Peanut]

I don't deserve it. I've been an asshole to everyone here lately.

Not as much of an asshole as I've been, but I still have one! :D

Can't wait for Wario Ware. I have no money, but at times like this, with games I really want, I come up with some kind of scheme to get it.

[Barkworm]

Prostitution?

[Peanut]

If only. It usually involved swindeling one or two people.

[愛]

Yeah, like making your sister's boyfriend buy you games to win your trust. You're a monster.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Price announced. PSP will cost $250.

Excuse me while I roll around the room and laugh.

[愛]

That's because you have to buy a Goddamn package thing that comes with stuff you don't even need, and games you probably don't even want. I'd NEVER want Metal Gear Ac!d. EVER!!! What a waste! God. At least in Japan they sold the thing separately for $180, which is still pretty high, but not unreasonably high.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Packages are nutso. That's all I'll say. They'd better have a standlanoe version, or they're screwed, but I'm sure they will. Meh, I gotta go post a new copyright in the NIntendo thread...

[Kid Icarus]

I don't deserve it. I've been an asshole to everyone here lately.

I'd love to see more FPS games on it, too. I really do love my FPS games. Even an MMORPG on it would be fantastic. Pokémon, anyone? I don't know if I'd be willing to buy a wireless router just to play it, but...I do enjoy my MMORPG's.
Ai, Radioshack has 802.11b WiFi certified wireless routers for $30. My suspicions tell me that Nintendo's gonna have free online/noline gaming, so just consider that $30 your membership fee ;). For a Pokemon MMORPG, the only old school RPG that was designed to be one before they were even around, I think it'd be WELL worth it. And, if I remember right, you can get an 802.11b adapter for your Xbox. No more crazy routing wires running all over.

Did the $180 PSP come with a memory stick in Japan? That's really a cost of the console, as much as a memory card is for the current ones. That to me's the biggest drawback of CD's on a handheld... what if you have a lot of games, and hence a lot of cards.... and you leave the house with the wrong memory card?

[Barkworm]

I'm pretty sure it came with a memory stick.

[Kid Icarus]

I thought they had a 'bare bones' pack, with just the PSP and the battery charger.

BTW, I love how they make it seem all grand that they're including the charger.

[ThirdMarioBro]

"Yes, we're inclusing a battery charger so that you can play your Pretty Sh*tty Portable for more than 2 hours, What a GREAT deal!"

Awesome Marketing Campeign idea :D

[Barkworm]

I just checked and you're right, it only had the charger.

[Kid Icarus]

So yeah. Really, that comes to $180 plus $60. $240 then. And Sony's still taking a big loss on hardware.

[Barkworm]

The memory stick is "only" 30$.

[Kid Icarus]

What's the size on it though? 'Cause I gaurentee you the PSP isn't selling on its games alone, and you can't fit many songs on a 34MB one, let alone movies.

[Barkworm]

Good point. I think it's only 32 MB but there's also a 128MB one. I don't know its price though.
EDIT: I've just read the IGN and Gamespot reviews of Wario Ware Touched. Basically IGN really likes it, Gamespot does not. Both think that "Twisted" is a lot better and more inventive. I'm buying both games anyway.

[Peanut]

Jeff Gerstmann is a fat idiot anyways. He tried to pick stuff apart. Which is probably what he did with Wario Ware. Like Barkworm though, I'm getting both anyways.

[Barkworm]

All gamespot reviews should be done by Greg Kasavin. I love that guy. In Gerstmann's defense though, he was the one who reviewed the first Wario Ware and he gave it a 9.1.

[Peanut]

Greg Kasavin really is the man. I saw a video he did on GS about Steel Batallion, that game that comes with the $150 controller, and he's pretty damn funny in it too.

As for Gerstmann, I've never liked him. I don't know if he thinks he's a bad ass, but he isn't. The fat one from Dave and Steve's Video Game Xplosion was a lot better. Did anyone ever see that show? Best. Review show. EVER!

[Barkworm]

Greg Kasavin really is the man. I saw a video he did on GS about Steel Batallion, that game that comes with the $150 controller, and he's pretty damn funny in it too.
He sure is funny. I love his Ninja Gaiden review. In the last one or two minutes of it he just keeps talking about how cool Ninjas are and shows how to dress up like one with a black T-Shirt. :lol:

[ThirdMarioBro]

Wario Ware is the DS's first major killer app, so abviously people want to pick it apart. Now that's there are four games in the series they'll probobly start complaining that it's not innovative and that they shoyuld do something else.

I'm getting both. The first one was a total riot.

[Barkworm]

Actually they're not complaining about the lack of innovation. They complained about the lack of variety. Since you have to use the Touch screen in almost every task, the mini games are very similar. It was also said that there are fewer mini games than in the previous two games. The IGN review was still very positive and I have also seen a lot of other good reviews of the game.

[Peanut]

http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/920757.asp

Game Rankings is the best site to determine how good a game is, without actually playing it yourself. As you can see Touched has an 85% average, which is damn good. Gamespot is the only one of two places that gave it below an 8.

[愛]

Wario Ware Touched! looks pretty badass. If I had a DS, I'd definitely pick it up. I do enjoy mini games like they have in the Mario Party games.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Then you're really gonna like this game. Its got some crazy sh*t like Armpit hair picking, potty humor, and Jpop background music. Wario Ware is kinda one of a kind. Very wild crazy Japanese sh*t :D

[Kid Icarus]

I dunno when I'll be getting either of them. I don't own any Wario Ware games, yet *hides*.

[Peanut]

You've...you've at least played them...right?

[Kid Icarus]

Yeah, I have.

That weird version of "othello" in the GCN version of the game's awesome.

[Peanut]

Ok good. I got worried for a second.

I'll probably get it tomorrow, day it comes out. I have my ways, and I think I may have done it yet again.

[Kid Icarus]

If Walmart had put them out early enough, I'd have gotten it instead of my new car stereo (that i can't figure out how to hook up >_>)

[ThirdMarioBro]

Too bad I'm not in Nebraska. I'd help you out seeing as I'm pretty good with that junk.

[Mecha Cow]

Are the Wario Ware games any good on your own? I have the GC version but its only real appeal comes from the multiplayer (And it's great).

[Peanut]

The Gameboy versions are only good alone. Mutli-player games they ain't.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Yep, they're like the untimate form of single player entertainment for twitch happy gamers.

[marleynaki]

HOW MUCH COST THE.... sony psp???

[Barkworm]

It costs 250$.

[愛]

The dollar sign goes out in front of the number, Barkworm, in case that wasn't a typo or something. :D

[Barkworm]

:sweatdro:
Nope, I didn't know that. Good to know, thanks!

[愛]

No problem, my good man. You're still excellent at your English. Just trying to help you out. ;)

[Barkworm]

As I said before, I'll be teaching soon. I wouldn't want to teach crappy English so I appreciate any help. :)

[Dinny]

As I said before, I'll be teaching soon.
Maybe you could make the kids play Final Fantasy or Paper Mario:The Thousand Year Door in English for their preps. If those don't get them reading/speaking English nothing will. ;)

[Demented Utrom]

PSP is coming out in North America next Month,Price unknown as of yet.I think it might be 200 dollars or more.It runs on Discs.This is the first handheld to use game discs instead of carts.

Nintendo DS has a head start.

[Kid Icarus]

It costs 250$.

Price was announced a while back...

[Demented Utrom]

It would be 350 dollars in Canada.That is without GST.

[Peanut]

Oh how I hate that GST.

[愛]

6% sales tax in New Jersey! Suck it!

[Peanut]

PSP is coming out in North America next Month,Price unknown as of yet.I think it might be 200 dollars or more.It runs on Discs.This is the first handheld to use game discs instead of carts.

Nintendo DS has a head start.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v102/tmntrule/stoppost.gif

[Kid Icarus]

More then likely Canada's gonna get the shaft again, like they always do, and have the price jacked up waaaaaayy higher then it should be.

[Peanut]

We don't get shafted. It's only because our money is worth a little less than the US $. It also should be noted that where you guys make say...$7 US we make $8.50 or $9. Really it all evens out in the end, not much of a difference if you were to convert.

[Kid Icarus]

Really? I thought a lot of people were complaining about price hikes, after currency exchanges of course... guess my brain tricked me again XD.

[Demented Utrom]

Some price hikes are a little overboard.I payed nearly 500 dollars for pS2 in 2001.This was the second year it came out.Canada gets shafted on Electronics with the awful GST tax all the time.The government wants there share of the money you spent.Then they waste it on stupid things.

When I bought my 36 inch HDTV.I bought it during a sale.It was over 3000 dollars not on sale.I bought it at 3200 with the 6 year warranty in 2003.TV brand sony model 36HS500.Otherwise stuff in canada is way too much.

[Peanut]

What the hell? You bought a PS2 for $500 cdn the year AFTER it was released? Are you insane? I bought it for half that amount at the same time! There isn't anything wrong with the prices in Canada.

[Duke]

I don't know the exchange rate but they were only 300 in the states the day they were released.

[ThirdMarioBro]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v102/tmntrule/stoppost.gif

pwned. :lol:

Sadly, I'm afraid all next gen consoles are gonna cost like that in the US.

[Demented Utrom]

Well Canada gets the shaft on electronics all the time.New consoles cost for next year cost unknown.Put GST on top of that there usually more money to buy in Canada.Then in the States.

[Peanut]

Not by much. You do know that our $ has less worth than the US $ correct? That's why our prices seem so much higher, when they're really only different by about $5, if that.

[Demented Utrom]

I agree about hating the GST.It makes stuff more then it actually is.Sometimes it adds on a extra 200 dollars for stuff like TVS.Because of our Dollar value being low is the main problem.

[JameO]

Yeah, our dollar is doing pretty good and is expected to rise. And yeah there is GST and sure it might be taking your money but that goes into the government. Which means more money for our health care and other needed resources.

[Dinny]

If anything it's Europe (especially Britain) which gets the worst deal. We get everything last and it costs the most. New games here cost £40, the pound is quite a bit stronger than the dollar (£1 = $1.6) so a game here costs around $64. :(