Still think this movie is going to flop?

[GeneralTragg]

Hey, why go to all the trouble of planning, rehearsing and perfecting the art of cinematography and fight choreography when you can just shake the camera around and call it a day?

It's possible to use it "right", but most often the shaky-cam style is just covering for a lack of talent. It looks terrible and I'm tired of it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjWq2Yrfz0I

[Bjarni]

Fail upwards, the best way to advance to dangerous positions of authority and responsibility!

All the new directors in Hollywood either come from a long line of music videos or commercials (like Marcus Nispel and Michael Bay).

They are not artists or storytellers. They are factory workers who know how to make the product they are told to make.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

They are not artists or storytellers. They are factory workers who know how to make the product they are told to make.

the thing is no one is telling them..they are the ones telling people what to do

sure you can transition from small to big screen, but what works for one doesn't work for the other. its to completely different mediums


but Bays commercial work definitely leaks into his movies, watch transformers and tell me you cant just take the driving autobots as a chevy commercial

or Fox or whats her face from 2 and make victorias secret commercials

[d_osborn]

All the new directors in Hollywood either come from a long line of music videos or commercials (like Marcus Nispel and Michael Bay).

They are not artists or storytellers. They are factory workers who know how to make the product they are told to make.
Well that's a bit of an uninformed statement. Steve Barron was a music video director, as was Fincher, Gondry, and Spike Jonze. I consider them all amazing artists AND storytellers.

[TigerClaw]

Well that's an uninformed statement. Steve Barron was a music video director, as was Fincher, Gondry, and Spike Jonze. I consider them all amazing artists AND storytellers.
Even Music Video Directors can be good storytellers in a music video, Its not just shots of the bands singing and performing, But most music videos do have stories in them reflecting the song.

[samxsteal]

Even Music Video Directors can be good storytellers in a music video, Its not just shots of the bands singing and performing, But most music videos do have stories in them reflecting the song.

seriously just look at the director of Micheal Jackson's Thriller video

[Candy Kappa]

Or Michael Bay's Meatloaf video.

[samxsteal]

Or Michael Bay's Meatloaf video.

and saw what you will but even Micheal Bay a proven he can create descent works.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

and saw what you will but even Micheal Bay a proven he can create descent works.

eh ,depends what you consider "decent works"


is bay successful? sure...but he def falls under the summer popcorn flicks alot more than storytelling

his action explosions,effects are his "story"

[samxsteal]

eh ,depends what you consider "decent works"


is bay successful? sure...but he def falls under the summer popcorn flicks alot more than storytelling

his action explosions,effects are his "story"

And yet can create a stories like Pain and gain, and the Rock.

[Warhorse]

Hey, why go to all the trouble of planning, rehearsing and perfecting the art of cinematography and fight choreography when you can just shake the camera around and call it a day?

It's possible to use it "right", but most often the shaky-cam style is just covering for a lack of talent. It looks terrible and I'm tired of it.

That pissed me off so much when I was watching Captain America 2. The scenes in the beginning were dark to begin with, they could have just added shadow to stunt man's face to hide him instead of shaking the crap out of the camera. Those scenes could have been so much better without the shaky cam. No need for it. At all.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

And yet can create a stories like Pain and gain, and the Rock.

i haven't seen either so i cant speak on them..not my cup of tea..but from the few i know the rock is liked a ton more


i am not saying bay cant tell stories just that his stories are driven by something else than words..he lets the action tell it

[Warhorse]

i haven't seen either so i cant speak on them..not my cup of tea..but from the few i know the rock is liked a ton more


i am not saying bay cant tell stories just that his stories are driven by something else than words..he lets the action tell it

Kind of like a motion comic book:P


Runs outa here..........................................

Just curious, why does this thread have a thumbs up?

[samxsteal]

Kind of like a motion comic book:P


Runs outa here..........................................

Just curious, why does this thread have a thumbs up?

who ever created it thought it was a good idea lol.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

Kind of like a motion comic book:P


Runs outa here..........................................

Just curious, why does this thread have a thumbs up?

:trazz::trazz:

only one of seen of those was the watchmen one and death of superman

[Warhorse]

:trazz::trazz:

only one of seen of those was the watchmen one and death of superman

What, comic books you read?

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

What, comic books you read?

i thought you meant motion comics like the ones that they turn into "movies"

[Pondslider]

And yet can create a stories like Pain and gain, and the Rock.

49% Rotten Tomatoes rating Pain and Gain?

[Warhorse]

49% Rotten Tomatoes rating Pain and Gain?

Eh, I don't put too much stock in Rotten Tomatoes. They have their little darlings, (sorry, but if anyone but Joss Whedon was behind Cabin in the Woods, the movie would have been panned) and those they detest.

i thought you meant motion comics like the ones that they turn into "movies"
Oh, I just meant that in the real world, the elitist of the world consider novels and books to be real literature while comic books are nothing more than flashy pictures because the creators can't form a decent paragraph to convey the story they are trying to tell. So, I guess I was saying, Ridley Scott is a novel, while Michael Bay is a comic.

And out of all of the comic book movie adaptations you've seen, you seen only two? When was The Death of Superman a movie?

[Ramboraph4life aka Matt]

Eh, I don't put too much stock in Rotten Tomatoes. They have their little darlings, (sorry, but if anyone but Joss Whedon was behind Cabin in the Woods, the movie would have been panned) and those they detest.



:tgrin: I very much agree with that statement, especially about Cabin in the Woods.

And I know there was the animated movie of 'Death of Superman', called Superman: Doomsday.

[Warhorse]

:tgrin: I very much agree with that statement, especially about Cabin in the Woods.


Throughout that whole movie, I was just like the pot head. WTF? WTF? WTF? One minute, it was some weird illuminati sacrificing thing going on, and in the end, I got unicorns impaling people? Really. I was like, what in the hell did I just watch?

[MajorViolence]

That movie was weird and confusing but I thought it was incredibly fun.

[Pondslider]

Eh, I don't put too much stock in Rotten Tomatoes. They have their little darlings, (sorry, but if anyone but Joss Whedon was behind Cabin in the Woods, the movie would have been panned) and those they detest.


Ok, but The Rock at least has a positive rating on the site, so it's not as though all the critics are twirling their mustaches waiting to give Michael Bay a bad rating. I enjoyed The Rock. Even Armageddon is sort of a guilty pleasure, but most of his movies are objectively bad from a storytelling point of view. It's not about comics vs. novels, it's about style vs. substance and over the course of his career he's been found lacking.

For that matter I'm no huge fan of Whedon but looking at his ratings over the years on that site, several of the movies he has a screenwriting credit on have negative scores too.

As for Cabin in the Woods, it may not be perfect but I would take it over at least the last decade of Michael Bay's films. It's far more memorable than the blur of commotion in most of Bay's movies.

P.S. This is one the greatest Michael Bay reviews ever: http://io9.com/5301898/michael-bay-finally-made-an-art-movie

[samxsteal]

49% Rotten Tomatoes rating Pain and Gain?

yeah i dont really take RT Seriously loads of people on there are trolls, they have no moderation, ive seen both positive and negative review appear and disappear and change from positive to negative and vise versa

[Pondslider]

yeah i dont really take RT Seriously loads of people on there are trolls, they have no moderation, ive seen both positive and negative review appear and disappear and change from positive to negative and vise versa

Movie critics with Associated Press, the Wall Street Journal, and Rolling Stone magazine are trolls?

[samxsteal]

Movie critics with Associated Press, the Wall Street Journal, and Rolling Stone magazine are trolls?

Believe what ever you want im just saying what i've seen. I'm not just talking about the "professional" reviews im talking about users as well.

I'm not about to get into a stupid argument about a freaking website That's obviously "corrupt" from my own personal experiences

[Pondslider]

That's fine. I didn't say you couldn't like the movie. I haven't seen it. Though FWIW Metacritic's score is 45% from critics and 65% from users, so overall it seems like the movie has pretty mixed reviews.

[turtlefanforever]

And yet can create a stories like Pain and gain, and the Rock.

Not to try and undermine you, but wasn't pain and gain a true story? Not that hard to do. I'll give you the other one though even though I bought that video was a bore. I don't think this movie will be good but reviews are a mixed bag so it'll either do well or lose a good chunk of money.

[Warhorse]

Not to try and undermine you, but wasn't pain and gain a true story? Not that hard to do. I'll give you the other one though even though I bought that video was a bore. I don't think this movie will be good but reviews are a mixed bag so it'll either do well or lose a good chunk of money.

So was Pearl Harbor.

But Rotten Tomatoes is not a reliable place. I will see the same critic give one movie 3.5 and it will be a fresh, and the same critic give another movie a 3.5 and that would be a rotten.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

And out of all of the comic book movie adaptations you've seen, you seen only two? When was The Death of Superman a movie?

i mean more literal "Motion Comic" where they take the panels and animated them

death of superman was with the doomsday animated movie

[SonicKnuckles18]

I doubt it will be a hit, but I'm sure a lot of people will still go see it.

[BODYCOUNT]

i say 250 WW 180 NA
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=tmnt2013.htm
oh man i was off by 12 million .. it has been only 2 1/2 weeks maybe it ends at that before the blue ray drops

[SwiftNinjaFox]

You underestimated the foreign market, but overestimated the domestic just about right to balance it and come close. :D

[bloodstainedwings]

This movie has not made a profit for the studios it has to make another $10 million to break even. So when I heard the studio was happy with its success and the sequel being announced, I become very confused. The toys and other TMNT items must be selling like gangbusters to cover the cost of the movie since the movie has not made any profit yet. I am sure once the Blu-Ray/DVD hits this movie will be making a lot of money.

[samxsteal]

This movie has not made a profit for the studios it has to make another $10 million to break even. So when I heard the studio was happy with its success and the sequel being announced, I become very confused. The toys and other TMNT items must be selling like gangbusters to cover the cost of the movie since the movie has not made any profit yet. I am sure once the Blu-Ray/DVD hits this movie will be making a lot of money.

the budget was 125 mill its made more then that

[Bry]

The studios don't get 100% of the box office returns - they only get a specific cut of it. According to this article from 2011 (http://io9.com/5747305/how-much-money-does-a-movie-need-to-make-to-be-profitable), studios generally receive 50-55% of the domestic box office total. And that percentage is usually much less for the foreign market.

I'm not sure if that information is up to date, but regardless, a good chunk of the revenue goes to the theatre chains and elsewhere. Just because a movie's made more at the box office than it cost to produce doesn't mean it's anywhere near profitable, necessarily.

[beeshaw]

This movie has not made a profit for the studios it has to make another $10 million to break even. So when I heard the studio was happy with its success and the sequel being announced, I become very confused. The toys and other TMNT items must be selling like gangbusters to cover the cost of the movie since the movie has not made any profit yet. I am sure once the Blu-Ray/DVD hits this movie will be making a lot of money.

I'm sure merchandising is helping. I'm also fairly certain that Paramount/PD/Nick is looking at this first movie as a long term investment. Sure they may take a little bit of a loss with the first movie, but they are more concerned about the FRANCHISE money. Now if the sequel barely squeaks out a profit I doubt they will make a third. But they had most likely planned for this one to be a modest success, to re-introduce the Turtles to the general public (because lets be honest, not a WHOLE lot of people even know about the Nick toon), with the hopes the sequel(s) will be the ones to bring in those mountains and mountains of cash monies.

[Cipher]

I'm sure merchandising is helping. I'm also fairly certain that Paramount/PD/Nick is looking at this first movie as a long term investment. Sure they may take a little bit of a loss with the first movie, but they are more concerned about the FRANCHISE money. Now if the sequel barely squeaks out a profit I doubt they will make a third. But they had most likely planned for this one to be a modest success, to re-introduce the Turtles to the general public (because lets be honest, not a WHOLE lot of people even know about the Nick toon), with the hopes the sequel(s) will be the ones to bring in those mountains and mountains of cash monies.
No one plans for a tentpole summer studio film to be a "modest" success, especially if they plan on launching future films from it.

That said, it is possible given the companies involved that their aims for profitability were lower with this than most big summer films. Nickelodeon rarely ventures into this territory, and Platnium Dunes, I believe, has done almost nothing but niche genre movies. That and, as you said, this may have been commissioned more as a vehicle to bolster Nickelodeon's merchandise sales than stand alone as a movie itself with incidental merchandise (like Marvel and DC's summer films, Godzilla, etc.). In that regard a lower return over a longer period of time might have been the name of the game, in favor of getting a film out quickly and seeing more profits and awareness drawn in for the franchise overall, especially to hasten the return on that 2009 purchase.

But that just makes this movie even more off-putting. Everything about it says "throwaway project." As in, "We need a film and it needs to come out in 2014 performing only reasonably well; everything else is incidental." Which is almost certainly why it was saddled with a hack studio like Dunes in the first place.

[beeshaw]

No one plans for a tentpole summer studio film to be a "modest" success, especially if they plan on launching future films from it.

That said, it is possible given the companies involved that their aims for profitability were lower with this than most big summer films. Nickelodeon rarely ventures into this territory, and Platnium Dunes, I believe, has done almost nothing but niche genre movies. That and, as you said, this may have been commissioned more as a vehicle to bolster Nickelodeon's merchandise sales than stand alone as a movie itself with incidental merchandise (like Marvel and DC's summer films, Godzilla, etc.). In that regard a lower return over a longer period of time might have been the name of the game, in favor of getting a film out quickly and seeing more profits and awareness drawn in for the franchise overall, especially to hasten the return on that 2009 purchase.

But that just makes this movie even more off-putting. Everything about it says "throwaway project." As in, "We need a film and it needs to come out in 2014 performing only reasonably well; everything else is incidental." Which is almost certainly why it was saddled with a hack studio like Dunes in the first place.

Of course everyone involved would have happy with a larger B.O, but the fact they announced they were going ahead with the sequel so quickly makes me think they had that a low golden number for opening weekend, that was the 'go ahead' goal. The fact it made over $2Xmil more than studio expectations probably helped quite a bit as well. That's a 'bonus' 2nd weekend right there, built into the opening weekend. It's probably on track to make more money domestically than they had planned (not hoped obviously), and are setting their targets on making a sequel, with close to the same budget (and a whole lot of SFX R&D out of the way), but with a larger anticipated B.O. Again, a second round of merchandising and more brand awareness included.

In addition to that, those who grew up on TMNT and hated this movie just became even MORE nostalgic for the older stuff, and wouldn't you know it... 90's inspired figures, a new Documentary on DVD, all kinds of 80's toon merch is hitting shelves, as well as more awareness for the Nick merch that's available as it's all side by side. More school supplies, more clothing... It all leads back into the TMNT Money truck.

[Cipher]

Of course everyone involved would have happy with a larger B.O, but the fact they announced they were going ahead with the sequel so quickly makes me think they had that a low golden number for opening weekend, that was the 'go ahead' goal. The fact it made over $2Xmil more than studio expectations probably helped quite a bit as well. That's a 'bonus' 2nd weekend right there, built into the opening weekend. It's probably on track to make more money domestically than they had planned (not hoped obviously), and are setting their targets on making a sequel, with close to the same budget (and a whole lot of SFX R&D out of the way), but with a larger anticipated B.O. Again, a second round of merchandising and more brand awareness included.

In addition to that, those who grew up on TMNT and hated this movie just became even MORE nostalgic for the older stuff, and wouldn't you know it... 90's inspired figures, a new Documentary on DVD, all kinds of 80's toon merch is hitting shelves, as well as more awareness for the Nick merch that's available as it's all side by side. More school supplies, more clothing... It all leads back into the TMNT Money truck.
You're probably right on the money.

It also means this franchise, even more than something like Transformers, basically consists of 90-minute commercials and will represent exactly as much effort as is needed to push whatever their merch numbers are.

: (

Not to be a total downer. It's just kind of disappointing in the way that, while "Hey, it did well!" is, I'm sure, good news to some, the more you look at their bars for success with this the more evident the hackery becomes. Like, everyone was concerned with how it might stack up compared to Godzilla, Guardians, etc., tentpole films that actually depended on audience engagement and box-office numbers as movies, but it's increasingly evident the powers that be weren't even playing that game here at all. It wasn't even in the same category as far as a strategy/product. It's hard to get excited about that.

[bloodstainedwings]

the budget was 125 mill its made more then that

A movie has to make twice its budget to break even, so the movie has to make $250 million to break even. Do a google search about it, there is lots of info about it out on the web

[NinjaPug]

Production budget got bumped up to $150 million during filming/post. The rule of thumb I've always seen is that a movie needs to make 2.5 times it's production budget ($400 million in this case) to break even unless the marketing budget is really high like TASM2.

[samxsteal]

A movie has to make twice its budget to break even, so the movie has to make $250 million to break even. Do a google search about it, there is lots of info about it out on the web
It's made that already. Not domestic but world wide. And had yet to release me overseas markets.
Production budget got bumped up to $150 million during filming/post. The rule of thumb I've always seen is that a movie needs to make 2.5 times it's production budget ($400 million in this case) to break even unless the marketing budget is really high like TASM2.

No it got cut during production and marketing is not nearly that high remember months ago talking about no marketing lol so there marketing is likely slim as well I highly doubt it needs to make 400 mill at all

[NinjaPug]

It's made that already. Not domestic but world wide. And had yet to release me overseas markets.


No it got cut during production and marketing is not nearly that high remember months ago talking about no marketing lol so there marketing is likely slim as well I highly doubt it needs to make 400 mill at all

Nah, Deadline and The Wrap both reported the production budget was closer to $150 mill when it was released - probably due to all the script changes and reshoots. I have no clue what the marketing budget for this movie was. I'm just going by the 2.5x multiplier that pundits say is the common calculation used.

[TMNTChris1980]

Usually it's 3x what you've spent. 2.5x is good, but that is more of a strategic move.

[Leolead]

Nah, Deadline and The Wrap both reported the production budget was closer to $150 mill when it was released - probably due to all the script changes and reshoots. I have no clue what the marketing budget for this movie was. I'm just going by the 2.5x multiplier that pundits say is the common calculation used.
Dude why are you so negative on this movie?

[Leo656]

Sounds like he's just stating facts, nothing more. Movies are generally only considered a success if they make 3x their budget, especially big special effects movies. Pointing that out, and pointing out that this movie still hasn't quite hit that, doesn't indicate an agenda, it's just stating a fact.

However, I agree with the "long-term investment" theory, where the studio would have considered a lower take-home for the first movie as "acceptable" so long as the merchandise sold decently and the word of mouth was not overwhelmingly negative, thus being in a position to extend the franchise over several films and eventually end up well into the black, profit-wise, over an eight or ten-year period. I think they went into it hoping they'd at least make twice the budget and are happy enough that it looks like they'll hit it. I don't think they were exactly expecting or hoping for a huge runaway success, I think "good enough" is more than enough for what the long-term goal is.

[NinjaPug]

Dude why are you so negative on this movie?

What was negative about what I said?

[Warhorse]

What was negative about what I said?

Because you are raining on their parade! Eh, they don't understand the box office. I'm still curious though, is the sequel going to have an increase in it's budget. With Liebesman talking about Rocksteady and Bebop and the Technodrome, this stuff is going to need some serious cash to pull off.

[ScrewtheMirageTMNT]

They should use miniatures to realize the technodrome in some scenes.

[bloodstainedwings]

Usually it's 3x what you've spent. 2.5x is good, but that is more of a strategic move.

3x? that is insane knowing this now I think am going to stop caring how much a movie makes. Why do they keep making movies, if they don't make much money? By this logic most movies are failures when it comes to BO results.

[Leolead]

Because you are raining on their parade! Eh, they don't understand the box office. I'm still curious though, is the sequel going to have an increase in it's budget. With Liebesman talking about Rocksteady and Bebop and the Technodrome, this stuff is going to need some serious cash to pull off.

:( of course if you was expecting a TMNT 2, you'd hope the best for it too! you wouldn't want to hear about it not making it's money back!

You'd only want to hear the good! :(

[Davetello]

The thing is that it's all very well that the film has performed fantastically commercially - and it does increase the chance of a sequel and will attract new fans to the franchise - but critically speaking (and in my own personal view) it's not a particularly good film. If we're being tactful.

There's no correlation between popularity and quality. If there were then the X Factor would be full of the highest quality music and David Beckham would be the best soccer player ever. In fact this film is a lot like Mr Beckham - attracting hysterical love from quite a lot of people but actually quite sh!t in every way imaginable and more of a case of style over substance.

Apologies to anyone who liked it - I like things which are objectively speaking quite poor too. There's nothing wrong with this being a guilty pleasure, but compared to the original film it's a disgrace. I will still go and see it and buy the BR though - I'm funny like that.

[The Cheese Phone]

The thing is that it's all very well that the film has performed fantastically commercially - and it does increase the chance of a sequel and will attract new fans to the franchise - but critically speaking (and in my own personal view) it's not a particularly good film. If we're being tactful.

There's no correlation between popularity and quality. If there were then the X Factor would be full of the highest quality music and David Beckham would be the best soccer player ever. In fact this film is a lot like Mr Beckham - attracting hysterical love from quite a lot of people but actually quite sh!t in every way imaginable and more of a case of style over substance.

Apologies to anyone who liked it - I like things which are objectively speaking quite poor too. There's nothing wrong with this being a guilty pleasure, but compared to the original film it's a disgrace. I will still go and see it and buy the BR though - I'm funny like that.

This pretty much sums up my exact thoughts on the subject as well.

[Davetello]

This pretty much sums up my exact thoughts on the subject as well.

I know nobody here actually believes that something must be good because it's well-liked. But it's surprising just how many people in society do think that way. It's a bugbear of mine. Really fvcking annoys me when someone tries to vindicate some singer's 'talent' simply because they won a glorified popularity contest like X Factor or Big Brother.

[Galactus]

No one plans for a tentpole summer studio film to be a "modest" success, especially if they plan on launching future films from it.

That said, it is possible given the companies involved that their aims for profitability were lower with this than most big summer films. Nickelodeon rarely ventures into this territory, and Platnium Dunes, I believe, has done almost nothing but niche genre movies. That and, as you said, this may have been commissioned more as a vehicle to bolster Nickelodeon's merchandise sales than stand alone as a movie itself with incidental merchandise (like Marvel and DC's summer films, Godzilla, etc.). In that regard a lower return over a longer period of time might have been the name of the game, in favor of getting a film out quickly and seeing more profits and awareness drawn in for the franchise overall, especially to hasten the return on that 2009 purchase.

But that just makes this movie even more off-putting. Everything about it says "throwaway project." As in, "We need a film and it needs to come out in 2014 performing only reasonably well; everything else is incidental." Which is almost certainly why it was saddled with a hack studio like Dunes in the first place.

I'd definitely say that's how it ended up but I do believe that when it went to Platinum Dunes they did have expectations that it would be on a Transformers level. It makes all the sense in the world they would approach a company owned by a guy who turned a niche 80s animated property into a billion dollar industry with the hopes they'd do the same with TMNT.

I think when it became clear to Viacom that wasn't going to happen and they halted production, demanded re-writes, slashed the budget (apparently more than once) they reassessed everything and we're at the situation were it's pure product.

Some people have argued that this movie has landed in the same ballpark as the first Captain America and Thor movies but those were essentially marketed as preludes Avengers which did huge business and greatly boosted the Captain America and Thor sequels (as well as Iron Man 3).

I sadly don't see that happening with a TMNT. Even if the sequel is legitimately a good movie that fixes everything wrong with the first (the likelihood of that is pretty low) I don't think it will increase it's takings to a significant degree. This was the first time seeing these characters in live action in decades at just the right time that it these kinds of movies are working. If people didn't turn out in droves now then I don't think they will next time either. There was an opportunity here but barring anything truly unexpected happening to get people invested the die is very much cast,

The only reason to keep the franchise going is to eventually turn a profit on it.

[Coola Yagami]

IMO it flopped hard. Doesn't matter how much money it makes now, years from now we're gonna look back and think 'wow..... THAT one made HOW much money? Man, we were stupid'.

Even if the sequel is awesome (we're still playing the 'wait and see' game, I take it), it won't change the fact that this one sucked.

[Warhorse]

IMO it flopped hard. Doesn't matter how much money it makes now, years from now we're gonna look back and think 'wow..... THAT one made HOW much money? Man, we were stupid'.

Even if the sequel is awesome (we're still playing the 'wait and see' game, I take it), it won't change the fact that this one sucked.

This. It might just be me noticing nothing, but it seems even on this forum, no one is really talking about the movie itself. The only thing generating traffic in here now is the proposed sequel and the box office, whereas in the Nick toon section, people are talking about past, current and new episodes and dicsecting them, trying to find clues to what's going to happen next, talk about fights and moments and is Apritello going to happen or not. The movie is having none of this. Even the GIF's, pics and stills thread has been dead. The movie hasn't even been out a month yet, and interest in it has dropped so bad, even if it is generating money at the BO.

[Coola Yagami]

This. It might just be me noticing nothing, but it seems even on this forum, no one is really talking about the movie itself. The only thing generating traffic in here now is the proposed sequel and the box office, whereas in the Nick toon section, people are talking about past, current and new episodes and dicsecting them, trying to find clues to what's going to happen next, talk about fights and moments and is Apritello going to happen or not. The movie is having none of this. Even the GIF's, pics and stills thread has been dead. The movie hasn't even been out a month yet, and interest in it has dropped so bad, even if it is generating money at the BO.

This too. It's like, well yeah... the movie's out... it sucked. But I'm sure the sequel will be super-awesome and wash the bad taste out of our mouths, let's talk about that instead.

[Warhorse]

This too. It's like, well yeah... the movie's out... it sucked. But I'm sure the sequel will be super-awesome and wash the bad taste out of our mouths, let's talk about that instead.

I'm not hopeful about this. If James Cameron was the one directing it, then yeah, I would have all the faith in the world, but we are dealing with a group of people and a couple of studios (both Platinum Dunes and Paramount) that have not got the track record of making stellar sequels to their originals. Well, we're in the age of the Batman and Robin for the TMNT in the movies. We've been in this age since the third movie. Let's hope after the Nick toon has finally made it's run, it's popularity dwindles, the latest movies are forgotten, and someone comes out of the shadow to make a TMNT, in the same light that Batman Begins was made.

[NinjaPug]

This. It might just be me noticing nothing, but it seems even on this forum, no one is really talking about the movie itself. The only thing generating traffic in here now is the proposed sequel and the box office, whereas in the Nick toon section, people are talking about past, current and new episodes and dicsecting them, trying to find clues to what's going to happen next, talk about fights and moments and is Apritello going to happen or not. The movie is having none of this. Even the GIF's, pics and stills thread has been dead. The movie hasn't even been out a month yet, and interest in it has dropped so bad, even if it is generating money at the BO.

Great point. This is what happens when you make a hollow movie that has absolutely no substance to it.

[samxsteal]

This. It might just be me noticing nothing, but it seems even on this forum, no one is really talking about the movie itself. The only thing generating traffic in here now is the proposed sequel and the box office, whereas in the Nick toon section, people are talking about past, current and new episodes and dicsecting them, trying to find clues to what's going to happen next, talk about fights and moments and is Apritello going to happen or not. The movie is having none of this. Even the GIF's, pics and stills thread has been dead. The movie hasn't even been out a month yet, and interest in it has dropped so bad, even if it is generating money at the BO.

This too. It's like, well yeah... the movie's out... it sucked. But I'm sure the sequel will be super-awesome and wash the bad taste out of our mouths, let's talk about that instead.

I'm not hopeful about this. If James Cameron was the one directing it, then yeah, I would have all the faith in the world, but we are dealing with a group of people and a couple of studios (both Platinum Dunes and Paramount) that have not got the track record of making stellar sequels to their originals. Well, we're in the age of the Batman and Robin for the TMNT in the movies. We've been in this age since the third movie. Let's hope after the Nick toon has finally made it's run, it's popularity dwindles, the latest movies are forgotten, and someone comes out of the shadow to make a TMNT, in the same light that Batman Begins was made.

NO. People Had been trying to talk about it plenty of people But it so hard to talk about it when everything is so cluttered by Negative comments from those who hate it. Vocal MINORITY and all. there so much being talked about every where else I have plenty of friends on Tumblr who still can't stop talking about it, face book groups and pages, Deviant art pages with photos official pages and such, Still filled with loads of discussion. People prefer to stay away from pages with people moaning and complaining every day.

Facts are there are loads of people who would love for nothing more then to discuss it on these forums but they cant/ choose not to,

As i have said before its a damn shame when the best option is to find some where else to talk about it.

The difference between this movie and the Nick show thread is those who hate the nick so moved on and focus on other things. This thread on the other hand is all complaints that's it and it sucks

[Warhorse]

NO. People Had been trying to talk about it plenty of people But it so hard to talk about it when everything is so cluttered by Negative comments from those who hate it. Vocal MINORITY and all. there so much being talked about every where else I have plenty of friends on Tumblr who still can't stop talking about it, face book groups and pages, Deviant art pages with photos official pages and such, Still filled with loads of discussion. People prefer to stay away from pages with people moaning and complaining every day.

Facts are there are loads of people who would love for nothing more then to discuss it on these forums but they cant/ choose not to,

As i have said before its a damn shame when the best option is to find some where else to talk about it.

The difference between this movie and the Nick show thread is those who hate the nick so moved on and focus on other things. This thread on the other hand is all complaints that's it and it sucks

Not fact dude. Sorry. And it's not just here, it's everywhere Sam. Face it, the movie is a dud. No one is going to give two sh!ts about it in 5 years from now. And it's nothing new, there are tons of oscar winning movies that people don't give two sh!ts about years down the road either. Anyone actually care about Shakespeare in Love? It seems people love Saving Private Ryan, but forget that other POS.

[Leolead]

Not fact dude. Sorry. And it's not just here, it's everywhere Sam. Face it, the movie is a dud. No one is going to give two sh!ts about it in 5 years from now. And it's nothing new, there are tons of oscar winning movies that people don't give two sh!ts about years down the road either. Anyone actually care about Shakespeare in Love? It seems people love Saving Private Ryan, but forget that other POS.
Well I will..

[samxsteal]

Not fact dude. Sorry. And it's not just here, it's everywhere Sam. Face it, the movie is a dud. No one is going to give two sh!ts about it in 5 years from now. And it's nothing new, there are tons of oscar winning movies that people don't give two sh!ts about years down the road either. Anyone actually care about Shakespeare in Love? It seems people love Saving Private Ryan, but forget that other POS.

NO ITS NOT. God its painful smh. Its doing awesome at the box office, way better then most people even expected. And seriously Just go onto Twitter its been pretty much all positive since it was released people. Heck its been Positive since before it was released From pre screenings but those Punks dont matter do they Cuz they use words like badass, :trolleye:, I know tons TONS, of people who are more then thrilled by this movie huge fans cosplayers Artist, Tumblr users, whole Facebook groups, People are very excited about this movie, And will be more then excited For the sequel.

THis place is so Ridiculous Some times. It really is a shame

[Leolead]

NO ITS NOT. God its painful smh. Its doing awesome at the box office, way better then most people even expected. And seriously Just go onto Twitter its been pretty much all positive since it was released people. Heck its been Positive since before it was released From pre screenings but those Punks dont matter do they Cuz they use words like badass, :trolleye:, I know tons TONS, of people who are more then thrilled by this movie huge fans cosplayers Artist, Tumblr users, whole Facebook groups, People are very excited about this movie, And will be more then excited For the sequel.

THis place is so Ridiculous Some times. It really is a shame
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[samxsteal]

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

for really Ever Notice how all the positive people Left Its because this place sucks if you want to enjoy the movie and discuss it how many threads started to discuss it and turn to bashing contests. Ever notice it the same people and they are the very same people who have been talking crap about this movie the whole time.

Guess you people Won, driving off all those fans. Good on you

[Leolead]

for really Ever Notice how all the positive people Left Its because this place sucks if you want to enjoy the movie and discuss it how many threads started to discuss it and turn to bashing contests. Ever notice it the same people and they are the very same people who have been talking crap about this movie the whole time.

Guess you people Won, driving off all those fans. Good on you
I agree, I know people have the right to their opinion, but why bother with something you clearly don't care for?

It'd be like me going in the comic forums and bashing the IDW comics, ya know.

[samxsteal]

I agree, I know people have the right to their opinion, but why bother with something you clearly don't care for?

It'd be like me going in the comic forums and bashing the IDW comics, ya know.

Yeah But i guess People dont care they Feel the need to complain, and complain, and complain, and complain......... lol I loved the movie and pretty much everyone i talked to did too Loads of them Loved it enough to see it multiple times Some of these guys Aren't even "hardcore" turtle fans. SOme are some of the biggest turtles fans i have ever met. There was like two people out of the plethora i have talked to the didn't like it. Online it crazy how positive people seem to be and really with it yet to release in most Foreign Markets there is loads more people ready to see it.

[Leolead]

Yeah But i guess People dont care they Feel the need to complain, and complain, and complain, and complain......... lol I loved the movie and pretty much everyone i talked to did too Loads of them Loved it enough to see it multiple times Some of these guys Aren't even "hardcore" turtle fans. SOme are some of the biggest turtles fans i have ever met. There was like two people out of the plethora i have talked to the didn't like it. Online it crazy how positive people seem to be and really with it yet to release in most Foreign Markets there is loads more people ready to see it.
The thing is, it seems negative people are louder and more vocal (no offense guys) with their opinions.

Some people feel the need to constantly express their displeasure with this movie, again it'd be like me bashing the IDW comics just because I don't care for them.

But everyone is entitled to their opinions.

[Candy Kappa]

Maybe next movie can show some respect for dojo etiquette and actually care about the weapons the turtles use.

[Galactus]

Its doing awesome at the box office, way better then most people even expected.

Better? Yes. Way better? No.

It beat a lot of recent professional predictions which didn't account for them hammering promo at the eleventh hour but let's not forget that it's fallen very short of initial predictions that it woud comperable to the Transformers movies.

Also there's a long running thread on here speculating on which movie would come on top this month; Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles or Guardians of the Galaxy with several of this movie's defenders vehemently argueing GOTG didn't stand a chance. Now it seems for a lot of those same fans the goal posts have moved and doing half that movie's business is billed as a success.

And seriously Just go onto Twitter its been pretty much all positive since it was released people. Heck its been Positive since before it was released From pre screenings but those Punks dont matter do they Cuz they use words like badass, :trolleye:, I know tons TONS, of people who are more then thrilled by this movie huge fans cosplayers Artist, Tumblr users, whole Facebook groups, People are very excited about this movie, And will be more then excited For the sequel.

I don't pay much attention to twitter but I'd say from what I've seen it's a mix but let's say for the sake of argument that I've been looking at the wrong times and you're mostly correct; how is twitter and social media a better barometer for public opinion than boards like this or similar boards?

THis place is so Ridiculous Some times. It really is a shame

If it's so ridiculous then why do you stay?

[NinjaPug]

The negative people drove the positive people off this forum? Outside of a select few, maybe those positive pre-release folks just acknowledged it wasn't a good movie once they saw it. Or at least it wasn't good enough to them to drive conversation longer than opening weekend.

[CyberCubed]

It was a bad movie overall. It just made no sense and these Turtles weren't very likeable.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

I didn't think they were unlikeable but their characters just weren't explored enough. The thing with this movie is that it actually has a lot of potential but the story and the writing is what I wasn't too fond of.

[Xiewin]

Great, now we have five bad turtle movies. Seems like no one was able to make a decent one after the 1991 film. What's even worst, the 2014 movie had 30 years of material to take from, so there was no excuse for them to mess up this badly.

[NinjaPug]

Why can't TMNT have someone like James Gunn working on it. Gunn's thoughts after GOTG became the highest grossing movie of the year:


To quote my favorite little monstrosity, "Oh... Yeah."

And although io9 may be right, that people like the movie because it's funny, I like to believe it's because WE GAVE A ****. You aren't numbers to us. You deserve to be given something we the creators believe in and that isn't just seeking a big opening weekend. I love my characters, I care about the quality of the movie, and Marvel was cool enough to let us take some risks.

Hopefully, THAT'S the lesson - that we'll see more spectacle movies coming out of Hollywood that the filmmakers actually believe in, and that take risks, NOT just a bunch of superhero or space movies trying to be funny.


Instead we get the exact opposite from Platinum Dunes. They don't care at all.

[Bry]

Why can't TMNT have someone like James Gunn working on it. Gunn's thoughts after GOTG became the highest grossing movie of the year:

To quote my favorite little monstrosity, "Oh... Yeah."

And although io9 may be right, that people like the movie because it's funny, I like to believe it's because WE GAVE A ****. You aren't numbers to us. You deserve to be given something we the creators believe in and that isn't just seeking a big opening weekend. I love my characters, I care about the quality of the movie, and Marvel was cool enough to let us take some risks. Hopefully, THAT'S the lesson - that we'll see more spectacle movies coming out of Hollywood that the filmmakers actually believe in, and that take risks, NOT just a bunch of superhero or space movies trying to be funny.

Instead we get the exact opposite from Platinum Dunes. They don't care at all.

James Gunn is the real deal. Super talented, but also super genuine. He poured his heart into that movie and it shows. And that's what it takes to make something successful and loved and memorable: a lot of work and a lot of care to make the best possible movie with the best possible characters. Not just looking at an existing property with dollar signs in your eyes.

"Let's make something that people will connect with and truly love". Not "let's get the rights to this IP and turn it into bags of money". The Platinum Dunes method is the most emotionless, empty, cynical type of movie-making there is.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

Heck its been Positive since before it was released From pre screenings but those Punks dont matter do they Cuz they use words like badass,

there is nothing wrong with liking a movie or saying it was "Badass" on twitter...

however a Twitter post or facebook post does not a positive movie review make..they are nothing more than conversations between friends just on the digital realm


if twitter and facebook where the end all be all of how movies did no movie would ever fail

[Xiewin]

Even though I really dislike James Gunn's style, I'll prefer him over the talentless hacks at platinum dunes.

Wow, two of the worst movies of the summer, Transformers 4 and TMNT, are either produced or directed by Michael Bay. Anything that he or his film company touches becomes automatically poor. It's embarrassing that these people can't make at least one good movie. Really, it's getting old. While, a majority of other filmmakers are going to improve, or at-least try, to make good quality films (well not all), MB and his awful film company is going to continue to make more bad movies, with an average of of 20% on RT. Pathetic.

[Warhorse]

NO ITS NOT. God its painful smh. Its doing awesome at the box office, way better then most people even expected. And seriously Just go onto Twitter its been pretty much all positive since it was released people. Heck its been Positive since before it was released From pre screenings but those Punks dont matter do they Cuz they use words like badass, :trolleye:, I know tons TONS, of people who are more then thrilled by this movie huge fans cosplayers Artist, Tumblr users, whole Facebook groups, People are very excited about this movie, And will be more then excited For the sequel.

THis place is so Ridiculous Some times. It really is a shame

MOS was a smash at the BO, but still a dud of a movie, hence why they are bringing in Batman to try and up the anticipation for it. Again, you are in denial. There is more to the word dud than just as a box office perspective. The fact that people can only seem to talk about what we get in the sequel and the BO numbers is enough evidence to me that the movie has not done what it was supposed to do. Go look at the Nick section, it's got as many viewers as the TMNT movie section does, and they are talking about the episodes, the characters, fights, personalities, scenarios and what not, that is when a franchise has hit all the rights, and what is going on with the movie is evidence when a franchise has hit all the notes wrong.

In five years from now, this movie will be as forgotten as the Red Dawn Remake, Eragon and Turtles 3/TMNT 2007.

[ScrewtheMirageTMNT]

Even though I really dislike James Gunn's style, I'll prefer him over the talentless hacks at platinum dunes.

Wow, two of the worst movies of the summer, Transformers 4 and TMNT, are either produced or directed by Michael Bay. Anything that he or his film company touches becomes automatically poor. It's embarrassing that these people can't make at least one good movie. Really, it's getting old. While, a majority of other filmmakers are going to improve, or at-least try, to make good quality films (well not all), MB and his awful film company is going to continue to make more bad movies, with an average of of 20% on RT. Pathetic.

So, what's your ideas of good movies? I noticed that you don't like any marvel comics movies. At all.

[Xiewin]

So, what's your ideas of good movies? I noticed that you don't like any marvel comics movies. At all.

Are you asking what type of movies I like or what's my idea of what makes a great film.

[samxsteal]

All i can safely Say is the large Majority of those who were excited for the movie and Enjoyed the movie vehemently have left and it wasn't from lack of trying to discuss it.

Is the movie successful? Yes. Anyone denying that is delusional Regardless how what they think of the quality of the movie is.

[Whatswiththeheadbands?]

So, what's your ideas of good movies? I noticed that you don't like any marvel comics movies. At all.

I'm not that keen on most of them either.

[Autbot_Benz]

All i can safely Say is the large Majority of those who were excited for the movie and Enjoyed the movie vehemently have left and it wasn't from lack of trying to discuss it.

Is the movie successful? Yes. Anyone denying that is delusional Regardless how what they think of the quality of the movie is.

I can see why they left when most of the threads are just infected with the usual bitching and moaning and bitching about the movie Bay Platinum Dunes etc.

[DarkLightDragon]

It can go either way. Just sayin.

[Galactus]

All i can safely Say is the large Majority of those who were excited for the movie and Enjoyed the movie vehemently have left and it wasn't from lack of trying to discuss it.

I'm actually surprised that that a number on here who were genuinely excited or cautiously optimistic prior to going ended up saying they didn't like it.

I'd imagine if you and others like you who made it their new jobs to defend this movie from any criticism you weren't going to see anything but greatness.

Is the movie successful? Yes. Anyone denying that is delusional Regardless how what they think of the quality of the movie is.

Delusional you say?

Surely the movie has fallen financially speaking in the ballpark were you could argue it's a success or failure and both camps would have a point.

However I feel a movie that hasn't made it's own budget back so has yet to make a profit has a more than valid reason to be labelled as not successful.

[Coola Yagami]

I know opinions are different.... but there are just some movies or things that generally everyone, or almost everyone agrees are bad. This is one of them. Yeah, some people can like it... but then again they probably also liked Dragonball Evolution and Batman and Robin.


Of course the movie made big bucks, it's turtles, and turtle fans are gonna go see it, and some of them actually went to see untainted from negative opinions and not knowing the full details of all the behind-the-scenes ******** that us Dromers know about. Hell, I did, willing to give it a chance and hope it wasn't at least as bad I was afraid it was gonna be.... It's AFTER those fans actually seen this movie that they don't feel like coming back after seeing how horrible it was.

I honestly don't get how anyone being any kind of Turtle fan can like this. Don't you, as a fan, think the turtles deserve better? Are you admitting the turtles suck and needed all of these changes just so that 'it could work'? Cause that sure is what PD thought.

[samxsteal]

I'm actually surprised that that a number on here who were genuinely excited or cautiously optimistic prior to going ended up saying they didn't like it.

I'd imagine if you and others like you who made it their new jobs to defend this movie from any criticism you weren't going to see anything but greatness.



Delusional you say?

Surely the movie has fallen financially speaking in the ballpark were you could argue it's a success or failure and both camps would have a point.

However I feel a movie that hasn't made it's own budget back so has yet to make a profit has a more than valid reason to be labelled as not successful.I have seen just as many people who where skeptical really enjoy the film. On here there were done who where optimistic and let down but even the poll show there are more people excited then people who disliked it and this forum is hardly the general audience. The general audience enjoys it. Just look at the Tmnt movie # on Twitter seriously day after day after day there are people going on there posting about how awesome it's was, how much they enjoyed it.

And I say the same could be said for many people who say people that keep so muchb pent up anger about something are never I repeat never going to enjoy it even if it was the exact opposite of what they thought it was going to be.


I think it's a success because one it has made its budget. If GI Joe can get a sequel with is budget (which is similar to Tmnt) then yes I say this movie is doing very well. Heck it still had over half of its foreign openings left major markets yet to release it. So of course it's going to make as good amount of money.


I know opinions are different.... but there are just some movies or things that generally everyone, or almost everyone agrees are bad. This is one of them. Yeah, some people can like it... but then again they probably also liked Dragonball Evolution and Batman and Robin.


Of course the movie made big bucks, it's turtles, and turtle fans are gonna go see it, and some of them actually went to see untainted from negative opinions and not knowing the full details of all the behind-the-scenes ******** that us Dromers know about. Hell, I did, willing to give it a chance and hope it wasn't at least as bad I was afraid it was gonna be.... It's AFTER those fans actually seen this movie that they don't feel like coming back after seeing how horrible it was.

I honestly don't get how anyone being any kind of Turtle fan can like this. Don't you, as a fan, think the turtles deserve better? Are you admitting the turtles suck and needed all of these changes just so that 'it could work'? Cause that sure is what PD thought.

I love this movie would I like a more "ninja" style movie yeah sure but it's not that one is "better" then the other they're just different. I like this movie and it's universe ib love is actors (for the most part ) I can't wait to see the sequel.

After the movie first open there were review threads with tons of positive reviews. From users there's a poll that shows more people on the forums enjoyed it but notice how the majority of those users don't pay here anymore it's because this place is unbearable that's why it's not Cuz they dislike what they liked. It's that this place is not hospitable to those who want to enjoy it with other like minded fans


And that's a damn shame

[Coola Yagami]

I have seen just as many people who where skeptical really enjoy the film. On here there were done who where optimistic and let down but even the poll show there are more people excited then people who disliked it and this forum is hardly the general audience. The general audience enjoys it. Just look at the Tmnt movie # on Twitter seriously day after day after day there are people going on there posting about how awesome it's was, how much they enjoyed it.

And I say the same could be said for many people who say people that keep so muchb pent up anger about something are never I repeat never going to enjoy it even if it was the exact opposite of what they thought it was going to be.


I think it's a success because one it has made its budget. If GI Joe can get a sequel with is budget (which is similar to Tmnt) then yes I say this movie is doing very well. Heck it still had over half of its foreign openings left major markets yet to release it. So of course it's going to make as good amount of money.




I love this movie would I like a more "ninja" style movie yeah sure but it's not that one is "better" then the other they're just different. I like this movie and it's universe ib love is actors (for the most part ) I can't wait to see the sequel.

After the movie first open there were review threads with tons of positive reviews. From users there's a poll that shows more people on the forums enjoyed it but notice how the majority of those users don't pay here anymore it's because this place is unbearable that's why it's not Cuz they dislike what they liked. It's that this place is not hospitable to those who want to enjoy it with other like minded fans


And that's a damn shame

...and those are the people that like Dragonball Evolution, Avatar the Last Airbender, Batman and Robin, Superman Returns, Son of the Mask, Legend of Chun Li, etc etc etc.

The movie is bad. It just is. There's not much to say, except that yeah, it is. Can you say you like it? Sure, go right ahead. You're entitled to like bad movies. It won't change the fact that as Ninja Turtles film... it was just a bad film.

Eventually we'll get a good one. And then we'll look back and remember just how bad this one was. Just like we have the Amazing Spiderman movies now, and everyone looks back at how cheesy the Tobey Spiderman movies were, and how horrible the third one was.

[Autbot_Benz]

...and those are the people that like Dragonball Evolution, Avatar the Last Airbender, Batman and Robin, Superman Returns, Son of the Mask, Legend of Chun Li, etc etc etc.

The movie is bad. It just is. There's not much to say, except that yeah, it is. Can you say you like it? Sure, go right ahead. You're entitled to like bad movies. It won't change the fact that as Ninja Turtles film... it was just a bad film.

Eventually we'll get a good one. And then we'll look back and remember just how bad this one was. Just like we have the Amazing Spiderman movies now, and everyone looks back at how cheesy the Tobey Spiderman movies were, and how horrible the third one was.

That is your opinion that the turtles movie is bad it isn't fact. Just because a bunch of you hate it doesn't mean its a bad movie. Yes your Opinion is its as bad as the movies you listed but it isn't fact so stop trying to push that its bad.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

Just because a bunch of you hate it doesn't mean its a bad movie. Yes your Opinion is its as bad as the movies you listed but it isn't fact so stop trying to push that its bad.

and just because a couple members on here like it doesnt mean its a good movie...so stop trying to push that

[Coola Yagami]

That is your opinion that the turtles movie is bad it isn't fact. Just because a bunch of you hate it doesn't mean its a bad movie. Yes your Opinion is its as bad as the movies you listed but it isn't fact so stop trying to push that its bad.

Aha, but then why do you say the movies I listed were bad? Isn't that also opinion? And yet you take to fact that something like Son of the Mask is bad? Why is one bad movie bad and another bad movie is 'bad, but like that's just your opinion man".

Face it, this movie is in the same pile as those others. But you're free to like it if you want.

[Galactus]

I have seen just as many people who where skeptical really enjoy the film. On here there were done who where optimistic and let down but even the poll show there are more people excited then people who disliked it and this forum is hardly the general audience. The general audience enjoys it. Just look at the Tmnt movie # on Twitter seriously day after day after day there are people going on there posting about how awesome it's was, how much they enjoyed it.

Whether twitter is an accurate gauge of public opinion seems to fluctuate based on whatever argument people are trying to make. Same with any other social media.

I'm not a twitter user but every so often I've searched for TMNT related things and seen a more mixed opinion. I should also point there's a bit of a flaw in only paying attention to a particular hash tag. Not everyone who voices an opinion will use #TMNTmovie in their comment.

And I say the same could be said for many people who say people that keep so muchb pent up anger about something are never I repeat never going to enjoy it even if it was the exact opposite of what they thought it was going to be.

But here's the thing; have you ever heard the phrase "they want to love you".

Fanboys are renown for having a strong opinion on something and having a complete 180 when they see it. I can personally vouch for this because as much I have ragged on this movie and said I didn't want to see it when an opportunity to watch it I took it hoping there'd be something worth liking. After all this is freakin' TMNT not only in live action but able to do things they couldn't do in the 90s but from that weak cartoon intro right up 'til "what's family for" I hated it worse then my original estimates. I can sincerely say I have never been more disappointed by a movie ever.

I wanted to like it I really did and I'd wager so did every other skeptic that went to see it.

I think it's a success because one it has made its budget. If GI Joe can get a sequel with is budget (which is similar to Tmnt) then yes I say this movie is doing very well. Heck it still had over half of its foreign openings left major markets yet to release it. So of course it's going to make as good amount of money.

You can make that argument with the 1990 movie which made much more money than it's meager budget but for a movie with meager budget that has yet to make it back I'd say success may not be the right adjective.

The bottom line of any business is to make as much money as you can and for a movie which hasn't made any money yet and when all is said and done wont be making much profit then I think they need a serious re-think.

Sadly I wouldn't be surprised if Platinum Dunes banked on the trend from the last ten years of sequels surpassing the originals financially with comic book based properties leading that trend however they shouldn't bank on it. After all this movie to large degree rips off the Amazing Spider-Man and look how the sequel to that turned despite it's attempts to appease fans with the classic costumes etc and TMNT was far more divisive than that Spider-Man movie.

This movie has already played it's trump card. The was the first live action movie in decades and the first to have the technology to make is really make the story visually engaging and they screwed up to the point that a lot of people decided to give it a miss and a lot of those that did give it a shot walked out disappointed. I don''t think the presence of two hench-mutants is really a huge draw. The sad part is that in the unlikely event that a sequel fixes all the problems with the first the die is cast really unless something drastic happens to convince people it's a movie worth seeing. Even a reboot down the line will probably end up the same financial bracket and I don't think that a series which just about breaks even is what Paramount wants.

I love this movie would I like a more "ninja" style movie yeah sure but it's not that one is "better" then the other they're just different.

I know this wasn't directed at me but I would argue that in a movie called Ninja Turtles the presence of martial arts does make it better.

Hey where were all The Raid inspired action scenes?

Didn't you tell me more than once that it was "obvious" that they were going the reincarnation root in this movie? Defenders of the movie acted as if the suggestion there would be no Hamato Yoshi as outlandish. I'm guessing if you all felt the need to argue that they would be there, does that mean you all thought they should be there?

[Jester]

Not to be "that guy" Coola, but TMNT has better numbers than most of those movies (both critical and fan reaction), except Superman Returns...which is actually "certified fresh" on RottenTomatoes.

[ScrewtheMirageTMNT]

Are you asking what type of movies I like or what's my idea of what makes a great film.

The former.

[Xiewin]

The former.

Wait What?? So you want me to list the type of movies I like?

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

The former.

Wait What?? So you want me to list the type of movies I like?

why does it matter what kind of movies Xiewin likes...people can dislike and like many types of movies no matter the genre, even if its a Genre someone likes

[Leo656]

Maybe people left when it became all too obvious that they couldn't handle being challenged and didn't feel like defending their opinions. Because even now, weeks later, the main talking points coming from people who liked the movie are, "I wanted to like it, and I knew I was going to, and I did! It was so bad-ass and anyone who didn't like it is just a hater who's stuck in the past!" Meanwhile, people are able to write entire novellas listing the multitude of things objectively wrong with the movie that ruined their enjoyment of it. So, you have people with legitimate gripes on one side, people who just love everything they're given on the other side, and people on the "positive" side insisting that all of those Very Real concerns and complaints are either imaginary or don't matter.

See, here's the thing that kills me about the internet: People can have "opinions" all day long, but what nobody likes to admit anymore, is that sometimes facts interfere with your opinion. You can have an opinion that's "wrong". Like someone saying Toxic Avenger was a "good" movie. It's not, it's f***ing terrible and badly made in every single possible way, it just happens to fail so epically hard that it becomes entertaining as a spectacle. But it's an awful movie, and anyone's Opinion on whether or not they're entertained by it, can't change the Fact. You can like it; but liking it so much you start projecting value onto it that simply isn't there, is a fallacy. That's what a lot of people are doing with this new TMNT movie, inflating it with lots of artificial value to justify the fact they're so into it, so they don't have to admit they fell in love with something tragic and that they may have questionable taste.

Whether people want to hear it or not, this TMNT movie was conceived in sin from the very beginning, it was NEVER going to be any good, it's not any good, and the fact that some people can "shut their brains off" and still be entertained by it doesn't change the fact that there were piss-poor decisions made at every single level of production. The people making it had no idea what they were doing, other than "Movies Based On Toys Make Huge Money". They've all but admitted that their approach to making films in general is, "Do the least amount of work possible, slap a sticker on it, and watch the money roll in," and it absolutely infuriates me that their approach gets rewarded time and time again, since so many keyboard warriors constantly bemoan how much they "know better", and "won't support Hollywood's laziness". Oh, you care, sure ya do... until "your" Brand Name Movie comes around, at which point you'll just go see it and laugh at the same jokes the trailers beat unto the ground for months as if they're new, you'll ignore the non-existent plot and the bad acting because "you still love the characters" even though they don't bear more than a passing superficial resemblance to what you fancied as a youngster. You'll ignore all the Very Real Problems in a movie because it has a brand name you once loved stuck to it, and you'll abandon all your teeth-gnashing and wailing about how Hollywood is stagnant and all movies suck anymore, and just follow along with the "It's Just A Movie, It Doesn't Have To Make Sense" tripe, because the alternative would mean admitting that not everything about the Brand Name you obsess over is f***ing Perfect, and we can't have that, now can we?

People's problems with the movie are real. Plot, acting, editing, direction, effects... the movie itself has too many Real Problems for it to be objectively called a "good movie". Now, saying "Those things didn't bother me," is one thing, but they exist, and ultimately, you yourself are choosing whether you care more about Good Movies or More TMNT Product. you can choose to ignore the problems and like the movie anyway... that's bizarre and needy and childish, but whatever, that's a person's prerogative. But you can't say, "It was a good movie" because the math doesn't add up; there's too much wrong with it. Any movie can't be objectively "Good" if you have to ignore a bunch of problems just to get through it, or hypnotize yourself into loving it because you loved it when you were 7 and can't handle the fact that your tastes may have changed with age.

Saying, "I don't care, I like it anyway" is a choice/problem for each individual to determine for themselves. But it sure seems most people who liked it would have liked literally any TMNT movie, and frankly, I'm not in any way going to support that line of thinking. I do, however, have infinitely more respect for people who can say, "Well, it was bad, but I enjoyed this part of it because of..." over people who blindly, persistently insist it was somehow a "good movie" despite clear, overwhelming, soul-crushing amounts of factual evidence to the contrary. You can't have a "Good Movie" when that many pieces are broken, it doesn't work that way. Sometimes things are what they are. People need to stop projecting.

Anyways, Coola was making a lot of sense until he threw Superman Returns in the pile with the rest of that garbage he mentioned. When the worst thing about a movie is "it dragged a little", it doesn't belong in the same sentence as celluloid vomit like "Batman & Robin", sorry. :lol:

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

very well said Leo



sidenote not to start nothing..but out of those that left..i never felt like most of them would stick around after the movie came out anyways..not naming names or,calling people things..just personally felt that way for a lot of members

[Davetello]

I always said that "I'm entitled to my opinion" is an easy get out clause and a mirage. So basically you can think anything moronic or silly and it's fine because it's your opinion? So someone could say they find rape funny or that black people are slime, and it's fine 'cos it's their opinion?

Obviously views on a film are nowhere near that level of controversiality, but seeing as Leo656 says that opinions can be fundamentally wrong, I figured I'd comment upon it.

[pdizzle]

All i can safely Say is the large Majority of those who were excited for the movie and Enjoyed the movie vehemently have left and it wasn't from lack of trying to discuss it.

Is the movie successful? Yes. Anyone denying that is delusional Regardless how what they think of the quality of the movie is.

I have seen just as many people who where skeptical really enjoy the film. On here there were done who where optimistic and let down but even the poll show there are more people excited then people who disliked it and this forum is hardly the general audience. The general audience enjoys it. Just look at the Tmnt movie # on Twitter seriously day after day after day there are people going on there posting about how awesome it's was, how much they enjoyed it.

And I say the same could be said for many people who say people that keep so muchb pent up anger about something are never I repeat never going to enjoy it even if it was the exact opposite of what they thought it was going to be.


I think it's a success because one it has made its budget. If GI Joe can get a sequel with is budget (which is similar to Tmnt) then yes I say this movie is doing very well. Heck it still had over half of its foreign openings left major markets yet to release it. So of course it's going to make as good amount of money.




I love this movie would I like a more "ninja" style movie yeah sure but it's not that one is "better" then the other they're just different. I like this movie and it's universe ib love is actors (for the most part ) I can't wait to see the sequel.

After the movie first open there were review threads with tons of positive reviews. From users there's a poll that shows more people on the forums enjoyed it but notice how the majority of those users don't pay here anymore it's because this place is unbearable that's why it's not Cuz they dislike what they liked. It's that this place is not hospitable to those who want to enjoy it with other like minded fans


And that's a damn shame

That is your opinion that the turtles movie is bad it isn't fact. Just because a bunch of you hate it doesn't mean its a bad movie. Yes your Opinion is its as bad as the movies you listed but it isn't fact so stop trying to push that its bad.

Agreed with all the above


...and those are the people that like Dragonball Evolution, Avatar the Last Airbender, Batman and Robin, Superman Returns, Son of the Mask, Legend of Chun Li, etc etc etc.

The movie is bad. It just is. There's not much to say, except that yeah, it is. Can you say you like it? Sure, go right ahead. You're entitled to like bad movies. It won't change the fact that as Ninja Turtles film... it was just a bad film.

Eventually we'll get a good one. And then we'll look back and remember just how bad this one was. Just like we have the Amazing Spiderman movies now, and everyone looks back at how cheesy the Tobey Spiderman movies were, and how horrible the third one was.

Maybe people left when it became all too obvious that they couldn't handle being challenged and didn't feel like defending their opinions. Because even now, weeks later, the main talking points coming from people who liked the movie are, "I wanted to like it, and I knew I was going to, and I did! It was so bad-ass and anyone who didn't like it is just a hater who's stuck in the past!" Meanwhile, people are able to write entire novellas listing the multitude of things objectively wrong with the movie that ruined their enjoyment of it. So, you have people with legitimate gripes on one side, people who just love everything they're given on the other side, and people on the "positive" side insisting that all of those Very Real concerns and complaints are either imaginary or don't matter.

See, here's the thing that kills me about the internet: People can have "opinions" all day long, but what nobody likes to admit anymore, is that sometimes facts interfere with your opinion. You can have an opinion that's "wrong". Like someone saying Toxic Avenger was a "good" movie. It's not, it's f***ing terrible and badly made in every single possible way, it just happens to fail so epically hard that it becomes entertaining as a spectacle. But it's an awful movie, and anyone's Opinion on whether or not they're entertained by it, can't change the Fact. You can like it; but liking it so much you start projecting value onto it that simply isn't there, is a fallacy. That's what a lot of people are doing with this new TMNT movie, inflating it with lots of artificial value to justify the fact they're so into it, so they don't have to admit they fell in love with something tragic and that they may have questionable taste.

Whether people want to hear it or not, this TMNT movie was conceived in sin from the very beginning, it was NEVER going to be any good, it's not any good, and the fact that some people can "shut their brains off" and still be entertained by it doesn't change the fact that there were piss-poor decisions made at every single level of production. The people making it had no idea what they were doing, other than "Movies Based On Toys Make Huge Money". They've all but admitted that their approach to making films in general is, "Do the least amount of work possible, slap a sticker on it, and watch the money roll in," and it absolutely infuriates me that their approach gets rewarded time and time again, since so many keyboard warriors constantly bemoan how much they "know better", and "won't support Hollywood's laziness". Oh, you care, sure ya do... until "your" Brand Name Movie comes around, at which point you'll just go see it and laugh at the same jokes the trailers beat unto the ground for months as if they're new, you'll ignore the non-existent plot and the bad acting because "you still love the characters" even though they don't bear more than a passing superficial resemblance to what you fancied as a youngster. You'll ignore all the Very Real Problems in a movie because it has a brand name you once loved stuck to it, and you'll abandon all your teeth-gnashing and wailing about how Hollywood is stagnant and all movies suck anymore, and just follow along with the "It's Just A Movie, It Doesn't Have To Make Sense" tripe, because the alternative would mean admitting that not everything about the Brand Name you obsess over is f***ing Perfect, and we can't have that, now can we?

People's problems with the movie are real. Plot, acting, editing, direction, effects... the movie itself has too many Real Problems for it to be objectively called a "good movie". Now, saying "Those things didn't bother me," is one thing, but they exist, and ultimately, you yourself are choosing whether you care more about Good Movies or More TMNT Product. you can choose to ignore the problems and like the movie anyway... that's bizarre and needy and childish, but whatever, that's a person's prerogative. But you can't say, "It was a good movie" because the math doesn't add up; there's too much wrong with it. Any movie can't be objectively "Good" if you have to ignore a bunch of problems just to get through it, or hypnotize yourself into loving it because you loved it when you were 7 and can't handle the fact that your tastes may have changed with age.

Saying, "I don't care, I like it anyway" is a choice/problem for each individual to determine for themselves. But it sure seems most people who liked it would have liked literally any TMNT movie, and frankly, I'm not in any way going to support that line of thinking. I do, however, have infinitely more respect for people who can say, "Well, it was bad, but I enjoyed this part of it because of..." over people who blindly, persistently insist it was somehow a "good movie" despite clear, overwhelming, soul-crushing amounts of factual evidence to the contrary. You can't have a "Good Movie" when that many pieces are broken, it doesn't work that way. Sometimes things are what they are. People need to stop projecting.

Anyways, Coola was making a lot of sense until he threw Superman Returns in the pile with the rest of that garbage he mentioned. When the worst thing about a movie is "it dragged a little", it doesn't belong in the same sentence as celluloid vomit like "Batman & Robin", sorry. :lol:

very well said Leo



sidenote not to start nothing..but out of those that left..i never felt like most of them would stick around after the movie came out anyways..not naming names or,calling people things..just personally felt that way for a lot of members

So I see things haven't changed at all here. Its ironic to say people left due to the movie being bad etc, ect, blah blah blah...personally for those who have a life with real things to do its hard to always find time to be on a forum arguing with people who think their opinions are facts....that's like trying to get color blind people to see the sky as blue and not green. Not only that but maybe people didn't leave but instead took a break. I mean after all, all the negativity in this place is quite annoying. Besides I have kids if I wanted to hear someone whine and cry over stupid sh*t...just saying

[DarkLightDragon]

If anything, people who complain/whine about complainers/whiners is quite frankly more annoying to read than any "negativity" especially when it involves labeling people who actually explain why this wasn't a good movie.

Just sayin.

[pdizzle]

If anything, people who complain/whine about complainers/whiners is quite frankly more annoying to read than any "negativity" especially when it involves labeling people who actually explain why this wasn't a good movie.

Just sayin.

Your statement as a whole is invalid. I mean whos really complaining about who? I guess it would all be in the eyes of the beholder. You say people are explaining why the movie sucks with valid reasons but people who praise the movie also backs it up with their own valid reasons, and sometimes for both its those same valid reasons why one would or wouldnt like the movie. Again everyone is arguing the same points from different views, and since these are opions and not facts what makes ones opinion right over the other. Some will agree with you and leo while others will agree with me and sam....just the way it is. Im not labeling but it seems as if your labeling me



Just saying

[Davetello]

I think an important distinction has to be made here. The film is 'objectively' weak going by the fundamental rules and processes of what would normally constitute 'quality' - but that doesn't mean you can't enjoy it for what it is, some mindless action and corny jokes. As I said earlier in the thread, it's a guilty pleasure.

What I and others touched on earlier in the thread, and what Leo656 went into great detail on, is that you can enjoy the film subjectively as long as you acknowledge that objectively it's just not very good and has numerous issues. That's why it can be a guiltly pleasure - because deep down you know it's of average or poor quality but you enjoy it anyway, for peculiar reasons or reasons personal to you. The problem comes when you try and paint this film as of high quality relative to genuine quality, and as something which anyone should enjoy, rather than a specific minority which likes it for certain quirky reasons. You simply can't do that as it has the aforementioned numerous issues. Nobody wants to limit your enjoyment of it, but on the other hand you want to stop people rightly complaining about its problems and its lack of respect for or reference to the superior source material or other universes. So who's REALLY the dictator here? Those who complain about the film but are fine with people liking it for niche reasons, or those who keep trying to convince others that this is actually a high quality film rather than a guilty pleasure and simply won't accept that some people see this as a betrayal of the turtles franchise?

Allow me to offer an example - I enjoy the heck out of the Masters of the Universe film. I really enjoy it for many reasons and it also has personal attachment as my grandad took me to see it as a surprise when I was 5 (a grandad who is now 76, he will probably be gone within twenty years at most and those memories will be priceless). However, I would never try and convince others that it's a well written or well produced movie because it isn't by any standard. I can understand why many people hate it, but TO ME it's fantastic. And that's all that should matter to you and this new Turtles film's other supporters. Other people berating it shouldn't affect your own enjoyment of it, but don't try and tell people that it's a great film when it really, really isn't.

[Bry]

Maybe people left when it became all too obvious that they couldn't handle being challenged and didn't feel like defending their opinions. Because even now, weeks later, the main talking points coming from people who liked the movie are, "I wanted to like it, and I knew I was going to, and I did! It was so bad-ass and anyone who didn't like it is just a hater who's stuck in the past!" Meanwhile, people are able to write entire novellas listing the multitude of things objectively wrong with the movie that ruined their enjoyment of it. So, you have people with legitimate gripes on one side, people who just love everything they're given on the other side, and people on the "positive" side insisting that all of those Very Real concerns and complaints are either imaginary or don't matter.

See, here's the thing that kills me about the internet: People can have "opinions" all day long, but what nobody likes to admit anymore, is that sometimes facts interfere with your opinion. You can have an opinion that's "wrong". Like someone saying Toxic Avenger was a "good" movie. It's not, it's f***ing terrible and badly made in every single possible way, it just happens to fail so epically hard that it becomes entertaining as a spectacle. But it's an awful movie, and anyone's Opinion on whether or not they're entertained by it, can't change the Fact. You can like it; but liking it so much you start projecting value onto it that simply isn't there, is a fallacy. That's what a lot of people are doing with this new TMNT movie, inflating it with lots of artificial value to justify the fact they're so into it, so they don't have to admit they fell in love with something tragic and that they may have questionable taste.

Whether people want to hear it or not, this TMNT movie was conceived in sin from the very beginning, it was NEVER going to be any good, it's not any good, and the fact that some people can "shut their brains off" and still be entertained by it doesn't change the fact that there were piss-poor decisions made at every single level of production. The people making it had no idea what they were doing, other than "Movies Based On Toys Make Huge Money". They've all but admitted that their approach to making films in general is, "Do the least amount of work possible, slap a sticker on it, and watch the money roll in," and it absolutely infuriates me that their approach gets rewarded time and time again, since so many keyboard warriors constantly bemoan how much they "know better", and "won't support Hollywood's laziness". Oh, you care, sure ya do... until "your" Brand Name Movie comes around, at which point you'll just go see it and laugh at the same jokes the trailers beat unto the ground for months as if they're new, you'll ignore the non-existent plot and the bad acting because "you still love the characters" even though they don't bear more than a passing superficial resemblance to what you fancied as a youngster. You'll ignore all the Very Real Problems in a movie because it has a brand name you once loved stuck to it, and you'll abandon all your teeth-gnashing and wailing about how Hollywood is stagnant and all movies suck anymore, and just follow along with the "It's Just A Movie, It Doesn't Have To Make Sense" tripe, because the alternative would mean admitting that not everything about the Brand Name you obsess over is f***ing Perfect, and we can't have that, now can we?

People's problems with the movie are real. Plot, acting, editing, direction, effects... the movie itself has too many Real Problems for it to be objectively called a "good movie". Now, saying "Those things didn't bother me," is one thing, but they exist, and ultimately, you yourself are choosing whether you care more about Good Movies or More TMNT Product. you can choose to ignore the problems and like the movie anyway... that's bizarre and needy and childish, but whatever, that's a person's prerogative. But you can't say, "It was a good movie" because the math doesn't add up; there's too much wrong with it. Any movie can't be objectively "Good" if you have to ignore a bunch of problems just to get through it, or hypnotize yourself into loving it because you loved it when you were 7 and can't handle the fact that your tastes may have changed with age.

Saying, "I don't care, I like it anyway" is a choice/problem for each individual to determine for themselves. But it sure seems most people who liked it would have liked literally any TMNT movie, and frankly, I'm not in any way going to support that line of thinking. I do, however, have infinitely more respect for people who can say, "Well, it was bad, but I enjoyed this part of it because of..." over people who blindly, persistently insist it was somehow a "good movie" despite clear, overwhelming, soul-crushing amounts of factual evidence to the contrary. You can't have a "Good Movie" when that many pieces are broken, it doesn't work that way. Sometimes things are what they are. People need to stop projecting.

Anyways, Coola was making a lot of sense until he threw Superman Returns in the pile with the rest of that garbage he mentioned. When the worst thing about a movie is "it dragged a little", it doesn't belong in the same sentence as celluloid vomit like "Batman & Robin", sorry. :lol:

http://media.giphy.com/media/77keVUQWTIzni/giphy.gif

[pdizzle]

I think an important distinction has to be made here. The film is 'objectively' weak going by the fundamental rules and processes of what would normally constitute 'quality' - but that doesn't mean you can't enjoy it for what it is, some mindless action and corny jokes. As I said earlier in the thread, it's a guilty pleasure.

What I and others touched on earlier in the thread, and what Leo656 went into great detail on, is that you can enjoy the film subjectively as long as you acknowledge that objectively it's just not very good and has numerous issues. That's why it can be a guiltly pleasure - because deep down you know it's of average or poor quality but you enjoy it anyway, for peculiar reasons or reasons personal to you. The problem comes when you try and paint this film as of high quality relative to genuine quality, and as something which anyone should enjoy, rather than a specific minority which likes it for certain quirky reasons. You simply can't do that as it has the aforementioned numerous issues. Nobody wants to limit your enjoyment of it, but on the other hand you want to stop people rightly complaining about its problems and its lack of respect for or reference to the superior source material or other universes. So who's REALLY the dictator here? Those who complain about the film but are fine with people liking it for niche reasons, or those who keep trying to convince others that this is actually a high quality film rather than a guilty pleasure and simply won't accept that some people see this as a betrayal of the turtles franchise?

Allow me to offer an example - I enjoy the heck out of the Masters of the Universe film. I really enjoy it for many reasons and it also has personal attachment as my grandad took me to see it as a surprise when I was 5 (a grandad who is now 76, he will probably be gone within twenty years at most and those memories will be priceless). However, I would never try and convince others that it's a well written or well produced movie because it isn't by any standard. I can understand why many people hate it, but TO ME it's fantastic. And that's all that should matter to you and this new Turtles film's other supporters. Other people berating it shouldn't affect your own enjoyment of it, but don't try and tell people that it's a great film when it really, really isn't.

This is a great post and I agree with 98% of what you said...its a great way of expressing both sides in a possitive light. However how was I being a dictator or even say this film was without its flaws. I personally feel I said basicly the same thing you did...only you but it better. My comments were not for arguments sake but for putting another spin on what Leo said the responding to someone who responded to my post. Maybe its the way I'm wording it, I don't know but it was to never dictate anyone or claim this movie was perfect however if there was a snarky comment it would have only been the fact that after a break from these forums and coming back, it seems the back and forth arguing hasn't changed.

[Davetello]

This is a great post and I agree with 98% of what you said...its a great way of expressing both sides in a possitive light. However how was I being a dictator or even say this film was without its flaws. I personally feel I said basicly the same thing you did...only you but it better. My comments were not for arguments sake but for putting another spin on what Leo said the responding to someone who responded to my post. Maybe its the way I'm wording it, I don't know but it was to never dictate anyone or claim this movie was perfect however if there was a snarky comment it would have only been the fact that after a break from these forums and coming back, it seems the back and forth arguing hasn't changed.

Thanks. Let me preface my following comments by saying that I don't really post about this particular film in this forum as I don't wanna force my more negative views on the film down other people's throats. I was actually someone who started out pessimistic, became more optimistic as the release date grew nearer, and then had my original pessimism confirmed when i saw the film, so I'm not someone who's been down on the film the whole way. Perhaps some people are being forceful in their opinions and that is going over the top. I'm more referring to people who (like me) might insult the film but not necessarily try to suck others' enjoyment from it.

Don't worry man, I wasn't referring to you specifically with the 'dictator' comment. The reason i didn't quote anyone in particular is because I wasn't referring to any specific user. There are some fans who enjoy the film who feel as I do, and others who try and force its 'quality' down others' throats. The latter would grate but I don't actually have anyone in mind, and you seem to be in the former camp, so that's fine. Equally, there are people who hate this movie who may try and stop others from enjoying it - I don't think that's fair either. What is fair is my perspective - to be critical of the film but respect that others like it for quirky reasons. I'd also assume that some of the forceful critics of this film have very guilty pleasures themselves - things which they will actually argue are very good quality. Hence, for them to attack others for doing so is hypocritical.

Overall what I'm saying is that we both have the same view - neither side should force its views down the others' throats. The only difference is that we are coming at things from opposing polarities in terms of personal enjoyment i.e. you really liked the film and I really didn't. But we agree that other opinions should be respected (with my proviso that the film's fans don't try and convince anyone that this is objectively a great film). So don't worry m8 - none of this was aimed directly at you.

Leo656 is someone whom I like to think I get on well with, and who I communicate well with - I agree with much of his above post but I can understand why fans of the film (who are already feeling sensitive due to the criticism on here) might interpret it in a sanctimonious manner. Leo is obviously a bit more forceful about his views on the melodrama and hype surrounding the film than I am and has more of a problem with people enjoying it as a guilty pleasure than I do. Perhaps he and others have gone too far sometimes - I read threads on the film but I don't go through them with a fine-tooth comb, so I couldn't say with any great certainty who the main aggressors are in either camp. But equally, perhaps he and others were pushed into going too far because others were trying to impress how good they think this film is on others.

I don't know what came first, the chicken or the egg. But I think a good stance to take is to acknowledge that while this is a poor film by any critical standard, it's fine to like it as a guilty pleasure despite its numerous issues. The only problem might be how this enthusiasm affects the turtles going forward - if too many people are positive about this film it sends out the wrong message to the likes of PD and Viacom, and we might keep being served the same sort of thing in the future i.e. things which, while okay as a time sink, really don't do the turtles justice or equal things which came before (Mirage, 4kids, 1990 etc).

[Davetello]

Just to add - I can actually see why you'd think I was speaking to you specifically mate, seeing as my post is directly below yours. That coupled with my specific language i.e. 'you' etc gives off the wrong impression. I was talking about people and sections of the community generally with 'you'. That's something I do a lot. Apologies for the confusion.

Oh, and please don't feel like you have to leave because of your views on this film. The bigger the community and the more volume of opinion the better. Ultimately we all have the same end - love of the turtles. We often disagree in the means to that end, but our ultimate goal is love of the turtles and quality turtles entertainment.

[MajorViolence]

So I missed way too much since my last time dropping in, but I will just interject that while this movie hasn't flopped, it's doing a lot worse than I expected.

[pdizzle]

Just to add - I can actually see why you'd think I was speaking to you specifically mate, seeing as my post is directly below yours. That coupled with my specific language i.e. 'you' etc gives off the wrong impression. I was talking about people and sections of the community generally with 'you'. That's something I do a lot. Apologies for the confusion.

Oh, and please don't feel like you have to leave because of your views on this film. The bigger the community and the more volume of opinion the better. Ultimately we all have the same end - love of the turtles. We often disagree in the means to that end, but our ultimate goal is love of the turtles and quality turtles entertainment.
Thanx for clarifying that for me bro....:D

[Davetello]

Thanx for clarifying that for me bro....:D

No problem. And as I say - don't feel bad for liking the film, or feel pressured into going off it.

[chrisdude]

I can't really agree with this idea that if you like this movie, it's a "guilty pleasure," or that you're entitled to enjoy it - so long as you acknowledge that it's not actually all that great.

There are certainly things about a movie that can judged objectively. What can't be done objectively is to declare them the most important aspects of the movie. It's a matter of opinion how important those things are. I think Superman: The Movie is perfect. I can't say a bad word about it. But even though I could write a list of its problems, I like Superman II more, because I appreciate that story. I feel similarly about the turtles. I'd be hard pressed to find something wrong with the 1990 movie, but I can't say it's as enjoyable an experience as this new one. I prefer this take on the turtles as characters, their looks, seeing them in this scale of action, Donnie's gadgets, etc. That just outweighs the other stuff, for me. The scales wouldn't always tip that way, for me. If it were a different property, I'd care about different things. But I certainly don't feel guilty about it. It's just a matter of what's important to me.

[Davetello]

I can't really agree with this idea that if you like this movie, it's a "guilty pleasure," or that you're entitled to enjoy it - so long as you acknowledge that it's not actually all that great.

There are certainly things about a movie that can judged objectively. What can't be done objectively is to declare them the most important aspects of the movie. It's a matter of opinion how important those things are. I think Superman: The Movie is perfect. I can't say a bad word about it. But even though I could write a list of its problems, I like Superman II more, because I appreciate that story. I feel similarly about the turtles. I'd be hard pressed to find something wrong with the 1990 movie, but I can't say it's as enjoyable an experience as this new one. I prefer this take on the turtles as characters, their looks, seeing them in this scale of action, Donnie's gadgets, etc. That just outweighs the other stuff, for me. The scales wouldn't always tip that way, for me. If it were a different property, I'd care about different things. But I certainly don't feel guilty about it. It's just a matter of what's important to me.

"Guilty pleasure" isn't really a literal term. It's not about feeling guilty (you shouldn't), so it's perhaps a lazy term.

I know exactly what you mean, though. I mean I don't feel comfortable with stating things about this movie are DEFINITELY crap, because most things are subjective. I did say in another thread that it's an easy get out clause to say "it's my opinion so I can't be wrong", but when it comes to entertainment that quote is true in a way. I'm conflicted about this film, because on one hand I see a ton of things which are fundamentally wrong with it, but then what gives me the right to tell people that they're wrong for thinking a certain costume, or storyline, or scene, or piece of dialogue is of good quality? What really gives me that right? It's not like I'm an expert on the matter, and even if critical reception is often poor, the general consensus isn't always correct.

Like I say, I couldn't genuinely say I think it's a good film - overall I think it's pretty poor. But then who am I to tell people how to feel about it? You can't help liking it, so if it clicks for you who am I to try and change that natural feeling? But at the same time I think the film and possible sequels could do some serious damage to the franchise.

Hence, I know exactly what you mean. But at the same time I just can't personally call this film good by any objective measure. I see a lot wrong with it, but perhaps it's not right for people to say that just because they see something wrong that means that you have to too.

[Puddinpop]

I can't really agree with this idea that if you like this movie, it's a "guilty pleasure," or that you're entitled to enjoy it - so long as you acknowledge that it's not actually all that great.

There are certainly things about a movie that can judged objectively. What can't be done objectively is to declare them the most important aspects of the movie. It's a matter of opinion how important those things are. I think Superman: The Movie is perfect. I can't say a bad word about it. But even though I could write a list of its problems, I like Superman II more, because I appreciate that story. I feel similarly about the turtles. I'd be hard pressed to find something wrong with the 1990 movie, but I can't say it's as enjoyable an experience as this new one. I prefer this take on the turtles as characters, their looks, seeing them in this scale of action, Donnie's gadgets, etc. That just outweighs the other stuff, for me. The scales wouldn't always tip that way, for me. If it were a different property, I'd care about different things. But I certainly don't feel guilty about it. It's just a matter of what's important to me.

Well said dude.. I loved this version for the same reasons. The gadgetry.. The fight scenes.. the origin I thought made more sense and I just found it more interesting and modern in a way. Yea it's different but that doesn't make it bad at all. I like change and I'd like to think of myself as a glass is half full kind of guy and the flaws in this film just don't outweigh the positives. I am excited to see where they take it. I am excited to see this story play out and how they progress and improve.

"I know exactly what you mean, though. I mean I don't feel comfortable with stating things about this movie are DEFINITELY crap, because most things are subjective. I did say in another thread that it's an easy get out clause to say "it's my opinion so I can't be wrong", but when it comes to entertainment that quote is true in a way. I'm conflicted about this film, because on one hand I see a ton of things which are fundamentally wrong with it, but then what gives me the right to tell people that they're wrong for thinking a certain costume, or storyline, or scene, or piece of dialogue is of good quality? What really gives me that right? It's not like I'm an expert on the matter, and even if critical reception is often poor, the general consensus isn't always correct.

Like I say, I couldn't genuinely say I think it's a good film - overall I think it's pretty poor. But then who am I to tell people how to feel about it? You can't help liking it, so if it clicks for you who am I to try and change that natural feeling? But at the same time I think the film and possible sequels could do some serious damage to the franchise.

Hence, I know exactly what you mean. But at the same time I just can't personally call this film good by any objective measure. I see a lot wrong with it, but perhaps it's not right for people to say that just because they see something wrong that means that you have to too.

This is what I was saying before. It's nice to read something like this here. I wish other people understood this concept. It is so true. Unfortunately.. Some will never get it lol. It's a " My views tastes and opinions are concrete fact and if you disagree then you're a moron" mentality.
And then it's expanded on like it's fact lol.

[Xiewin]

I was really looking forward the turtles being created as weapons story. It was so interesting, did they really have to cut up the movie like that? Everything I was excited about was taken out just for the purpose of inserting some random Japanese guy.

[Davetello]

This is what I was saying before. It's nice to read something like this here. I wish other people understood this concept. It is so true. Unfortunately.. Some will never get it lol. It's a " My views tastes and opinions are concrete fact and if you disagree then you're a moron" mentality.
And then it's expanded on like it's fact lol.

Life just seems to be like that generally. I definitely don't think it's right to belittle people for enjoying the film.

[GrapeSoda]

very well said Leo



sidenote not to start nothing..but out of those that left..i never felt like most of them would stick around after the movie came out anyways..not naming names or,calling people things..just personally felt that way for a lot of members

i jive with what you're slangin' :twink: and i agree with you. it's why i took an extended break from the 'drome altogether. it was just so toxic here, i couldn't even lurk and read threads...much less post comments. it was so hard to cut the wheat from the chaff.

[Glados]

sidenote not to start nothing..but out of those that left..i never felt like most of them would stick around after the movie came out anyways..not naming names or,calling people things..just personally felt that way for a lot of members

Please keep in mind that some avoid the forums because they haven't seen the movie yet due to different release dates and other reasons, tho. I've been keeping away from this place my self to be spared of major spoilers... but I guess today I was bored enough to dare drop by again (I just try to avoid reading the most spoiler-ish threads)

[M-Frame]

In a perfect world, my ideal TMNT film would be somewhere in between the Marvel Studios and Nolan/Batman approach in terms of tone/style. If the studios/writers/directors and movie-goers can suspend their disbelief when it comes to those franchises then what makes TMNT any different??? However, as a 28 year-old fan who has worshipped TMNT for as long as I can remember, I've known for a long time that'll never happen. It's frustrating that studio heads continue being so hell bent on keeping the franchise toddler/soccer mom friendly in this day and age. Even in 2014, there's still a double standard when it comes to TMNT and that's not fair. With that being said, and I hate using this phrase, I try looking on the bright side. It's amazing the movie was even made. I was honestly shocked it was rated PG-13. Lastly, it's remarkable that it's made as much money as it has. As sad as it may sound, that's a huge step for the franchise, IMO. When you consider all this, the botched production, my admitted bias as a fan, and the many troubling last-minute changes made to placate outraged/butt-hurt fanboys, I give the movie a pass and enjoy it for what it is, despite all its' apparent flaws. I expected an edgier version of the early 90s films and that's what I got. :D

[Leolead]

In a perfect world, my ideal TMNT film would be somewhere in between the Marvel Studios and Nolan/Batman approach in terms of tone/style. If the studios/writers/directors and movie-goers can suspend their disbelief when it comes to those franchises then what makes TMNT any different??? However, as a 28 year-old fan who has worshipped TMNT for as long as I can remember, I've known for a long time that'll never happen. It's frustrating that studio heads continue being so hell bent on keeping the franchise toddler/soccer mom friendly in this day and age. Even in 2014, there's still a double standard when it comes to TMNT and that's not fair. With that being said, and I hate using this phrase, I try looking on the bright side. It's amazing the movie was even made. I was honestly shocked it was rated PG-13. Lastly, it's remarkable that it's made as much money as it has. As sad as it may sound, that's a huge step for the franchise, IMO. When you consider all this, the botched production, my admitted bias as a fan, and the many troubling last-minute changes made to placate outraged/butt-hurt fanboys, I give the movie a pass and enjoy it for what it is, despite all its' apparent flaws. I expected an edgier version of the early 90s films and that's what I got. :D
Sweet! another TMNT fan enjoyed TMNT 2014 :D

:neutral: Get ready for the negative post. :roll:

[Puddinpop]

In a perfect world, my ideal TMNT film would be somewhere in between the Marvel Studios and Nolan/Batman approach in terms of tone/style. If the studios/writers/directors and movie-goers can suspend their disbelief when it comes to those franchises then what makes TMNT any different??? However, as a 28 year-old fan who has worshipped TMNT for as long as I can remember, I've known for a long time that'll never happen. It's frustrating that studio heads continue being so hell bent on keeping the franchise toddler/soccer mom friendly in this day and age. Even in 2014, there's still a double standard when it comes to TMNT and that's not fair. With that being said, and I hate using this phrase, I try looking on the bright side. It's amazing the movie was even made. I was honestly shocked it was rated PG-13. Lastly, it's remarkable that it's made as much money as it has. As sad as it may sound, that's a huge step for the franchise, IMO. When you consider all this, the botched production, my admitted bias as a fan, and the many troubling last-minute changes made to placate outraged/butt-hurt fanboys, I give the movie a pass and enjoy it for what it is, despite all its' apparent flaws. I expected an edgier version of the early 90s films and that's what I got. :D

Well said. It's a very unselfish mentality to have. Some treat TMNT like it belongs to them and that no one has the right to touch it.. not even Eastman. I'm stoked for this sequel :lol:

[Leolead]

See?! TMNT 2014 fans enjoying their selfs! "Nothing last forever" get ready guys..

[Puddinpop]

Get ready guys..

Na lol. Its late. Maybe in a few hours though someone will disagree. Some just cant except that " good and bad " in this case is subjective.

[Leolead]

Na lol. Its late. Maybe in a few hours though someone will disagree. Some just cant except that " good and bad " in this case is subjective.
Yep.. Someone will find a way to turn things negative.

[Galactus]

Sweet! another TMNT fan enjoyed TMNT 2014 :D

Not to speak for this particular user but they did say...

I've known for a long time that'll never happen. It's frustrating that studio heads continue being so hell bent on keeping the franchise toddler/soccer mom friendly in this day and age. Even in 2014, there's still a double standard when it comes to TMNT and that's not fair.

Trying to look on the bright side but still feeling frustration at the product isn't what you feel is the right road doesn't sound like a something that said if someone truly enjoyed it. I could be wrong though.

Yep.. Someone will find a way to turn things negative.

You must be psychic.

[jestermon]

I loved it but just like on the transformers boards their will be people who act like it was the hugest flop regardless of the reality of the money the movie earned or the reception the mass public that matters the most reacts to the movie.

Since they don't like it no one else must either.

[Galactus]

I loved it but just like on the transformers boards their will be people who act like it was the hugest flop regardless of the reality of the money the movie earned or the reception the mass public that matters the most reacts to the movie.

Since they don't like it no one else must either.

No one is arguing that it's a flop and hardly anyone argued that it would be a flop. Just look at the replies to this thread were no one was seriously suggesting it would fail.

I'm perfectly fine with arguing my case about how bad I thought this movie was if it has been a huge runaway hit, after all commercial success doesn't mean quality however in this case it's not necessary. I'd avoid comparisons with the Transformers movies as those have made billions and this movie while not a failure isn't anywhere near that level.

Fans of "Bayformers" can feel justifiably smug in the fact that criticisms of those don't matter because they are huge hits but here I don't think anyone should be feeling so smug...at least not 'till it actually turns a profit.

[ScrewtheMirageTMNT]

Wait What?? So you want me to list the type of movies I like?

Just some. By title. :3

[JTH]

Well it took about a month in theaters, but the fan approval rating dipped below 60%.

Fan Approval says the movie is officially rotten.

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/teenage_mutant_ninja_turtles_2013/

[Coola Yagami]

Well it took about a month in theaters, but the fan approval rating dipped below 60%.

Fan Approval says the movie is officially rotten.

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/teenage_mutant_ninja_turtles_2013/

.... big surprise?

[Autbot_Benz]

who cares what rotten tomatos things all they do is hate on most comic book movies.

[Coola Yagami]

who cares what rotten tomatos things all they do is hate on most comic book movies.

or in this case, confirm what we already know.

[Jester]

who cares what rotten tomatos things all they do is hate on most comic book movies.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t31.0-8/10582760_537218553462_2445963135349416757_o.jpg

[The Stryker]

http://www.kidactivities.net/image.axd?picture=2009%2F7%2Fbored+kid.jpg

[Autbot_Benz]

ok So Rotton Tomatoes only likes Marvel and DC Comic movies good to know

[Jester]

ok So Rotton Tomatoes only likes Marvel and DC Comic movies good to know
Both Hellboy flicks are also pretty well reviewed on RT.

[Autbot_Benz]

I think what I meant to say if its got M Bay in the movie RT will **** on it no matter what.

[Coola Yagami]

I think what I meant to say if its got M Bay in the movie RT will **** on it no matter what.

.... and you say insinuating that this movie wasn't on the same level of lame as the other M Bay movies? Psssh yeah right. Their review is pretty spot on.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

I think what I meant to say if its got M Bay in the movie RT will **** on it no matter what.

ok So Rotton Tomatoes only likes Marvel and DC Comic movies good to know

mmmm i thinks its pretty clear what you meant

[Jester]

I think what I meant to say if its got M Bay in the movie RT will **** on it no matter what.
That one I can give you. A quick look has all as rotten, save The Rock, with 66%.

[Warhorse]

I think what I meant to say if its got M Bay in the movie RT will **** on it no matter what.

But,,, I thought that it was Johnathan Liebesman that directed the movie, not Michael Bay?

[Shark_Blade]

Lame, trashy kiddie movies like Muppet movie and Lego movie were overrated by rottentomatoes. Even higher than most (if not all) Marvel movies.

So that's enough to deem it as unreliable. It's just filled with comic book fanboy nerds and over nostalgic old people.

Imo of course.

[Jester]

Trashy how, exactly??

And I've heard nothing but good about The Lego Movie, and I enjoyed The Muppets, as did a lot of people.

And if it's full of nostalgic old comic book fans, wouldn't TMNT have fared better?

[Coola Yagami]

Trashy how, exactly??

And I've heard nothing but good about The Lego Movie, and I enjoyed The Muppets, as did a lot of people.

And if it's full of nostalgic old comic book fans, wouldn't TMNT have fared better?

Maybe even the old nostalgic comic book fans know better. Even now I'm still surprised by the people that can't see that this is a bad movie.

Sure it did great at the box office. But so did the Transformers sequels.

[neatoman]

When it comes to comic book movie's approval ratings on Rotten Tomatoes, here's a list of of ones considered bad but still better than this movie:

X-Men Origins - Wolverine 38%
Superman III 26%
Ghost Rider 26%
Fantastic Four 27%
Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer 37%
Blade: Trinity 26%
Constantine 46%
The Return of Swamp Thing 33%
The Phantom 43%
Kick-Ass 2 29%
Batman Forever 41%
The Losers 49%
Green Lantern 26%
Daredevil 45%
Men in Black II 39%
The Punisher (2004) 29%
The Punisher (1989) 24%
Punisher: War Zone 27%
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: The Movie 41%
TMNT 34%
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles II - The Secret of the Ooze 31%
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles III 21%

So you'll notice that all of the previous TMNT films (except for Turtles Forever which does not even have reviews counted on Rotten Tomatoes) are all technically in the bad category. So basically, with a higher budget they somehow managed to be worse than the worst of four B-movies that only appeal to a niche group (let's be honest here, TMNT 2007 came the closet to not being a B-movie but it's still noticably low-budget).

Then again, this is all just opinion after all...

[The Stryker]

Maybe even the old nostalgic comic book fans know better. Even now I'm still surprised by the people that can't see that this is a bad movie.

Are you seriously going to start with this 'They need to realize that this one opinion on a movie is the gospel' bullsh*t again?

[Bry]

Well it took about a month in theaters, but the fan approval rating dipped below 60%.

Fan Approval says the movie is officially rotten.

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/teenage_mutant_ninja_turtles_2013/

That score's been steadily dropping since release. And a lot of big-but-bad movies start off with higher fan scores that gradually drop off to reveal a more realistic fan/audience consensus. Similar to the glowing advance online/Twitter impressions that taper off quick. I've been there before too - movies I've been excited about and really wanted to like, but don't live up to expectations and the shine wears off soon after. Their true badness took some time to sink in.

I think what I meant to say if its got M Bay in the movie RT will **** on it no matter what.

I wouldn't say "no matter what". If he'd make another movie that isn't terrible they'd probably go easier on him. He's managed to pull that off once.

Are you seriously going to start with this 'They need to realize that this one opinion on a movie is the gospel' bullsh*t again?

What's the alternative? Getting all indignant every time there's some kind of consensus you don't like?

A bunch of people agreeing that something is "bad" doesn't stop anyone else from enjoying it. And if it does, that's more an issue with that person than anyone else's opinion or an overall consensus. Hey, sometimes an overall consensus is just a whole bunch of peoples' independent opinions happening to align!

[Warhorse]

I think a good consesus to look at in guaging the true appeal of this movie, would be to just look at the traffic that is coming here, and what that traffic is entailing. It's dropped a considerable amount, and the talk is either box office, the sequel, and what people would have done different. There is no analyzing of the plots or characters or talking about the easter eggs thrown in or how badass a certain fight was. There's a little bit here and there, but compared to the likes of say, the 2007 movie, it's embarrassing. At least the 2007 movie had the Leo and Raph fight that kept people talking about it for at least half a year. This movie has been out barely a month, and it's already dropping out of the picture. I am sure that the more stellar Nick toon is rightfully stealing it's thunder. Too bad they just don't take the Nick toon and turn the whole Invasion arc into a big live action theatrical release.

[Xiewin]

Too bad they just don't take the Nick toon and turn the whole Invasion arc into a big live action theatrical release.

Now I would have loved to see something like that instead.

[The Stryker]

What's the alternative? Getting all indignant every time there's some kind of consensus you don't like?

A bunch of people agreeing that something is "bad" doesn't stop anyone else from enjoying it. And if it does, that's more an issue with that person than anyone else's opinion or an overall consensus. Hey, sometimes an overall consensus is just a whole bunch of peoples' independent opinions happening to align!

Okay? I was just talking about this one guy and his insistance to say that people who enjoyed the movie 'haven't realized its bad' or are in denial. And thats crap.

On both sides. Same goes for people saying sh*t like 'Haters will watch it again and love it because blah blah'. It has nothing to do with my personal opinion on the thing.

[Coola Yagami]

Okay? I was just talking about this one guy and his insistance to say that people who enjoyed the movie 'haven't realized its bad' or are in denial. And thats crap.

Don't blame me. Blame the powers-that-be for not making a better movie. It's like you don't think there are daredevil fans that are disaapointed the movie wasn't as good as it could have been? It sucks for them but at least they don't make tons of excuses to cover up the fact that the movie wasn't all that good.

I mean look at the previous posts saying how there isn't that much to discuss in this movie. Well there isn't. There's tons more to discuss about behind the scenes or wondering why Fitchner wasn't shredder after all or even the sequel and expectations. But as for this movie itself, there's really not all that to discuss. The turtles were barely memorably characters. No real scene stood out or made any kind of impact. There was really nothing. Just a bunch if fast paced crap that happened without any downtime to actually know who these characters are.

Like the guy said about the 2007 movie. Also lacking but the fight between Leo and raph, and the fact that raph actually won launched tons of discussion and debates for months.

[The Stryker]

Don't blame me. Blame the powers-that-be for not making a better movie. It's like you don't think there are daredevil fans that are disaapointed the movie wasn't as good as it could have been? It sucks for them but at least they don't make tons of excuses to cover up the fact that the movie wasn't all that good.

Once again you're acting like there is NO POSSIBLE way that someone could genuinely like the movie without 'making excuses' or 'lying to themselves'.

That's garbage.

[Coola Yagami]

Once again you're acting like there is NO POSSIBLE way that someone could genuinely like the movie without 'making excuses' or 'lying to themselves'.

That's garbage.

That's not true. Lots of people genuinely like bad movies. Hell, I like the street fighter movie due to Raul Julia's cheese alone. Yeah, I know it's a bad movie and I'm not gonna defend it to the high heavens to street fighter fans, but I genuinely like it.

[The Stryker]

That's not true. Lots of people genuinely like bad movies. Hell, I like the street fighter movie due to Raul Julia's cheese alone. Yeah, I know it's a bad movie and I'm not gonna defend it to the high heavens to street fighter fans, but I genuinely like it.

And some people genuinely don't think this movie is bad and enjoyed it. What is the problem with that?

I get disliking some of the more vocal supporters but its a bit ridiculous to say everyone should 'accept that its a bad movie'.

[Coola Yagami]

And some people genuinely don't think this movie is bad and enjoyed it. What is the problem with that?

I get disliking some of the more vocal supporters but its a bit ridiculous to say everyone should 'accept that its a bad movie'.

Again, don't look at me. Look at the producers. This is on them since day 1 and the whole alien thing. I know it didn't make the final cut but just the thought that they at one time were actually gonna go through with that already mean we were in for a crap fest.

[The Stryker]

Again, don't look at me. Look at the producers. This is on them since day 1 and the whole alien thing. I know it didn't make the final cut but just the thought that they at one time were actually gonna go through with that already mean we were in for a crap fest.

... Annnnnd there's no use in arguing with you. Bringing up something that has nothing to do with a person's opinion being genuine but whatever.

[Autbot_Benz]

The Stryker Give it up Coola's Opinion is fact about this movie and there is no changing that do what i did and put him on ignore.

[The Boston Ninja Turtle]

And some people genuinely don't think this movie is bad and enjoyed it. What is the problem with that?

I get disliking some of the more vocal supporters but its a bit ridiculous to say everyone should 'accept that its a bad movie'.

i kinda get what he is saying..

its not that this movie is so awful everyone should hate, just more like its a "bad" movie and seems more like a guilty pleasure than a movie that is universally praised

kind of like next mutation...sure it has its fans (myself included) but i wont sit in here and say its the best TMNT series over all the rest...its poorly written, but it has a few elements i do enjoy


not sure if that made sense

[The Stryker]

i kinda get what he is saying..

its not that this movie is so awful everyone should hate, just more like its a "bad" movie and seems more like a guilty pleasure than a movie that is universally praised

kind of like next mutation...sure it has its fans (myself included) but i wont sit in here and say its the best TMNT series over all the rest...its poorly written, but it has a few elements i do enjoy


not sure if that made sense

Sure I get that. But he's saying that EVERYONE should think of it that way and that no one could ever think this new movie is genuinely good.

[Coola Yagami]

i kinda get what he is saying..

its not that this movie is so awful everyone should hate, just more like its a "bad" movie and seems more like a guilty pleasure than a movie that is universally praised

kind of like next mutation...sure it has its fans (myself included) but i wont sit in here and say its the best TMNT series over all the rest...its poorly written, but it has a few elements i do enjoy


not sure if that made sense

Exactly right. Ya see, This guy gets it.

[Bry]

Even accounting for taste, I think it's fair to say something's a "bad movie" if that's provably true. That doesn't mean that it's unenjoyable, or that someone's wrong for liking it - I've seen a lot of movies I've enjoyed the hell out of that I wouldn't call "good". But if it fails on a basic storytelling level -- and I think that we can pretty objectively show that this movie does fail on that level -- then I don't think everyone should have to walk on eggshells about calling a bad movie a bad movie for fear of offending someone or getting snapped at. Sometimes it's just true.

[Coola Yagami]

Even accounting for taste, I think it's fair to say something's a "bad movie" if that's provably true. That doesn't mean that it's unenjoyable, or that someone's wrong for liking it - I've seen a lot of movies I've enjoyed the hell out of that I wouldn't call "good". But if it fails on a basic storytelling level -- and I think that we can pretty objectively show that this movie does fail on that level -- then I don't think everyone should have to walk on eggshells about calling a bad movie a bad movie for fear of offending someone or getting snapped at. Sometimes it's just true.

Another guy that gets it.

[Leo656]

Even accounting for taste, I think it's fair to say something's a "bad movie" if that's provably true. That doesn't mean that it's unenjoyable, or that someone's wrong for liking it - I've seen a lot of movies I've enjoyed the hell out of that I wouldn't call "good". But if it fails on a basic storytelling level -- and I think that we can pretty objectively show that this movie does fail on that level -- then I don't think everyone should have to walk on eggshells about calling a bad movie a bad movie for fear of offending someone or getting snapped at. Sometimes it's just true.

http://www.memecreator.org/static/images/memes/3102173.jpg

[MothraLeo]

Hmm. I think you guys need some perspective. Leading up to this movie, every time it was brought up, or the official Facebook made a post, the comments would fill up with people hating on evrry aspect of this film. Yet after it came out, those same posts full up with people who loved this movie. My Xbox clan's website has a movie thread which was full of very positive reviews. I hate to break it to you guys, but it was a good movie. You may not have liked it, but that is absolutely okay.

I hated Next Mutation.
I hated TMNT 2 and 3.
I loved TMNT 2014.
And I thought it was going to suck.

[Powder]

I hate to break it to you guys, but it was a good movie.

I hate to break it to you, but your opinion isn't a fact. Besides, FB is pure BS anyway.

[Coola Yagami]

I'm not gonna say that everyone is gonna hate this movie. You're entitled to your opinion after all, but honestly, all it's got going for it is the name brand and possibly Megan in tight outfits for those that like her. It's the equivalent of someone liking Batman and Robin just cause Batman is in it, despite everything that happened in the movie. Most of those people already had their minds made up that it was gonna be super-mega-awesome dude, even if April had a make out scene with Splinter, they're still handwave it with those nostalgia glasses. The movie does have pizza and cowabunga after all, which are the only things that matter in anything tmnt related for some.

Now I know many also went in with their minds made up to hate the movie no matter what. I however, went in with a lot of doubts after bad news after bad news after even bad news we kept hearing about the movie. But hey, I'm doing it for the Turtles, so I'll give it a shot.

And yes, from the get-go we see Japanese Shredder looking bad-ass and uttering the famous line from the OT, and we see that they captured April's determination to cover dangerous stories instead of normal harmless interviews and stuff, hell the intro kinda looked like a Mirage comic for a few secs before it turned into 'real life'. I thought to myself, hey this isn't so bad. This is gonna be a good movie after all.

And then the rest of the movie happened. Aside from a few scenes here and there.... it just wasn't that good. Mostly because we barely got to see the title characters themselves and we barely got to know them as characters due to everything being rush, rush, rush. No time for downtime at all. Everything else that ruined it for me is just me repeating myself and everyone else that gave detailed and valid reasons as to why it sucked. And there were a LOT of them, both as a Ninja Turtles movie and as a movie in general.

It just wasn't that good of a movie. I can wish it was awesome all I want. I can't change what I saw.

[LeoRaph]

I hate to break it to you guys, but it was a good movie.


No bro, it's not. It is bad and I mean Razzie bad. This is not opinion. It is a fact, this is being 'panned objectively' on a world wide basis and deservedly so because of the number one reason 'The Script'. It has some and I mean some saving graces with the acting from the bad guys mostly. But it is not enough to save the reincarnation of Blue Door also known as April O'neil/Megan Fox Rules the Universe.

The pace is also a huge problem it is too freaking fast, in fact it's a blur I can barely even remember the movie. The only scene that stands out was Leo's anguish at almost watching his father die. You can thank Pete Ploszek for that and to some degree Johnny Knoxville who sounded a lot like Pete Ploszek for some reason... Apart from that, it's just go go go. You know Michael Bay...er I mean Johnathan Liebesman...

nickeldoeon only have themselves to blame, they chose the wrong production company. They shouldn't have gone with PD, they needed someone who could write intelligently, cast intelligently and they needed someone who could direct martial arts. Not action, not explosions, not things getting smashed or thrown constantly, but actual hand to hand, weapon to weapon, fluid, creative, amazing fight scenes. You need people for this Not Cgi.

There are a lot of people here who do not like this and the people who do like it are a minority. That's saying something. Once the honeymoon period ends and people come to their senses I can guarantee this thing will be at a very low score. Especially by the time of the Razzies next year.

[Xiewin]

I still wonder, Was it Nickelodeon who requested the 100-minute run-time? or was that a decision made by PD themselves?

[Gorilla Grodd]

It's okay to like crap. Many people here love the Fred Wolf toon. But tons of those episodes were awful. It doesn't mean we can't still enjoy them while recognizing that they're pretty poorly written/animated.

I think a lot of people never grew out of that weird stage where they feel embarrassed by liking something that most people think is crap. So to protect their ego they throw up the defensive shell of "Everyone else is stupid and their opinion is wrong and I'm going to rant about it."

I think a lot of people go through this as little kids. I can kind of remember moments of buyers remorse when it came to videogames as a kid where I would defend crappy game purchases because I was still able to have fun with them. But as an objective adult I can now look back on them and recognize that they were bad. It's all just a part of growing up and learning not to take yourself too seriously.

[Warhorse]

I was under the impression that the movie was in works way before the TV show got started, so nick really didn't have a say to what was going to happen. But in the end, Paramount is probably the main one who wanted a shorter run time. Shorter run time means more times to play at the theater in a single day. And really, when was the last time Paramount has made a franchise film that was really any good outside of Marvel's influence?

[Galactus]

Whether something is a "good" or a "bad" movie is of course a matter of opinion however there are things that objectively speaking that are definite flaws; Plot holes, missing or outright avoiding the point of the source material, unfinished cgi etc

I don't think anyone can really deny that this movie has a lot of flaws of those kinds. Too many for me to say that it could be labelled as a good movie. Whether people enjoy it in spite of those and feel it's a "good" movie in that sense is something different.

I think when the dust settles and the hype of a new live action TMNT movie and the first to have a big scale wears off this wont be seen as a "good" movie. It doesn't stand up to a whole lot of scrutiny. The only thing that I can see really improving upon a home release is the ability to fast forward through the first 20 minutes. ;)

Even some of the film's biggest defenders no longer seem to argue the movie's quality but rather pin the flaws on the changes so it's "our" fault. That's a neat way to absolve the movie, isn't it?

[Xiewin]

I was under the impression that the movie was in works way before the TV show got started, so nick really didn't have a say to what was going to happen. But in the end, Paramount is probably the main one who wanted a shorter run time. Shorter run time means more times to play at the theater in a single day. And really, when was the last time Paramount has made a franchise film that was really any good outside of Marvel's influence?

If that's the case, then I expect two more terribly rushed movies in the next couple of years.

[RaphaelinSTL]

Hmm. I think you guys need some perspective. Leading up to this movie, every time it was brought up, or the official Facebook made a post, the comments would fill up with people hating on evrry aspect of this film. Yet after it came out, those same posts full up with people who loved this movie. My Xbox clan's website has a movie thread which was full of very positive reviews. I hate to break it to you guys, but it was a good movie. You may not have liked it, but that is absolutely okay.

Top Facebook posts are generally filled with moronic statements, so any praise doesn't surprise me.

Even some of the film's biggest defenders no longer seem to argue the movie's quality but rather pin the flaws on the changes so it's "our" fault. That's a neat way to absolve the movie, isn't it?

Exactly. As opposed to them defending why they enjoyed certain aspects of the film and explaining why they think the plot holes aren't as jarring to them or how these rushed, rewritten re-shoots help the film...some people on here just whine about how we're still not accepting the film as it is and criticizing it.