Who is your favorite TMNT.

[Rooish]

Hm, that's a good question. I know that the people who make FF are (sort of) in collaberation with Peter Laird, but I nonetheless don't consider FF to convey any sort of "official" information about the TMNT. From what I've heard (I don't watch it as I don't have a TV and haven't bought the DVDs for my computer), FF is kind of crappy anyway.

But anyway, Mikey best at redirecting his chi? In the cartoons, maybe he is. But I think this is sort of a statement meant to appeal to the plethora of Mikey fans. Kids (and I, apparently) love Mikey, and although he goofs off, they like to know that Mikey actually has some sort of talent going for him. So the series makes up vague things like "he's best at redirecting his chi" or "he has the most inate potential," which are hard to quantify or show. My suspicion is that it keeps the kids happy. Because otherwise Mikey wouldn't have any talents like the others do--Leo's leadership, Don's smarts, Raph's strength.

Mikey is my favourite Turtle and I know that he has a lot of creative and playful ways of kicking butt, but I don't consider him the most spiritually enlightened because I haven't seen much evidence of that from Peter Laird; it all seems to me to be a gimmick to please young Mikey fans. I like him for his flaws, I guess.

[Aignatius]

Sure, a lot of the Mirage stories point to Don being spiritual. Then there's other manifestations point to him as being not so spiritual but more, say, existentialist.
And I agree, Leo is also very spiritual. It depends on the writer's POV I suppose on who is more spiritual.

[triplexxx]

I consider it some sort of conflict between Leonardo and Michaelangelo. While Leonardo does have more discipline than Michaelangelo, Michaelangelo has more of a positive mental attitude than Leonardo. Both of these characteristics, I believe, are vital for spiritual growth. I believe its Leonardo's and Michaelangelo's pride and egos that sometimes get the better of them, and it keeps them from attaining the one of these two characteristics they each lack (notice, I didn't say lack "completely"). As for Donatello, even though he's pretty positive, he's not as free-spirited and more grounded than Michaelangelo; I'd say it's more of intellectual enlightenment, rather than spiritual enlightenment. But don't get me wrong, I think splinter made them all pretty spiritually enlightened, how else would they have been able to accomplish everything they did in the Lost Season?

[Ramboraph4life aka Matt]

Raphael will always be my favorite. I guess with everybody they always think of their favorite characters with 3-Dimensional eyes. Mikey, Leo, and Don all have 3-dimensional characteristics...but for me Raph's is the most interesting (Mikey is my close second fave).

I guess I always loved the loner type heroes...hell my 3 favorite characters of all time are Raphael, Rambo, and Ash from Evil Dead. The idea that sometimes you can only count on yourself, just resonates with me....and it's especially with Raph who feels like a man against the world.

All the turtles have there own inner demons...some of them like Mikey hide it better than others. But Raph I think definately has the darkest....the classic beast within himself. Maybe because he hates the possibility of a normal life taken away with no choice, no freedom. And most teenagers major notion is for freedom, whether to go to college, get their own apartment, raise a family of their own, etc. And he knows it and fights it, which to me makes him a classic example of a true hero....not only must there be a fight in the world, but in oneself and Raph definately takes that to heart. It's a dynamic battle and notion....it creates emotional baggage and arc....maybe that's why Raph is used a lot in the movie.

I love Raphael because his journey mimics many action films, which i'm a huge fan of....the imperfect hero.....one's journey from the darkness to the light. Plus he's willing to kick ass and take names, and there's nothing wrong with that lol. And yet as seen many times, especially with Mikey, his heart is there. Especially when a family is in need. And maybe with this path of darkness, there's a knowledge and wisdom he'll have for the future....so he can help his family in need not just physically, but emotionally...simply cause he's been there, down that road a time or two before.

Plus it's easiest for me to see Raphael in violent battles...which i must admit i'm a sucker for lol being a huge fan of horror and action...although Leo truthfully would be too. But Raph...i don't know for me I think of Raph in that league of Rambo, Snake Plissken, Dirty Harry (lol would that make Mikey like Jack Burton in Big Trouble in Little China lol)....or maybe it's just me kidding myself lol. When i try to think of stories to right (mostly horror/action stories) Raph just feels right as the go to guy for them. The spit against authority attitude, the violent yet heroic spirit, and the willingness to take matters to the next bloody level when necessary.

Plus I always loved Raphael and Mikey's relationship...the whole 'two sides of the same coin' notion. The funny, buddy cop like banter (Mikey and Raph for Rush Hour 4 anybody? lol). That's my favorite part of the new toons, and hopefully in the new movie.

Anyway sorry for the length of this lol.

[Rooish]

I see your points; all have some sort of spirituality in his own way. Don did have his moments in the comics (that one where he went nuts and became a shaman, anyone?) and he's always been pretty philosophical. Mikey is enlightened in a way, because he has such a positive outlook, and it takes a lot of work to get that mindset. Either that or he's just cluelessly happy (ignorance is bliss).

raphroehler2003, I agree with you about Raph's and Mikey's relationship. I think I talk about them too much already. I wouldn't get your hopes up for seeing much of their relationship in the new movie, because it won't have time to develop all of the relationships very well. The 2k3 toon, though, shows a very close love-hate relationship between Raph and Mike that is delightful to watch. In my opinion, it seems like a very realistic brotherly bond (although since they have all been stuck together for 15 years in a sewer, I doubt any of the boys would actually get along quite so well as they are shown to).

I agree that Raph has the most developed character in the TMNT universe, but I think he and Don get gyped a bit in the new toon.

[Sage Ninja]

Originally Posted by Rooish

Hm, that's a good question. I know that the people who make FF are (sort of) in collaberation with Peter Laird, but I nonetheless don't consider FF to convey any sort of "official" information about the TMNT. From what I've heard (I don't watch it as I don't have a TV and haven't bought the DVDs for my computer), FF is kind of crappy anyway.

I agree FF is a far cry from what the true TMNT is ment to be represented as. Just about all the characters have been simplified to the point at is painful. Just look at what they did to Splinter! I take anything that is said about any of the charcteers and thier abilties with a grain of salt.

But anyway, Mikey best at redirecting his chi? In the cartoons, maybe he is. But I think this is sort of a statement meant to appeal to the plethora of Mikey fans. Kids (and I, apparently) love Mikey, and although he goofs off, they like to know that Mikey actually has some sort of talent going for him. So the series makes up vague things like "he's best at redirecting his chi" or "he has the most inate potential," which are hard to quantify or show. My suspicion is that it keeps the kids happy. Because otherwise Mikey wouldn't have any talents like the others do--Leo's leadership, Don's smarts, Raph's strength.

I think it is too. The writters seem to like to come up with these little talents or traits that Mikey supposedly has but never capalise on them or explore them. In fact you never see any of these special traits of Mikey's except in text book fan bio's and never see any evidence of them at all in the show. Mikey is the only turtle that doesn't posses a definable niche in the group which could be an interesting character dynamic to play up and make him evolve but they don't. Except to occasianlly mention once or twice through out the series with nothing to back it up.

Mikey is my favourite Turtle and I know that he has a lot of creative and playful ways of kicking butt, but I don't consider him the most spiritually enlightened because I haven't seen much evidence of that from Peter Laird; it all seems to me to be a gimmick to please young Mikey fans

I think thats tottally the case that the writters only say these things to appeal to the younger kiddies instead of actually incorporating what they claim into his character. And I think its because Mikey is considered the "kids audiance" turtle so they leave his character alone with just gimmicky things thown out at random with no back up thining that it will sufice the kiddies (and forgetting that Mikey has fans from the older age group as well) and in turn concentrat on Don, Leo, amnd Raph who have been stero-typed as "the older peoples audiance" turtles and there for give them more nuanced and indepth character traits, that is actually shown and explored through out the series. Its a bit sad really and biased too.

But I guess we have to an extent Peter Laird and Keven Eastman to blame for that. Don't quote me on this but I believe I've heard it said that the two have always had trouble writting for Michaelangelo's character because of how light hearted his character is. Perhaps that wjhy there isn't any concret evidence of his other traits and talents that the other turtles have, which leave the writters to make vague refrences to his abilties. At least that what i have heard so no please kill me for saying it.

[Time Mistress]

A few thoughts on Mike:

1. He's the team optimist and prankser. I think it's evident that IF Mike does have a defined roll on the team it's "morale." Both he and Donny are the team peacemakers, but Mike is the one who is more likely to do something about it imediately whereas Don goes of into his room to invent stuff and waits for it all to blow over. It's once Mike's jokes and "lighten up" antics fail that Don become the more useful peacemaker of the two. But Mike is the most empathic Turtle which explains why he gets along the best with just about everybody - including humans, kids, and animals. He's the best liason to the human world of the four, so maybe that's also another team strength.

2. He's the team innocent. The child. The baby brother. And as a result, he's the one most set up to be "saved" by Splinter or one of his brothers. Unfortunately, it also ends up caling his ninja skills into question when he should be equal with the others.

3. The comics show Mike's evolution better than the other mediums I think. Mike isn't just into comics, he's into most all literature. He writes novels, keeps an journal, etc. Leo always has a plan. Don is the stratigist. But Mike is an instictual and the most creative fighter. Raph relys on instict too (as well as power) but his rage can cause him to fight sloppy.

4. Potential is a word that's used a lot to sum up Mike, especially in terms of fighting. Is he really the most athletic? The most naturally talented? I think there has been some evidence of his agility in the new toon, but it's more implied than stated outright (such as shots where Mike will be walking a tightrope on his hands while the others rely on feet.) The Turtles in Space arc shows that is is the best pickpocket and perhaps the best at the ninja art of concealment of the four. He's good for running distractions. As for weapons talent, I think there is a certain degree of natually athleticism/quick movement required more for the nunchuks than other ninja weapons because it is a "flexible weapon" and Mike has a greater natural adeptness than the others for flexible weapons. But they are all experts in their own unique weapons catagories so you can't say Mike is more skilled than any of his brothers, just that he's the best suited for his weapon as they all are.

5. Another potential aspect of Mike's is speed. He might just be the fastest Turtle on the battlefield. At least one comic (Veitch's The River) stated that Mike has the fastest reflexes of the four (I think), which again ties in with his weapon catagory. Mike seems to be the fastest Turtle in the video games based on the new toon and the Lost Season has his tap into his chi power or whatever during a race. His fighting style in the new toon tends to involve a lot of dodging, and tauting of his opponent being too slow until he is able to get in a few good hits. (Just witness how he beats Raph.) Of course Mike is also overconfident and easily distracted on the battlefield in which case my second point comes into play (i.e. needs rescuing). Either than or those quick reflexes come in handy.

That's my 2 cents for now anyway.

[poobone]

My favorite turtle has always been Leonardo, because he has swords, and growing up, I watched a lot of movies like Conan, Willow, and even the awful Red Sonja, so Leo was cool cuz he had swords. Nowadays I think I'm more of a Donatello fan, just due to his personality.... but then the new cartoon has me gravitating back towards Leo's more complex personality.

But definitely Michelangelo has the most fans around where I'm from, cuz he's funny and likes to party.

[Sage Ninja]

Originally Posted by Time Mistress

A few thoughts on Mike:

He's the team optimist and prankser. I think it's evident that IF Mike does have a defined roll on the team it's "morale." Both he and Donny are the team peacemakers, but Mike is the one who is more likely to do something about it imediately whereas Don goes of into his room to invent stuff and waits for it all to blow over. It's once Mike's jokes and "lighten up" antics fail that Don become the more useful peacemaker of the two. But Mike is the most empathic Turtle which explains why he gets along the best with just about everybody - including humans, kids, and animals. He's the best liason to the human world of the four, so maybe that's also another team strength.

yeah, but if his nich is "moral" or "peace maker" its one that is easily, filled in by Donatello, and there for not his alone. In fact (in the new toon at least) the role of over all peace maker and is Dontello's department. It was pretty said so in the New toon in the episode Same as it Never Was that with out Donatello's "voice of reason" the whole team/family fell apart. So as far as "peace maker" goes the more important contributor is Donatello. Which leaves Mikey with out a talent that is his jusdiction alone, unlike Leo, Don, and Raph who have talents that are theres alone.

He's the team innocent. The child. The baby brother. And as a result, he's the one most set up to be "saved" by Splinter or one of his brothers. Unfortunately, it also ends up calling his ninja skills into question when he should be equal with the others.

I like that Michaelangelo has a innocent way about him. It is a great paradox for some one like him to have since he is a warrior that fights and occasinally has to kill and has all these grey areas that play in his life but yet he still maintains an innocent empathitic out look on things. And as for the needing rescued thing. I'm ok with it but when it happens to often and it becomes that he has to be baby sat in battle thats when it becomes annoying. I remember in season four there was a string of episodes back to back where Mikey would get in trouble and Donatello was always saving him. It got a bit annoying.

The comics show Mike's evolution better than the other mediums I think. Mike isn't just into comics, he's into most all literature. He writes novels, keeps an journal, etc. Leo always has a plan. Don is the stratigist. But Mike is an instictual and the most creative fighter. Raph relys on instict too (as well as power) but his rage can cause him to fight sloppy.

I've never really read the comics but every thing you have just mentioned sounds really interesting and...sophisticated that almost sounds alien to his character. I wish I could see this Michaelangelo incorporated into the media. i eman don't get me wrong I've always loved Michaelangelo but I feel they have relied on sterotypes for the most part to sell his character.

Another potential aspect of Mike's is speed. He might just be the fastest Turtle on the battlefield. At least one comic (Veitch's The River) stated that Mike has the fastest reflexes of the four (I think), which again ties in with his weapon catagory. Mike seems to be the fastest Turtle in the video games based on the new toon and the Lost Season has his tap into his chi power or whatever during a race. His fighting style in the new toon tends to involve a lot of dodging, and tauting of his opponent being too slow until he is able to get in a few good hits. (Just witness how he beats Raph.) Of course Mike is also overconfident and easily distracted on the battlefield in which case my second point comes into play (i.e. needs rescuing). Either than or those quick reflexes come in handy.

Mikey does appear to be something of an endurance fighter. He must have loads of stanima to be able to wear his oppenents down. But he seems to be a good fighter regardless with out all the dodging and the taunts. I resently watched "meet Casey Jones and I was shocked at how well Michaelangelo was against Raphael (whom I also felt was up there with Leo) and was actually nocking him around and was to genuanly able to beat him in a sparring match with just his own skill. You never see Mikey able to that later on in the series, and it makes me wonder why. He has the skills to beat Raph if he wanted to but rected fearfully and practically ran away from him in the Battle Nexus episodes when they got paired up. After that incindent in the Casey Jones episode any time Mikey comes up against Raphael he is dominated by him (actually he doesn't even try to really fight back any more, you notice that). And I really take Mikey is the fastes turtle of the bunch with a grain of salt, because they all appear very quick and agile to me.[/QUOTE]

Potential is a word that's used a lot to sum up Mike, especially in terms of fighting. Is he really the most athletic? The most naturally talented? I think there has been some evidence of his agility in the new toon, but it's more implied than stated outright (such as shots where Mike will be walking a tightrope on his hands while the others rely on feet.) The Turtles in Space arc shows that is is the best pickpocket and perhaps the best at the ninja art of concealment of the four. He's good for running distractions. As for weapons talent, I think there is a certain degree of natually athleticism/quick movement required more for the nunchuks than other ninja weapons because it is a "flexible weapon" and Mike has a greater natural adeptness than the others for flexible weapons. But they are all experts in their own unique weapons catagories so you can't say Mike is more skilled than any of his brothers, just that he's the best suited for his weapon as they all are.

I think his potentical is more than just his fighting abilites and physical prowess. For the reasons that you have mentioned i think his physical potenticial as a fighter is more or less there even though it is not adressed as strongely as Don's technicall genious or Leo's affinity with ninjitsu. But I think that Mikey's intellectual prowess intution is also hinted at (but not played up as much) potentical is there as well. On a whole Mikey isn't seen as being particulary smart but occasiannly he comes up with whoppers that occasinally shock his brothers. So how smart is Mikey really? Its not so apparant that he is a idiot in the new toon, like he is portrayed in other mediums. He can also be rather perceptive and intutive on occasion as well. You through all Mikey's facets but his mental capibalites. What are your thoughts on that Time Mistress?

[triplexxx]

Originally Posted by Sage Ninja

Which leaves Mikey with out a talent that is his jusdiction alone, unlike Leo, Don, and Raph who have talents that are theres alone.

Just for clarification, it's not literally that their talents are "their's alone"; they're just more dominant than their brothers, there's a difference. Like you said, Michaelangelo is agile, but so are the others. Same for Raphael; he's strong, but so are the others. And Leonardo; he's very skilled and strategic, but the others are very skilled too and can strategize too when situations call for it, especially Donatello. And Donatello; well he may stand alone in the area of science smart, but there's two types of smarts, science smart and street smart, in the science smarts he's dominant, but not really in street smarts.

[Masked Ninja]

My personal version of Michelangelo (aka, what I'd write in my own TMNT story... aka my favorite characteristics mashed together) would be like this:

(warning: long personality overanalysis ahead! my brain got bored and my fingers just kept typing )


Mike's the one who keeps the others from getting too serious, but not solely in a comic relief kind of way. Being so readily social, he's just naturally able to get everyone (even Leo) to join in whatever fun he's cooking up without being overbearing or annoying about it. That said, he does enjoy bad/lame jokes and tells them partially because he thinks they're funny and partially because the "uuuugh" reactions from his bros cracks him up as much as the jokes. This does earn him the occasional headwhap from Raph, but he knows it's not administered out of pure annoyance, so he just savors the attention, maybe reciprocating with some playful jabs of his own. He's rarely happier than when having a good time with his family, or even friends of the family - just a social creature by nature. Of course, he's perfectly capable of being serious when the situation needs it, and he can usually tell when those times are.

Though light-hearted overall, Mikey isn't immune to depression, which in his case usually comes from their separation from the human world. He'd love nothing more than to be able to walk the city streets and socialize with all the people he came into contact with, but he can't. He also probably feels the strongest guilt for the people he and his brothers kill, self defense or not, and occasionally this will hit home. He's also sensitive to negative comments from his brothers, whose opinions he values very highly. Whatever's making Mike feel down, he'll usually go hide himself somewhere to be sad about it, worrying that his brothers may think differently of him if they ever saw him this way... perhaps then his peacemaking skills wouldn't be as effective? Extreme cases see Mikey sneaking to Splinter's side for emotional support, but he tries to keep this rare. His brothers are pretty perceptive, however, and can tell when he's upset... especially when he mysteriously disappears for several hours.

Fights in general are kind of a love/hate thing for Mikey. He hates having to kill people, but at the same time he loves being outside in the open air. He also loves feeling part of the team in whatever missions they have to accomplish. And the guilt doesn't even come until after the battle - during, it's almost a game for him as he outmaneuvers the enemy with as much style as he can afford.

Just like sadness, Mikey shows outward anger sparingly. When he does get visibly angry, it's rather scary because you know there's enough built up that he can't conceal it any more. In family situations Mike's anger is the scary silent type... in terms of enemies (say, a ninja jumps out of nowhere and kills Don) he's more liable to go into a Raph-like rage, but it would take a severe hurt to do that, probably related to an injury to his family (as evidenced by the example), to which he's fiercely loyal.

While he enjoys training enough, after a while Mikey gets bored with it and goes off to do something fun. These will include video games, reading (comic books or whatever books they've collected over the years... they're all great to lose himself in), or even art. It's one of those far-flung dreams of his to one day draw comic books, or even write a best-selling novel. He's got natural talent in the martial arts, and if he had the drive or focus to surpass Leonardo he would most likely be able to do it... but he doesn't place much importance on being the "best," perferring to have fun with life. And while he's never even thought about it, his rising to the position of top fighter would probably change his relationship with Leonardo to be pretty uncomfortable, and he would regret it once he got there.

Mikey gets along best with Raph, who he finds to be more fun to hang around with than Leo or Don, who are less social and more focused on their own interests. Videogame tournaments and practical jokes are common, as well as the type of silliness Leo or Don may not allow themselves to participate in. Raph sometimes feels like Mikey's the one who understands him the most, and instinctively gravitates to him when having emotional issues (often when he sneaks back into the lair after storming topside for whatever reason)

As for Leo, Mikey looks up to him as a big brother and shining example. Of course he believes Leo could stand to lighten up a lot, but he respects him for what he does for the family. He's also able to bring out a little bit of Leo's fun side, which he enjoys doing. Leo appreciates Mike for his peacemaker personality, and doesn't underestimate his skill like Don or Raph might on occasion - good especially for impromptu battle plans. He sees Mikey's potential and wishes he'd work harder to achieve it, but if Mikey ever surpassed him he honestly wouldn't know how to react.

Mikey feels like he knows Don the least, mainly because Don likes to spend a lot of time by himself and this doesn't compute to Mike's social-butterfly brain. They can have fun together easily enough, but sometimes Mikey feels like he just doesn't know Don well enough, like they think on totally different planes. Don, on the other hand, loves spending time with Mikey... though he does get annoyed whenever his "alone time" is disrupted. He also wishes Mikey would apply himself to something a little bit more, not seeing as much value in his younger brother's sketches and writings as Mikey himself does. (could be the left-brainedness in him?)

As I've said many times, I can't pick a favorite Turtle very easily anymore, and even when I try it seems to change alot. But this would probably be my favorite Michelangelo. I see a hint of this Mikey in a few of the new movie posters - the one where he's actually got his serious face on. For whatever reason, those make me really happy. Too bad Mikey's obviously going to be more extreme and silly and maybe a little ADHD in the actual movie. But if I get to see at least one serious face from him, I'll be satisfied.

...heaven forbid I try something like this for the other Turtles. That was a lot of words.

[Time Mistress]

Some well thought out posts. As far as Mike's intelligence goes I think he's very smart. He's not the genius Don is, but I think he's as smart as Raph or Leo. Mike's smarts however are of the creative kind. He's the most left brained of all the Turtles. Don the scientist, Mike's the artist and writer. The most like his namesake of all of the four. When it comes to how this applies to his ninjitsu, it's harder to say. I think it gives him the ability to think fast - like when he and Don were falling off the roof in one ep, and Mike came up with a quick way to save them both. I think his creativity allows him to be an unpredictable opponent, that keeps his enemies on their toes. Some might call his fighting chaotic, or making it up on the fly, but I think Mike's style of thinking allows him to read the body language of his opponent and use their emothional state to his advantage whenever possible. It certainly seems to work on Raph.

[Rooish]

Hm, that's a really good analysis, Masked Ninja. The one thing I must ask about is Mike's relationship with Don. Those two spend a lot of time together in most of the TMNT mediums. I definitely get that Mike doesn't get Don sometimes, finding him distant. But they definitely seem to have a good rapport, although I can imagine that Don might get more out of their relationship in terms of emotional connection. Mike is so friendly that everyone feels loved by him, and even Don needs love, sometimes. But they do have some things in common--they are less interested in training, they are less confrontational and egotistical, and they are peacemakers. I can see them understanding each other in that way.

I always saw Mike as being the least close with Leo, although Mike looks up to Leo and Leo wants to protect Mike and help him reach his full potential. Sometimes they have cheerful fun together. But Leo is so hard and cold sometimes, and he's such a perfectionist, and he's so responsible and proud. I'd think Mike would have difficulty understanding Leo.

I think Mike and Raph were the best of friends when they were younger. Then Raph got more depressed and angry, and he also started seeking more power. This lead to Raph's conflicts with Leo, but also to his closeness with Leo (shown especially in the movies and new toon). So Mike settled more for Don's companionship. I think that Mike misses Raph and wishes they could just have fun together again, but Raph is focused on Leo now. They still have good times, but I don't think they get each other quite as much when Raph is competing with Leo.

Poor Mikey.

[Masked Ninja]

Originally Posted by Rooish

Hm, that's a really good analysis, Masked Ninja. The one thing I must ask about is Mike's relationship with Don. Those two spend a lot of time together in most of the TMNT mediums. I definitely get that Mike doesn't get Don sometimes, finding him distant. But they definitely seem to have a good rapport, although I can imagine that Don might get more out of their relationship in terms of emotional connection. Mike is so friendly that everyone feels loved by him, and even Don needs love, sometimes. But they do have some things in common--they are less interested in training, they are less confrontational and egotistical, and they are peacemakers. I can see them understanding each other in that way.

As far as I see it, they get along great day to day... and as much as Don loves his work, I'm sure he loves hanging out with Mikey to give his mind a break when he's working on a project. But as great as they get along, I see Mike feeling a little barrier between himself and Don just because they think so differently. Mikey is extremely right-brained, Don's very left-brained. They enjoy some of the same stuff, but on certain levels it just doesn't compute. It's more what Mike feels than what actually shows on the surface. Like sometimes he might not feel smart enough to truly relate to his brother. That kinda thing.

I always saw Mike as being the least close with Leo, although Mike looks up to Leo and Leo wants to protect Mike and help him reach his full potential. Sometimes they have cheerful fun together. But Leo is so hard and cold sometimes, and he's such a perfectionist, and he's so responsible and proud. I'd think Mike would have difficulty understanding Leo.

Heh, I think Leo has a fun side that he hides most of the time, and Mikey knows about it. So he tries to bring that out as much as he can during normal family time. He's not always successful, but he's sure better at it than his other brothers. But yeah, there's a barrier there, too. When Leo is in no mood for fun, no fun happens, no matter how Mikey tries. Again, I can see Mikey looking up and seeing Leo and thinking "I wish I were like that." He's perfect for his role in the team, but I think there's a little bit of perfectionism that usually gets buried under his tendency to procrastinate or daydream. I can see him having some self-esteem issues because of this - he sees he's not as dedicated as Leo, not as brilliant as Don, not as powerful as Raph... and he fails to see his own potential and what he's already good for.

Heh, I might have to write out my thoughts for each turtle at some point, because overanalysis like this feels like stretching for my brain. I'll say this right now though... I prefer Don to be more the handyturtle and Mr. Fixit than being able to create technology beyond anything humankind has ...out of garbage. It feels a little more realistic to me that way.

And I know, using the term "realistic" in regards to TMNT is rather silly.

Oh, and that's a good observation on Mike's relationship with Raph. It does make good sense.

[Rooish]

Character analysis is fun, eh? One time I tried to explain my interpretation of all the Turtles' relationships to one of my friends. I don't think she cared as much as I do.

Good point about Mikey with Leo and Don.

[Warhorse]

Hey, keep up the character analysis thing you all got going. It's fun to read, and really makes the characters three dimentional.

[heretic888]

Originally Posted by Masked Ninja

Again, I can see Mikey looking up and seeing Leo and thinking "I wish I were like that." He's perfect for his role in the team, but I think there's a little bit of perfectionism that usually gets buried under his tendency to procrastinate or daydream. I can see him having some self-esteem issues because of this - he sees he's not as dedicated as Leo, not as brilliant as Don, not as powerful as Raph... and he fails to see his own potential and what he's already good for.

Uhhh.... which version of Michelangelo are we talking about here??

In the new toon, Mike is the reigning Battle Nexus champion and defeated both Raphael and Kluh to prove it. And, in the unreleased "lost season", he mastered the technique of blinding speed, something none of his other brothers can do. I don't think he has any "self esteem" issues in this medium.

In the comic, Mike is much more emotionally mature and self-assured. He has defeated Raph twice in sparring (issue 2 and the Raphael one-shot), so I don't think he has any doubts about his combat ability. And, unlike the new toon, Mike actually has a bevy of artistic talents in the new comic.

No offense, guys, but I think you are reading truckloads into these characters that just isn't there.

[Jo Dawn]

Dude... where have you been?!

It's, like... the Mikey-Authority...

[Rooish]

Who is the Mikey-Authority?

[Masked Ninja]

Originally Posted by heretic888

Uhhh.... which version of Michelangelo are we talking about here??

Not a canon one, you don't need to freak out.