If the Turtles all had to change rolls for a day...
 

Who do you think would replace each one the best?

Like, who do you think would make the best leader after Leonardo, best machine guy after Donatello, etc. Without giving 1 Turtle multiple roles, the whole team has to switch roles.

I don't think they really have "roles."

Leo - Don
Raph- Mike

That's how I see it at least. Donny often saved the day & had great solutions, like a leader. Raph was always wisecrackin', & since mikey is a jokester too, they'd easily trade places. As for Leo, he's very bright and intuitive, I'm sure he could figure out some tech.

I dunno man, I still feel Mike's holding out on showing his smarts. He prefers to play, but I could see him getting into something HE liked and tinkering around like Don. And of course everyone know Raph and Leo could switch it up. :)

I'd agree with Powder, at least on the Leo - Don bit. Leo is smart enough to get into heavy tech, he would just have to put his mind to it really. It's just not his passion like it is Don's. Likewise, I'd wager Donny could be (and has shown himself to be) a great leader and he could rise to Leo's level in martial arts if he wanted to. What it comes down to is that they just want different things and their personalities just aren't wired that way - but since this is a "what if" type of thread, it's okay to speculate.

I'm not sure really where that would leave Mikey & Raph, though. I do not see Mike "switching" roles with Raph, simply for the fact that although they both have gigantic hearts in the emotional sense, Michelangelo far surpasses Raphael in both patience and mutability.

I'm not sure OT Raphael could switch with Michaelangelo. It would annoy him having to be so cheerful all the time, lol.

And just because you're smart like Leonardo doesn't mean you'll have any sort of technical skills.

It's like how some people are good with words and others are good at math. And very bad at whatever their opposite is, lol.

Interesting debate though! :)

I can imagine Raph sighing as he's forced to talk like a surfer.... and Mike struggling to come up with clever wisecracks/putdowns.

I find it funny how all 4 turtles has been seen skateboarding, yet in Rennasance Turtle, Leo suddenly couldn't skateboard and said Mike was the expert.

The only Turtle whose "role" couldn't be filled by one of the others stepping up would be Michelangelo, IMHO. I don't think any of the other Turtles are as creative as he is.

Leo's "Leader" role is pretty meaningless (he's Splinter's successor but by the time Splinter dies the Turtles have already fulfilled their purpose of killing Saki and the they basically break up by then) so any of the others could step in as that.

Donatello's tech-savvyness is pretty overstated and mostly just by fans all too eager to pigeonhole each Turtle into cute little "slots": Leo the Leadery One, Raph the Angry One, Don the Computery One, Mikey the Jokery one... if you really subscribe to that then it all begins to feel a little bit like some kind of New Kids on the Block/Backstreet Boys/N*Sync. You know, where the little girls each get to crush on the one of them that suits their mood or whatever -- it's best to treat the Turtles as whole, well-rounded multi-dimensional characters whose moods and emotions are allowed to go beyond what the back of their action figure cardboard said, I say.

And it wasn't like Don took a couple of years off of ninja training to go to ITT Technical Institute or anything... the other Turtles could probably just read the same books he did and apply themselves similarly if need be to fix the water heater or fix April's car or whatever.

Pickles & ice cream
Pepperoni & licorice
Peanut butter & caramel fudge
Whipped cream & peppers

They exchanged pastries?

It's called "The Convenient Plot Device Syndrome." ;)

To me, at least regarding the OT, Donatello didn't need to go to a Technical school. He's clearly a child prodigy. Now whether it's because of the mutagen or because he was already a special little turtle before that happened to him, we'll never know, lol. :tgrin:

Donatello is naturally gifted in the tech field - I would wager that the other Turtles (with perhaps the exception of Leonardo after careful study) couldn't do as good a job/better job than him on repairing, etc. It's just Don's thing. It's not his only thing by any means, of course.

That being said, I do agree to an extent with what Andrew is saying about the other Turtles being (hypothetically) somewhat decent at repairs if they took the time to read a book or something of the sort - like I stated in my first post I do think the other Turtles could learn a lot of the stuff Donny knows, if they took the time and energy to do it.

I also agree that the Turtles shouldn't be pidgeon-holed into the typical OT roles. They all have many different facets in their personalities. In the comics they're much more fleshed out, very well rounded characters.

Andrew, I'm guessing by "creative" you mean artistic? As in the field of writing, art, word craft, etc? In this I would agree that Michelangelo is top dog but surely Donatello is the most creative in a different realm of passions, especially when we're talking higher technology.

Right.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but what would be some examples of Donatello showing a high degree of creativity via his passions?

Well repairing is one thing. Inventing and brainstorming ideas is quite another and I don't think that's something the other turtles could just learn by reading more.

Like what?

Maybe I'm mistaken, but didn't the title of the thread say the 1987 turtles? 'Cause I sure as hell was talking about the OT...

Not that I saw. And I sure wasn't talking about the "OT" Turtles.

Well, it depends on what medium you are talking about. I doubt I need to give examples if we are talking the OT or the 2k3 show as Don clearly developed many different/bizarre inventions. If you are talking about the comics, I can cite at least one example from the top of my head: Donny built his normal sized turtle robot body after being shrunk. Albeit it was rather necessary, it was still a creative approach. I don't think you'd specifically count this since it goes outside of Mirage canon, but in the "TMNT" Donatello Prequel he invents a software that can track other strange/abnormal non-humans (which leads him to one of the 13 monsters).

I would agree that the other Turtles simply do not organically have what Donatello has in the realm of technology. They do not think the same way as he, therefore they would not be able to produce or think as he does concerning higher technology. I was talking about repairing random household gadgets, etc. which Donatello does the bulk of throughout Volume 1 & 4 (V1 #11, V4 #3, etc.)

I think we are all talking about different mediums of the Turtles. Herein lies the confusion. Andrew's probably talking comics, others perhaps the OT.

Well.. the others might learn how to fix the TV if they read up on it... but that doesn't mean they'd be able to create all the devices and vehicles Donatello always did.

I love this analysis. You read my mind.:tsmile:


I'm hoping everyone is talking about all mediums. I wouldn't want to think Mikey, Leo, or Raph wouldn't be capable of doing something else. I don't think their characteristics change in other incarnations. They're the TMNT. They should never really change.

And yes, I agree with you that Don's brothers wouldn't be able to work with higher technology.

ANYWAY: My analysis . . .

I believe whatever role each turtle has only reflects on what they like to do the most. Leo likes to lead, Don likes to invent machines, Mikey likes to be a fun loving goofball, and Raph likes to be the courageous hothead. Those make them who they are. But things can tend to switch. Don, Raph and Mike are leaders, too, if you think about it. Don would lead the way with his brain power, while Raph can lead when Leo is captured (just not full time- he'll need practice). As for Mikey, I think he's a leader in making things comical when things are always not. Don is the brains of the group who comes up with the inventions. Leo invents, too. Not really gadgets, but tactics and strategies. Leo's got some brains, especially for leading a team and having the ninja experience. Raph's also an inventor, but at wisecraking or coming up with ways to pick on his brothers. Mikey of course has a brain, as a few don't tend to believe. He just a goofball. But not all goofballs are dumb. Besides, just like Leo, he's got a good memory, especially if it's derived from pop culture. As for being funny, I can see all of them being funny in their own way. They can all have a sense of humor. They just don't have to be silly or clown around to do it, though. As for losing their tempers, I could see Mikey losing his if he's having a bad day. I can even see Don beating the crap out of a Foot Ninja that's trying to hurt April.:tlol: As for Leo, who may get really angry at Shredder if Splinter was killed.

Just to sum it up, they all have these characteristics. But when you're talking about who they are and what's their positions, you don't say "Leonardo is the leader, brains, rebel, and sometimes funny one of the group." That's too much. They may have these, but it's the strengths they use the most that makes them who they are. That's why Leo's the leader and Don's the brains and so on.:tsmile:

I think it's kind of a fallacy to look at any of the spinoff universes to define the Turtles. Whatever personality traits and such (like Don being smarter than an MIT graduate or Cowabunga Mikey) became grafted onto them in the children's spinoffs, any discussion about core character traits of the TMNT should pretty much begin and end with the TMNT as written by Kevin and Peter in the Mirage material.

OK, sermon over.

Does he, though? I can't recall much of anything to indicate he actually ever derived any pleasure from "leading." And did he ever even lead? He always struck me as sort of more of a "leader-in-training"... meaning, Splinter's understudy in case he passes away. The actual leadership came from one party alone -- Splinter.

Actually, Splinter is like the official leader since Leo's in training. I like to see Splinter as the captain and Leo as the first officer. You know, like Captain Picard and Commander Riker.:tlol:

Oh hey, I'm a big fan of purity too when it comes to entertainment. But at the same time, if I feel a different incarnation (such as OT or the movies) is also decent in its own right, in its own way, then I don't mind bringing them into the conversation.

OT for instance may have been technically a "children's show." But it was cleverly and skillfully written and performed. I'd like to see many of today's adult shows do better! That's what's most important for me.

Andrew, 90% of threads in this section of the board pertain to the Fred Wolf turtles, so it's only fair to use those personalities for example.
If this thread were in the comic section, your feelings would apply.

I've often wondered why Andrew ventures into the Non-Mirage sections of the Turtle forums, as we all know by now how he feels about the Rainbow-Brite Mutant Ninja Turtles.

So what do you guys think of my analysis? Do you agree? I'm curious to hear your viewpoints.

I know it was very long, but I got too excited typing it.:tlol: Just read the main point at the very end if you like. :tsmile: