Fantastic 4, suffering the same fate as TMNT (2014)?

[NinjaPug]

Trank's problem with F4 was that he received zero interference from Fox when he made Chronicle. He got to do what he wanted with no pushback from Fox. He was naive and expected the same thing with F4 despite Fox shelling out a lot more money for the budget. When he received pressure from Fox he obviously didn't handle it well. Plenty of directors have made good movies while dealing with crap from studios. Hopefully Trank rebounds.

[PangolinFeets]

All the F4 movies are awful so this isn't surprising. Fantastic Four are barely interesting as it is. The only reason I like them in the comics is because they had a lot of room to flesh out and Reed finally kinda retired into just being a 'smart guy'. If anything, make it a TV series.


If they decide to keep plugging ahead, I hope they just skip everything and go for a Franklin Richard's movie. That would at least be visually and conceptually entertaining.

[TrickOrTreater]

Believe it or not, this FF PoS movie had a very similar production to BayTurtles PoS.

And they both suck balls.

Even though they didn't have to.

It's a bummer.

[ranger_scout]

Fantastic Four received a "C-" from Cinemascore.

http://comicbook.com/2015/08/08/fant...rom-audiences/

That is much lower than the "B" that TMNT (2014) received. Plus, it's compared day gross is abysmal compared to the opening day of TMNT (2014). It earned $11.3 million while Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles earned $25.6 million.

http://www.comingsoon.net/movies/new...riday#/slide/1

[Foombamaroom]

I think the controversy kinda helped TMNT. After the second trailer, the hate started dying down a little because the movie looked decent.

The difference between TMNT and F4 is that TMNT didn't take itself too seriously. It basically knew that it was going to be a Bay movie and it was just made for action/explosions. F4 was trying to be a good movie, and it crashed and burned. There were re-shoots for TMNT, but us fans caused those re-shoots (Shredder.). These re-shoots were based on studio/director disagreements. Plus, F4 was just flat out terrible. At least TMNT had the Turtles, the only good things about the movie.

All honesty, though, I thought the actors of F4 would've been great if they had more to work with. Miles Teller was a decent Reed, and Jordan, Mara, and Bell were decent, too. I really liked the way they portrayed Victor in the first half of the movie (I saw it online, wasn't gonna see it in theatres.). When he becomes Doom... his motivations are nonexistent. Although Doom's powers are cool and all, it just... It didn't feel like Doom. Honestly, the way he was portrayed... It felt more like Terminator.

[jenna]

Somewhere between Iron Man and the Avengers, Marvel suddenly got the stamp of approval from generic movie-goers and now they're churning them out faster than they can write them. They've run out of new property and are now re-doing the rounds, assuming that by slapping the Marvel brand on something they'll bring in the big ££££s.

Daredevil on Netflix - which is genuinely extraordinary writing - excepted, the thought and quality that's going into these things are getting poorer and poorer.

Is it any wonder fans get upset at their incompetence and that last minute panics result?

There are a lot of comic adaptions out there. So far the only ones that have struck a chord with me are Nolan's Dark Knight trilogy and Daredevil on Netflix. They've not been churned out, they've been expertly crafted.

That's the treatment turtles deserves.

[TrickOrTreater]

Originally Posted by jenna

Somewhere between Iron Man and the Avengers, Marvel suddenly got the stamp of approval from generic movie-goers and now they're churning them out faster than they can write them. They've run out of new property and are now re-doing the rounds, assuming that by slapping the Marvel brand on something they'll bring in the big ££££s.

Daredevil on Netflix - which is genuinely extraordinary writing - excepted, the thought and quality that's going into these things are getting poorer and poorer.

Is it any wonder fans get upset at their incompetence and that last minute panics result?

There are a lot of comic adaptions out there. So far the only ones that have struck a chord with me are Nolan's Dark Knight trilogy and Daredevil on Netflix. They've not been churned out, they've been expertly crafted.

That's the treatment turtles deserves.

...you are aware that Marvel Studios had nothing to do with Fantfourstic right?

This was a 20th Century Fox movie based on Marvel characters, not a Marvel Studios movie.

[Wildcat]

Well I'm not really a Fantastic 4 fan. I saw the first live action movie and that's about it but sounds like another case of fan whining over some differences in portrayal and the studio listening to it which is not something you wanna do.

Whoever steps in to authorize these kind of changes needs to turn off their internet service. Seriously how hard is it to ignore the internet?...where everything is "worst thing evAr!"

[jenna]

Originally Posted by TrickOrTreater

...you are aware that Marvel Studios had nothing to do with Fantfourstic right?

This was a 20th Century Fox movie based on Marvel characters, not a Marvel Studios movie.

Yeah - sorry - I was referring to Marvel property, not Marvel Studios.

Just that the "Marvel" name has really increased in popularity, creating high demand for comic book adaptions.

[IndigoErth]

Originally Posted by Wildcat

Whoever steps in to authorize these kind of changes needs to turn off their internet service. Seriously how hard is it to ignore the internet?...where everything is "worst thing evAr!"

Starting to wonder if there is a line where "worst thing" is allowed to be legit.

I mean, they do need to consider the people who are the most likely to give them money, because to them film is after all a product to sell, so... could be a reason they have some amount of interest in what the bigger consensus is saying.


Besides... if complaints push them to try at least a little harder (e.g. adding at least a few Foot ninjas this time), why is it bad. If actually listening to an audience results in a film they'd be happier with and it does better and gets better praise and looks good on the film makers...then it's a win-win.

[Powder]

If the PD guys hadn't listened to the fans (albeit at a bare minimum) their film would've tanked like this as well...

[TrickOrTreater]

Originally Posted by Wildcat

Well I'm not really a Fantastic 4 fan. I saw the first live action movie and that's about it but sounds like another case of fan whining over some differences in portrayal and the studio listening to it which is not something you wanna do.

Whoever steps in to authorize these kind of changes needs to turn off their internet service. Seriously how hard is it to ignore the internet?...where everything is "worst thing evAr!"

Oh be quiet. Literally the only changes that were made because of "fan complaining" were two name changes.

Victor Domashev(stupid decision in the first place) became Victor Von Doom so he was AT LEAST Doom in Name Only. Everything else about him apparently sucked anyway.

And Harvey Elder was changed to General Allen or whatever the f*ck.

Reshooting a 1/3 of the movie, about 40 minutes worth and hacking the thing up was all on FOX and their insecurities.

As well as Trank not being able to deliver anything good to begin with probably.

Fans complained about a lot of other stuff too throughout production and none of that was changed.

So this bullsh*t you keep going on about "fan complaining" can stop.

It's a sh*tty movie because it's a sh*tty movie. Has nothing to do with the fans.

EDIT: And it's not just fans that hate this sh*t movie. Critics do, and the general audience does as well, giving it a C- on CinemaScore.

[Bry]

Originally Posted by ranger_scout

Fantastic Four received a "C-" from Cinemascore.

http://comicbook.com/2015/08/08/fant...rom-audiences/

That is much lower than the "B" that TMNT (2014) received. Plus, it's compared day gross is abysmal compared to the opening day of TMNT (2014). It earned $11.3 million while Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles earned $25.6 million.

http://www.comingsoon.net/movies/new...riday#/slide/1

Cinemascores are weird. They're polled on opening night, among audiences that are the most excited to see the movie in question, and tend to score higher than you'd expect on average for that kind of rating system. The vast majority of movies get a B or higher, based on what I've read. My understanding is that basically anything B or lower is considered less-than-great, and a C or lower is pretty dire.

[Redeemer]

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

http://i.imgur.com/q5tmtch.jpg

I don't really know squat about Fantastic 4 to be honest, but even then that premise is just...

Did...did... these people go to school with the Turtle's people? Did stupid ideas get an A+ in screen writing class?

Question is though, will they find an old video game strategy guide book and learn powers from it? Unless they do that, then Bay Turtles is still the master at this.

They probably did, especially with the politically correct "Everyone Wins, Nobody losses" our society has developed.

[Wildcat]

Originally Posted by IndigoErth

Starting to wonder if there is a line where "worst thing" is allowed to be legit.

I mean, they do need to consider the people who are the most likely to give them money, because to them film is after all a product to sell, so... could be a reason they have some amount of interest in what the bigger consensus is saying.


Besides... if complaints push them to try at least a little harder (e.g. adding at least a few Foot ninjas this time), why is it bad. If actually listening to an audience results in a film they'd be happier with and it does better and gets better praise and looks good on the film makers...then it's a win-win.

But by the sound of it, listening to internet complaints, they're going back and reconstructing an already layed out movie.

Which is worse than whatever character/plot etc changes they were doing in the beginning. Now, most likely, the movie ends ups being cobbled together just to please fans complaining about things that were not that big a deal in the first place.

I don't see how any studio could even let complaining on the internet influence their production. It's the movie industry...but wait let's not anger message board users and bloggers.

[Leo656]

So it's a bad idea to pay attention to people who know more about the story/characters than you do? Interesting theory, but I'm afraid it's not very sound. People developing licensed properties SHOULD listen to their audience, they're the ones paying the money, and frankly, very few studio people even know what the property they're trying to adapt is even about, they just know it's popular.

Like, I don't know a damn thing about Dr. Strange. If I'm making the Dr. Strange movie, like if it wasn't my choice and I was assigned the project... do I wanna just insist I'm an "artist" and know what I'm doing, do it all "My Way" and insist it'll be great because I'm me and "I know better", or should I take into consideration the ideas and feelings of people who are a lot more familiar with and interested in the character than I am?

"F** the fans, I know better, I'm the guy wearing a suit"... I don't think that's a very good approach, frankly. I think you need to listen to your audience, not just be different for different's sake.

[TurtleTitan97]

Originally Posted by Wildcat

But by the sound of it, listening to internet complaints, they're going back and reconstructing an already layed out movie.

Which is worse than whatever character/plot etc changes they were doing in the beginning. Now, most likely, the movie ends ups being cobbled together just to please fans complaining about things that were not that big a deal in the first place.

I don't see how any studio could even let complaining on the internet influence their production. It's the movie industry...but wait let's not anger message board users and bloggers.

You said so yourself that you weren't a fan of the Fantastic Four. If you realize what they were doing with this movie, you'd be mad too, even before the rehoots. Especially considering how we have never gotten a GOOD F4 movie AT ALL. This movie was literally doomed to fail.

[IndigoErth]

Fans/internet... lol A film that's going to be bad, probably started off that way from page one. Probably before it.

If you want to take a property and make a film for it but have not yet put in an appropriately large amount of research, learned the in's and out's and gotten a feel of the important parts and understand why it's important - if that hasn't happened or has only scratched the surface with what you think are "the basics," then put down the Microsoft Word (or what ever the heck you're writing it with) until you DO. Do not move forward or pass go until you study extensively and GET. IT. Because jumping the gun is probably how you end up with Colonel Schrader, ninja books, missing and disconnected elements that are important and so on. And there is no excuse for that. If you're going into it relatively clueless - to the point you can't even talk to the media as if you understand it - then that is not the fan's fault for complaining, it's your fault from failing to do the required leg work from the start. And if you don't have the interest required to do the leg work, then put down the property. To do otherwise or expect it doesn't matter...you're basically a fully color blind child trying to paint a rainbow and everyone is supposed to nod and tell you it's pretty.

[Leo656]

You're a poet, seriously.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Indigo, why oh why have you never given writing a try? I bet you'd pen some great TMNT fics. You have such a flare for the poetic.