80's Cartoon Nonfans

[FoxBoxKid]

I was introduced to TMNT through the 4Kids cartoon, probably the least prolific Turtles show and since then, I've been the biggest Ninja Turtles fan I know, (outside of this forum, of course). I enjoy the IDW comics, the Mirage comics, the Nick show, the 4Kids show, the first movie, etc. That being said, the most prolific version of Ninja Turtles, the 80's cartoon, is not one in which I'm interested. I've seen a couple of episodes, but it isn't really my cup of tea. I know this forum was originally based on the 80's Turtles, but I was wondering if there were any other 80's show nonfans out there.

[Pagong]

I grew up with these cartoons, I understand why you will not like it since you grew up with the 4kids one. I'm not saying that I liked the OT more than the 4kids incarnation, but Based on my childhood experience the original toon was the reason why I got hooked with TMNT. But to agree with you, I don't think I have the patience to rewatch the old 80's show all over again.. maybe a few episodes. hehehehe.:D

[CowabungaMikey]

I really like the 1987 show just as much as all the other shows. (Okay, The Next Mutation is worse). But it's just an opinion thing I guess.

[ZariusTwo]

Still greatly prefer the OT over Next Mutation and Nick...which is odd because the original 'toon is much cornier than the Nick show, but it's fuelled by a childhood attachment, plus the characters are just more endearing, relatable and arent annoying.

[CyberCubed]

The OT's strength comes from an enjoyable main cast and villains with wacky sci-fi plots and some funny dialogue that comes out of nowhere.

It's understandable that if you grew up with the 4kids series that you would find it hard to get into the original show. But if you can I suggest you give it a chance. The episodes are what cartoons were like in the 80's and early 90's and the cheesiness actually makes it fun.

This is one of those shows where actual stupid things happening isn't bothersome and the show has some very fun episodes done on a one and done format.

[Discogod]

I grew up during the height of Turtlemania, but I never really liked the cartoon. Part of that was the awful, edited-to-hell version we got over here (having watched the uncut versions of the original episodes, they are much better), but part of it was the goofyness. I discovered the Mirage & Archie comics (not to mention the toys) before I was able to watch the cartoon, and was disappointed at how different it was from the original comics.

It does probably have the greatest theme tune of any cartoon, ever, though...

[Andrew NDB]

I was wondering if there were any other 80's show nonfans out there.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_jkNcMZVGCOw/S5fkxtqYcKI/AAAAAAAAAHc/TvIwwjBaxCI/s400/hand_raising.jpg

[ObiWanFan4life]

I like the theme song, first few seasons. But after a while, It kinda lost me during the later ones when the animation started to get sloppy and the comedy became too obnoxious. Then, later when the show started getting better, it took itself way too seriously.

[ABrown]

If you became a TMNT fan during the 4Kids series, try watching the "red sky" episodes of the original cartoon. The last three seasons, seasons 8-10, were a little closer to the 4Kids series. I loved the red sky episodes. I think that they had better animation than seasons 1-7, and the story lines were much better as well.

[Leo656]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_jkNcMZVGCOw/S5fkxtqYcKI/AAAAAAAAAHc/TvIwwjBaxCI/s400/hand_raising.jpg

He didn't ask, "Does anyone here only barely like TMNT at all except for one very specific, very niche interpretation of it." :lol:

Juuuuuust kiddin'. 8)

[CyberCubed]

Even if you didn't grow up with it I find the OT to be a fun series that you can just relax and enjoy and not have to worry about story arcs or plot twists.

It's a stress release show.

[Leo656]

Some people just can't accept silly or stupid or camp or whatever unless it was an active part of their childhood.

He-Man is another perfect example. People who didn't grow up watching it - or who did, but somehow grew up into cynical, jaded bastards anyway - just harp on all the recycled stock animation and how like four people did all the voices in the entire show, and how corny it was at times. But nobody watching it then gave a sh*t, they/we were well aware of those things even at a young age and accepted it as part of the show's charm.

Kids who grew up watching it still swear it holds up, and anyone who didn't watch it then looks at it now and declares, "How could anyone have watched this?" Same exact thing with the TMNT.

[Whatswiththeheadbands?]

I grew up during the height of Turtlemania, but I never really liked the cartoon. Part of that was the awful, edited-to-hell version we got over here (having watched the uncut versions of the original episodes, they are much better), but part of it was the goofyness.

Yeah, sometimes it sucks being a TMNT fan over here.

[ticktack]

There are differences between fans that
are not familiar with the 80's and
"I'm not fond of it". Which ones would you like to respond?
The second ones? Well, could you yourself bring your viewpoint on what was your problem with it?

[Gabriel GP]

I don't like that much of the OT either. I prefer much more the comics and the 2003 and 2012 series. But the OT certainly had its importance

[Whatswiththeheadbands?]

I do respect the 80s series. I even really liked Season 1 and 2, but after that, i just lost interest.

I suppose the reason is I prefer to watch an animated series that has story archs, as it will actually lead somewhere. I'm not really keen on Animated series that have a lot of episodes that don't lead anywhere.

This is not me bashing the 80s series. This is just me explaining why I'm not really keen on it.

Saying that, the voice acting is really good. It has very good humour in it and the animation was good for it's time. And also, the theme, you can't resist the theme. The theme is awesome.

[snake]

Early seasons are nice, red sky sucks.

[Leo656]

Love/Hate it. Loved absolutely everything about it as a kid. Now, I can watch it and love SOME of it, and some of it I can't stand, but can sit through for nostalgia.

I like it, but I'll grant a critic absolutely everything that's wrong with it, especially the dregs in the middle seasons.

And why were there TWO Don Turtelli's? We ever find that one out?

[FoxBoxKid]

There are differences between fans that
are not familiar with the 80's and
"I'm not fond of it". Which ones would you like to respond?
The second ones? Well, could you yourself bring your viewpoint on what was your problem with it?

I've only seen a couple of episodes, and I might watch more in the future, but, honestly, it was too silly for me, and I really do not enjoy episodic TV shows in general.

[Leo656]

Just curious, but how old are you? I totally agree, some episodes of that show are total groaners. But as others have said, in the 1980s, that was pretty much how cartoons were done across the board, with very, very few exceptions. It's very much a product of its time, for better and for worse.

That's why I said earlier that people who didn't grow up with some of that stuff have a harder time dealing with it now.

[CyberCubed]

I've only seen a couple of episodes, and I might watch more in the future, but, honestly, it was too silly for me, and I really do not enjoy episodic TV shows in general.

What's your definitive of silly? If you mean light hearted plots with cartoony supervillainy than that's not entirely silly.

There are some ridiculous episodes in the OT, but most of it is fairly standard action cartoon stuff.

[Aaronardo]

I think the strengths of the OT was its corniness not being too corny, if you know what I mean. And with episodic episodes, it really acts for some really fun, really creative episodes! However, I can understand that some episodes were a little "miss". Here's my opinion by season:
Season 1 was good all the way through, each episode was masterpieceful. This season wasn't episodic, either!
Season 2 was episodic, but it was still good. More humor was introduced in this season, which was a little... okay-ish.
Season 3 is my favorite. They had really creative stories while still staying as dark as an 80's children's cartoon can get.
Season 4 was when the humor just started to take over. At least it was still smart and wasn't obnoxious!
Season 5 was when the show went WAAAY downhill. I despise this season to be completely honest. The humor was the same joke over and over, and this season really felt like it was just there to sell toys.
Season 6 was Season 5-ish. But at least the stories were still creative and the humor was still good.
Season 7 was when the show started to get a little bit darker. The actual humor, however, got way better again. It just wasn't as often. And, of course, the stories were creative.
Seasons 8, 9, and 10 are very much the same. They were dark, weren't episodic, had great stories (and the great Tony Jay! :D), and if you started off with the 2003 show, these are the seasons to see.

But that's just my opinion.

[CyberCubed]

The original series came out at a time when people watched cartoons for FUN. Just to kick back and relax.

This is before the days of complex story arcs, plot twists, character changes, people killing each other, etc.

In the 80's and early 90's people just watched cartoons to have fun. You sat back for 22 minutes and enjoyed an adventure. You didn't have to worry about watching the show out of order or if you missed an episode.

If you watch the OT looking for stories/arcs/battles you won't get it. It's an adventure series based on old-style comedy with a little action.

[RaphAndDonnie]

I adore the OT with the exceptions of the European Vacation episodes (replacement voice actors) and the Red Sky seasons. I don't know, I just really like campy, funny, not to plot heavy stuff. I can see how other people wouldn't like it though.

[Shark_Blade]

You don't like OT? OMG ur not a true fan!!!111 :o

:P

[Sabacooza]

I was wondering if there were any other 80's show nonfans out there. Yes. I'm one of them though I wasn't always a non-fan. When the show first came out, I was all over it. I loved it but that was before I found out about the Mirage stuff. Now, I can't sit through a single episode in it's entirety because honestly, it hasn't aged well.

[TMNT_Guy]

Season 1 was good all the way through, each episode was masterpieceful. This season wasn't episodic, either!
Season 2 was episodic, but it was still good. More humor was introduced in this season, which was a little... okay-ish.
Season 3 is my favorite. They had really creative stories while still staying as dark as an 80's children's cartoon can get.
This is kinda how I feel. Whenever I re-watch the original series, I stop at the end of Season 3. Season 4 just felt like a major drop in quality, Michelangelo stopped using his nunchucks, the Technodrome was never again fully charged for battle...etc. There were still good episodes after season 3, "Where is September O'Neil?!?", but for me the quality just dropped too much.

Maybe I just need to re-watch Seasons 4-10 again, I haven't done so in five years...

[Powder]

I'm not a non-fan by any stretch of the imagination (being that, like most fans, I was introduced to the property via the OT) but I have definitely come to resent it immensely over the years. As I got more involved in the brand and became a Mirage enthusiast, I saw the wasted potential, the bastardization, the toy-shilling, etc... Also I'm pissed that thanks to the shallow nostalgia of 90's kids, in the worlds eye, the casuals who know nothing of the series short of bits and pieces they vaguely remember, going around hating on every non-Fred Wolf version that exists are the "fans" of TMNT... Eugh. I love the original cartoon, just not the stain it left- the fact that it pretty much guaranteed we'd never have a more adult oriented series, and that it has pretty much eternally pigeon-holed the turtles' personalities.

[CyberCubed]

^ Season 4-6 still have a number of great episodes even if there are several lackluster episodes. Season 7-10 are almost consistently good.

Yes. I'm one of them though I wasn't always a non-fan. When the show first came out, I was all over it. I loved it but that was before I found out about the Mirage stuff. Now, I can't sit through a single episode in it's entirety because honestly, it hasn't aged well.

"Aged well" compared to what, an action cartoon? The show was never trying to be anything it wasn't. You don't watch the original cartoon for story arcs, plotlines or plot twists. It's just a fun adventure series.

[CyberCubed]

I'm not a non-fan by any stretch of the imagination (being that, like most fans, I was introduced to the property via the OT) but I have definitely come to resent it immensely over the years. As I got more involved in the brand and became a Mirage enthusiast, I saw the wasted potential, the bastardization, the toy-shilling, etc... & more than anything else I've come to hate what it represents in the mind of the general public, how the fans, in the worlds eye, are considered the casuals who know nothing of the series short of bits and pieces they vaguely remember, going around hating on every non-Fred Wolf version that exists... Eugh. I love the original cartoon, just not what it has spawned in recent years, the fact that it pretty much guaranteed we'd never have a more adult oriented series, and that it has pretty much eternally pigeon-holed the turtles' personalities.

So you're grown resentment because of the casuals praising it? The same casuals who have never come back to the franchise since 1993? I don't see why you'd let them bother you.

As for all the OT stuff showing up in Nick and IDW, they're doing it in such a different way that I don't see the big deal. If either series was a 100% rehash of the original cartoon I can see why it would be bothersome, but the characters and stories they alter fit into their series just fine.

[FoxBoxKid]

I didn't make this thread so people could tell me I should "give it a try" or ask me to justify my opinion. I made this thread I, and others with similar opinions, could vent about an overrated version of an underrated franchise, unfortunately being the most popular version. I respect that some people enjoy the original cartoon for nostalgic reasons, but I don't, and there are plenty of other versions of TMNT that I enjoy very much. I also appreciate the importance of the original cartoon, and respect contributions to the franchise such as Shredder being a main villain and the Turtles having different colored bandanas. I don't like my Ninja Turtles goofy, I like 'em serious, not necessarily dark and brooding, just not silly. I know this may be unpopular opinion, but isn't that what forums are for, expressing opinions?

Edit:
I'm not a non-fan by any stretch of the imagination (being that, like most fans, I was introduced to the property via the OT) but I have definitely come to resent it immensely over the years. As I got more involved in the brand and became a Mirage enthusiast, I saw the wasted potential, the bastardization, the toy-shilling, etc... Also I'm pissed that thanks to the shallow nostalgia of 90's kids, in the worlds eye, the casuals who know nothing of the series short of bits and pieces they vaguely remember, going around hating on every non-Fred Wolf version that exists are the "fans" of TMNT... Eugh. I love the original cartoon, just not the stain it left- the fact that it pretty much guaranteed we'd never have a more adult oriented series, and that it has pretty much eternally pigeon-holed the turtles' personalities.

I totally agree with what you're saying about the negative impact of the original cartoon.

[CyberCubed]

I don't like my Ninja Turtles goofy, I like 'em serious, not necessarily dark and brooding, just not silly.

Truth be told, the Turtles personalities in the actual cartoon aren't really goofy. It mainly comes from Bebop/Rocksteady's slapsick and Shredder being treated as a goofball at times.

I never looked at the actual Turtles and said, "They seem goofy" while watching the OT. Oddly enough the original series also has the most laid-back version of Michaelangelo.

[TMNT_Guy]

I don't like my Ninja Turtles goofy, I like 'em serious, not necessarily dark and brooding, just not silly. I know this may be unpopular opinion, but isn't that what forums are for, expressing opinions?
Certainly, let's face it, even Batman fans are divided between the 60s Batman show and Batman the Animated series. Both are great shows, just with different tones and character interpretations. All because you like one doesn’t mean you have to like the other.

Though, I personally like them both.

[Sabacooza]

I'm not a non-fan by any stretch of the imagination (being that, like most fans, I was introduced to the property via the OT) but I have definitely come to resent it immensely over the years. As I got more involved in the brand and became a Mirage enthusiast, I saw the wasted potential, the bastardization, the toy-shilling, etc... Also I'm pissed that thanks to the shallow nostalgia of 90's kids, in the worlds eye, the casuals who know nothing of the series short of bits and pieces they vaguely remember, going around hating on every non-Fred Wolf version that exists are the "fans" of TMNT... Eugh. I love the original cartoon, just not the stain it left- the fact that it pretty much guaranteed we'd never have a more adult oriented series, and that it has pretty much eternally pigeon-holed the turtles' personalities. Well said. You, my friend, have hit the nail on the head.

[Powder]

So you're grown resentment because of the casuals praising it? The same casuals who have never come back to the franchise since 1993? I don't see why you'd let them bother you.


Well, look, passing comments, general negativity, I brush that off. But here's the problem- Those people are the ones who affect how things go. The same guys who call a new series a "gay spinoff" are the ones complaining about the lack of Bebop & Rocksteady, despite never giving the show a fair chance and not watching it once they're included anyway. Ciro is only putting those two into the Nick series because of the loud minority hating on Facebook posts & stuff like that. Same goes for the IDW book, they cater to the people who aren't supporting the book fully anyway, leaving dedicated fans to struggle through Neutrino arcs & the like. :tgrumble:

[FoxBoxKid]

Truth be told, the Turtles personalities in the actual cartoon aren't really goofy. It mainly comes from Bebop/Rocksteady's slapsick and Shredder being treated as a goofball at times.

I never looked at the actual Turtles and said, "They seem goofy" while watching the OT. Oddly enough the original series also has the most laid-back version of Michaelangelo.

What about that breakdancing scene in the second episode when they meet April at Channel 6?

[CyberCubed]

Well, look, passing comments, general negativity, I brush that off. But here's the problem- Those people are the ones who affect how things go. The same guys who call a new series a "gay spinoff" are the ones complaining about the lack of Bebop & Rocksteady, despite never giving the show a fair chance and not watching it once they're included anyway. Ciro is only putting those two into the Nick series because of the loud minority hating on Facebook posts & stuff like that. Same goes for the IDW book, they cater to the people who aren't supporting the book fully anyway, leaving dedicated fans to struggle through Neutrino arcs & the like. :tgrumble:

To be honest I mainly put this to Mirage having a poor rogues gallery than anything else. Other than Savanti Romero, Mirage didn't have any other good regular villains that aren't already mainstream (like Karai, Baxter, Rat King and Leatherhead), so taking inspiration from OT characters isn't surprising.

It does kind of bug me that 4kids characters are pushed aside, although I like how Hun appeared in IDW. Still pulling for either Hun or Bishop in the Nick cartoon.

[CyberCubed]

What about that breakdancing scene in the second episode when they meet April at Channel 6?

They were in disguise and in public. Don't really see how that's any more goofy than anything any other set of turtles would have done.

[Powder]

To be honest I mainly put this to Mirage having a poor rogues gallery than anything else. Other than Savanti Romero, Mirage didn't have any other good regular villains that aren't already mainstream (like Karai, Baxter, Rat King and Leatherhead), so taking inspiration from OT characters isn't surprising.

It does kind of bug me that 4kids characters are pushed aside, although I like how Hun appeared in IDW. Still pulling for either Hun or Bishop in the Nick cartoon.

It's fair to say that, absolutely. But it's not that I have a problem with OT/playmates villains, I love most of them. It's just that B&R have that nostalgia push, they're the only mutants any of these nobodies remember. Their involvement represents the casual voice to me.

[Leo656]

I gotta agree with a lot of what Powder said. I still run into an unfortunate number of people close to my age, many of them watched the OT as much as I did, but they truly have no idea ANY TMNT existed outside the OT, movies, toys, and NES games. And since stuff like 2K3 and the 2007 movie and the Nick show DO exist, and were pushed semi-heavily, you know what it tells me? That these "fans" are willfully ignorant of anything TMNT that isn't from their precious childhood. They don't know about Mirage, Nick, etc., because they don't WANT to know. They don't WANT to broaden their horizons, they want to keep things in the little box in their minds they've kept it in since they were 6.

And there's a LOT of them. I remember when 2K3 had just come out, like, a month in, a few guys at work, guys I'd gone to school with, were just randomly talking about cartoons when we were on break, gushing about how the TMNT OT was "the best thing ever!" I was like, "Hey, what a coincidence, because they just started doing a new show like, a couple weeks ago. It's totally different, but really good!" They were like, "They did a new show? Nah, it'll probably suck, it can't be as good. I bet they f*cked it up. Do they have Bebop and Rocksteady and all that?" And I'd be like, "No, it's more based on the comic, so it's different, but it's also a little more serious, so it's pretty cool." And then they start with, "Why would they make it more serious? That's stupid, it's not supposed to be serious, it's f*cking Ninja Turtles, it should be stupid as f*ck on purpose, like, for stoners and sh*t. That's the whole point!" I didn't even try to explain why that's not, in fact, the whole point. Anyway, so the one guy's like, "Ok, maybe I'll check it out, when's it on?" I said Saturday morning's, so he goes, "Never mind, I'm hung over on Saturday mornings, I'm not getting up before 5 for a cartoon show." I suggested he tape it, as I was doing since I worked most weekends, so he goes "Nah, that's a lot of work. It's cool. I don't need to see that anyway." :roll:

That's MY problem, that so many of these people don't WANT to acknowledge anything but OT exists. I surmise part of it is because they think it will somehow "taint" their precious childhood memories if they don't like a different version. More likely, though, they're worried another version would actually be - gasp - better. And studies have conclusively shown, the human brain actively rejects and ignores any and all information it does not WANT to know. If someone has decided, "The TMNT OT is a flawless masterpiece, and no other TMNT will surpass it," they'll go out of their way to either ignore or find fault with any and every other version. We see a lot of that on this very board, but with the OT and every other version, from time to time.

That's part of why I love this place, despite all the BS that pops up. I look at this board as a gigantic sociology experiment, and it's fascinating. :lol:

[CyberCubed]

But those people are casuals. They don't even rewatch the original toon either, they don't think of TMNT as anything more than their memories from their childhood. I bet if you were to ask them what happened in the original cartoon none of them would be able to tell you anything other than the basics.

[Powder]

Word to that 10000%, Leo656.

[TMNT_Guy]

That's MY problem, that so many of these people don't WANT to acknowledge anything but OT exists.
To be fair, ALL franchises have this problem.

Popeye will always be seen as that guy who eats spinach to save Olive Oyl from Bluto...even though Bluto was only in one storyline in the original comics. Olive's brother and Popeye's best friend, Castor Oyl, has yet to appear in anything outside the comics. Castor was in the live action movie, only he acted nothing like Castor from the comics. Popeye's main villain, the Sea Hag, has managed to make a few appearances outside of the comics...but really, who else knows about the Sea Hag outside of Popeye fans?

The public keeps insisting that Sonic shouldn't have big stories, even though in the Japanese storyline the stories have always been big and serious. For the general public, there hasn't been a Sonic game since Sonic the Hedgehog 2...except Sonic 06. They admit Sonic 06 exists because it gives them fuel for their argument that all Sonic games after Sonic 2 suck. Which is just plain wrong; any Sonic fan can tell you that. This is why the plot in recent Sonic games have been watered down so much.

Whenever people talk about Scrooge McDuck, they always refer to the Ducktales cartoon instead of the Carl Barks comics that came before it. The stories were a lot more complex in the comics and Scrooge wasn't as kind as he was in the cartoon...not to mention the cartoon introduced a bunch of characters that weren't from the comics like Gizmoduck and Webby.

To the public, Mega Man 2 was the last Mega Man game made, so much so that when they made Mega Man 9 they completely ignored the abilities introduced from Mega Man 3 onwards.

I could go on and on...but I think I've made my point. The Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles aren't the only ones who suffer from this.

[Leo656]

But those people are casuals. They don't even rewatch the original toon either, they don't think of TMNT as anything more than their memories from their childhood. I bet if you were to ask them what happened in the original cartoon none of them would be able to tell you anything other than the basics.

It's amazing the kinds of compulsions people have. In real life, I can't watch TV without commenting out loud on every chick's tits. True story.

And apparently, yours is that you can't go three posts in any topic without using the C-Word.

And not even the GOOD C-Word. That's such a c*nty way for you to behave.

:)

[CyberCubed]

To be fair, ALL franchises have this problem.

I could go on and on...but I think I've made my point. The Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles aren't the only ones who suffer from this.

Don't forget long lasting franchises like Power Rangers and Pokemon, where people always obsess over the first few seasons and original characters over all the ones who came after.

There are a number of Pokemon anime fans still stuck on Misty...and she's been gone from the show for almost 12 years now. ;)

[Leo656]

Guilty. F*ck Power Rangers after Amy Jo Johnson left. I hated that show, but loved her legs in those shorts. Totally checked out after she left.

I still want to do incredibly ridiculous and possibly illegal in Mexico things to that girl.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

The OT is what got me introduced to as a kid. And I was hooked to the series like a drug. I still love it to this day. But the OT, as I got older and because of investing in the original comics, is a cartoon that has become noticibly worse as time passed for me. Each and every time I go back and watch an episode, there's something inside me that strays me further away from the series. I just can't seem to enjoy it like I used to. I guess I liked it for what it is but it is certainly not a direction that I want to see a future incarnation adapt to. Which is why I'm not to keen on Nick taking a fair amount of influences from the show (though I like the way Irma and Slash were handled admittedly). From the corny jokes and villians to the animation slip ups, the show has not aged well at all, in my honest opinion. At least with the Adam West 60s Batman show, they had some decent action for a show that was intentionally suppose to be campy. And it was the silver age.

As much as I love this show for introducing me to this wonderful franchise, I just don't think it holds up anymore. I just think the later cartoons did a much better job at doing a TMNT cartoon, even if they have their own flaws as well. Sorry...

[CyberCubed]

What I like about the show is how each episode somehow feels action oriented with very little fighting. It'd odd, because there's always something exploding or breaking or jumping around in the show even though the actual fight scenes are extremely brief.

I'd also wager to say the off-the-wall dialogue and witty humor from Raph or Shredder/Krang are better than most of the dialogue in the other series.

[FoxBoxKid]

What I like about the show is how each episode somehow feels action oriented with very little fighting. It'd odd, because there's always something exploding or breaking or jumping around in the show even though the actual fight scenes are extremely brief.

I'd also wager to say the off-the-wall dialogue and witty humor from Raph or Shredder/Krang are better than most of the dialogue in the other series.

Cubed, this isn't the "I love the 80's Turtles" thread, it's the "I think 80's TMNT is overrated" thread. I'd suggest you make an 80's show appreciation thread if not for the fact that the entire forum began as an 80's show appreciation site, and mostly still is.

[Leo656]

Eh, if it wasn't him it'd be someone else. 100% Unavoidable. For every action, there's an equal and opposite reaction. And for every opinion, there's going to someone who feels so far the opposite that they just have to counter-balance things. We all do it. It's human nature, and naive to think otherwise. It'll be fine until the inevitable name-calling starts, which is also simply nature taking its course.

Spitting in the wind, my friend. Eventually, things will become too wild and upon that time, a purging fire will be necessary, and from the ashes, it will begin anew.

But anyone who seriously tries "This is a 'I love/I hate' thread, no opposing opinions please" is clearly about five days into their internetting. Don't work that way, son. Just don't work that way.

[TMNT_Guy]

I just think the later cartoons did a much better job at doing a TMNT cartoon, even if they have their own flaws as well.
As you said, no TMNT show is without it's flaws.

Whenever I re-watch the 80s cartoon I always stop after the third season. Whenever I re-watch the 2003 cartoon I always stop after Secret Origins Part 3. After that, the 2003 cartoon started it's brilliant "Michelangelo is the Battle Nexus Champion" running gag that got old. Not to mention the other problems that I had with it. The ending to "What a Croc" makes me do a face palm every time.

I think when it comes to the best TMNT adaptation; I have to with the first movie as my personal favorite. It has some serious moments, and some really funny moments too. (The scene where Donatello and Michelangelo treat that moldy Pizza like a fallen soldier gets me ever time.) I hope someday we get a director's cut of the film; I hear there were a lot of serious moments cut from the theatrical release.

[CowabungaMikey]

I prefer the original first seasons to the Red Sky seasons, because of the same reason CyberCubed said. You could just relax with them, get a few laughs and you don't have to worry about story arcs. But if you're a big fan of the 4Kids show and you'd like to watch the 80s cartoon, I guess you could try the Red Sky seasons.

[1987]

this thread is just asking for trouble. im sick of people trying to trashtalk the 1987 cartoon ON A SITE THAT IS SPECIFICALLY NAMED AFTER SOMETHING FROM THE 1987 CARTOON

you people really think the nick show is far superior? seriously?

[Powder]

It's really not trash talk. & if threads can exist for those who dislike other versions, so long as they remain civil, there is no reason this one can't. The only trouble it may invite, is from people who love the OT and refuse to allow other people to have their own opinions... :trazz:

[Leo656]

We both know that the folks around here are nothing if not tolerant of dissenting opinions. AmIrite? 8)

[ZariusTwo]

I guess I liked it for what it is but it is certainly not a direction that I want to see a future incarnation adapt to.

And yet that's exactly what the Nick cartoon did. It has dark elements to it, but it is just as corny. Like I said earlier, I think OT is cornier, but at least it generates genuine laughs from me, the Nick show doesnt, it's humor is juvenile and too random/lame. Indeed, there will come a time where fans will wonder just what they were thinking liking the Nick cartoon when we inevitably get a much tighter, stronger cartoon down the line. If the first five seasons of 4Kids were airing back to back against the Nick show, the former would win everyone over hands down.

Honestly, I just think people are just "settling" for mediocrity because it's all we've got until the movie, which will be of subjective quality also.

I just think the later cartoons did a much better job at doing a TMNT cartoon

And yet none of them will ever be as memorable as the original was by a large consensus. Ever. There's a reason for that. OT simply had more charm to it.

In my opinion, the OT not only still holds up, it still does things better than any other show since.

I didn't make this thread so people could tell me I should "give it a try" or ask me to justify my opinion. I made this thread I, and others with similar opinions, could vent about an overrated version of an underrated franchise, unfortunately being the most popular version. I respect that some people enjoy the original cartoon for nostalgic reasons,

I love the original cartoon for reasons other than nostalgia. I genuineally do think it's better than a lot of interpretations, including the overrated Mirage comics.

That said, I don't hate every TMNT version that has come along before or since the original 'toon. As overrated as the Mirage stuff is, I still enjoy some of the early stories, I love the first few years of the 4Kids 'toon and the Nick show does have potential in it and there are moments that I like in it...but the original 'toon is just so damn innocent and wholesome it's hard to really understand why anyone would want to find fault in it unless they are just someone who wants everything "uber-serious" with death and swearing everywhere. That's great when you're a teenager/young adult and you have those kind of wants and desires and want to see more of it in the medium, be it television, comics, or movies, but there eventually comes a time where you grow out of that phase or start to tire of all that angst as it becomes just as predictable and as corny as the fluff you watch. It's why I only tolerate only one series with any of that in it every few years. Last time, it was Battlestar Galactica, and recently it was Breaking Bad.

[ObiWanFan4life]

You just described the entire essence of the 2k3 show doe.

Well, that's a different story. The 2003 show called for being serious, the tonal shift in the red sky seasons (IMO) was a bit sudden.

[CyberCubed]

The difference is each series goes for a different tone and you have to accept it for what it is. If you want more serious action oriented series go for 4kids, if you want humor mixed with action go for Nick, if you want an adventure/parody series with memorable dialogue and character banter go for the original cartoon.

People keep trying to compare the shows to the other ones but when each has a distinct tone there's no point.

As someone said, it's like getting mad that the Adam West Batman is goofy and silly compared to the Nolan Batman trilogy. There's just no point to compare them since they're entirely different takes.

[HeroTurtlesFan]

Yeah, sometimes it sucks being a TMNT fan over here.

Well, as my user name suggests, I can't be mad with the Hero Turtles... too much nostalgia associated with the year 1990 and my utter devotion to the Turtles back then!!

[ABrown]

Some people just can't accept silly or stupid or camp or whatever unless it was an active part of their childhood.
He-Man is another perfect example. People who didn't grow up watching it - or who did, but somehow grew up into cynical, jaded bastards anyway - just harp on all the recycled stock animation and how like four people did all the voices in the entire show, and how corny it was at times. But nobody watching it then gave a sh*t, they/we were well aware of those things even at a young age and accepted it as part of the show's charm.
Kids who grew up watching it still swear it holds up, and anyone who didn't watch it then looks at it now and declares, "How could anyone have watched this?" Same exact thing with the TMNT.

It's a similar situation with He-Man, but not 100% the same. The original He-Man cartoon doesn't hold up as well today as the original TMNT cartoon does, and this is coming from someone who watched the original He-Man cartoon as a child. Another good way to see how well cartoons stand the test of time is to watch them with a kid today. When my step son was younger, I'd watch episodes of both shows. He loved watching episodes of the original TMNT cartoon with me, he didn't like watching the original He-Man series anywhere near as much. And I know it's not just a TMNT over He-Man preference, because he loved watching the 2002 He-Man cartoon with me.

[SwiftNinjaFox]

I grew up with the 80s cartoon as well and I loved it as a kid, but going back to watch it, not so much.

I still like the first few episodes. But it gets too silly for me after a bit. Not that I hate it either. ;)


I do still like how all the 80s cartoons you can tell when a wall will break because the color isn't the same as the background :D

[pferreira]

I'll always love the 80s cartoon as that's the one that I grew up with. That's my favourite interpretation of Ninja Turtles. That's not to say I hate the other shows. I see good things in the other shows as well. The 4kids series feels well constructed story-wise compared to the 80's cartoon, better animation as well. However, the 80's Fred Wolf series struck a nerve with me because it was entertaining. I'm not a massive fan of serialized storytelling which is why I don't watch much new TV shows today especially in the case of a show like Lost where the writers are clearly making it all up as they go along episode by episode.

I think the reason I like the OT series so much more is because it's creative (although sometimes repetitive), the voice work is good, the characters are fun, the animation comes from a period that has my favourite type of animation, it's funny and all these qualities add up to provide me with an entertaining show. I don't condone people slagging off the newer series because the newer shows have good qualities to them, things lacking from the OT series. Vice-versa. So, likewise I don't like people devaluing the original series as it has just as many strengths as later Ninja Turtles cartoon series. That's something I've noticed among fans and Internet media. I have my favourite but for the most part I agree that all three major Ninja Turtles cartoon series are equal to each other.

[TMNT_Guy]

Some people just can't accept silly or stupid or camp or whatever unless it was an active part of their childhood.

He-Man is another perfect example.

Kids who grew up watching it still swear it holds up, and anyone who didn't watch it then looks at it now and declares, "How could anyone have watched this?" Same exact thing with the TMNT.
Eh, I don't know about that. I didn't grow up with the original Turtles series-the only Ninja Turtles related thing from my childhood was a Mummy Raphael figure.

My introduction to the Turtles came from the TMNT 2007 film. I knew that the Turtles had a long running history, so before I went to see it I read a bunch of the character profiles on the old Mirage website. I still remember watching the movie for the first time in theaters and seeing Raphael dressed as the Nightwatcher and thinking "Is this that Casey Jones guy I read about?" Heh...

I thought the movie was just ok, but less than a week later they had the original movies playing on TV, so I watched them. I thought the first movie was amazing, this got me thinking; "I wonder what the original cartoon series is like?" So I got a DVD of Season 1- and I LOVED it.

I eagerly picked up the Season 2 DVD...and I was immediately disappointed. The writing wasn't as sharp as Season One, the animation wasn't as good as Season 1...it just felt like a major drop in quality. Season 3 was better, but never quite as good as the five part miniseries. Season 3 also lets us FINALLY see the Technodrome fully powered up-and it was awesome!

The series never managed to out due the "Big Break" three-parter, which is why I usually stop watching the series after Season Three. Don't get me wrong; there are good episodes after Season Three; "Son of Return of the Fly II", "The Big Cufflink Caper!", "Raphael Meets His Match", I also really like when the Turtles shove the pizza into the screen in the new intro. But the series never managed to be as good as it once was after Season Three. Sometimes I slip a few Season Four episodes between Seasons Two and Three just so I can pretend "The Big Blow Out" is how the series ended.

Michelangelo giving up his nunchucks in favor of a grappling hook didn't help matters, either.

[kolaida]

I liked the 80s turtles and still do (I don't go back and actively or obsessively watch it; sometimes I'll watch an episode or two just 'cause).

As someone else stated, the 80s Turtles fit pretty well into cartoons for that time (I remember watching that along with Alvin and the Chipmunks, DuckTales, ChipNDale, Rugrats, Doug, Clarissa Explains It All-- I didn't think the Turtles were out of place or anymore ridiculous than those shows). Besides, as far as I'm concerned nothing gets weirder or more silly than Ahhhh!Real Monsters-- there was like a butt with hands growing out of it, holding up its eyeballs (I'm still traumatized, it grossed me out so much, I would actually change the channel during commercials for the show).

Anyway, forgot where I was going with that. Oh, yeah, I loved the NES game, too, played it to death multiple times.

I don't know, sometimes I'm a big fan and sometimes I'm a nonfan, just depends on my mood, LOL!

Oh yeah, my mom was super strict with shows for the most part and generally watched them with me or previewed them and she was always okay with the Turtles, it never came under any scrutiny (can't say the same for Sailor Moon or Ahhhh!Real Monsters, which I didn't WANT to watch, but my mom still made it clear I wasn't allowed to- hah, and I was like, "thank god!" On the other hand, pretty sad with Sailor Moon got banned).

[CyberCubed]

I rewatch my OT DVDs every 2 years or so and I don't see what's so hard about watching through the show.

The series is just dumb fun. Leave you brain at the door and just relax.

[kolaida]

I rewatch my OT DVDs every 2 years or so and I don't see what's so hard about watching through the show.

The series is just dumb fun. Leave you brain at the door and just relax.

Oh, yeah, I don't think it's hard to watch at all. There's just so much time in a day and I usually choose to watch other things (new stuff mostly, I don't have ANY show from back in the day I go back and rewatch often).

[ABrown]

I rewatch my OT DVDs every 2 years or so and I don't see what's so hard about watching through the show.
The series is just dumb fun. Leave you brain at the door and just relax.

European episodes are a little rough. For the most part, the rest of the series is a pretty easy watch.

[Leo656]

^^That's like calling King Kong Bundy "a little fat".

[CyberCubed]

European episodes are a little rough. For the most part, the rest of the series is a pretty easy watch.

Well yeah, those 13 episodes are bad. It really goes to show you that most of the original toon is quite entertaining because then when you compare it to bad episodes the difference is noticeable.

There are of course a some bad episodes scattered around Seasons 3-6, but I can either deal with them or not be bothered by them.

[FoxBoxKid]

What happened to this thread? :ohwell:

[Leo656]

Told you, same thing as always, buddy.

It is absolutely impossible for any "Positive/Negative Opinions Only, Please" threads to exist. "Pink Elephants." Tell someone NOT to think about Pink Elephants, it's all they can think about.

Simply by saying not to do something, you already invite someone to do it. People gonna talk, just let 'em.

In case you haven't noticed, this place is one giant pool of free-floating anarchy. Coloring inside the lines is supremely frowned upon.

[CyberCubed]

The problem is when you have a thread like this there's really not much to talk about. Other than having a few people agree with you...there's nothing much to discuss.

It's fair enough people can't get into the original toon, but again, what is there to say other than, "I agree" after that?

[Kurai]

I definitely place myself in the 'not a fan of the 80's cartoon' camp. I respect it for bringing the property to the mainstream (since I doubt that many of us would have heard of the Turtles if it wasn't for the '87 cartoon), but I can't seem to get into it. It's a bit too overly goofy for my liking.

[CyberCubed]

It's a children's show. Of course it's going to be silly.

I like watching the sci-fi plots in the original toon because you never get that out of any other series.

[Jester]

Must you defend the series in a thread meant for those who prefer other Turtles media? I love the FW series, but it's not everyone's cup of tea....such is life.

[Kurai]

It's a children's show. Of course it's going to be silly.



That statement I have to disagree with. Children's shows don't have to be silly. ReBoot, for example, may have started out a bit more silly and kid friendly, but eventually progressed to become a pretty dark, serious show by it's third season. Yet, despite that, it's still a kids show. There are so many other examples out there (such as Batman The Animated Series) that show that children's shows don't have to be silly.

[CyberCubed]

That statement I have to disagree with. Children's shows don't have to be silly. ReBoot, for example, may have started out a bit more silly and kid friendly, but eventually progressed to become a pretty dark, serious show by it's third season. Yet, despite that, it's still a kids show. There are so many other examples out there (such as Batman The Animated Series) that show that children's shows don't have to be silly.

Many cartoons are light hearted and silly. Even modern ones like Teen Titans and Brave and the Bold.

Not every show needs to be serious.

[ToTheNines]

I love the Fred Wolf series. It had some garbage, even a couple of episodes I've vowed to never watch again (The Turtle Terminator, Funny They Shrunk Michaelangelo), but it's awesome.

The voice cast is great, the soundtrack was brilliant, the background art was nice, and it was capable of being pretty damn funny.


And why were there TWO Don Turtelli's? We ever find that one out?

Anyone ever wonder why there were two different Don Corleone's in the Godfather movies?

"Don" is a title given to head of a crime family, it's not like their first name was Donald lol. Granted, the show never made an effort to explain this, but it still makes sense. To me, at least.

[CyberCubed]

(The Turtle Terminator

Haha, I think Raph's alternate voice and the god awful animation ruined that episode more than anything. Also think Irma was written to be more annoying than usual in that ep.

It seemed only David Wise or Jack Mendelson knew how to write Irma without her being annoying.

[Panda_Kahn_fan]

To me, the 80's cartoon is cheesy, dumb, and painful to watch. I rewatced several episodes recently, and was only enterained by the humor.

That being said... I find the characters (rocksteady bebop, krang, etc.) to be some of the best in the franchise, and find myself liking them more than the Mirage characters, who I find boring and cliche. I see it as one of the major components of Turtle lore, and I think a serious take the OT and the Archie series are the bedrock conerstone of my preferred version of TMNT. To dismiss them as spinoff kiddie fare is the hieght of stupidity.

[Tuxedo Moroboshi]

Honestly, I grew up with the old 1987 cartoon, and I loved it as a kid, but I don't really like it the same way anymore. I still enjoy it, but it does feel like an inferior product to me, going back and watching it again after all these years. I think the 2012 cartoon is marginally better, but also hasn't really been my cup of tea, either. As far as kid-appropriate animated adaptations go, I've only ever been able to get into the 2003 cartoon (though not the two final spin-off seasons).

But, ya, I loved the 1987 cartoon as a kid, but outside of the initial five episodes, I largely find it a bit of a chore to watch nowadays. The only thing that it trumps all the other TMNT cartoons in is that it has the best theme song, imo.

Many cartoons are light hearted and silly. Even modern ones like Teen Titans and Brave and the Bold.

Not every show needs to be serious.

That's true, but I still think there's a difference between those two shows and the 87 TMNT toon. The 1987 TMNT toon started off as being largely an action cartoon. It had a lot of humor during its initial five episodes, yes, but I feel like as time moved on, it became more of a comedy than an action show. Action always being present, yes, but the focus became more on comedy than action, rather than the other way around. At least until the Red Sky episodes, anyway.

That being said, I love Brave and the Bold, but felt that sometimes the Teen Titans cartoon went a little too out there. I dunno, I guess it's just the way things are handled. I, myself, am not against comedy, but I do feel that when adapting something where action is a main focus, one should be careful when adding in comedy and how it's handled. Just my opinion, though. If people enjoy the 1987 cartoon (and I know almost everyone does, with how many people think of it as the "definitive" version of the TMNT), that's all fine and dandy. It's just that I, personally, don't really like it much anymore. And my memories of watching the show as a kid are a bit distorted, since I only remember the action and never any of the comedic moments (though I was incredibly young when I first watched the show).

[CyberCubed]

Oddly enough I find the OT to be the most rewatchable of all the cartoons. While I've sat through the original series countless times, I've only ever rewatched the 4kids series in full about 4 times. That means I've only seen each episode of the 4kids cartoon about 4 times throughout the years.

With Nick so far I've rewatched all of Season 1, so I'll probably just rewatch each season after it ends and then give it a break until more seasons airs.

[Jester]

Oddly enough I find the OT to be the most rewatchable of all the cartoons. While I've sat through the original series countless times, I've only ever rewatched the 4kids series in full about 4 times. That means I've only seen each episode of the 4kids cartoon about 4 times throughout the years.

With Nick so far I've rewatched all of Season 1, so I'll probably just rewatch each season after it ends and then give it a break until more seasons airs.
Good...then this thread isn't for you...

Or me for that matter. Let the people who don't necessarily like the FW series have their thread...it ain't hurting nobody.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Guilty. F*ck Power Rangers after Amy Jo Johnson left. I hated that show, but loved her legs in those shorts. Totally checked out after she left.

I still want to do incredibly ridiculous and possibly illegal in Mexico things to that girl.

In that case, have you checked out Flashpoint? Great show, and she's in it!

On topic, I'm with Jester and Cubed here, and the others who still enjoy it even years later. Granted, there are some aspects that I feel are way up there on the cheese factor, but it's all in good fun, and sometimes it's nice just to sit back and have a good giggle over how goofy and light-hearted it was. And I agree that it did indeed have the most "laid-back" Mikey- it's one of the things I loved most about it- their personalities. And the banter of Shredder/Krang, and R&B's stupidity, of course.

However, I get why some might not enjoy it, whether from not feeling it holds up well, or lack of interest in the campy, episodic approach. Then again, I'm wondering if some of those in that camp weren't born later on and remember the other shows better. Once the mid-90's came around and cartoons started becoming more story-arc driven and serious, a lot of the more "silly" shows started to seem less appealing to many folks, for some reason. Maybe a lot of us just grew up too fast....

[Walkabout]

Guilty. F*ck Power Rangers after Amy Jo Johnson left. I hated that show, but loved her legs in those shorts. Totally checked out after she left.

I still want to do incredibly ridiculous and possibly illegal in Mexico things to that girl.

If she was the original pink ranger, I'm with you on that one :trazz:

[CyberCubed]

I know the casuals give the OT a bad name, but just ignore them. The OT is quite fun and enjoyable as long as you forget about those casuals in real life praising their childhood memory.

[Jester]

I know the casuals give the OT a bad name, but just ignore them. The OT is quite fun and enjoyable as long as you forget about those casuals in real life praising their childhood memory.
But aren't you, by not seeing the Fred Wolf series flaws and viewing it solely through nostalgia goggles, doing as much if not more damage than any "casual"?

[CyberCubed]

But aren't you, by not seeing the Fred Wolf series flaws and viewing it solely through nostalgia goggles, doing as much if not more damage than any "casual"?

But being campy or cheesy isn't a flaw, it's the style of the show. It's like getting angry that the Adam West Batman isn't serious like modern Batman.

The OT's real flaws are some of the poorly animated episodes, the mistakes, alternate voices and not using its villains to its full potential. But other than that I don't have much to complain about.