Interview With Michael Bay: Talks About Problems With TMNT
 

I think a lot of people won't be too happy after they read this. It’s an interview about other stuff, too, but these are the bits pertaining to TMNT:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...oducers-758333

Well, I don't think Jonathan Liebesman will be working with Bay anytime soon.

this is really great news this is cool to hear. and really does seem like they are learning from their mistakes

I don't think you read it right, sam. I think you entirely read it backwards, actually.

Firstly, anyone and everyone can entirely stop with "Bay had nothing to do with it", because there it is in black and white, the buck on this thing stopped with him. SO, no more "Bay had nothing to do with it" nonsense from anyone. PLEASE. There it is. He made the Big Calls. That's straight from The Man himself.

Secondly... uhhh, they originally wanted to do a "brooding action movie for an older audience" and Bay said they needed more comedy and fart jokes. Bay said that the ORIGINAL tone was wrong - the brooding action movie tone - not the tone of the movie we actually got. What we GOT, is what he thinks was the RIGHT way to do the movie, and thus, we can expect more of the same next time out.

The only "mistakes" Bay apparently "learned from", are, "We Need More Of Teh Funny!" :roll: F*ck that guy in the mouth. Seriously.

Just... just no more godddamn movies, please. I'm an old man, my heart can't take the strain.

From the interview. It seem that the tone was to serious. That bits and pieces worked alone. But it needed something and tmnt has always been a comedy thing.

AND if bay was so heavily involved from the beginning then why was to tone so messed from the beginning.

TMNT is and has always been lighthearted ALWAYS. This movie has a darker tone with lightheartedness. You keep Say that Bay was there and just said hey Add some freaking fart jokes Are you serious right now. GOD your insufferable dude You act as if your this all knowing Big shot.

IM not saying that Bay wasn't involved but You people think that he has his hands in every thing, by adding every possible negative into the movie. You Ignore all the good stuff and just condemn the living **** out of everything else.

Seriously I take it that there was major miss communication between people. Some wanted to to be this super serious action movie Which does not fit tmnt really(thats not to say it can't be serious ever) And he wanted it to be the more usual Lighthearted version the fit tmnt more. ala 80's show the other movies, the 2k3 show, and the newer nick series even the comics.

You act as if bay has no understanding of Hollywood and that hes just some stupid dude who can't make movies

Yep.

And lookie there, it all went right over Sam's head.

What a shock.

you just answered your own question...as Leo said its in black and white ...right there..from the words of the almighty creator

they had Dinner..Bay didnt like it..they changed it

this is pretty much a confirmation that the sequel won't be an improvement from the first.

It's really sad to think that will never get a great live-action turtles movie.

Yeah, really. I've tried, sam. Fact is, I'm right way more than I'm wrong, and when I am wrong, I don't make excuses for it. Like, for example, I didn't think the movie was gonna make as much as it did. Mostly because of the release date. I figured there'd be some heavy fatigue amongst theater audiences and parents not wanting to go to the movies for an 8th time that summer. That was a conservative bet, and I was wrong. See? Not hard. My track record is really, really strong, in general. I could make a list about every single thing I predicted about just this one movie that turned out to be 100% true, but I'd be here all day. But I'm not right every time. So, yeah... oops?

You, on the other hand, are wrong about a lot of stuff, but whenever you get faced with it, when there's Proof that you're wrong, you backpedal, you twist words, you come up with straw man arguments that hold no weight, and you interpret people's words the exact opposite of what they mean. Every single time. Occasionally, you even make it personal. You're not the only one, but the fact you've been this movie's biggest cheerleader while NEVER ONCE admitting you were wrong or mistaken about anything is way more "insufferable" than me citing Inconvenient Truths.

Still gonna tell me they had Japanese Shredder planned from Day One? Because... they admitted they did that last-minute. You were... pretty adamant they didn't, aaaand, you called people names over it. Aaaand, you were proven wrong. Like, not A Little wrong, Entirely, 100% wrong. Apology? Admission of being wrong? I don't care, personally, but it'd speak well to your character.

I'm pretty sure you're a good guy based on what I've seen/read but your comprehension needs work and you need to man up to your mistakes. If you're gonna make the amount of noise you do, then take the hit when you're wrong and say so. So you misread the article. Big deal, I ain't mad at ya, I just pointed out what you misread. That's "insufferable"? Dude, you completely misread what the people being quoted in the article actually said. That's A Fact, don't get F'n mad at me.

I don't have to be patient with people when I'm forced to constantly point out mistakes they make or things they misunderstand. I've never attacked you, guy, and I've called you a "buddy", but holy sh*t, man, check yourself. I've stood up for you when other people here were straight-up giving you The Business. From now on, I guess I'll refrain from that, since my help isn't appreciated?

I ain't even angry, just disappointed. I'm really disappointed that my faith in some people is entirely misplaced.

No Hes said they had start woirk on and got pretty far and then once he was there he had found it was the wrong tone Not that he was there every step of the way.

How arrogant can one man be really Really. Yup Your all knowing. ANd literally this is the frist time you even admitted you were wrong. EVER since i joined at least You blast on as if you this holly untouchable FORUM USER. you've threaten users and seriously whats funny is it worked be proud of your self.

Bull ****. I said that a Japanese Shredder was a major possibility and i even said that there would be a Japanese Shredder and i was right. I said that I had faith that they was always an option, Was i wrong about the extent of what they planned sure But i was still right that there would be a Japanese Shredder that that it would work out Heck half my half back theories were freaking true. Ive Never called people names. I have been Threatened made fun off definitely called name. and You know what those users still on here still posting. With friends that were banned for much less. Whats that mean.

In what other ways have i been wrong about this movie.

Most of the Arguments come down to just being opinions Some people think there was to much April I didn't feel that way Thats still just an opinion. Unless there is some Algorithm about to much screen time for characters.

They Never Admitted they added him last minute Evidence show they added him late in the production. I Said that it was a huge possibility that this was the plan the whole time about that i was wrong. But there were those who said that there was no possible way they could have a Japanese Shredder well those people were wrong.

I have never called anyone name Have a said that the were being annoying yes that not name calling thats stating my OPINION of there actions.

Im the first person to man up on my mistakes Anyone who actually knows this for a fact. How did i miss read the Article???

What mistakes have i made Beside spelling and grammar, which i have admitted to being terrible at nor do i care. Other then that I admit if im wrong but i dont feel as if i have even been proven wrong especially when Most of the "mistakes" are that my opinions are wrong which is not correct.

IM sorry I dont condemn a movie that I wholeheartedly Enjoyed, that entertained me on multiple levels. Just because it wasn't what others wanted.

Saw that last night and had skimmed over it right quick. Wish more on TMNT had said, but what's there is interesting.

After the waitstaff had already removed the other 10 empty glasses, right? 'Cuz some things in that film surely required drunkenness.

Trust me, it didn't help.

I do not drink, not a fan of it at all.

I wanted to after I saw the movie.

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I don't know how someone can QUOTE me, dissect said quote, and still get every single thing inside-out. You're one of a kind, buddy.

You use the quote where I flat-out say, "I don't have a problem being wrong if it's proven", and even give an example... and you go ahead and FIRST say I think I'm "all-knowing", THEN you actually use the exact words I actually said... and then complain I'm not wrong often enough? What am I supposed to say to that? I'm... sorry? I'm sorry my predictions and gut instincts are usually right? I'm sorry I use things like evidence and experience to predict things and don't just run off at the mouth?

I mean, I'm NOT sorry, because that's what everyone should do before they put themselves out there so strongly, but... sorry it hurts your feelings, I guess?

I'unnno, man. This isn't even about a movie anymore. It's about separating Fact from Fiction. Anyone can read your last post and see that you have issues with that. Again, sorry. Not my fault at all.

And threats... really... I... don't remember doing that. Do you mean me telling people I can "make 'em disappear"? WOW, do you read too much into things. For one, it's a joke, and secondly, I think I said it once, and finally... the guy I said that to, I don't think is here anymore. See? I'm right even when I'm not even trying. :lol:

I think you just need a super-villain to cast yourself against and I'm an easy target. Not interested.

Damn right I'm arrogant, though. My eyes are gorgeous as f*ck. Not sorry.

"But we listen to the audience" Michael Bay

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Exactly... because probably only after several does "how-to ninja book" sound like a great plan.

I want to see the 'brooding action film' version.

It's a great way to shorten the character list, so it won't be so crowded like Amazing Spider-man 2 was.

Considering PD-TMNT had the same basic plot as Amazing Spider-man, I can only imaging they're saving the Too-Many-Characters for the sequel.

Oh hai thar Bebop and Rocksteady, how's it going?

How can anyone read that and have positive thoughts about the future of this franchise?

Bebop, Rocksteady, Shredder, William Fichtner, Karai, Casey, April, Vern, Whoopi, and I'm sure they'll try to push in Krang, have scenes between April & her good friend Irma...

And, oh yeah, the Turtles will be there. Just don't blink or you'll miss them.

Sounds like no one, at all knew what the **** they were doing, and all of a sudden, Bay is done with TF, looks over at Liebse, and is like "aw hell no son!"

He then got involved to FUBAR the film, but started with a FUBAR film, so the end result was a double negative. (Yes you can have one, apparently, PDTMNT is the proof.)

Poor guys may as well stay home. :ohwell:

optimism..

which i get, im a pretty optimist guy...but some people just turn a blind eye to things

I can't speak for your conversations on here with Leo656 however I'm sure you remember we've had some discussions on here too and I remember when it was officially announced that it was not going to be William Fichtner playing Shredder you were very vehement (to the point of obnoxious I'd say) that this had been the plan all along and that the idea Eric Sachs character was Shredder to be a red herring that we all just mad we didn't see. Obviously we know now that was not the case.

Very much like how you were adamant that the re-shoots were purely down to Megan Fox having a pre-pregnancy figure like Bay said and not to make last minute changes. How you sneered and tried to make out the rest of us we're paranoid morons for seeing something we know now to be true.

I don't know what theories you had about the movie that turned out to be true but since you've said about how you don't like being called names maybe I didn't like the inference that I was stupid because I could not see they were "obviously going down the reincarnation route" - I guess I wasn't so stupid after all.;)

Same for any number of claims like Hamato Yoshi being present to the idea after the movie came out there was still a possibility he could still be connected to Yoshi despite Leibesman's own words saying that was not his intention.

The board has a certain tone a lot of times. A lot of posters here are long time fans that know the franchise inside and sometimes a lot of us can come across as know-it-alls on tje subject of TMNT when debates get intense but you don't even need that. You've been one of the worst offenders of this and the sad thing is you don't even see it.

Reading more of that interview, Bay comes off as the most arrogant prick on Earth. And he contradicts himself constantly!

He swears he has pretty good gut instincts... but admits he thought "Raiders" was going to be trash. He thought the *music* was why Transformers 3 didn't work. He swears they picked the "right" ending for the Elm Street remake, and yet, that movie was totally panned. Which, to be fair, was probably only partly because of the ending, but it shows his judgment is pretty skewed on what "works" vs. what doesn't. The way he casually jokes about lording it over his subserviants and whatnot, flat-out walking out of the room dismissively when people don't agree with him, basically acting like King Dictator of every project he's involved with... :roll:

Yeah, gimme more of what this guy's selling. He totally cares about his audience. He says he can hear what people say, but I don't think he could possibly hear anything at all with his head jammed that far up his own ass.

Sh*t rolls downhill, gang.

And people are eating it up and are actually EAGER to eat more of it up.

I hate the film as much as anyone else, but keep in mind that they did bother to reshoot to include Saki. Of course, we ended up with an even worse film than we would have had they just kept Sachs as Shredder, but at least they tried.

I don't know if they were trying to please longtime fans in some misguided fashion or just trying to cover their own asses. Either way they're at least in tune with what the audience wants to some degree.

I do give 'em credit for being willing to bend, but it doesn't at all change the fact that from the very start, their entire approach was wrong.

Maybe if they'd gotten people who actually knew TMNT and cared about it, instead of a few guys who watched the show a few times 20 years ago and then forgot about it, they could have started things off on the right foot and gone from there, instead of scrambling to "fix" things when it was already too late.

Technically, we don't know that Shredder's name is Saki, or Oroku Saki. They never said his name. We only "know" it, because we are familiar with TMNT as a brand. They never bothered to provide the supposed main baddie an actual name, even Slinter don't know Shredder's name.

They didn't even explain how Splinter knew who Shredder was to begin with.

Eh, the movie isn't that bad. I went in with mid to low expectations but just accepted it for what it is. I try to imagine how I would have felt about the movie if I had seen it at 8 years old. I would have thought it was incredible. That being said, I can do without the origin story. I'm tired of seeing it. I just want new turtle adventures. Now, I own the movie and even though it's not a great movie and I'm not crazy about the old tired (bad guy poisoning the air/water supply) storyline, there are scenes that I really enjoy watching.

A. Splinter/ Shredder fight- Yes, in context of the movie, who cares, but the fight itself is awesome! Also the first time Splinter actually fought Shredder in a movie. I like the Shredder suit and blades (although I would have liked to see his eyes. I think that would have helped) also I kind of like the fact Splinter uses his tail to fight. I know he never did it before, but honestly, why wouldn't he?

B. Snow battle- By far my favorite scene in the movie. Yes it's crazy over the top and certain things aren't realistic, but hey, it's human size turtles fighting crime. I check realism at the door. VFX are awesome and the scene was well done.

C. Elevator scene, turtles being punished scene, meeting April O'Neil on the rooftop- These were the most "Ninja Turtles" scenes out of the whole movie so I liked them.

D. Turtles vs. Shredder fight- once again, in the context of the movie, who cares. However, the fight itself is badass and I liked that the turtles fought in the bright sunlight so you could see every detail and how they still managed to go unseen. Also liked how they had to work together to defeat Shredder. If there had been a more interesting backstory with Shredder, it would have made this scene pay off more but it's still awesome in and of itself.

Bottom line, I was entertained through the whole thing even though it's not great. I think if they keep what worked, scrap what didnt, and move the story forward by bringing in characters we remember from childhood. A sequel could be good. I don't know if any of the filmmakers "learned from their mistakes" but hopefully Paramount did and will take more time and consideration with the sequel. Redesigning the turtles a bit wouldn't hurt. Technodrome, Krang, Bebop and Rocksteady is what I want to see. "The Dark Knight" I thought was way better than "Batman Begins" so there is no excuse as to why Paramount can't get it right the second time out. As fans, let's just make our voices heard about what we WANT and maybe we'll get it. :)

I love that some fans of this property are perfectly okay with mediocre to bad just because.

And as I've said before, even kids deserve better than what they got. Because kids movies don't have to suck ass for them to like it.

I agree with his sentiment that if we raise our voice we might get some positive change rolling. But I maintain that nothing truly good can come from THIS group of filmmakers, as far as TMNT. The wrong people are making it; everything else is just band-aids on bullet wounds.

...which the Turtles would know nothing about... because... they're bullet-proof... because that's a good idea... for... some... reason...

And I love how some fans are just cynical just because. Why can't I like certain things but not others. Turtles 3 was terrible, Turtle Tunes is the worst tape ever and let's not forget Turtles Christmas! That's what I got as a kid. I would have preferred this movie over any of that. Not everything has to be black or white, terriffic or terrible. Most movies fall somewhere in between and it's perfectly ok to like certain aspects of a film without just dismissing it as terrible. There are many many movies I feel this way about so being a "turtle fan" has nothing to do with it.

They already replaced the director so that's a start. I would like to see different screenwriters. I don't mind that the shells are bulletproof because that's the reason turtles have shells to protect them from danger, but their skin shouldn't be.

$$$ is the only thing that will force positive change. PD knows they can produce drivel and people will still go see it. Why put time and energy into making something good if you don't have to? The general movie-going audience has screwed us on this one.

Just Ignore/put on ignore TrickorTreater he is nothing but negativity.

Because being badass ninja turtles just wasn't good enough for Lord Bay.

Ha. Yeah, I'm not cynical "just because." Because I love the cartoon. Which is genuine and genuinely good with creative and talented people who are also fans working on it. No cynicism there, sport.

I've seen the movie. It was awful. That's the reason I have zero faith in this creative team for a sequel. The VERY TINY LITTLE BIT of good that it had is completely outweighed by the sh*t. And there's a lot of it.

The "wait and see" period is over. I saw, and it sucked.

Boy howdy is that true.

I log into the 'drome, and the first two threads I look at make me want to slam my head repeatedly with a car door.

Is it too early in the day to start drinking? It's always 5.00pm somewhere, right?

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I hear ya, brah. Problem is, they replaced the director because he didn't match Bay's "vision", though. Bay said he thought the movie needed more humor. We all know now what he meant: boner and fart jokes and buck-buck and a bunch of other misfires.

Liebsman was only hired in the first place because he would fall in line, and... apparently, he didn't quite fall in line enough, and that's why he's out. So, using deductive reasoning, that implies his replacement will be even more of a figurehead with no voice, no power, and no authority. :ohwell:

Doesn't fill me with any confidence at all. Even new writers wouldn't fix anything, knowing what we know now. It's Bay's Movie/Series. Always was, always will be. There really can't be any debate about that, anymore, it's impossible to dispute who The Boss is when it's coming from his own mouth. And Bay, frankly, is an asshole. All the biggest problems start and end with him. I wasn't entirely certain of that until literally just today.

It's not what I want to be true, but... it is true. Until the franchise is rescued from being kept hostage by PD, nobody should expect anything more than what we already got. Some folks are okay with that; most folks aren't. I'm not.