The Nintendo DS

[ThirdMarioBro]

Well, the curtian has finally fallen. Nintendo has revealed the mystery machine that they have been building in secrecy for a while now. It sounds really cool to me. Nintendo has been really secretive about it as always (but with good reason). Yesterday, they finally blew the lid on it. Here is what they said.
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Nintendo Mystery Product Revealed
New dual-screened portable will be focus of E3 2004.

January 20, 2004 - For months Nintendo president Satoru Iwata has been offering Japanese newspapers vague comments about a new mystery hardware that the company would launch in 2004. Nintendo of America today pulled back the curtains on the top-secret device and it looks to be good news for Nintendo fans worldwide.

The company's mystery machine is in fact a dual-screened portable game device that is entirely separate from both the GameCube and the Game Boy Advance. It will be marketed completely free of its sister hardware. It's called Nintendo DS for Nintendo Dual-Screen.
Nintendo DS features two connected 3-inch backlit TFT LCD display panels -- one on top of the other, according to a Reuters report -- and two separate processors. The device features an Arm9 main processor and an Arm7 sub processor.

The portable will not use GameCube optical disc or Game Boy Advance cartridge based media. Instead, it will play software on semiconductor memory of up to 1 Gigabit, according to the manufacturer.

Nintendo explains the importance of the dual-screen setup: "Players can look forward to being able to manage their game progress from two different perspectives, enhancing both the speed and strategy of the challenge. For example in a soccer game, users can view the whole game on one screen while simultaneously focusing on an individual soccer player's tackle or goal on the other screen.

"Players will no longer be forced to interrupt game play to shift perspective, such as moving from a wide shot to a close up, or alternating between a character's ongoing battle and a map of the environment. Nintendo DS makes it possible to perform the tasks in real time by simply glancing from one screen to the other."

Today's revelation is just the beginning, according to the company. The bulk of information on the machine will be unveiled at May's Electronics Entertainment Expo in Los Angeles.

"We have developed Nintendo DS based upon a completely different concept from existing game devices in order to provide players with a unique entertainment experience for the 21st century," explained Satoru Iwata, Nintendo president.

"We're not trying to take on PSP, because this machine will be completely different than anything that exists right now," said Nintendo spokesman Yasuhiro Minagawa.

The announcement, seemingly out of nowhere, likely comes in preparation for Nintendo's upcoming financial report. Also, developers have indicated that they will soon receive development hardware for the new system and with that Nintendo wouldn't be able to keep it a secret for very much longer.
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Well, what do you think? I think it's cool. There was also some spectulation on another site....
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News: Exciting 3D Prospects for Nintendo DS


An article published in the new issue of GMR magazine out this week covers some very intriguing information about what the Nintendo DS system could really be about. According to GMR, Nintendo has been in discussions with Sharp to possibly use a certain technology in a then future portable system. The big secret is that the Nintendo DS may actually have a "true" 3D display.

Considering the nature of the Nintendo DS and its two screens… it makes one think that there is more to be revealed at E3. Details have been announced, but no pictures and no mock-ups. If Nintendo has been working with Sharp for the Nintendo DS it has some good speculative evidence going for it. Sharp employees have been talkative about the company developing 3D display technology that uses two TFT LCD screens (the kind announced for Nintendo DS) that work together to create a 3D view. Coincidence? Here is what has been reported about the technology from ExtremeTech:

"Sharp's TFT 3D LCD technology works on the principle of displaying left and right eye views that are separated so that the left eye sees only the left eye image, and the right eye sees only the right eye image," said Ian Matthew, 3D Solutions Business Development Manager at Sharp Systems of America. "Since these images have perspective and are offset in the same way that the human eye normally sees the two images, the brain naturally interprets the image disparity and creates a 'sense of depth' effect. The result is 3D, 'out of screen' display that provides users with a visual experience previously unattainable without polarized or liquid crystal shuttering lenses."

There are already a few things that need to be addressed with this scenario. Could the 3D display work when the screens are stacked vertical? So far there isn’t any reason not to think so.

But what about Nintendo’s statements about the machine, that it will help to make playing games easier, allowing a person to see two different perspectives in a game? The example used by Nintendo of a player seeing different areas or camera angles at once doesn’t sound like 3D. Perhaps Nintendo has been saying such things to offset the rampant speculation and surprise the world come E3.

Lastly, the price of such technology wouldn’t seem fit with Nintendo’s philosophy on lower-cost systems. Could this be a special case where Nintendo is doing something different from the norm? That’s sort of what we’ve been told all along. Still, there hasn’t been much in the way of implying that Nintendo DS will be 3D, the closet thing is Iwata’s foggy mentions of it being "heterogeneous" and producing movement that gamers have never experienced before.
Posted by Ethan Pearson, Founder, Director
Source: GMR
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Sounds cool. I'll just leave on this totally fanboyish statement.

DEATH TO THE PSP!!!! LONG LIVE THE GBA!!! (and apprently the DS as well)

[Jason]

I'm a huge Nintendo fan, but I'm not liking this DS idea.
The 3D concept sounds cool, however it is just speculation and Nintendo made no mention of it in their official Press Release.
All they said was that it would have 2 screens, using the football example of seeing the whole field and a single player at the same time, which doesn't really sound that impressive.
They could have at least included somes images of the device instead of being so unspecific. I really don't understand why they made such a clumsy press release, they should have either spilled more or saved everything for E3. Instead it's leading to much negative speculation.
I'd much rather Nintendo focus on make the next Gameboy instead of marketing a new device seperately from their top selling console. It kind of reminds me of the Virtual Boy...

[MW8979]

Well, I can agree that it would be helpful if you could glance at something else in the game, while your attention is focused on something important, but.... I see the whole 2 screen as a large bulkiness factor and an impediment to portability. I mean, if they just developed this for the sake of "checking the map or another perspective in a soccer game", then it wasn't worth it, because people have adopted to play without that anyway.

[Eye of Sarnath]

Two screens? What's the point of having two screens?

[Demonfox38]

So they don't have to split the TV screen anymore, I guess.

Eh, I'm not too big on portables. I love my honken' huge counsles.

[Taloniss]

Colour me unimpressed. Two screens just sounds like a useless gimmick to me. I think PSP will take over the handheld market when it comes out.

[Bowser_Koopa]

i still don't get how its not gonna replace the gba but its just gonna be a competence to the psp

[ThirdMarioBro]

Originally Posted by Taloniss

Colour me unimpressed. Two screens just sounds like a useless gimmick to me. I think PSP will take over the handheld market when it comes out.

No offence, but I really hope the PSP burns in hell. Knowing Sony, they'll have that worthless piece of overpowered, overpriced, and overdeveloped hardware, and do absoultly nothing except port old PSone games to it.
That thing is going to cost as much as a console. Even if the DS were to flop, it really wouldn't hurt the GBA. That's why they are marketing this thing seperately. It it takes off like wildfire, then they could consider what to do with the GBA. It the DS flops, then they bury it and go on with the GBA SP. The key to all of this is cost. When it comes Christmas time again, which do you think a parent is going to get their kid? A system with a history that has been unfolding since 1989, with 1000's of games to choose from, and only $99.95, or a $299.95 piece of crap that has PS1 ports that they are charging $49.95 apice for. Knowing Nintendo, they'll screw Sony a little harder by dropping the SP to $69.95 when the PSP comes out. The DS will fly or it won't. Looking at the upcoming software list for the GBA, I don't think the DS will have much effect on the GBA either way.

Worst case serineo: The idiots at all the game mags promote the PSP, and start predicting when Nintendo will go third party. PSP's so called "coolness" factor actually manages to sell a few units. If that happened, the market would be split into three groups...

Group 1. Sony fanboys, rich people, EGM fans, and people who get "peer preasured" into buying the PSP because it's supposed to be "cool".

Group 2. Nintendo fanboys, normal people, people who don't give a crap what other people think, and know gaming mags are all paid off to some degree.

Group 3. Final Fantasy fans who have to buy both, because FF isn't Sony exclusive anymore.

The GBA is here to stay. Still, I hope the DS does great too.

[Kid Icarus]

*clears throat*
First off, the DS is NOT going to be marketed against the PSP. This is a THIRD system to co-exist with the GBA and GCN, as well as the successors to both GBA and GCN.

Another thing: 2 screens can do what one can, 1 screen cannot do what 2 can. Also, developers will be able to use both screens as 1 jumbo screen. Nintendo's been showing off some of their game ideas to companies like Namco and Konami, and they've all said they are VERY impressed by what they've seen.

This next part is tad off topic
REASONS WHY PSP WON'T SELL:
#1: Price. Sony's tossing a LOT of advanced technology in to the thing. Sure, it all looks good on paper, but the price is going to ad up really fast.

#2 Battery life. The PSP will have a processor, graphics card, and sound card from what I've read. Along with the bulky front lit LCD screen, and a motor to spin the UMD's and power the laser to read and transmit the data, this thing will more than likely have a 2-2.5 hour battery life. What's the point of having a portable if you can't play it?

#3 GBA's 20 MILLION userbase in the US alone. That's a BIG number folks. Basicaly, that's like Microsoft and Nintendo going up against the PS2 RIGHT NOW. Not a year ago, not 2 years ago, but after the console's leaked in to peoples homes.

#4 Games. GBA games are relatively cheep and easy to make because of the system being 2-D. The average 3-D game costs about as much as a Hollywood movie, and takes 2-3 years on average to make, not to mention it's really dificult to code 3-D games. Not to mention the GBA has a library of over 1,000 games, plus an arsenal of old SNES games that many gamers have yet to play.

#5 UMD's. Sure, discs offer a ton of space, but I'd be worried about my new $50 game getting banged up in my pocket. Ever look at a screen of a GBA? See the scratches? Imagine that being on your CD, and you get an idea of what I'm talking about.[/b]

[Taloniss]

except port old PSone games to it.

I'd hope they do do that. Then I can play all the classics anywhere

Group 1. Sony fanboys, rich people, EGM fans, and people who get "peer preasured" into buying the PSP because it's supposed to be "cool".

Group 2. Nintendo fanboys, normal people, people who don't give a crap what other people think, and know gaming mags are all paid off to some degree.

Don't you think it's a little harsh to generalize someone based on what gives them entertainment, given it's subjective? I own all 3 console systems, and I find they all have their qualities and their dissadvantages.

Personally, I hope the PSP survives, because with some true competition in the handheld market, it will make both Nintendo and Sony up the quality of there games and systems, and that's only good for us gamers

[MW8979]

Hmm...well, I think it's fair to say that the only good portable system always has been and will be gameboy, in any of its incarnations. I think PSP will disappear like Game Gear did, because it wasn't that good. That being said, I think the DS isn't going to be good either, because two screen will make it quite bulky and that's a big factor when you're talking about a PORTABLE system. So I think in the future, Nintendo is going to continue to dominate with the gameboy, and the gameboy only.

[ThirdMarioBro]

True, the Game Boy will always be the king.
The Virtual Boy died for many reasons, and definately didn't sell well, but I still like it. The DS is a different concept, but it will be the games that make or break it. When the Virtual Boy launched, the game selection sucked except for the 2 Mario Games (Mario Clash which I still enjoy, and Mario Tennis). The rest was generic junk like "Teleboxer" and "Galactic Pinball".
If Wario Land had come out at launch, that thing would have sold a lot better.
The point is, the masses didn't like the VB, but some people do. Sadly, "some" people can't keep a system alive nowadays. I hope Nintendo is hiding some groundbreaking feature that will change portable gaming as we know it until E3 comes around. Either way, the Game Boy will always be king.
Just for the record, let's count how many systems the Game Boy has destroyed over the years.....

Turbograph 16 portable, Sega Game Gear (twice), Atari Lynx, Sega Nomad, Sega CDX, Tiger's Game.com, SNK's NeoGeo Pocket, and Neo Geo Pocket Color, Wonderswan, and that new wonderswan in Japan whose name I forget. Add Virtual Boy to the list if you want to be cruel

Keep in mind that most of those were destroyed by the old Black & White 8-bit "creamed spinach color screen" Game Boy. PSP dosen't have a chance, especially now that Square is making games for GBA (hehe).

Originally Posted by Taloniss

Personally, I hope the PSP survives, because with some true competition in the handheld market, it will make both Nintendo and Sony up the quality of there games and systems, and that's only good for us gamers

That's your opinion. I've always observed that Sony uses mind games to compete. They're hardware is always inferior, yet they always win, because they project the image that they are "cool", and that if you buy anyone but them, you are a loser, and will be ridiculed by all the cool kids. That's why I am against the PSP. Nintendo fans have always done just fine without compatition. I don't mean to offend, but I really do hate the PSP whole heartedly. Portable games are supposed to be easy to pick up and play, not games where you have to wait for a system to boot up, load...load...load...and then finally get to play for a few seconds before you have to go do something else.
And who buys a portable system to listen to MP3's?
Sony is inventing this thing so that they can release movies on those DVD optical discs. They want to popularize the format, so that they can resale every movie under the sun in this new format. Discs are delicate, and break easily. Not good for a portable system. On top of that, disc drives have moving parts. Moving parts wear out. Then you have to replace it. How convienient for Sony. It will wear out just in time for their next handheld. What would you do? Fix your old PSP, or choke up $300 for the next one.


I apoligize for being so aggressive about this. I've talked about this on a few other boards, and people are already making fun of me for buying an GBA SP, instead of saving my money for the so called "cooler" PSP. I never thought I'd have to go through this hell in the portable market.

One last depressing thought. The GBA will fight the PSp for a long time, and probobly kick it;s a**, but eventually Nintendo will have to release a new Game Boy. It will most likely be more powerful than the PSP by that time, but it will come at a cost. Look at the home consoles. How many old school 2D platformers are on them? Hardly any. Look at the GBA, it's full of them. It's the only place they still survive in the current market. It's a known fact that Sony is against 2D platformers because they are old fashioned, and Sony caters to the modern gamer. Nintendo is more innovative and always developing new and beautiful 3D games (F-Zero GX, Rebel Strike, Metroid Prime), but they never forget that they have fans of all ages. Because of this, they rerelease their old classics in a more modern form, or they make new sequels in the classic form (Mario & Luigi Superstar Saga). When the handheld markey is forced into 3D, 2D will die.
On PS2, Irem just released what they are calling the final R-Type game. R-Type is one of the few surviving 2D shooters, now it's dead. Look at the ever so awesome TMNT game for GBA. It feels so much more like the originals than the console one does. This will be gone as well. I love 3D games, but I love 2D games equally. I can't bear the thought of seeing them fade away.

My point is that the PSP will begin the death of 2D gaming if it susceeds. I hope and pray the GBA destroys it, and I hope and pray the DS helps destroy it, for the sake of 2D gaming.

[Eye of Sarnath]

No one's ever needed two screens before... why now? It seems just plain stupid to me. I simply can't think of any reason for two screens.

[turtleking]

cool system but what are the games for it any ideas.

[MW8979]

Originally Posted by ThirdMarioBro

My point is that the PSP will begin the death of 2D gaming if it susceeds. I hope and pray the GBA destroys it, and I hope and pray the DS helps destroy it, for the sake of 2D gaming.

I just have to say that I love 2d games too. I think they're certainly better then 3d stuff. But....3d are here now and not all of them are that bad. Plus, if it's not PSP, something else will kill 2d games, it's just a matter of time, so you gotta make peace with that. Besides, you'll always be able to play them on the older systems. And I find that the 2d games made today, just have the look, but not the spirit of the old 2d games. That's why a lot of them are rereleases, be successfull 2d ideas just aren't around today and neither are the people who used to make them. That's my take on this. I love 2d gaming above 3d, but at the same time, I still enjoy 3d games if their subject matter appeals to me.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Say hello to my new best friend.

Originally Posted by Gwgtrunks

*clears throat*
First off, the DS is NOT going to be marketed against the PSP. This is a THIRD system to co-exist with the GBA and GCN, as well as the successors to both GBA and GCN.

Another thing: 2 screens can do what one can, 1 screen cannot do what 2 can. Also, developers will be able to use both screens as 1 jumbo screen. Nintendo's been showing off some of their game ideas to companies like Namco and Konami, and they've all said they are VERY impressed by what they've seen.

This next part is tad off topic
REASONS WHY PSP WON'T SELL:
#1: Price. Sony's tossing a LOT of advanced technology in to the thing. Sure, it all looks good on paper, but the price is going to ad up really fast.

#2 Battery life. The PSP will have a processor, graphics card, and sound card from what I've read. Along with the bulky front lit LCD screen, and a motor to spin the UMD's and power the laser to read and transmit the data, this thing will more than likely have a 2-2.5 hour battery life. What's the point of having a portable if you can't play it?

#3 GBA's 20 MILLION userbase in the US alone. That's a BIG number folks. Basicaly, that's like Microsoft and Nintendo going up against the PS2 RIGHT NOW. Not a year ago, not 2 years ago, but after the console's leaked in to peoples homes.

#4 Games. GBA games are relatively cheep and easy to make because of the system being 2-D. The average 3-D game costs about as much as a Hollywood movie, and takes 2-3 years on average to make, not to mention it's really dificult to code 3-D games. Not to mention the GBA has a library of over 1,000 games, plus an arsenal of old SNES games that many gamers have yet to play.

#5 UMD's. Sure, discs offer a ton of space, but I'd be worried about my new $50 game getting banged up in my pocket. Ever look at a screen of a GBA? See the scratches? Imagine that being on your CD, and you get an idea of what I'm talking about.[/b]

Yep. The disc goes into your pocket. You forget. Car Keys go into your pocket. Uh-huh. Then you go jogging. Come home. Dicide to play PSP.
Ypu take Madden [insert number here] from your pocket and look at disc.
.......................oh crap! Now you have to replace the game. Another $49.95 down the drain and right into Sony's pocket. Yup, people will be screwed by Sony again.

Originally Posted by SuperShredder84

I just have to say that I love 2d games too. I think they're certainly better then 3d stuff. But....3d are here now and not all of them are that bad. Plus, if it's not PSP, something else will kill 2d games, it's just a matter of time, so you gotta make peace with that. Besides, you'll always be able to play them on the older systems. And I find that the 2d games made today, just have the look, but not the spirit of the old 2d games. That's why a lot of them are rereleases, be successfull 2d ideas just aren't around today and neither are the people who used to make them. That's my take on this. I love 2d gaming above 3d, but at the same time, I still enjoy 3d games if their subject matter appeals to me.

Sure you can play them on the old systems, but there won't be any new 2D games. For all I know, Sonic Advance 3 might be the last 2D Sonic game. I haven't beaten 2 because I don't want it to end.
3D games rock as well. Zelda Ocarina of Time to me is the greatest game ever. F-Zero GX made the dream of Nintendo & Sega joining forces come true.
Yes, 2D games of today have the look but not the feel. Vutiful Joe to me just dosen't feel right. Well, 2D gaming will eventually die, and I will make peace with that. I just wish Sony wasn't starting it so soon. I hate Sony so much that it makes me want to cry.

[Taloniss]

I apoligize for being so aggressive about this. I've talked about this on a few other boards, and people are already making fun of me for buying an GBA SP, instead of saving my money for the so called "cooler" PSP. I never thought I'd have to go through this hell in the portable market.

People who mock others for what they derive entertainment from are dumbasses anyway. I enjoy GBA as well. I don't want it to die, since it allows classes to be ported and enjoyed by a new generation, I just want it them to co-exsist.

#5 UMD's. Sure, discs offer a ton of space, but I'd be worried about my new $50 game getting banged up in my pocket. Ever look at a screen of a GBA? See the scratches? Imagine that being on your CD, and you get an idea of what I'm talking about.[/b]

I'm pretty sure there will be some kind protecting cover over the disc. I put my CD player in my pocket all the time and the discs don't get scratched.

[malignant]

Nintendo needs New games damnit.....

Not another damn handheld.

[ThirdMarioBro]

Originally Posted by Taloniss

People who mock others for what they derive entertainment from are dumbasses anyway. I enjoy GBA as well. I don't want it to die, since it allows classes to be ported and enjoyed by a new generation, I just want it them to co-exsist.
.

If only the world were that simple. I wish it was. I really do.