Why are people disappointed with the series finale?
 

Ever since the arc aired on Nicktoons, I've seen some people voice their complaints about it.

So, why do some folks hate the finale?

I'm sure that can probably be figured out in the discussion thread for that arc.

There are more than enough places where people have said their piece. This is just gonna lead to more whining/arguments/etc.

You're right. This was a bad idea.

Can you lock the thread, Machias?

Well, since the world is essentially a hellhole now, it makes all the turtles' attempts to save it over and over pointless and a slap in the face.

That, and also...

It was alright but it shouldn't be a series final because

All 4 turtles should have been in it from start to finish.
April, Casey, Karai, Shinigami should have been involved or at least mentioned to find out what happened to them.
More explanation on the mutagen bomb.

I'm glad that Nickelodeon are airing the crossover as the final but it's a shame they released it on DVD first.

You've made some good points here (especially on all turtles being there all the way through)
It did have a few good moments (Leo and Raph, the final shot with Splinter and the turtles). But, there were way too many contradictions and plot holes. The writing was quite lazy. The more I think about it, the more flaws I notice. I'm not a fan of how they disposed of two important female characters with barely a mention. It's a shame-- the animation was excellent as usual, as was the voice acting (especially Sean Astin)

That didn't help, either. .......which is why I'm relieved that it's an AU :D

You don't think Casey would approve? Is that fate not sufficiently "metal" enough?

I disagree.

The Mutant Apocalypse was the last episode in production order, had the same turtles from the show (not an alternate reality), wrapped them up perfectly in the end (it doesn't matter that not all were in all 3 episodes) and we don't need an explanation for the Mutagen bomb, we already know it was something along the lines of a Kraang attack, and it didn't matter in the actual story of the arc.

The series finale even had a cool image by Ciro of a Mirage turtle at the end, holding a thank you sign of the two co-creators of Ninja Turtles.

I think its a damn shame Nick is opting for a cop out by trying to pull another Turtles Forever, rather than airing the episodes as Ciro intended. I wasn't actually that iffed by the other episodes being aired out of order, but the series finale? That should've been aired at the end without a shadow of doubt and fully deserved it from every angle.

As much as I love the crossover, I think its a slap in face to Ciro and the entire team behind the show for the Corporate Executives to make the crossover the finale, its nothing but FW pandering in all the wrong ways that even a huge FW fan such as myself would find repulsive.

^This! Not every version of Turtles needs to end on happy times. They lost their father at the end of the last season.

While MA wasn't perfect, I'd much prefer it as the ending. They at least took a risk.

Maybe its because it contradicts the fact that Renet (in this series) is from the future. And her claims that the Turtles become legendary heroes.

If it really was Casey's own skull, not just a fake representative of him to put the mask on...

Now, where is the side story that covers the whole question about Raph keeping the head of his dead friend? :teek:

Did he go back and retrieve it later after nature had time to take care of the rest? Or did he just keep his friend's decomposing body and/or separated head upon his death? ("Weekend at Casey's"?)

Wtf Raph, who does that.

Happy Halloween.

Most of this has been covered in the arc thread and season 5 thread..... and we're still going to have different views :)

I've already made my comments, the misery basically, dead friends, turtles separated till old age, Leo being mutated to become something he hates for years... you get the idea.
At least they did get together in the end even if it was in old age, could have been worse :)

It's less disappointing than it is perplexing. At best it's a (very) loose adaptation of relatively obscure table-top RPG, which is still an odd choice to base the finale on.

Judged on it's own merits it's just... I mean, really? Everyone except six characters (two of which are mute pets) are implied to have died in a nuclear blast shortly after the last regular episode, thereby axing any lingering plot threads and/or undoing anything that was accomplished.

Like for example, why does Karai's reconstructed Foot Clan matter if it just got blown up out of nowhere?

I guess it might have been too much all at once. For a series that has such a steady continuation, this felt like such a drastic shift in story, it was a bit much to take in that not only was this where the story was going to ultimately go, but it was the series final to boot. I personally enjoyed it for the most part, but I can understand why some won't like it. Personally, I thought Lone Rat and Cubs would have been a nicer way to end the series.

Why do you grow old, marry and have children if out of nowhere something happens and you die?

There's lots of valid reasons to not like how this ended but that one is moronic and childish. :tgrumble:

Just a couple of random criticisms:

Maximus Kong should have been a presence from the beginning. They weren't really trying to conceal his identity with his Dark Leo design (even the kiddies probably added up the plastron and blue skin), but they still should have built him up as a threat. Would have made the boss fight less rushed.

Meera or whatever should have been some kind of legacy character. Leo and/or Karai's daughter? Don and April's? A mutated Shadow Jones? Or even a human Shadow, showing that there's still hope for humanity. That would have given it kind of a Children of Men feel. But it was hard to care about this random meerkat.

No I mean just because reality features random deaths, that doesn't mean it's the least bit satisfying in fiction. If you're gonna do it then at least bother to try make their legacy matter.

If you're gonna blow everyone up for the sake of making a story largely unrelated to what happened before, then what was the point of it?

Even your "growing old" scenario is presented with a legacy, Karai's Foot Clan was just blown up and shown no sign of having mattered, along with the majority of everything else in the first 121 episodes.

We don't know how old the Turtles were before the mutagen bomb went off. Most likely the Turtles, Karai and the Foot, etc. all existed as we know them for 2-3 decades before this happened.

Remember this is 50 years in the future. I seriously doubt it happened immediately after we left off. You really think Raph and the others didn't see Leo for 50 years?

So would Shadow be April and Casey's kid or something.

My only criticism aside from some of the designs is the lack of Casey. It would've been badass to see Old Man Jones as the last human alive. Give him a cool bike, grey hair, and the american flag mask. It would've been perfect.

Another reason for me not to bother with this series.

This was my take too. It feels less like a finale and more a very elaborate what if story. If this were set up as a dream sequence, alternative future, or something set apart from the main series explicitly I think more people would have enjoyed it.

I actually would be really intrigued to see an exploration of the Turtles in a post human world (ala the tabletop RPG as another already said) though perhaps less a Mad Max homage and something more cyberpunkish, which has always been part of TMNT's spiritual roots . A PG rated Shadowrun like setting, or, dare I say, Turtles in Time #4 from IDW. A world where Shredder, Krang, and Stockman are locked in eternal war, Mutants have replaced humans as the dominant species, etc.

Or Donnie and April. I'm sure the Nick team would have gone wild with some kind of human turtle hybrid design. Honestly Donnie is more human than turtle so i would expect him just to be a green kid, but i know Nick loves their grosd out mutation designs.

I

I honestly was expecting her to turn out to be a mutated April, or the daughter of a mutated April and Casey.

Maybe Mira is an obscure reference to Mezcaal (non Archie reader)?

A 3-parter set in the future disconnected from the majority of the cartoon itself is a reason for you not to bother with the series? This doesn't discount the other 121 episodes that came before it.

Do you think part of the disappointment for it was that - as a finale - we were expecting something big for the fans to be shocked/fascinated by, but most of the unexpected stuff was spoiled in the trailer? Robodon for example, alongside the deaths of the humans.
Coupling that with an expectation that there would be more of a drama focus because it was a finale and thereby we were expecting something more... heartfelt I guess?


I mean the dark Leo thing was a step in that direction, but because he (Maximus) wasn't even mentioned until episode 3, there wasn't much of an emotional impact. There wasn't time for any drama there, it was too focused on action and the urgency of the moment.


Look at the speculation over what turned out to be Mikey for example. Had that been Don/Aprils kid as surmised, would that not have opened up a lot more opportunity for drama and an emotional focus?

Instead we didn't really get any major revelation like that, that wasn't already spoiled in the trailer. As a result, the arc was fun, but didnt really carry much emotional weight to it - making it feel less like a finale.


Compare that to the emotional strength of the rooftop fight against Super Shredder and the build up to it. Admittedly, that had the rest of the series as background weight, but that could and should have been true of Apocalypse too.

I thank the gods of the universe that Don/April didn't have a kid turtle offspring in this. I actually almost believed it would be true and actually happen during the speculation, because it sounded like something the writers might actually do....but praise all the Gods of the universe that it never came to pass.

Don/April having some Turtle offspring just makes me sick to my stomach just thinking about it. We REALLY dodged a bullet here that such a thing never happened in canon. Thank god Ciro didn't go in that direction. It had a real possibility.

Oh be quiet. You'd still find someway to defend it and get on people's case if they complain about it. Just like Russian Rocksteady and whatnot.

I would never in a million years defend Don/April having a mutant turtle kid, lol. I mean I've always said even when the show first started Don's crush on April was nothing more than a running gag and wouldn't actually go anywhere. And of course I was right.

But since this was a 50 year timeskip and we had the crazy speculation going on for a while and some "small Turtle" in the preview, it definitely seemed like a possibility, or the writers possibly giving in to shippers. I knew Ciro wouldn't let us down!

Some really strong feelings there Cybercubed :)
It wouldn't have bothered me if they had a child along the way, I wasn't sure it would be that though it looked likely. I did think there would have been a small something between April and Donnie and some point by the end.

Edit: Ciro did make some hints according to some people, course when he said there will be a resolution/conclusion to the love triangle (so I believe,?) he must have meant cause they get blown up by a mutagen bomb but who would have guessed that :)

TMNT is not a love story nor do I expect it to be and romance doesn't suit all incarnations. In this show, I didn't see a problem with it, in small amount. I liked Leorai, the writers did tease ships a bit because they want the following, even if they aren't going to go there officially.

Why won't you defend true love?

More like, why won't you defend your absolutely flawless show??? Which for him is true love

lol...

I'd been reading through a bunch of old threads due to the 5 year anniversary/my rewatching the whole series and it is hilarious to see all crap the little twit would throw tantrums over that he just ended up defending tooth and nail. Constantly threatening how they "better not" change some thing about some character.

What a joke.

Yeah, wouldn't put it past him. He says he'd hate on the Don'O Neil hybrid baby, but as soon as someone else ragged on it, he'd tell them it was a good design and how they just aren't seeing the sheer genius and perfection of it. :roll:

I was not big fan of the series, since season 2 and hearing that it's final is some grim-dark "alternate" future-thing is rather neither inspiring, nor interesting.

I wouldn't exactly call it "grimdark", between Mikey eating decomposed mush that used to be frozen pizza and other goofy things, I'd say it doesn't take itself seriously enough for that.

Yeah it wasn't that dark, there were a lot of deaths (characters getting blown up ect)but Requiem and the Kavaxas Arc were more dark than this Future Arc.

Well even then, the 3-parter in the future is pretty disconnected from the rest of the show. I'm rewatching the series now and Season 2 is pretty great, the show does take a bit of a hit in early Season 3 but I think it improves after that until the end.