Why was Rise cancelled?
 

I've been out of the loop, is there a reason why Nick pulled the plug on Rise?

I wonder if it's due to the toys not selling. I've seen successful shows get canned due to toys not selling, and even though this show is still airing it's final episodes, I don't even see the toys anymore.

Yeah, that right there. If it was selling it would still be on shelves.

Agree.

I can understand people who liked it wanting it back, but when they're watching it on Nick for free...why is Nick going to invest time and money into a show that isn't pulling a big enough audience and profiting enough to be worth it to keep it going.

Now, to be fair, they weren't exactly giving people that much product to buy, and the Turtle figures in particular were not that great looking and didn't translate well to real life toys. (Some of the non-Turtles were better, but too scarce?) That said, well, I guess Rise fans should have gone crazy cat lady mode and bought irrational quantities of it to support it and make them think it was popular. But that sounds a little unreasonable.

The last Rise products I saw, and beyond the end of the toy line, was some kid gift set for probably Valentine's Day (or Easter?) and they weren't exactly flying off the shelf. I still see Rise gift bags in Dollar Tree currently (at the one I visit for my job every week) and they aren't exactly selling fast either.

But hey, if any Rise fans what any remaining memorabilia, check the gift bags. And if not for a gift, well... I dunno, cut out and frame a side of it for art?

The toys were trash. Really, just awful. The articulation was easily Playmates' best, but the likenesses were God-awful. Especially for Raph & the Donnie which came packaged with a drone vehicle of sorts. Toys largely fund these cartoons, as I understand it, so their failure may be the most simple answer, sure. I saw a lot of guys who didn't like the show support the toy line, out of brand loyalty. I also saw many express that they'd have liked to, if only the toys didn't look so bad, bias against the actual episodes aside. Even 'haters' like to pepper their shelves with a new set of turtles, if only to sort of represent their evolution over time. I bought them despite my own criticisms, but largely on clearance, & out of desperation. They/we deserved better figures, for sure. At least concerning the turtles themselves, anyway. Others, like Meat Sweats & other baddies, were great!

Obviously, the series making dramatic changes in style, tone, & character turned off the majority of longtime fans (not me, I loved it, but I'm not blind to the fact). Those changes seemed to scare off the majority of companies who otherwise would have wanted to license these characters for the merch, too. Remember, 2012 had people saying Turtlemania was back. You couldn't go ANYWHERE without seeing tons of goods with CG renderings of those turtles on 'em. That's a lot of revenue to drum up, or in this case, not see. I saw Rise party favors & stickers, not much else. They made it impossible to support this iteration financially, honestly.

Nick also treated it very poorly. Odd scheduling, hiatuses, lackluster updates, shoving it into obscure time slots & ultimately the Nicktoons channel, etc.

There could be any number of reasons:

• Low toy sales (most likely)
• Low TV ratings (second most likely)
• Not enough people watching it digitally (wherever that was, if anywhere)
• Too expensive (I'm willing to bet Aussies cost more than Koreans)
• Not enough buzz on twitter (no, really, that's a thing these days)
• Another pitched show (possibly TMNT related) was projected to have better chances

There's also the possibilty that Rise was never meant to last more than two or three seasons in the first place. There are thirteen Transformers cartoons (twenty-two if you count Japanese exclusives and online ****) and hardly any of them lasted more than seventy episodes, most don't even exceed fifty-two. So it is indeed possible that TMNT cartoons from now on may not last one hundred plus episodes.

Rise always struck me as a quick, temporary experiment to keep something TMNT out there while they work on the next "real" TMNT cartoon.

Did anyone ever even see a t-shirt, at least a kid one, for this show? I saw them online, but never a single one in person.

Also, pulled out my wrestling Leo, one the few Rise figures I bought. Why did they give him a shirt that's basically wearing him? Compared to my 'in disguise' PD Leo (honestly a fav variant figure among recent incarnations), I just don't get it. Playmates clearly knows how to do a good sculpt of a Turtle in clothing, so why did they make the choice they did with the Rise figure, just putting a rubbery plastic "shirt" on over top of the figure? Was it a cheap shortcut to not bother with a new sculpt?

Tried to get a pic of these two. (Though too lazy at this hour to post it for reference.) Annoys me that the Rise figures don't even stand up well.



I keep seeing people now claiming that it's popular on Twitter... but well, where was that popularity when it mattered, and it kind of needed to be popular on television, too, not just a minority of people online after the fact. :tconfuse:

The people that it needed to be popular with the most aren't old enough to have a Twitter account yet.

True, it's a good point. They did want to go younger. Guess the little kids didn't care. (And/or like my nephew banned from shows that insanely hyper.)

Hopefully, maybe Nick is realizing that where the money is, is more-so with the people old enough to earn it, as well as have influence on what their own kids are seeing if it's good enough to pull the older fans in.

The only shirt I saw of this show was a grey one with all four turtles and the show logo on it. Saw no kid wearing one though.

But yeah, pretty much what everyone else has said. We all saw the cancellation coming but what caught us off guard was when they shortened the season from 26 to 13 episodes. That shows how much Nick really didn't see much profit nor further use for this series.

Pretty much what everyone said above. If your toys don't sell your cartoon is F'ed. Not to mention changing a lot of the characters so much that it turned off the hardcore turtle fans.

also nick went out of their way to kill it. changing the air times, moving it to nick toons, only releasing two dvds in all this time. as for the toys if they would have stopped releasing wave one constantly and given us the figures they kept hinting at it probably would have sold better. i really wanted that hidden city add on.

The toys and the time/channel changes/breaks were the shows killer. A lack of consistency of new episodes will eventually turn away children, unless they are a really big fan of the show. This leads to declining toy sales which will lead to cancellation

Probably all in response to poor ratings/receival. Attempts to right the ship.

It's also possible it was originally re-tooled from being a Michael Bay/Platinum Dunes movie tie-in cartoon. Donatello has the same goggles on his head that he wore in the movie, and Raphael is "bigger and bulkier" like the Turtles were in the movies.

After the movies bombed they probably re-tooled the show into what it is now. Remember this cartoon came out in 2018 so it was in pre-production as far back as 2016 when the second movie came out.

Yes, it is certainly posssible that it was originally meant to be a tie-in to the PD movies... But they sure changed a lot if that was the case... Like way more than you'd expect if that was the case. If it really was meant to be a tie-in (and not just loosely using some elements) then you'd expect more similarities to remain. As examples:

• Splinter being a literal lab rat
• Sacks being where they came from
• April being an adult reporter
• Vernon hanging around being a creep
• Shredder being a regular human
• Karai being a modern day member of the Foot
• Krang and Dimension X
• The Turtles being open allies to the police
• Casey being a male corrections officer
• Baxter Stockman being an adult scientist
• Bebop and Rocksteady... Having any signifigant presence

Not saying all or even most of these elements would have been kept, just that expect more than just "Raph and Donnie kinda look the same as in the movies... Sort of...".

Yes, I know it's dumb but appearently it is something companies track these days.

I tried to buy em on the basis of the show might not be for me, but at least if the toys look good... And I just couldn't. They were just too crappy looking.

While I don't mind making them look different to a degree, I particularly did not like the size difference between Raph and the others. The exaggerated skinny limbs on the other three were on their own not good for figure designs. Far too flimsy and can hardly stand up. If an adult has a hard time making them stand steadily on their feet, how frustrated are the kids going to get with that who they wanted as the audience? That just hurts the play potential. When I saw the Rise basics Five Below had, the limited articulation was better for the young kids, but I only got my nephew Raph because I really thought he might end up breaking the others with those skinny limbs. :tconfuse: And that face paint and the basic Leo looking drugged or something... ugh.


As for PD... ehhhhh... I dunno, there's clearly some inspiration there at least in the case of Raph and Donnie's designs -- and maybe utterly coincidental that Rise Leo's red marks falls almost exactly across where PD Leo's scar(s) is above/across his right brow and cheek so maybe they looked at that and it evolved into the red stripes -- but enough else is different that I doubt it was supposed to be a PD show per se. I think it's also probable they did the old "hey, here's a random idea, now what franchise will we apply it to?" lazy nonsense.

From what I understand, Nickelodeon went through a management change and the new people in charge decided to get rid of what was considered to be "Surplus material" from their predecessors, which included Rise.

The only Rise toy I have is the one of April, since that was the best looking of them all.
https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon...._AC_SX425_.jpg

Problem is that she has the same issues as the others: as in they don't look the way they do in the show.

https://i.pinimg.com/564x/8e/f9/58/8...d783c0e6ba.jpg
Yes, a dress is a bit hard to pull off in toy form but it's what made her look.

It's also kinda sad that black April will always be remembered for this incarnation alone, I'm pretty sure April will be white again in the next cartoon. They'll probably always associate black April with "Rise" and assume it didn't work.

Back to the basics.

Hm, I always figured it was just a shirt she has on.



Can I just add, why didn't they make a Mayhem plush? I mean come on... That and I'll always be annoyed there was no Ice Cream Kitty plush (edit: or figure!). Mayhem had more potential than what he was given. But isn't that the way of Rise.

The issue I had during Rise is one that has happened before, but it's a mistake they keep making.

When a company commits to a show, the industry seems to demand that all merchandising needs to reflect that show and that show only. This worked out fine for the 2K3 show and the 2012 show, because those shows used "standard" turtle designs. If a parent needed to buy their kid a Ninja Turtles toy or, in my favorite example, a Ninja Turtles halloween costume, great, no problem, you've got lots of great choices.

But then Fast Forward came along and the turtle designs changed to crap with weird gear (markings) over the turtles. Now if you wanted a halloween costume, it looked like this:

https://crazyforcostumes.com/ProdImages/DIS6693.jpg

Then the 2012 show happens and those are nice, standard designs and all the merch looks good.

Then the 2014 movie happens... oh god.

Luckily, the Bay movies didn't take over all the merch; it co-existed with the 2012 merch. But now when you went Halloween costume shopping, this was one of the options:

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/uMkAA...Bas/s-l400.jpg

LEGO dropped the TMNT license after supporting the 2014 movie, and I'm sure there were others.

So now the 2012 show ends and Rise comes to replace it. Look, I think it's neat that they got creative with the Turtle designs for this show, but now you've got Turtles that don't look like the Ninja Turtles parents know, so when Johnny asks for a Ninja Turtles toy they don't find what they think that is supposed to look like. And here is what you get in the Halloween costume aisle:

https://spirit.scene7.com/is/image/Spirit/07559966-a

(There's actually a pretty interesting range of Rise costumes if you google these, all of which are terrible.)

Meanwhile, there is a small trickle of what Nickelodeon calls "retro" merchandise, which is generally ok. But it tends to be in specialty stores or in a different department other than the basic toy aisle. And I think they've even had some retro Halloween costumes (ok, just did a quick google search and they seem to only be available in adult sizes).

Anyways, this is a lot of words to say that they took a creative risk and they KNEW they were taking a creative risk. None of the vocal reaction to the show should have been a surprise to them. BUT THEN THEY DOUBLED DOWN ON IT. They green lit a second season (and made a HUGE press release about that) before the show ever aired and after they knew people didn't really like how it looked. And then they went and gave it a freaking Netflix movie. THINK ABOUT THE WASTED OPPORTUNITY. No one is going to care about that when it comes out and Netflix is going to be all, "Thanks, but no thanks" on more TMNT projects.

It's fine to take a creative risk with a show, but it's stupid to put all of your turtle eggs in the one basket when there's no reason that you can't have generic TMNT merch on the shelf alongside some Rise-specific toys because hopefully some kids do like and want that.

AND I WILL NEVER FORGIVE RISE FOR CHANGING THE TMNT ICE CREAM.

ahem.

You're really good at this. :tgrin:

Well said, Rose!

Some people like coffee, some people love coffee, some need a non-fat latte with decaf espresso and cinnamon drizzle. Grabbing a coffee sometime can be seen as a date, or an excuse to friend zone/brush off somebody.

Turtles, like coffee, covers a lot of ground, and just like coffee, it can be made strong, or weak. Some people are addicts, and so you want that main-lined hard stuff, you want the purest, most Mirageiest experience possible. Some are so bored of the same old, they need it to be reimagined and deconstructed. If Seth is looking to please the base, just make the thing they never got, distilled, purified, Mirage. If he wants to go after Gen Alpha, mock it, shave down the edges, gentrify and liquify it into a new beast.

Preacher was pretty good. The Boys is pretty good. Seth seemed to know how to translate those to series, without losing what made them cool. So long as he doesn’t inject too much of himself into the series, it should be good.

Rose nailed it on the head "chef's kiss"

I agree with what Rose said as well. Though I'm sure Nickelodeon wants to forget about this show even before the movie comes out.

Still hoping the 2012 series gets revisited for a movie. Ciro said he gave a number of pitches to Nick to bring it back for a movie as a follow-up to the series. I hope it happens.

You'd think Nickelodeon would just go with that instead of the announced CGI film by Seth Rogen.

I dunno, Nick still at least knows that 2012 is popular enough that when they recently licensed some face masks for charity they used 2012 for it. :tthumbsu:

edit: If Nick can't really go and give us the kind of show we dream of, at least not on their channels... I at least still wouldn't mind a 2D series that is essentially an aged-up version and continuation of the 2012 Turtles. Edit the designs and art style to freshen it up, sure, but still keep the looks of them mildly recognizable enough as an older version of those Turtles.

Nick managed a popular one in their first try, but may be hard to repeat that success if they remain determined to go too far off the rails.

mY NEXT series will start ifn a few months and it will be as seiorus as 2012 and 2003 series were. No suprise that it failed. I was not fighting the turtles as much as the previous series, there wasnt aliens, i didnt have any good and powerful henchmen like Hun Rocksteady bebop and Tiger claw, it was much more kiddie and funny than even the 1987 series was... That why it failed but evrytihng will be good in the next series that will start in a few months and will be dark and serious like the 2012 and 2003 series. The failurp roved that such kiddle and funy series cant be succesful.

as far as I know, rise hasn't been officially cancelled.

correct me if I'm wrong.

I don't think that I've ever come across Rise merchandise in Ireland. Of course, I'm sure that the toy stores used to stock them. However, in the supermarkets I've only ever seen TMNT 2012 cakes and birthday cards.

Nickandmore!
@nickandmore
?
46m
That was the TV show's finale. The second season, which was ordered in July 2018 before the show had even premiered, was apparently cut from the original 26 episodes to 13.

Susanna

@SuspiciousAnna
? 43m
Welp it?s done! It?s been a crazy two years of animating on #rottmnt and I have loved every second of it! Thank you guys so much for the constant and unwavering support!?? THANK YOU!!! #rottmntfinale #rottmntspoilers


ant ward
@Ward_Ant
? 19m
Hope everyone enjoyed the #rottmntfinale -Thanks for being amazing fans. Thanks to the entire crew for being amazing humans.

Those are all people who worked on Rise

Yeah, the posts of those behind it made it pretty clear, but anyone waiting for the words "it's canceled" probably aren't going to get it, because being straight forward doesn't seem to be a thing that shows and whatnot do anymore. I hate that companies do that though. (Hell, I still want Josh Gates' Destination Truth to come back since they never said a word to suggest it was over and never explained it -- and why not just tell us?? -- but after a while it was safe to assume, esp since he moved on to other series. Sucks that companies do this.)


I work for a card company and while only one of my stores I service sells a TMNT card, can confirm it has also remained the 2012 version.

Hardly anyone was watching the show or buying the toys.

As for why hardly anyone was doing these things I imagine it just came too soon after the 2012 show to really hook people in. Most kids who hadn't outgrown the cgi show wouldn't take to a new version and there hadn't been a significant turnover of new kids coming to the franchise fresh.


Beyond that I think there are certain concepts that just don't work well for this franchise. New non-Shredder central villains (Dregg, Dragonlord, Draxum), magic and techno weapons, excessive accessorising, giant 'roided up turtles and this show did all of that.

Defenders of Rise will say that fans don't like change (and that is true) but this wasn't new or trying anything different. It was taking a bunch of stuff that time again has either been met with mixed reactions or outright flopped with fans and doing it all in one show.

I kinda get why Nickelodeon would do it. People often obsess about how kids will be able to tell the turtles apart so accessorising and giving them all different proportions sounds like a good idea on paper. It's always a problem that few versions of TMNT can get past the Shredder as the main villain only Archie and 2K3 really managed it, even Mirage kinda struggles with City at War the last universally considered good story after Saki's final defeat in Return to New York. I get why coming up with new villains is a popular idea but it rarely ever works out well. I just feel that the powers that be always look at these issues and think that 'this time it will work'.

I feel that some new concepts could work fine for TMNT, but if you're going that route you really can't half-ass it and expect it to work out, and that has happened all too frequently.

When it came down to it, for example, what was the point of the mystic weapons really? Just because? They never really played much part in the show other than "look a flashy thing." If the explanation for something can be summed up as "just because," that is sort of a rather lousy reason.

After all, the 2003 Turtles got mystic weapons too. But it was made to matter that they got them, that they'd earned them, it mattered that Leo came away disappointed and probably wondering why he didn't and how it impacts him. I realize these are very different shows, but even some hyper, candy coated comedy could at least have a decent enough excuse and reason to have them other than they saw shiny objects and stole them without a thought or care.

Sure, I'm probably giving it more thought than fans of Rise care for and would hand wave it off, but if a show runs by the premise that you're not supposed to think about it, then, well, I guess it also died by that motto, too, didn't it.


Draxum had potential, but they again just stuck with scratching the surface then dropped the ball in favor of a Shredder that never really got to pose that much of a threat to the world beyond the TMNT. They could have gone into more detail and given his existence and history in the mystic city more depth, and not forgotten about the reason he was a bad guy after a short time. I really wouldn't mind seeing someone else's deeper, more impactful take on Draxum someday.

I'm kinda reminded of the 87 series episode raphael meets his match when a guy told raph his tmnt costume was better than raphs.

Besides the toy-lines Nick just also treated it like crap. I mean only show the newest episode then go right back to Spongebob or Loud House with the occasional showing of the previous episode before the newest episode come on (Although they did that with the 2012 series too). I watched a video about Rise from TheCartoonGamer 8000 and he said YTV treated Rise a whole lot better than Nick showing it multiple times on the channel. Having pretty cool fan art promos showing fan art from fans that liked the show, making promos with actual turtles. Seriously Canada treats their shows a whole lot better than we do.