Baxter Stockman as a Fly or a Cyborg?
 

Baxter Stockman is one character who can never seem to catch a break. While he did turn himself into a cyborg without any "punishments" in the Mirage comics you can't help but feel sorry for the guy being turned into a fly when attempted to be killed and being "punished" to the point he turs himself into a cyborg. I personally have always found him more interesting as Baxter the fly opposed to a cyborg. Which did you like seeing best? I don't mind either way as I liked both ideas, but I am leaning towards the mutant fly because I always found that take a little more interesting. Also, in case if effects the poll results Baxter's race can be either black or white I am just curious if you all like the idea of his as cyborg or a fly or vice versa or see him as a human from beginning to end. Would you like to see either in an upcoming version? Thanks for contributing!

I prefer him as a fly in the cartoons but a cyborg in the comics.

For example I am hoping IDW goes the cyborg route, but I would prefer Nick to turn him into a fly in the cartoon.

In general? I like the cyborg route that Mirage Volume 2 went... seemed a natural "evolution" of his character.

Was there even any payoff to making Baxter a fly in the Fred Wolf cartoon? Seemed like just something random they decided to do to him. Like they just saw Jeff Goldblum in "The Fly" and went "That's so cool, let's do something like that" only without the "cool" part.

About the current IDW book: If any and all notable villains are to be either mutants and aliens in IDW TMNT (and right now this seems likely) then he ought to stay human there.

In the original cartoon Baxter tried to get revenge on Shredder/Krang in every appearance for turning him into a fly. Since his mind deteriorated Shredder also tricked him into helping him almost every time too.

OK... but I mean, no payoff for specifically making him a fly and not... say, a moose or a hippo or something equally random?

I remember Peter posting old sketches of fly Baxter for Playmates back in 1987. I think the idea was PL's actually. I wish I could find that old blog post.

Here it is:
http://peterlairdstmntblog.blogspot....ter%20Stockman

Peter told me that the two things he liked about the original cartoon was the Technodrome and Baxter turning into a fly as a homage to The Fly which was remade in 1986. He never came out and said if either were his ideas but I am sure he influenced both.

I would have liked to see him demutate back into a human at least once in the old toon. I felt sorry for him for being a fly for too long.

I felt really sorry for him in the new toon after what happened in Insane In The Membrane, he seemed so close to getting a real human body, and it wasn't even done in 2105.

That doesn't answer my question.

Why not a mix of both? Have him have a similar arc where he keeps losing his body and becomes a cyborg and when he tries to become a human again like in the 2k3 show instead of his body rotting away he starts becoming like a fly.

I like both versions but I do think the fly is a little bit neater.

Well they very likely made him a fly for that exact reason but I do think there was a payoff, instead of being one of many generic mad scientists or robot villains the OT had instead we had another mutant which early in the OT there really weren't that many, he could fly and his "fly" personality was interesting, he kept getting dumber/losing his mind through out the series and man each episode of Baxter you just feel terrible for him and his appearances were always memorable in some way. If he had been a moose or hippo who knows but it's easier to accept that the more time as a fly he became more stupid like a fly.


Well it would have been a nice final episode, you do feel sorry for him the entire show, especially when re-watching Season 1 and you realize he didn't really do anything wrong besides being tricked and landed up in Jail. And all the times he was a villain in the OT as a fly it was because he couldn't tell the difference anymore as a fly for what was happening, he was confused. It's only S2 where he is more of a villain as a human but even then he seems to be following orders from Shredder like he is threatened or brainwashed.

At least Baxter in 2k3 was a villain all along, it wasn't until later that you start feeling sorry for him but even then he made plenty of evil actions he couldn't justify unlike OT Baxter. And Baxter did get a feel good ending in Fast Forward even if he had been a bad guy all along.

I voted Human, because that is the way I would like to see him stay in the IDW comics. I think he can be a great reoccuring villain as a smart competent and slightly obsessed, but not insane villain. I think it would be cool if he creates Slash as a way to try and catch the turtles to make up for losing the mutagen in the vandalization by The Foot. He may be one of the few villains to be fully human (hopefully Shredder is as well). But I like both the cyborg and Fly incarnations we've seen in the past. I always felt a little bad for Baxter being stuck as a fly in the OT partly because he wasn't a full blown crazy evil villain like he was in the comics. But if IDW does decide to take him past being human, I would rather see him become a Cyborg instead of a Fly. I hope we have a number of mutants in the IDW book but I don't want Baxter to be one of them. He would be fairly unique as a Cyborg. Also a feel like there are a lot of people who are afraid that the IDW comic is going to be the Original Cartoon: The Sequel (I am not one of them, but see where they are coming from) with Bebop & Rocksteady and the colored bands (which I am okay with). I feel like Baxter as a human or cyborg will help calm their fears or at least give them one less thing to be up in arms about.

how about as a Flyborg?

I will leave that to you to write a fanfiction piece about and share with us.:tlol: His body is dying so he becomes a cyborg and the technology isn't working so to stay alive he mutates himself into a fly.

I could see the cyborg Baxter Stockman as a way to blend it all together and with him not a mutant maybe we could see another like you say Slash.

aww, I was about to write that

Not to endorse this idea, but wouldn't it kind of make more sense if the opposite? i.e., he mutates into a fly, then gets pissed off that that the fly side of him is messing with his mind, making him less than the genius that he was, and that his fly appendages aren't as suitable as his human ones were (you know, for working on circuit boards, typing on a keyboard, etc.)... so he starts outfitting himself with cybernetic implants and such to compensate for this and even improve himself further.

I'd actually like a series where nothing like mutaliation or mutation happens to Stockman, myself.

Well...

It sure did lead to some awesome artwork on the toy packaging!

prefer as a fly

I chose fly, but honestly, I like both. & also, I think they should make Dr. Chapman into the fly, considering, imo, he looks like the OT Baxter, anyway.

not really...:-? Anyone care to do screen cap comparison to support this?

I prefere Stockman as a human. In both the old and new shows I thought Baxter was a better character before all the shizell happened to him.

What about a compromise? He becomes a cyborg, but his cyborg body has the characteristics of a big humanoid fly? (multiple appendages, wings, and multi-lens "eyeballs")

I think I would have to agree with you for once. Especially in IDW.

The cyborg with fly like armor/robot body could work. With Baxter being under Krang here it makes me think that Baxter xan not be on his own but has to be a greater threat's underling by force. That and he can't seem to be human from his first to his last appearance. Its a shame.

Close enough, imho.

Hopefully Baxter breaks out of the underling role and wreaks revenge upon the Turtles AND Krang/Shredder.

(sigh) Again?

Ditto. That'd be a change I'd warmly welcome.

Well, unfortunately, he's already working for someone (General Krang) from the get-go instead of being a stand-alone villian... hopefully he breaks free from that. It seems only the Mirage comics had Baxter be his own man.

A fly isn't as random as a moose or a hippo.

You've already mentioned the obvious reference to The Fly.

Plus a lot of people get creeped out by insects, and flies are pests, making a mutant fly a good choice for an antagonist.

I'd prefer mutant fly over cyborg, because someone becoming a cyborg feels more overdone. Someone becoming a fly monster obviously isn't original either, but I like the nod to The Fly. It's something for the adults who had to deal with Ninja Turtles being on TV all the time.

For the current comics, I'd say keep him human. There are going to be plenty of mutants running around anyway. Bebop and Rocksteady are more well known, so let the new Baxter Stockman get established as a mad scientist and not another mutant.

I like both renditions. I liked the fly in the cartoon and the cyborg in the comics. I don't think I'd like a cyborg fly though.

He should have stayed human all the way. It's stupid to have him walking around as a fly, and he went through so many cyborg incarnations you can just guess what the next version will be (and probably be correct).

This time he should get turned into a stork, so he can be renamed "Baxter STORKman"! HAW!!! :tlol::tlol::tlol:

At least as a human, he was the most threatening to the turtles in any form compared to his other forms. In the coming out of their shells tour, we just see human Baxter. But at least as a fly, he can move quickly and his alien computer can help him get proper support. Says a lot about the acceptance of his fly form.

It's just that Baxter transformed in so many different forms in the 4kids era its tough to pick out a distinctive form. I find it more of a grower of a choice; it's less memorable but builds more depth to the character.

We don't know the direction IDW will take Baxter Stockman yet but the teaser image makes it look like Baxter might get "punished" by Krang in #7. It may be leading to him taking anothe form there too. With Baxter transforming each time it might actually be interesting to see what he can do a a threat as normal human. We can have the cartoon go one route and the comic go another.

Why
 

WHy did the writers suddenly made him a fly? Did they dislike him and tried to write him out of the series (at least as a main character)?

The Fly remake had only come out a few years before. They clearly wanted to reference that movie, while adding another mutant that would make a gross toy for kids. Let's face it, a toy mutant fly stands out more than a generic mad scientist.

I'd like to see Baxter as a fly mutant (simply because the visual is so amazing), but I'd like him to retain his scientific curiosity as opposed to just becoming an absent-minded schizophrenic. After Baxter's mutation episode in "Enter the Fly," he generally wasn't as great of a mental threat to the TMNT by himself.

I have this visual image in my mind of a mutated, savage-looked Fly in a tattered-and-torn scientist's lab-coat tinkering with chemicals, test tubes, and Bunsen burners while surrounded by a handfull of "faithful" mousers. I think he could really be a great villain if he was both brilliant and a hideous mutant bug.

Why
 

But why they have him sent to Dimension X so often? The episode he was transformed him to change from a main character to a bi-character.

Now that I can't explain. I agree that he could have been a main part of their rogues gallery, instead of them fighting Shredder every single time.

Yeah, I think we can make an own thread of that.

As astounding as it may sound, I found Baxter Stockman less annoying as a fly. Almost likeable in fact.