Peter Laird on IDW TMNT
 

From his blog:

"I've read a couple of issues of the IDW comics, and I just can't get into them, for whatever reasons. I think the most off-putting thing about them -- for me, at least -- is that they don't seem very unique, especially as far as the artwork goes. Say what you will about the weaknesses of our original comics as far as the art is concerned -- and I freely admit we had our weaknesses -- at the very least Kevin and I put a lot of effort into what we were doing and tried to make it look different. Or maybe it just ended up looking different because that's all we were capable of doing!

There is also something about modern color comics which drives me nuts, and that is the unfortunate (as far as I am concerned) tendency towards filling every available space with something -- be it linework and/or color -- instead of taking the classic approach of panels with borders and white space in between. I think the latter approach allows the pages to "breathe", and to my eye, anyway, the former approach is cluttered and generally ugly.

I am also disheartened by the way the story seems to be developing -- there just seem to be a lot of changes made for change's sake. And the introduction of yet another mutated animal character right away (Old Hob) pushes one of my buttons, and not in a good way.

I'm thinking that when the first IDW collection of these new TMNT comics is released, I may pick that up and read it all at one sitting and see if my opinion changes.

As far as wanting my input for any ongoing new TMNT productions at IDW, no, they have not approached me. That's probably a good thing, given the direction in which they seem to be heading. And lest people get the wrong idea, I wish IDW all the best of luck with their TMNT projects."

And later:

"Not really knowing anything about this new "Krang", I won't venture an opinion.

[on April naming the Turtles] This is one of the things which I think gives this new comic series a significantly different "feel" than the original TMNT stories that Kevin and I created. There seems to be more trying to make things seem -- I don't know -- "realistic"? Like it's easier to buy a human female naming turtles after Renaissance artists than a mutated rat. There seems to be less acceptance of some of the ofttimes whimsical nature of what Kevin and I did… and I find the result somewhat lacking.

[about the reincarnation angle] It does nothing for me, and in fact seems emblematic of a trend -- to make things bigger and more "meaningful" than they really need to be -- that I see in modern comics, especially in new "takes" on established characters. I was just reading something online recently about someone remaking the origin of Spider-Man, I think, so that instead of just being a kid who is transformed by the bite of a radioactive spider, he's actually the latest incarnation of some spider deity or something (sorry if I am messing this up -- I just quickly read the piece and don't remember where to find it again). I think it kind of started with Alan Moore when he reinvented "Swamp Thing" and turned him into a "plant elemental". That worked pretty well, but the problem is most writers aren't as brilliant as Alan Moore often is.

I also feel that it diminishes the characters of the Turtles and Splinter… like they can't be who they ARE, they have to be like someone else WAS.

And finally, one of the things about the way we created the Turtles that I always liked was the random, accidental nature of it. For some reason, I find that appealing (possibly because the origin of the Turtles sort of mirrors the creation of that first TMNT comic itself!)… and it's why whenever a new project would come up and someone would suggest redoing the origin of the Turtles and almost inevitably start with "See, there's this firm that's working on genetic engineering, and they take these turtles and -- ", I would shoot that down right away. It always felt so boring to me, so hackneyed. So obvious.

Now, I say all of the above with this caveat: I have not read all of the IDW TMNT comics. I think someday I will, in collected form, so that I can read a bunch of them all at once, conveniently. Maybe after I've done that, I will change my mind. Not likely, but possible. -- PL

This is pretty much what I expected. Interesting nonetheless. I feel that Peter is very much a fan of respecting source material. His thoughts on the recent Star Trek reboot, and his big concern with what and what isn't "canon" in the Mirage comics, etc. Stuff like that kind of paints a picture. I suspect he isn't a man accustomed to change. I can only guess, though. Not to say his opinions aren't valid. I wouldn't mind hearing him expand on his thoughts later on.

Thanks for gathering the info though, I kept putting off asking Peter this question, myself.

He's just not fond of color comics, that's what seems to be distracting him. I see why he kept the Mirage run black and white for 25 years.

Other than that the story does read better when you have 4 issues together. The whole first arc was meant to be read in one sitting. I think that his awkwardness around it was the same we had due to the new origin but we're more used to it now.

What do you mean? Vol. 2 in color was something he pushed for.

I was gonna call him out, but with a 13:170+ color to black and white ratio, I gave Cyber the benefit of the doubt.

They only did that to boost sales, which failed. That's why Mirage stopped publishing among other financial problems at the time.

Not surprised by this... There goes the chance of Peter Laird and Kevin Eastman "collaboing" with IDW for atleast 1 issue :tsad:

Not at all. Pete said he'd work on something but only by the personal invitation of Kevin Eastman.

That's right. That's what he's said.

These are things I thought myself, I didn't like the idea of a new mutant cat, I didn't particularly care for the artwork and some of the coloring threw me off. I think some of the recent issues have been a bit better tho. I see where Pete is coming from any how as I had very similar first impressions.

As a big fan of Pete's, I was excited to read his thoughts. I understand where he's coming from, but at the same time, I like the changes made in IDW. I stil looooove me some classic Mirage stuff, but this is a great new take with some fresh blood pumped in and a bit of the OT sprinkled in for seasoning. (Sorry for the mixed metaphors.) ;)

Pretty much the same here. More than the coloring, is the overall of the art what doesn't really look too good in my eye. I can tell Dan Duncan is a great artist, but I feel like TMNT doesn't fit him somehow, and there's quite a lot of pages that seem a bit rushed. I can't wait to read Ross Campbell's Leonardo, because I think he'd be more like the kind of artist that perfectly suits in the Turtles universe. Script wise, I was expecting changes to be made, and was actually very excited about it. But I can't help thinking that some bits have been done kind of careless, like Casey and his dad's reaction when they first see Raph (not to mention him buying a hot dog). I mean, I'd be just fine with those things, if the mood of the story were to go that route, wich in my opinion, it doesn't. I've read Waltz's explanation on the subject, but it still doesn't make a lot of sense to me. I feel like IDW's Turtles are already very far from the 'urban legends' type of concept. Then you've got the whole new origin, wich could potentially bring a lot of things that I never wanted to see in the franchise. I already dislike the idea of reincarnated Turtles, but also, I'm worried there's gonna be stuff related to that going on forever.

And, rainbow bandanas.

Link to the quote, please. I can't find it again for the life of me. :/

maybe Peter should of thought about this before he sold them to someone else..If he upset about the comic books, (Which to me did a GREAT job)..Wait til he finds out about the 3 toe CGI Nicks are doing to the turtles..I have a feeling he'll be back with the turtles. I mean we did hear Kevin was finish with tmnt and now he's back..

Maybe you should read Pete's other feelings about the TMNT as a whole before you get mixed up.
He basically said if he could go back and un-create them, he would. Don't bank on it.
Besides, Kevin was gone for over a decade. Pete's only been out of the scene for roughly 3.

He was gentler in his criticism than I expected him to be although maybe I'm projecting my own negativity of the series onto Laird.

I agree with some of what he said and then add in some of my own issues as a fan that probably cares in a very different way to a creator.

I do agree to a point but a guy who green lighted the creation of Ch'rell can't be that afraid of change. To me it seems that IDW brought about these big changes right out the gate and it's taken six issues to set up the basics and it doesn't look like we'll be getting round to the "good stuff" just yet.

This is a shame as I do think Waltz writes the turtles and Splinter very well. I'd like to have seen more of this rather than spending five issues ultimate-izing the characters.

I was excited about Old Hob as I figured we weren't getting an army of mutants and he was billed as a different but just as important villain as the Shredder and well....he just isn't.

Old Hob is awesome. He'll probably go rogue at some point.

Maybe. Right now he's almost early Bebop and Rocksteady caliber.

Yeah, this comment in particular left me feeling a little... weird. I don't see how Kevin is the way he is and Peter is like that. I mean, what has Peter gained by creating the turtles? Alot. He has his wife and his daughter. A happy life, at least on the outside. And he's a millionaire. I just don't get how Kevin can be such a cool dude and Peter such a .... well, you know.

Maybe there are things that happened behind the scenes that we don't know about but jeez, when a creator says something like that about his creations it's a bit unsettling, to be honest.

I'm in agreement with him thus far but still along for the ride.

Samhain, I think it's because for the last decade he's been the sole owner of the Turtles and everything went through him and he's just totally burnt out. He had to deal with the business end and, probably even more so, fans. Especially some of the ones of us who are never satisfied, and let him know... everywhere. Kevin, on the other hand, seems to get altogether nicer treatment. I can't remember anyone openly complaining on how he handles the Turtles, like many have when Peter was at the helm.

Not saying that their respective attitudes and personalities have nothing to do with it, but I'm sure the TMNT burn-out of being in control for the entire life of the franchise has a lot to do with it. Peter seems to take it all to heart, even if we didn't intend to be hurtful.

I agree that the earlier issues could have been utilized better. At least that is my perspective so far. I can't imagine going back and reading issue's 1-4 in the long run, honestly. I'll probably usually start with 5, 6, and the Raph Micro, in the future, which were the issues I've really enjoyed so far.


Aw.

Issues 1-4 are great and if you read them as one story arc it opened this universe quite nicely.

Maybe when we look back at #1-4 here in context they will appear better, but they didn't spring out at me like the early originals did. I guess because they are a story arc, not singles, and that things are a little spread out in explaining. I have still enjoyed them though.

To be honest, if I wasn't a hard-core TMNT fan, I probably would have dropped the title after issue #4.

Of course... the hype behind #5 may have drawn me back in one more time just so I could finally get the full(er?) origin story.

I do have high hopes for the near future of IDW, however!

It is bizarre that PL said he would erase it all in a second if he could go back in time. Not only is it strange because he flat out said his daughter Emily might not have existed...but this made him a millionaire.

No matter how successfull he might have become being an illustrator, he sure as hell would have never become a millionaire like he did when TMNT became really big.

And as he said, what about all the friendships he made over the years through the Turtles? The enthusiasm from fans? The impact on pop culture?

It really is weird. It almost makes it seem like he feels he wasted his life on the TMNT franchise and wanted to be something else.

Yeah. I just wanna know what has he LOST by being the co-creator of the Tmnt? One of the reasons why I have such a huge heart for the Tmnt franchise as a whole is it's kinda the american dream. Stuff they make movies about. Just 2 regular guys, late one night decide to do a silly comic. It takes the world by storm and they get rich. Maybe 10 years away from the turtles will put everything into perspective for Peter.

Agreed, its not like his family life is bad either. He has a wife that's been with him for like 20 years, he has a daughter in College, he still keeps in touch with his friends at Mirage, etc.

If he was divorced, never had kids, and was a bitter old man living by himself I could see where the disdain stemmed from...but that's clearly not the case. His family life seems very positive and loving.

I'm glad he feels the same way most of us do about the first film, though. The ideal TMNT movie.

He specifically said he would only go back if it meant his daughter wouldn't cease to exist.

I am reminded of the old adage, "Money can't buy happiness."

Just sayin'.

EDIT: Also, didn't he say "Emily as we know her..." Meaning the Turtles in a way shaped her life quite a bit, and she'd be a different person if she wasn't the daughter of "that guy who created the Turtles."

Its common sense if you have a baby in a different year, it won't be the same baby as you would have had otherwise.

If you went back in time to have your first born a year later than what it was originally...it would turn out to be an entirely different baby or person.

This thread is getting weird...

We're trying to get inside Peter Laird's head, that's all.

TMNT is known for being re-invented. Think about all the different versions we have of the turtles.

The IDW is just another re-invention, and from what I've read from Peter Laird, he doesn't like change to his work.

I like the IDW verison. Seeing some ideas from OT being brought into comic form and having a gritty feel to it, just keeps things interesting.

Its just getting hard to still like the guy when he negativity criticizes on other peoples interpretations all the time.

I agree with Peter on the changes to TMNT. The idea of Old Hob is not great in any way and it is true that it does seem like "...there just seem to be alot of changes made for change's sake."-Peter Laird. I also believe that none of the changes make sense.

Like April O'Niel naming the turtles and the idea of them being mutated instantly into teenagers and all of a sudden develope deep feelings for one another, which is unrealistic behaviour.

-but in the end I can't deny the fact that IDW did create a interesting setup for TMNT. Even though I have alot of dislikes I will still read/watch the comic and new show and just enjoy it for it's own reasons.

Many great directors and developers state their dislikes of a product for the sake of improvement. It is the hard part but the people who make the product must heed a critic's review. Paying attention to only the likes will cease innovation that would make the product better.

Myself, I think it's premature for Peter to say there's changes for the sake of changes... when we have not yet seen the fruition of those changes, where the plot threads will take us to.

It's true, they may take us to... crap. But I really suspect not.

Volume two being colorized was originally something that I looked forward to during vol one. I always thought, "man if the turtles were in color it would be even more awesome!" Once vol two hit, I quickly came to the realisation that black & white was a big part of what I really loved about the turtle comics. It added to the grittiness that the turtle comics were known and loved for. IMO that was one of the major reasons vol two tanked. I think many fans found that colorization was a mammoth change that was better in theory than actuality. After the first two issues I was (temporarily) done with the turtles. A big part of my being done with them was the feeling of being let down and the fact I was going into high school so my new priorities were girls and saving up for a car. The tmnt comic just didn't feel the same anymore.

Any way...I also agree with Pete about the borders and comic being able to breath.

Its quite obvious Old Hob is in the series for the long haul. I truly expect him to go rogue and betray Baxter and/or Krang.

April naming the Turtles is actually clever, when you think that they already had previous names in this version. After all, why would Splinter name them again then?