Criticisms of the New Show
 

Hello Technodrome!

It's been awhile since I posted here, but I've had an account for about a decade.

I plan on doing a TMNT anniversary video on my Youtube channel, and would also like to talk about the new show in it as well. I would like to address some of the criticisms people have of it.

While I'm generally more active on Twitter, I wanted to get the consensus of a group that I know are actual fans of TMNT, and not just random pundits.

So I'd like to know what your issues are with this show (if any) so I have a clear idea! Thank you for your time.

Personally I'd say character designs aren't great, especially Splinter. New villains are all pretty garbage. Some of the humour works but most does not and there's way too much of it and the shorter 10 minute episodes make most stories feel rushed and inconsequential.

Oh and Baxter stockboy.

If you are going to make an anniversary video why only make a thread on the criticism, isn't it fair to ask the people who like this show why they enjoy it. I'm not saying talk about this show as if its the greatest thing ever but if you want to know what the fans think and get a consensus, why focus only on a one-sided argument that's doing nothing but demonizing this incarnation

Because I already know the positives. And when it comes to criticisms, I’d like to address direct statements.

The Turtles themselves, there's a little too much "teenage" and not nearly enough "Ninja"

- Raphael, stereotypical dumb jock.
Makes a pile of bricks look smart. Too easily distracted from what he has to do on a mission and rather makes videos of pigeons eating Pizza to put them online. He also (as do the others for that matter) has NO respect for other's property. Taking the wheels off of Donnie's Turtle tank so he can go rafting with the others. Endangering a rare plant because he wants to dare the others to smell it. Ravaging a hotel lobby to take out Mutagen mosquitoes (and leading to Bullhop's mutation), when Donatello mentions the fact that he handed out manuals for the Turtle tank, the scene shifts to Raph and the others rendering the said manuals to shreds when feeding them to a paper shredder.

- Leonardo, lazy bum.
Has leadership talents but chooses not to bother with them but he also loves victories so much that he willfully leads the team into battles they simply cannot lose if only because it can add up another notch to his victory list. And I haven't mentioned his "Wannabe Deadpool" motormouth yet, he's tiresome and blissfully unaware that people hate his tacky one liners.

- Michelangelo, back stabber.
Goes where ever the wind blows, does buddy-buddy with Meatsweats because at that moment he was cooler than Todd. Invited Bullhop to the lair and starts shouting at him when the latter turns out to be more than the turtles can handle. Has an eye for art but also has no problem with the destruction of that said artworks. His worst character trait however is taking credit for something he wasn't involved with. The wrestler episode being a good example, every single time Donatello wants to do something, Mikey jumps in and does it a second earlier and taking the credit for having done so.

- Donatello, Egomaniac.
Stereotypical "I-graduated-valedictorian-so-I'm-better-than-all-of-you!" entitled nerd. Feels like he's never taken seriously by the others (As I mentioned earlier, the Manual for the Turtle tank scene) but on the other hand does very little to win their respect either. Forcing his rule onto the others with his inventions rather to be accepting that the others are individuals and won't change by force. His meticulousness to being perfect, leads to him flat out denying at ever making a mistake, the creation of Albearto "Wasn't my fault, who is Albearto anyway?" His closest ally is April, to such a degree that she's the only one who willingly hangs out with him, even when he treats her badly. And yes, he DOES treat her badly, when the Purple Dragons made their debut, April warned Donnie about them not being the cool whizz kids he thought they were and when the Dragons used his tech to commit crime, he had the nerve to tell her "You should have told me (she did) so I'm blaming YOU!"

The Great Saiyaman put it well. :thumbsup: While there are other issues with this series, including the arc being put aside too much, the changes to the personalities are also my biggest gripe. Save for the two decent choices of Raph not being angry and Mikey being less dumb, the changes to all of their personalities were otherwise however not in a positive direction.

Criticism aside from adaptation related issues? Well, OK:

• The official episode order is clearly not the intended order
• Some aspects could stand an explaination, or at least one that comes a little earlier
• Too many pointless episodes like Mascot Melee
• Somewhat too silly for a show that also wants you to care about the storyline
• The characters could use a bit more depth
• There aren't any episodes that have mostly bad animation but there tends to be some notable drop in quality for some scenes

That's pretty much what I can criticise the show for without bringing up personal preference and/or previous TMNT material.

Here's what I don't like in regards to preference/familiarity:

• Being a straight up comedy is a big no no
• Never really liked the "humans become mutants" thing, if you want an amalgam of Splinter and Yoshi, please stick to the reincarnation angle. Having Yoshi mutate into a rat in the incident that turned the turtles into humanoids has always been contrived. Not to mention all the other scenarios in which you have to contrive why humans turn into different things.
• Not exactly a fan of Raph and Don's designs, not against making the turtles differ from each other (Mike and Leo look fine) but there is such a thing as overdoing it.
• The Turtles driving around in bizarre combat vehicles has always been a problem in the cartoons, but the literal movie prop from a space adventure film is easily one of the worst offenders.
• Splinter comes across like a parody of both Hamato Yoshi and Splinter, rather than a decent depiction of either.
• The cartoons have admittedly always ignored who April is as a character, but I'm not even that sure who this version of her is beyond a teenage girl who can't hold down a job and yells her own name a lot. Awkwardly trying to fit into a world of weirdness? Except when she tried to avoid it? We don't even know how or why she met the turtles.
• Other depictions of previously established characters, like Shredder and Baxter, also lacks their distinctive familiarity.
• And ignoring The Turtles, April and Splinter, that would mean Baxter and Shredder are the ONLY previously established characters. I guess I should be thankful the new characters aren't just wearing the skins and names of old Fred Wolf characters like in the previous show, but it is strange to see so few.

My big criticism is they cancelled the Magnum Opus 2012 Show for this hot garbage. Id love to be in that meeting room of Viacom and Nick when they made that stupid decision.

Neatoman and The Great Saiyaman criticism's are basically mine too.

I'm just saying if you are coming here to listen to the true fans then should't you get everything both the good and the bad

Oh yeah because when I think of Raphael and the TMNT franchise as a whole I think of them respecting other people's private property like in the 1st episode of 2k12 where he breaks Donnies bo staff, turn it into escrima sticks and literally beat him like a drum or the time when he and Casey were PLAYING with weapons they don't own on an alien planet yeah thats an example of respecting personal property. If you want go far back enough 2k3 Raph where he and Donnie were throwing April's China while she let them live in her home, also speaking of 2k3 remember when they decided to skate in a MUSEUM and does not going into OT using things they find as weapons(because god forbid you actually use your weapons). Yep when it comes to TMNT the turtles are known nothing except being respectful to private property.


Hows the thing with Bullhop example with "goes where ever the wind blows" patience is finite and Mikey waiting for over a week to shout at them to leave tells you a lot about a character's patience also if you are talking about Hot Soup: The Game the kid was attacked by a Foot ninja and wasn't doing it on purpose unlike the 2k3 turtles. With Shell in the cell that wasn't him taking credit it was him unknowing stealing Don's stuff and finishing his sentences which he stopped doing at the end of the episode.

Again that for was ONE episode and you know I would take ONE episode of Donnie being a jerk to April than him being a creepy stalker for two seasons.

Why do you want the show to get another season, the show was pretty much done and most characters arc ended in a some sort of resolution(even if some of them were clumsy) so having it continue would be unnecessary also I just gotta ask why do you think 2012 was a Magnum Opus

I asked for people's input. You can argue in other threads.

simple it was dark had bits of comedy had some emotional moments mainly with Splinter and the Turtles and Karai. Had the balls to Kill Splinter (albiet first time was a fake out) which no cartoon has ever done . Wasn't a full on comedy show for kids.

It had stuff for older fans and didn't alienate them like Rise did. It also got me back into Ninja Turtles after being out of it since the 2003 Series which I only watched a bit off.

Well that's how I show my input.

Actually it was three fakeouts but I understand a little better, I disagree heavily that its the Magnum Opus but I kinda can see where you are coming from.

The show is ugly. It’a not visually interesting, no matter how many dynamic angles and quick cuts they do.

Negatives

Splinter is repulsive, and a joke. Unlikeable and an offensive stereotype.
The shape language isn’t nuanced, it’s aggressively "in your face."
The Cal arts look should not be used for TMNT, ever.
Always felt like the writers were trying too hard. Goofy verging on idiotic.


Positives
The humour in small doses is good, and the pacing of the show is fun.


As a whole, the show is that obnoxious guest at a party, overbearing and extra, the guy you can’t to have pass-out, or leave. Kind of like @papagreg

Dude if you want to ask me out on a date just be direct with alright because I'm not too crazy with this schoolyard junk. We are both adults so please handle your feeling towards me in a mature way, thank you.

See below.

I adore a good lover's quarrel.

I'm also a terrible person. Unrelated. But relevant.

Don't worry TommyT is a tsundere and this is how he show's his affection.

You are literally the last person to criticize anyone for derailing a thread, every time I talked about Rise you call me a troll and say I'm not a "Real Fan" because I like a particular incarnation of a franchise that has god knows how many interpretations

I asked for people's criticisms of this show. Not for you to have a lover's quarrel/pissing match in this thread just because people are saying things you don't like. I'm asking people for this info for a reason. If you don't like it, you can haunt other threads.

This is the last time I want to have this out with you.

I'm right there with you Autbot, I always loved turtles as a kid, but the 2012 series really got me hooked again and then I felt gut punched with Rise came along. I'm going to echo about 99% of the negative things that folks had posted here. While the turtles designs themselves did not appeal to me right off the bat I grew to live with them. The thing that really killed Rise for me and rendered it unwatchable for me was Splinter. I'll admit I haven't kept up with it so I can't make any further opinions other then what I has already been said because it would be completely biased for me to do so. Is it an okay show? I guess for the target fanbase they were going for, but it 100% alienated the adult fan base in my opinion and that is the toy markets primary bread and butter these days. Not children. All kids want are electronics now a days which is sad but true. Do kids still want toys? Of course, I'm not saying that at all, but the adult collectors are the ones buying compete sets and waiting at Walmart to get the short packed figures, etc. while forking over the cash for the premium market. Why not cater to them as well? (I mean it is playmates, so I guess compared to Neca they are cheap toys geared towards kids, but you get the general idea of what I mean)

In summary, if you are a fan of Rise, fine. To each their own. I'd say if that's the case give the older audience a Netflix original based off the comic or SOMETHING instead of just taking this huge leap, changing everything so drastically and expecting it to do well with the older audience. *shrug* If you're going to do that you better have a good story to tell, and Rise just doesn't have the story pulling the viewers in to justify all the bizarre changes that they made to the characters and backstory. I dunno… my opinion was that the 2012 show had reeled back in a long time fan like me. I fell in love all over again with the characters and the story. It was silly but had depth and drama and even darkness that most of today's cartoons skirt around. It had a bit of it all and I found myself began spending thousands on TMNT merch which I hadn't done in years and now I find myself feeling less and less interested as time passes by with Rise being introduced. Things just aren't exciting. I'm not rushing home to see the new episode or feeling excited for the future. I'm not running to Walmart to make sure I get the toys... I'm just...meh about it all. I will watch reruns of the older shows to get me by, but Rise really dampened my love for the franchise albeit for a short time I suppose. Eventually they will reboot it again and hopefully Rise will be a learning experience. Maybe it was time for the 2012 show to end, but to replace it with this... yea... I don't think that was a swift move on Nick's part.

Positives, I will say the show does have some good animation at times. I grew to tolerate the voice cast as they settled into their roles... Splinter though... that damn Splinter... I couldn't get past him.

Oh cry me a river I can't make a Rise thread without TommyTurds calling me a troll so don't act all uppity just because I'm "derailing" your thread because guess what literally every thread here gets derailed and just because you are making an anniversary video doesn't mean you get special treatment.Also its not like people aren't making criticism to the show the person above this post literally did so its not like me replying to people are stopping them from doing what you asked, you decided to make a thread on a forum which is free for everyone to reply to so if you don't want any some sort of argument then private message them or something.

So this one turned out as expected. Unfortunately.

I think it should be obvious what didn’t work - in that this show wasn’t really on brand, aside from very loose ties to the source material. Stepping back, it could have been any characters on an adventure. The feel is also unpleasant - which I think is the biggest problem, and while I’m sure it wasn’t cheap, the animation feels cheap. The big awkward square heads, the flat flash simplified look, it all feels like they belong to the powderpuff universe, and at least for me, thats the last thing I want from TMNT.

There are good artists who could really bring flare to TMNT, this was not the right fit, too ugly and too “wrong”

For TPTB that are listening, I humbly submit:
https://i.imgur.com/5IaP8yp.jpg

If the show had looked like the above, with less emphasis on humour and more on deep storytelling, you'd have made a killing.

Now that’s my opinion, but also the sentiment that I have seen echoed in facebook groups and other social media. Nobody wants the look and feel of Bays turtles, at all.

Well except for trollface up there, but as has been said before, he isn’t a tmnt fan to start with, so his opinion is of little to no relevance.

LioConvoy:

Hi! Welcome (back) to The Technodrome! Everyone is just the absolute worst and the place smells like bad opinions and sour milk. Wasn't this an extremely productive use of your time? Isn't your faith in this fandom just bursting through the roof? Aren't you glad you came back???

I know nothing warms MY heart more than knowing for a fact that most of the people who love one of my all-time favorite things are the living, breathing embodiment of festering herpes sores. Doesn't make me feel like I've wasted my life or anything, no sir. I'm proud to know each and every one of these people.

WTF? Speaking to the room or not, that’s a bit much.

Sir. I have been here a very, very, VERY long time and ran out of f*cks to give sometime around 2008.

I am one of the very few who remain from the "Old Guard", back in the Long Long Ago. It was a simpler time, dare I say a happier one... An age of e-mail lists and Welcome Mangoes, and a place where wisened Sages such as HorseTechie and AzureTurtle kept vigilant watch in order to protect the weak, the young, and the helpless against vile creatures such as Jarrah White and PWDesai. Myself and the legend known as Grunger Kittie, known by some as Alison Chains, and by still others as GK Punk, known currently as "That Guy Nobody Has Seen Or Heard From In Like 87 Years", were the Knights Anointed, given reign by our sovereign Krang himself to weed out the weak, the useless, and the stupid, so as to protect the sanctity of this realm and defend all who dwelt within it, because Krang used to go to bed mad early sometimes and the malcontents mostly logged on after midnight. Thus, the task fell to us, with surreptitious assist from the fair maiden Machias Banshee, to trick these undesirable reprobates into getting themselves banned, so the grown-ups could go back to having an actual conversation.

It was a Golden Age. Everyone was mostly drunk, everyone had close-ups of girls' butts in their sig pics for some reason, and you could make a simple joke about having a dead hooker in your crawlspace without having some snowflake tattletale go crying to the Mods. For a time, the Kingdom thrived, and conversation was lively. Unlike today, dozens upon dozens of threads would be lit up like Christmas trees at all hours of the day with nary a lull to be had. It was glorious. CyberCubed was still here but nothing's perfect.

But then, things changed. Our benevolent leader, Krang, abandoned us without explanation, and the Kingdom fell into chaos. Respected and beloved Mods had the audacity to get jobs, and in the absence of any true leadership, the constituents turned on each other, with violence and ill-intent. While Krang's hand was firm, but fair, once it became openly known that words and actions no longer carried any consequences, it was like blood in the water. The fun, stimulating, and occasionally intellectually-stimulating conversations of years past were replaced by rampant sh*tposting and unprovoked personal attacks, and one by one, all but a few of the Legendary posters of the days of yore tragically succumbed to the disease we now know as, "Too Old For This Sh*t".

Andrew, CyberCubed, and myself are among the last of the Old Guard. And the things we have seen and the scars we carry weigh heavily upon us. We are not as we were; we are darker, forever changed by our gaze into the abyss and being forced to watch everything we once helped build be set ablaze and turn to ash.

Well, what *I* helped build, at least. Cubed has always been more of a court jester than anything. And Andrew has managed to hold onto more of his sanity than some, simply because by all accounts he was pretty much a goddamn lush to start with, so on that very little has changed. Although I do think he's lost some weight since then.

This place is not as it once was. The Old Gods have abandoned us; the soil is sour, and tainted, no longer capable of producing anything but withered, rotting fruit. Its caretakers have all but given up, leaving those of us who remain to eat each other like rabid, ravenous dogs. And soon - perhaps not tomorrow, but sooner than anyone wants to believe - there will be nothing left but bittersweet memories of a much better time, a much better place, and a much, much better looking group of people.

Nowadays it's a bunch of 40-something guys in TMTN pajamas trying to convince the rest of us that Rise and BayTurtles aren't really all that bad, and praising NECA for their terrible, terrible retail stock and customer service policies. Less of a fall from grace, and more like a fall from Heaven and landing directly in an Arby's dumpster. In Mississippi. On the sweatiest day in August.

I confess, I have given up my soul and any chance of hope or salvation. But ask yourself this: Were you in my place, having seen what I have seen... Would we really be so different? I'm not so terribly certain.

In brief... I've seen some things, man. And some stuff. And I wouldn't recommend it.

Ok, great.

Did you read it in Jeremy Irons's voice? I get the feeling that somehow you didn't. I probably should have mentioned that was important.

I love the design suggestions posted above. I'd agree that, put simply, the show is just too far off brand, with no compelling justification for being that way.

I'm a guy that loves remixes, reinterpretations, etc. But this was too far off for even me.

I'm still here ;o).. February 2002.

Actually, this is one of the few saner places. Minus the mods, other than Jester, who have gone to the dark side of SJW madness....It's one of the saner places to try and have an actual discussion o nthe days of old.

One of the places I HAVE given up flying ***** of hope is ANOTHER board that I have been a member of since 2002. That place is filled with people who will insult you simply for not liking the current iteration of the current 'greatest thing ever', no matter how you phrase your opinion. and I've basically retreated to the Tar Swamp and hardly post there anymore.

here, you can at least still have some fun once in a while. so long as you keep an healthy ignore list active.

Some places I have given up hope. I just don't care anymore. Apart from the mod situation, here I don't think it's that desperate yet.

1. Any beef between you and Tommy has nothing to do with my request here.

2. I will call you uppity if I wish, and you will sit there and take it.

3. Special treatment = / = staying on topic. If you are this objectively stupid, I can see why so many people don't like you.

4. Most people with a functional brain can read a room and determine what someone is requesting. You literally have the rest of this forum to have your mentally-challenged arguments on. I asked for you not to do it on this one thread. How's it feel to be incapable of following directions that even a DOG can follow?

I don't care if you're the #1 biggest fan of this show. This thread's purpose isn't to watch you cry and moan for what people are saying here.

Piss.

Off.

You'd stand out more in my memory if you 1. Bought a T-shirt, and 2. Reminded everyone how great I am more often. Y'know, like those other guys I'm always talking to... Whatsizname and Whozits. I always put them over big. :lol:

Ah, He-Man.org? I actually never bothered with their forums, not even back in the day. I mostly used that website for research and brushing up on history and whatnot. I like He-Man way more than Ninja Turtles, so this forum completely turned me off to ever joining a forum where I could possibly interact with other people who like the same things I do. It simply doesn't end well. I want to continue liking He-Man, therefore I refuse to talk to other fans about it. But if their forum sucks, I can't say I'm surprised, just disappointed.

I don't Block/Ignore because I think it's kind of childish, but I'm sure it works fine for some. I'd guess there are dozens of people who have me on Ignore, at minimum.

I got a temp-ban from that forum a few years ago because I said certain comic writers were morons that had no idea what they were writing for. Apparently, they have a rule where you can't say mean things about people that work on the properties. That site is so insistent on being in the good graces of a corporation that it kills real discussion,

HAH, were you here when someone from Nick had me Temp-Banned for my not-so-nice opinions about Rise? :lol: Sh*t's going around, man. These corporate types are so sensitive. And they apparently have not a lot better to do than make sure no fanboys are saying mean things about them. Ain't that about a bitch, eh?

Oh, I haven't been paying attention to that garbage site since the temp-ban. I'm a hard-core ThunderCats fan, and they didn't like me tearing the MOTU/ThunderCats crossover apart.

Then again, I also got perma-banned from the biggest ThunderCats message board.....because I said mean things about the He-Man board.

****-monglers, the lot of them!

Only criticism I have is that I wish there where more episodes available, the show is absolutely rocking, it easily kicks FW and 2k3 out of the water and it's humor have a lot more hits compared TO 2012.


Maybe it's you and not everyone else

I got nastied for daring to dislike the new she-ra show and not 'respecting' the creators and instantly kissing their boots. yeah. I started posting less after that.

In the sense of “they’re obsessed with ‘positivity-only’ and you’re not allowed to be critical because we have an addiction to feed”, yes, it absolutely IS me, and not them. Because I refuse to lie to myself and others. Forced, corporate-origined positivity can die in a tire fire. :)

I can't believe you forgot to add that "Nemesis" is the best Star Trek movie, "The Spaghetti Incident?!" is the best Guns N Roses album, and Rocky V was Stallone's greatest masterpiece.

that has to be a troll post at this point.

I'm a big FW fanboy and 4Kids blows that out of the water. nothing else comes close...surely not rise :).

1. Don't care used him as an example

2.Not doing that

3. Again there are tons of threads that go off topic so yes you asking for everyone to do what you want is special treatment also off topic but what is with this site and using the word "objective" as an adjective. Also at least I never been temp ban like seriously how do you get temp ban when you have less than a 100 posts maybe should take care of the controlling personalty you have.

4. Well I'm not a dog and I have no reason to do what you exactly want me to do okay. You are a member of this forum and if people don't do what you want on this thread you have no right to tell them what to do it happens to literally everyone who makes a thread but for some reason you're the only person who complains about it.

As long as I see something I want to reply to, I'll reply.

https://media1.tenor.com/images/f0f1...temid=14707056

What's with people in their 30s not comprehending that some people might like some interpretations better than the ones they like.

For over the past 10 years we had the same turtles filling in the same roles fighting the same enemies, if thats not a compelling justification to be off brand I don't know what is.

That's not animation thats design



Meanwhile its enjoyed on places like Twitter, Reddit, Sakugabooru, and tumblr or you can just say they aren't "rEal FAnS"



Hey remember when Tom Waltz called you out for making dumb conspiracies, good to see you didn't learn that lesson.

I'm pretty sure you tried to slander the creator

Again opinions some people have them