Raphael - turtle of a thousand faces

[jenna]

Hey dudes and lady dudes:)

First of all, I apologise if this topic exists on another thread, but after some browsing through old threads, I ran out of patience and am starting this one.

Once again, I'm off to bed, but since I always find the most interesting conversations happen while I'm asleep (exceptin of course the contributions from my fellow Brits), I thought I would start one, this time about my favourite turtle - Raphael. In my opinion he is one of the most interesting characters ever written and would be a good case study for a psychological analysis too.

Raphael has been so differently portrayed in the various incarnations and I would like to hear everyone's opinions of the different sides to him that come out in these depictions.

I won't give my thoughts now - they will be far too long and borring and not only will typing them keep me out of bed for a while, they will bore everyone to tears so that no-one will get through reading this post and more importantly will be too knackered by reading to contribute. ;)

So, I'm opening the floor.... please refer to comics, TV and films and any other versions you think are applicable... maybe even fanfics?

Go!:D

[Scandia]

Raphael is my LEAST favorite turtle- in all of his incarnations.

I dislike sardonic people because they are usually making fun of me for some reason or another- not just because I lack the ability to use and understand sarcasm unless provoked. But the OT version is still the most passable one.

I have no clue why in the world is he so angry at everyone and everything in the other incarnations. I mean, what does he want? To be the boss? To be left alone? To be number one? To have Splinter's undivided attention? To get ALL of the compliments from Splinter WITHOUT earning them?

Sure sure, there are bad guys and injustice in the world. But ALL the Turtles and the good guys are out combatting them. This is not just anger about bad things happening in the world or bad people getting away with bad things.

Without Splinter, Raphael would be totally lost. And I know that he appreciates his father and brothers very much. I can imagine his worst nightmare would be getting kicked out of the family. Hence this is why I think that he says "I'm leaving" or "I quit"- to go on his own before getting kicked out by another.

I wonder if Raphael wants Splinter to give him more positive attention. Or conversely if what he wants is Splinter off his back.

In a tangent, personally I think the Turtle that could be the most interesting is Donatello. Why? In some ways he is like Splinter, while in others he is very different. So with Donatello, Splinter has a Turtle in his hands that is neither a chibi version of himself nor totally unlike him.

[dj mav]

i didn't get why they portrayed him so different in the movies from how he was in the OT. i liked him in the OT best, cause he's so damn funny. :lol: he's probably my 2nd favorite, behind mikey.

[KROW]

i didn't get why they portrayed him so different in the movies from how he was in the OT.
That could be because in the original comic book series, he was a hothead whereas Mikey was the funny one. I guess that was better for the film than using Mike's stoner/surfer persona.



I liked Raph in the old toon because although he wasn't that loose cannon, he was humorous and sarcastic. It was odd, but it was still fun to watch.

Of course, I like him better the way he was meant to be.

[dj mav]

That could be because in the original comic book series, he was a hothead whereas Mikey was the funny one. I guess that was better for the film than using Mike's stoner/surfer persona.



I liked Raph in the old toon because although he wasn't that loose cannon, he was humorous and sarcastic. It was odd, but it was still fun to watch.

Of course, I like him better the way he was meant to be.

oh ok, never read the comics. :ohwell:

[DonatelloDomeHead31]

"Raphael is cool, but rude (Give me a Break)" you have the first season song intro to thank for Raphael's attitude in the old toon.

[triplexxx]

OT: Raphael is a sarcastic joker, likes making fun of people, and is mild-mannered and sensitive. He's seems smart, witty, and utterly charming at times. There have also been times he's shown self-sacrafice, like when he stayed behind as a hostage for Bebop and Rocksteady at the Asian-American Cultural Center while the others carried Splinter back to the lair to recuperate him from the amnesia he got from the smoke bomb in Blast From the Past, and when he decided to be a superhero when he thought he was near death and nearly sacraficed himself in Raphael vs. the Volcano. He really cares for family.

NT: Raphael is sometimes hotheaded and rash, running into situations without thinking, and other times he thinks very hard and is extremely rational about things, like in the City at War arc, when he protested getting involved in the gangster war because he believed doing so would only make it worse. He has a keen intuition, like about Karai, he knew from the start it was a bad idea getting involved with her, trusting her, and in the end, his intuition about her was right all along. He's even tinkered with mechanics, like his motorcycle; so all in all, he's very smart. He seems to enjoy sarcastic jokes too, except for some that come from Michaelangelo. He preaches lessons he learns from his anger issues to that kid Tyler in Lone Raph & Cub. Again, he really cares for family.

Old Movies: Hot-headed, has a hard time with temper, like being alone. Again, he's passionate about his family's protection and takes it real hard when Splinter is kidnapped, they all did. Again, seems to enjoy sarcasm, especially in the second and third. And in the second and third, again he preaches against avoiding fights and handling anger to Keno and Yoshi, respectively.

New Movie: An independent loner trying to make good use of his time while his father has put his sons' crime-fighting days on hiatus and has somewhat neglected him (damn you, Splinter). Takes the family break-up harder than any of the others; in the end, realizes how much he needs his family and that he can't do without them. Like always, feels great concern for family.

[discordiatookie]

One of my favourite Raph stories is 'Sons of the Silent Age' (Vol 1 #28). All the way through he is distant, sulking away on his own. Casey tries to see what's up, and gets told that he won't understand, he's human. Then Leo tries, and basically gets told to get lost. Ultimately, we (and April) realise that what's wrong with Raph is that he's pondering about being the last of his kind, only four males in his whole species and after that, nothing.

Another thing with Raph is that when Splinter went missing in Vol 1, it seemed to hit him really hard. He even went out by himself looking for Splinter, which none of the other guys did.

Also, he seems very close to Shadow, even following her on a trip to Paris to keep an eye on her. He seems to have a very protective bond over her, perhaps its because its his best friend's daughter and he feels some responsibility? Anyways, I aint no psychologist, but I think that all this shows that he's not the loner and hothead that alot of people right him off to be...

[ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael]

What I don't get is, why is it that in every one of Raph's future incartnations, he's missing an eye?

[The Shelf]

What I don't get is, why is it that in every one of Raph's future incartnations, he's missing an eye?

Arrr, 'cause he be mean like a piiirate, yarr!

[Buslady]

someone doesnt understand Raph.
Raph is angry mainly cos they're different, unable to live as people-with lives, jobs, fun things, families, denied everything they should have. Then there's the view Raph sees, he sees Splinter seemingly giving most of his time to Leo, the perfect student. Jealous? Probably. He feels neglected sometimes. We know he isn't. Splinter favors Leo as a student, that is undeniable.
Im gonna stop here cos were watching DrWho.....

maybe I'll type more...

[jenna]

Thanks for all your contributions. As promised here is mine.

Raphael’s character forms a polar opposite to each of his three brothers. Whilst Leonardo is level headed and sensible, Raphael is quick tempered and rash; whilst Donatello is quiet and gentle, Raphael is aggressive and violent; whilst Michelangelo is fun-loving and innocent, Raphael is angst-ridden and old beyond his years. His personality juxtaposition to his brothers isolates him from them and he is something of a loner. He has been shown at times to be a depressive, an insomniac, and unable to control his anger, often losing himself in his rage and at times becoming almost homicidal. He is fiercely protective of victims of crime to the point where he will throw himself into the line of fire to protect someone and adopts an eye-for-an-eye attitude to defending them and punishing their attackers.

The origin for Raphael’s anger and bitterness to my knowledge has never been fully explored, but is indicated to have its routes in, or at least to be fuelled by, his rivalry with his oldest brother, Leonardo, in whose shadow he has always lived; together with a self-loathing borne through understanding that he and his brothers can never enjoy the world as the humans do. In contrast to his aggressive attitude, he also has a very fragile side and is the most likely to experience extremities in emotion. He is also shown to be tender and compassionate to children. Despite their differences, Raphael is close to his brother Leonardo, but often on more of an unspoken level as they rarely see eye to eye. He is also often depicted as being particularly close with Michelangelo, who balances his cynicism and angst with humour and light-heartedness.

Due to the complexity of his character, he is favoured more in representations on the big screen, as the limitations of children’s TV series have caused interpretations of his character to be one-sided.

The 1987 cartoon, perhaps questioning the appropriateness of Raphael’s angry personality for children’s TV, tones his character down somewhat. Instead he is a sarcastic wise-cracker who rather than harbouring deep rage, is easily irritated, but much more friendly and humorous than in other incarnations. He tends to have a cynical, pessimistic outlook and is usually the first to fear that they will be defeated. He is also prone to panic in difficult situations, but remains calm and delivers fantastically biting retorts when facing an enemy. In fact, it could be argued that Raphael’s personality in this incarnation is a representation of the very core of the character – who Raphael would be if he had not suffered the emotional scarring he is shown to have in other incarnations. Uniquely in this series, there is little suggestion of any rivalry with Leonardo, and the two are shown to be very close friends. In Series 3, rather than be shown to be jealous of Leonardo’s role of leader, Raphael is shown to cope very badly when he is elected as leader in Leonardo’s absence. However, this side of him, along with the more gritty aspect to his personality, is developed in later episodes, and in series 8 he is shown on one occasion to challenge Leonardo to battle with him for the title of leader.

The 2003 TV series also chooses to avoid the complexity of Raphael’s character, although in this instance, focuses more on his aggressive personality. In this incarnation he is extremely tough, impulsive and quick to jump into a fight. He is highly competitive with Leonardo and often gets into arguments with him. It is suggested that this rivalry is a result of the two competing for the role of leader in their preteen years. He also has a very close relationship with Michelangelo, who loves to taunt Raphael and play jokes on him. Raphael is protective of his brothers and is shown to suffer the highest level of distress if one of them has been injured. Despite the fact that his vulnerable side is left largely untouched, he is shown to cry in this series. In Series 1, in a direct adaption of an episode from the Mirage comics Volume 1, Raphael allows himself to be taunted into a violent attack on Michelangelo during a sparring session, and comes close to beating his brother with a wrench. Consumed by guilt, this leads him to address his reactions to his anger, and attempt to gain some balance in his life. I personally find him harder to empathise with in this version and like him least of all than any other incarnation.

Raphael’s character is explored more deeply in the first film. In this film he is a highly volatile character, carrying self-punishing anger, resentment of Leonardo and is on the brink of some sort of personal crisis. His body is scarred and his shell is cracked in places, showing that his tough exterior is quite literally breaking. His vulnerability is a key element to his character in this incarnation and is concentrated on more so than in any other. His relationship with Leonardo provides much of the focus. Whilst they do not appear to get along with each other and are prone to frequent arguments, they are shown to have a very close, spiritual bond. In the middle of the film Raphael is attacked and beaten, and spends a large stretch of narrative unconscious, during which time Leonardo does not leave his side. Raphael’s recovery from this ordeal brings with it a cooling of the hysterical nature to his anger, and he becomes more mature with it.

The new film is very much a catharsis for Raphael and he is depicted as bearing responsibilities that are far beyond his capacities. It is also revealed that an aspect of his resentment of Leonardo is the result of the pain of feeling unloved by Splinter. He is much calmer and his anger is more intense, rather than being eruptive as in the first film. His role as The Nightwatcher is the epitome of his loner role, as he has resorted to taking on the crime in NYC on his own, without the support of his brothers. His reaction to the conflict with Leonardo coming to a head is the most revealing scene. Whilst he is furious at first and attacks without mercy, he realises his mistake and his anger turns to devastation. This story arc allows some of the conflict between the two brothers to be resolved. This is my favourite version of Raphael and is the way I always imagined he should be portrayed.

Wow - sorry to have banged on for so long. :lol:

[Scandia]

Wow. That is a lot to be said about a Turtle. We need to make similar threads for the other three. Starting with Donatello, since he's often neglected.

Anyhow, regarding Raphael:

1) Does he want to be "teacher's pet", in other words the best and/or favorite STUDENT?
2) Does he want to be "daddy's boy", in other words the best and/or favorite SON?

Because he seems to be envious of Leonardo regarding BOTH of those, and thus pick on him and resent him too much.

[jenna]

Anyhow, regarding Raphael:

1) Does he want to be "teacher's pet", in other words the best and/or favorite STUDENT?
2) Does he want to be "daddy's boy", in other words the best and/or favorite SON?

Because he seems to be envious of Leonardo regarding BOTH of those, and thus pick on him and resent him too much.

I don't think he wants to be teacher's pet or daddy's boy in the strict senses, but I think he hasn't been able to make the distinction between Splinter as a father and Splinter as a teacher. I think he sees Splinter's rewarding and praise of Leonardo as a declaration of love as a son. So he thinks Splinter loves Leo more than him and deals with this by going all out and trying to out-do Leo to prove himself worthy of Splinter's love. Interestingly, neither Don nor Mike seem to have similar notions, and Leo probably doesn't realise this is going on. These thoughts are based on the new film concept: "Just because you are not my favourite student does not mean you are my least favourite son". This is all Raph needs to hear in the end, and he picks himself up and takes action to rectify the damage he has done.

As for similar threads for the others, I have plenty to say about them too!

[Scandia]

Interestingly, neither Don nor Mike seem to have similar notions

If Splinter did indeed have a favorite SON, then there would be THREE very angry and jealous Turtles instead of just one. I do not think that Mikey's and Donnie's easygoing and laid back personalities alone would account for their not being upset that Leo is the leader and gets the most (earned) positive feedback.

So I wonder if Raph does have an emotional handicap that led him to conclude that "best student = favorite son".

and Leo probably doesn't realise this is going on.

He probably has noticed that his brothers are not as close to Splinter as he is. However, he could simply deduce it is because their personalities and thus interests are not as similar to that of their sensei/father. If Leo is more into martial arts than the other 3, that could explain the spending more time together easily without leading Leo to think that another brother is afraid Leo is also favorite son.

[Buslady]

There's so much more to Raph than what they can show in the toons. I wish they could show more.
One thing that kinda bugged me in the new movie, Splinter lecturing him on how a good leader is tempered by compassion and humility...okay, so is he saying Raph has no compassion???? The opposite is the truth. He has loads of it.
Now humility.....

anyways.

I think one of Raph's problems, he has all these emotions but unable to act upon them they hit a wall. He can not act upon any natural feelings, maybe that with an ungodly amount of male hormones rushing through him, it binds up and what can he do? It's gotta be hard to control that.
I'm only guessing, I'm not a guy...lol

Knowing that he also has very strong emotions, he is sensitive. Seeing Leo getting most of the attention upset him. Maybe he feels he isn't as worthy of the lessons sensei teaches, Leo picks it up so fast and learns faster where Raph is behind with learning disabilities contributing to his anger? He then is jealous of Leo which keeps him in competition with him. Just another of of my fun theories. Stuff like this happens in school though.

Ya know...the bottom line...sometimes I think ol Raph just needs one good long cry. Let it all out.

[Warhorse]

I think Raph's root for his anger stems from the thought that of all the Turtles and Splinter, he is the only one that actually gets it. That they are the only ones of their kind. And him being the most emotional of the four, he longs to have alot of friends. I think he watches tv and people from the streets having relationships, procreating, succeeding, or failing in their lives, but they at least have options, options Raph knows, that no matter how much he looks at it different angles, he'll never have.

As much as people want to label Raphael as the loner. Seems to me like he's the one Turtle that actually goes out of his way to meet and befriend people. I mean, in retrospec, where would the Turtles be if Raph hadn't thrown his temper, gone off on his own to recouperate and come across Casey Jones? Face it, Raph's biggest flaw was the teams biggest savior!

And can you blame Raph's anger, in that he will not sit down and be content with what he has like the other three. He wants more out of life, and he's in the right to go out and try to get it. There's nothing wrong with a little anger fueling your ambitions!

[Buslady]

I think Raph's root for his anger stems from the thought that of all the Turtles and Splinter, he is the only one that actually gets it. That they are the only ones of their kind. And him being the most emotional of the four, he longs to have alot of friends. I think he watches tv and people from the streets having relationships, procreating, succeeding, or failing in their lives, but they at least have options, options Raph knows, that no matter how much he looks at it different angles, he'll never have.

As much as people want to label Raphael as the loner. Seems to me like he's the one Turtle that actually goes out of his way to meet and befriend people. I mean, in retrospec, where would the Turtles be if Raph hadn't thrown his temper, gone off on his own to recouperate and come across Casey Jones? Face it, Raph's biggest flaw was the teams biggest savior!

And can you blame Raph's anger, in that he will not sit down and be content with what he has like the other three. He wants more out of life, and he's in the right to go out and try to get it. There's nothing wrong with a little anger fueling your ambitions!

Actually I think his loner thing is like denial. Yeah he says he wants to be alone...bull...he wants to be normal and not be alone, just wants to be normal. Friends, family, everything life could give him but he can't have.

[jenna]

I think Raph's root for his anger stems from the thought that of all the Turtles and Splinter, he is the only one that actually gets it. That they are the only ones of their kind. And him being the most emotional of the four, he longs to have alot of friends. I think he watches tv and people from the streets having relationships, procreating, succeeding, or failing in their lives, but they at least have options, options Raph knows, that no matter how much he looks at it different angles, he'll never have.

As much as people want to label Raphael as the loner. Seems to me like he's the one Turtle that actually goes out of his way to meet and befriend people. I mean, in retrospec, where would the Turtles be if Raph hadn't thrown his temper, gone off on his own to recouperate and come across Casey Jones? Face it, Raph's biggest flaw was the teams biggest savior!

And can you blame Raph's anger, in that he will not sit down and be content with what he has like the other three. He wants more out of life, and he's in the right to go out and try to get it. There's nothing wrong with a little anger fueling your ambitions!

That is really insightful and I think really true. I don't think he wants to be a loner and makes an effort not to be, but like Buslady says, acts like he would rather be on his own as a defense to not having the friends around him that he really seeks.

[Spawn Guy]

New Movie: An independent loner trying to make good use of his time while his father has put his sons' crime-fighting days on hiatus and has somewhat neglected him (damn you, Splinter). Takes the family break-up harder than any of the others

So rather than talk with his father and get the "neglect" to stop he exhausts himself so much at night that he does absolutely nothing to do anything about the break up until his brother is in trouble. The Nightwatcher was about as ironically neglectful as Splinter keeping them below ground for their saftey and Leo staying in the jungle to make sure he wouldn't go back a failure.

[triplexxx]

Well, as I said before, this break-up never would've happened in the first place if it hadn't been for Splinter. Also, how can anyone help mend the family while one of them isn't even home for a whole year; it takes everyone's efforts to mend the family, and it's impossible to do when one of them isn't even there. And maybe Splinter could've tried talking to him; I mean, he's the father, he's makes the decisions for the family, he decides what his sons are or aren't allowed to do, so maybe he could try making an effort to reach out instead of sitting on his meditative behind not doing jack for his family.

[Spawn Guy]

So Raph gets off the hook for not only "doing jack" but actually decrying Leo and Don when any mention is made of them as a team? And yeah, I think the whole reaching out thing is a two way street. If Splinter is expected to make the effort I don't see why Raph or the other two couldn't, even and especially with Leo gone. It might take the whole family to fully heal, but there's no reason for the other three to not make any effort to keep it together.

And seeting Leo, the other reason there's a nice big long gap for them to fall apart over, sounds like making a desicion to help the family to me.

[triplexxx]

Well, as Donatello mentioned, he and Michaelangleo were contributing to the family. And in a way, Raphael was contributing by picking up where the others left off by tending to the city's problems so that things don't get too messy for them when they're all back together again. And of course, Leonardo's working to be a better leader and member on the team.
Thereby, I see everyone doing something for the family, except Splinter, and what did you mean by "seeting", what's that mean?
So Raph gets off the hook for not only "doing jack" but actually decrying Leo and Don when any mention is made of them as a team?
Well, maybe that's where he made the mistake. I mean he was correct when he said "this team doesn't exist" because they're not all there, but he should've taken it out on the source of the problem, his father, not his brothers. When they train and contribute to the family, they're supposed to do it "together", that way they don't lose their sense of unity.

[Buslady]

IMO...the whole thing is Splinter's fault.
He failed to continue training with the others. Do we see any training? No. All he does is sit on his butt or do Tai Chi...Mike even says he was training, his fingers with a game controller. Daddy wasn't keeping them in line. They fell apart. Raph, bored does his own thing. They don't question him being in bed all day, out all night? Don't they wonder what he's doing?

[Spawn Guy]

Setting. Sorry, typo. And that was kind of my point, they could have done more, even with Leo not there. Something along the lines of "Master Splinter, I really don't think that's a good idea." Hell, maybe they did and it didn't work, but I'm not getting that impression when Raph spooks Don to prove bullying is an approprite way to act.

[triplexxx]

"Setting Leonardo", "Master it's not a good idea?"->what's not a good idea? Sorry if I sound nieve, I'm still kind of confused what your saying here.

[Spawn Guy]

Okay

Splinter sets Leonardo about tryint to pull the team back together: The rooftop training, going out to look for Raph. Basically it's the results of that scene in Splinter's room where he and Leo reunite. You know "I'm sure things will be back to normal Sensi."

As for the "Not a good idea" part, maye Raph, or even Leo, or any of the four of them could have said something along those lines: why one of the family and one of the team shouldn't have gone off to South America. If Splinter's getting no objections he's not really going to reconsider a plan that sounds good on paper. And for their to be ojections we have to assume the TMNT thought about the potential danger there.

And your hardly coming off as niave at all.

[Time Mistress]

Wow, so much to talk about. I don't know where to begin.

I guess I'll start with Raph in each medium:

Old Toon - least fave overall, though he became my fave for a little while in seasons 4 & 5 after I saw the first movie despite the differences in personality, so it varies. I love whoever said (Jenna I think) OT Raph is like Raph if he could have as close to a normal life as possible (sorry I can't remember the exact words) but I thought that was a brilliant way to put it and reconcile some of my disapointment of OT Raph, cause Raph deserves to be happy.:)

All 4 movies - fave
Mirage - fave/tied with Mike
New toon - fave/tied with Mike
Archie - fave

I think Raph's problem can be summed up in three words - Jan Brady syndrome.;) "It's always Leo, Leo, Leo."

But I also think that Raph's concerns about a normal life and knowing he can't have one because he's a mutant is such a powerful theme for him (and for all of them). Sons of the Silent Age, the first Mirage issue I read really hits that home. It's the same theme that makes the X-Men so powerful and long lasting, but I think TMNT drives the alienation point home all the more. Only 198? Try being 4! I don't know who else here reads X-Men but I became a huge fan of Wolverine because he reminded me so much of Raph (though I know the original influence was the other way around.) The following was said to sum up Logan, but I think it applies just as well to the contradictions of Raphael on most counts:

"Super hero and outlaw. Moral philosopher and psychotic. Loner and family man. A protector of society who feels ill at ease with it. A breaker of rules who binds himself to a code of honor. (World famous adventurer who hides behind a false identity.) Savage killer of criminals and kind friend to children. Beast and man. In one person."

Warhorse also made a great point about Raph befriending the most people of the four which seems like it would be Mike's department, but I guess not. Raph's befriended - Casey, Lucindra, April in the first film, Keno, Yoshi in the 3rd film, Traximus, Tyler, Mona Lisa, Ninjara, and Shadow. And I'm sure I'm forgetting some.

[Spawn Guy]

The Foot in Vil 3? They were practically holding tea parties! What's cutting a line and letting someone almost fall to their death between friends?

[triplexxx]

As for the "Not a good idea" part, maye Raph, or even Leo, or any of the four of them could have said something along those lines: why one of the family and one of the team shouldn't have gone off to South America. If Splinter's getting no objections he's not really going to reconsider a plan that sounds good on paper. And for their to be ojections we have to assume the TMNT thought about the potential danger there.
I see what you're saying now. About the "no objections" thing, maybe that is a fault of the turtles. I find them to be somewhat blindly obedient to Splinter, they'll just take for granted anything he says, thinking he always knows best. But he doesn't always know best, he made the mistake here, and they were the one who had to suffer for believing he was right.

[Scandia]

Yeah, I cannot help but wonder exactly why the other 3 Turtles did not want to keep up their training in the new movie. I read the prequel comics- but they are not quite conclusive about this.

Sounds like Splinter's plan backfired- although everything worked out in the end.

[Spawn Guy]

Yeah. Although I wonder if Leo had actually come back on schedule or if the others had made more effort (again, assuming they didn't)if it would have worked.

[triplexxx]

Well, they obviously must've still been doing some training, Raphael especially, considering how easily they were all able to get past the Foot and break into Winter's tower.
Yeah. Although I wonder if Leo had actually come back on schedule or if the others had made more effort (again, assuming they didn't)if it would have worked.
Bottom line: the whole plan was faulty to begin with.

[Spawn Guy]

And he got his fare share tracking down a large amount of crime all over NY. Putting on and walking around in that suit must have been a bitch.

Bottom line: the whole plan was faulty to begin with.

I fail to see how. Other leaders do things solo to imporve their skills. Why not Leo.

[Buslady]

why the hell does splinter expect leo to 'bring back the team' so to speak, i felt like yelling at him get off your fat rat @$$ and you do it!!!!

[triplexxx]

I fail to see how. Other leaders do things solo to imporve their skills. Why not Leo.
Because like I said above, their training is most effective for ALL of them when they do it "together". Without his brothers, Leonardo would be nothing, same goes for the other turtles; without each other, they'd be nothing. They've all helped make each other who they are.

[Spawn Guy]

why the hell does splinter expect leo to 'bring back the team' so to speak, i felt like yelling at him get off your fat rat @$$ and you do it!!!!

New appreciation for his brothers. Maybe.

Because like I said above, their training is most effective for ALL of them when they do it "together". Without his brothers, Leonardo would be nothing, same goes for the other turtles; without each other, they'd be nothing. They've all helped make each other who they are.

See above. I think that would help Leo appreciate that.

And maybe if we could all think of the TMNT as individuals for a moment here, training on his own was for Leonardo, not the TMNT.

[triplexxx]

If Leonardo can train on his own, any of them could. Where they do so is irrelevant. They're all excellent warriors, they're all self-sufficient, and they all have survival skills. Anyway, it's useless unless they train together, as this movie showed.

[Warhorse]

Okay

Splinter sets Leonardo about tryint to pull the team back together: The rooftop training, going out to look for Raph. Basically it's the results of that scene in Splinter's room where he and Leo reunite. You know "I'm sure things will be back to normal Sensi."

As for the "Not a good idea" part, maye Raph, or even Leo, or any of the four of them could have said something along those lines: why one of the family and one of the team shouldn't have gone off to South America. If Splinter's getting no objections he's not really going to reconsider a plan that sounds good on paper. And for their to be ojections we have to assume the TMNT thought about the potential danger there.

And your hardly coming off as niave at all.

You know what. Your phrase just gave me a huge brain storm. If they were to generate a sequel, and I know how we would love to see the City at War arc, but that aside, why not have Splinter send all of his sons out on some sort of quest to find them selves out in the world, but in a team like setting? Kind of like the ninja tribunal thing is about. (To be honest, that would have been a killer story for this movie as well, have them all go out to become stronger and more independent, learning new techniques on their own away from his guidence and councel.)

Just a thought.

[triplexxx]

Well, that sounds perfect, just gotta hope they make Splinter a bit smarter "upstairs" next movie, kiddin (not about your idea). But still, it'd make an intriguing story, and it could be somewhat different/unique/new from what they've done before in the cartoons and previous movies. It's always nice to expand horizons.

[Time Mistress]

Cool idea, Warhorse. Maybe we could see the TMNT battle the Karai & the Foot, but in Japan where her HQ is.

The Raph discussion seems to be going well, who wants to start that one for Donatello next?

[Warhorse]

Cool idea, Warhorse. Maybe we could see the TMNT battle the Karai & the Foot, but in Japan where her HQ is.

The Raph discussion seems to be going well, who wants to start that one for Donatello next?

You can. I find Donatello to be the most under-appreciated Turtle. I also find him the one Turtle we really dont know much about. Or at least I dont know much about.

[Scandia]

I will! I woke up early- must have been for a reason :)

[jenna]

The following was said to sum up Logan, but I think it applies just as well to the contradictions of Raphael on most counts:

"Super hero and outlaw. Moral philosopher and psychotic. Loner and family man. A protector of society who feels ill at ease with it. A breaker of rules who binds himself to a code of honor. (World famous adventurer who hides behind a false identity.) Savage killer of criminals and kind friend to children. Beast and man. In one person."



Oh wow! You are absolutely right - that could have been written about Raph! It's perfect. And you're right - Raph is a condradiction in himself really - like that line in Taxi Driver: Partly truth, partly fiction, a walking contradiction."

[ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael]

I guess I should post something serious about my favorite character ever.

I love Raph's strong sense of justice. He knows he can never truly fit in with the the public, but at the same time, he wants to protect them. I felt the same way as Raph at times, i hear about some really wrong injustices going on in the world, and I get pissed cause I can't do anything about ti. I've felt his pain.

I love the fact that Kevin and Peter have managed to turn Raph into more than just some Wolverine clone.

[Sewer Bull]

What I don't get is, why is it that in every one of Raph's future incartnations, he's missing an eye?

Because it makes him so bad-ass.

[Buslady]

makes him look badass maybe but i never cared for the missing eye thing...

he keeps his eyes in my ficcies...

[Warhorse]

makes him look badass maybe but i never cared for the missing eye thing.

Same here. Just another reason why I avoid the comics like the plague. I simply don'tlike what I hear, in how the stories evolve in later volumes, so I pretend they dont exist.

[Buslady]

Same here. Just another reason why I avoid the comics like the plague. I simply don'tlike what I hear, in how the stories evolve in later volumes, so I pretend they dont exist.


so far so good in the movies...he still can see with a pair of eyeballs. :lol:

[Rooish]

I was wondering. Why is Raph such a jerk and a bully at times? And do you think everything he does is forgiveable? Sometimes it annoys me that he takes out his frustration on everyone else. I think he may be the most flawed Turtle. But he is also the most well-developed, and a lot of people seem to identify with him.

[Scandia]

By nature, he has a short fuse.

Plus he is envious of his older brother and the positive attention he gets.

However, I don't think even Donatello escapes Raph's wrath.

Splinter taught Raphael better than that. But Raph seems just way too angry at times- even though I doubt that he is truly evil. Without Splinter, Raphael would be completely and totally lost.

[Buslady]

I was wondering. Why is Raph such a jerk and a bully at times? And do you think everything he does is forgiveable? Sometimes it annoys me that he takes out his frustration on everyone else. I think he may be the most flawed Turtle. But he is also the most well-developed, and a lot of people seem to identify with him.

his bullying and attitude is part of his defensive mechanism, he keeps a distance from others this way. I dont think really means to bully so bad that he causes physical harm to the target; just seriously annoy, emotionally hurt, etc. His bullying is often a sign of low esteem so he has to pick on others to make himself feel better. He's sad. Really sad.

I do wonder if love can conquer and heal his soul?

[jenna]

I have a Raph question!

I've been entertaining myself lately by reading fan fics and have read a number by different authors (Buslady, yours was one) which all describe Raph as having a fear of needles. Where does that originate? Was it in the comics?

[SassyGal]

By nature, he has a short fuse.

Plus he is envious of his older brother and the positive attention he gets.

However, I don't think even Donatello escapes Raph's wrath.

Splinter taught Raphael better than that. But Raph seems just way too angry at times- even though I doubt that he is truly evil. Without Splinter, Raphael would be completely and totally lost.

It's like you had a camera into my teen years, Scandia:lol:
I think lots of people identify with Raph in all his incarnations because so many people find themselves in his situation. I was always envious of my older sister & all the positive attention she got. I was all angsty and angry as a teen, very emo before the term existed (I am so old :P ) & I took a lot of it out my older sister & younger one, even though my parents taught me better than that and always told me I could go to them and work on channeling my anger, but I had to do it the hard way, by myself. I don't think anyone escaped my wrath between the ages of 14 & 17 in my house, but without them, especially my mom, I would have been completely lost despite the fact I just wanted them to leave me alone.
Wow. That stirred up some feelings...like maybe I should apologize to my family (again :lol: ) for being such a b***h, then write a poem about it ;)

[Scandia]

I was the eldest in my house. However, I am rebellious in some of the most bizarre ways. And I get emo and angsty at times to this day- partially due to my being envious and jealous of what other people have and I don't.

Donatello is also a middle child, yet he does not seem to be envious of Leonardo. And from what I gathered in the NT, it seems like all 4 Turtles could have tried to become the leader- that Splinter did not just give Leo and Raph the chance.

[aabxx]

Raphael is so desperate to lead that he in volume 3 actually started leading the foot. Which came at the expense of his relationship with his brothers and Splinter,

Don and Mike couldn't work with Raph as the leader. He doesn't have the "big brother" dynamic going with them like Leo does and while they admire his fighting skills, he's no Leo when it comes to ninjitsu and the art of war. Everything leads to Leo being the leader, really. Raphael never stood a chance if you ask me.

But it's a great responsibility. And I think Don and Mike both find a lot of comfort in Leo's leadership. Leo's their edge, really... he instills in them a lot of confidence as it's no coincidence that he's lead them out alive against the odds time and time again. Leo's a fantastic leader and Don and Mike recognize and appreciate this. And they easily submit to him.

Raphael knows all too well that Leo's a brilliant leader too but he doesn't look up to him in the same way as his brothers because he has difficulties submitting to anyone, because he fought for and lost out in the right to lead early on and because he's way too competitive towards him (which his other brothers are not). And he probably also objects to Leo's leadership because he feels his input isn't appreciated enough by Leo and the rest of the group, who view him as a bit of a hothead who doesn't think through his decisions often enough. And knowing he's not the leader, he lets his ego cloud his judgement and sometimes goes so far as to do the opposite of what Leo says just to oppose him, or because he wants to impress the group.

Contrast that to Don, who makes an excellent number two. Leo listens to Don because he knows Don is a genius, and this makes Don feel appreciated because being the genius, he couldn't follow a leader who wouldn't be willing to listen to his rational input. And then we have Mikey who plays out the "little brother" role. Ninja stuff is pretty serious stuff and Mikey would probably rather not think too much about it and just simply follow orders. To quote Splinter talking to Mikey: "The way of the warrior has found acceptance and lives in your brothers but for you it is not so easy." This is probably why Mikey doesn't get too involved with the group's battle tactics... he's not ruthless enough and this makes him uncertain and indecicive, which you cannot be when you're planning a strategy. This is also evident in the new movie when Leo's captured, and you see Raphael, Don and Splinter working together to organize the rescue while Mike's all "so what do we do now?".

[jenna]

I have a Raph question!

I've been entertaining myself lately by reading fan fics and have read a number by different authors (Buslady, yours was one) which all describe Raph as having a fear of needles. Where does that originate? Was it in the comics?

Hey guys - can anyone shed some light on this? (sorry, I know I'm impatient...)

[Warhorse]

Hey guys - can anyone shed some light on this? (sorry, I know I'm impatient...)

Hey, he hates bugs too. Remember!:lol:

[Buslady]

I have a Raph question!

I've been entertaining myself lately by reading fan fics and have read a number by different authors (Buslady, yours was one) which all describe Raph as having a fear of needles. Where does that originate? Was it in the comics?

This element IS canon. I can't spout out the issue, story or whatever but it is canon.

[jenna]

Hey, he hates bugs too. Remember!:lol:

I know, bless! I can relate - I'm scared of bugs too. I love the 2k3 episode April's Artifact where he is terrified off insects. It's so funny, because he is portrayed as being so tough in 2k3!

This element IS canon. I can't spout out the issue, story or whatever but it is canon.

Thanks for clearing that up for me. If anyone knows where the fear originated I'd like to know.

[triplexxx]

I know, bless! I can relate - I'm scared of bugs too. I love the 2k3 episode April's Artifact where he is terrified off insects. It's so funny, because he is portrayed as being so tough in 2k3!
Then how did he have the guts to stand up to that queen hornet at the end? He's not "scared" of bugs. They just severly annoy him, as do a lot of things. There's a difference between being annoyed by something and being scared of it.

[jenna]

Then how did he have the guts to stand up to that queen hornet at the end? He's not "scared" of bugs. They just severly annoy him, as do a lot of things. There's a difference between being annoyed by something and being scared of it.

He can stand up to anything. When I say scared I don't mean runs screaming away like I do. (yes, folks, it's true - I'm a wuss) - but he did panic when Mike teased him telling him there was a bug on his back and April teased him for being "afraid". But he is a really brave fighter and faces it.

[Warhorse]

Thanks for clearing that up for me. If anyone knows where the fear originated I'd like to know.

Maybe Don did some sort of experiment on Raph when they were younger, and it didn't go so well, and perhaps this is how Raph got his fear of needles.

[Raven]

Am I the only one thats supised that those Raphgirl twins havent come here yet and started yelling at every saying "stay away from raph, raph is mine and mine alone."


Eh any way I always found raph to be an interesting character and at times the most fun to draw because of his more agressive side that he lets out. I always like the stories that revolved around leo and raph fighting over the leader postion.
I think out of all the turtles Raph has also had the most progression then the others in terms of what we have seen, we've seen him try to deal with his anger for expample in the new movie.

[jenna]

Maybe Don did some sort of experiment on Raph when they were younger, and it didn't go so well, and perhaps this is how Raph got his fear of needles.


:lol: :lol: I can just imagine Don: "OK, Bro - hold still!!"

Am I the only one thats supised that those Raphgirl twins havent come here yet and started yelling at every saying "stay away from raph, raph is mine and mine alone."



Nope. I'm just waiting for this fun thread to be ruined by it.

[Scandia]

I'm watching the Mona Lisa episode now. I had never watched it before. Mona Lisa is not a turtle- she looks more like a lizard or salamander. Long tail, no shell.

For some reason, in this 4th season, the two Raphael episodes are close together and early on. Only Michelangelo got an earlier spotlight episode. I wonder how popular OT Raphael was among the audience.

[SassyGal]

OT Raph will always hold a special place in my heart because he taught me the important art of sarcasm :lol:

I don't remember him being the most popular when I was growing up. I seem to remember Leonardo & Michelangelo being the most popular.

[Scandia]

Leonardo was not all that popular- other than perhaps by his being first one you could pick in the video game.

Some of my classmates liked Donatello best due to his purple bandanna. Purple may be my fave color now- but I do not think it had gotten to that level back then.

[ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael]

I was looking at Raph's profile on Wikipedia, and I was upset to find that the lenghty description of Raph's portrayal and role in the 2007 movie was completley removed. Which sucks becasue it was very well written. If the person who wrote that is on the forums, I just watend to bring that to their attention.

[Sonic x 20]

I love Raphael and he's cool, very hotheaded and very strong as well!! He's the one with the depest emotions which does set him apart from him brothers of how they are. He may argue here and there with his brothers, but he is protective of them when the situation calls for it. Get on this turtles bad side and you'll wish that you never met him. 8) 8)

[jenna]

I was looking at Raph's profile on Wikipedia, and I was upset to find that the lenghty description of Raph's portrayal and role in the 2007 movie was completley removed. Which sucks becasue it was very well written. If the person who wrote that is on the forums, I just watend to bring that to their attention.

That is a shame. 2007 Raph is one of his best portrayals. It's a shame it's not used. I liked what it said.

[Warhorse]

That is a shame. 2007 Raph is one of his best portrayals. It's a shame it's not used. I liked what it said.

I just looked on the wikipedia site. The other three Turtles still have their 2007 movie description up, but no Raph. Seems some anti Raph fan didn't like the positive outlook it gave Raph.

Why doesn't somebody put another 2007 description of Raph on wikipedia?

[NightwatchersOnlygirl]

My Raphael can be firendly when he wants to

[Buslady]

I was looking at Raph's profile on Wikipedia, and I was upset to find that the lenghty description of Raph's portrayal and role in the 2007 movie was completley removed. Which sucks becasue it was very well written. If the person who wrote that is on the forums, I just watend to bring that to their attention.


that sucks :( i'd have liked to have read it

[ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael]

That is a shame. 2007 Raph is one of his best portrayals. It's a shame it's not used. I liked what it said.

The irony is, Leo, Mikey, and Don's weren't even touched.

[jenna]

The irony is, Leo, Mikey, and Don's weren't even touched.

And Mike's was the one that was seriously unsourced - saying that he is let down by Raph in the movie when he finds out he was the nightwatcher. :ohwell:

[RaphaelsOnlyGirl]

My Raph does have a sensitive side.

[NightwatchersOnlygirl]

No not your Raph but my Raph

[jenna]

Am I the only one thats supised that those Raphgirl twins havent come here yet and started yelling at every saying "stay away from raph, raph is mine and mine alone."





Nope. I'm just waiting for this fun thread to be ruined by it.

This thread is supposed to be an interesting discussion about a character analysis.

This:

My Raph does have a sensitive side.

No not your Raph but my Raph

is just the kind of sh*t that will ruin the discussion and have the thread locked because of your arguing over who has possession of a fictional character (who by the way is decidedly unhuman). Please don't ruin this thread like you have ruined so many others. Some of us actually want to maintain a thoughtful discussion that has some intelligence.

[RaphaelsOnlyGirl]

No not your Raph but my Raph

No I said my Raph.

[NightwatchersOnlygirl]

Raphael Is Mine and so Is the Nightwatcher

[RaphaelsOnlyGirl]

Raphael Is Mine and so Is the Nightwatcher

You think so huh.

[Cascadia]

Ladies, knock it off. this would only cause this thread to be locked. There are some of us that would like to have an intelligent discussion about Raphael in all of the TMNT universes.

[RaphaelsOnlyGirl]

Ok, back on subject, my favorite Raphael out of all of them is the one from the new movie.

[jenna]

Ladies, knock it off. this would only cause this thread to be locked. There are some of us that would like to have an intelligent discussion about Raphael in all of the TMNT universes.

Yeah, agreed. It's not funny. It's not clever. As far as I'm concerned this thread has not run its course yet and there is still a lot to say. You'll get it locked if you keep spamming like this and it's beginning to really p*ss people off.

[iris]

I was looking at Raph's profile on Wikipedia, and I was upset to find that the lenghty description of Raph's portrayal and role in the 2007 movie was completley removed. Which sucks becasue it was very well written. If the person who wrote that is on the forums, I just watend to bring that to their attention.
Are you talking about this (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Raphael_%28TMNT%29&oldid=129424606)? (scroll to the movie section)

Also, it's Wikipedia... anyone can edit it. Most of the people on this board are exceedingly qualified to edit the TMNT entries. You can also restore things that were deleted, although it may need to be hashed out on the Disucssion page.

[Warhorse]

Yeah, agreed. It's not funny. It's not clever. As far as I'm concerned this thread has not run its course yet and there is still a lot to say. You'll get it locked if you keep spamming like this and it's beginning to really p*ss people off.

I dont think it's fair to lock up a thread because of two immature people. Maybe it would be healthier to give certain individuals some time out.:roll:

As for the wiki incident, how does one add stuff onto it, and why would someone delete Raph's 2007 movie discription, but not touch the other three?

[jenna]

Are you talking about this (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Raphael_%28TMNT%29&oldid=129424606)? (scroll to the movie section)

Also, it's Wikipedia... anyone can edit it. Most of the people on this board are exceedingly qualified to edit the TMNT entries. You can also restore things that were deleted, although it may need to be hashed out on the Disucssion page.

Yeah, that's the text. Is it back?? Sorry, just saw you changed it to a link. It's not gone. Woohoo!

[iris]

No, that's the archived page. Why'd they change it? Who knows. Maybe they thought thought it needed sources. Maybe they thought there were too many spoilers.

[jenna]

No, that's the archived page. Why'd they change it? Who knows. Maybe they thought thought it needed sources. Maybe they thought there were too many spoilers.

Oh. That's a shame. I liked that evaluation - it showed Raphael in a more sympathetic light.

[Buslady]

ugh as usual an incorrect description of sai:
Unlike his sai, the manriki are typically not lethal weapons,

Sai are not lethal!!

some bonehead erased all my stuff about tmnt 1!

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

It's restored at Wikipedia now. The one who removed was toold to not replace Wikipedia pages or sections with blank content, as he did.

[ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael]

Wikipedia is a strange and disturbing world.

[Warhorse]

It's restored at Wikipedia now. The one who removed was toold to not replace Wikipedia pages or sections with blank content, as he did.

How does one find who adds, edits or removes content from wikipdia.

[RaphaelsOnlyGirl]

I dont think it's fair to lock up a thread because of two immature people. Maybe it would be healthier to give certain individuals some time out.:roll:

As for the wiki incident, how does one add stuff onto it, and why would someone delete Raph's 2007 movie discription, but not touch the other three?

I'm not immature. You don't even know me. I'm just tired of her going around saying Raph is hers.

You and the others can get back to your happy chating now.

~Raph's girlfriend~

[SassyGal]

:roll:
OMG, aren't there enough different incarnations of Raph for all of you to share? Yes you can love him, but everyone's just asking that you rise above the obvious baiting and join in with relevant material. If you love Raph, then you probably have more you can say about him besides constantly defending your "love". Let's hear something new from you guys.

Anyway, back to topic...I am happy to hear that Raph's info's back on Wiki so I can read it :D

[Buslady]

yeah I can share. There are what...a gazillion incarnations of our hero in red.
I'll take TMNT1 Raph. And you two girls can fight over your versions. LOL!!!!

[SassyGal]

yeah I can share. There are what...a gazillion incarnations of our hero in red.
I'll take TMNT1 Raph. And you two girls can fight over your versions. LOL!!!!

You rock Buslady! I knew you would share :) It's those other two, I'm not so sure about :lol:

And just so everyone knows, I was not talking about Buslady. Her love is healthy!

[Buslady]

You rock Buslady! I knew you would share :) It's those other two, I'm not so sure about :lol:

And just so everyone knows, I was not talking about Buslady. Her love is healthy!
:lol: :lol:
Well, being that the 1990 Raph is my first love it's only natural he would be the one I'd take. The other two can fight over 2007 Raph...it seems they both like him. I like him alot but 1990 version to me seems more mature.
I even changed my avvie to fit my Raph. I wish I could see what he looks like without the bandana but I know the masks were molded into the headpiece so the cloth wout fit better around it.

[Cascadia]

Throughout all of the different TMNT universes, there are many different types of Raphael. As Buslady pointed out, the 1990 movie Raph had a different personality/attitude than the one in the recent movie. Buslady, I still love your signature. :lol: :lol:

[SassyGal]

:lol: :lol:
Well, being that the 1990 Raph is my first love it's only natural he would be the one I'd take. The other two can fight over 2007 Raph...it seems they both like him. I like him alot but 1990 version to me seems more mature.
I even changed my avvie to fit my Raph. I wish I could see what he looks like without the bandana but I know the masks were molded into the headpiece so the cloth wout fit better around it.

Well said Buslady! I like OT Raph because that was my first exposure to TMNT, but the 1990 movie Raph is a close second for me :D

However, I am still in love with your 2007 movie sig!!

[Buslady]

yeah well the sig...hehe...it was too irrisistable not to make. :)

[iris]

Tsk... don't y'all know about Raphael?

Any other day, you'd call and he'd say, "Baby, how's your day?" But today, it ain't the same. Every other word is, "aha," "yeah," "ok"... could it be that he's at the lair with another lady? If he takes it there, first of all let me say you're not the kind to sit around and be played. I know he says that you're "assuming things," but somethin's going down; that's the way it seems.



lol... title of this thread just took on a new meaning

[Buslady]

Tsk... don't y'all know about Raphael?

Any other day, you'd call and he'd say, "Baby, how's your day?" But today, it ain't the same. Every other word is, "aha," "yeah," "ok"... could it be that he's at the lair with another lady? If he takes it there, first of all let me say you're not the kind to sit around and be played. I know he says that you're "assuming things," but somethin's going down; that's the way it seems.



lol... title of this thread just took on a new meaning

:lol: :lol:
I'd hope he wasn't a two timer...omg...his brothers would kick his butt if he was!! heehehehe

[Ava Collier]

XD He might try to coerce them into helping.

"Don, Mikey, put on these red bandanas..."

"But...why?"

"There will be girls."

"Uhh...OKAY!"

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[SassyGal]

XD He might try to coerce them into helping.

"Don, Mikey, put on these red bandanas..."

"But...why?"

"There will be girls."

"Uhh...OKAY!"

:lol: :lol: :lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol:
That was so awesome!

[Scandia]

I wonder why was Raph chosen to be the most inconsistent Turtle. All four of them are multidimensional. None of them are cardboard cutout characters.

[Buslady]

I wonder why was Raph chosen to be the most inconsistent Turtle. All four of them are multidimensional. None of them are cardboard cutout characters.

what with all the different versions of him?

who knows?

[Spawn Guy]

I wonder why was Raph chosen to be the most inconsistent Turtle. All four of them are multidimensional. None of them are cardboard cutout characters.

Ouch.

I'd prepare to have that to fight for that point of view. Alongside your life.

[Coola Yagami]

They also chose Raph to keep the original Mirage colored bandana and change the colors of the other 3.

[Buslady]

that's cos red looked best on him lol!

[Ava Collier]

Red is the color of passion, and rage.


...duh.

[Buslady]

Red is the color of passion, and rage.


...duh.

yeah but i doubt thats why he kept red, in the old toon he wasn't his normal pissy, angry self....

he still looks best in red hahahaaha

[Spawn Guy]

"I'm red because my sarcasm hurts you so much, you will actually hurt yourself to feel some other kind of sensation."

[Scandia]

In the OT he still had the shortest temper of the four. And he was very sarcastic and cynical. And he was the one flinging the insults and snark the most.

Seems pretty suitable to keep him as the red one indeed. As compared to the spiritual one, the intuitive one, or the hungry one.

[RaphaelsOnlyGirl]

Red definitely suits Raph's temperament a lot.

[NightwatchersOnlygirl]

I know about Raphael liking red

[tOkKa]

-->> ..o gawd i love red..

..o gaw yes.. of all the Turtles i wish to eat .. i deffly ' eat Raph first ..

.. i'm sure he's got the leanest meat n'lowest sodium count.. but real hearty too ..


ah h3ll that wouldn't be a Soup..

it'd be freekin' STEW ~~!~!


http://www.davidplattartist.co.uk/turtle-soup.jpg


..Ok.. hang on .. i'll go get the Crack-pot..


..i mean Crock-Pot..

Buslady can keep an eye on the Raphael Stew..

but i get to gorge on all'of it..


the rest o yas just get oyster crackers ..


gaw i'm ssooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo hungry..

When we eat ?!
http://www.terrible2z.com/coleco-wh0rehouse/sewer/tokka-yapyap.gif

[Scandia]

I wish Mirage had started using the multicolored bandannas after the OT began doing so. Mirage was still early on enough to incorporate them.

[Warhorse]

I wish Mirage had started using the multicolored bandannas after the OT began doing so. Mirage was still early on enough to incorporate them.

The different colored bandanas wouldn't make any difference in the Mirage comics, they are in black and white. They could have been pink and lime green, and still wouldn;t have made any visual difference.

But with Mirage being black and white is the number one turn off for me from reading and enjoying the comic books. I like color in my life!

[tOkKa]

I wish Mirage had started using the multicolored bandannas after the OT began doing so. Mirage was still early on enough to incorporate them.

-->> ..that's Turtle G U M B O ..

http://www.terrible2z.com/coleco-wh0rehouse/sewer/lhead-owe.gif

[Buslady]

:lol: :lol: You're silly Tokkie :lol: :lol:


-->> ..o gawd i love red..

..o gaw yes.. of all the Turtles i wish to eat .. i deffly ' eat Raph first ..

.. i'm sure he's got the leanest meat n'lowest sodium count.. but real hearty too ..


ah h3ll that wouldn't be a Soup..

it'd be freekin' STEW ~~!~!


http://www.davidplattartist.co.uk/turtle-soup.jpg


..Ok.. hang on .. i'll go get the Crack-pot..


..i mean Crock-Pot..

Buslady can keep an eye on the Raphael Stew..

but i get to gorge on all'of it..


the rest o yas just get oyster crackers ..


gaw i'm ssooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo hungry..

When we eat ?!
http://www.terrible2z.com/coleco-wh0rehouse/sewer/tokka-yapyap.gif