If Nickelodeon never bought TMNT
 

When Nickelodeon bought the TMNT-franchise in October 2009, the 2003–2009 animated TV-series was over, and Turtles Forever had aired.

But what would we have if they never did? Would we now have two films, IDW comics and the 2012 cartoon? Something else, or nothing new at all?

I for one am glad with what the buyout has given us, especially the return of not just Kevin Eastman's presence in the franchise but wonderful talents like Rob Paulsen. I'm sure it was a tough decision for Peter Laird to make, and I'm willing to bet he spent many countless nights debating whether or not it would be a good idea. I wish people would just get over the fact that Mirage no longer holds the rights to TMNT.

But do you think we would have anything new post-2009 if that never happened?

I'd say we wouldn't have got anything new if Nickelodeon never bought TMNT. Peter Laird had grown tired of it and wanted to move on.

Not even two films?

Maybe one or two films and the IDW comics, but I think a new cartoon would not have been made.

There would probably not be possible to put all characters the producers want into the same version (except for maybe Krang, Vernon, Bebop and Rocksteady appearing in the films).

I don't know... Maybe Peter would have ended up licensing TMNT for another cartoon? It seems like the most likely scenario, only he probably wouldn't be as involved that time around as he was with the 2003 series, only vetoing a few things.

What I have in mind is something like this, imagine that he licensed TMNT to Nickelodeon for a cartoon and they ended up putting the same people to work. You'd basically end up with the same show, only without Bebop, Rocksteady, Slash etc.

The franchise was dead in the water when Nickelodeon bought it.

The TMNT franchise as a whole would be like the current state of Mirage comics from PL....non-existent.

IDW would have never gotten the license if not for Nick, so we would have no new comics now either.

I think we'd have maybe gotten another series of trade paperback reprints of the Mirage books.

They were selling book 1 in Artist's Alley.
But short of that....who knows.

If Nickelodeon wouldn't have bought TMNT, I would've been so happy. However, we wouldn't have gotten the IDW comics and I do love those. We probably would've gotten a better live action movie as well.

No we wouldn't have. The movie deal was dead in the water before Nick picked it up.

And why would you have been so happy if Nick didn't get the license? The cartoon was a huge hit, and you don't have to watch it if you don't want to.

While I doubt this is the case, I'm curious how things would be now if someone other than Nick had picked up the license.

Disney?
Warner Brothers?
Someone else....

Well if Disney or Warner Brothers got to TMNT, then TMNT comics would probably be a neglected aspect of Marvel or DC. Fox or Universal, maybe even Sony?

And maybe some Archie...

Thanks for reminding me even more how boring it was to be a TMNT fan back in 2009.

WB and Disney both could have bought the license, Nick offered them the highest money and were interested. I'm sure Mirage would have sold to Disney if they were interested back in 2009 and/or offered more than the $60 million Nick did for the franchise.

Disney would probably give the TMNT franchise more publicity, but I don't think it's worth that.

What Rose said is only partially true, the franchise was indeed dead but only during that moment, the first movie had failed and the 2k3 show had been cancelled after multiple seasons and there was no plan for anything new and Laird had been tired of the franchise for a while now at that time. But like it did in the past it would've had some off time and returned. Look at the franchise now and it's also "dead", no more movies after they bombed, the 2012 Nick show is coming to an end and IDW isn't doing gangbusters either so who knows how long it'll last. The problem with Viacom owning the turtles is for them they already profited from the franchise and it could easily be thrown in their bolt and seen as a product that doesn't make money anymore outside of licensing for nostalgic nerds. Viacom has tons of franchises that have been huge and would've gotten revivals by any other company and yet they don't, I don't really know why; Only recently are we seeing them revive old Nickelodeon stuff but even then it seems to be aimed at nostalgic adults who grew up with those IPs instead of re-imagining them for new generations.

But anywho let's take a look at what would've happened in the short term if Viacom hadn't bought TMNT:

The Mirage comics would've continued in their once every so long I believe Laird would've been more inclined to finish something even if not the story and only releasing one new issue every 2 years and Tales would've continued along with reprints. So yeah no IDW there.

Would we have seen a new TMNT show as fast as Nick's did? Probably not but another animated show would've happened eventually and I'm sure by 2017 we'd be enjoying it (or hating it). Who knows where the show would've appeared, maybe even Nickelodeon and who knows if Laird would've finally allowed Mutants and other OT elements in it like the Nick 2012 show did. That's still up in the air, I think after his baby 2k3 finished, his lack of enthusiasm of TMNT stuff and all the pressure to have OT content he would've caved and allowed it.

We already had a movie on the way and it would've released and while Andrew would've still hated it you can bet it would've been nothing like the goofy movie we got from Platinum Dunes and hate. Who knows if it would've been a success but we would've at least had that movie to look forward to that Laird described as "closer to the comics"

The nostalgic merchandising would've continued pretty much as it did as we'd already seen a lot of that stuff before the sale. It's true that once Viacom owned TMNT this type of merchandise was seen everywhere and Mirage wouldn't have done that but it was inevitable since there was demand there. We'd already seen Laird being ok with that type of OT merchandise. It's more likely that we wouldn've seen season sets for 2k3 as 4Kids started licensing their stuff for cheaper DVD sets, that dream is now dead as the format is dead. Video Games? Well we haven't gotten any good ones and I don't think we would've either, maybe some cheap licensed apps.

TMNT is too big and what's considered in business as an evergreen company that will always make money so of course it would've continued without the sale and as reluctant as Laird was to try different things I do think it was better having a man and small company in charge of TMNT than a multi-billion dollar one. Without Viacom we wouldn't have gotten this current wave of TMNT so soon but it went away as quick as it came and even if it wasn't terrible it really could've been so much better that what we got with the new movie and show, which I don't hate and like them but they are far from my favorite incarnations as well. Let's hope for the best.

Sdp time to go over a few things.

The problem is Mirage would have to take the interest with another party to revive it back in 2009, otherwise they would have sat on the property and let it stay dormant. TMNT isn't like WB, Disney, etc. franchises where they can get revived by company execs out of nowhere...TMNT was basically a niche indie franchise owned by a minor company.

IDW TMNT is literally their best selling book at the moment. It's going to get at least a 10 year run (we're in year 5 now) and 100 issues (we're up to issue #66 now). IDW TMNT will continue long after the cartoon ends.

Mirage had no interest in doing more reprints. They only put out two collections for the 25th anniversary and stopped there. They never intended to continue reprinting old books. Also Volume 4 would stay dead as it is right now, PL just doesn't care to continue it. Tales of the TMNT also ended in 2010 when Mirage still has rights to publish 12 comics a year even while IDW is going, they don't want to do it.

Most likely we'd have no new TMNT cartoon for a decade. TMNT would be a dead franchise. We'd all be sitting here twiddling our thumbs.

Mirage wouldn't have continued the license for toys when they were done. The Playmates toyline was ending in 2010 for the most part. Had Nick not picked up the license we'd get nothing.

NOW TMNT is an evergreen property, but there was no guarantee it would be one before. Remember when the original cartoon ended and nobody believed there would be a "new" TMNT cartoon after? When the 2k3 series was originally announced people were shocked. Nobody expected a new show.

And as said, the only reason the Nick cartoon started so quickly is because they got the licensed and wanted to make a new show as quick as possible. Otherwise TMNT would have had nothing new since 2009.

Seriously, it's like some of you have no idea what the "dead years" of TMNT were like circa around 1997-2001 besides the flop of Next Mutation. For those of us old enough to remember that era it would have happened again.

Turtles in Time remake
 

We at least got a Turtles in Time remake some months before the purchase.

Having a new animated show by 2017 is rampant speculation from my part but like I mentioned an evergreen property like TMNT wouldn't stay dead too long as long as a small company like Mirage had it since they'd find different companies interested. As far as the licensing we were already seeing a lot of nostalgia merchandise before the purchase so while Viacom kicked it up a notch (or blasted it) it was also the right time I think we'd continue to get those Keychains/plushies/mondo's/SHFiguarts even if the Playmates line didn't exist. TMNT reached that point where most of the fans of the OT are now in their late 20s/early 30s so it's the "merchandising tipping point" that say Transformers and other 80s properties had a few years prior. I think that is pretty much at its tail end now though.

As far as comics I don't really follow that industry too much so I'm only basing that on a few things I read here from time to time and how Mirage handled things but I'm no expert and IDW I remember about a year ago or so how the line was not selling as well but other than that I don't know.

I still have mixed feelings about Nick having the turtles, hopefully they don't shove it to the vault and we can see some stuff sooner rather than later.

Maybe we'll get a third film, but then by the late-2010's and early-2020's there'll probably be seom years of breaks again.

I'd hope if it hadn't been Nick then it would (surely?) still have been someone else sooner or later.

I hope that they would never get set aside forever. Esp not with the fact that the first generations that grew up with them now have people in the businesses capable of seeing to it that they continue to exist and care to give any thought to the level of public interest in the franchise.

Plus new fans that have been made via 2012 so you have a whole new crop of kids that will one day be nostalgic for it. Turtle Power is (hopefully) unstoppable...even if it takes a nap now and then.

I can't fault Peter Laird for wanting to move on after his/their lives being dominated by the Turtles for so many years. It's good of them that they even had the mind to, in a sense, let them leave the nest as a grown franchise and continue without them (save for Eastman playing helicopter parent a tiny bit via IDW lol). Grateful for that.



Were it ever at risk of being put aside for good, I wish the fan base could somehow take a collective ownership of them ("community ownership"?) and posses the ability to give license or rights to whatever companies it/we saw fit via vote.

TMNT would have been different if it was bought by Disney, They probably would've had Marvel do the comics, an animated series for Disney XD and live action movies that would have the Disney flair to them, in other words, they wouldn't be dark, but family friendly movies.

Most likely a Disney cartoon would have been terrible if Marvel's current animation of Ultimate Spiderman, Avengers, and Hulk is any indication.

I'm sure there's an parallel universe in which Disney owns TMNT.

Either some other company would have bought it with a different show, movie and comic than we got, or Pete would have just let the turtles die. He was just that burnt out.

Everything you suppose is good in theory. But the problem at the time was that every new thing required Peter's personal approval, and he was pretty done with the whole thing at that point. Getting any new projects off the ground through him, short of anything being an exact adaptation of the original comics, would have been near impossible. And Mirage had completely forgotten how to be a viable comic book company. Everything Playmates might have had in the works got the hault (remember their first go at Mirage Turtles, which never got produced?). There was a movie supposedly in the works (one of the things Viacom inherited), but it was more wishful thinking than a reality.

I think a lot of people have simply forgotten over the years what the franchise was like with Mirage/Peter in control. Granted its literally been over 7 years since 2009 now, so a lot of people either weren't around back then or simply don't remember.

For those of us older fans who have been in the online fandom for 15-20 years, we still remember. Back then people would also complain how few Mirage trades of the comics there were, how little copies were produced and how they sold out so quickly, and how most stuff was so obscure.

PL would have done nothing other than sit on the TMNT franchise had the Nick deal never happened, and it would be just as dead as the Mirage comics are right now. We'd literally be sitting here twiddling our thumbs.

Nick will also most likely sit on it after it becomes non profitable so we only delayed the inevitable. I hope I'm wrong though.

Oh we can always count on a TMNT All Grown Up sequel or a crossover with Jimmy Neutron or whatever to pull then out of the vault every few years.

I think some of the unfinished stuff from Tales might've gotten fleshed out a bit better.

I don't think that the movie they were going for would've ever gotten off the ground.

Any subsequent TV appearances would've been extremely limited like 2k3 and the 2k7 movie was.

I would've still enjoyed having my gritty little indie comic Turtles doing their thing in Tales every couple of months, but I'm very glad that things turned out the way they have.

Tales of the TMNT ended because Mirage/Pete didn't want to put out any more issues. It has nothing to do with the sale to Nick.

Mirage still has the rights to publish 12-18 comics a year and has had those rights since the sale. They could have had Mirage comics coming out alongside IDW over these last 5 years, but Peter simply doesn't care to do so.

I think we'd be better off. A downside would be not having the IDW comics, but at least we wouldn't have to suffer Bayturtles, incompetent writing, or more Playmates crap.
I'm sure that nostalgia would've eventually hit the turtles some way, and we'd have a resurgence of TMNT differently than the one going on now; we would've probably seen more stuff geared towards Mirage, then FW, Archie, and so on.

I feel like I mentioned this already and I'm sure it was discussed back then but I don't see why they sold the franchise at all. Could have just taken a break from it if it got overwhelming or tiring.

Anyway someone would have gotten a license to do another cartoon. Probably Nick. I'm just really curious what they want to do long term. Make more shows that are basically a retelling again? This goes for whoever had acquired it.

I would have preferred Disney...because they're Disney. Their movies would have been better and they definitely would have put TMNT in thier theme parks.

$150 million dollars is a pretty good reason to sell. Plus being able to essentially retire and not having to worry about business stuff anymore.

As for another series getting off the ground had Peter not sold, like I said a few posts back, it would have required Peter's oversight on everything and he only has one "creative" vision for the Turtles.

I doubt the franchise was even on Disney's radar. 2009 was the year they spent $4 billion on Marvel. Compare that to Nick paying $150 million for TMNT and TMNT simply isn't big enough for Disney to bother with.

Well it's a lot of money but I'm assuming they were rich before anyway. It's fine but if I had created something this popular I would not sell it. That's just me.

What's Peter's one "creative" vision? I really don't follow them individually.

Ya at the time Disney wasn't gonna get it but why do you say it isn't big enough for them to bother with? I'm sure they'd do a great job with it.

Basically for the franchise to stick close to Mirage as much as possible. Same reason you didn't see any original cartoon or Archie characters in the 2k3 series.

Disney's current superhero cartoons are terrible and I doubt a comic by Marvel would do any good.

As far as big companies go, I think TMNT landed in the right hands. Sure, the movies suck, but everything else is great. If they had gone elsewhere, we'd probably have a pretty good movie & crappy comics/cartoons. I'm good with 2/3.