What Story was better - Page 2

**Karpo_007** · 11-02-2002, 03:37 PM

I didnt remember seeing that...

**Kali** · 11-02-2002, 03:45 PM

It's in the TMNTA Collected Book, Vol. 1. It includes issues 5-9, plus a prologue of Splinter telling of how he and the Turtles were created to April. There's a panel where he's holding up a mutagen-covered rat. Just one panel, not much, but it's got me thinking.

**Karpo_007** · 11-02-2002, 04:14 PM

Another question. When Bepop and Rocksteady mutated what happened to the animals? Why didnt they mutate?

**Kali** · 11-02-2002, 04:26 PM

Well, I suppose they didn't get any mutagen on them. He had Bebop and Rocksteady touch the animals, then I suppose they got dragged off and disposed of while Shredder administered the mutagen to the punks.

**Karpo_007** · 11-02-2002, 04:31 PM

I remember the exact scene from the cartoon. Rocksteady and BEpop are tied up to Chairs, Shrdder has some sort of protective suit on, He opens the mutagen can and then the robots drag the animals in... Ofcourse what happens next isn't showed...

**azure turtle** · 11-02-2002, 04:41 PM

Hmm... Personally, I liked the Mirage origin story better than the 'toon version. Just the idea of a pet rat learning ninjitsu from observing his master totally amazes me. I love it!

**Karpo_007** · 11-02-2002, 04:43 PM

Talking brains or Human cloning with worms dosent? It was never ment to be realistic.

**azure turtle** · 11-02-2002, 04:46 PM

Huh?? I don't understand the question...

Yeah, I liked the idea of Utroms and Shredder coming back from the dead via worms. I was just addressing the original topic about which origin story I liked better.

**Karpo_007** · 11-02-2002, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by azure turtle

Just the idea of a pet rat learning ninjitsu from observing his master totally amazes me. I love it!

You said it Amazes you. I just said it shouldnt, nothing about it is realistic...

**Kali** · 11-02-2002, 04:52 PM

We never said it was realistic, which is why it's so amazing. If it was realistic then it wouldn't be as interesting. If I want realstic, I'll go read one of my scientific texts.

**Karpo_007** · 11-02-2002, 04:56 PM

My poiny is that nothin in TMNT Amazes me. Everything that happens is real in it's universe. Usually i dont even think about how a rat could learn Ninjitsu etc.

speedracer · 11-03-2002, 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karpo_007

Intresting theory. But it was never ment to be realistic.

Anyone else tought the thing about cartoon, that Yoshi Touched turtles last time, not rats....

No. He stepped into the puddle of mutagen before picking up the turtles, remember?

speedracer · 11-03-2002, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heretic888

besides the 'enmity' you spoke of is rarely, if ever, expressed in the cartoon or archie books.

What???

Everytime Shredder and Splinter duel, you can hear about it. And there were two entire episodes that centered around the fact that Shredder usurped leadership of the Foot Clan from Splinter.

Quote:

whereas splinter's dislike of saki in the mirage books is quite public. besides, saki murdered splinter's master. it doesnt get a lot more personal than that.

Well, I guess I just can't conceive of a rat having that kind of affinity for its owner.

speedracer · 11-03-2002, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karpo_007

My poiny is that nothin in TMNT Amazes me. Everything that happens is real in it's universe. Usually i dont even think about how a rat could learn Ninjitsu etc.

Well, my point is that the pet-rat-learning-ninjutsu plot crosses the line from "fantastic" to "ridiculous in a non-self-respecting way."

~~Reznorite420~~ · 11-03-2002, 06:57 AM

Geez...it's just a comic book...enjoy it for what it is and don't pick at the realism of it! You're starting to sound like my English II teacher...

**Karpo_007** · 11-03-2002, 06:58 AM

That was my point...

*heretic888* · 11-03-2002, 08:02 AM

the debate was about which story was 'better' and i am going to have to go with the mirage one. why? well, in the sense that it is more mature and less oriented to kids is a damn good reason. however, in addition, the mirage line does something the others dont: it expresses a mythologic archetype. The mirage story actually has metaphorical connotations, social commentaries, and underlying themes/lessons in it. The others do not.

in other words, the mirage line could theoretically be put into an novel or saga form.... the archie could not.

not to mention the mirage turtles would kick the living bejeezus out of the archie ones.

Sparvid · 11-03-2002, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heretic888

not to mention the mirage turtles would kick the living bejeezus out of the archie ones.

*sigh* Why didn't this idea go anywhere..?

*heretic888* · 11-03-2002, 08:52 AM

that was mostly a joke (although it's still true).

you apparently neglected to read the rest of my post.

**Karpo_007** · 11-03-2002, 09:41 AM

I think tere is no idea to do a cross over between mirag turtles and archie ones... They are two diffrent universes from the same thing. The other one is for kids the other for little older people.

11-02-2002, 04:41 PM	#26
azure turtle Mango Lovin' Mutant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 9,453	Hmm... Personally, I liked the Mirage origin story better than the 'toon version. Just the idea of a pet rat learning ninjitsu from observing his master totally amazes me. I love it! __________________ "God, I love being a turtle!" Want to meet the only blue ninja turtle in existence? Come visit me at my Lair!

11-02-2002, 04:46 PM	#28
azure turtle Mango Lovin' Mutant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 9,453	Huh?? I don't understand the question... Yeah, I liked the idea of Utroms and Shredder coming back from the dead via worms. I was just addressing the original topic about which origin story I liked better. __________________ "God, I love being a turtle!" Want to meet the only blue ninja turtle in existence? Come visit me at my Lair!

11-03-2002, 08:02 AM	#37
heretic888 Foot Elite Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3,344	ahem the debate was about which story was 'better' and i am going to have to go with the mirage one. why? well, in the sense that it is more mature and less oriented to kids is a damn good reason. however, in addition, the mirage line does something the others dont: it expresses a mythologic archetype. The mirage story actually has metaphorical connotations, social commentaries, and underlying themes/lessons in it. The others do not. in other words, the mirage line could theoretically be put into an novel or saga form.... the archie could not. not to mention the mirage turtles would kick the living bejeezus out of the archie ones. __________________ "Ninpo began as training to become a moral people and to learn to endure in whatever social condition one is in; to know and accept one's fate, and to live for human beings and all other creatures. The person who masters all of these is a Ninja." (Masaaki Hatsumi)

11-03-2002, 08:52 AM	#39
heretic888 Foot Elite Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3,344	ahem that was mostly a joke (although it's still true). you apparently neglected to read the rest of my post. __________________ "Ninpo began as training to become a moral people and to learn to endure in whatever social condition one is in; to know and accept one's fate, and to live for human beings and all other creatures. The person who masters all of these is a Ninja." (Masaaki Hatsumi)

11-02-2002, 03:37 PM	#21
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	I didnt remember seeing that...

11-02-2002, 03:45 PM	#22
Kali Inactive Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: California! Posts: 11,101	It's in the TMNTA Collected Book, Vol. 1. It includes issues 5-9, plus a prologue of Splinter telling of how he and the Turtles were created to April. There's a panel where he's holding up a mutagen-covered rat. Just one panel, not much, but it's got me thinking.

11-02-2002, 04:14 PM	#23
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	Another question. When Bepop and Rocksteady mutated what happened to the animals? Why didnt they mutate?

11-02-2002, 04:26 PM	#24
Kali Inactive Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: California! Posts: 11,101	Well, I suppose they didn't get any mutagen on them. He had Bebop and Rocksteady touch the animals, then I suppose they got dragged off and disposed of while Shredder administered the mutagen to the punks.

11-02-2002, 04:31 PM	#25
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	I remember the exact scene from the cartoon. Rocksteady and BEpop are tied up to Chairs, Shrdder has some sort of protective suit on, He opens the mutagen can and then the robots drag the animals in... Ofcourse what happens next isn't showed...

11-02-2002, 04:43 PM	#27
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	Talking brains or Human cloning with worms dosent? It was never ment to be realistic.

11-02-2002, 04:52 PM	#30
Kali Inactive Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: California! Posts: 11,101	We never said it was realistic, which is why it's so amazing. If it was realistic then it wouldn't be as interesting. If I want realstic, I'll go read one of my scientific texts.

11-02-2002, 04:56 PM	#31
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	My poiny is that nothin in TMNT Amazes me. Everything that happens is real in it's universe. Usually i dont even think about how a rat could learn Ninjitsu etc.

11-03-2002, 06:57 AM	#35
~~Reznorite420~~ Banned Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 3,851	Geez...it's just a comic book...enjoy it for what it is and don't pick at the realism of it! You're starting to sound like my English II teacher...

11-03-2002, 06:58 AM	#36
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	That was my point...

11-03-2002, 09:41 AM	#40
Karpo_007 Inactive Moderator Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 8,798	I think tere is no idea to do a cross over between mirag turtles and archie ones... They are two diffrent universes from the same thing. The other one is for kids the other for little older people.