The Peter Laird situation
 

Do you consider Peter Laird retconning Venus from TMNT a wise or a poor situation? And why?

Why would you ask such a thing? Next Mutation was a terrible series so nobody really cares.

When did that happen?

After next mutation got cancelled. But it really doesnt matter i just made this thread out of boredom

Wise, for all the reasons I said in my thread about Venus. She was among the most abysmal effects of the series' degradation.

At the time the whole TMNT self-parody was spiraling out of control, Laird was the right man to fix most of it. His return of the series to its roots was extremely refreshing at the time. A shame his own show eventually descended into some extreme stupidity itself, but at least it broadened the horizons of what TMNT could be for future generations. Since then, we've never had another adaptation that's all-but combat-free, and I hope we never do.

Embrace the franchise even the sillier moments. Just look at Batman and how many silly things they did with the character and they aren't locked away they're embraced by the company as in-jokes or whatever.

Besides Laird didn't retcon Venus, she's still canon in TNM, she just hasn't appeared in anything else but neither have other characters from the OT, Archie, Mirage etc.

she was only retconned off the website letters, she was never canon to any other incarnation that wasn't TNM

Actually, much as with TMNT, whether the Silver Age bits of Batman are embraced by modern writers varies with the writer. Tim Burton and Frank Miller didn't like Silver Age Batman, the writers of Batman: The Animated Series had a certain respect for it despite a different tone, and Batman: The Brave and the Bold was mostly a love-letter to the Silver Age.

I think it was foolish to disregard anything that was not Mirage Comics related or be an original character from the time he oversaw the property by himself but I give him huge applause for stating Venus and Image did not exsist. I pretend those two aspect of the TMNT multiverse don't exsist myself so when he says it it give more crediblity to the fact these two annomalies will not hold any influence down the road which is a great thing. Best that its the best thing he ever did aside from create the 2003 cartoon.

Not even that. I specifically remember letters about Venus "leaving" the Turtles to continue training elsewhere.

Ideas that Laird has "retconned" anything is just fanboy wish fulfillment and nothing based in reality.

For years pretty much anything pre-Denny O'Neil was disregarded by DC and I know for years a lot of the silver age stories and anything remotely like the Adam West show was seen as "wrong" and irrelevant to any modern intepretation of the character.

It's only comparitively recently that DC seemed to allow any direct references to any of the sillier aspects of the franchise history or embracing it. If a cartoon like The Brave and the Bold had taken place instead of Batman: TAS I'd wager it wouldn't be nearly as well recieved.

To scale this seemed to be true for a while with TMNT too. Just look at the letters pages of the Image series with fans asking specificaly to keep Fred Wolf characters out.

... Retcon?

What, did Laird publish an issue set in the Next Mutation universe where the Turtles woke up and it was all a dream or something?

I havent heard of this but i am intrigued!

The only thing I can think of was during Turtles Forever there was no Next Mutation image during the Turtle-verse scene, whereas every other universe that existed at the time got something.

It was December 8th,2000.Peter had just bought out Kevin. The first thing he did was issue a statement that went something like ,"From this point forward any knowledge of the character of Venus de Milo's exsistence will be disavowed and will forever be the four turtles making up the TMNT".The statment was made on the Updates of Ninja Turtles Offcial Website. I loked at the Wayback Machine and unfortunately the date was not captured but Dan Berger made that wonderful announcement on the above date.

Venus, what's a Venus? I know there's a planet named that.

...which was named after the Roman Goddess Venus who as the Greek Goddess Aphrodite


Venus de Milo is a famous greek statue that have lost it's arms.

Venus de Milo is also the nickname of Mei Pieh Chi the 5th female ninja turtle introduced in the short lived live-action series Ninja Turtles:The Next Mutation

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Venus De Milo as a character from the unpopular live action series Ninja Turtles: The Next Mutation. She was a female turtle with mystical powers(Not kidding) the show recieved scathing reviews and was canceled after the 1st Season. As for Venus, Peter Laird HATED the character so much that he disavows her existence and banned her from ever appearing in any TMNT iteration again.

Quite honestly Peter is the man who saved the franchise, and what happened during that dark period was a time of purification and renewal by Peter in order to give a new order that started by removing the crap (Venus, some of the Image concepts, cheesy plots) and eventually refine to give a back to basics moment with 4kids and a new direction with Vol. 4 which Peter believed to retcon from the end of Vol. 2. He knew that the core fans saw Venus as a pointless addition that had little fresh, and knew that a breather needed to be made for a few years to recover from the goofy/corny image the TMNT had become. It all worked out and if it weren't for Peter with 4kids, the momentum toward the Nick era would have been just a blip on the radar since Nick had momentum to build from a previous series (4kids), whereas 4kids/Vol. 4 felt like the reset button had been pushed from everything that had been popular before, except for the basics of the comics.

gotta say im a little offended by the whole "core" fans dont like Venus as i stated before ive been a TMNT fan since the come around and i still like her does that remove my "core" fan credentials


but i will agree what Peter did in the end help the turtles not fall into just a forgotten memory, i watched most of the 4kids series when it aired and caught up later via youtube and it was a great show, minus a few eps here or there.

You can like whatever character you want. Liking Venus or not is simply a matter of opinion.

No. That just makes you an Eastmantis.

but some bs thread about no roof-top jumping in the ot is valid for discussion?

:roll:


dunno if this is such a huge deal as to be called "the peter laird situation", but whatever.

i remember that "statement" coming out and kinda laughing about it. i didnt really think about it being that big a deal, because to me, TNM was a different aspect of the franchise. since the show was long over, I didnt think it mattered, since there wasn't ever any real crossing over of the mediums. sure, there were characters that were included in the different universes, obviously, but venus (at least to me) was a strictly TNM character, and since i was reading volume 4 at the time, i didnt really care. it never even occurred to me that there was the possibility she might show up in the comics, until the very moment mirage said it wouldnt happen.

Yes it is.

Not even .

so.....what was wrong with Venus?? XD............
(I know nothing.....)

in fact what is this "next mutation??" is that a movie or something....

(I'm starting to think 2003 was a good time to start watching TMNT XD)

why?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ninja_T..._Next_Mutation

i know some people have a soft spot for it, but i watched it as aired and couldn't stomach it then. a few months ago i tried again (it's on netflix), and still couldn't.

people sometimes compare it to the 60's batman show, but no...

at least adam west batman had charm.

At least the 1960s Batman show was actually about Batman.