How will the love triangle be resolved?

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by Leo656

That's in your own head then, pal.

Just a question for those genuinely in favor of April and Donatello being a couple (I don't play that "name mash-up" garbage): Why? Simply curious.

Because it's different and the one thing that would be truly unique to this series.

Originally Posted by BabyTurtles

Wanna know the one thing that annoyed me throughout the seasons?

April and Donnie have NOTHING in common with each other and yet I'm supposed to believe she likes hanging out with him and calling him the most.

Just because Donnie likes her doesn't mean April had to humor him and be around him 24/7.

like we could have gotten a big sister April to all the turtles....but NO, the writers wanted to make sure you knew that Donnie liked April so they pushed them in every scene possible.

Eh, I don't think we know April enough to decide they have nothing in common, and don't forget, Donnie can't just go to places like the movies, zoos or museums like Casey can. Nor, can we assume that Donnie and April may or may not have things in common, because we really don't see enough of April during down time. For all we know, they very well might like the same movies and music and talk about it, it's just not going to be on camera, because this show seems to have this issue that if it's not action or some funny stuff, they don't really want to waste time on the down stuff.

[NoName999]

Originally Posted by Warhorse

Because it's different and the one thing that would be truly unique to this series.

Don had a small crush on April in the 2k3 series as well.

And it wasn't even a 1/12th as annoying the Nick cartoon

Eh, I don't think we know April enough to decide they have nothing in common

A problem in and of itself lol

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by NoName999

Don had a small crush on April in the 2k3 series as well.

And it wasn't even a 1/12th as annoying the Nick cartoon

That was just a crush. Leo was asking why people would want Donnie and April together, and it's because it would be unique to the series. I suggest you read my quote, and Leo's quote as well to see why I said what I said.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by NoName999

Don had a small crush on April in the 2k3 series as well.

That's popular fan-canon. Nothing more. Period.

[BabyTurtles]

Originally Posted by Warhorse

Eh, I don't think we know April enough to decide they have nothing in common,

Yea I know! It's the 3rd season and we still don't know April well enough!

That's not good.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by BabyTurtles

They should have dropped Donnie's crush on April the first season, have Donnie learn that he can't force someone to like him....yadda yadda.

Then we wouldn't have had to put up with the love triangle the second and third season.

....then Casey would be better bros with Raph instead of having this love rival srelationship with Donnie.

You don't get over a crush so fast. It can gradually fade, though. Anyway, I Donnie isn't trying to force April to like him. He's instinctively trying to impress her and show off for her (when the plot calls for it because he doesn't always do this) which is extremely normal. Donnie isn't even touchy-feely with her. That's "stop pinching your own butt" Casey's territory.

And despite what some say, to me, Donnie seems like he was trying to get to know April if season 1 is any indication. He had that flowchart of scenarios to find an excuse to impress her and get to know her. Help her with homework and stuff. How else do you get to know people? By spending time with them.

Anywho, there goes my two cents. Back to work I go.

[Leo656]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

He had that flowchart of scenarios to find an excuse to impress her and get to know her. Help her with homework and stuff. How else do you get to know people? By spending time with them.

Truly one of the most disgusting things this show has pulled to that effect.

True story? In high school I was in-between chicks at one point and feeling insecure and needy, and there was a girl I was super-into and she wasn't, we were friends but that's all she wanted to be, and I came dangerously close to being one of Those Guys. I never got THAT bad, but I DID do stupid sh*t like, plan out my route between classes so we'd pass by the maximum possible number of times per day, etc. Not only did it get me nowhere, by the end of it we were no longer even friends, because she rightfully found that kind of behavior disgusting and told me to f*ck off. I hated her for it at the time, but now I hate myself for being such a f*cking wiener back then. I'm surprised we were friends - BEST friends - for almost two whole years before she exploded on me and explained what a horrible person I was. It cost me other friends, too, because literally everyone but me could see how clingy, needy, desperate and terrible I was. It's inexcusable, and to this day I'm deeply ashamed of it.

So, I'm sensitive to this kind of thing. Donnie's behavior isn't "cute", it's not "endearing", it's definitely NOT healthy, and it doesn't work. It sends a horrible message that you can FORCE someone to "love" you if you're just the "right" combination of pushy and manipulative.

It's not even a matter that's up for debate. Nick Donnie is a terrible "person" and he doesn't even deserve April, simply based on how he's tried to "win" her like a carnival prize. IF he ends up with her, that's terrible. That would be the worst possible message they could be sending to kids.

[pennydreadful]

As off-putting as Nick Donnie's behavior towards April is, I still find Nick Casey's about a billion times worse. I've always liked Casey in every incarnation up til now, and in this incarnation I just want to drown him. He just comes off as a gross, lecherous little turd who doesn't know when to quit.

Originally Posted by NoName999

Don had a small crush on April in the 2k3 series as well.

Some fans read it that way, but I've honestly got no idea how popular it is or isn't as a theory. I never really saw it that way, myself - I always just saw them as friends. Given his reserved nature, 2k3 Donnie seemed like the type to get bashful about anybody hugging him - whether it was April or one of his bros.

[Leo656]

They're both pretty bad, yeah.

This show... has sh*tty writers. There, I said it. The best thing I can say, is that at times, it's clever.

[Luckyday]

Originally Posted by Leo656

They're both pretty bad, yeah.

This show... has sh*tty writers. There, I said it. The best thing I can say, is that at times, it's clever.

But there might a lot of things effecting the show that can't be sum in one sentence.

It all come down to

*Executive meddling
Just let show do it's own thing for **** sakes and stop forcing it to be a david wise reboot.

*Hellish schedule
It obvious at times when the script feels rush. I would trade 2 years on having nothing it all if meant that show didn't constantly go break after break.

*Not having a proper story outline on where to go next.
I don't know if Ciro production bible is mostly just character sketches or maybe it contains stuff that is undoable by nick standards but you can't just fly by seat of your pants. Plan your ****.

*Unexperience head writer that doesn't knows what **** he's doing.
Stop hiring your friends. Being a horror movie buff is not a skill set.

*Shallow understanding of the character April.
It not what she is, it WHO she is that makes us like her.

*Outdated mindsets that girls can only act in a certain way with limited roles.
Get Rebecca Sugar to be a guest writer.

Thats all I can think of.

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by Luckyday

But there might a lot of things effecting the show that can't be sum in one sentence.

It all come down to

*Executive meddling
Just let show do it's own thing for **** sakes and stop forcing it to be a david wise reboot.

*Hellish schedule
It obvious at times when the script feels rush. I would trade 2 years on having nothing it all if meant that show didn't constantly go break after break.

*Not having a proper story outline on where to go next.
I don't know if Ciro production bible is mostly just character sketches or maybe it contains stuff that is undoable by nick standards but you can't just fly by seat of your pants. Plan your ****.

*Unexperience head writer that doesn't knows what **** he's doing.
Stop hiring your friends. Being a horror movie buff is not a skill set.

*Shallow understanding of the character April.
It not what she is, it WHO she is that makes us like her.

*Outdated mindsets that girls can only act in a certain way with limited roles.
Get Rebecca Sugar to be a guest writer.

Thats all I can think of.

A lot of good points. In particular, the hiring of a friend to be a head writer. There were some posts by Cubed that were questioning the guy's writing abilities when he first came on, and Ciro himself actually came onto the board to defend him. Really, I found it a bit much that some random dude on a message forum doesn't like someone's writing style, and Ciro comes in here to blast him, doesn't speak highly of Ciro. If really had faith in his friend, then he wouldn't need some random joe's blessing on a message board to back that faith up, or lack of it.

[Luckyday]

Originally Posted by Warhorse

A lot of good points. In particular, the hiring of a friend to be a head writer. There were some posts by Cubed that were questioning the guy's writing abilities when he first came on, and Ciro himself actually came onto the board to defend him. Really, I found it a bit much that some random dude on a message forum doesn't like someone's writing style, and Ciro comes in here to blast him, doesn't speak highly of Ciro. If really had faith in his friend, then he wouldn't need some random joe's blessing on a message board to back that faith up, or lack of it.

I remember it was a baxter stockmen episode discussion. I think I was under impression that the attacks on ciro would have been very hellfire and brimstone but when I look at the actual transcript between Ciro and Cube I was like "This is seriously what made Ciro left thetechnodrome?".

It has to be more then that. It wasn't like the first episode. I need to look at that thread again or least look at Ciro's history post because seriously if not then dude is seriously thin skin.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by Leo656

Truly one of the most disgusting things this show has pulled to that effect.

I interpreted it differently, though. Nowhere did it seem like Donnie was trying to force the girl to hang with him. The chart seemed to have things he can say or do if those situations were to come up, not manipulate them to. The only way I would've had a problem with this was if he'd had something on there specific like, "April takes a shower every night at 10:45, so I will stand outside her door and offer some specially made shampoo made from many herbs to help increase its shine". I didn't get that impression at all from Donnie's chart which the ep itself showed that he overthinks and over plans things. With that much forsight he'd make an incredible chess player. Even at the end, iirc, April mentioned training, and checked that thread of his chart and asked to train with her. The opportunity presented itself and he asked to join her.

True story? In high school I was in-between chicks at one point and feeling insecure and needy, and there was a girl I was super-into and she wasn't, we were friends but that's all she wanted to be, and I came dangerously close to being one of Those Guys. I never got THAT bad, but I DID do stupid sh*t like, plan out my route between classes so we'd pass by the maximum possible number of times per day, etc. Not only did it get me nowhere, by the end of it we were no longer even friends, because she rightfully found that kind of behavior disgusting and told me to f*ck off. I hated her for it at the time, but now I hate myself for being such a f*cking wiener back then. I'm surprised we were friends - BEST friends - for almost two whole years before she exploded on me and explained what a horrible person I was. It cost me other friends, too, because literally everyone but me could see how clingy, needy, desperate and terrible I was. It's inexcusable, and to this day I'm deeply ashamed of it.

So, I'm sensitive to this kind of thing. Donnie's behavior isn't "cute", it's not "endearing", it's definitely NOT healthy, and it doesn't work. It sends a horrible message that you can FORCE someone to "love" you if you're just the "right" combination of pushy and manipulative.

Which Donnie isn't. He's never to my knowledge forced April to do anything. Trying to impress a girl isn't a problem. It's a problem if said girl said no on the get go and he continues to bug her.

That aside, I still don't get what you did wrong, unless there's more to the story.

[Warhorse]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

I interpreted it differently, though. Nowhere did it seem like Donnie was trying to force the girl to hang with him. The chart seemed to have things he can say or do if those situations were to come up, not manipulate them to. The only way I would've had a problem with this was if he'd had something on there specific like, "April takes a shower every night at 10:45, so I will stand outside her door and offer some specially made shampoo made from many herbs to help increase its shine". I didn't get that impression at all from Donnie's chart which the ep itself showed that he overthinks and over plans things. With that much forsight he'd make an incredible chess player. Even at the end, iirc, April mentioned training, and checked that thread of his chart and asked to train with her. The opportunity presented itself and he asked to join her. Which Donnie isn't. He's never to my knowledge forced April to do anything. Trying to impress a girl isn't a problem. It's a problem if said girl said no on the get go and he continues to bug her.

That aside, I still don't get what you did wrong, unless there's more to the story.

Eh, I don't know. I might have agreed with you, but then we have Raphael on the show, pointing out to Donnie "Now you know how April feels" So, if the writers themselves are writing the characters as thinking Donnie is going too far, can you blame the viewers for thinking the same thing?

[Luckyday]

Originally Posted by Warhorse

Eh, I don't know. I might have agreed with you, but then we have Raphael on the show, pointing out to Donnie "Now you know how April feels" So, if the writers themselves are writing the characters as thinking Donnie is going too far, can you blame the viewers for thinking the same thing?

I don't know because that's not the impression that I got. To me it was more for Donnie to understand how unlikely and weird the situation was for two different creatures to fall in love.

"I get it now. I'm just a mutant."

He thinks it because he's a mutant and not because of his behavior.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

Which Donnie isn't. He's never to my knowledge forced April to do anything. Trying to impress a girl isn't a problem. It's a problem if said girl said no on the get go and he continues to bug her.

Yeah, Donnie is respectful of April's personal space. You can point out the parts in Mutagen Man Unleashed and Target: April O'Neil where Donnie is following her despite the fact she had stated that she didn't want to see him or any of the Turtles again.

However I interprit his actions on checking in on a friend. He knows April has training as a Kunoichi, but he also knows the Kraang want her and the Foot have targeted her simply because she means something to the Turtles. And while she would be able to hold her own, she also

And New York also has other dangers for young woman who are out on the street alone at night. He really hadn't intended on her catching him in Target: April O'Neil. He was just making sure she got home or wherever she was going safely, and she just happened to sense he was following her.

Even during the conversation Donnie doesn't bring up anything that implies or hints that he wants her back. Nor does he force her change her mind. He doesn't deny responcibility with what happened to her father, he just allows her to express her displeasure at catching him following her and them imparts the words of "Somethings are just beyond our control."

Also April has shown she is capable of speaking her mind, so if Donnie was doing something she wasn't comfortable with she is perfectly capable of telling him she doesn't appriciated it.

Every hug, every kiss we've seen Donnie get from her were innitated by April herself. They weren't forced or coersed in any way. The only one that would count as forced would be the peace hug that Donnie and Casey were giving her at the end of 'China Town Ghost Story'

Casey on the other hand has invaded April's personal space such as slinking an arm around her shoulders or generally being a horn dog around her. And April has been very clear about not appriciating his behavior on occasion.

Originally Posted by Warhorse

Eh, I don't know. I might have agreed with you, but then we have Raphael on the show, pointing out to Donnie "Now you know how April feels" So, if the writers themselves are writing the characters as thinking Donnie is going too far, can you blame the viewers for thinking the same thing?

Well yeah Big Foot following him around like a love puppy. But Big Foot's behavior was more of an extream case of Donnie's behavior in season one. So Raph is pointing out that Donnie is learning how April must feel putting up with his behavior.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by Luckyday

I don't know because that's not the impression that I got. To me it was more for Donnie to understand how unlikely and weird the situation was for two different creatures to fall in love.

"I get it now. I'm just a mutant."

He thinks it because he's a mutant and not because of his behavior.

http://i3.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/...4/facepalm.jpg

This was my interpretation as well, since he pointed out the "I'm just a mutant" thing. Personally, after seeing Fungus Humongus I was under the impression that Donnie was self-conscious over being one.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

This was my interpretation as well, since he pointed out the "I'm just a mutant" thing. Personally, after seeing Fungus Humongus I was under the impression that Donnie was self-conscious over being one.

Yeah, he has indicated that is sensitive about the fact he's a mutant since season one and that could come into play more if Bishop is ever introduced into the show. A friend of mine pointed out in her review of Monkey Brains that April starts to see Donnie in a new light during that episode because she sees him getting hurt and witnesses how hard it is for him with his brothers and with being a mutant in general.

[Leo656]

Originally Posted by ssjup81

I interpreted it differently, though.

That aside, I still don't get what you did wrong, unless there's more to the story.

People can interpret things however they want, and their "interpretation" can be incorrect. I've seen many people here say they feel the exact same way, that Donnie's obsession is inexcusable and the way he is behaving is creepy. And any girl that would want a guy to "pursue" her in that way probably needs therapy. It's not healthy.

There's nothing more to the story, other than, when someone tells you, "I don't like you in that way, and nothing is going to change that," you can't force it to change by manipulating events so that you spend more time together, and hope you eventually wear down their resistance and they just give in and accept you. Just like April, this girl was giving me a ton of mixed signals - hugs, cheek kisses, even saying "I love you" (even though it was followed with "as a friend"), and even agreeing to go to the prom with me - that were encouraging despite her telling me it was never going to happen. She later took responsibility for her part, because while her words said one thing, her actions said another. Her words said no, but her actions said "Maybe eventually", so I kept it up. In the end, she admitted she should have just flat-out cut me off and ended the friendship earlier, rather than put false ideas in my head. I was making her uncomfortable, but she didn't want to hurt my feelings, and in the end, it all ended even worse than it could have if she'd never given me any false hope in the first place.

So, yeah, watching this Donnie/April thing is really uncomfortable because it's almost exactly the same thing. He's being a creepy stalker, she's encouraging him with mixed signals, and it can't end well no matter what, and if it does, WOW, what an awful lesson to send to kids. "100 No's and a Yes, means Yes, so just keep at it, guys, you'll wear her down eventually." Awful. Seriously sick.

[victory_angel]

Stalker no. Stalkers are people who follow and obsess over someone in a manner that makes them feel threatened. April doesn't feel threatened by Donnie, weirded out at times initially but not threatened. If she was threatened by him she would have certainly brought it up to his brothers or Splinter or stopped visiting the lair.

Creepy maybe. But would you have any understanding of how to approch and talk to someone you liked if you've only been surrounded by the people of your same gender your whole life?