Do you care about "seeing yourself" on screen?

[Prowler]

In the last few years people have talked a lot about representation in the media and how people want to "see themselves" on screen, meaning they want a decent amount of "heroes" representing their race/nationality/religion/sexual orientation/etc. in the media.

Do you, personally, care about that?

I really don't tbh. If that was the case, I'd only watch TV show productions from my own country... and no thanks. TV is garbage in my country for the most part. . Also, I don't think a character needs to be "similar" to me in order for me to like it or relate to it. I mean, some of my favourite fictional characters ever are from Japanese video games and animation/comics. They probably never ate many of the dishes I have nor have I eaten much Japanese food(haven't even tried Sushi...) but that doesn't mean I cannot relate to them in other ways.

What about you? Do you actually care about "being represented on screen"?

[Cryomancer]

Not really. It's fun when a character creator in a video game lets me play as a big fat guy though, since it usually clashes with the setting / other characters.

But yeah I'll watch stuff starring whoever from wherever, I'm not watching a movie for a vanity trip or whatever. For kids it's probably a little more important that they can sometimes see someone like them doing important/good stuff though.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by Cryomancer

Not really. It's fun when a character creator in a video game lets me play as a big fat guy though, since it usually clashes with the setting / other characters.

But yeah I'll watch stuff starring whoever from wherever, I'm not watching a movie for a vanity trip or whatever. For kids it's probably a little more important that they can sometimes see someone like them doing important/good stuff though.

Personally, it never mattered to me as a kid either. Nor did it seem to matter to most kids I knew back then. I mean, everyone loved DBZ, Pokémon and such. And my favourite Street Fighter character from day one was Ryu. I played that game for the first time ever when i was like 5 years old. I like him because the hadouken was cool.

Also, this being a TMNT website, is proof that we can relate to different people than us, even to those of different species. I mean, it's not like I've ever stopped on my tracks one day and wondered "Hmmm... I wonder what the Turtles would look like if they were human".

[Candy Kappa]

I see myself everyday on TV since it's usually turned off and I can see my reflection

[plastroncafe]

Me personally? Nah, not really.
More variety of people in my media? Oh hell yes.

[Allio]

No. I'm face blind so I am literally blind to idea of something like this. So for me I have to relate to a character other than what they look like.

heck the two character I relate to the most are

Tomoyo from Card Captor Sakura. The idea of being so in love with someone so much but in the end you know you have to let them go...That there is nothing wrong with it and that you can be happy when someone else is happy. It believe it is something that everyone can understand.

and

Cerise Hood from Ever After High. The thought of having to wear a mask and put up a front to make sure you are just you, it's a hard thing for many to deal with.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Funny I thought that was why we had imaginations. If we want to pretend/relate to being some superhero, we can imagine being like Superman and flying around stopping disasters, not trying to imagine HE was more like US. Where's the fun in that anyway? Heroes and villains are supposed to be larger than life, more of the paragons of their race/gender/etc. Not average Joes like everyone we meet- because a protagonist in a comic, movie or animation is by their very nature of being the "hero" of the story someone who is ABOVE and BEYOND the average schmuck. That's why we aspire to be like them in the first place! It's why we dream.

[Allio]

sadly we live in a time and place that for people to "relate" a character will have to be literally "humanized" and by that they would often be of the same color/gender/sexuality/etc.

For us of technodrome, it shouldn't be that common afterall we had to learn to related to four mutant turtles.

[Vegita-San]

Originally Posted by MsMarvelDuckie

Funny I thought that was why we had imaginations. If we want to pretend/relate to being some superhero, we can imagine being like Superman and flying around stopping disasters, not trying to imagine HE was more like US. Where's the fun in that anyway? Heroes and villains are supposed to be larger than life, more of the paragons of their race/gender/etc. Not average Joes like everyone we meet- because a protagonist in a comic, movie or animation is by their very nature of being the "hero" of the story someone who is ABOVE and BEYOND the average schmuck. That's why we aspire to be like them in the first place! It's why we dream.

careful, you make too much sense. that's not welcome in some parts

[Vegita-San]

i'd like to see more john candy's and john goodmans representing fat people on screen and less mcarthy's and farleys....but other than that, I could care less who's on screen. just make the damn movie naturally and be good.

[Cure]

Nope. I'm not so insecure that I need that. I can relate to characters based on their ideas and personality and what they go through, not what they look like.

[Allio]

I think there is a difference between "relating to someone that looks like you" and "diversity" it's like the square=rectangle thing.

Like I think I agree we need more diversity because of relations, but relating to someone exists beyond just skin

[sdp]

I love diverse casts since it felt like "yeah, we're all in this together" so I actually miss the 90s multicultural casts we used to get on stuff like The Magic Schoolbus, Captain Planet, hell even the Burger King kids club cast.

Having an all black or all white cast is also fine; Boy Meets World and Fresh Prince of Bel Air didn't need to "diversify" anything.

I don't think many people complained about Nick Fury being Sam Jackson, it was the only casting most of were willing to accept even if it was Ultimate Fury and not 616 Fury.

What I usually have a huge problem with is when an established character is changed sex or gender for the sake of "diversity". Just make a new god damn character, we love a character the way they are and changing it for diversity is dumb. If it's a d-lister who was mostly a background character it can be successful since that character wasn't really established yet but taking an iconic character and changing him for the sake of Social Justice is beyond retarded.

I think anyone would rather have a new awesome character created in their race/sex than changing an established one. if anything it feels more like an insult, "since we can't come up with a good black/female character let's just make this one that race/sex". I'll take Spawn over Black Kid Flash any day.

When creating a new character you also have to be careful, some characters that are only created for diversity in recent years are lame and no one wants them like the most recent Marvel stuff being done that failed. Look at Dwayne McDuffie, he mentioned this exact thing and created Static Shock to better represent.

Changing an established character can work if done right, look at Jon Stewart Green Lantern and Miles Morales Spider-Man. Everyone including black people are hating Cyborg being in Justice League, he doesn't deserve that spot. Martian Manhunter or Green Lantern could've been the black man in the team if they wanted more diversity and that would've worked.

The double standards are also annoying, changing a white man to another color/sex is fine but if it's the opposite then it's praised. Me personally, I get pissed when either case is done, at least I'm consistent.

There will always be exceptions though, when an actor or race change just feel "right". I was fine with black Kingpin in Daredevil or darkening the skin of Hunk in Voltron. Also if an actor has brown skin and so does the fictional character, even if they aren't from the exact nationality from the fictional story it doesn't matter. I want the better actor who resembles more the fictional character.

The whole "you see yourself as the character so you need ____ representation" is for the most part only used to further advance a political ideology. In Mexico people love Captain America, Cosplay as all their anime characters, they don't give two ***** about latino Blue Beetle (who is awesome btw) and they got incredibly pissed off that Sombrero wearing Super Mario got removed from the cover of Mario Odyssey because of SJW pressure of cultural appropriation since they just don't give a crap about it.

Fiction; Serious business.

TL;DR: I don't want brown Princess Allura but I also don't want White Shredder. I'd rather have X-Men's Storm as is.

[plastroncafe]

Hooray for false equivalencies!

[IndigoErth]

Myself? That's not going to be a very interesting character, so no and probably never will. lol I'm not those characters, so it's hard to really see myself in them, and relatability goes deeper than just surface stuff like gender or race.

I haven't seen Wonder Woman yet, but I still bet I'd continue to see much more of myself in aspects of Leo, a fictional male mutant Turtle, than I would in Wonder Woman for simply being a woman and played by one. Although a bit of girl power is nice, even if it isn't mine.


Diversity is kind of a different matter though, no matter if I see myself in it or not; it's nice to see a little more effort on that front so long it is doesn't seem forced.

Really, it may be best summed up as PD Donnie once said, "Let me be the badass for once."

Even the somewhat more pacifist geek of the group wants to get to be the badass hero once in a while. It doesn't always need to be Leo and Raph focused on every moment as the biggest ass kickers (or other central character traits in a film/show/whatever). Just like it doesn't always have to be guys or white people.



Really, the things that bug me more go a bit deeper and are more the things that there hasn't been much attempt to buck the trend.

Such as... I'd rather the "cool kids" become a bit more diverse. Let some be on the heftier side, or god forbid... let one wear glasses with ZERO geek/nerd/awkward/weird/smart one personality. Teach kids these days that glasses actually mean NOTHING outside of the fact that your vision sucks and it's a necessary accessory, that's it. But even today's cartoons and kid shows continue this crap, showing kids that glasses mean something else, and not good.

(edit: Donnie getting glasses "because geek" is annoying. But if one of the other three were seen with reading glasses on at home, that would have been kind of adorable.)

Also, how atheists are generally done in a negative light by various media or, at the very least, there is always that twinge of snideness against them.

[chrisdude]

Isn't this issue entirely about kids?
I don't care if people in movies look like me, but if kids grow up seeing every character who accomplishes something important, or acts heroically is a white male, it's got to influence their perception of the world. I do think it is primarily a parent's responsibility to teach a child how the world works. But when every black character in a superhero movie is a sidekick, like Rhodey, Heimdall, or Lucius Fox, and every female is a love interest for the hero, that has to have SOME influence on an eight-year-old's outlook. Again, not a movie's responsibly, but if consumers want to see it, then that becomes what's marketable.

[Allio]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

Isn't this issue entirely about kids?
I don't care if people in movies look like me, but if kids grow up seeing every character who accomplishes something important, or acts heroically is a white male, it's got to influence their perception of the world. I do think it is primarily a parent's responsibility to teach a child how the world works. But when every black character in a superhero movie is a sidekick, like Rhodey, Heimdall, or Lucius Fox, and every female is a love interest for the hero, that has to have SOME influence on an eight-year-old's outlook. Again, not a movie's responsibly, but if consumers want to see it, then that becomes what's marketable.

As mentioned before as a kid I tended to lean towards black characters rather than white ones

[Spike Spiegel]

Originally Posted by chrisdude

Isn't this issue entirely about kids?
I don't care if people in movies look like me, but if kids grow up seeing every character who accomplishes something important, or acts heroically is a white male, it's got to influence their perception of the world. I do think it is primarily a parent's responsibility to teach a child how the world works. But when every black character in a superhero movie is a sidekick, like Rhodey, Heimdall, or Lucius Fox, and every female is a love interest for the hero, that has to have SOME influence on an eight-year-old's outlook. Again, not a movie's responsibly, but if consumers want to see it, then that becomes what's marketable.

TV and films can reflect some inherent aspects of the culture they are produced in, but a little media literacy can go a long way. It's also a responsible parent's job to teach their child that the stuff they see on the screen isn't real, and that stereotypes are just that--stereotypes.

That said, I'd be lying if I said seeing Geordi LaForge, John Stewart/Green Lantern, and Static wasn't meaningful to me as a kid.