Season 2: What was the Problem

[CyberCubed]

Most of the things people are saying in this thread never happened. The writers didn't "forget" anything.

[Papenbrook]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Most of the things people are saying in this thread never happened. The writers didn't "forget" anything.

Okay. Then explain what the writers didn't "forget". Also, give details on how the writers didn't "forget" plotlines, arcs, character development, or any other lore that was important to the show.

[CyberCubed]

What did they forget? They didn't forget about mutant canisters in the city because that's how new mutants are randomly popping up. There's no way for the Turtles to find hundreds of canisters scattered around the city, its just to explain new mutants.

They didn't forget the Kraang storyline, the various mutants, or what Shredder is doing.

[Papenbrook]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

What did they forget? They didn't forget about mutant canisters in the city because that's how new mutants are randomly popping up. There's no way for the Turtles to find hundreds of canisters scattered around the city, its just to explain new mutants.

They didn't forget the Kraang storyline, the various mutants, or what Shredder is doing.

They would put those plotlines on hold in favor of various fillers. Is Mutagen Man's arc going to go somewhere? How about Sir Malachi's? Or April's reveal as a mutant-human hybrid? Or Karai's reveal as Splinter's daughter? Did any of those go anywhere?

[CyberCubed]

Since when did Sir Malachi have a story arc? Mutagen Man is still frozen, they're working to de-mutate Karai first.

[Papenbrook]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Since when did Sir Malachi have a story arc? Mutagen Man is still frozen, they're working to de-mutate Karai first.

Last time we saw Sir Malachi, he was walking alone in the sewers with no way to return back to a human. They still haven't mentioned Mutagen Man until the second season finale, and the Karai plotline was put on hold in favor of fillers.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by Purple Kraken

Okay. Then explain what the writers didn't "forget". Also, give details on how the writers didn't "forget" plotlines, arcs, character development, or any other lore that was important to the show.

Being temporarily put on hold isn't the same as being forgotten. The show isn't over yet. There's still time to revisit old plot lines and characters.

The only things I do feel were legitimately forgotten about are the Sqirrelanoids and the Cockroach Terminator.

[Sushi Shea]

A lot of these one-shot characters like Malachi and Squirrelanoids don't really need to be brought up again. I'm not sure if not bringing these characters back is a major flaw -- it's not like they really added anything or are integral to a plot line. They're built as filler characters, after all!

[Luckyday]

Originally Posted by Sushi Shea

Yeah, that seems to be the case. Excellent way of putting it! So, basically, we have a case of the writers not really knowing their style/structure, and therefore playing around with machines they don't want/can't operate.

Thank you! I know we tend to criticized season 2 and most of us can agree that were good stand alone episodes, but when talking about the ones suppose to have this long season structure. Those episodes are the ones that tend to color our view and made us feel that was something either missing or lackluster.

This is the reason why I really hated the North Hampton arc because it undercut the emotional payoff that was started in season 2 final. It was the wrong time to do it with so many loose ends.

But at this point if they wanted to do the same thing again but with a whole new location like dimension X or outer space, I'm all for it. The mind serum arc is sort of done at this point and the turtles know how to fight it.

[Wonton]

Originally Posted by Luckyday

Thank you! I know we tend to criticized season 2 and most of us can agree that were good stand alone episodes, but when talking about the ones suppose to have this long season structure. Those episodes are the ones that tend to color our view and made us feel that was something either missing or lackluster.

This is the reason why I really hated the North Hampton arc because it undercut the emotional payoff that was started in season 2 final. It was the wrong time to do it with so many loose ends.

But at this point if they wanted to do the same thing again but with a whole new location like dimension X or outer space, I'm all for it. The mind serum arc is sort of done at this point and the turtles know how to fight it.

Gosh, I can't add on to this; spot on, both of you! I want so badly to thorougly enjoy this show -- it has so many good concepts and ideas -- but it's so hard when they can't seem to decide what they want to do with it. It's kind of like listening to a book reading by a kid with a really, really short attention span.

[Meliwen]

Overall I thought season 2 was great, but if there's anything it fell short of, it was how they handled some of the big plots which didn't always feel like they followed them through satisfactorily, particularly in terms of emotional payoff like Luckyday mentioned, for North Hampton especially.

We know they'll get around to dealing with the plots again. But like Leo's sudden lack of reaction to Karai being his sister, North Hampton, April's half human revelation, April's importance to the Kraang, Mutagen Man... These have been dealt with, or will be dealt with eventually, but it's the time in between that, rather than feeling like an appropriate space to breath in between the action, just feels directionless. These plot points aren't forgotten, but like April's half human origin, some of them can certainly feel forgotten.

[Sushi Shea]

Absolutely, Lucky. Agreed on all points.

I think we also have to consider that a lot of the "drag-on" we felt in season two was because along with some faulty pacing in some places (we had filler between the Karai/Miwa reveal and the follow-up, same with Kirby's mutation, etc.), the hiatuses started picking up a bit, too. So, people get the feeling that things are dropping off without a trace -- even if the writers plan to wrap it up later, it's taking too long. So, we probably have to shift the blame of some of the issues to the network and scheduling, too.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by Purple Kraken

They would put those plotlines on hold in favor of various fillers. Is Mutagen Man's arc going to go somewhere? How about Sir Malachi's? Or April's reveal as a mutant-human hybrid? Or Karai's reveal as Splinter's daughter? Did any of those go anywhere?

Yes they haven't really addressed the April is a human/kraang hybrid mutant....at least not directly. But put yourself in April's shoes.

If you found out that the reason you have psychic powers and the reason a bunch of evil alien brains squids want to capture you is because you have their DNA in your veins. Logically that would not be something people would say "Oh cool" about. That would be something that a person would want to distance themselves from the moment they hear it.

In so far the Turtles haven't mentioned anything about it to her as a way of letting absorb it at her own pace. Also when Casey asks about how she has psychic powers, she just says "I'm special" as a way of giving her a way of answering him without going into details. The other Turtles also haven't told Casey as to why she is special because they feel that is something for April to reveal when she is ready.

[Luckyday]

Originally Posted by victory_angel

Yes they haven't really addressed the April is a human/kraang hybrid mutant....at least not directly. But put yourself in April's shoes.

If you found out that the reason you have psychic powers and the reason a bunch of evil alien brains squids want to capture you is because you have their DNA in your veins. Logically that would not be something people would say "Oh cool" about. That would be something that a person would want to distance themselves from the moment they hear it.

In so far the Turtles haven't mentioned anything about it to her as a way of letting absorb it at her own pace. Also when Casey asks about how she has psychic powers, she just says "I'm special" as a way of giving her a way of answering him without going into details. The other Turtles also haven't told Casey as to why she is special because they feel that is something for April to reveal when she is ready.

Even so but for the audience, when dropping a bombshell of that size, you can't just swept it under the rug. It just too juicy because changes almost everything about the character. When a new revelation is only use to give an explanation but not changing dynamic of the characters or showing how it's effecting them, then it makes the revelation seem completely worthless in context of the show.

At the very least address and resolve it even if the resolution will look half ass.

I strongly suspect there was a scene cut from "The Good, the Bad, and the Casey Jones" due to the release date of the episode. It would've gave us the mindset of what was going on in April's head and some much character dimension.

[Groverman62]

CyberCubed, Purple Kraken is actually making some good points. Dont be so rude.

Also I feel Raph's lack of focus is as season 3 issue

[NinjaPug]

Originally Posted by Purple Kraken

Last time we saw Sir Malachi, he was walking alone in the sewers with no way to return back to a human. They still haven't mentioned Mutagen Man until the second season finale, and the Karai plotline was put on hold in favor of fillers.

Karai's storyline isn't something they're going to wrap up in one season. The Karai storyline was "put on hold" as you put it when the a Turtles were in Northampton and every other storyline took a back seat.

Sir Malachi was nothing more than a MOW. Nothing needs to be wrapped up there. You can't expect every mutant to suddenly be demuated.

MM isn't a main character. I'm sure there will be resolution at some point but I doubt there is any rush for that.

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by NinjaPug

Karai's storyline isn't something they're going to wrap up in one season. The Karai storyline was "put on hold" as you put it when the a Turtles were in Northampton and every other storyline took a back seat.

Sir Malachi was nothing more than a MOW. Nothing needs to be wrapped up there. You can't expect every mutant to suddenly be demuated.

MM isn't a main character. I'm sure there will be resolution at some point but I doubt there is any rush for that.

Agreed on all counts. It seems like other people here don't know how television works. Season long plotlines tend to be resolved throughout the season or at the end of one, not immediately.

People laughably saying the Karai plot was "forgotten?" What the hell does that even mean? She discovered Splinter was her father, then got mutated and wandered around NYC, and then was brainwashed by Shredder. What's "forgotten" here? Its obvious she's going to turn back to normal eventually probably at Season 3's finale.

And people saying one-off mutants are a "plotline" or whatever that means. The mutants are still shown in various episodes too even if its just background cameos, like Spidebritez in the Fishface skateboarding episode.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by Sushi Shea

A lot of these one-shot characters like Malachi and Squirrelanoids don't really need to be brought up again. I'm not sure if not bringing these characters back is a major flaw -- it's not like they really added anything or are integral to a plot line. They're built as filler characters, after all!

I only mentioned the Squirrelnoids because Donnie mentioned wanting to use the retromutagen on them and I mentioned the Cockroach Terminator because it's still alive and probably still has a vendetta against Raph.

[Sushi Shea]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

I only mentioned the Squirrelnoids because Donnie mentioned wanting to use the retromutagen on them and I mentioned the Cockroach Terminator because it's still alive and probably still has a vendetta against Raph.

I see why you said it, of course! I'm just saying, these characters are more gimmicky than anything -- not hard-hitting enough to warrant timely pay-off like I felt Kirby's mutation or the Karai/Miwa reveal did. I totally understand the interest, though, especially since they liked to bring attention to them again at the end of the episodes.

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Originally Posted by Purple Kraken

Last time we saw Sir Malachi, he was walking alone in the sewers with no way to return back to a human. They still haven't mentioned Mutagen Man until the second season finale, and the Karai plotline was put on hold in favor of fillers.

Originally Posted by Purple Kraken

They would put those plotlines on hold in favor of various fillers. Is Mutagen Man's arc going to go somewhere? How about Sir Malachi's? Or April's reveal as a mutant-human hybrid? Or Karai's reveal as Splinter's daughter? Did any of those go anywhere?

Originally Posted by Purple Kraken

Okay. Then explain what the writers didn't "forget". Also, give details on how the writers didn't "forget" plotlines, arcs, character development, or any other lore that was important to the show.

I am 100% on Purple Kraken's side in this debate.

Originally Posted by Sushi Shea

A lot of these one-shot characters like Malachi and Squirrelanoids don't really need to be brought up again. I'm not sure if not bringing these characters back is a major flaw -- it's not like they really added anything or are integral to a plot line. They're built as filler characters, after all!

Consider all the mutants in the 4Kids storyline "Outbreak", etc. Eventually, ALL of the mutants in NYC are dealt with by Bishop gassing the city to cure them. Because they were DANGEROUS. Nick's mutants are just as dangerous but completely swept under the rug by the writers with their "mutant of the week" mindset and writing style.