Did Leonardo really need to lighten up?

[Prowler]

Remember that episode where the 3 other Turtles tell Leonardo to lighten up and he gets hit by the personality changer or whatever it was called and becomes a party animal?

Did Leonardo really need to lighten up? Was he really that uptight in the FW series?

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by Prowler

Remember that episode where the 3 other Turtles tell Leonardo to lighten up and he gets hit by the personality changer or whatever it was called and becomes a party animal?

Did Leonardo really need to lighten up? Was he really that uptight in the FW series?

Leo is usually the 'remember what Master Splinter says' nag of the series and the most obsessed with training, but as usual with cartoon tropes, they purposely made him much more unbearable in that particular episode to justify the personality changer.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

Leo is usually the 'remember what Master Splinter says' nag of the series and the most obsessed with training, but as usual with cartoon tropes, they purposely made him much more unbearable in that particular episode to justify the personality changer.

They also used it in Raphael in a latter episode and he was acting way meaner than he actually was at the beginning of that episode . FW Raph is probably the nicest Raph of them all. Just a guy who likes to crack jokes.

Leonardo Was my least fave as a kid due to being so one dimensional and boring compared to his brothers.

[cammy85]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

Leo is usually the 'remember what Master Splinter says' nag of the series and the most obsessed with training, but as usual with cartoon tropes, they purposely made him much more unbearable in that particular episode to justify the personality changer.

He was essentially in charge when Splinter was away and while he took things too far, we all know the others needed the nagging at the time. This despite the fact that they took the G. Cleff threat seriously with or without Leonardo's prodding while he was under the alterator's effects

Originally Posted by Prowler

They also used it in Raphael in a latter episode and he was acting way meaner than he actually was at the beginning of that episode . FW Raph is probably the nicest Raph of them all. Just a guy who likes to crack jokes.

Leonardo Was my least fave as a kid due to being so one dimensional and boring compared to his brothers.

No one actually used it on them. Both times were fluke accidents. And Leonardo did learn a lesson as did the others in the first case.

[TheLabRat]

Originally Posted by Prowler

They also used it in Raphael in a latter episode and he was acting way meaner than he actually was at the beginning of that episode . FW Raph is probably the nicest Raph of them all. Just a guy who likes to crack jokes.

Compared to Leo, Raph actually has better intuition and flexible thinking. If Raph learns to control his anger issues, he might become wiser than Leo. I also think Raph deserves have more moments of inner peace. In IDW comic, his real wish is to be a farmer and then they just never followed up on that. How hard is it to just give him his own hobby? I think letting Raph have gardening can make sense. If he's only got anger issues but no well-meaning intent behind it, then he's just a jerk.

Originally Posted by Prowler

Leonardo Was my least fave as a kid due to being so one dimensional and boring compared to his brothers.

I always blame most writers for not being able to write an interesting "serious leader character". In the 2007 movie, Leo even turns into a control freak jerk. It's weird that he is a ninja, but his thoughts and methods are so rigid, romantic and naive.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by TheLabRat

Compared to Leo, Raph actually has better intuition and flexible thinking. If Raph learns to control his anger issues, he might become wiser than Leo. I also think Raph deserves have more moments of inner peace. In IDW comic, his real wish is to be a farmer and then they just never followed up on that. How hard is it to just give him his own hobby? I think letting Raph have gardening can make sense. If he's only got anger issues but no well-meaning intent behind it, then he's just a jerk.


I always blame most writers for not being able to write an interesting "serious leader character". In the 2007 movie, Leo even turns into a control freak jerk. It's weird that he is a ninja, but his thoughts and methods are so rigid, romantic and naive.

As a teenager I liked angry and antisocial Raph, but nowadays, as an adult, I find Raph's anger to be toxic and destructive for the most part. Which is why I prefer the FW series take on him. He does have an edge to him which shows in some episodes but he's more sarcastic than violent.

I liked Leo in the 2k3 series. Clearly he was the writers favourite Turtle in that show. He got the most lines, arcs and cool moments.

[Icebot]

I thought Leonardo was also extra motivated in the season 7 episode Combat Land. He acted the way he did In Leonardo Lightens Up. He kept bugging the others to stop goofing off and practice.

[FredWolfLeonardo]

The way Leonardo acted in that episode reminds me of how the 87 turtles acted in Turtles Forever. I feel like he didn't need to lighten up, since the point of the episode was to show that 87 Leonardo's serious side was still needed.

As a character, I am obviously very fond of 87 Leonardo. He still makes jokes, and his serious side provides great contrast with other characters like 87 Raphael, who wouldn't be as funny if he didn't have someone like Leonardo to roast.

[IndigoErth]

Nah, Leo is fine as he is, but the one playing the straight man trope is probably bound to get hit with the message that they should be different, funner and more like anyone else. Though I imagine the real point of that ep is his brothers appreciating Leo for being who he is, even if they don't necessarily always like some aspects of him.

[triplexxx]

A certain upside to the 1987 series, while the turtles had thier differences in personalities, they didn't let their differences get the better of them and cause a bunch of needless conflict between each other, not as often anyway. So, in a way, the 1987 series showed the turtles as more "mature" than in other series.

[TheLabRat]

Originally Posted by Prowler

I liked Leo in the 2k3 series. Clearly he was the writers favourite Turtle in that show. He got the most lines, arcs and cool moments.

Except 2k3 Leo always been a lame simp for Karai. 2012 Leo also has same problem.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by TheLabRat

Except 2k3 Leo always been a lame simp for Karai. 2012 Leo also has same problem.

Well, yeah, that was a bit annoying, but other than that I was fine with him.

[cammy85]

Originally Posted by FredWolfLeonardo

The way Leonardo acted in that episode reminds me of how the 87 turtles acted in Turtles Forever. I feel like he didn't need to lighten up, since the point of the episode was to show that 87 Leonardo's serious side was still needed.

As a character, I am obviously very fond of 87 Leonardo. He still makes jokes, and his serious side provides great contrast with other characters like 87 Raphael, who wouldn't be as funny if he didn't have someone like Leonardo to roast.

At the end of the episode, he was still the same, just a lot less angry about it. He had indeed learned to lighten up when it was time to be serious. Same in Combat Land.

[IndigoErth]

Originally Posted by TheLabRat

Except 2k3 Leo always been a lame simp for Karai. 2012 Leo also has same problem.

2012 definitely.

Wouldn't agree on 2003 though. Leo does have a (sometimes foolish) tendency to believe that some foes could be won to the good side. He recognized that Karai had honor and had the potential to switch sides, thus he tried hard to make alliances because it would be a major game changer for them, but she was simply far too closely tied and loyal to the Shredder. He probably had some empathy seeing her stuck where she was and knowing that in different circumstances she'd very possibly be a decent person, but he needed to accept that she wouldn't be breaking those alliances.

Same with 2012, but that only worked out when she felt abandoned, used, and betrayed by Shredder, giving her a reason to break that loyalty to the person she had believed was her father.

I can't fault the guy for being optimistic and knowing the world could be a better place if people would simply live up to their own better potential. Definitely applies to real life too, but likewise isn't ever going go happen.

[Cowabung-Gal]

You mean lighten up like Rise Leo? Yeeeah, no.

[TheLabRat]

2k3 Leo should understand that even if Karai is a respectable person. But when she become an enemy, the one who would kill him and his family. He should kill her without hesitate. It is foolish to put your own family and even yourself in crisis multiple times just to sympathize with the enemy. He seems to have forgotten that he is a ninja, and his duty is to protect the interests of the family or their master first. Even Karai knows this better than him, that's why she was able to kill Leo in the dark future timeline.

[IndigoErth]

To be fair, she was also older and much more worldly than him. He may have been trained for vengeance, but his life experience otherwise was pretty limited and, for obvious reason, none of them grew up experiencing any important life lessons in interacting with the world and other people outside of their family. Realistically, they should be rather socially delayed, awkward, and naive in that regard.

Though it doesn't excuse putting too much trust in someone (Karai) who shouldn't have it, esp when you've been raised to be avoiding, mistrusting and suspicious of all people.

[ranger_scout]

There needed to be a serious and responsible member of the four 1987 Turtles. Rise of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles didn't work for me because all four Turtles were comedic party dudes. Came Clarke really put his heart and soul into the character despite being the polar opposite of Leonardo's personality. Leonardo really made a positive influence on my life because he taught me a very important lesson in Snakes Alive! that "Fears are just in our minds and we have the power to overcome them." That lesson I learned so many years ago still holds up for me today.

[TheLabRat]

It always makes me roll my eyes when Leo talks about honor in "battle". Remind me of 2012 Splinter tell Leo they're ninja, and there's no shame in use dishonorable way to win a fight.