Freakin' Mutagen: how does it work? - Page 2

*Andrew NDB* · 05-22-2011, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jo Dawn

This has no scientific merit, and barely any thought put into it, but maybe Splinter had more rat DNA on him, but also some turtle DNA. So he turned into a rat, but with a wee bit of turtle in him.

That explains why he lived so darn long for a rat.

I'm confused. Did you mean Splinter in the Fred Wolf universe or Splinter in the Mirage, 4Kids, or movie universes? Because there's no explanation needed for him living "so darn long for a rat" in the Fred Wolf universe because he's half human. And if you're talking about the Mirage, 4Kids, or movie universe Splinter, the mutagen in those doesn't do any splicing.

**Jo Dawn** · 05-22-2011, 11:13 PM

I guess Fred Wolf. I really didn't mean anything. Like I said, I barely thought it out, just remembered a conversation once about Splinter living a long time for a rat, and that just came into my mind and thought it was kind of funny.

I pretty much expected to have a more thought out answer tomorrow, when it wasn't so darn late!

*oldmanwinters* · 05-23-2011, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jo Dawn

This has no scientific merit, and barely any thought put into it, but maybe Splinter had more rat DNA on him, but also some turtle DNA. So he turned into a rat, but with a wee bit of turtle in him.

But this just can't be true, Jo Dawn! Because everybody knows mutant turtles love PIZZA! And we all know OT Splinter's view on pizza, don't we?

**Jo Dawn** · 05-23-2011, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldmanwinters

But this just can't be true, Jo Dawn! Because everybody knows mutant turtles love PIZZA! And we all know OT Splinter's view on pizza, don't we?

Touche, good sir.

***First of Two Latin Kings*** · 05-23-2011, 10:30 AM

What's really interesting is the way in which Mutagen works in ARCHIE. Rocksteady and Bebop have a conversation in one issue where Rocksteady says, "Our bodies and memories are both..." implying that mutagen fused them with the animals. This is the basis for Rocksteady and Bebop going to the Eden worlds instead of being punished like Shredder and Krang: they can't be "evil" because "beasts" can't be evil. Krang and Belly-bomb, while not "human," aren't "beasts" in the sense that they were the intellectual equivalents of humans on their respective planets.

In the episode "Planet of the Turtleoids," one of them says, "This is the zoo we came from," implying that the mutagen worked the same way on them in the cartoon as it did in Archie.

*oldmanwinters* · 05-23-2011, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ***CJJ***

What's really interesting is the way in which Mutagen works in ARCHIE. Rocksteady and Bebop have a conversation in one issue where Rocksteady says, "Our bodies and memories are both..." implying that mutagen fused them with the animals. This is the basis for Rocksteady and Bebop going to the Eden worlds instead of being punished like Shredder and Krang: they can't be "evil" because "beasts" can't be evil. Krang and Belly-bomb, while not "human," aren't "beasts" in the sense that they were the intellectual equivalents of humans on their respective planets.

In the episode "Planet of the Turtleoids," one of them says, "This is the zoo we came from," implying that the mutagen worked the same way on them in the cartoon as it did in Archie.

Yeah, both of those revelations were really surprising. One might assume that Rocks and Bebop become more animalistic the longer they stay mutants... or it might just be the result of both of them being idiots and forgetting they were actually human to begin with.

*Andrew NDB* · 05-23-2011, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ***CJJ***

What's really interesting is the way in which Mutagen works in ARCHIE. Rocksteady and Bebop have a conversation in one issue where Rocksteady says, "Our bodies and memories are both..." implying that mutagen fused them with the animals. This is the basis for Rocksteady and Bebop going to the Eden worlds instead of being punished like Shredder and Krang

Yeah, I noticed this as well and was reminded of it in recent days. Rocksteady even has a dream of being a normal Rhinoceros in Africa, trotting alongside a female Rhinoceros, and when he wakes up he tells Shredder and Krang that he was dreaming that he was with his old girlfriend.

Very strange, and bizarre actually. There's no memory in DNA, and it's not like when human Rocksteady touched the Rhinoceros before touching the mutagen he ABSORBED the Rhinoceros. That wild Rhinoceros is still out there somewhere.

I wonder if Murphy was confused on that.

***First of Two Latin Kings*** · 05-23-2011, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

I wonder if Murphy was confused on that.

I don't think Murphy was confused; I think he simply found it more "artistic" to have the animals "fuse" with human Rocksteady and Bebop (which is how Mutagen works in Archie). Murph is one of those hippies who believes that animals have souls and what not, so it isn't at all surprising.

Berserker · 05-23-2011, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

There's no memory in DNA

Well... that's not completely true. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic...8psychology%29

cryan · 05-23-2011, 07:10 PM

Not to mention there were other mutants that were mutated by other means other then the mutagen.

Stockman got his molecules slammed with a fly

Mona Lisa got eradiated by the reactor on Filtch's sub

April got her molecules slammed with a cat

This are the only examples I know of at the moment.

**Jester** · 05-23-2011, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cryan

Not to mention there were other mutants that were mutated by other means other then the mutagen.

Stockman got his molecules slammed with a fly

Mona Lisa got eradiated by the reactor on Filtch's sub

April got her molecules slammed with a cat

This are the only examples I know of at the moment.

Ray and Fish April were made through different, yet unknown means.

***First of Two Latin Kings*** · 05-27-2011, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

I wonder if Murphy was confused on that.

I don't think Murphy was confused; I think he did it for reasons of artistic merit.

I'm suprised the subject of dandelions hasn't come up in this thread

*mysterycolor* · 05-28-2011, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jester

Why is it that I created this thread and every time I see it I can't help but think of this:

and this:

In fact...there....changed.

hey jester... started thinking the same thing as I was reading

cryan · 05-28-2011, 12:14 PM

I find it interesting that in many origin stories of superheroes a lot of times nuclear radiation is the catalyst for mutations.This kinda give the wrong impression that if you get exposed to radiation that you will get super powers.Just a thought.

*gobo* · 05-28-2011, 02:20 PM

Good point. That's socially irresponsible. Kids, always remember to close the microwave door before turning it on or you'll get cancer.

Tuxedo Moroboshi · 05-28-2011, 04:53 PM

I think the whole "evolutionary step" thing is definitely a good way of explaining the original ooze from the comics. I don't know if it counts as canon, but it's how it was explained in the old RPG books. It even stated that a human being exposed to ooze would get a larger brain and psychic abilities.

As for the mutagen of the 87 toon... that really doesn't seem to have any rhyme or reason, and is incredibly inconsistent. I think the best example of this is that episode where Michelangelo turns human. The mutation is unstable, and he keeps switching between a fully clothed human with no headband, elbow+wrist+knee guards, and belt, and a turtle with those items of clothing but no human clothing (like shorts, a shirt, and shoes). Seriously, clothing is part of the mutation?

But that episode was pretty horrible, in general, too. What with Michelangelo being useless as a human due to the loss of his "turtle powers" and whatnot... since, you know, obviously being a turtle is what somehow makes him kick ass and not all that ninja training.

Honestly, if you're trying to figure out the Fred Wolf Mutagen, do yourself a favor and just write it off as magic. Trying to figure it out scientifically will only cause you headaches.

**Venom** · 06-03-2011, 05:15 PM

Just imagine if the last thing you touched was poop.. ;P

*gobo* · 06-03-2011, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Venom

Just imagine if the last thing you touched was poop.. ;P

**Venom** · 06-03-2011, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gobo

Hi guys!

Logan · 06-03-2011, 06:05 PM

My thoughts...

Regarding Yoshi's transformation into Splinter: Yoshi made physical contact with the mutagen before touching the turtles (there is a big puddle of it, after all). Since he touched a rat beforehand, the mutagen reacted to that DNA instead of the turtles'.

Why a rat and not something like bacteria, insect, etc.?: Well, based on what we see in the Mirage comics, the mutation caused those exposed to evolve.

If the evolution idea applies to the OT, then perhaps the DNA of organisms exposed to the mutagen chooses to evolve with whatever external DNA would prove more advantageous to survival.

In a nutshell, Yoshi's DNA chose a rat over bacteria because it would optimize his ability to live.

Maybe I'm being presumptuous, but I don't think the writers put much thought into it. But who cares? Stuff like this is what fandom is all about!

05-22-2011, 11:13 PM	#22
Jo Dawn Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Authority On All Things Don Posts: 5,190	I guess Fred Wolf. I really didn't mean anything. Like I said, I barely thought it out, just remembered a conversation once about Splinter living a long time for a rat, and that just came into my mind and thought it was kind of funny. I pretty much expected to have a more thought out answer tomorrow, when it wasn't so darn late! __________________

05-28-2011, 02:20 PM	#35
gobo Wacky Action Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: on Earth Posts: 12,784	Good point. That's socially irresponsible. Kids, always remember to close the microwave door before turning it on or you'll get cancer. __________________ Live and let live... or go to hell.

05-28-2011, 04:53 PM	#36
Tuxedo Moroboshi Mad Scientist Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Battle Nexus Posts: 1,127	I think the whole "evolutionary step" thing is definitely a good way of explaining the original ooze from the comics. I don't know if it counts as canon, but it's how it was explained in the old RPG books. It even stated that a human being exposed to ooze would get a larger brain and psychic abilities. As for the mutagen of the 87 toon... that really doesn't seem to have any rhyme or reason, and is incredibly inconsistent. I think the best example of this is that episode where Michelangelo turns human. The mutation is unstable, and he keeps switching between a fully clothed human with no headband, elbow+wrist+knee guards, and belt, and a turtle with those items of clothing but no human clothing (like shorts, a shirt, and shoes). Seriously, clothing is part of the mutation? But that episode was pretty horrible, in general, too. What with Michelangelo being useless as a human due to the loss of his "turtle powers" and whatnot... since, you know, obviously being a turtle is what somehow makes him kick ass and not all that ninja training. Honestly, if you're trying to figure out the Fred Wolf Mutagen, do yourself a favor and just write it off as magic. Trying to figure it out scientifically will only cause you headaches. __________________ Hey, be sure to check out my art!

06-03-2011, 05:15 PM	#37
Venom Space Knight Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 3,637	Just imagine if the last thing you touched was poop.. ;P __________________

05-23-2011, 07:10 PM	#30
cryan Stone Warrior Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Athens,AL Posts: 743	Not to mention there were other mutants that were mutated by other means other then the mutagen. Stockman got his molecules slammed with a fly Mona Lisa got eradiated by the reactor on Filtch's sub April got her molecules slammed with a cat This are the only examples I know of at the moment.

05-28-2011, 12:14 PM	#34
cryan Stone Warrior Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Athens,AL Posts: 743	I find it interesting that in many origin stories of superheroes a lot of times nuclear radiation is the catalyst for mutations.This kinda give the wrong impression that if you get exposed to radiation that you will get super powers.Just a thought.

06-03-2011, 06:05 PM	#40
Logan Hench Mutant Join Date: May 2011 Location: Michigan Posts: 483	My thoughts... Regarding Yoshi's transformation into Splinter: Yoshi made physical contact with the mutagen before touching the turtles (there is a big puddle of it, after all). Since he touched a rat beforehand, the mutagen reacted to that DNA instead of the turtles'. Why a rat and not something like bacteria, insect, etc.?: Well, based on what we see in the Mirage comics, the mutation caused those exposed to evolve. If the evolution idea applies to the OT, then perhaps the DNA of organisms exposed to the mutagen chooses to evolve with whatever external DNA would prove more advantageous to survival. In a nutshell, Yoshi's DNA chose a rat over bacteria because it would optimize his ability to live. Maybe I'm being presumptuous, but I don't think the writers put much thought into it. But who cares? Stuff like this is what fandom is all about!