Official Justice League Movie

[AquaParade]

Sounds like they arent going to talk specifics. Until then there's nothing to be said by speculators. I can understand that it could be a legal issue, but I'm skeptical of that because Fisher doesn't seem to be acting very careful.

There must be more unfolding behind the curtain that we can't see. I just know that you can't "cancel" someone because of creative and personal disagreements on a movie set. Throwing around the word "abusive" is powerful, but we as the public don't even know what they mean by that at this point.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

But I doubt this actually happens, given Matt Reeves and Robert Pattison are already presenting a very intriguing take on Batman.

Though it sure looks like it represents a return to more Grounded Batman™. At least with the Affleck Batman it seemed like they would be unafraid to do... bigger, weirder stuff.

[AquaParade]

I'd be down to see Affleck locked in Arkham with something arguably supernatural.

[Leo656]

HAH. I remember when everyone said there was zero chance of this happening.

https://screenrant.com/justice-leagu...vill-reshoots/

Shooting starts next month. Might take a week or so to complete. Cavill, Affleck, Gal, and Ray Fisher are all coming back to do more scenes.

F*ck it, man, just greenlight "Justice League 2" already and let things wrap up the way they were supposed to. They're already in balls-deep and have no firm long-term plans except for 80 Harley Quinn movies and "something" with The Rock as Black Adam, "eventually". If they're in for a penny, they're in for a pound already.

Who knows. Things that were "impossible" 6 months ago are now either Very Likely or Actually Happening depending on which case. At this point, I definitely wouldn't be shocked if at some point between now and May, someone at WB comes out and says, "Yeah, f*ck it, JL2 is back on." I mean, why not? At THIS point, there's no good reason NOT to.

Anyways yeah this is exciting.

[AquaParade]

Very cool. I want a Ben Affleck project next. Assuming his vision is different enough from Reeves. Can't just be different enough for us, but for general audiences.

Cool news either way. They should see how this does before greenlighting JL2. Hoping for the best but Snyder gave us Man of Steel and the world said "meh". Fans need to put their money where their mouths are and support the hell out of this thing before they greenlight more.

[MikeandRaph87]

Originally Posted by Leo656

HAH. I remember when everyone said there was zero chance of this happening.

https://screenrant.com/justice-leagu...vill-reshoots/

Shooting starts next month. Might take a week or so to complete. Cavill, Affleck, Gal, and Ray Fisher are all coming back to do more scenes.

F*ck it, man, just greenlight "Justice League 2" already and let things wrap up the way they were supposed to. They're already in balls-deep and have no firm long-term plans except for 80 Harley Quinn movies and "something" with The Rock as Black Adam, "eventually". If they're in for a penny, they're in for a pound already.

Who knows. Things that were "impossible" 6 months ago are now either Very Likely or Actually Happening depending on which case. At this point, I definitely wouldn't be shocked if at some point between now and May, someone at WB comes out and says, "Yeah, f*ck it, JL2 is back on." I mean, why not? At THIS point, there's no good reason NOT to.

Anyways yeah this is exciting.

Considering Fisher had such beef its surprising. Both sides are lying. With this still in the news it makes it eye brow raising.The funny thing is in Synder's version Cyborg dies though is prominent. As a DC fanboy I think Cyborg is not neccessary and I want at least a hint of Hal Jordan. I don't care about skin color representation. Please know I want to see adaptations off the page and Cyborg is a Teen Titan. I hold nothing against him I just don't see him as a League member. He is like their Martian Manhunter, coordinate from Titans Tower.

[Leo656]

I think if they're gonna dump money blindly into stuff nobody cares about like 80 more Quinn movies or John Cena as Peacemaker in a streaming show nobody but wrestling fans are gonna watch, if that, then they can scrape together enough cash for a movie they had already promised five years ago , had a budget set aside for, and then pulled away from us because they were gun-shy.

I promise you, whether they are vocal or not, a LOT more people want JL2 than want more Harley Quinn movies. With all the other worthless crap WB is flinging at the wall these days, JL2 is like, the ONE thing that actually makes sense to pursue.

We'll see. Things are changing fast nowadays. The very fact that they're doing a LOT of work on this "dead" movie, to the point of now actually getting the band back together on-set when they said a hundred times they were definitely 100% NOT going to do that... well, if it's not actually leading to more stuff long-term, then it's a little eyebrow-raising.

This was originally supposed to be a "Donner Cut" style reworking of a dead movie, done for a lark and to toss a bone for bored and loyal fans with nothing to watch. THEN they say they're gonna spend a lot of money on finishing the score and VFX. THEN they say that some of the cast are gonna do voice-over pick-ups, but absolutely no new footage to be shot. And NOW, lo and behold, they're shooting new footage with most of the main cast.

It's a lot of work for Just This, is all I'm saying. It's almost like they realize that they gave up on the entire project too quickly and that maybe it was a mistake to do so, and are trying to find ways to un-f*ck themselves out of the hole they dug by abandoning the sequel in the first place.

Affleck was always the big question mark (aside from "Will WB work with Zack", which we've seen the answer to be "Yes, Sometimes"), and we've seen that he can be talked back into the cape very easily. Every other actor wants to do JL2. Zack would do it. The rest, as always, comes down to money. But again, it would be a LOT easier to make JL2 as it was supposed to be, than to start over and try an entirely new approach to doing a Justice League movie.

Another JL movie WILL happen at some point, it's inevitable. WB has to figure out, at THIS point is it really worth starting over and throwing out what they were always planning to do when most of the heavy lifting was already done as far as prep? Smart money says No, it would be easier (and cheaper) to just make the movie they'd already planned to make and let the chips fall where they may.

We'll see. If they don't announce JL2 by, like, May of next year, it probably isn't happening. BUT... evidence now suggests it might. That by itself is huge. I won't get too hopeful - "Hope" as a concept doesn't have much to do with the real world, after all - but I recognize it as a strong possibility, and I will be rooting for it.

[MikeandRaph87]

Originally Posted by AquaParade

Very cool. I want a Ben Affleck project next. Assuming his vision is different enough from Reeves. Can't just be different enough for us, but for general audiences.

Cool news either way. They should see how this does before greenlighting JL2. Hoping for the best but Snyder gave us Man of Steel and the world said "meh". Fans need to put their money where their mouths are and support the hell out of this thing before they greenlight more.

The interesting thing is two versions of the character in the same media being allowed. If Synder and Justice League get a second chance it could be great. Its just how to rein Synder in to prevent Dick being dead and amn enforced dark tone. Sure Weadon made iit lighter, but it apparently didn't go over well with the actors and the audience. How can it be won over and not be dark?

Sure people gripe about 'Martha' in Dawn of Justice but what bothered me was Superman took the kryptonite spear to defeat Doomesday/Zod Wonder Woman should have used it since she is an amazon warrior proficient in such weaponry. Not to mention the fact that she could have been pushed as the difference maker and redeem her image after taking Lord's life in an ironic but justified manner.

[MikeandRaph87]

I skipped out on seeing two Bat Rogues debut in Birds of Prey and while I liked Suicide Squad I will not go see The Suicide Squad. I will go see Justice League 2 though! Come on, DC I want to give you my money and vocal support but...

[Leo656]

I actually feel like by now you should probably stick to watching the JL cartoons, I don't think this movie is gonna be anything of what you want for lots of reasons. Juuuust sayin'. We've all only had 5 years to get used to the idea of Who's in it, Why they need to be there, and What's going on. By now, if it ain't for you (or anyone else) then it's just not.

You'll get a two-second J'onnz cameo. Be happy with that. Cyborg actually has PLOT reasons to be in the movie beyond "skin color representation", considering he's made of Mother Box tech and the entire movie is ABOUT the goddamn Mother Boxes. J'onnz has NO reason to be in the story other than "Welllll he was in the comic book too, though". For the purposes of the movie itself, that reasoning is flimsy. Doesn't mean anything. He's redundant to the plot. You already have Superman as the centerpiece (despite being dead for half of it). We don't need "Exactly Superman, BUT can also turn invisible and read minds if he feels like". Absolutely redundant. You don't need TWO guys who do the exact same things (For this movie, that would mean Fly Around and Punch Hard). I honestly would've cut him, too, despite being a fan of the character. It wouldn't have been an easy choice, but I would have cut him, absolutely. He wouldn't ADD anything, he'd just BE there, taking up space and adding yet ANOTHER origin story flashback subplot, when they already have a lot of juggling to do. That was one of the biggest complaints about BvS, just throwing characters on-screen with no explanation and forcing the audience to fill in the blanks. And allegedly, one of the "problems" WB had with JL was that Flash, Cyborg, and Aquaman ALL have origin subplots (or at least threads) taking up a lot of space, which is why all of that was cut for the Whedon version.

It's a lot to juggle. It's probably too much. I like J'onnz, but he just wouldn't add anything to THIS story and I'm fine with him being benched until a later movie where he might actually be useful. In this round, ALL he would do is take shine off of Superman by being more powerful than he is, which was the exact opposite of what the movie was trying to put over (which was Make Superman Even More Important). You can't be all, "HEY, guys, look how cool Superman is!" and at the same time, have a guy with ALL of his powers who can also read minds and be invisible. Now your Star Player looks like a putz and the whole thing's blown. That's not how you tell that story. Again, I like J'onnz more than Cyborg, but for THIS story, they absolutely made the right choice in which characters would be involved and which ones would have to sit out.

Let's hope this project does well and in turn WB decides to greenlight JL2, since J'onnz and Green Lantern (though I doubt it'd be Hal) were eventually going to have larger roles in the movie universe. Once they became necessary. I like them too, obviously, but they simply are not mandatory for the plot of this film's story. Cramming them in there just to get them in wouldn't have been very graceful whatsoever.

Much of what you want is just baffling. You wanted WONDER WOMAN... to kill Doomsday... who is a SUPERMAN villain... just so Superman wouldn't have to die, when if he doesn't die then Doomsday has no reason to even be in the movie at all? Which also ignores the fact that if SHE kills Doomsday then she looks stronger than Superman, when the entire POINT of Zack's entire vision for the movies was, and is, "Superman Is Just The Most Important Thing In The Universe And Thus Everything Revolves Around Him". That Was, and Is, the entire point of the film series.
Everything that happens, happens in service of That Idea. Which is why certain characters can't be in the movies yet and other can't be allowed to look Better than he is.

Like seriously, I get that you're a huge fan of lots of things and want to see them done Your Way, but you're also demanding that your wants and needs override authorial intent for very nebulous reasons.

Like, none of those things would have made a better story, and most of them would fly directly counter to the point Zack was trying to make from the outset. Those things wouldn't push that story further, they'd just make it more of a story you personally would enjoy. Every creative choice they made, they had perfectly good reasons for. By now, if you're not on board, then you probably won't be, it's that simple.

Not trying to kill your enthusiasm, BUT, it seems pretty clear that you weren't thrilled with the creative direction in the first place. Still being upset about it 5 years on isn't going to change anything, nor will it make your day any happier. My advice? Re-watch the cartoons. Not being mean, just being honest. The movie isn't gonna please you. Instead of sulking, watch something else. That's really all I can say to you or anyone else who's still pining for some of these things at this point. They're not happening, and we're ultimately better off whether people accept it or not.

It Is What It Is.

[sdp]

If response is generally positive and it does well in HBO Max I can see them go for a theatrical Snyder's Justice League part 2 with Affleck.

[Leo656]

I mean, Why Not, right?

Zack's JL2 was written, and I assume it was at least partially storyboarded. They already have a cast and sets and costumes. A huge chunk of any movie's budget is in pre-production and prep; Tim Burton's "Superman Lives" cost like $80 million or some sh*t and they never even got to make the movie, that was all spent on finding a director, a cast, getting a script, making costumes, etc. etc. ALL of that was wasted when they didn't make the movie. Once all the parts are locked in, the process of actually shooting the damn movie is by most accounts "The Easy Part".

Another JL movie is a promise, whether it be in two years or 10. Now that we've seen that there is still some passionate support for Zack's vision, why NOT just let it get back on track? Almost all the foundation for Zack's JL2 was already built, they just have to actually shoot it. To scrap it all and start from zero would cost them WAY more money (and time) than any other option they could theoretically pursue.

OR, they could stick firm to "We're starting from Zero" and waste another $100 million on pre-production for a movie that might not even get made a'la "Superman Lives" or "Justice League: Mortal". That's why I laugh whenever people bring up "But the Money!" whenever it comes to decisions WB may or may not make. They've proven a hundred times they'll gladly bleed hundreds of millions and end up with nothing at all to show for it; they just don't like being made fun of on the internet when a movie actually does get made. They'll spend a hundred million on a project that never even shoots one single frame and they'll do it with a smile, but Lord help us if someone on aintitcoolnews pummels them with snappy zingers. THEN they get gun-shy.

If I were the guy in charge? Easy call. "F*ck it, we've already got the script, the sets, the costumes, the cast, and a director. That part's all done, let's Let It Ride." By that point, even if you fumble you've STILL gone with the most economical option and you still come out ahead, because at least you're not wasting resources you've already paid for. Which is what WB usually does.

[MikeandRaph87]

Wonder Woman as a character bores me. I don't care to read her outside of a Justice League comic, but despite my disinterest in the character Gal Godot hit it out of the park and truly embodies a great portrayal of the character that no script writer or director can mess up. Same with Aquaman. Jason Mamoa looks more like Roman Reigns than Aquaman, but I loved the Aquaman film, it did not matter that he did not look like Aquaman. It was a good script throwing everything that makes the character great in one basket and actually had an optimsitic ending, something I would have bet would not have happened considering the fate of Arthur's father. Nice fight sequences, nice soundtrack, everything was great. Both Gal and Jason have done wonderful jobs in bringing renewed life to the characters they are portraying. To me these two are the light of the film universe if it still is one.

[Leo656]

I think the reinvention of Aquaman is like, the biggest unexpected thing to come out of the entire project.

In 2014, rumors that Aquaman would be in the upcoming BvS movie and then spun off into his own were met with derisive snorts. "Who cares about Aquaman? That guy's a joke, he can't carry anything. Why waste time on that C-lister?"

Lots of people care, it turns out. Just not about the insipid "Super-Friends" version. They took the basic fundamental elements of the character and kept it all intact, and then from there they just let Jason Mamoa be himself. I don't always like that - I HATE it when it turns out like Hemsworth's "creative input" on the Thor character, for example - but the fact is, nobody liked Aquaman before this version happened. NOW he's cool.

I think the Wonder Woman project would have turned out mostly-fine regardless; a female super-hero movie was overdue and she's such a strong character that it would have been well-received no matter who starred in it, I think. Her movie doing well was a bit of a surprise because people were so split on the earlier DC films, but I don't entirely credit Gal Gadot with that; people flipped for the character in BvS, and with everything else about her scenes being equal... I kinda think anyone could've made it look cool. Zack took great care in making her look great, from the music to the Grand Entrance and everything else she was given to do. Not to take away from Gal herself, I just don't think Gal did much to move the needle one way or the other with the Wonder Woman character, I think with the exact same presentation just about any actress would have come out of that looking supremely bad-ass. They probably still should have cast someone a little more filled-out if we're being 100% honest, just to maintain the illusion. I mean, once you've seen Gal in a tank top, you know just how hard her costume has to work in order to make her look like a proper "Wonder Woman". She's fine, I like her. But again, That Music, That Entrance, Those Fight Scenes... they could have cast Megan Fox and people might not have been over the moon about it, but it still would have been generally well-received because of the presentation the character was given.

Aquaman's success, meanwhile, rests 100% on a combination of Zack's vision and Mamoa's charisma. You cast Chris Pine or some other Handsome Blonde Guy and play the character exactly like he's portrayed in the comic books, and guess what? Nobody Cares, and Aquaman's still a joke.

I never really cared about Aquaman, personally, and I kinda felt like he was a "wasted spot" in the movie roster, BUT I did quite happily change my tune upon seeing it in action. I also liked the solo movie a lot despite the trailers making it look very goofy, and the "I could'a just pee'd on it" joke being completely not necessary. But anyways, yeah, "The Rise Of Aquaman" from Robot Chicken punchline to billion-dollar box office is something I feel we don't really talk about enough. It took a VERY unique set of circumstances to make all of that happen, and I give them a ton of credit for it.

[Andrew NDB]

I didn't like Gal's performance in the Whedon cut of JL. She just phoned it in, like she was in an extended daze.

[AquaParade]

It's just not a safe bet until the audience actually turns out for a Snyder film. The box office numbers went down, down, down with all the DC films his name was attached to. Yes, a lot of work has been done but you still would have to renegotiate contracts and you already have Ray Fisher playing hardball on the Flash script and asking for double what they've offered him. Point is, it's not as easy as just snapping their fingers and letting production roll on. It cant be justified when the director hasn't had one unanimous success in this arena, let alone the fact that his films have shown a downward trend.

I'm not convinced it would be a wise move to greenlight JL 2 tomorrow afternoon, financially speaking. Creatively, I'm wondering how much of these reshoots are to nip/tuck this into having a satisfying conclusion. The fact that this film was always meant to be a two-part opens up a lot of questions. I think Snyder wants to continue in this universe, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him leave some openings for the future.

And finally, despite my personal feelings, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see more DC work from Zack Snyder greenlit any day now. The James Gunn Suicide Squad HBO max spin off makes it seem likely we'll see something there.

[Leo656]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

I didn't like Gal's performance in the Whedon cut of JL. She just phoned it in, like she was in an extended daze.

I wouldn't be shocked if she wasn't entirely thrilled about the entire situation. It's been oft-reported how adamant Joss was about having that scene of Flash falling on top of Wonder Woman, and how Gal refused to shoot it so they shot it with her stunt double or whoever it was.

Because Lord knows THAT kinda sh*t needed to be in there. Jesus, I loathe Joss Whedon. That situation right there plus "What Is BRUNCH"? just tells you everything you need to know about what goes on in that joker's head.

Anyways, yeah, now that you mention it Gal looked rather bored for most of JL, except for the scenes Zack originally shot which were chopped up and repurposed. Really, everyone except Ezra Miller and Mamoa looked like they had a gun in their back the entire time and would've rather been anywhere else at all. And I think Jason just tries to make the best of everything and Ezra was just grateful for the opportunity. Everyone else seemed various shades of miserable.

All of that together is kinda why I believed Ray's story about it being a miserable re-shoot experience even before Mamoa jumped in to back him up. They sure didn't LOOK like they were having any fun, despite "HAVE FUN AND LAUGH A LOT" being like, the entire point of Joss's reshoots.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by AquaParade

you still would have to renegotiate contracts and you already have Ray Fisher playing hardball on the Flash script and asking for double what they've offered him.

Good. Get rid of him -- he shouldn't even be there. Bring in Green Lantern or Martian Manhunter, who actually belong there. Explain it away with one line of dialogue ("Cyborg went to start something called 'Titans'") or don't even bother explaining at all. Also, reveal that Barry Allen is a FAKE Barry Allen from the future... he's actually Bart Allen, AKA Impulse. Then bring in the real Barry Allen played by a stoic blond dude with a lantern jaw.

Originally Posted by Leo656

All of that together is kinda why I believed Ray's story about it being a miserable re-shoot experience even before Mamoa jumped in to back him up. They sure didn't LOOK like they were having any fun, despite "HAVE FUN AND LAUGH A LOT" being like, the entire point of Joss's reshoots.

There's got to be a big sense of disappointment to the JL shoot. They shoot for months for Snyder, then they wrap. The movie is done. Affleck gets fat, Gal Gadot gets jaded. Now WB steps in and says, "None of you are done yet" and force them to redo 90% of the movie with barely even a break... and then it comes out and everybody hates the movie.

[Leo656]

Originally Posted by AquaParade

It's just not a safe bet until the audience actually turns out for a Snyder film. The box office numbers went down, down, down with all the DC films his name was attached to. Yes, a lot of work has been done but you still would have to renegotiate contracts and you already have Ray Fisher playing hardball on the Flash script and asking for double what they've offered him. Point is, it's not as easy as just snapping their fingers and letting production roll on. It cant be justified when the director hasn't had one unanimous success in this arena, let alone the fact that his films have shown a downward trend.

I'm not convinced it would be a wise move to greenlight JL 2 tomorrow afternoon, financially speaking.

Aqua, that still ignores the fact that Skwad didn't make a ton of money (it did Just Okay) and was critically reviled with poor word of mouth, and that nobody saw "Birds of Prey" who wasn't IN "Birds Of Prey", and yet, we're still getting 80 more Harley Quinn movies, allegedly, despite two misfires that most people hated. "Shazam!" also did Just Okay, and going strictly by the numbers they drew they probably shouldn't have made any Big Huge Plans for any sequels; BUT, they are, because they already signed The Rock to play Black Adam several years before they even knew what they were gonna do with those characters, so they have to make sequels even though the first one didn't do huge business to start with, all just because otherwise they paid Dwayne a lot of money for no reason and thus they're stuck. "Oops". It'd be one thing if "Shazam!" wasn't the lowest-grossing DCEU movie to that point, but... it was. "But we have THE ROCK!" isn't in itself a great reason to push ahead with a franchise if they stumble out of the starting gate the way they did. I liked "Shazam!", but it didn't do great business and thus, by your logic, moving ahead with more movies in that series SHOULD be very questionable. Instead, they've promised us THREE: A Shazam sequel, a Black Adam solo film, AND a movie where they finally fight.

That's a LOT of "we promise" for a movie that did Just Okay. Sure, the reviews were glowing, BUT lots and lots of people ignored it for whatever reason. Objectively, and by your own logic, they have NO good reason to swear by THREE more Shazam-related films, but that's what they're doing. "Because The Rock", and no other reason. This is how weird and nonsensical this stuff gets.

All of these are "big risks" with no promise of a payoff. Rock's been in a few bombs, so he's not a proven draw no matter how popular he is. People are mostly "over" Robbie as Harley and the praise she got for her first outing has mostly been written off as a fluke by now, with vocal backlash on the rise. Yet, WB is still "All-In" on these upcoming projects despite the fact that they're almost certainly bigger risks than JL2 would be.

My point is simply This: If we know anything at all by now, there is NO logic whatsoever to any decisions WB makes, be it financial logic or otherwise. They do whatever the hell they want and change their entire game plan on a whim. Frankly, I'm amazed they're still even in business, let alone such a powerhouse in the industry. If you look at their history of making films, the place is a total zoo, run by chimps. That's been true forever and it stays true no matter whose name is on the door. They're a sh*t company that makes ludicrous decisions for nebulous reasons. They occasionally make a movie I really enjoy, but as far as their general state of operations, they're a f*cking disaster as a matter of course. That has never NOT been true.

That's why I just kind of have to dismiss it whenever anyone tries to say, "They Will or Won't do this, because logic and/or finance says..." Fact is, we don't know WHAT they're gonna do. Because neither do they. And next week, they still won't know. All we know is, if they get made fun of, then they're gonna do something else instead. That's the ONLY thing you can set your watch to with these jokers.

I just think it's telling that they're doing so much work on a movie project with "no future". Specifically, it tells me that at least they're keeping their options open. It doesn't set anything in stone, but... it at least says that they're listening to their audience a little more.

But we can't make predictions based on what makes financial sense OR common sense. Precedent tells us that you simply can't call WB's plays that way, nothing in how they operate is logical on any level. They're trying to get Nic Cage to play Superman again for f*ck's sake; these people are clearly insane. You'd have better luck predicting which way a cat's gonna jump after you set off a firecracker than in guessing what they're gonna do next. That's just the way it is.

[AquaParade]

Again, I think they will continue this universe.
I just don't think they should/might as well greenlight a second JL film with Snyder right now.

Suicide Squad was a huge hit, by the way. God knows why. Probably the thirst for more Joker on the big screen.