Season 2 will feature Mutagen Man, Eighties Turtles

[BabyTurtles]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

And after all that, they still made the OT turtles into cowardly goofballs.

That is what they did.

They did that.

are we talking about the OT turtles in Turtles Forever? cause they didn't seem cowardly to me...

but they were goofballs XD.....though...weren't they in the OT series??

[Martin]

Originally Posted by Zulithe

Saw the facebook post... so I guess it's REALLY happening... great, a second turtles forever... I'm happy to see the OT voice cast return for guest appearances but I'd really rather it not go this way. At least when the 2k3 series did this kind of crossover it was after the show had already ended... Nick is doing it in the second season and who knows how this will play into the storyline. I don't want to see the classic turtles showing up all the time.

I like the Nick show becuase it is its own thing. I'm not interested in these nostalgic elements like the OT turtles and bebop and rocksteady showing up. And for the love of all things good NO KRANG (hopefully Kraang Prime is a much better character)

I grew up with the OT turtles in the 80s/early 90s so I think I have a right to this opinion: Let the OT turtles rest, stop bringing them back.

I totally agree with this. As a matter of fact, I believe that both this series and the IDW comics are pushing the whole reference thing a bit to far. I've got to admit though, that so far it has been done quite well by both nick and IDW (especially IDW), but I'd hate to see any of those runs sacrifice their identities for the sake of nostalgia.

Anyway, I'm really curious as to how all this is gonna work. So far IDW has been flawless when it came down to integrating nostalgic elements into its cannon, and I'm really looking forward to see how nick handles this.

[RaphAndDonnie]

Hmm...I'm curious as how this will pull together in the second season...Also, wow! The original voice actors are coming back Can't wait to hear Townsend Coleman being a surfer dude again. Also, Mutagen Man? I'll have to look him up on the TMNTpedia, never heard of him.

[Gyt Kaliba]

Okay, let me get this out of the way before I say anything else - YES. YES. YES YES YES. OH MY GOD HELL YES.

...Okay. I think I'm calm now. Somewhat.

Yeah, I am LOVING the idea of seeing the OT Turtles again, especially with their actual voice actors. I'm not expecting it to be as awesome as Turtles Forever, which was nigh perfect, but I'm still very excited to see what they have in mind for this.

The only issues I had with the treatment of the OT Turtles in Forever was the wrong voices, and the fact that yes, they were treated as a little more laughable than they should have been. I don't really know if that was a 'mistake' per say though. They come from a universe which operates on a lot more vintage cartoon logic than the 2K3 universe did. So you really only have three routes you can go with that. 1) They are made to be completely ineffective and laughable; 2) they are made to be idiot savants who despite being bizarre, never fail; or 3) a mix of the two. I think that for the most part, 4Kids went for option 3, but fell into option 1 a little too often. I would have liked to see a few moments where the OT Turtles actually achieved something in a ridiculous way, and the 2K3 Turtles are just flabbergasted that it even worked. Ah well, missed opportunities.

As for if this crossover will also eventually feature the 2K3 Turtles...eh, leave that for another time I say. And as much as I want them to get the 4Kids cast back if they do that, I would find it akwardly hilarious if it was THAT cast that wasn't brought back this time around.

[Vivi]

Eh, not too much into the old toon, so not fussed. As someone mentioned, it will be interesting to see how they mix the 2D and 3D - you think that they'll make them 3d also?

[Refractive Reflections]

Originally Posted by Galactus

The earlier post on this thread that I was responding to was about you casting negetive aspersions on the intentions of the 4Kids creative staff of why they did homages to the Fred Wolf show. I pointed out there's actual evidence that suggests that far from meaning to be snide or to make their version cooler in comparison - they did it because they knew fans of the old show liked it.

Talking about Turtles Forever specificaly I think the effort that went into animating the Fred Wolf characters and world is a rather telling of their intentions. When the special was first announced people expected only minor design differences to differentiate the two but 4Kids went all out. They even took obscure things that only a die hard would remember like the other punks from the first season or the Technodrome's cockpit and the phone booth elevator and recreated them in exact detail right down to the trash in the dumpsters. Are you really saying they went to all that trouble simply to trash them?

It went far beyond the animation though. A lot of the fun as a fan of the Fred Wolf show should have been stuff like...hearing Donatello say "let's stay in touch" and thinking; hey that's from 'Return of The Shredder" or hearing Raph say "we resemble that remark" and thinking that was a callback to 'Raphael Knocks 'em Dead" or seeing Bebop use the Scent Analyser from 'Beware The Lotus' or Donatello using a wrench as a hammer like he did 'Leonardo Lightens Up'

They really must have scoured through the old show for stuff like that which again makes it unlikely they would go to that much effort if they meant to make them look bad. It also seems to put a dent in the argument they were inaccurately represented. For years I've heard detractors say "OT Leo wouldn't say this" or "OT Don wouldn't do that" about stuff that was ripped directly from the Fred Wolf show.

Why are you still focused on the artwork references? (The cockpit, the scent analyzer, the wrench as a hammer, the phone booth elevator). Yes, they may have searched through the episodes, but again like I said before the OT Turtles took almost every threat by a villain seriously but in Turtles Forever the OT Turtles were depicted as having Vernon-level cowardice and Bebop-level incompetence.

Originally Posted by Galactus

Kind of like how brave Leonardo is in 'Snakes Alive'

So Leonardo is supposed to be a Gary-Stu? He can't have one paralyzing fear like normal people, like 2K3 Raph's fear of insects? The point is the OT Turtles were depicted as having Vernon-level cowardice and Bebop-level incompetence and if that was accurate to the original series, which Gen Y kid would have wanted to emulate/aspire to be that (a cowardly buffoon) during the OT's heyday?


You don't have to agree with me or my opinion, and that's fine with me... but when you don't want to discuss in depth about the points I'm bringing up (OT Turtles cowardice and incompetence in "Turtles Forever") and still referring to the artwork detail/references that I didn't bring up, then it's just not worth my time and it's inappropriate for me to continue this discussion in this thread. I'm sorry and I apologize, but it just seems like we're on two different wavelengths...

[Mona_Lisa]

Originally Posted by Darth Knuckles

Wow this is great news! I thought it may never be as cool as Turtles Forever but this sounds like it definitely could be. All of the original cast voicing their turtles again! Freakin' awesome! The Baxter Stockman and Mutagen Man stuff sounds neat too but the original cartoon turtles should be epic. They'll probably have a really funny moment with Original Cartoon Raph and Nick Toon Donatello!

I am so excited and happy!!!!!! I can't wait. I want to see the 80's turtles done right one more time!!!!!! Not that I don't like Nick turtles, they are awesome.I love them!
But as weird as it sounds, there's just something sacred to me about the 80's turtles.

Originally Posted by BabyTurtles

are we talking about the OT turtles in Turtles Forever? cause they didn't seem cowardly to me...

but they were goofballs XD.....though...weren't they in the OT series??

The OT turtles Were "goofballs" at times, but turtles forever took it way to far imo. They weren't cowardly at all either. I liked turtles forever, but it was far from what I wanted it to be.
Now it would be funny to me if all the turtles were in a fight together and somehow the ot turles tried to get one of thouse food fights going, and the nick turtles were like what???? And the bad guys didn't go along with it (maybe they shot the pizzas with there guns). and the ot was like "dang, it always worked before... LOL!!!!!!!

[Slade]

Not really excited for either of these. I will admit I do want to see how the crossover comes about and what animation style either will be in. Honestly though I feel like it's to early in the game for a crossover.

[NinjaMan]

The crew loves the 80s turtles so I have faith in what they will do

[Galactus]

Originally Posted by JLS

Why are you still focused on the artwork references? (The cockpit, the scent analyzer, the wrench as a hammer, the phone booth elevator). Yes, they may have searched through the episodes, but again like I said before the OT Turtles took almost every threat by a villain seriously but in Turtles Forever the OT Turtles were depicted as having Vernon-level cowardice and Bebop-level incompetence.

My point is to show the amount of effort they went to really sell it that this was the '87 turtles and not vaguely similar ones. Why would they do all this if they meant to do them a disservice.

As I pointed out it's not just the animation that has that attention to detail but everything from lines of dialogue ripped from the old show and references to obscure episodes. Again why would they go to all this effort if their intention was to do them a disservice as you claimed?

Also you are forgetting the knocks the 2k3 turtles recived particularly by the Mirage turtles who mostly viewed both cartoon turtles as stupid and in the end seemed to prefer the OT turtles? Hardly trying to make the 2K3 turtles look good there.

"Vernon-level cowardice" - I don't remember that. I remember the '87 turtles getting involved in every fight with little hesitation. When the 2K3 turtles told them how threatening Ch'rell was in comparison to their Shredder and that they could do and then they went in the Technodrome to fight him anyway. They got scared for a funny moment in the Mirage world but that lasted a few seconds before they were fighting again.

"Bebop-level competence" - '87 Don came up with the method to track the Technodrome both on Earth and through Dimensions. He also built the portal stick, something the newer Don thought was impossible. Infact the newer Don got it to work by doing something he previously thought his older counterpart was stupid to do.

The exploding shuriken saved their lives and their fighting methods were seen as silly but got the job done. It was the OT characters methods that saved the multiverse....what more could you possibly want???

So Leonardo is supposed to be a Gary-Stu? He can't have one paralyzing fear like normal people, like 2K3 Raph's fear of insects? The point is the OT Turtles were depicted as having Vernon-level cowardice and Bebop-level incompetence and if that was accurate to the original series, which Gen Y kid would have wanted to emulate/aspire to be that (a cowardly buffoon) during the OT's heyday?

I'd say running away from battle and the way he acted in that episode in general is pretty embarassing even by OT standards. (I didn't care for how Raph's fear of bugs was portrayed in the Nick show either.) It does however show that there is a precedent for the Fred Wolf turtles getting as scared as they did for an ever so brief moment in Turtles Forever.

You don't have to agree with me or my opinion, and that's fine with me... but when you don't want to discuss in depth about the points I'm bringing up (OT Turtles cowardice and incompetence in "Turtles Forever") and still referring to the artwork detail/references that I didn't bring up, then it's just not worth my time and it's inappropriate for me to continue this discussion in this thread. I'm sorry and I apologize, but it just seems like we're on two different wavelengths...

I am discussing it. Your original point of the 4Kids creators intentions with the old toon homages and your followup ones about the characterisation of the '87 characters in TF. I've come up with what would say are logical arguments and even cite many examples to back up my point of view. You have not.

[Donatello19]

I wonder if we will see the OT versions of some of the other characters as well...I'd love to see how OT Shredder and Nick Shredder would interact with each other

[CyberCubed]

God I would love to see Krang interact with the Kraang.

It would be funny to see Krang say, "I am the real Krang and you are all my slaves" to the Kraang.

[Luigiperps]

How's about if OT and nick dons both make a machine, the same one at the same time, and they malfunction and switch OT Mikey and nick Mikey.

[Powder]

I wonder if OT Don will make a crack about Nick Don's gap.

[Slade]

Originally Posted by Powder

I wonder if OT Don will make a crack about Nick Don's gap.

That'd be hilarious. Be great if it made Nick Don want to fight. OT vs Nick....who would win?????

[CyberCubed]

If the old toon turtles are in CG, I hope the CG is as true to the old toon style as possible.

[gobo]

Originally Posted by Candy Kappa

looking especially at you BS19

I love that guy's choice of initialx. ^_^ So appropriate...

[demonsweat]

SO stoked for this! I hope they keep the OT turtles in 2d. Maybe do a cell-shaded kind of thing. I don't know, it'll be interesting to see! I'm excited for Mutagen Man too, I love that guy. They'd better make him really gross.

Originally Posted by Darth Knuckles

They'll probably have a really funny moment with Original Cartoon Raph and Nick Toon Donatello!

Oh my god I hope so. I bet one will say something, and they'll keep mistaking him for the other guy.

Originally Posted by Powder

I wonder if OT Don will make a crack about Nick Don's gap.

That would be funny too. Not to mention how tall he is. And...

"Dudes - what's up with that extra toe??"

[Donatello19]

Originally Posted by Raph_tha_Dude

That'd be hilarious. Be great if it made Nick Don want to fight. OT vs Nick....who would win?????

Nick Don. All the OT turtles ever did was throw their weapons at their enemies, that is, if they were even using their weapons and not tossing around garbage cans or whatever...

[Powder]

Originally Posted by demonsweat

That would be funny too. Not to mention how tall he is. And...

"Dudes - what's up with that extra toe??"

Yeah, there are really so many things they could joke about between them. The chipped shell on Raph, Donnie's gap, Mikey's freckles, their height differences, one Leo being focused on his work whereas the other is a sci-fi fanboy, the three toes as you stated, etc. I could see the Nick turtles making a crack about how the old ones look identical short of their colored masks.