President Bishop

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

So, does anyone have an idea as to where Fast Forward is going by having Bishop be the President of the Pan-Galactic Council?

At first, I thought he’d secretly be in league with Sh’Okanabo, and provide the Turtles’ DNA for cloning the Dark Turtles, but Sh’Okanabo obtained their DNA on his own in “Night of Sh’Okanabo!” Also, Bishop has always fought against the aliens. Even though he’s a villain, I seriously doubt he’d be helping Sh’Okanabo assimilate Earth’s population into those funky Kanabo drone creatures.

On one hand, I don’t think the last six episodes of FF will have enough time to do justice to an evil President Bishop. On the other hand, I'm skeptical of Bishop’s statement that he’s turned from his former ways. Bishop has to have SOME kind of ace up his sleeve.

But maybe I'm totally wrong—maybe this is just another FF disappointment, promising far more than it delivers.

Opinions, everyone?

[Spawn Guy]

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos!

[The Terror of Death]

I have a strong feeling that he really has gone legit. Trust me, if he was evil the writers would have given us a hint already. They may have planned for him to reveal his true colors in season 2 but in season one he is a definite good guy.

I dont know why they chose to make this decision but it really bugs me. If the guys return to the present things are going to get weird.

[ToTheNines]

I think it was a dumb idea. Now if we ever wake up from the terrible nightmare that is FF, Bishop won't make much of a baddie. Also, why the heck has he only appeared once? You'd think they would get him a little bit more involved...

[odupianist]

if he was evil the writers would have given us a hint already.

Agreed

If the guys return to the present things are going to get weird.

Yes and no. They could return to the present and the future could end up changing because they know what the future will be like (Back to the Future-esque sort of). But if you think of it that that is how the future pans out, here's out I see it.

Bishop: Now I will destroy you all, I have you right where I want you.
TMNT: Oh, hey Bishop, how's it going buddy? oh yeah, you're against us now. Duh, it's in the future you're a decent guy. Hmm so if we kick your butt now, do you still become a good guy in the future? What if we don't kick your butt now, will yo ustay a bad guy? Hmm, can we have a time out so we can think about this?

[CyberCubed]

You guys are assuming Bishop would have a major role if the Turtles return to the present. It seems to me that Season 4 was about as much as you can do with Bishop, and since we know he never "dies" since he's in FF, there's really not much more you can do with him.

[ZariusTwo]

I agree, Bishop's role in FF is more of a "coda" to the character, with his arc from "ruthless agent motivated by national security" to "ruthless agent understanding more of the Turtles and their contribution to global preservation" played out in the last two seasons.

[Revan]

The turtles are no longer a threat to Bishop because there are hundreds of aliens living on Earth in 2105 anyway. The turtles are no longer freaks so Bishop has no reason to want them. IMO

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

But Bishop CAN'T become a good guy!! He's the most kick-butt villian TMNT 2003 has ever had! Heck, he even beats The Shredder! BOTH Shredders!! :cry:

Our only hope is for "Head of State" to show Bishop as having some dark motive. Or at least trying to shellack one of the Turtles.

[Revan]

But Bishop CAN'T become a good guy!! He's the most kick-butt villian TMNT 2003 has ever had! Heck, he even beats The Shredder! BOTH Shredders!! :cry:

Our only hope is for "Head of State" to show Bishop as having some dark motive. Or at least trying to shellack one of the Turtles.

I just can't see his motivation to destroy the turtles unless it's out of pure spite now that Earth has been settled by aliens from all over.

[kerfootw]

I agree! This is a real mess. They should've done another episode with him to fill us in...are you guys sure he's not Torbin Ziixx? I'd say it's possible.

P.S. Just turned 21 today. See ya'll later.

[Revan]

are you guys sure he's not Torbin Ziixx? I'd say it's possible.

Ha or Darius! Isn't Darius's VA the same guy to does Bishop?

[Spawn Guy]

Maybe he's taken kind of an Abe Lincon approach to the whole aliens on Earth thing. "Okay, your here, I need man power, away we go." Ironic considering I recall Bishop being a member of the confdiracy. But anyway, point is his reasoning probably isn't all that angelic; aliens living on Earth are less likely to write home saying "Dear Ma, dear Pa, come invade! They've got beaches and cars and BBQ's and stuff! It'll be fun!"

Not the parinoid loose cannon we knew, but not that far from paroniod either.

[The Terror of Death]

Maybe he's taken kind of an Abe Lincon approach to the whole aliens on Earth thing.

Its funny you should say that considering how Abe Lincon is actually an alien in the new toon.

[gobo]

You know why they had him be a Confederate? O_o Perfect way to give reason to his prejudice views (i.e. the fact that he took forever to realize the Turtles had the same goals as him all along just because they aren't human). When we saw him at the end of The Lost Season, that was probably when he started understanding that maybe not all non-human sentient beings are a waste of intelligence. We don't know if or how many more times the Turtles had to prove themselves to him in the full lives they apparently led in that reality in spite of them being whisked away to the future with no certainty of returning to their time. :roll:

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

What do you mean, Abe Lincoln's an alien in 2K3? WTH?

Actually, I think Darius is connected to Hun. Hun, Dun. Very close. Same huge giant body, too. Just a thought.

Bishop as Zixx? I sure as heck hope not. That would be crap.

As for Bishop realizing the TMNT are allies, I hope that doesn't happen until season 10. Bishop is evil. He needs to STAY evil. (I'd like it better if Karai stayed evil, too. :evilgrin: )

[Spawn Guy]

Perfect way to give reason to his prejudice views (i.e. the fact that he took forever to realize the Turtles had the same goals as him all along just because they aren't human). When we saw him at the end of The Lost Season, that was probably when he started understanding that maybe not all non-human sentient beings are a waste of intelligence.

Yes, their a handy work force he can keep an eye on.

[The Terror of Death]

What do you mean, Abe Lincoln's an alien in 2K3? WTH?

I was like WTH too when I found it. But its true hes an utrom.

And you guys are write about the Bishop thing. His story cant really go any further. The problem is that its the same thing for Hun and Karai. If the turtles return to the past they need a new main villian. Hopefully its slashur but that might be hoping for too much.

[Spawn Guy]

I was like WTH too when I found it. But its true hes an utrom.

Evidence? Because I'm pretty sure I'd remember something like that. As a matter of fact, I can't recall Lincon coming up in the show...at all.

If that's true, he's probably adressing the whole of humanity with the whole "Your race suffers greatly, many of them by living among us, while ours suffers from your presence. If this is admitted, it affords a reason why we should be separated." thing. Asshole hypocrite aliens.

[The Terror of Death]

Evidence? Because I'm pretty sure I'd remember something like that. As a matter of fact, I can't recall Lincon coming up in the show...at all.

Could someone help me out because I dont have the software to put the clip up. But dont worry Spawn Guy I might be able to find it on youtube.

[Spawn Guy]

Or could just tell me what your talking about. Okay, so it's a scene in the show. What happens?

[The Terror of Death]

Its not a scene from an episode its actually one of those short clips they made in season one. They showed some of them on the Foxbox. I dont know if you remember but they were quick bios on most of the main 2k3 characters. It was done by the animators so its not one of those poorly drawn 4kids commercials. In the utrom clip the utroms are basically talking about themselves. One scene showed Abe as an utrom. The mutant nightmare game is the only place where I think you can still look at it.

[gobo]

Only place I ever saw it. :ohwell:

[The Terror of Death]

Only place I ever saw it. :ohwell:

I didnt watch the turtles that much when it aired on the foxbox so I dont know if they showed the utrom clip. I did see the april and raph clips though.

[Coola Yagami]

It could lead to a final episode and a major dilemna for the turtles. I mean, c'mon, it's genuis writing. Bishop with some huge master plan, the Turtles gotta stop him, but they're confused and can't kill him cause they know he's gonna be a good guy in the future. Hell, throw Karai into the mix, out to kill him too and have the turtles try to stop her without even knowing why they have to save him in the first place. It's the kind of deep mental dilemna comics go for. It should be a hell of a ride for a cartoon.

[Revan]

It could lead to a final episode and a major dilemna for the turtles. I mean, c'mon, it's genuis writing. Bishop with some huge master plan, the Turtles gotta stop him, but they're confused and can't kill him cause they know he's gonna be a good guy in the future. Hell, throw Karai into the mix, out to kill him too and have the turtles try to stop her without even knowing why they have to save him in the first place. It's the kind of deep mental dilemna comics go for. It should be a hell of a ride for a cartoon.

The dilema might work except Bishop allied himself with the turtles in the two final episodes of season 5 TLS so perhaps there is no more beef there since the turtles and Bishop fight for a similar cause.

[odupianist]

The dilema might work except Bishop allied himself with the turtles in the two final episodes of season 5 TLS so perhaps there is no more beef there since the turtles and Bishop fight for a similar cause.

Yeah I've heard that before, with Karai.

I think the Bishop being Zixx thing could play out interesting. Think about it. He said he couldn't interfere as pres, but as this notorious Zixx, it's quite possible

[The Terror of Death]

I think the Bishop being Zixx thing could play out interesting. Think about it. He said he couldn't interfere as pres, but as this notorious Zixx, it's quite possible

Zixx and Bishop are just way too different. And Bishop asking the turtles to stop Zixx would not make any sense at all.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Exactly.

Bishop: Okay, what'll I do today? I'll try to smuggle something onto Earth for that weird shadow freak. Oh, and I'll hire those pesky Turtles to stop me while I'm at it.

But hey, Coola Yagami's idea kicks butt. :o Hope the writers use it!

[ZariusTwo]

They won't, FF is finished, it was finished before this idea was implemented, it was finished before these comparisons were made, and presumbly, it's finished with a little saner and sensical plot twist than the one discussed.

[The Terror of Death]

They won't, FF is finished, it was finished before this idea was implemented, it was finished before these comparisons were made, and presumbly, it's finished with a little saner and sensical plot twist than the one discussed.

I could be wrong but I think it was finished 05 or early 06 so its not like any of us thought these ideas would actually happen. It was just one of those "wouldnt it be cool if" type of things.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

I'm wondering if Renet will show up in the last FF episode and send the boys back to the 21st century.

At first I would've bet the farm on it, but since the time window being repaired in "Timing Is Everything," I'm not sure.

[Tora_Chan]

Or could just tell me what your talking about. Okay, so it's a scene in the show. What happens?

It's not actually in the show, but in those little extra clips you can unlock in TMNT 3: Mutant Nightmare. The utrom one is about how they're among us, as neighbors, friends and leaders. And when they mention leaders, they show Lincoln with the glowy eyes.

[kerfootw]

Check my latest reply in the good news/bad news thread. It's a summary of both "Race of Glory" and the following episode consisting of Bishop and Stockman. And the "Fast Forward on Demand" thread of course.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

It's offical: Bishop is a good guy.

Sniff... the end of an era... :cry:

[The Terror of Death]

It's offical: Bishop is a good guy.

Sniff... the end of an era... :cry:

The intro to FF kind of gave it away so its not like no one saw this coming. And Bishop to Knight was an even bigger indication that he had gone legit.

But I agree, it is a sad thing. Bishop was my favorite 2k3 villian so I wanted him to remain a bad guy.

[ZariusTwo]

It's like Parralax from Green Lantern, one of the best "hero to villain" roles ever, and they retconned it and axed Kyle Rayner from his role just to bring back Jordan as a victim and a hero all over again

I don't like Rayner, but he had a young fanbase, and they drove that audience or forced them to accept an older character in the role. Iron Man right now is another great choice for a villain, but you know after "World War Hulk", he'll be allying with Spidey like nothing happened.

Characters like Bishop need to be asses, it's what makes shows different and evovling, not "safe", but sadly that's all FF is, "safe"

[VaughnMichael]

It's like Parralax from Green Lantern, one of the best "hero to villain" roles ever, and they retconned it and axed Kyle Rayner from his role just to bring back Jordan as a victim and a hero all over again

I don't like Rayner, but he had a young fanbase, and they drove that audience or forced them to accept an older character in the role. Iron Man right now is another great choice for a villain, but you know after "World War Hulk", he'll be allying with Spidey like nothing happened.

Characters like Bishop need to be asses, it's what makes shows different and evovling, not "safe", but sadly that's all FF is, "safe"
it's hardly safe when torbin zixx tricked the damn turtles into smuggling bomb parts to faker aliens who plan to destroy the triceratons or has that one slipped your mind?
I still like bishop either way good or bad and he still kicks major ass! And I can see why people want him to be a villian but saying they're playing it safe by making past villians have happy endings and changing is hardly keeping it safe its moving the show and story along evolving it further...if they where indeed playing the safe card bishop would be the same men in black ripp off he always was.

[Spitfire]

Characters like Bishop need to be asses, it's what makes shows different and evovling, not "safe", but sadly that's all FF is, "safe"

Do you watch the show? I mean really, or do you just make ignorant comments about it? If the show as playing it safe Darius wouldn't be trying to murder his Nephew.

[odupianist]

did I miss something? how did it become official? and we all have to remember, if we follow the Back to the Future thought on time, this can all still change. The TMNT can go back with their knowledge of the future and Bishop can remain a bad guy and not change.

[The Terror of Death]

did I miss something? how did it become official? and we all have to remember, if we follow the Back to the Future thought on time, this can all still change. The TMNT can go back with their knowledge of the future and Bishop can remain a bad guy and not change.

No. Thats just plain horrible thinking. Why would the 2k3 writers have to follow the time theory of a movie that came out years ago? If they were going to make him a bad guy in season 7 there would be no reason to put him in Fast Forward. He doesnt really play a big part in FF so they could have easily made different storys if they wanted him to remain a villian. We might see him a few times in season 7 and he will probably still be a bad guy (according to Bishop to Knight) but he wont be posing the same threat he has in previous seasons.

And I want to put in some input about the "safe" thing. I think we can all agree that FF is slightly "safer" than 2k3 due to Playmates telling the guys to make it "lighter and funnier" but it too has some dark themes from to time. But the kind of "safe" Zarius is talking about is a ignorant view on things. Even before Playmates intervened with the "lighter and funnier thing" who is to say the writers had not always planned to make Bishop a good guy?
Playmates did not force them to put Bishop in FF. He could have remained in the present like all the other villians.

I will say that the writers might be playing it safe a little because not many human villians die. We see alot of aliens, monsters, and demons die but I dont think they have ever shown a recurring human foe die. I am not saying it needs to happen but it would be nice to see the turtles kill someone like Hun onscreen. (Well, it would be nice for me anyway)

[creativerealms82]

I have never seen Bishop as a villain. An Antaginist yes but not a villain. For he is never protrayed as evil or really all that villainus. Ok there was that fake alien invasion wbut even that was so he could continue being a good guy.

I have always seen Bishop as a moraly ambigous man who everything he does is for the good of man kind. He is protecting humanity from what he believes is the true threat. This makes him an antaginist to the turtles but never a villain. When Bishop's fake invasion turned into a mutant outbreak Bishop was right there to fix his mistake. He realized what he had done, that he has in some ways no better then the aliens we fought agianst and tried to put a stop to it.

Now I do wish President Bishop was still underhanded, willing to do anything possible to make the world a better place. That is a problem. He does not seem like the same person who would fake an invasion just to prove his worth anymore. But really since I have never seen Bishop as evil or a villain his change really is not much or a surprise to me.

Also didn't "Head of State" actually do a decent job explaining Bishop's change more believable?

[ZariusTwo]

Do you watch the show? I mean really, or do you just make ignorant comments about it?

F*ck off Spit, FF's writing is mostly safe, what you're seeing right now is akin to changing at the last minute, gems in an ocean and empire of dirt, that's you all over is'nt it? One or two fangasms of brilliance and you think that speaks for the entire season?

[VaughnMichael]

F*ck off Spit, FF's writing is mostly safe, what you're seeing right now is akin to changing at the last minute, gems in an ocean and empire of dirt, that's you all over is'nt it? One or two fangasms of brilliance and you think that speaks for the entire season?
I sure as hell do it speaks for the entire series of peter lairds new tmnt.

[Spitfire]

F*ck off Spit, FF's writing is mostly safe, what you're seeing right now is akin to changing at the last minute, gems in an ocean and empire of dirt, that's you all over is'nt it? One or two fangasms of brilliance and you think that speaks for the entire season?

If I had "fangasms" I'd enjoy the whole series alot more then I happen to. I don't see them playing it safe I see them witting gritty story lines their forced to tone down. That's hardly playing it safe in my eyes.

Lately I've been noticing the comic adapt episodes are horrid and I'm glad their doing new stories. As I read each comic and see the episode I dislike the episode.

You want to talk playing it safe go read Return To New York and then watch the episode, oh and watch Rogue In The House so you can see them bastardize Zog.

[odupianist]

I like Zog lol.

Why would the 2k3 writers have to follow the time theory of a movie that came out years ago?

He doesnt really play a big part in FF so they could have easily made different storys if they wanted him to remain a villian.

You totally missed what I was saying. I was saying they could follow BTTF's thought on time travel and history changing. I'm saying he could still remain a villian. Head of State could end up changing and not happening or having another consequence.

[The Terror of Death]

You totally missed what I was saying. I was saying they could follow BTTF's thought on time travel and history changing. I'm saying he could still remain a villian. Head of State could end up changing and not happening or having another consequence.

I get what you are saying but trust me, Bishop not becoming President is about as likely as us seeing Ch'rell eating pizza while watching the old toon. I just cant see the writers changing the future so that the events in FF dont happen.

[gobo]

did I miss something? how did it become official? and we all have to remember, if we follow the Back to the Future thought on time, this can all still change. The TMNT can go back with their knowledge of the future and Bishop can remain a bad guy and not change.
No. Thats just plain horrible thinking. Why would the 2k3 writers have to follow the time theory of a movie that came out years ago?
My guess is: for the same reason 12 Monkees needed to. ^_^

[odupianist]

Where can I see Head of State? Has it aired already?

[gobo]

No, it's on a few cable On-Demand services. It's officially been released, but not broadcast. If you have a friend with Comcast or Cox On Demand, now might be a good time for a visit. :D There are supposed to be the remaining four put up this month, but I doubt they'd show the last one until the DVD is out, August 7th.

[odupianist]

Blast, maybe Youtube will have it. I typically wait for 4kids to have it online unless I happen to catch it on tv.