Splinter is Kind of a Jerk (and an idiot)

[The Sewer Lord]

Originally Posted by Panda_Kahn_fan

Okay, I can look past the previous 'lessons' that Splinter taught them, but the 'switch waepons/no weapons' thing during combat, when thier lives were in danger and the Pulverizer complicating things, was stupid, just plain stupid. Besides leaving the four at a disadvantage where they could have died, Splinter may just be indirectly responsible for creating one of the turtles most dangerous enimies during the coming season.

I agree with this.

[kelligrafie]

Splinter seems to impart his wisdom via Chinese proverbs. Which to me, can be interpreted a number of ways depending on who is receiving the advice.

Don't forget Splinter knows each of the turtles intimately, he has lived with them for 15 years (in this series). We haven't (aside from the fact they're not real blah blah blah).

Without wanting to get too deep and psychological, the turtles may glean some hidden meaning from whatever Splinter says, that won't be immediately obvious to us viewers?


And in regards to making them fight without weapons before a battle being dangerous, I'd say that the turtles are in danger 24/7 now that Shredder has aligned with the Kraang. With or without weapons. If they don't face an enemy minus weapons now, it'll happen at a later date. Splinter simply forced the timing of it.

Without wanting to change the subject, it reminds me of the argument between Harry Potter and Dolores Umbridge during DADA where he states, "If we're going to be attacked, it won't be risk free." I feel it's the same principle here.

[Bossa Nova]

Originally Posted by Martinf

Switching weapons in theory isn't a bad idea, the problem was that they clearly had no idea how to use other weapons beside their own. I fail to see how it is a good idea to make them face life or death situations with a big handicap. You want them to learn how to use new weapons? Well, how about you teach them how to use them before throwing them into the frying pan

Pretty much this. Someone else has already pointed out that the turtles are in fact very GOOD at using whatever's at their disposal to use at weapons when in a pinch, but when training with each others weapons it wasn't just random crap laying around. It was an actual other weapon, something they know has a specific way to be handled and used and they were trying to go about using them in such a way. Obviously in this version Splinter hasn't taught them all at least the basics in each others weapons, and I doubt he would have been happy if they just wound up randomly throwing them at each other either (like they did at Tim at the end of the episode), so I don't really know what he expected of them. To just randomly, instinctively know how to use double swords when you've only been training with nunchucks your whole life? Please.

[Dudette]

Originally Posted by Martinf

Switching weapons in theory isn't a bad idea, the problem was that they clearly had no idea how to use other weapons beside their own. I fail to see how it is a good idea to make them face life or death situations with a big handicap. You want them to learn how to use new weapons? Well, how about you teach them how to use them before throwing them into the frying pan

I fully agree with you on this.

What did strike to me as odd was that if the turtles are learning the art of ninjutsu from Splinter, doesn't ninjutsu include at least bojutsu and kenjutsu as a "must" in the training program. The sais and nunchucks are optional, but they all should be able to fight well with Donnie's Bo and at least so-so with Leo's katanas.

Of course, I can't say anything for certain about Splinter's teaching style. Just wondering.

[crd2082]

Eh, I wasn't bothered by Splinter making them fight with no weapons.

As he said during the episode, they had grown complacent. At the start of the series they were returning home battered and bruised. Now they fight the Krang, the Foot and Shredder and come home without a scratch. I believe Splinter had a good feeling that even if they fought without weapons it wouldn't make much difference, and it didn't.

Hell, Donnie was able to take on Dogpound, Fishface and some foot soldiers WHILE keeping Pulverizer out of harms way without much trouble and without his familiar weapon. What was important for this lesson was learning how to adapt to not having weapons. A valuable lesson. And it was better that they learn it now when they were facing something they felt they could handle than the alternative.

What bothered me more than that was the fact that none of them knew how to wield another turtles' weapons. I mean NO idea. Leo should not have had as much trouble as he did with Donnie's bo staff for example. Tripping over it, really? Watching Mikey spin Leo's katanas around like nunchaku was hilarious though.

[raph27]

I know! That was practically the ONLY flaw in the episode for me.

[RskimB]

considering how much "younger" they make this Splinter versus any other incarnations I'm wondering what is stopping them from having Splinter fight alongside the turtles.

[The Sewer Lord]

Originally Posted by Dudette

What did strike to me as odd was that if the turtles are learning the art of ninjutsu from Splinter, doesn't ninjutsu include at least bojutsu and kenjutsu as a "must" in the training program. The sais and nunchucks are optional, but they all should be able to fight well with Donnie's Bo and at least so-so with Leo's katanas.

I think so.

[Candy Kappa]

Originally Posted by Dudette

I fully agree with you on this.

What did strike to me as odd was that if the turtles are learning the art of ninjutsu from Splinter, doesn't ninjutsu include at least bojutsu and kenjutsu as a "must" in the training program. The sais and nunchucks are optional, but they all should be able to fight well with Donnie's Bo and at least so-so with Leo's katanas.

Of course, I can't say anything for certain about Splinter's teaching style. Just wondering.

According to Bujinkan yes, Bugei juhappan is according to them mentioned in the Togakure-Ryu scrolls, and are used in modern teachings of Togakure-Ryu. Historical accuracy? dubious, but Splinter is a modern/pop culture Ninja.

[victory_angel]

I don't think of Splinter as a Jerk. His sons are fifteen, so I think largely he stands back and lets his sons try and figure out things on their own with out daddy having step in and save the day. He knows he's not going to be with them forever so when that day comes they would be able rely on one another. And he also doesn't want them to repeat mistakes that he has made or that other people have made.

Some examples being Metalhead- There is one part where Raph makes a rude comment about Donnie's weapon while Splinter is in earshot. Splinter however doesn't comment because 1. Donnie is fifteen and any issues he has with his brothers is old enough to deal with on his own. It would be more of an insult for Splinter to step in a defend Donatello because that would be saying he is incapable of standing up to his brothers.

New Friend, Old Enemy carried and Never say Xever had two halves of the same lesson. So the full lesson is "Win no matter what it takes, but don't stoop to the level of your enemy."

Pulverizer returns: It's already been covered that the weapon chooses you just as much as you choose it. So the weapon in that case would only trust you as much as you trust it. So while the obvious lesson of that exercise is to learn to adapt to what is unfamiliar.There is the unspoken lesson of learning from each other that the Turtles never consider.

Buyakashowdown- The lesson of "With the world at stake you must complete the mission no matter what or who you have to sacrifice." Sounds rather hypocritical for someone who has repeatedly stated that the Turtles are the only precious things he has left. Since it sort of sounds like he's saying "Go ahead and abandon someone". But in reality it's more like "Between saving an individual such as one of your brothers and the lives of numerous innocent people. Save the numerous innocent first." As Captain Kirk has stated-The needs of the many out weigh the needs of the few.

Mutagen Man unleashed: Private lesson for Donnie that he shouldn't force April to like him. This lesson was meant an early intervention to keep Donnie from falling down a path that would end up destroying him. What caused the lesson in the first place is Donnie had been jealously ranting about how April obviously likes Casey because he's human and other such things. Splinter more then likely over heard this and that sends up some warning bells because the Shredder could not accept the fact that Teng Shen loved another man and let his jealousy consume him. Even his statement of "For one so brilliant the obvious seems to allude you" felt like he was saying "You should listen to yourself."

[plastroncafe]

You mean the Mystical Asian Stereotype isn't a 100% fleshed out wonderful character?

Well color me shocked. SHOCKED!
And I say this as someone who finds the Nick version to be the best of the incarnations.

The show is more through the kids' eyes than it is through the Adults, which is why I think Splinter comes across as an absentee father.

[BabyTurtles]

IDK.....he's not perfect (which I'm glad he isn't)

I like him this way...he's trying to be both a sensei and a father.

[BubblyShell22]

Yeah, same here. I love Splinter and how he's portrayed. Parents are allowed to make mistakes too, and Splinter has done this at times. He even admitted to it in "Panic in the Sewers" when he stated that he was the reason the Turtles were too scared to go up to the surface and that he'd been holding them back.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

I was just talking about Splinter and his role in the new Nick show and I was even going to open a thread.

TBH I think he is actually really irresponsible, he lets the turtles do pretty much what they want. He lets Don experiment on un tested and un staple compounds at the tender age of 15, who has absolutely no qualifications or practice in that area of expertise. Leo still is not a strong leader at this point in the show, and some what inexperienced, yet he puts the fate of the world on his shoulders and almost sends him to his death while he was panning on sitting in his cosy little sewer and doing nothing. Keeping Timothy in their home is just plan daft, he should be in a proper facility, with qualified doctors/scientists, not some 15 year old who has no experience in that field.

At the end of the day they are only 15 and taking on to much, without adult supervision. We all make mistakes but he needs to play a bigger role in what they get up to.

[Shark_Blade]

He's a flawed but realistic portrayal of parent/father so far imo. The best.

I like that he's strict and puts out punishments on the boys. And physically, he's very ideal - the tallest of them all, towering his children, dominating them. A feel of authority above all.

[Ashwolf]

Originally Posted by TheBlueTurtle1

He lets Don experiment on un tested and un staple compounds at the tender age of 15, who has absolutely no qualifications or practice in that area of expertise. Leo still is not a strong leader at this point in the show, and some what inexperienced, yet he puts the fate of the world on his shoulders and almost sends him to his death while he was panning on sitting in his cosy little sewer and doing nothing. Keeping Timothy in their home is just plan daft, he should be in a proper facility, with qualified doctors/scientists, not some 15 year old who has no experience in that field.

At the end of the day they are only 15 and taking on to much, without adult supervision. We all make mistakes but he needs to play a bigger role in what they get up to.

being a leader, u gotta deal w/ the pressure sometimes, even if it is all or nothing/life altering

as far as don goes, it wouldn't be don much if he didn't learn new science tricks along the way

if tim was in some facility, that pretty much would be the end of him cause all those qualified doctors and scientists would keep him locked up 4 as long as they wanted or needed

in all honesty from the way I see it, yes, hes giving them more freedom than in the past, there r moments where im surprised he didn't go aid them at least in the background but it might be part of his condition from mutating but it doesn't change how hes teaching them

[Technogeek29]

Originally Posted by Shark_Blade

He's a flawed but realistic portrayal of parent/father so far imo. The best.

I like that he's strict and puts out punishments on the boys. And physically, he's very ideal - the tallest of them all, towering his children, dominating them. A feel of authority above all.

True OT Splinter seemed very laxed and the Turtles weren't strangers to the surface which lead me to believe they've been up there several times before April came along.

2K3 Splinter was very over protective to the point the Turtles became afraid to go against his orders after their first venture to the surface. Going top side didn't really become a thing for them until episode 6.

Of course I'm surprised as rowdy as the 2k12 are they didn't do sneak to the surface as well.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by Technogeek29

Of course I'm surprised as rowdy as the 2k12 are they didn't do sneak to the surface as well.

It's possible they've gone to places outside the city for supplies and stuff.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

Originally Posted by Ashwolf

being a leader, u gotta deal w/ the pressure sometimes, even if it is all or nothing/life altering

as far as don goes, it wouldn't be don much if he didn't learn new science tricks along the way

if tim was in some facility, that pretty much would be the end of him cause all those qualified doctors and scientists would keep him locked up 4 as long as they wanted or needed

in all honesty from the way I see it, yes, hes giving them more freedom than in the past, there r moments where im surprised he didn't go aid them at least in the background but it might be part of his condition from mutating but it doesn't change how hes teaching them

Leo at this point is not a very strong leader atm. Think of the 2003 Leo, very strong and decisive in his leadership. Nick Leo still needs to grow in his experience. I am sure he will get there, and I suppose he is the longer he is leader, but not ready to have the pressure of saving the entire world at the end of season 1 lol.

[Shark_Blade]

Hey, he tried. He even sacrificed himself and that shows courage.