Good and Bad things about all TMNT

[Sparvid]

After reading a little about the "new vs old" debates, I had an idea. List all the different TMNT comics/TV shows/movies that you have seen, and say one good thing and one bad thing about it. No more, no less. And no "missing" things (like "One bad thing with the Archie comics is that Casey never appeared"), it should be things that were actually included.


Mirage comics:
Good: The action
Bad: (I swear, this one is the hardest...) Err, the clearly out-of-continuity issues

Archie comics:
Good: Ninjara!
Bad: The earliest issues

Image comics:
Good: Raph as leader of the Foot
Bad: Mutilations

First movie:
Good: The suits
Bad: The sped-up clips

Second movie:
Good: Shredder's return scene was somewhat cool
Bad: Dance scene

Old cartoon
Good: The Technodrome was a good concept (when filled with fuel, and not stuck anywhere)
Bad: Pizza

New cartoon
Good: The action scenes!
Bad: Some of Mike's goofiness

[The Master]

Mirage comics:
Good: Action, story, characters, art. (sorry)
Bad: Eastman and Laird allowing Hedden McWeeney to do issues.

Archie comics:
Good: Cool new characters.
Bad: Kind of shallow.

Image comics:
Good: Art.
Bad: Character mutilations.

First movie:
Good: You name it.
Bad: Where?

Second movie:
Good: Comedy
Bad: Keno

Old cartoon
Good: Krang
Bad: Turned the Turtles weak.

New cartoon
Good: Animation
Bad: Not a lot, really.

[Deathknight]

Pizza a bad part? I would think you might say that how the action was toned down was bad. The only thing I didn't like about Pizza in the old cartoon was how they sometimes used it as a weapon, I thought that was stupid.

[Leo656]

Mirage comics:
GOOD: Plot depth
BAD: The fact that it was black and white (I know, I know, it just hurts my eyes)

Archie comics:
GOOD: Good character development
BAD: Some of the dialogue was really cheesy, particularly the early issues

Image comics:
GOOD: An interesting way to keep the TMNT property alive through some of the lean years
BAD: Too many shocking changes and mutilations

First movie:
GOOD: Great plot
BAD: Umm... none of the deleted scenes ended up on the DVD.

Second movie:
GOOD: Kevin Nash as Super Shredder
BAD: Vanilla Ice

Third movie: (I noticed you "forgot" this one :wink: )
GOOD: April showed some leg :lol:
BAD: Some of the comedy was really hit or miss, leaning towards "miss"

Old cartoon:
GOOD: Incredibly entertaining when I was 7
BAD: Too many pizza jokes

The Next Mutation:
GOOD: It attempted to make the TMNT popular again
BAD: The writing was pretty bad

New cartoon:
GOOD: A great mix of the Mirage comic with some new ideas
BAD: Sometimes Mike acts a bit too close to his old cartoon self

[Jephael]

Mirage comics:
GOOD: lots of great storylines and settings
BAD: not enough character interaction

Archie comics:
GOOD: plenty of interesting characters and settings
BAD: the Mutanimals being killed

Image comics:
GOOD: good storylines
BAD: Don being killed and turned into a cyborg

First movie:
GOOD: the costumes, the plot
BAD: the editing

Second movie:
GOOD: the costumes and storyline again
BAD: Vanilla Ice

Third movie:
GOOD: the storyline (although Renet could've been used)
BAD: costumes

Original cartoon:
GOOD: the turtles being shown as laid-back teens
BAD: Burne dissing the TMNT every second and Vernon kissing his ass!

The Next Mutation:
GOOD: interesting costumes
BAD: bad writing

New cartoon:
GOOD: mirrors Mirage to a tee and even throws in stuff from the original toon
BAD: Baxter resembles Urkel just alittle too much.

[DarkNinja]

Movie 1
good: plot
bad: I don't think it bothers anyone else, but I'm annoyed at Donatello's face...it looks fat. (someone punch me). :lol:

Movie 2
good: costumes (in my opinion)
bad: Splinter laughing about Turtles being on front of newspaper (it's not like him).

Movie 3
good: feudal Japan :)
bad: costumes (the huge eyes, look the same, and huge spots all over)

Original Cartoon
good: just awesome
bad: not as detailed as I would have liked...

New Cartoon
good: detailed living forms (human and mutated)
bad: nothing yet...

Next Mutation
good: I always watched it when I got home from school (hey, it was the TMNT)
bad: a little corny :roll:

[Taloniss]

Mirage comics:
Good: Action, story
Bad: Hard to find old issues

Archie comics:
Good: Cool original characters
Bad: silliness

Image comics:
Good: Art
Bad: Character changes

First movie:
Good: Story, Costumes, Action
Bad: Nothing!

Second movie:
Good: Tokka and Rahzar were cool
Bad: Keno, Night Club scene

Old cartoon
Good: Krang, Technodrome, Sparked TMNT phenomanon
Bad: Silliness

New cartoon
Good: Animation, Action, True to comics
Bad: Nothing

[Dr. Doom]

Mirage comics:
GOOD: The best incarnation so far. Amazing storylines with no limitations.
BAD: Not that easy to get ahold of. And Jim Lawson.

Archie comics:
GOOD: Great alternative to the old show. Nice artwork and great storylines again.
BAD: The early issues. And it ended kinda suddenly, didn't it?

Image comics:
GOOD: Awsome way to break TMNT away from the old show and do some stuff that the mature fans had been waiting and dreaming for.
BAD: Leo's arm, Raph face, and especialy Cyborg Don. Also ended abruptly.

First movie:
GOOD: Amazing. State of the art SFX in 1989/90. Great story that stayed true to Mirage.
BAD: Corey Feldman

Second movie:
GOOD: Adam Carl, better suits, very fun, humorous movie.
BAD: Vanilla Ice, Keno, a bit more childish.

Third movie:
GOOD: Casey was back! Not that bad a soryline, and AWSOME title music.
BAD: Costumes, Corey Feldman, Splinter.

Original cartoon:
GOOD: Got me into TMNT as well as many others, spawned movies/games/archie/figures/etc., plus the theme song.
BAD: Too childish for me to relate to anymore.

The Next Mutation:
GOOD: Some good voice actor in it, although I don't think some of them quite fit their parts.
BAD: Everything else. Costumes, Venus, the works.

New cartoon:
GOOD: Very true to Mirage, great animation and voice acting, brought TMNT back into the spotlight.
BAD: "Shell" this and "shell" that.

[Stone Ill]

Mirage comics:
Good: The thing that started it all.
Bad: The style kind of the humans bug me.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 1:
Good: Very good plot.
Bad: The low quality film. It look a little grainy.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 2:
Good: The costumes were very good.
Bad: Tokka and Rahzar.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 3:
Good: OKAY concept.
Bad: Not a very believable storyline, given that mutant turtles ARE real. :P

The original TMNT toon:
Good: Got the turtles really popular.
Bad: The jokes.

The new TMNT toon"
Good: The art/animation and storyline.
Bad: Too many shell puns..I mean c'mon, what the shell?

[Tetsu Deinonychus]

GREAT thread idea Sparvid :)

Mirage Comics:
Good: Plot, Artwork, Action, Everything
Bad: TOTAL lack of availability

Old Cartoon:
Good: Great supporting characters, Every Turtle had a love-interest
Bad: Too dumbed down at times, transformation powers

Action Figures:
Good: Well-made, fun to play with!
Bad: Jim Lee!

Archie Comics:
Good: Ninjara, Like a combination of old cartoon and Mirage
Bad: Killed off all best characters!

Video Games:
Good: Action packed!
Bad: A little repetitive

Movie 1:
Good: Corey Feldman :P , Mirage based
Bad: Multi-colored Masks! (It's supposed to be Mirage-based!)

Movie 2:
Good: Tokka and Rahzar, Kevin Nash
Bad: Dumb plot, Vanilla Ice

Movie 3:
Good: Great Concept!, Feudal Japan
Bad: the rest

Image Comics:
Good: Raph as the new Shredder, Pimiko
Bad: Mutilations, sweeping changes, dumb ideas, Erik Larson

New Cartoon:
Good: Mirage-based, Great-animation, Anime-influenced
Bad: Multi-colored Masks! (It's supposed to be Mirage-based!)

Dreamwave:
Good: LeSean :D , "New Archie Series"
Bad: Issues #2 and #3 are a rehash of Mirage issue #2

[Fugitoid Jones]

Mirage Comics
Good: Grittiness (I could list a ton of other stuff, but it's only supposed to be 1)
Bad: Guest artists/writers

Archie Comics
Good: Great storylines in the later issues, also introduced new characters.
Bad: First couple of issues were too goofy.

Image Comics
Good: Art
Bad: After a while, it wasn't even the TMNT, they were kinda like something else that in one point in time resembled the TMNT.

First Movie
Good: More Mirage based. (grittiness was extra cool)
Bad: um....my mind is drawing a blank.

Second Movie
Good: Dialogue was still a little funny.
Bad: I could really go off on this one, but mainly Keno. (I hated him even more than Vanilla Ice.

Third Movie
Good: The return of Casey Jones
Bad: Lots of stuff, but mainly the costumes.

Old Cartoon
Good: The first bunch of episodes were good.
Bad: The rest of the episodes were better when I was 7.

New Cartoon
Good: Neat mix of Mirage and old cartoon.
Bad: Mikey can be a little too much sometimes.

By the way, I like Corey Feldman as Don, no where's in the original comics does it give the impression that Don's voice has to sound totally geeky. Just cause he's smart, doesn't mean he has to sound like Rick Moranis. Plus, the first movie looked grainy to some was because it not only was an independent film which can't really afford the best film to shoot with, but also a lot of movies from the late 80's, early 90's look like that.

[Dr. Doom]

-=curbs corey feldman=-

[Karpo_007]

Mirage comics:
Good: Best Written TMNT
Bad: Some guest artist issues weren't up to par

Archie comics:
Good: Good plot
Bad: Some of the art wasn't that good

Image comics:
Good: Few good ideas
Bad: Most ideas were bad

First movie:
Good: Good balance between Original TMNT and comedy
Bad: I heard it was cut severely

Second movie:
Good: Suits were ok
Bad: Made for children and all that comes with it

Old cartoon
Good: First season, good action and comedy
Bad: Gradually degraded to just comedy

New cartoon
Good: Excellnt writing team has been able to create Mirage based show suitable for children.
Bad: There have been some compromises

[Tetsu Deinonychus]

I would REALLY like to hear about what got cut out of the first movie, and of the new show's compromises. Could you elaberate?

[Karpo_007]

Everyone who has watched the show should know... So far Raph and Leo very rarely use their weapons to anything else than blocking. When a battle is over it seems that the foot ninja are only knocked out, I don't think that the TMNT have caused the death of any of the foot ninjas. Except maybe the two who fell down of a building in Shredder strikes part 1. It's still pretty impressive what they can do with a show that has rating of 7.

About the deleted scenes, I know only what I have learned from interviews, Judith Hoag said that the movie lost lots of it's soul due to editing, and I remember reading that some battle scenes got edited to. Nothing specific I can remember tough.

[uviuar]

-Old cartoon (1st season only)-
Good:Nicely stylized and shaded japanese animation style, very unique voices, great personalities and diversity of voice ranges

Bad:Inconsisten drawing style, some sloppy animation, absurd amt of bloopers


-New cartoon-
Good:Consistent quality level of animation, more attention to actual fight choreography, more violent

Bad:Horribly misplaced style for eyes, always blank and always frowning, the intention was good but it just doesnt work. Too much reliance on weapon blurs for lack of effort, (everyone can just twirl their weapons into a circuluar blur of destruction, which is neither realistic nor fun to look at, too easy to do)[/b]

[jeff the cheff]

New cartoon good- Awesome stories
New cartoon bad-When they said "Turtles Forever!" and how the art for the new tmnt always has ying-yangs

[Deathknight]

Old Cartoon
Good- Very funny cartoon, Krang, Technodrome, Dimension X, Shredder
Bad- Pizza as a combat weapon, comedy was sometimes taken too far
New Cartoon
Good- Plenty of action, good voice actors, and well written stories
Bad- Nano, GarbageMan, bad theme, the TMNT being portrayed weaker than they actually are in some spots.
1st movie-
Good- Perfect blend of cartoon and mirage, well written, plenty of action, good costumes
Bad- Severely cut
2nd movie-
Good- Well thought out plot, was pretty funny
Bad- New actress that played April, action toned down way too much, no Casey, Vanilla Ice
3rd movie-
Good- Action somewhat increased, return of Casey, and funny
Bad- Too many TV references, no Shredder, plot wasn't that good.

[SkaterMike]

Mirage comics:
GOOD: Stories, characters
BAD: Hard to find

Archie comics:
GOOD: Good ideas for new characters and storylines
BAD: Art not too great

Image comics:
GOOD: A new direction for the series, characters
BAD: Too much radical change

First movie:
GOOD: Story, action, dialogue
BAD: Nothing

Second movie:
GOOD: Story, comedy
BAD: The whole dance scene thing, not much use of weapons

Third movie:
GOOD: Casey jones returns
BAD: Casey has a crappy part, horrible villians and execution of the story (time travel isn't that bad of an idea, just the way they did it)

Old cartoon:
GOOD: The Technodrome, all the cool characters
BAD: Not too much character depth in the turtles

The Next Mutation:
GOOD: Tried to revive the franchise and continue the story
BAD: Writing, Venus

New cartoon:
GOOD: Excellent story and characters, better fight scenes, artwork
BAD: Not much that I can think of

[Roseangelo]

Mirage Comics (Vol. 1&2):
Good: The successful combination of action, adventure, and heart.
Bad: Hedden McWeeney

Image Comics:
Good: Frank Fosco's art & the first five issues aren't all that bad.
Bad: There's a lot, but CyborgDon is the worst.

Mirage Comics (Vol. 4):
Good: Michael Dooney's cover paintings. *drool*
Bad: For the last few issues in particular, I've had the feeling that something was missing. And honestly, I think the thing missing is Kevin Eastman.

Archie Comics:
Good: Chris Allen's art and the stories he helped develop.
Bad: That it ended! That was so not fair..

Dreamwave Comics:
Good: Brilliant writing and art
Bad: Selling your own variant cover at Comic-Con for $10! I got it for cover price from my comic store. What's up with that?

Old Cartoon:
Good: Insanely wacky/funny at times. And there are some really good episodes that are actually on the more serious side.
Bad: The last two seasons.

New Cartoon:
Good: Everything
Bad: I have to miss the first new episode *cry*

Next Mutation:
Good: I loved the humor.
Bad: I don't hate the character, but I think the series could have been stronger without Venus.

Movie 1:
Good: Honestly, everything. It's a brilliant movie.
Bad: Knowing that most people who saw the movie don't understand the depth it has.

Movie 2:
Good: The costumes.. they're just so adorable!
Bad: Keno & Keno's whining

Movie 3:
Good: Fabulous story.
Bad: Lack of a special effects budget.

[That Matt Guy]

NOBODY DID THIS ONE YET!

Coming Out of Their Shells:
Good: Power ballads about pizza.
Bad: The Turtles, Splinter's head, Shredder, Barry Manilow, Baxter Stockman, April, The Foot, The dances, The costumes, The audience, Kip.

[Tetsu Deinonychus]

Everyone who has watched the show should know... So far Raph and Leo very rarely use their weapons to anything else than blocking. When a battle is over it seems that the foot ninja are only knocked out, I don't think that the TMNT have caused the death of any of the foot ninjas. Except maybe the two who fell down of a building in Shredder strikes part 1. It's still pretty impressive what they can do with a show that has rating of 7.

About the deleted scenes, I know only what I have learned from interviews, Judith Hoag said that the movie lost lots of it's soul due to editing, and I remember reading that some battle scenes got edited to. Nothing specific I can remember tough.OK, well maybe the new movie won't be overedited.
I wonder if there's a director's cut of the first movie out there somewhere.

[Roseangelo]

Peter Laird has a tape that has some of the cut footage, but that's about it. Whether or not we ever get to see that.. who knows.

[Karpo_007]

Chances for a driector's cut seem pretty small... But let's hope it will happen someday.

[Ninja Turtles Cartoon Fan]

First Movie
Good: The costumes were well-done.
Bad: I'll never forget how disappointed I was when I first watched this movie. I thought it was going to be based off the original cartoon. Yeesh, that most certainly did not happen.

Second Movie
Good: The part at the beginning of the movie where Donatello beats the heck out of that ski-masked mugger with a foam bat was absolutely hilarious.
Bad: Vanilla Ice; need I say more? "Ninja . . . Ninja Rap!" Don't even get me started.

Third Movie
Good: Everything. I liked this film. Too bad there's only about seven of us in the entire universe who think the same way.
Bad: Casey Jones was wasted in this movie. He could have been used more.

Original Cartoon
Good: Everything.
Bad: Getting rid of all the things that made the show a success and replacing them with Dregg and Company.

New Cartoon
Good: For some reason, the wide-screen thing the animators do all the time really clicks with me.
Bad: The Turtles without eyeballs. Somebody, for the love of God, fix that. Please.

Coming Out of Their Shells
Good: The music. It should have won a Grammy Award.
Bad: The two videos and the actual concert. I love those green guys, but even I have to admit those videos are garbage. Not to mention the concert.

The Next Mutation
Good: While it was on, it forced me to watch.
Bad: Shredder, the Foot Clan, the costumes; a.k.a. just about everything. I give the show an "A" for effort, but a "D" in execution.

"Hey, boss. This is me callin'. Bebop."
"Really? And all the time, I thought it was Santa Claus!"

Bebop and Shredder, from "Turtles, Turtles, Everywhere"

[impetus]

Mirage Comics (Vol. 1&2):
Good: Everything except...
Bad: bi-monthly (and late) :roll:

Image Comics:
Good: Cyber Don!!!!
Bad: Raph going to a strip club :o

Archie Comics:
Good: Raph in all black.
Bad: see "Old Cartoon"

Dreamwave Comics:
Good: art!!!
Bad: those bandanas are all wrong... :P

Old Cartoon:
Good: introduced me to the TMNT! :)
Bad: introduced me to the wrong TMNT :lol:

The Movie:
Good: dialogue!! :evilgrin:
Bad: dumbed-down PG flavor :dead:

The Other Movies:
Good: it's for the kiddies
Bad: it's for the kiddies

[Tetsu Deinonychus]

I would definately reverse what you said about the Image comics! :lol:

Also, I almost forgot just how freaking cool Raph was in that all black suit. I used to get pissed off at the old cartoon for not using it.

[Leo656]

I agree with Tetsu about the Image comics. :lol:

And maybe I'm just dumb but I just do NOT get what the big deal is about bandana colors. I mean, yeah, they were all red in Mirage..... but then again the original Superman logo was always changing between various combinations of red, yellow, and black (the shape changed in almost every panel too). Just because something is an "original" design doesn't really make it "better" necessarily.... I just don't see the big deal. ((shrug))

I'm just dumb I guess.