Unrest in Ukraine
 

Tensions between Russia and Ukraine are growing. Russia does not want Ukraine to join the NATO, and many people now fear a Russian invasion of Ukraine.

Like other Eastern European countries, Russia travelled in the directon towards democracy during the 1990's and early 21st century (while it had its economic problems). But while the other joined the EU or NATO, recent years saw Russia travelling in the oppsite direction, and Russia is now becoming a dysfunctional democracy that threatens its neighbourhood.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-60448162

Make it "totalitarian five-minutes-away-from-Fascism ineffective state, full of corruption".
The only differences between Russia and some banana republic are territory and nukes.

As for stuff with Ukraine - I don't know anymore what Putin, wants, but it will be clear over the course of the next few days.

Edit:
Putin made an emergency speech on TV. Given his rhetoric, bald dwarf has finished his evolution in a Russian version of a Hitler.

Well in that case Ukraine should definitely be allowed to join NATO and Putin can either piss off or be made to wish he had.

What is his deal anyhow? More territory? Childish pot stirring on the world stage or just dick waving?

All these years in power, with (real) stolen elections made him corrupt. Vladimir Putin now sees the collapse of the Soviet Union and the end of the Cold War as a catastrophe (which is strange, since he is not a Communist but rather a Nationalist), and now he seeks revenge.

It can be compared to a guy with moustache in Germany, who saw the defeat of the German Empire in World War I and the establishment of the Weimar Republic as a catastrophe. He came to power in 1933, and sought revenge...

Very well stated.

In 2014 Crimea was taken from Ukraine from Russia after the Ukrainian president was ousted. Now, it appears that this is a sequel. Do these people actually want to switch from Ukraine to Russia or is it a certain section of the Ukraine? I am just trying to get a non-political insight. On the surface it appears Vladimir Putin bullying the Ukraine into being fully absorbed and the west is trying to use diplomacy to stop it though NATO may be an option. Is there a difference this time where the people wanted to be annexed before and these don't which is why the U.N. didn't act last time? Like I said, I don't want any political issues here, just clarification. It is hard to do that through news media.

It is impossible, since according to own NATO's rules, country which have conflicts on its territory can not become part of NATO. Which supposedly was one of the main reasons for starting DNR LNR **** in the first place.

One reason is that dwarf wants to boost up his ratings, which are extremely low due to the tanking economy and Russia effective fight against COVID (spoiler: it was not effective at all).
Another, he seemingly really thinks of himself as Russian Tsar who gathers old Russian territories - an idea existing, since they days of actual Russian Empire.

It doesn't make him a Communist, since late USSR, where Pitler is from, had very little in common with Communism. It does make him run-of-the-mill Imperialist, who believes that "territory is everything", and, "if your country is bigger than the rest, it is also more powerful and feared".

Which shows that oldman completely lost touch with reality and seemingly doesn't have a basic grasp on economy, modern technology and how relationship between modern countries work.

You mean separatist republics?

I think, originally locals, like in Crimea, were on board, since culturally they were more Russians, than Ukrainians. It doesn't help that Russian propaganda created a whole storm of "fake news" about atrocities of Ukrainian army and their version of Nazis groups, against Russian-speaking people of Ukraine including rape, crucifixion (!!) and ol'good genocide.

So people were scared and were willing to accept new pro-Russian separatist leadership. Thing is, 8 years later, it had become obvious that their life has not become better under quasi-Russian control. Those republics are ruled by ruthless and dumb gangs of mercenaries, whose leaders at each throats. Its basically low scale Mad Max in post-Soviet cities. It hadn't changed as well.

Local people, obviously has no power in their own "independent (ha-ha) republics", which are ultimately ordered around by Moscow enforcers. So, whatever, "documents" and "pleas" are coming from those republics are basically, what Moscow had ordered local governments to say.

So, to sum it up: locals has no say in their destiny and every time you hear from pro-Russian source that "people of Luhansk / Donetsk had chosen this and that", it is a lie and was down by orders from Moscow.

NATO won't be an option, because, they won't get into conflict with nuclear power, because, of Ukraine.

Also, I don't think Pitler wants to get whole Ukraine: country is divided into Western and Eastern parts. Historically Western part is pro-West, it has its own culture, craving for independency and hatred for the Russians, who they consider usurpers and conquerors.

Eastern Ukraine, on contrary, is pro-Russian - they culture leans towards being more Russian-like and they predominantly speak Russian as their main language. However, after shitshow with separatists republics, even those people are not fans of Pitler's Russia.

If old dwarf will try to conquer Ukraine as a whole - he will end up with guerilla warfare and acts of terror of unprecedent scale, so maximum he can try is to conquer Eastern part of the country and now, even this looks like no easy task.

The only reason separatist republics were not annexed is, because, they were more useful as separatist republics. Now, it might change.

It's funny, back when I used to move furniture I met a few guys from Russia, Ukraine... Even a couple from Georgia (country, not state). I remember the one guy, Vladimir, one day he was just constantly giving this other guy (whose name I forget) the stinkeye, and I asked him what was up. They sounded similar (to my ears) so I was like "I thought you Russian guys would all stick together?" He got all animated and was like "That guy not Russian! He from f*cking Ukraine! Those people are crazy!" :lol: I didn't ask him to elaborate, but it was funny.

One thing ALL of those guys told me, though - independently and years apart - was that no matter what they did on the surface, the Russian government had no intention of ever letting the past go and were obsessed with regaining whatever status and glory they'd lost over the latter half of the 20th Century. That even if it takes 200 years, they're hellbent on "ruling the world" again and will stop at nothing to see it through. Like they're the actual Legion of Doom over there.

Wouldn't doubt it.

Stopping Ukraine joining NATO is definitely one angle. The fact Ukraine has a **** ton of valuable resources (such as rare metals and other minable assets) is probably another given prices on them have been rising last few years due to COVID etc.

Russia has more resources.
Annexing Ukraine basically will make it a huge money sink for the Russia (and that is without money, which Russia would need to sink into fighting local guerillas).
And given horrible state of Russian economy it is a complete insane plan. But Putin had proven that he and sanity run on separate lanes, so...who knows.

Isn't it funny how no one, not even the liberal nuts who would appear in this thread, have nothing to say about the comment although Russian-guy's comment was inherently racist? But if you make a blanket observation about another group with habits central to one location, you'd have cries of racism.

A noteworthy amount of super conductor and semi-conductor materials are imported here from Ukraine.

Our spineless social justice President has done nothing. Trump would've been all over this as his record of action points out. Germany took action before Biden for God's sake. Germany. That's like saying that France launched a full out offensive against terrorism - it's unheard of.

I am not sure what Trump could have done differently at this point.

I mean, sure situation would not escalated to this point, if he was a president. That is I am fairly confident in.

But at this point the only tangible thing possible is to proclaim sanctions. Neither US, nor any other country would go to war with nuclear power, because of Ukraine.

Basic explanation of what Pitler is doing

He would've taken faster action and then backed it up with further and immediately deployable sanctions. Hands down that's what he would have done.

Fast and measurable response in that he probably would've worked on stopping the Nord Stream pipeline with Germany as an immediate action. Second likely sent a fleet into the national waters near Russia in preparation of an immediate trade blockade and third likely have began immediate investigative talks not only with Russia but an immediate and pre-emptive coalition in direct communication with the U.N., instead of Biden's wait time and days-later-offer to talk provided no invasion. All of that fits Trump's operating models. And all of that plays to what you said in that through those measures the situation wouldn't be where it is at now.

As opposed to Biden and Harris sitting around until after Russia had created a full crescent moon invasion force and then decided to say something too late in the game to truly deter a problem. Under Trump the entire mechanism of action for deterrent would've been moved up by days, along with a follow-up action plan for the next measures had Russia not been deterred.

Putin's entire operating model is old-school KGB deception and feint motions. And Biden and his patsy crew fell for it. "We will begin pulling out some troops tomorrow" and instead while Biden goes "wooo boy we dodged that bullet" the next day Putin sends them in. You have to have a non-war show of force that is immediate and overwhelming with the next action already set to go. Biden and Harris got strung along like fools.

Biden set the stage for this by surrendering Afghanistan to the Taliban. There has never been a better time for foreign powers to militarily basically make whatever moves they want... the U.S. won't do anything about it

Yeah, Biden might be screwed here because if his bloviating about sanctions doesn’t work then he’s going to continue to look bad. Also if the U.S. had to step in physically it would be another blow to his presidency because with everything that has gone on, American voters will react poorly to conflict. It’s a bad situation for him because ultimately he will just end up looking weak.

https://bronx.news12.com/ukraine-cri...outside-russia
Financial sanctions against Russian banks and oligarchs were made earlier this afternoon. U.S. could do more though. I am surprised that Boris Johnson has not announced any sanctions yet.

Shh, lets just pretend Trump didn't make deals directly with the Taliban to pull our people out before Biden was elected and was in agreements to have them out by May 2021, earlier than Biden's extended deadline. No way was that fallout not going to happen either way.



I'm surprised no one has ever managed to just take Putin down yet. How old is he even at this point, it would be easier if he'd just kick the bucket.

He is 69. The relic of the KGB past is still pretty vigor and healthy for his age. I admit I thought he would have started to step back by now. Though look at both Trump and Biden who are a few years older still going full force. Fidel Castro did not step back until he was in his late 70s'.

Epic post written. Then considered my highly-opinionated-yet-childlike-view of an audience for a moment before hitting "submit".

Let the conversation ensue at the level of "I can't beliiiiieeeeve that nobody haven't taken Putin ooooouuuuttttt" (try reading that like "Oh. MY. God. Becky look at her butt").

Its not about pipeline profit, but about Putin's "dream" about "gathering back Soviet Union". Or at least, as much as possible he can manage, before going full WW3. Well, and looking like a macho leader for his dumb followers.

It might be interesting, since unlike before it directly affects Putin's friends, a circle which for a long time was considered to be untouchable. On one hand, it might lead to some disagreement among Russian elites and possible change of course in the perspective, since they would not like to lose money, on the other - it might anger dwarf even further.

Russian tsars rarely step away on their own. You either need a revolution, a coup d'état or them just kicking the bucket to achieve this. Otherwise, they will cling to the power until their last breath. And it doesn't matter whether they are called "tsars", "general secretaries" or "presidents".

The only ones who stepped away in the last few decades were Gorbachev (who, surprisingly for a Russian leader, didn't want power), Yeltsin (who was too sick to rule) and Medvedev (who was Putin's proxy and thus doesn't count).

They will sent James Bond, Ethan Hunt and Batman to hunt him down. Any day. Any day. :roll:

Putin's crack team of bears on unicycles would easily quell any potential coup or uprising within minutes, anyways.

If Biden had a team of bears on unicycles then Jan. 6th never would have happened. Goes to show, there's still much we can learn from Russia, even now.

What, is he living in a bullet and bomb proof bunker all the time? No infiltrator could use his poisoning tricks against him?



Aahaha... Maybe all over it writing grade school poetry for his love, Putin.

https://www.clayandbuck.com/presiden...om-mar-a-lago/
Says it wouldn't have happened under his watch, yet he's fawning over it and calls them peacekeepers...with more tanks than he's ever seen. Righhhht...

:roll:

I can't even address this comment.


You clearly have no idea how to read context. Trump wasn't calling Russia "peacekeepers" you clown. He was citing what Russia had said and then mocking it. He's saying "Putin said they were peacekeepers" and following it up with "well that's BS - he's sending in the strongest -airquotes- peacekeeping force ever", hence mocking it and calling out Putin's lies. And then he says how this never would have happened under his watch.

OMG your comprehension level is.... I mean this is exactly how an idiot forms her opinions. Go back and re-read the statement. Holy $#!( I can't even believe what you've got in your head. I can't even believe it.

I swear to God that I actually almost feel guilty saying this outright because it's like taking candy from a baby - but you are a f'ing idiot of the highest order and it's clear by how you interpret information. What you wrote and interpreted above is direct evidence of the kind of mental calculus that all of your opinions are born of. I can't even believe it.

You read that and formed the honest-to-God perception that Trump's statement on the matter was that Russia was in the right and that he was saying that Russia is indeed a peacekeeping force. That was your comprehension and ability to read the statement. And that is the headmath you've used to form all of your analysis about current events and the political state that you dig in on so tightly. This isn't "one" mistake on Indigo's part. It's actually direct evidence of who you are really talking to when you engage with her in any discourse. It's a person with ZERO knowledge, and clearly ZERO reading or situational comprehension who only has developed one life skill. And that one life skill is to fake real understanding by digging in and delivering hard-nosed, semantic-arguments in the hopes that nobody notices that she is indeed clueless.

You actually misread and misinterpreted your own source and then delivered your position based on a complete lack of reading comprehension on the matter.

She's had you blocked for like a year, bro.

I just feel compelled to let you know in case you wish to save your strength going forward. Time is not a renewable resource and you're literally talking to yourself. I know that you value your time greatly, and I'm not sure if you knew that she hasn't seen any of this stuff you say, but now you know. You said you deleted another post earlier because you knew it wouldn't do any good; neither will arguing with someone who can't see what you're saying.

Just FYI.

Putin has started a war.
Hopefully it will be his last war and the last war for this iteration of Russia.
Prayers and strength to the Ukraine.

Are you an idiot? No, seriously, do you seriously judge the world by comic books and action movies?

It is clearly an irony. Drink less left kool-aid, before you start growing sickles and hammers, instead of brain.

Oh I know. But I'm also literally talking to everyone who would read the nonsense she posts so that they have a reality as a counterpoint so as not to be drawn into a ridiculous and uninformed opinion that vitriolic people like Indigo might say.

So I could care less about Indigo herself - I never did. But I care more about the quasi-influential nonsense that she puts out into the world, especially here where people onboard with skewed perspective so easily or without real information.

This whole thing is an honest-to-God tragedy, man. Anyone who doesn't think it is clearly has no conceptualization of what this could lead to. Those are real lives in Ukraine that are being threatened and upended - I have two friends from Ukraine who live in Chicago and they are both terrific girls and good people who have a lot of great information about this. And Biden's handling of this is also an open invitation for China to move on Taiwan.

This whole thing is terrible.

something i've been wondering lately.

why is communism so common on 'the mainland'? The UK seems to have gotten over it. Australia. some other places. but not russia, china, etc. all the bad seems to come from that 'small' section of the world and nothing really changes much.

The United Kingdom and Australia have never been Communist. Russia hasn't been Communist snce the dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1991. Vladimir Putin is an aggresive Nationalist and today's Russia is a dyfunctional democracy.

what I was trying to get at is that the idea never really took hold over there. yet on the main laind, not so much.

Stil, Communist countries haven't existed in Europe since 1991. Extreme nationalism is the new poison that threatens Europe.

Communism is an incredibly effective form of population mobilization and "peasant control". Both of which make it a ripe system for power grabs and the diminishment of a middle class.

https://www.cnn.com/europe/live-news...ntl/index.html

Here are live updates.

Most reasonable people have migrated away from CNN as a news source as eyes have been opened.

CNN’s Ratings Collapse: Prime Time Down Nearly 70% In Key Demo

There are other places to give the clicks to. Some of the extreme-libards & hangers-on here will argue the point, but CNN is in shambles, rightfully so.

Cuomo, there key hate-monger host was fired for sexual harassment.
Toobin exposed himself on a zoom call.
CNN's president Jeff Zucker resigns for having internal sexual "relationships"
Don Lemon conspired with Jessie Smollett who was found lying in court about being "attacked by white people"
And there's more....

And you'd link to CNN for anything? Find another source, dude.

lol... only about 100,000 people are watching CNN? That's hysterical.

Rational people are walking away in droves from the liberal assault and the "woe-is-me-I'll-blame-an-ism" culture. YouTubers are getting more views that the Crap News Network.

It's just a convenient source to refresh as I sit through meetings. I knew the station had been hit hard, but I didn't realize that bad. I had hoped Nickelodeon would continue with decline after the stunt it pulled over the summer. Another thread for another time.

I don't know anything about the Nickelodeon thing.....
What should I search for to catch up on that?

Just search : nickelodeon ratings decline lgbtq

https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/enterta...agenda-to-kids

Really disgusting. Sadly, not at all surprising.