A fan base more divided than Ninja Turtle fans?

[Leo656]

I like your style, brother.

Kirk or Picard? Well, Kirk didn't solve all his problems by talking at them, he did it with his fists - and on green-skinned alien chicks, with his penis! So it's pretty obvious which Captain was superior. I never understood why this was even a debate. Sometimes, there IS no debate.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I'm with Andrew, actually. Others are bad but TMNT is by far "the worst".

It all comes down to how wildly different each version of TMNT is, each one has its fans and detractors, and yes, all that is normal in any fandom. BUT, Some people think TMNT is a dark and gritty action story about ninjas and others feel it's just a balls-out, batsh*t-crazy anything-goes kinda thing that shouldn't be taken seriously at all. That schism is the root of it, and although there are a lot of people who are "in between", the fact that the most well-known version of the property is directly at odds with "the source material" as far as tone and characterization, means there will NEVER be a clear consensus on what TMNT is, what it's supposed to be, and what is and is not "Okay" for the property.

That's why tiny little disagreements become "your version sucks, my version is better" all the time. There's no "right" answer, but the "purists" are always going to believe they are right and that the other fans don't treat the property with the respect and seriousness they think it deserves, and the "it's all just for laughs" people are going to think they're right and the other side takes things too seriously.

The more new comics, shows, movies and offshoots that contradict each other, it can only get worse. That's what scares me.

LOL! You guys thing THIS franchise is bad?! You should check out any forums involving WotC's D&D/Forgotten Realms properties. Over the last 4.5(and soon to be 5) editions of the game, not to mention all the novels, sourcebooks, etc for the FR shared world, the fans of Faerun and the D&D multiverse in general make us TMNT fans look like a bunch of pussycats. Seriously. The past edition ALONE divided fans along pro/con lines for or against it, and this is in addition to all the fans who were ALREADY spouting rhetoric for their own particular preferred edition. Many long-time fans actually got so fed up they switched over to the more player-friendly Pathfinder world. No joke- fans left the franchise IN DROVES. Here's the short version:

First, we have "Old School" fans of the "Old Grey Box" (or the original Forgotten Realms game material and the related novels from that time period WAAY back in the late seventies and early eighties), and 2nd ed fans of AD&D, and also the fans of the later 3rd edition revamp (though admittedly minor) of the rules and the game/novel world (A la the Time of Troubles storyline and related tales) and when 4th ed came out there was this REALLY nasty edition war with the COMPLETE rewrite of both rules/world and the resulting furor over changes not only to kingdoms and a 100 year time jump (thus killing off the majority of long-running popular characters) but a MASH-UP OF TWO SEPERATE WORLDS INTO ONE! Yes, we ended up with a "worlds collide" scenario that utterly changed the entire game/novel world into something many fans found unrecognizable.

And now, Hasbro/WotC is set to release a NEW edition (yeah, the last one has only lasted about four years, and since then has proven far less popular than was hoped- go figure....) dubbed "D&D Next". Time will tell how that goes, but the company has decided to take the property back to its "roots" to appease many of the fans of older editions who were so incensed by the last and most glaringly across-the-board changes (and we're talking about ret-conning out over HALF of their most popular characters and regions!) and hopefully win back the fans' trust. How are they doing it? With yet ANOTHER RSE(that's a Realms-Shattering-Event for those unfamiliar with such terminology) that undoes most of what was done with the current edition (including UN-killing about half of the world's gods-most of which were wiped out during the 4th ed purge that left so many fans up in arms).

And THIS franchise is bad? PLEASE. We're pretty tame around here compared to some of the rabid FR fans out there....

[Mr._Mutant_Man]

I heard that WOTC made a lot of changes in 4E to try to appeal to the World of Warcraft crowd. Would you say that's true?

Lately they've been reprinting old D and D books. Almost as if to say, "we're sorry."

[turtle1237]

Originally Posted by Shark_Blade

Ha, New 52.. I'm fine with most of their reboots but their new Super Girl...





Old outfit:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supergi...%29#The_New_52

Seriously? What were they thinking?
Lucky we don't have this kinda thing in tmnt.

And there is a reason why
supergirl should wear a skirt
That looks bad, I know there trying to add Superman's red Underwear into Supergirl's outfit, but that just looks bad.

[Candy Kappa]

Originally Posted by MsMarvelDuckie

Over the last 4.5(and soon to be 5) editions of the game.

Well... There's more then 5 editions of D&D, with Next it's gonna be 11, or 12 with Essentials as a separate unit.

And that is why Next is not labeled 5th edition, cause it's a homage to all editions.

Originally Posted by Mr._Mutant_Man

I heard that WOTC made a lot of changes in 4E to try to appeal to the World of Warcraft crowd. Would you say that's true?

Lately they've been reprinting old D and D books. Almost as if to say, "we're sorry."

To say it was made to appeal to the WOW crowd is kinda silly, it's broader then that, to appeal to all casuals that isn't used to previous editions of D&D.

4th edition is greatly streamlined and due to more actions to do in combat and the 4e rule-set combat is a heavier part of the game and classes are heavily balanced. No classes are no longer extremely under powered or overpowered as in previous editions. (Take out the role-playing part and you get a miniature wargame, which is a thing: Dungeon Command)

Example:

Spoiler:

A wizard was likely to die very early at low levels, but became god-king of awesome at higher levels. While a fighter is very good at low levels but becomes weaker and very very boring to play at higher levels

Printing the old books started with (ofc) AD&D 1st edition as the money are going to raise a statue of Gary Gygax. And it just escalated from that, which I am very glad with as I absolutely love the look of the books.

[Prowler]

Anime/manga fandom is pretty damn divided. So is the Metal fanbase. And dont' even get me started on the Internet Wrestling Community...

I don't think the TMNT fandom is that bad, to be honest. I do wish some people were more open minded and not be quick to dismiss a different version of the TMNT. I'm mostly referring to people who grew up watching one of the cartoons and then hate on the next one just for being different compared to the version they grew up with. And the thing is, they don't even care if it's good or not, they'll still disregard it just because "this isn't the turtles I grew up with!"

[BubblyShell22]

Ah, yes, I forgot about the wrestling community. There's a lot of division among that fandom believe it or not.

[CyberCubed]

This fandom isn't that divided. You're talking about the people who just watched TMNT as a passing fad and never got back into it.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

This fandom isn't that divided. You're talking about the people who just watched TMNT as a passing fad and never got back into it.

In case you're referring to my post, some people I've talked to with that kind of mentality still like the FW series and the first 3 live action movies. Sure it's more nostalgia than anything but a fan is a fan nevertheless.

Ironically they dislike the newer cartoon versions for being different but still like the 90s live action movies even though they were quite different form the FW series.

[Michelangelo]

Even the different comic series have fans divided. Vol 3 by Image got bumped from the main cannon but it was certainly different and took risks. Thankfully we are able to enjoy whatever we like from the TMNT history, and the type of fan one is should be based upon their own experience and feelings. I don't know what 'type' I'd be as a TMNT fan, but I pretty much like all TMNT stuff. Even though I love the original movie I'm really hoping the new one will be better. I just think that there is always room to improve upon things that have been done, whether it takes 20yrs or forever.

[pannoni1]

The Nick show and IDW series IMO is doing a good job to keep or even close the fandom gap and is the reason for the current success, and I feel that it will continue with the third movie after watching a recent Con panel with E&L, Michael Bay, the Turtle Doc, and the fact that the first movie will be re-released with outtakes. I feel that the biggest gap is simply generational, with the urge to stay in the comfort zone to keep the classic and not try the new. Its important to stay informed so you don't get left behind. IMO the biggest divide in the fandom's history was back in the late '80s after the OT started but before the first movie was released, though that was likely forced by a small Mirage fanbase being annoyed at a much larger OT fanbase. To a lesser degree this occured with the 4kids series who preferred the OT, but this has never been a significant problem for the franchise, and even in the early days it was still during the brands' fledging phase.

[Davetello]

From what I have read on here and on other internet sites I wouldn't particularly consider the turtles fanbase divided. Some aspects and universes can be argued to be divisive but from what i have seen the majority have respect for the most prominent universes, even if they state a clear preference for one of them. Most people seem to be pulling in the same direction.

The fanbase is also infinitely less pretentious than many. Most of you seem fairly laid-back which is rare for a community such as this.

I don't know if you could call it a 'fanbase' per se, but believe me when I tell you that the soccer community is much more fickle, highly strung and frustrating than the turtles fanbase. There's also more egotism amongst football fans and a burning desire to be correct above all else.

Obviously none of you are football fans but if you were you'd know exactly what I mean.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by Davetello

From what I have read on here and on other internet sites I wouldn't particularly consider the turtles fanbase divided. Some aspects and universes can be argued to be divisive but from what i have seen the majority have respect for the most prominent universes, even if they state a clear preference for one of them. Most people seem to be pulling in the same direction.

The fanbase is also infinitely less pretentious than many. Most of you seem fairly laid-back which is rare for a community such as this.

I don't know if you could call it a 'fanbase' per se, but believe me when I tell you that the soccer community is much more fickle, highly strung and frustrating than the turtles fanbase. There's also more egotism amongst football fans and a burning desire to be correct above all else.

Obviously none of you are football fans but if you were you'd know exactly what I mean.

Oh, definitely, even among fans of the same club. Especially when your team is going through bad times, oh boy...

[Davetello]

Originally Posted by Prowler

Oh, definitely, even among fans of the same club. Especially when your team is going through bad times, oh boy...

Yeah, I was gonna bring it down to individual fanbases, but even the footballing support/community as a whole is a very combustible entity.

As for mutiny and civil war when your club is struggling, that's something that American sports fans won't be able to comprehend. US sports aren't considered a religion from what I have seen.

I've seen people offer to meet each other and 'settle things' because they had a different opinion on whether their team's manager should be sacked. Can you imagine people on here wanting to fight each other due to disagreements on the turtles?

[Michelangelo]

TMNTs certainly have a lot of history now and amongst everything out there I think there's enough stuff argyue about if people want. I just found out about these japanese super mutants version of the TMNTs. I have no idea what it's all about but it certainly looks like something different, but as to whether I'll like it or not I'll just have to see for myself. Anyone know much about this japanese super mutants stuff and are there many fans of it among everyone here?

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by Davetello

Yeah, I was gonna bring it down to individual fanbases, but even the footballing support/community as a whole is a very combustible entity.

As for mutiny and civil war when your club is struggling, that's something that American sports fans won't be able to comprehend. US sports aren't considered a religion from what I have seen.

I've seen people offer to meet each other and 'settle things' because they had a different opinion on whether their team's manager should be sacked. Can you imagine people on here wanting to fight each other due to disagreements on the turtles?

Considering you're from Glasgow I take it that you either support Rangers or Celtic, right? That's one of the 3 biggest football rivalries alongside Boca Juniors vs. River Plate and Fenerbahçe vs. Galatasaray, imo.

[Airconny]

Originally Posted by pannoni1

The Nick show and IDW series IMO is doing a good job to keep or even close the fandom gap and is the reason for the current success, and I feel that it will continue with the third movie after watching a recent Con panel with E&L, Michael Bay, the Turtle Doc, and the fact that the first movie will be re-released with outtakes.

This. Watching that Turtle Doc during the panel got me riled up, seeing that they got some of the voice talent and actors from FW and 1990 movies is definitely something I want to watch. I think that's what Nick is trying to do anyways with the new series, to unify most of the fandom into one, so that the level of arguing over ''what's better and what isn't'' is kept to a low minimum.

[Davetello]

Originally Posted by Prowler

Considering you're from Glasgow I take it that you either support Rangers or Celtic, right? That's one of the 3 biggest football rivalries alongside Boca Juniors vs. River Plate and Fenerbahçe vs. Galatasaray, imo.

Yeah, Rangers mate. Now the Old Firm is an example of exactly the type of insanity I refer to I consider Boca-River to be the biggest derby in the world.

I've deduced from your post on the turtles' visit to Portugal in the OT that you're from Lisbon. You a Sporting or Benfica man?

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by Davetello

Yeah, Rangers mate. Now the Old Firm is an example of exactly the type of insanity I refer to I consider Boca-River to be the biggest derby in the world.

I've deduced from your post on the turtles' visit to Portugal in the OT that you're from Lisbon. You a Sporting or Benfica man?

Rangers are my favorite Scottish team, actually.

I'm a Benfiquista

[Davetello]

Originally Posted by Prowler

Rangers are my favorite Scottish team, actually.

Yes, I'm a Benfiquista

Thanks. That's nice to know

I probably like Benfica most of the big three in Portugal, coincidentally. Your club has a sensational history and I believe has the most paid up members of any club in world football - or did. Hard end to the season last year though (sorry to remind you).

Fancy your chances against Sweden? You have been woeful recently and Ronaldo hasn't performed for ages.

We are sidetracking the discussion here but it would be great to talk football and turtles in private some time.